My (not unique) story...

[Oberfeldwebel]

My wife and I are actually communicating and talking. MC has made us BOTH see that we had issues... and I've been NC with the OW for over a month now. Isn't that some kind of progress?

 

Absolutely. The fact that you both are in counseling and working on the problem is definitely progress. I believe that most relationships can be fixed, if both parties work to fix the problem. It is not easy, but it can be done. Best wishes to you and your family.

[shermanator]

Do you mean progress back from where YOU put your marriage in the truck and drove it over the cliff?

 

This isn't about what you wife has or hasn't done. You're only in charge of you and responsible for your actions. If you were truly remorseful - which you don't seem to be - you'd be proactive and accountable in making things right.

 

That would look like this:

 

1). Honesty

2). Transparency

3). Integrity

4). Communication

5). Decisiveness

6). Compassion

 

And you'd do this if for no other reason than that's the type of person you want to be going forward. And maybe that would even be the type of person your wife would want to be married to - at least she'd have a real choice rather than this dodgy dance you've engaged her in...

 

Mr. Lucky

 

This is exactly what I've started doing, in line with what my wife has told me she 'wants' to know. She's not interested in knowing more about the A or what happened... we BOTH want to work on US, to make things better moving forward.

 

If we discover that we cannot make it work or we are too much like oil and vinegar, then we will work on a co-parenting solution.

[shermanator]

Absolutely. The fact that you both are in counseling and working on the problem is definitely progress. I believe that most relationships can be fixed, if both parties work to fix the problem. It is not easy, but it can be done. Best wishes to you and your family.

 

Thank you for the kind response.

 

Whether you're dating, married, friends, co-workers, whatever... saying goodbye to someone after a long time is HARD. Going NC is HARD. Working on putting a relationship back together is HARD.

[Mr. Lucky]

This is exactly what I've started doing, in line with what my wife has told me she 'wants' to know. She's not interested in knowing more about the A or what happened... we BOTH want to work on US, to make things better moving forward.

 

Have you had any contact with your AP?

 

Given your wife's insistence on ignoring the elephant in the room, what would "moving forward" look like for your marriage?

 

Mr. Lucky

[bobwhite007]

So, about 18 months ago, I started noticing a woman at my gym... I didn't even go out of my way to talk to her for a long time, just found myself looking for her and getting bummed when she wasn't there. I considered leaving the gym, but couldn't bring myself to do it. It's a small gym and all the members know each other, so it was easy to have casual communication.

 

About seven months ago, we eventually started talking more, texting, etc, until she was all I was thinking about... after five months of talking/texting/visiting her at her place, we finally caved in and slept together. We were only together, off and on, six or seven times, until we couldn't take the guilt anymore... we agreed to step back until I figured out what to do with my marriage. She's told me that she loves me and can see a life with me and my kids - understanding how messy things might be.

 

My wife (married 12 years, 3 kids) has no idea, I think... she's noticed me being distracted and we haven't had sex in a while (but that's not totally uncommon - we've had some dry spells during the last 12 years), but she hasn't accused me of anything.

 

I know all the cliches... it won't work with the new woman, it's lust, etc. The OW and I have even talked about our relationship is just a fantasy right now - no bills, no daily routine, no boredom, etc, but that hasn't stopped anything or put a damper on me wanting to be with her.

 

I tried to ignore my feelings for so long, but something kept pulling me toward this other woman... I didn't even think my marriage was awful, but something must have been missing for me to take this step.

 

I know my story isn't special, but I'm just looking for some feedback from someone who's been through the same thing. I've left the gym and I'm not talking/texting with the OW right now, but nothing has changed... I'm still dying to be with her.

Maybe she knows all about it and really couldn't care less, or maybe she's too busy with her own activities.

[shermanator]

Have you had any contact with your AP?

 

Given your wife's insistence on ignoring the elephant in the room, what would "moving forward" look like for your marriage?

 

Mr. Lucky

 

The AP sent me an email last week... she said she's wondering how I'm doing. She mentioned that she's met someone, but doesn't feel the same way about him that she felt about me. He's fine, but the draw and connection isn't the same as the one she had with me, basically.

 

"Moving forward" would equal transparency with my wife. Because she doesn't want to know everything, it's hard to be completely open and honest.

