Does anyone think the procedure to get a girl is too exhausting??

[Woggle]

It isn't if you don't want it to be. I am just myself and women can take it or leave it. It has worked so far.

[Revolver]

Pretty much.

 

I doubt it's a coincidence that my one and only GF (now ex) liked me for about a month before I asked her out. Once I knew she liked me, everything else was super easy.

 

The only real issue was that I had no idea she liked me until I took a risk. Which makes me wonder how many girls actually liked me, but I didn't know so I never asked them out. It actually kind of makes me feel bad to think that I missed out on possible girlfriends because I just didn't know that somebody may have learned kid me and I just didn't know.

 

This bothers me till this day

[somedude81]

Ugh, stupid auto correct. Thanks for making me see my error Revolver

 

It actually kind of makes me feel bad to think that I missed out on possible girlfriends because I just didn't know that somebody may have liked me and I just didn't know.

[Under The Radar]

Don't hate the player, hate the game ......

 

 

...... actually, you already hate the game.

 

 

Ok, so why should you compete for women in IRL and OLD?

 

 

The answer is simple: Because you want a girlfriend.

 

 

Your only other choice is to remain single ...... which judging by your posting history doesn't make you happy either.

 

 

It's reality.

 

 

BTW, here's another piece of advice: Shooting the messenger is not good for public relations .

[somedude81]

At a high school reunion I talked to a former classmate who said he spent every second of Spanish class for 2 years completely infatuated with me. We never spoke more than a few sentences together. I told him that I would have gone out with him in a heartbeat. His wife said that she had to almost tie him down to ask her out. All three of us started laughing so hard we couldn't stop. Many of us wish we could go back in time with our adult experience.

 

Heh, I remember being that guy in sophomore year of high school.

 

I remember sitting in a school bus and a couple of girls come up to me, "Hey somedude. Did you like Melissa Irvin" (who had since moved to a different school)

 

"Yeah, I did. How did you know."

 

"We just knew. How come you never talked to her?"

 

I didn't have an answer. At least to my defense I was 16 years old.

 

Though my ex was 20 when she had her secret crush on me, so apparently it still happens to people in college.

 

The best thing I can say is, if you like somebody regardless if you are a male or female, let them know. You never know what will happen if you do. But if you don't do anything, there is almost a 100% chance that nothing will happen.

[normal person]

 

Women have proved to me that trying to "get to know them" turns them off. They have said it to my face.

 

This is an odd statement. In my experience, taking a legitimate interest in a girl and trying to figure out what makes her tick turns her on as much as anything. People love talking about themselves.

 

When you express a genuine curiosity in a person it makes them feel special. Then when you offer up your own opinions/stories/experiences to supplement, you might empathize and bond with each other. It's a fun, sexy process. Have a legitimate conversation. Don't necessarily agree with everything she says. Challenge her ideas. Have a natural curiosity but don't compromise your own conventions. It creates a collateral sexual tension.

 

If you connect with someone organically you'll be amazed with the results and the ease of which things fall into place for you. I've met plenty of girls who appeared cold or hesitant at first. If the cards get played right, those same girls thaw out and want to go home with you when you're leaving. Not that that's what I'm/you're after, I'm just saying, there's a genuine way to connect to everyone.

 

 

Women are insecure.....and they need the guy to build them up and make them feel good. THATS why players and users are sooo successful with women. Because they know exactly what to say, how to say it, and when to say it.

 

Even if that was the case (which I'm not saying it is), would it be so hard to just bite the bullet and tell a girl what you think she wants to hear if you want/her a girlfriend that badly (assuming you think it)?

Think about this: obviously there's something you like about the girl, what harm does it do express it to her? Why not make her feel comfortable if you think she's insecure? That will improve your standing. Is it that much of an assault on your pride to tell another human being what you like about them?

 

 

I want a long term relationship.....but to get that, I need to get to know her, and find out who she is. Women nowadays dont want that. They have too many other guys knocking at the door.

 

A women is desired by a lot of guys and therefore doesn't want any sort of deep interpersonal connection? I'm not sure I follow.

[jay1983]

Yeah I just kinda gave up. If a women is interested she can pursue me, then I'll make some effort, otherwise I'll just stay single.

[gaius]

I loathe spending money, to the point I don't even pay my cell phone bill till 30 minutes before it's due. But taking out a chunk of change from the bank for my last first date was incredibly natural and satisfying. Nothing felt more right. Couldn't have stopped myself even if I wanted to.

 

It's not work if you actually want it.

[nofeelings22]

 

I want a long term relationship.....but to get that, I need to get to know her, and find out who she is. Women nowadays dont want that. They have too many other guys knocking at the door.

 

What age group are you in?

