Where to find a woman like this?

[jbelle6]

Yes, especially when you know they would not like it if the situation was reversed and you were the one doing it.

 

I guess I'm just old fashioned as well, but I'm sure there's a better word that we could use because I'm certainly open minded with just about every other aspect of my life.

 

Not sure if you saw this earlier, but I think you'll like this.

 

http://i.imgur.com/b2th86u.png

 

 

 

LOL!!! I love it. I have one need to find for you!

 

I don't know a better term for old fashioned, but I suspect I am just mostly like that. I'm open about other lifestyles etc. though.

[jbelle6]

Ok, I found it lol

 

 

 

He caught me cheating but it's his fault. - 9GAG

[marcjb]

Ok, I found it lol

 

 

 

He caught me cheating but it's his fault. - 9GAG

 

So funny because it's true! Ok, one more.

 

Meme Creator - HAS ALL MALE FRIENDS WONDERS WHY HER RELATIONSHIPS NEVER WORK

[jbelle6]

So funny because it's true! Ok, one more.

 

Meme Creator - HAS ALL MALE FRIENDS WONDERS WHY HER RELATIONSHIPS NEVER WORK

 

 

Haha! These are fantastic!

 

(she also wonders why she has no female friends)

[iiiii]

Finding the right person - for a life long relationship - isn't easy. There is no formula or recipe that we can follow that guarantees we will find the right person. But I don't think your requirements are unreasonable, and it seems to me that you'd have as much chance as anyone else to find a partner who can live up to them.

 

Having said that, everyone's view of a good relationship is different, and I would personally find it very hard to be with someone who did not trust me enough to "let" me stay friends with an ex, or "let" me associate with friends of the opposite gender. If my partner did not trust that I can decide for myself which friendships are innocent and which are not, or did not trust that I can and will keep friendship boundaries appropriate, then I would feel like we had a serious problem in the relationship.

 

For the record, I am also more than happy for my partner to have contact with his ex, and to have friends of the opposite gender - because he is an honourable man and I trust him implicitly to keep appropriate boundaries with other women. If I could not trust him to do that, I would not be interested in being his partner.

[firmness]

Wrong. *I* am one of those people...

 

I think you must be very young...

 

I am just very lucky to have met a man who is secure enough in our relationship as to acknowledge that we both have pasts and there are occasions where those in our past may be part of our present for various reasons.

 

This is reasonable - although the slight insult to OP's age was unnecessary.

 

AND...this is the beginning of just about ever story of cheating I have ever read. "He is just a friend" ..."If I wanted to be with my ex, I would not be with you"..."You are just insecure".

 

As we reach our 40's and 50's we build up a history that is unavoidable. I agree with that. And it is also reasonable for a completely secure person to be a bit skeptical of a partner who feels the need to keep exes hanging around in the background.

 

With all that we know about relationships, it is entirely reasonable to view this with a bit of skepticism (in fact it would be almost irrational to assume otherwise).

 

With several of my ex-girlfriends, I was not worried about them cheating. I was completely secure. I loved her ( thinking of one in particular) but if she cheated I would have just moved on. I was not fully committed. Another time I did not worry because I knew that she would not likely find anyone better than me. So she could cheat if she wanted, but she risked losing a good thing.

 

OP's perspective is valid and should be respected. Snarky comments are not necessary.

 

We should all remember that it is completely reasonable to be both 100% secure in ourselves and our relationships AND be suspicious. That old "insecurity" thing is pop-psych stuff that is more than 20 years out of date.

Edited June 15, 2014 by firmness
Grammers and speilling

[firmness]

This thread is an interesting one to me mainly because reasonable people can disagree. After reading the responses a thought comes to mind.

 

There is no answer to the question "Should my partner have friends of the opposite sex" Well, there is an answer and it is "It depends"

 

I can only speak from my own experience. I prefer to have a woman who has overwhelmingly same-sex friends for about 20 reasons - most of which have already been expressed eloquently by others here.

 

Some other questions that come to mind when thinking about my own boundaries with my woman. These can be very tricky and I only think them in my head as I reflect on where we are and where things might be going:

 

1. Are ALL or most of her friends men?

2. What is the nature, quality, and quantity of her relationships with other women?

3. What stage of the relationship are we in, and is she "moving" along and being more mindful of these boundaries and making me feel good about things without me having to ask?

