affair ten years ago?

[jjsk]

Do NOT ask for a lie detector test. I read an article recently (backed up by research) that the worst thing one can do is to try to stop someone from cheating. It can actually make things worse.

 

firmness, do you have a link to this research by any chance?

I feel this way too. A lie detector must not be a silver bullet, otherwise most criminal cases would have been solved quickly and easily. I guess it's practically impossible to force someone tell the truth. If she has a lot at stake then nothing will convince her to give in.

 

That's because the roles weren't reversed. Honestly, if you did what she did, I promise you that it wouldn't sit well with her and she would be the one playing "Twenty Questions".

 

She had two relationships where she was cheated on. she simply moved on without asking a million questions, although it took her some tremendous will power to do that. But she had absolutely no reason to doubt me, rightly so. There was never a sliver of jealousy. It's possible that she would feel different if I actually cheated on her, but I'm not trying to find out

 

She said she will get over if I leave her. She will not beg or fall to my knees and let me wipe my feet off her. no matter how much I want that. I respect her for being so strong.

[road]

firmness, do you have a link to this research by any chance?

I feel this way too. A lie detector must not be a silver bullet, otherwise most criminal cases would have been solved quickly and easily. I guess it's practically impossible to force someone tell the truth. If she has a lot at stake then nothing will convince her to give in.

 

 

 

She had two relationships where she was cheated on. she simply moved on without asking a million questions, although it took her some tremendous will power to do that. But she had absolutely no reason to doubt me, rightly so. There was never a sliver of jealousy. It's possible that she would feel different if I actually cheated on her, but I'm not trying to find out

 

She said she will get over if I leave her. She will not beg or fall to my knees and let me wipe my feet off her. no matter how much I want that. I respect her for being so strong.

 

 

 

To base whether one get's the chair in the big house is not the same as getting the truth about an affair.

 

 

When a BF/GF cheats on you there are no need for questions. You dump them. Move on. End of story. There was no marriage.

 

 

Your WW is wrong if she truly believes that the way she handled being cheating on when single is the guide on how to handle being cheated on when married.

 

 

Or she is grasping at anything and everything to stop you from getting at the truth.

[drifter777]

I suspected something, found some evidence and confronted her. The truth did not come out easy and she only admitted doing things for which I had proof. No extra information was offered. She said I already know everything and I should stop digging for more and move on

This is pretty much always the case with a cheater. Most WS's will take the whole truth to their graves. The most you can hope for is truth about who, what, where, when and perhaps a few details just to keep you from digging too much deeper.

 

When I read what she said to you I see a wife confessing to an affair - to having a sexual relationship with another man. It's as clear as could be, but I don't think you will ever believe it until if/when you catch her in your bed with another man.

[mikethemechanic]

p.i is only good at catching what is currently occurring. Polygraph costs $500.00 and is yes or no with leading questions. Maybe you could get her drunk and get her to open up a little. A trick with detectives is to ask the suspect as too how the crime might have happened, this is a trap to get to the truth. Ask her opinion you could start with... You know the guy at work he thinks that his wife is having sex with om as a matter of fact she has already admitted to the affair but not the sexual aspect of it... Where could they be having sex I wonder, can you think of anyways they could have sex without getting found out? My personal favorite is the columbo technique. Tell your wife that ic is going well but the psychologist needs to know various details for his notes. Now start with hunny 2000 you said that you went to visit your mother right. When I told that to the psychologist he said that was impossible because your mother was in Florida that day. I'm just trying to get these details right for his notes. Get the drift?

[lolablue17]

p.i is only good at catching what is currently occurring. Polygraph costs $500.00 and is yes or no with leading questions. Maybe you could get her drunk and get her to open up a little. A trick with detectives is to ask the suspect as too how the crime might have happened, this is a trap to get to the truth. Ask her opinion you could start with... You know the guy at work he thinks that his wife is having sex with om as a matter of fact she has already admitted to the affair but not the sexual aspect of it... Where could they be having sex I wonder, can you think of anyways they could have sex without getting found out? My personal favorite is the columbo technique. Tell your wife that ic is going well but the psychologist needs to know various details for his notes. Now start with hunny 2000 you said that you went to visit your mother right. When I told that to the psychologist he said that was impossible because your mother was in Florida that day. I'm just trying to get these details right for his notes. Get the drift?