 

This is true of quite young girls. A majority of young ones are just looking to have some fun and not get into anything serious.

 

That's just the stage of life they are in.

[GoodOnPaper]

I hated the initial stages of dating -- exhausting is exactly the right word for it. I always wanted to get to the relationship stage quickly, which of course is a big attraction killer when you are dealing with girls in the 18-23 age range who are the kid-in-a-candy-store phase of their dating lives. I thought I was past my peak when I bailed out of singlehood -- my parents married when they were 19 -- but I should have actually been more patient and waited until I was more professionally established and the women were more relationship-minded.

 

A number of people of said that we struggling guys need to figure out what attracts women. I'd say that we first need to learn what really attracts US to a woman. The most exhausting part is the pressure -- either from the inside because we feel we are ultimately validated by sex/intimacy with women or from the outside messages about how our masculinity is low if we can't bed women on a regular basis. This really detracts from discovering what true connection we may or may not have with a particular woman.

[somedude81]

I hated the initial stages of dating -- exhausting is exactly the right word for it. I always wanted to get to the relationship stage quickly, which of course is a big attraction killer when you are dealing with girls in the 18-23 age range who are the kid-in-a-candy-store phase of their dating lives. I thought I was past my peak when I bailed out of singlehood -- my parents married when they were 19 -- but I should have actually been more patient and waited until I was more professionally established and the women were more relationship-minded.

 

A number of people of said that we struggling guys need to figure out what attracts women. I'd say that we first need to learn what really attracts US to a woman. The most exhausting part is the pressure -- either from the inside because we feel we are ultimately validated by sex/intimacy with women or from the outside messages about how our masculinity is low if we can't bed women on a regular basis. This really detracts from discovering what true connection we may or may not have with a particular woman.

 

Same here. I hate dating. But being in a relationship was so much easier and more fun. Even though I was suddenly dumped without warning after six months, it didn't feel hard at all to keep a relationship going. Though maybe she secretly hated me the whole time, and I never knew.

[Glinda.Good]

Nobody can prove to me its worth trying to get a date anymore.

 

Is somebody trying to? I don't think so.

 

With all the social media, dating sites, and dating apps....many women are getting bombarded with attention from all sides.

Must be fun!

 

Why should I compete for her attention when I know nothing about her?

Good question! Why would you?

 

Why invest time and energy into a woman when I have no clue that shes even gives a f*ck about me?

Since you feel this way, of course you should not!

 

I dont see any women putting forth 1 ounce of effort.....yet they can sit back and assume that its my job to track them down and invest my effort???

Do they really think that is your job?

 

The whole idea of a PROCEDURE to GET A GIRL is just …

 

It's not about playing a game, jumping through any hoops, or "getting" a THING. It's social activity. If you dislike it, and maybe even don't like women (which seems to be a pretty major thing around here) then why even fight yourself? Just say NO!

 

There are plenty of men and women who enjoy each others company. They might be having a good time together.

[normal person]

I have a serious knack for reading between the lines, and figuring people out when sitting face to face having a discussion. I think the problem is that most guys only care about the womans looks, and pursuing their agenda with her. I on the other hand, am genuinely trying to get to know the woman, and I'm betting I may be the first guy that has done that with many of them. Instead of the cliched back and forth flirting, I ask real questions, and have a real conversation and I think many of these women just arent up for that right from the start. They want me to just take them for their looks at face value, and like them for that, and compliment them on it. But why would I invest that in someone I dont know?

 

Well you need to find a happy balance. It can't feel cold and clinical like she's on a job interview. Learn about her but have fun doing it with her. You need to flirt with her during the process otherwise there's no sexual tension.

 

Women just expect the guy to dish out compliments and treat her "special" right from the start. But why? I dont know you from Adam....so why would I give you special treatment and invest time and emotion when I dont know you? This is why there is a problem in the courting in our society. Because its all backwards. The woman should prove her worth before I treat her like a princess. But many women expect it to be the other way around.

 

In a perfect world, yes. But the world isn't perfect and complaining about it isn't going to help. If the girl has something you want (herself), then you have to play by her rules to get it. She has the power in the situation and she's not going to give up something that's advantageous to her because it's "not fair" to someone else. She gets that mentality when other men give it to her, so in a very subjective way, she actually is "worth it" to some people. If she at some point demands more than she's worth, she'll get a reality check and have to reevaluate herself and what she can garner. That's how it works. You can always make her want you and then construct the situation as you like it and bypass whatever aspects you think are unnecessary.

[ThaWholigan]

Well, this thread went into a typical direction

 

I mostly agree with normal person though. Figuring out what makes the woman tick has become incredibly exciting for me. Don't get me wrong - I still get nervous as all hell, but that feeling is accompanied by excitement nowadays.

