IS HE CRAZY or AM I?

[Out-of-my-mind]

***Warning this is a long story***

I was here a year ago trying to let go of a relationship with a "commited" man. With the advice I got from here I picked myself up and started dating a really nice guy.

 

After 6 months of dating this really nice guy, the "still commited man" returns into my life. Begging me, telling me I'm the love of his life, to please not give up on him and to give him just 6 months to end his 9 year relationship with his g/f. That he needed this time to get it all sorted out with her and then we would be together.

 

My first impulse (God why don't we EVER listen to those?) Was to tell him to take a hike. But because I still loved him and had invested so many years into this I agreed to give him this time and this LAST chance as I said it.

 

I started to pull away from the nice guy that I was starting to fall for, and at Christmas the nice guy gives me a ring and wants to marry me! I declined of course and tried to explain to him, sparing detail that he and I will just not work out and broke off the relationship.

 

However, the "commited" man flips out over this news of the ring and tells me that on DEC. 30th he is ending it with her. That was the day, period.

 

So that day comes, he calls me and tells me its over. We can be together.

 

7 days after all this I receive an E-mail from his g/f. She tells me that they had not broken up that she confronted him about the knowledge of me and wanted to work things out. He told he that he did not want to be with me , he wanted to be with her and that they would talk about it more.

 

I informed her of the WHOLE truth...the years he's been with me, the way I tried to get away and start a life for myself he came back begging...the whole nine yards. Needless to say she was heartbroken. My next call was to him to tell him about my conversations with her via email for the last 24 hours and about all the knowledge she now had. That I would no longer be lying for him and basically told him to piss off.

 

He promised me that it was just her way of trying to get him back, to start trouble and that none of it was true. That he told her that he would not be ending it with me and they did need to talk more about REMAINING FRIENDS

 

All along now the nice guy is calling me everyday....telling me how much he loves me, how he'd do whatever it took to make me happy ETC ETC ETC

 

However, I had made a choice to trust this man (WHY I HAVE NO IDEA) and beleive him. It wasn't that hard to beleive really, sometimes a woman will do things like that. Things were very normal, dates in public, dinner at each others house, like a NORMAL relationship should be.

 

Which brings us to FEB 6th. I called him at home, No answer, called him on his cell- TURNED off...hummm OK trying to be more trusting I let it go. He calls at almost 10PM telling me he was at a friends house. We had a date the next night which I could not keep because something came up. Then the next day the same thing happens...I decide to write him an email to explain that I hated feeling this way but.....we had trust issues and I was willing to work on them but I had to know if he was lying. He of course told me NO and everything was fine.

 

FEB 10th the day before my Birthday the blow comes!!!!! An Email from her! She had found my email, apparently he had spent since that Friday night trying to get her back. Going to see her every night. Talking things out. We had plans for a weekend trip (HE and I) and he told her because it was my birthday he could not tell me that he wanted to really be with her. To just let him have this weekend with ME and he would end it the following SAT. To trust him to handle it this way!

 

CAN U BELIEVE THIS???? She said NO of course and told him that if he loved her that much he would not keep this date. If he kept it they were DONE. And the only way they could work it out was if he showed her how commited he was to her by not going with me on this trip.

 

HE kept the date. I confronted him about all this once again and he tells me that him keeping the date should tell me that he does really want ME. That he made the choice and that he was just confused for a few days about what he wanted. That he hasn't felt this way about anyone in 18 years and he's scared. That she was comfortable and after so long there was an attachment there but he wasn't really happy with her or IN LOVE with her and he knew it.

 

I did tell him that he should be smart enough to realize by now that SHE is going to tell me everything to see if he's telling her the truth.

 

WHAT THE HELL DO I DO NOW????

 

I love him, I want to believe him but I feel like I can't. YEARS this man has taken from me, hurt me, and when I finally move on, he comes back, just to do it all over again....

 

How do I know that he's not trying like hell to patch things up now or give her time to cool off again like he did before to try to patch things up. He's promised me that "WE ARE MOVING FORWARD"

 

Please someone ...anyone .....WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON?

Am I just stupid or can I really trust him this time?

[MsMree]

Where there is smoke, there is fire.

 

You will never trust him and rightly so - give the nice guy a call

[BoatingBabe]

No, of course you can not and SHOULD NOT trust him, cut your losses and try to save the relationship with the nice guy...Why do we women always go for the bastards???

[Leafcantlogin]

(I cant log in for some reason!)

 

 

 

Okay... first off... WTF?!!! I hate it when these men pull this crap! How can you trust him at all?