 

I think she already made it clear that she wont take the polygraph, even if it means divorce.

 

she thinks that by asking for poly, he disrespects her and is trying to humiliate her. she is also fighting for control, and she really doesn't see him or care about him at all in that matter.

 

And of course there's the other thing - She knows she cheated, so she knows that poly means divorce anyway, so why should she cooperate?

 

I think that the past issue is over and the OP should decide whether he can clean the past in his mind and focus on the future, or if he can't do that he should just divorced her. It's his call.

Edited June 16, 2014 by lolablue17

[jjsk]

I think she already made it clear that she wont take the polygraph, even if it means divorce.

 

she thinks that by asking for poly, he disrespects her and is trying to humiliate her. she is also fighting for control, and she really doesn't see him or care about him at all in that matter.

 

And of course there's the other thing - She knows she cheated, so she knows that poly means divorce anyway, so why should she cooperate?

 

I think that the past issue is over and the OP should decide whether he can clean the past in his mind and focus on the future, or if he can't do that he should just divorced her. It's his call.

 

She said she would take it if i want it. And she "thinks" she would pass.

 

I read that polygraph results are not reliable as they are advertised to be. A friend told me this is not the way to go. No way to get the truth unless she decides to cooperate in which case the poly is not needed.

 

The main reason i want to know about the old affair(s) is to understand if she was ever in love with me or had any feelings. Or her decision to stay married was only to have financial comfort and a nice house to live in.

 

She is away right now. We won't see each other for another few days. The wait is agonizing. Lots of bad thoughts going through my head.

 

D was on her mind on and off for the last several years but she never did anything about it. She only talked to me once many years ago. She cried and was devastated and felt trapped when i didnt agree to proceed with the D and promised a change instead. I didnt change enough for her.

Edited June 16, 2014 by jjsk

[tom670]

She said she would take it if i want it. And she "thinks" she would pass.

 

I read that polygraph results are not reliable as they are advertised to be. A friend told me this is not the way to go. No way to get the truth unless she decides to cooperate in which case the poly is not needed.

 

The main reason i want to know about the old affair(s) is to understand if she was ever in love with me or had any feelings. Or her decision to stay married was only to have financial comfort and a nice house to live in.

 

She is away right now. We won't see each other for another few days. The wait is agonizing. Lots of bad thoughts going through my head.

 

D was on her mind on and off for the last several years but she never did anything about it. She only talked to me once many years ago. She cried and was devastated and felt trapped when i didnt agree to proceed with the D and promised a change instead. I didnt change enough for her.

 

Polygraphs aren't the end all be all however, you may get the "parking lot confession"before you go in.

They are not the greatest thing since sliced bread but it is a means to an end.

[alwayshere]

Yeah, that is one of the problems with polys. Someone who is determined to believe they are being lied to can just dismiss a passed test as "lucky" or "unreliable."

 

A WW who is keeping info secret deserves no pity.

 

But I feel for someone who really IS telling the truth.

[William]

As a reminder to members, pursuant to published (at the top of this forum) policy, while content from past threads of a thread starter is admissible, any reference to such content or comments on such content, as it relates to the current topic at hand, shall include both a link to the actual post as well as a quote of the content being brought forward for clarification or comment. Other than that, postings are to be focused on the content in this thread, without exception. Thanks!

[tom670]

jjsk just curious as to her latest trip where did she go?

Was it to visit family or business and did you verify just throwing it out there sorry.

[jjsk]

Yeah, that is one of the problems with polys. Someone who is determined to believe they are being lied to can just dismiss a passed test as "lucky" or "unreliable."

 

A WW who is keeping info secret deserves no pity.

 

But I feel for someone who really IS telling the truth.

 

Right, she could be telling the truth at this point. But now she is being controlled, interrogated, monitored and every move scrutinized by me because of possibly a single mistake, albeit a big one.

 

There were so many posts here which said dump her. I guess any person who ever cheated instantly becomes a second rate citizen and deserves to suffer forever (and god forbid marry again, because once a cheater is always a cheater, right? I don't view the world this way. Everyone has a right to screw up, learn from it, move on and be happy.

 

Her recent trip had nothing to do with EA etc. Not related, period. Some posts here are more paranoid than mine. Kids not mine, she is sleeping around, etc etc

 

BTW she is reluctant to tell her family about what happened. To me that is a sign that she is remorseful even though she tries not to show that side to me.