[joystickd]

It's only exhausting if you over think the whole interaction.

[joystickd]

If the girl has something you want (herself), then you have to play by her rules to get it. She has the power in the situation and she's not going to give up something that's advantageous to her because it's "not fair" to someone else. She gets that mentality when other men give it to her, so in a very subjective way, she actually is "worth it" to some people. If she at some point demands more than she's worth, she'll get a reality check and have to reevaluate herself and what she can garner. That's how it works. You can always make her want you and then construct the situation as you like it and bypass whatever aspects you think are unnecessary.

 

Actually I always saw dating having a potential for creating a win-win situation. If you as a man think she has the power in the situation then that is a problem. That's not a win win situation. It's why I have an issue with women that make men wait to have sex under the pretense of getting to know them. That is for that woman's benefit not the man's. No win win right there.

 

You can't make anyone want you. It's either they do or they don't and if they do just make sure you don't say any crazy sh*t to turn them off. Making someone want you is manipulation and that is definitely not a win win situation.

[Glinda.Good]

Why would I flirt with someone I dont know??

 

It's fun???

[normal person]

How can you have fun and avoid the job interview feeling when all the women refuse to do anything except meet for coffee?????????

 

We'll probably need some more detail on this. Where are you interacting with this women? At a bar? Why do you think they only want to meet for coffee and refuse anything else?

 

Why would I flirt with someone I dont know?? NOBODY on this forum in the past few years has EVER been able to give a logical answer to that.

 

Because you like what you see and you have an irrational, illogical biological desire to be with them. It's inherently illogical, no wonder no one can give you a logical answer to it. Why do are you attracted to some people and not others? You can qualify some of your answers "I don't like overweight girls, I only like thin blonde, smart, funny girls." But go a few layers deeper and you'll find yourself disqualifying some blonde, thin, smart, funny girls in favor others and you won't be able to explain why. For whatever reason that we can't always explain, we like some people a lot more than others.

 

If I dont know her as a person, how am I supposed to flirt and be attracted to her??

 

Do really consider knowing someone a prerequisite to being attracted to them? Have you ever seen a stranger, model, or actress -- someone you didn't know -- that you were attracted to? How about instead of considering every woman on planet Earth in your search, narrow it down to just people you find physically attractive that you're naturally drawn to. Flirt with just them and then make your next cut based on your next parameter, whatever it is. Plenty of physically attractive people will reveal their less than desirable personality traits and then you can remove them from contention.

 

When a guy sees a pretty woman that he never met, and he flirts with her, his words have no meaning behind them. They are nothing more than words he could use on 100 other women.....because theres no intimate connection or knowledge with her yet.

 

If you assume every single guy uses a generic pick up line, then yes. But most guys aren't that dumb nor women that gullible. How do you think relationships form? Every person in a relationship was a stranger to their partner at one point. You're making a lot of assumptions.

[normal person]

Actually I always saw dating having a potential for creating a win-win situation. If you as a man think she has the power in the situation then that is a problem.

 

I agree. But a lot of times it seems that is the default situation. If OP likes a girl and she's indifferent towards him, she has the power.

 

 

You can't make anyone want you. It's either they do or they don't and if they do just make sure you don't say any crazy sh*t to turn them off. Making someone want you is manipulation and that is definitely not a win win situation.

 

I disagree. You can make people want you without any sort of deceit. Win them over with humor, talent, charisma, or any desirable quality that isn't immediately visible. Put what you've got on display (not desperately, of course), and if it's something they like, they'll take notice. It's worked for me plenty.

[pteromom]

Most women keep a wall up around them when they first meet a guy.

 

All people do this. It's not smart to just give some random person you just met access into your inner self. You have to get an idea of who they are and whether you can trust them first.

 

I on the other hand, am genuinely trying to get to know the woman, and I'm betting I may be the first guy that has done that with many of them. Instead of the cliched back and forth flirting, I ask real questions, and have a real conversation and I think many of these women just arent up for that right from the start. They want me to just take them for their looks at face value, and like them for that, and compliment them on it. But why would I invest that in someone I dont know?

 

You are right. You can't just START with the heavy stuff. First, you start with the light stuff. Music, tv, weather, food... just to see if you are on the same page and can keep conversation going. To see if you communicate on the same wavelength.

 

THEN if that all checks out, you start going deeper. But yes, if you start with heavy topics, you are going to scare women away. Not because she is hiding herself from you in some sort of plan to make you fall for her looks, but because what you are doing is so outside the norm socially that you make her uncomfortable.

 

Women just expect the guy to dish out compliments and treat her "special" right from the start. But why? I dont know you from Adam....so why would I give you special treatment and invest time and emotion when I dont know you?

 

Why can't we all treat each other as special? It's called respect. And the only way to form a deeper relationship is to invest time and emotion into each other.