 

Here is what i would do... get you, the GF, and he in a room together. Say "Look, Who are you telling the truth to? Who are you lying to? Or are you lying to both of us?"

 

I think his feelings for you are genuine. If they werent he would have never come crawling back. Its obvious that he missed you. Now, he has been with GF for 9 years? .. and they never married?? Does he have some mega commitment issue? How long were you with him (total time)?

 

Probably the healthiest thing to do is to kick him to the curb once and for all. But I know.. you arent gonna do that.. he is your weakness (like our MM are our weaknesses.. bastards!) Like I said, get ya'll in a room and confront him. He will not be able to lie with both of you in front of him.

[newby]

go for the nice guy and be happy in the knowledge that he himself has ruined two relationships for himself.

you dont wanna be kicking yourself when nice guy finally gives up. and what will you be left with?

[lynnered]

whew!!he is putting you through to much girl!!

there was a nice guy before mm started in my life ,basically dumped him i had a past with mm just as friends ,started A was nice guy was on a 3 month military training,when he came back i broke up, because mm "wouldn't be involved in that type of situation".

any i would leave mm totally alone until he gets it together, it wore me out reading it!!and your living it!!

and date nice guy casually ,just be honest and see what happens ,I'm not saying wait for mm but ,he's at the point where it sounds like he can walk away &it sounds likes he's playing with you &w.

 

do what's best for you

good luck

[out-of-my-mind]

Originally posted by BoatingBabe

Why do we women always go for the bastards???

 

Have no idea I'm still wondering that one myself

 

Originally posted by Leafcantlogin

(I cant log in for some reason!)

 

 

"Here is what i would do... get you, the GF, and he in a room together. Say "Look, Who are you telling the truth to? Who are you lying to? Or are you lying to both of us?"

 

"I think his feelings for you are genuine. If they werent he would have never come crawling back. Its obvious that he missed you. Now, he has been with GF for 9 years? .. and they never married?? Does he have some mega commitment issue? How long were you with him (total time)?"

 

 

He will not be able to lie with both of you in front of him.

 

I tried suggesting that LMAO!!!! Are you kidding me? He said NoWAY! Big surprise HUH?

 

Well SHE was the one with the commitment issue ...not him...believe it or not!! He asked her to marry him 6 years ago or to at least live together and SHE said NO..... I've always wondered why he wasted the time to begin with...but again he always said she was comfortable and undemanding

 

HAHA you don't know how good this man is...he's had me fooled and apparently her too. HE's the DEVIL I tell you

 

 

Originally posted by newby

 

you dont wanna be kicking yourself when nice guy finally gives up. and what will you be left with?

 

Kind of already there...the nice guy called last night to say after 3 months of begging he can't anymore and he's going on a date with another girl- but would love to remain my friend....I have enough MALE friends already...DUMBA** is coming to mind here

 

Originally posted by lynnered

whew!!he is putting you through to much girl!!

 

any i would leave mm totally alone until he gets it together, it wore me out reading it!!and your living it!!

 

 

he's at the point where it sounds like he can walk away &it sounds likes he's playing with you &w.

 

You said a mouth full

 

Thats what I said....actually all kind of happened last year, around this time. She has had knowledge of me for OVER A YEAR!

 

 

I did something I am not proud of- that's for sure. I never meant to intrude in anyone's relationship. He sought me out...you know the oldest tale...we became good friends..then best friends....then well you ALL know the way it goes right?

[d'Arthez]

You have gotten yourself in a complex situation. I can feel the suffering it causes you. And the hurt it caused to the nice guy you have been involved with.

 

You probably were not honest with nice guy, i.e. you did not tell him you were involved with a SCM. He does not know the causes of your changed attitude. What in your eyes may be 'desperation' is purely caused by the fact that you dropped him in favor of SCM. He cannot understand you, because he does not know what is driving you. You have a past together of several months, and without doubt the both of you have discovered that the other person is quite likeable, with many good qualities. Hence the 'Let's be friends' routine; he is only trying to salvage the minimum from the relationship.

He even had the decency to tell you he gave up on you (even though not completely as he has not announced he has a GF). I can only hope you were not the love of his life, and he will be happy regardless of what happened between the two of you.

You can't blame Nice Guy for giving up on you. As long as he does not know he faced battle with a SCM he cannot understand what went on in your mind. I hope you can be cordial with him and wish him the best. Concerning an potential friendship between the two of you, it seems imperative that you never mention anything about the competition he lost to.

And I don't understand women who are willing to date someone for the sake of dating. You said in your original post, that: "I ... tried to explain to him, sparing detail that he and I will just not work out and broke off the relationship." Why did you date him over an extended period of time, if you could not envisage a future together? Was that because of the lust for SCM, or because of self-esteem issues? What do you want to do in your life?