[2sunny]

What did she want you to change about yourself and what didn't you feel you didn't change enough?

[jjsk]

What did she want you to change about yourself and what didn't you feel you didn't change enough?

 

criticism, "neglected her", some anger issues (raising voice, but I have not ever done anything physical or called names etc), not engaging sufficiently with family/kids activities, not going out with friends (she would many times go by herself or with kids and they would ask "so where is your H"), not inviting people over for parties etc.. (I've got some social phobia/introversion issues) Yes I know it's not an excuse for what she did.. but it is kind of. She though I had Asperger's or bipolar or depression, something like that, but I've not been diagnosed with anything and not sure I want a label put on me and drugged up. I've tried some anti-depressant pills they did not help a whole lot, or only for a short time.. Hated the side effects

Edited June 16, 2014 by jjsk

[2sunny]

As far as the phobia for socializing - do you two have any married couples you're comfortable going out with? Even if it's a movie where you aren't forced to "interact with" on a demanding level...?

 

I do think if one partner is more social and the other isn't - it important to feed into that "social side" every week or so by doing an outing FOR the one who is more social.

 

It could be dinner out - but I mention the movie because you aren't forced to carry a conversation so much as just going and getting out with your wife as well as being friendly to others.

 

How much effort have you made to satisfy her "social needs"?

 

If not much - are you willing to make effort to change that?

 

And words - you can use words to boost another person up or tear them down - what approach would you say your words are used? Loving and kind words toward your family or not so kind?

[jjsk]

And words - you can use words to boost another person up or tear them down - what approach would you say your words are used? Loving and kind words toward your family or not so kind?

 

I usually end up tearing up the other person. Not sure why but it just comes out that way. I'm trying to change but it's hard.

 

I wonder if it's because my father was very critical of my mother. she had an affair when I was a pre-teen. He wanted to kick her out, but she threatened to take children with her and he would never see us again. So he stayed, but I don't think they ever reconciled. He remained critical and punished her for the rest of his life. My parents thought I didn't know about the affair so they kept quiet about it even when I tried to 'probe'. Imagine being lied to by mom and dad for many years and knowing that you are being lied to.

 

I'd hate to follow my farther steps. I don't want to be a bitter critical person forever. whatever it takes, but starting over with a new wife is not going to work. I will end up in the same position I'm in now, either divorced or cheated on.

Edited June 16, 2014 by jjsk

[2sunny]

I usually end up tearing up the other person. Not sure why but it just comes out that way. I'm trying to change but it's hard.

 

You are mean to people when you go out?

 

You don't know why isn't an answer. You know exactly why you would do something like that - you can control yourself. There's no excuse for being mean to others with no reason.

 

Is that really the way you act when you guys go out with others?

 

You didn't answer the other questions.

 

How often do you two go out?

 

Are you willing to change yourself/ the way you participate?

[2sunny]

I usually end up tearing up the other person. Not sure why but it just comes out that way. I'm trying to change but it's hard.

 

I wonder if it's because my father was very critical of my mother. she had an affair when I was a pre-teen. He wanted to kick her out, but she threatened to take children with her and he would never see us again. So he stayed, but I don't think they ever reconciled. He remained critical and punished her for the rest of his life. My parents thought I didn't know about the affair so they kept quiet about it even when I tried to 'probe'. Imagine being lied to by mom and dad for many years and knowing that you are being lied to.

 

I'd hate to follow my farther steps. I don't want to be a bitter critical person forever. whatever it takes, but starting over with a new wife is not going to work. I will end up in the same position I'm in now, either divorced or cheated on.

 

Blaming your father for your bad behavior is not useful.

You are responsible for your actions and words.

 

Since you saw what a piss poor example as a father - one might think you'd have a clear understanding of what not to do/say.

 

These are things you can control = you/yourself.

[Charlie Harper]

I usually end up tearing up the other person. Not sure why but it just comes out that way. I'm trying to change but it's hard.

 

I wonder if it's because my father was very critical of my mother. she had an affair when I was a pre-teen. He wanted to kick her out, but she threatened to take children with her and he would never see us again. So he stayed, but I don't think they ever reconciled. He remained critical and punished her for the rest of his life. My parents thought I didn't know about the affair so they kept quiet about it even when I tried to 'probe'. Imagine being lied to by mom and dad for many years and knowing that you are being lied to.

