Bruce Leigh Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 My friend was telling me on the weekend that he is thinking about using steroids as he has "hit the wall". Bear in mind he is 5'11 and 210lbs already. He has done this the right way, eating the right foods(mostly), training 5 times a week for around 90 mins. But to him this isn't enough. I told him i would support whatever decision he makes but he has done them before, years ago and he showed all the classic signs of using them. He sees the gains other people have made using them and is beginning to think about using them again. He takes great pride in getting to where he is now, through natural training but he says its not enough anymore. Support him or try to talk him out of it? Link to post Share on other sites
ja123 Posted June 2, 2014 Share Posted June 2, 2014 I'd try to talk him out of it. Arnold Schwarzenegger had open heart surgery, due to his use of steroids. Link to post Share on other sites
Andy_K Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 If he's already over 200lb at 5'11", he's either built like a gorilla or he's packing more body fat than he needs. If the former, I'd imagine he looks pretty damn muscular already. If the latter, then steroids aren't going to help. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Keenly Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 What the hell? I'm 5 11 and 200. If he needs to be BIGGER than this then he has underlying psychological issues that need to be addressed. Is he addicted to the gym / body building? Seriously, if his body won't let him get bigger, that's a pretty clear sign that he needs to chill the hell out on it. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Bruce Leigh Posted June 3, 2014 Author Share Posted June 3, 2014 What the hell? I'm 5 11 and 200. If he needs to be BIGGER than this then he has underlying psychological issues that need to be addressed. Is he addicted to the gym / body building? Seriously, if his body won't let him get bigger, that's a pretty clear sign that he needs to chill the hell out on it. That's the thing, probably only over the last 18 months has he really hit the gym hard, around the same time he was hurt by his ex-fiance when she ended it 2 days before xmas. He was ready to settle down with her, raise two kids that weren't his own, she fell pregnant with the second child during the year they were apart but he was still ready to settle down with her. I respected that. He loved her, maybe still does a little. He wants to see what happens with an 8 week program. I'll mention the health issues but he knows them. Link to post Share on other sites
Keenly Posted June 3, 2014 Share Posted June 3, 2014 Show him Google images of shrunken testicles. Link to post Share on other sites
Priv Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 As he has done them before, and knows the health risks, he is making an informed decision. Not much you can do about that. Best you can do is make sure he does it 'safely' and wisely. As in, making sure he does it correctly, or doing one program but can't handle the comedown/losses and keeps doing it. I personally have never done it and think it should be legalized and restricted to professional sports only just to level the playing field (because 90% are using already anyway), but I know a lot of people who do. You can easily tell the sensibles one apart from the idiots. And mostly due to their demeanor. Friends I lift with in another city use them periodically and are perfectly fine people. I dont condone what they do because I see little sense in it if you are not competing, but admire their drive. When I ask them about it, the only thing they tell happens psychologically is that their sex drives increase and they feel stronger and more confident. The commercial gym I go to in my town however... Freaking baffoons. Blood shot eyes, swollen heads, trying to intimidate people, getting into fights, harassing women, weird social structures and cliques I haven't experienced since high school. I bet they are all impotent too. A few months ago I almost got into a physical fight (on his part) because I used 'his' bench press which he got a towel on for the last half an hour without using it. All because their program is most likely just some continuous use of steriods or other compound. They just can't keep there hormones in check. Point being; the stuff really can screw up your personality. So just watch out for that. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Bruce Leigh Posted June 4, 2014 Author Share Posted June 4, 2014 Point being; the stuff really can screw up your personality. So just watch out for that. That's the thing, he can be a bit of a hot head anyway, not so much the last few years but when he was using, he could fly off the handle. But he wasn't training anywhere near the level he is now. He is far more dedicated at the moment. I'll keep an eye on him, try and calm him down if i need to. He said it will be an 8 week program, see what gains he makes. Link to post Share on other sites
thefooloftheyear Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 If you arent competing, then I dont see the point....You can be pretty big without, if you have good genetics.... I am surprised that people use the stuff today, as its pretty much made in someone's garage and the potency and steriliy are just not as you would have if you were getting it from a legit pharmacological source.. Its all in the bf anyway...Most of the guys that juice in the gym I go to hust look like fat and bloated pigs...No definition and when they go off they shrink to nothing,,, TFY 1 Link to post Share on other sites