[CarrieT]

"Moving forward" would equal transparency with my wife. Because she doesn't want to know everything, it's hard to be completely open and honest.

When/If you ask her if she is happy in the marriage, what does she say?

 

If you were to ask her that to be completely happy and fulfilled in the marriage you need to be able to share your inner-most fears/desires/actions/thoughts, how do you think she would respond?

[Oberfeldwebel]

The AP sent me an email last week... she said she's wondering how I'm doing. She mentioned that she's met someone, but doesn't feel the same way about him that she felt about me. He's fine, but the draw and connection isn't the same as the one she had with me, basically.

 

"Moving forward" would equal transparency with my wife. Because she doesn't want to know everything, it's hard to be completely open and honest.

 

I think you should respond to your former OW, that you love your wife and the two of you are working on your issues. Out of respect for your wife you request that she refrain from contacting you and allow them the time to mend the relationship. Additionally, that you wish her well in her and that she finds someone as special as you have found in your wife.

 

Do not give her reason to have confidence that you and her have a future, nor should it be fondly remembering the past. This is not helpful to either woman that you profess to care about. You need to focus on mending your relationship, that is your main concern. Don't be distracted by the OW trying to fish for information. As a wise man once said: "The main thing is to keep the main thing the main thing".

[shermanator]

When/If you ask her if she is happy in the marriage, what does she say?

 

If you were to ask her that to be completely happy and fulfilled in the marriage you need to be able to share your inner-most fears/desires/actions/thoughts, how do you think she would respond?

 

She says that she's happy. Our MC has told her that she has serious denial issues.

 

About the 2nd part, I don't think she wants to hear it. She's told me that she can't handle the full truth.

[shermanator]

I think you should respond to your former OW, that you love your wife and the two of you are working on your issues. Out of respect for your wife you request that she refrain from contacting you and allow them the time to mend the relationship. Additionally, that you wish her well in her and that she finds someone as special as you have found in your wife.

 

Do not give her reason to have confidence that you and her have a future, nor should it be fondly remembering the past. This is not helpful to either woman that you profess to care about. You need to focus on mending your relationship, that is your main concern. Don't be distracted by the OW trying to fish for information. As a wise man once said: "The main thing is to keep the main thing the main thing".

 

This seems like good advice. I've been fretting about her email since I received it. She's still in my thoughts all the time and I wonder how she's doing. The two months of NC didn't do much to slow down my mind.

[shermanator]

I think you should respond to your former OW, that you love your wife and the two of you are working on your issues. Out of respect for your wife you request that she refrain from contacting you and allow them the time to mend the relationship. Additionally, that you wish her well in her and that she finds someone as special as you have found in your wife.

 

Do not give her reason to have confidence that you and her have a future, nor should it be fondly remembering the past. This is not helpful to either woman that you profess to care about. You need to focus on mending your relationship, that is your main concern. Don't be distracted by the OW trying to fish for information. As a wise man once said: "The main thing is to keep the main thing the main thing".

 

This seems like good advice. I've been fretting about her email since I received it. She's still in my thoughts all the time and I wonder how she's doing. The two months of NC didn't do much to slow down my mind.

 

I feel like I'm still very much in love with the OW.

[minimariah]

This seems like good advice. I've been fretting about her email since I received it. She's still in my thoughts all the time and I wonder how she's doing. The two months of NC didn't do much to slow down my mind.

 

be careful with this... if you respond to her, you might reactivate your A. you know best of you're ready for that & the consequences or not.

 

as far as your W goes... not sure what to tell you. not sure if you can even build something, let alone repair with someone who keeps refusing to openly communicate. a lot of "fixing" is on you, she kind of..... checked out on some level.

[66Charger]

And it's easy to drop in, attack me, write some stuff about sailing different waters and move on. I'm not pining or fantasizing about the OW. Yes, I still think about her - just like I would anyone who was part of my life for years.

 

My wife and I are actually communicating and talking. MC has made us BOTH see that we had issues... and I've been NC with the OW for over a month now. Isn't that some kind of progress?

 

 

Yesterdays post

[66Charger]

 

I feel like I'm still very much in love with the OW.

 

Today's post

[shermanator]

Today's post

 

They weren't exactly 'yesterday' and 'today,' but I see your point.

 

I feel like my wife and I ARE making progress, but I also feel like I still love the OW.