 

I'd hate to follow my farther steps. I don't want to be a bitter critical person forever. whatever it takes, but starting over with a new wife is not going to work. I will end up in the same position I'm in now, either divorced or cheated on.

 

My advice, don't be a control freak, in life THERE IS NOTHING YOU CAN CONTROL. (not even your own bladder when you are old), so let go forgive and live, or continue to poison yourself with hate.

[Charlie Harper]

An yes I was cheated by my wife 13 years ago. (in case you are wondering)

[jjsk]

You are mean to people when you go out?

 

You don't know why isn't an answer. You know exactly why you would do something like that - you can control yourself. There's no excuse for being mean to others with no reason.

 

Is that really the way you act when you guys go out with others?

 

You didn't answer the other questions.

 

How often do you two go out?

 

Are you willing to change yourself/ the way you participate?

 

may be I should start a new thread about this. unless you see a connection to figuring out whether my wife had more than one affair during our marriage.

 

I could be mean on occasion yes, more so in the privacy of my home. I honestly don't know why I'm snapping and being mean at times. I regret that almost immediately. I could be very nice and kind too. I'm unstable like an alcoholic, except I don't drink. I want to change yes

 

we go out often just the two of us. I don't have a problem with that. It's only an issue with meeting new people or someone who is not in my close circle..

[2sunny]

may be I should start a new thread about this. unless you see a connection to figuring out whether my wife had more than one affair during our marriage.

 

I could be mean on occasion yes, more so in the privacy of my home. I honestly don't know why I'm snapping and being mean at times. I regret that almost immediately. I could be very nice and kind too. I'm unstable like an alcoholic, except I don't drink. I want to change yes

 

we go out often just the two of us. I don't have a problem with that. It's only an issue with meeting new people or someone who is not in my close circle..

 

I think you could benefit from professional guidance.

 

Individual counseling could help you overcome the fears that define you.

 

It could help if you present a list to who's helping you which may look like this:

 

I wish to change these things about myself...

 

Stop yelling at my family

Stop yelling at new people

Find out why I intend to hurt new people I meet

Find out why I tell my wife I love her when I think she's cheated

Find out where my boundary is that makes ME healthy

Understand better to overcome my childhood experiences

Learn new ways to communicate effectively

What it looks like when a person earns my trust

How to control MY feelings

How not to control everyone I love

How to live and be happy with myself

How to have appropriate boundaries in sharing info with my kids about me and my wife

What healthy forgiveness might look like

How to build intimacy within my marriage

How to help my wife feel safe when she's with me

How to make NEW friends by being a friend to others

How to learn about my wife, my marriage and whether or not to trust her

How to honor myself

How to build my self esteem

How to live a life of balance

 

Can you seek help for yourself with those concepts in mind?

[alwayshere]

I'll get flamed for this, and let me make it clear that an A is always wrong and always the responsibility of the cheater.

 

However.....if you cannot see the connection between going off on and criticizing your wife at home constantly and her vulnerability to an A, you are not looking very hard.

[jjsk]

I'll get flamed for this, and let me make it clear that an A is always wrong and always the responsibility of the cheater.

 

However.....if you cannot see the connection between going off on and criticizing your wife at home constantly and her vulnerability to an A, you are not looking very hard.

 

It was not not constant. There were dark times and good times. But the good times never lasted over six or eight months before I'd lose it and enter into a bad phase.

 

I've had this problem for over a decade so if the recent EA was the *only* thing she did then she is a saint in my eyes.

 

Going to the IC tomorrow and will see what he says. The sessions are short 40 min, once a week and he does not take notes. It feels like it will take ages to get to the bottom of this.

[carhill]

Going to the IC tomorrow and will see what he says. The sessions are short 40 min, once a week and he does not take notes. It feels like it will take ages to get to the bottom of this.

 

With a good psych, you'll find that to be plenty of time IMO, and our MC never took notes during session and remembered things we told him at the beginning over a year later. Steel trap. Hope your IC goes well. If there's still love, and your W is open to working things out, you all might make it. That love part is important IME. Difference between potential R and D.

[jjsk]

I'm tempted to say to her that she did the right thing. She paid back, with interest, for the way I was treating her. But I still want to know the truth of just how far she went. The pain is unbearable.