4. What has been her sexual history?

5. How often does she hang around other guy friends and how many of them are there?

6. What other signs is she giving off? Does she dress provocatively around these guys? Is she generally flirty? Is she crazy about me? (this is a tricky one)

7. Does she have children? Is she divorced? What is going on there?

8. How is she with my relationships with other women?

9. Would she tolerate the same from me? (This one could go either way)

10. Just to round it off to 10, how shady is she about texts, calls, extracurricular activities?

 

Ultimately if I feel that something is wrong, then something is wrong and it is either her or me. Either way, something is wrong.

 

If my girlfriend is too lovey dovey with other men, then I will shut my feelings down and do the same. This is only temporary. Women have equal power in this way to cheat, to nurture, to love, to lie, to deceive, to lift up and to respect. If I do not get enough of what I need, then it is on me to walk away.

 

And to paraphrase Bruce Banner in the Avengers, "my secret is that I am always willing to walk away."

[salparadise]

I would personally find it very hard to be with someone who did not trust me enough to "let" me stay friends with an ex, or "let" me associate with friends of the opposite gender. If my partner did not trust that I can decide for myself which friendships are innocent and which are not, or did not trust that I can and will keep friendship boundaries appropriate, then I would feel like we had a serious problem in the relationship.

 

But don't you think that you actually create or destroy the "trust me enough" factor with your own attitudes and behaviors? If staying friends with an ex means wishing him a happy birthday or sending a christmas card it's one thing. If it means you want to let him buy you a nice dinner twice a month, or go over to his place to cuddle and watch a movie, then it's something else entirely.

 

A reasonable man will trust you to keep friendship boundaries appropriate if you actually keep them appropriate and it's all perfectly transparent. But if you're seeking alone time with another man, perhaps an opportunity to share some personal feelings, the kind of intimacy that is traditionally only shared in romantic or same-sex, best-friend relationships, don't put it on him for not trusting... you're giving him every reason in the world to feel incongruent and wonder what in the hell is going on.

 

Whether a person can admit it or not, they're hedging their bet, maintaining backup supply, keeping a few in the cue... all at the expense of their primary relationship, even if there is no sex. I'm with jbelle and marcjb on this. I just don't get how easily people rationalize this kind of stuff and then want to blame their partner for being controlling and insecure. Part of being in a good relationship is making it feel secure for your partner.

[marcjb]

I would like to stress that in my last relationship with my ex fiancé, I did trust her completely until she ended up dropping the "I don't feel the same way about you", and "I love you, but I'm not in love with you" lines. I then took all of the red flags into consideration.

 

I doesn't take a rocket scientist to put things together and see that she had G.I.G.S. After a week long break and another week of dates until I moved back she evetually ended up saying that she did want to make it work between us, but all of her actions told me that she wasn't really committed to me. Her and her guy friend that she met AFTER me were a little too chummy.

 

This was someone that I loved and trusted with all my heart. I never thought she would do this to me. I never thought I would hear those words come out of her mouth. I was completely dedicated to her and saw myself spending our lives together.

 

Before her, I stayed away from getting into another relationship with anyone for 8 years. I did not meet anyone that I was really into and clicked with.

 

Never again will I trust someone with this opposite gender friendship garbage.

Edited June 16, 2014 by marcjb

[firmness]

Finding the right person - for a life long relationship - isn't easy. There is no formula or recipe that we can follow that guarantees we will find the right person. ...

For the record, I am also more than happy for my partner to have contact with his ex, and to have friends of the opposite gender - because he is an honourable man and I trust him implicitly to keep appropriate boundaries with other women. If I could not trust him to do that, I would not be interested in being his partner.

 

Well said i's. I agree wholeheartedly with this. AND I agree with OP!

 

Geez, this all feels so unresolvable at times.

 

There are no formulas, but one thing I have learned over time is that the person IN love is usually the worst person to judge things. What may be a blind spot to someone in love is usually pretty evident to the people around him/her.

 

So while I agree - I too would resist anyone telling me who I could and could not be around, I also recognize that this can be a delicate matter depending on the circumstances.