 

I can't just shut off that switch and not have the feelings anymore. I've used a strategy from therapy (I think it's a kind of behavior therapy), where I acknowledge the old feelings and say 'thanks for coming by' or something along those lines when the mind movies start playing.

 

It's helpful, but I still have the feelings.

[GollumsNightmare]

If you want to truly move on from this awful situation, no contact, no contact, no contact. The only thing the OW should hear from you is *crickets*.

[shermanator]

So... I told my wife that I got the email and that it kind of weirded me out hearing from the OW, but that I didn't respond (the truth).

 

She flipped out and told me that, if I'm the kind of guy that can even have other feelings/emotions/get distracted for one second by another woman, I'm a jerk and I just tore our family apart. She is going to let everyone know what kind of jerk I am.

 

It's partially my fault because I told her outside of the MC office, which is a big no no. All our conversations go better in the office.

 

Not sure what's going to happen next.

 

Part of me feels relieved that I told her the truth and part of me is pretty terrified that my marriage is over because I told her about the email and how it made me feel.

[Mr. Lucky]

If your marriage is going to recover, your wife is going to have to deal with the truth. For her own good, above all. This is the result of events you set in motion many months ago.

 

You've been driving the bus to this point, might just be a passenger from here on out. Hope things work out - whatever that currently means to you...

 

Mr. Lucky

[shermanator]

If your marriage is going to recover, your wife is going to have to deal with the truth. For her own good, above all. This is the result of events you set in motion many months ago.

 

You've been driving the bus to this point, might just be a passenger from here on out. Hope things work out - whatever that currently means to you...

 

Mr. Lucky

 

Yep... totally agree. I had a phone conversation with the MC today who said "the bad news is that the sh*t hit the fan. The good news is that the sh*t hit the fan."

 

When I told her the OW emailed me (and that I didn't respond) she got so dark and so nasty, I'm not sure my W is someone I want to be with. It was awful.

[violet1]

Holy cow! I just realized you started this thread almost a year ago and you are basically still in the same spot. You still pine over the OW and can't decide if you want to stay married or not. Do you seriously wonder why your wife freaked out? Do you not think she's entitled to be a bit angry with you? I'm guessing the AP's email to you was a huge trigger for her.

 

 

Honestly, I think divorce would be the best for both of you. I get you feel like your feelings for the OW can't be turned off instantly. However, if your heart was truly invested in reconciliation, your perspective of the OW would have started changing by now. If your heart was truly in it, you would feel disgusted with yourself and your AP for causing so much pain to your wife and children. Based purely on your posts, you don't seem to feel any remorse. I could be wrong, but I don't think reconciliation can work without it. I think it's time to end this charade.

[beach]

So... I told my wife that I got the email and that it kind of weirded me out hearing from the OW, but that I didn't respond (the truth).

 

She flipped out and told me that, if I'm the kind of guy that can even have other feelings/emotions/get distracted for one second by another woman, I'm a jerk and I just tore our family apart. She is going to let everyone know what kind of jerk I am.

 

It's partially my fault because I told her outside of the MC office, which is a big no no. All our conversations go better in the office.

 

Not sure what's going to happen next.

 

Part of me feels relieved that I told her the truth and part of me is pretty terrified that my marriage is over because I told her about the email and how it made me feel.

 

I'm actually glad you told her outside the safety of the MC office. It gave you a true reaction from your wife...not a fake response designed to please the counselor.

 

Her denial is huge. Go ahead, let her be mad, let her tell everyone.

 

Your heart isn't in the marriage and your wife doesn't allow you to feel safe telling her your feelings - so how can you possibly make the M better? You can't when she wont allow you to present info she NEEDS to know and talk through.

 

Since you've wanted out and the M isn't getting on track - why not separate for a long while and be on your own? That way you can clear your mind and give thought to how to be happy on your own. You can also give thought to what you really want to include in your future.

 

Maybe IC would help you gain strength you need to be authentic instead of trying to fake things to please a wife who won't face what is real in her life and work on it.

 

Best for you to be happy with yourself rather than miserable or just average with any other person.

 

Good luck.

[cocorico]

So... I told my wife that I got the email and that it kind of weirded me out hearing from the OW, but that I didn't respond (the truth).