 

You can't go from strangers to a couple with a deep meaningful connection without doing the work in between.

 

The woman should prove her worth before I treat her like a princess. But many women expect it to be the other way around.

 

So don't go out with women who expect to be treated like princesses. There are plenty of us out there who just want a nice equal partnership and have no desire to live up on a pedestal.

 

OP - dating should not be a "procedure".

 

The steps aren't that difficult. Talk to women you are attracted to. If you feel a mutual interest, ask her out. If that date goes well, ask her out again. Repeat until successful.

 

What makes it exhausting is getting too emotionally invested in asking someone out and having too many expectations built up. Then you find yourself overthinking things, analyzing everything she says or does, making drama out of nothing, etc. If you keep it simple and just go for it, it isn't exhausting.

 

The other thing is to go into it with no expectations. The truth is there are only a small % of women who want to date AND are compatible with you (not just you; that's true for everyone.) So of the girls you ask out, some of them will already be in relationships. Some will be getting over relationships, focused on other things in their life, or otherwise not looking to date. There will be a few who just aren't attracted to you - and that is OK... we all have certain features and traits we find attractive and others we don't. There could be a very beautiful woman but her voice sounds exactly like your mom's... and that could put you off to the point where you didn't find her attractive, but it wouldn't be her fault. That stuff happens. So you can't take rejection personally.

 

And you can't wait too long to ask a girl out. You can't watch her from afar, dream about her, and build her up to this image of perfection in your mind. That just sets you up for failure. Instead, as soon as you feel the pull of attraction, talk to her. Then if you are rejected, it doesn't really matter because you've lost nothing.

 

It's not a procedure. Just take a deep breath, talk to people, and focus on finding those who you can connect with.

[joystickd]

I agree. But a lot of times it seems that is the default situation. If OP likes a girl and she's indifferent towards him, she has the power.

 

 

 

 

I disagree. You can make people want you without any sort of deceit. Win them over with humor, talent, charisma, or any desirable quality that isn't immediately visible. Put what you've got on display (not desperately, of course), and if it's something they like, they'll take notice. It's worked for me plenty.

 

They wanted you from the beginning there was some curiosity. You can't make someone want you. They either do or dont. If that were the case the guys that complain about the friend zone could get out lol

[normal person]

They wanted you from the beginning there was some curiosity. You can't make someone want you. They either do or dont. If that were the case the guys that complain about the friend zone could get out lol

 

You could look at it that way, or you could consider that desirable qualities are the engine of change in peoples' opinions. I do think guys have it a lot easier than girls because we're more concerned with a girl's looks. Those can only be changed so much. But women are less concerned with looks and more apt to desire more malleable aspects of guy; traits that can be developed and learned. I think you ask around here you'll find a lot of women who weren't attracted to their boyfriend/husband at first but then became so later on.

[Haydn]

flirting is natural, I Flirt with girl in Tesco 's express.

[pteromom]

Obviously I'll be single the rest of my life then. Because I dont know how to play all these social f'n games that the rest of you play with each other face-to-face....lying, bending the truth, sugar coating, making each other feel comfortable....I will never know how to be anything but myself, which is upfront and honest. Everyone else knows how to balance the line of bullsh*t and charisma when they meet for a date....so theres no point in me even trying anymore.

 

It's not about being fake or playing games. It's just about showing the basics first.

 

You have movies you like, right? And music? And books you've read? And stories about where you live, friends, past experiences? THAT's where you start... finding the connection.

 

You don't go right into the meaning of life, expectations in relationships, past baggage, your goals for the future, your dysfunctional family, etc. on the first date. You save that stuff for when you've reeled them in so they won't run away... oh wait, no (LOL). You save that stuff for after you make the initial connection and establish that both of you want to go to the next step.

 

Still - if getting into the deep stuff and hating chit-chat and flirting is who you are, it is not impossible to find someone who feels the same way you do. She may be harder to find, but if that is who you feel you are, then be who you are and know that you are going to have to keep digging to find her. Don't give up though. That won't get you anywhere.

[joystickd]

Not true......at least not in Ohio.

 

Because I know 4 married couples where each of the women absolutely HATED their husbands when they first met them. I was actually with 2 of the guys the first time they met their future wives....and it was like trying to mix oil and water. But after a few more meetings between them, the guys start to "grow" on them....and for some unknown stupid reason, the women all ended up dating the guys.

 

I'm sure many of you have also heard of situations where the woman stated that "she couldnt stand him when we first met". But as I said, somehow these guys find a way to manipulate the situation, and get a woman to find something attractive about being with them.

She said she couldn't stand them but on a deeper level there was some curiosity about that man. On some level she was interested so the absolute hate was never there.