 

I think we all want the same thing here - to be progressive, trusting, loyal, faithful, and happy. We also want to be free to a reasonable extent, and to make our mates happy while not being controlled, abused or manipulated about it. Does anyone really NOT want these things?

 

AND we are also exposed to a variety of temptations, while some people apparently sense ZERO temptations, which makes it nearly impossible to come to a closer understanding on these matters. They become moralistic and judgmental, instead of constructive and wholesome.

 

*sigh*

 

I need a drink and it is only 11:00 am here. What am I doing here?

[iiiii]

But don't you think that you actually create or destroy the "trust me enough" factor with your own attitudes and behaviors? If staying friends with an ex means wishing him a happy birthday or sending a christmas card it's one thing. If it means you want to let him buy you a nice dinner twice a month, or go over to his place to cuddle and watch a movie, then it's something else entirely.

 

Absolutely. I think it is important to make sure you both understand and agree what is "acceptable" behavior within the relationship, and I agree that it is imperative to act in a trustworthy fashion yourself.

 

However, if I had a partner who I couldn't trust - whose behavior I had to police just in case he was "tempted" to have sex with someone else - then I simply would not want to be in that relationship.

[Babolat]

I don't think it's right to keep people around that you have been intimate with before. I think that it's disrespectful to your current significant other and actually shows a bit of insecurity in the sense that a person is not secure in themselves or their current relationship and are afraid of being alone. They will usually project blame onto their new significant other calling them insecure or jealous.

 

The Rules of Opposite Gender Friendships | Foundation Restoration

 

Do you ever see couples that have been married for years who have friends of the opposite sex which only one of them hangs out or spends time with? No.

My best female friend is 46, still single and has dated a lot. I have noticed she talks often about exes and how they still text and talk on the phone; one is even married. One is going through a divorce. I have told her many times as a friend, if I were to date her, hypothetically speaking, all that would need to stop. I've also told her if she wants to find "the one" she should consider cutting off all the ex talk. It's keeping him from emotioanlly connecting with a good man.

 

I have no issues with two exes remaining friends, especially if children are involved. It's the context of that friendship that is important. In her case I know it's flirting, sex talk, why did we not work talk and the like. I as a partner would not put up with that. She tells me when she meets "the one" she will cut it all off; i say cut it off, now.

 

Just my opinion and I am not an insecure jealous type. I tend to agree, when a relationship is over, it's over, and needs to be.

[Babolat]

But I wonder if maintaining a relationship with these ex's affects (or is a symptom of) a person's ability to invest in a primary relationship.

 

This, well said.

[Babolat]

This thread is an interesting one to me mainly because reasonable people can disagree. After reading the responses a thought comes to mind.

 

There is no answer to the question "Should my partner have friends of the opposite sex" Well, there is an answer and it is "It depends"

 

I can only speak from my own experience. I prefer to have a woman who has overwhelmingly same-sex friends for about 20 reasons - most of which have already been expressed eloquently by others here.

 

Some other questions that come to mind when thinking about my own boundaries with my woman. These can be very tricky and I only think them in my head as I reflect on where we are and where things might be going:

 

1. Are ALL or most of her friends men?

2. What is the nature, quality, and quantity of her relationships with other women?

3. What stage of the relationship are we in, and is she "moving" along and being more mindful of these boundaries and making me feel good about things without me having to ask?

4. What has been her sexual history?

5. How often does she hang around other guy friends and how many of them are there?

6. What other signs is she giving off? Does she dress provocatively around these guys? Is she generally flirty? Is she crazy about me? (this is a tricky one)

7. Does she have children? Is she divorced? What is going on there?

8. How is she with my relationships with other women?

9. Would she tolerate the same from me? (This one could go either way)

10. Just to round it off to 10, how shady is she about texts, calls, extracurricular activities?

 

Ultimately if I feel that something is wrong, then something is wrong and it is either her or me. Either way, something is wrong.

 

If my girlfriend is too lovey dovey with other men, then I will shut my feelings down and do the same. This is only temporary. Women have equal power in this way to cheat, to nurture, to love, to lie, to deceive, to lift up and to respect. If I do not get enough of what I need, then it is on me to walk away.

 

And to paraphrase Bruce Banner in the Avengers, "my secret is that I am always willing to walk away."