 

She flipped out and told me that, if I'm the kind of guy that can even have other feelings/emotions/get distracted for one second by another woman, I'm a jerk and I just tore our family apart. She is going to let everyone know what kind of jerk I am.

 

It's partially my fault because I told her outside of the MC office, which is a big no no. All our conversations go better in the office.

Not sure what's going to happen next.

 

Part of me feels relieved that I told her the truth and part of me is pretty terrified that my marriage is over because I told her about the email and how it made me feel.

 

It seems to me that you feel your marriage needs a third party - either the MC, to facilitate autheniticity between you and your W, or the OW, to facilitate some autheniticity within yourself. This is a concern. If you feel you cannot be authentic with your W, your choice is stark - opt for an inauthentic M with your W, where all the "real" stuff gets buried under a veneer of polite repectability, or leave your M and find a more authentic R elsewhere (whether with your OW, someone else, or just with yourself and your kids for the moment). It's a choice.

 

Your W has clearly indicated that she'd rather not know about your "dark" side - whether that's your drinking, your conflict around your OW, or anything else that forces her to confront a reality beyond the comfortable denial she needs to get her through the day. That's unlikely to change, even with MC. It seems she's just doing what she needs to do to make things smooth over as quickly as possible, rather than actually wanting to change your M. The question you need to answer is, is that sustainable for you? It wasn't before - hence your drinking, your A, your conflict - but, given the stark choice of staying or leaving, could you make it sustainably sufficient from here on out? If not, then you have to face the prospect that, sooner or later, leaving is your best bet. If it is, you need to work out how to "self medicate" in the least destructive way (to yourself and your family) to allow you to meet your needs for authenticity elsewhere, so that you're not demanding them of a wife and a marriage that can't provide them.

[beach]

But Coco, he's not getting his needs met from his wife.

 

By staying, he's participating in a fraudulent marriage. One which doesn't allow honesty and real feelings. One which requires pretending and lies to grow by the basis that his his wife won't face reality... Or, when faced with it - she is angry and mean to Sherm.

 

If a M isn't allowing each partner to be honest and feel safe - what kind of relationship is that? I personally wouldn't be capable of doing that. I'd feel that I was betraying myself every day all day long.

 

 

I think careful evaluation of the M is in order. One that requires you Sherm, to look at what you get out of this fraudulent marriage and what changes YOU can make to create a happy life FOR yourself.

 

Being with another person is not a requirement to being happy. You can get that from yourself. You can make a plan and get to that goal.

[shermanator]

Holy cow! I just realized you started this thread almost a year ago and you are basically still in the same spot. You still pine over the OW and can't decide if you want to stay married or not. Do you seriously wonder why your wife freaked out? Do you not think she's entitled to be a bit angry with you? I'm guessing the AP's email to you was a huge trigger for her.

 

 

Honestly, I think divorce would be the best for both of you. I get you feel like your feelings for the OW can't be turned off instantly. However, if your heart was truly invested in reconciliation, your perspective of the OW would have started changing by now. If your heart was truly in it, you would feel disgusted with yourself and your AP for causing so much pain to your wife and children. Based purely on your posts, you don't seem to feel any remorse. I could be wrong, but I don't think reconciliation can work without it. I think it's time to end this charade.

 

Yep... over a year of my life, just kind of floating along, not 100% invested in my M or my W.

 

I do feel disgusted by what I did, which is part of the reason I went NC.

 

We are going to see the MC today. Not sure what kind of outcome I'm hoping for.

[violet1]

Yep... over a year of my life, just kind of floating along, not 100% invested in my M or my W.

 

I do feel disgusted by what I did, which is part of the reason I went NC.

 

We are going to see the MC today. Not sure what kind of outcome I'm hoping for.

As hard as it is for your wife to hear, you need to be honest with her. You can't continue a marriage if your heart is not in it. It seems like your W has let her emotions bottle up instead of expressing them. Her anger is going to start coming out. Don't be afraid of how she's going to react. She needs to let it out so she can heal. You need to do the same so you can heal as well. All you can really do now is focus your energy on co-parenting. Get yourself healthy so you can be the best father possible. I personally think you should be single for awhile. Learn from the mistakes you've made in your M so you can grow and become a completely committed and honest partner that a woman deserves. It's time for you to stop fence sitting and make a move. I think you know what you need to do. So do it already. End this marriage.