dichotomy Posted June 4, 2014 Share Posted June 4, 2014 18 months only - and he has "hit the wall" in training? Depression over his breakup is making him try to over compensate. 4 Link to post Share on other sites
Author Bruce Leigh Posted June 4, 2014 Author Share Posted June 4, 2014 18 months only - and he has "hit the wall" in training? Depression over his breakup is making him try to over compensate. He has trained on and off for around 5 years, the typical chest and arms routine using his own weights but the last 18 months he has done it properly, training his entire body and in a proper gym. His max 1 rep bench press is 170kg !! I would hardly call him depressed, he is loving all the attention from women he gets these days. He joked he has never had it so good. He could be putting on a brave front but its a very convincing one, if that is the case. Link to post Share on other sites
dichotomy Posted June 5, 2014 Share Posted June 5, 2014 (edited) He has trained on and off for around 5 years, the typical chest and arms routine using his own weights but the last 18 months he has done it properly, training his entire body and in a proper gym. His max 1 rep bench press is 170kg !! I would hardly call him depressed, he is loving all the attention from women he gets these days. He joked he has never had it so good. He could be putting on a brave front but its a very convincing one, if that is the case. 375 lb bench press ?? Thats great ! That puts him in like top 5% of men on the planet. I guess I don't know whats motivating him beyond that. Edited June 5, 2014 by dichotomy Link to post Share on other sites
learning_slowly Posted June 5, 2014 Share Posted June 5, 2014 If he's hit a plateau, get him to try the smolov technique first. Unless he's just looking for an easier way. Link to post Share on other sites
deathandtaxes Posted June 5, 2014 Share Posted June 5, 2014 What's the silly point in getting bigger? I Don't get that mind set in dudes, and I am a dude!! What's he going to do with that extra size? It's a lot of damn e-peen. My chest is this big, I can bench this much. Good for you! Now go do something with your life other than obsessing about your muscles! There's so much more to life. That's what you need to tell your friend. He's looking in the wrong place for self-actualization. It's all downside. Link to post Share on other sites
TylerDurdenn Posted June 5, 2014 Share Posted June 5, 2014 What's the silly point in getting bigger? I Don't get that mind set in dudes, and I am a dude!! What's he going to do with that extra size? It's a lot of damn e-peen. My chest is this big, I can bench this much. Good for you! Now go do something with your life other than obsessing about your muscles! There's so much more to life. That's what you need to tell your friend. He's looking in the wrong place for self-actualization. It's all downside. You've just gotta keep eating up if you ain't gaining mass! It's fine! We've all been there! Link to post Share on other sites
thefooloftheyear Posted June 5, 2014 Share Posted June 5, 2014 What's the silly point in getting bigger? I Don't get that mind set in dudes, and I am a dude!! What's he going to do with that extra size? It's a lot of damn e-peen. My chest is this big, I can bench this much. Good for you! Now go do something with your life other than obsessing about your muscles! There's so much more to life. That's what you need to tell your friend. He's looking in the wrong place for self-actualization. It's all downside. Not saying this is true of you, but a lot of guys that can't get big have this mindset, so they just shyt on the guys that can/want to... The same people that sit around criticising these guys are usually ones that, ironically, smoke weed, get drunk with their buddies, have a shyt job, or whatever... I am a pretty big guy...I have good genetics for building muscle..Most guys that see me think I live in a gym, despite only training for around 5-7 hours a week, which is FAR less than many others..I like being strong more than I do being big, but the two kind of go hand in hand for me... I know a lot of bodybuillder types and most have good jobs and careers..I own two seperate companies along with managing a portfolio and investment properties..Not all big guys are "pick it and put it down" types.. Live and let live and everything in moderation... >02 TFY 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Author Bruce Leigh Posted June 5, 2014 Author Share Posted June 5, 2014 Most guys that see me think I live in a gym, despite only training for around 5-7 hours a week, TFY But in all fairness, that is what you should be aiming for. He is the same, 60mins-90mins straight after work, 5 days a week, has the weekend off so he isn't living in the gym. Will mention that Smolov technique but i am not sure how good his squat technique is. Link to post Share on other sites
learning_slowly Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 Every night? If he's lifting every night, he must be pretty good at isolating areas for recovery. Maybe I am too lazy to work out such a regime. I used to do everyday and my muscles were getting weaker. Are you sure he's not over training? This would explain a plateau. Now I only do 3 days/ week, with 4 days if I feel the body can recover. If he has a 5 day split that allows recovery, send me a copy. I do miss the rush of going more often. It is a drug, but at least its a natural one. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author Bruce Leigh Posted June 6, 2014 Author Share Posted June 6, 2014 Every night? If he's lifting every night, he must be pretty good at isolating areas for recovery. He might train just one muscle group on one day, two on another day, he does mix it up now and again. He throws in a 3 day a week program here and there for example. He splits his bicep and tricep exercises on different days but he know that these are accessories and are trained by other means anyway. The gym he uses, the guy who runs it, he is in 60's but he used to compete nationally in the UK years ago. He told him when he first started training properly that if you can't do what you want to do in 45 mins -60 mins, then you aren't training properly. The progress he has made in the last 12 months has been impressive. We are off for a quiet drink and a game of pool tomorrow, i'll try and give him some options other than steroids. Wish me luck. Link to post Share on other sites