 

I met a woman for lunch yesterday whom I met on an online dating site. All virtual chating to date. She mentioned she has mostly male friends because females are caddy and competitive. She said she has a few close female friends, but not many.

 

I have heard this a lot lately from woman, even my best female friend. I myself have a verly close female friend, as a man, and never really expected this in my life. I love our relationship as it differs a lot from my male friendships.

 

I dunno, I don't have an answer (and note I don't think the OP started the thread about male/female friendhsips, rather a female staying in contact with her exes). I'm not a woman, of course, so it's difficult for me to answer. I'm not sure I buy the whole "I have male friends because females are caddy" bit. Sometimes I think it's a way of saying "I have low self esteem - self worth, I'm not able to select my female friends wisely, so I have male friends, who give me "attention"".

[Babolat]

The Rules of Opposite Gender Friendships | Foundation Restoration

Thanks for posting this, a great read, and it makes sense to me.

[CarrieT]

She mentioned she has mostly male friends because females are caddy and competitive.

 

BTW, I think you mean "catty" - as in, cat-like in their predatory behaviors.

 

And, to some extent, I agree. In my 20s and 30s most of my female friends were very competitive and conniving which is why I had most male, gay friends.

 

Now, 20- and 30-years later, it is those male friends (gay and otherwise) who are still in my life while my long-term, female friends are few and far between. There are *some*, yes, but not as many as those male friends who have stuck by me.

[Babolat]

I have agreed with you on many other threads about this. What would I honestly do with a guy friend? Get our nails and hair done? Go shopping for pink stuff, shoes? Watch old episodes of Gossip Girl? I have acquaintances that are male that I find to be nice people, but I have zero reason to be texting them 20 times a day or to hang out with them if we aren't in a group setting.

When I am in a relationship I don't respond to private messages from men on Facebook even, they can say what they have to say in public where my guy can see.

 

People get so offended by the sexual aspect of cheating. That's not what hurts my feelings. Hundreds of messages to another woman talking to her about his problems and using pet names, spending time giving affection/attention to another woman, that is part of cheating that cuts me. It's really easy for things to become physical with "friends" like this as soon as your relationship hits a bump in the road.

My mother doesn't go for lunch or dinner with other men she meets and tell my father they are "just friends". I am not sure why that seems to have changed.

Great reply. I have been thinking about this a lot recently, with my female best friend. I even recently suggested to her that we are "emoptionally invloved" to the pooint where it may be keeping us from forming a dating relationship with another.

 

I get confused as I am sexaully attracted to her, she is a very attractive woman and turns a lot of heads, and I think "could we date?". Yet I'm not sure I could have sex with her. All of our close freinds aks me why we are not dating.

 

Then I think like you, why are we friends anyway? For example, yesterday she invited me to hang out with her at a festival. I did, we had fun, but once back home I'm thinkng, I could have done the same with a buddy, why her? It is a different relationship, one that's difficult to explain.

 

I personally am starting to think it's the emotional support I need from a woman, that she provides, and I provide for her as a man, and yes, it may be keeping me from developing that emotional bond-connection with another woman. I have recently backed off on our texting, I give shorter replies when she texts, I rarely initiate a text anymore, and I am not inviting her to do things together. I feel like I need to "back off" for a while.

[Babolat]

BTW, I think you mean "catty" - as in, cat-like in their predatory behaviors. .

HaHa, I did, I even Googled "caddy" while typing out this reply and could not find the word I was looking for.

[marcjb]

I don't think the OP started the thread about male/female friendhsips, rather a female staying in contact with her exes

She technically did not stay in touch with ex's. But I don't view any "friends" that they had sex with even once any differently. In our relationship we ended up getting past that because she agreed to cut contact. The issue that caused our break up was one particular male freind who she met after me when she went back to school.

 

She is 34 and I am 31. I also thought that maybe having a relationship with an older woman might be better, because she would be more mature. Boy, was I wrong. She is a very intelligent person, which is part of her that I love. As a correction though, she is mature, just not emotionally.

Edited June 16, 2014 by marcjb

[Babolat]

And, to some extent, I agree. In my 20s and 30s most of my female friends were very competitive and conniving which is why I had most male, gay friends.