 

I can only advise to drop SCM. He has been deceitful to you and the other woman. You can't blame that on the commitmentphobia of his gf of 9 years, only on him. He is a sad excuse for a man. If ever he tries to be in touch with you, you can message the still suffering girlfriend (SSG). If he has finally broken it off, be aware that he is a master of leading a double life. You should not be worrying about a bf who does not want to acknowledge your existence in your absence. You don't want to become the SSG. Both SCM and nice guy are not suitable for you.

 

Don't make excuses for yourself! Accept responsibility where it is due. Now it may feel that you have lost all these years. But that is not true. You have learnt many things, and even though your trust is shattered at the moment, you will recover. Rebuild yourself in the next months, and try to discover what you really want from a long-term partner.

It will be slow, but you will come true.

Good luck healing.

[Out-of-my-mind]

Originally posted by d'Arthez

 

 

it seems imperative that you never mention anything about the competition he lost to.

 

I would never metion this to him, it seems to me that it would only hurt him more and I honestly never meant to hurt him at all

 

And I don't understand women who are willing to date someone for the sake of dating. You said in your original post, that: "I ... tried to explain to him, sparing detail that he and I will just not work out and broke off the relationship." Why did you date him over an extended period of time, if you could not envisage a future together? Was that because of the lust for SCM, or because of self-esteem issues? What do you want to do in your life?

 

I explained at the begining of our dating that I was not interested in a serious relationship. That I was still healing from a painful experience and felt I did not have anything to offer a serious relationship. He was aware of my feelings in that regard. I DID start to have real feelings for him and it's almost as if the CM could sense it..which I think may be the reason he came back. I dated him over this "extended period of time" because I thought it was OK to do so, since I had explained my feelings up front to the nice guy. And we got along so great, we had a lot of fun and he certainly wasn't just filling a void. I thought I could/tried to resist the CM. BUT sadly I could/can not.

 

If he has finally broken it off, be aware that he is a master of leading a double life. You should not be worrying about a bf who does not want to acknowledge your existence in your absence. You don't want to become the SSG.

 

This is my fear at this point is if this all comes to fruitation would I ever really be able to build a relationship with these past trust issues lingering?

 

Both SCM and nice guy are not suitable for you.

 

You are not the first person to say this...my best girlfriend says bag them both and take time out for me and find a fresh start with someone new or no one at all

 

Don't make excuses for yourself! Accept responsibility where it is due. Now it may feel that you have lost all these years. But that is not true. You have learnt many things, and even though your trust is shattered at the moment, you will recover. Rebuild yourself in the next months, and try to discover what you really want from a long-term partner.

It will be slow, but you will come true.

Good luck healing.

 

I never have made excuses for myself and I own every part I've played in this drama. I know that the only person that can change this situation is me and I have control over it all. However, your heart and mind do not always agree. I have learned many things and I'm scared that the one lesson is to never trust anyone.

I thought I always knew what I wanted in a long term partner and quite honestly after getting to know the nice guy, he held most of those qualities but I just wasn't ready to offer him myself. I sure hope I don't live in regret over what could have been.

[d'Arthez]

You are a strong woman, as I noted in my earlier post .

The point about my seemingly harsh post is not to punish you. You must understand that it is never easy to change yourself or pick up the pieces after such a terrible thing that happened to you. Prove yourself to be stronger than this SC(U)M.

 

The easy way of dealing with life, is let it happen to you; but then when something happens you feel totally powerless to change your situation. People should be proactive. And now is the time for you to be proactive.

 

The SSG might of course dump SCM one day, as she deserves someone who is good to her too. He is not.

You are conflicted about what to do, but you must heal yourself from your weakness from him. He did not acknowledge when you were not around for years. That's not a trust issue on your part, but a fatal character flaw on SCM's part. Think of the bad things he has done to you, and to SSG. You don't want to share your life with such a man.

 

You have been in a terrible situation; the SCM was leading a double life. That is a something you cannot blame on yourself, especially if the SCM has a profession that makes disappearing acts quite easy (travelling).

Since you discovered his foul play, you have made mistakes. That's not terrible, that's part and parcel of life. Everybody makes mistakes, but smart people learn from their mistakes, so they don't make them again. You can too, I do not doubt that.

 

The heart and the head can always come in conflict especially when our vision is blurred by either lust, idealizing of the other person, or unexprected behavior by this person. It happens all the time. It takes some time to reconstruct the image of the other. You have spent long time with SCM, so it is impossible to forget about him in a matter of days or weeks. You must refocus, and attribute his low behavior to his character. He will not change, period! He tried to do the same thing again.