thefooloftheyear Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 He might train just one muscle group on one day, two on another day, he does mix it up now and again. He throws in a 3 day a week program here and there for example. He splits his bicep and tricep exercises on different days but he know that these are accessories and are trained by other means anyway. The gym he uses, the guy who runs it, he is in 60's but he used to compete nationally in the UK years ago. He told him when he first started training properly that if you can't do what you want to do in 45 mins -60 mins, then you aren't training properly. The progress he has made in the last 12 months has been impressive. We are off for a quiet drink and a game of pool tomorrow, i'll try and give him some options other than steroids. Wish me luck. Truer words never spoken....but make that time intense and high level.. TFY 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author Bruce Leigh Posted June 6, 2014 Author Share Posted June 6, 2014 Truer words never spoken....but make that time intense and high level.. TFY Only way he trains Link to post Share on other sites
deathandtaxes Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 Not saying this is true of you, but a lot of guys that can't get big have this mindset, so they just shyt on the guys that can/want to... The same people that sit around criticising these guys are usually ones that, ironically, smoke weed, get drunk with their buddies, have a shyt job, or whatever... I am a pretty big guy...I have good genetics for building muscle..Most guys that see me think I live in a gym, despite only training for around 5-7 hours a week, which is FAR less than many others..I like being strong more than I do being big, but the two kind of go hand in hand for me... I know a lot of bodybuillder types and most have good jobs and careers..I own two seperate companies along with managing a portfolio and investment properties..Not all big guys are "pick it and put it down" types.. Live and let live and everything in moderation... >02 TFY I'm not ****ting on anybody. I guess the get big mindset slipped me sometime in my youth lol. To each their own. But to really **** up your body with steroids because of some perceived deficiency on not being big enough? Me thinks OP's buddy would be better off seeing a shrink. I have a lot of respect for the guys at the gym that put in the time. It's just not MY goal to be a really big guy. I rather enjoy the slim form I have. It fits better with the activities I like, like yoga, and dancing. Slim, but not muscleless Link to post Share on other sites
Author Bruce Leigh Posted June 22, 2014 Author Share Posted June 22, 2014 Was talking with my mate last night, got some more specific info on the last 11 months to be precise. He has put on nearly 3 stone of muscle in less than a year. Wow, i knew he had bulked up but that is quite a lot. He averages close to 5000 calories a day as it is, throughout the weekdays. His shoulders are starting to give him grief. He probably needs to dial it back a little, give his body a chance to settle down a bit. It's probably in a state of shock !! His target is another stone, he doesn't want to cut yet. I have agreed to be his new training partner, what have i let myself in for ?? Link to post Share on other sites
ascendotum Posted June 23, 2014 Share Posted June 23, 2014 Was talking with my mate last night, got some more specific info on the last 11 months to be precise. He has put on nearly 3 stone of muscle in less than a year. ... His shoulders are starting to give him grief. He probably needs to dial it back a little, give his body a chance to settle down a bit. His target is another stone, he doesn't want to cut yet. I have agreed to be his new training partner, what have i let myself in for ?? I tend to agree with you. Shyte that's 19kg/42 lbs, and if his BF is low that's a brilliant outcome. Nothing to get all panicky about just because his gains have flattened lately. Back off on the intensity for a couple of months then up the intensity again when the weather starts to get cooler. He's 3/4 of the way there. Why ****ing turn to gear for the last bit when he capable of doing it with out it. I know he had a goal/date in mind and is getting depressed he is not going to make it. He needs to keep it in perspective. Lots & lots of guys would be jealous of his progress he has made, as well as the time-frame he had achieved it in. He has only flat lined for the past few months after achieving excellent gains (Ib a week, week in week out). Link to post Share on other sites
Author Bruce Leigh Posted June 23, 2014 Author Share Posted June 23, 2014 He has agreed that he needs to dial it back, he does next to no cardio, he admits he loves training so he may add more cardio to his workout. He can be quite stubborn but my aim is cardio right now. Hopefully he will make an effort to do some himself. Link to post Share on other sites
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