 

Now, 20- and 30-years later, it is those male friends (gay and otherwise) who are still in my life while my long-term, female friends are few and far between. There are *some*, yes, but not as many as those male friends who have stuck by me.

Yes the girl I met for lunch, and many others, said exactly this, that her past female friends have competed with her/them, even hit on her/their bfs and act "catty" .

 

Isn't that more of a friend selection "issue" then a generalization about male versue female friends, though? Not judging, being my curious self!

[Teraskas]

I agree with both Marcjb and Jbelle on this.

I'm one of those guys like Marc who can't stand it either.

It just sicks me to the point that I can't take it anymore, considering I've been cheated on twice as a result of these "male friends".

 

Call me old fashioned, but this does NOT qualify as being labeled "controling".

If anything it's called "honesty" which not a lot of people seem to be capable of anymore these days, lol.

[salparadise]

She mentioned she has mostly male friends because females are caddy and competitive. [...] I have heard this a lot lately from woman, even my best female friend. [...] I'm not sure I buy the whole "I have male friends because females are caddy" bit. Sometimes I think it's a way of saying "I have low self esteem - self worth, I'm not able to select my female friends wisely, so I have male friends, who give me "attention"

 

I had a relationship with a woman several years ago, the first after my divorce, so rebound or exit relationship or whatever... it wasn't healthy. I refer to her as BSC woman. And she definitely was––a somatizing histrionic, infantile, disingenuous, hypersexual and displaying at least 2/3 of the cluster B symptoms. I was vulnerable and she took advantage with absolutely no conscience or remorse. Anyway, that kind of learning makes one extremely wary. She had a bunch of male friends and no female friends. The reason was because she was catty (the term doesn't do it justice) and the only way she connected was through the somatic sexualization. Women picked up on it and didn't trust her. It was ok by her as they didn't have anything she wanted anyway. Men, on the other hand, are drawn to it like moths to a flame in an addictive kind of way. She needed attention from multiple men, loved to play them against one another, and worked to keep several on the string at all times.

 

So I now have a visceral reaction when I hear about women with only opposite sex friends. I realize, even if they are seemingly healthy, that the underlying motivation has a similar origin. They crave the sexualized attention (sometimes referred to as narcissistic supply) and have little ability to form healthy friendships that aren't based on that. Therefore no girlfriends, only the male fan club members. And when it's finally revealed that the woman has slept with all of these "friends," it just confirms that it is what it is. Men, you're going to have a lot of sleepless nights if you fall for one of these, so beware. Close, long-term, same-sex friendships are something that healthy people have, and the absence of such is a huge red flag.

Edited June 16, 2014 by salparadise

[irc333]

Oh no! That's so disrespectful. I feel the past should just be the past and if you want a future with the new person you have to move on.

How can you be just friends with someone you were intimate with?

 

Apparently, there are a class of people out there that are friends with people...no matter what the situation. They do not discriminate.

 

Some may see this as a good thing, while they may label you as the "bad guy" who has a problem them continuing to be friends with people they used to date.

 

Speaking of Seinfeld, there was that one episode where George Costanza was dating a woman with a male roomate that apparently, he had a problem with that arrangement.

 

I know of a woman that rents her room out to a traveling male friend (travels for work a lot) and when he's in town, she's elated that she gets a break on the rent by him contributing funds towards the house...but apparently there's certain class of women that can maintain boundaries with former lovers, other male friends that they "hang out with" but none of which have any kind of romantic interest, some of it a questionably ambivalent situation.

 

Basically, these people are so comfortable in their own skin, they seem to be somewhat naive to the situation, but apparently had no consequences of thes crossing boundaries.....yet. Not to slap labels on anyone, but I refer to them as some kind of modern day hippie.

Edited June 17, 2014 by irc333

[kart180]

I know what you guys will say, go to the gym or even join classes. I could join a gym, it might work,

 

I am looking for a good health centric women or a curvy women who is straight edge( no drugs, no tobacco ever and sober)

[Omei]

I too prefer the kind of relationship where ex's are in total past OP it builds a strong trust.

 

When I get older ill be more accepting of ex friendships but in my age bracket (20s) more often ex friendships or contact usually means drama or lack of moving on.

Edited June 18, 2014 by Omei