 

Begin healing, as hard as it may seem at the moment. Cut him out of your life completely, and don't let him ever in.

 

Concerning the nice guy, he moved too fast, especially as you held yourself back. Even though a cautionary note may need some repeating, especially as the friendship / relationship develops. But if the spark was not there (maybe because you were not 100% recovered), it was without a chance of developing into a healthy relationship.

 

Don't beat yourself too much up on this. Don't think that your life is over, or you will never be happy again. It might seem so at this moment, but in 6 months or 12 months time, you will be positively amazed at the strength you have found.

 

Begin healing, spend time on yourself and your interests, and you will find a happier future for yourself. Don't enter a new relationship lightly, and I even would not date for as long as you need to heal. In these months, you can take a look at your life and re-evaluate what you look for in a longterm partner.

If you radiate happiness, confidence and independence you are bound to attract a great man.

You might have some trust issues when you start a new relationship, but anyone who knows what happened to you will be understanding of your concerns, and willing to prove there is no need to distrust. Most men (and women) nowadays seem to have a few issues when they enter a relationship.

 

Good luck

[whichwayisup]

Take some time off just for YOU. Tell the nice guy you're really confused - you need time to figure things out and that you still love him but the other guy is a factor right now and you need that time to get over him. That is what you have to do...Get over him.

 

DO you want a life of always wondering and not trusting? Feeling insecure and being in an unhealthy relationship? The core isn't there...That loving and trusting bond. Yet you DO have that with the nice guy.

 

Take that time for you and really figure out what it is you want. You're lucky that the nice guy is hanging around to see what you want...

 

Hang in there, I bet it's not easy for you right now...Keep posting and getting the feelings out.

[out-of-my-mind]

Thank you all for your advice and it's certainly the same thing I've heard for years...yet here I am

 

I'm just not sure what to do anymore. I did see the nice guy this weekend and NOT the "CM". Not a date or anything we just spent 2 hours Saturday afternoon talking.

 

I don't know that I can still call this man the "commited male" because they are broken up....for the moment.

 

The "CM" behaves as if nothing has transpired...he seems to think that I'll just be fine with everything that has happened. Acting like everything is fine. He's been sensitive to the conversations I've brought up..but at this point I'm not sure how many more times I want to keep talking about what's happened. Or if even talking about it anymore at this point is healthy. There is a point when you just have to let go..one way or another. Except what happened or move on.

 

This past Saturday all I could think of was if she had been alright with him keeping the date of our trip together would be heartbroken right now? The more I thought about it the more upset I got. I tried to understand WHY??

 

Why would he have even bothered to try to work things out with her the week before knowing that this trip was coming up if he planned on keeping it?

 

Why did he still decide to go on the trip with me after he knew it would cost him his relationship with her?

 

Why did he think after all this time that she would not tell me of the events that week? Everytime they've "tried to work things out" SHE'S been the one to tell me. That's because he would have me think everything is fine between us.

Apparently she is a VERY forgiving woman.

 

I've asked him all these things and of course his reply is "I don't know."

 

I'm not sure I know anymore. I do feel that he loves me...I know he does..and unlike what most may think I don't know that any of these men or women set out with a motive to hurt. I think it's just something that is a product of these types of relationships.

 

A lot of people feel that a person cannot love but one person. I also know this is not true. Every relationship ..be it friendship or romantic...gives and takes something for a person. And it is possible to love different things about different people. However, I feel that honesty and trust are what ties two people together and without those things the relationship is dead.

 

Can you gain a persons trust once it is lost? Is it possible?

 

I wrote a letter to him today that I'm not sure I have the courage to send. I've waited sooo long for us to be together and what if this time is really it? This letter could end all of that.

 

How do you ever really know? He said it is over this time with her ...he said we were moving forward but with so much in the past I feel like we're just stuck in the mud.

 

I wrote him to tell him I think that he still needs to do some hard thinking and so do I. I'm not convinced that he has made a FINAL decision here and I can no longer wait until he does. I wrote to him about a period of NO CONTACT...NONE!!! It's hard because we do work together but not closely and I could give his project to another employee by stating I'm busy (which is true)

 

That way he could take time out without either one of us in his life to see what he truely wanted and I could take time to heal and see if I could really get over these most recent events.

 

I'm planning on telling him that after the period of no contact we can talk again and see where we are. It feels like a huge risk at this point because without me there he could go back to her....but I figure if that does happen he was going to do that anyway.

 

For once, I need his assurance that I AM TRULY THE ONE!!! And I think this is the only way.

 

What do u all think?