Have I lost my mind?

[sbdmsc]

Hello all, new member and first time poster.

 

My wife and I have been married for little over 9 years now and have a 5 year old child together.

Both my wife and I tend to avoid confrontation and have lived in a marriage that is not perfect but free of arguments.

I am admittedly selfish in the way that I do have hobbies such as snowboarding and water skiing that my wife does not partake in and she, on the other hand does not spend any time with her friends or have any hobbies that would provide her with any alone time.

 

Up until few months ago, I felt that this is just the way things were going to be forever and in all honesty, they probably could be.

 

here is when things changed dramatically:

 

I attended my coworkers birthday party, where I started interacting with a female coworker of 10 years. Although we have not slept together, we have been talking regularly, have taken several road trips and attended social events together.

This change caused me to completely check-out from my marriage and I have brought up the topic of divorce with my wife, as I felt I am not in love with her and it would not be fair to keep her in the dark.

 

Wife feels that I am not trying to work on our marriage - which is true at this point, as I feel that I would rather not be with her.

 

My wife decided it would be best for her to move out to her parents home and bring our son with her.

 

We have been living in an arrangement that I pick our son up on Fridays and drop him off on Monday mornings, she and her mother care for him on the weekdays when he's also attending daycare.

 

Here are my current thoughts:

 

I do not miss my wife since she moved out about month ago.

I do not hate my wife in any way, we still have lunch/dinner together when we're dropping off or picking up our son.

I do not feel that I am doing this to be with this "other woman", in fact, I feel that I would rather be alone and concentrate on my work.

 

I am in my mid 30's and the wife feels that I am going through a midlife crisis and need a professional help. I, on the other hand feel that I am perfectly fine and actually happier now that we don't live together.

The wife would love to stay together and "be happy".

 

I feel that this is all my fault as I don't really even know if I ever truly loved my wife, but failed to communicate it to her.

I feel "down" and unhappy whenever I see my wife now, however she does not feel that way. She says she still loves me and enjoys spending time with me - this in a way makes things more difficult for me as it adds to the guilt of breaking up our family.

 

 

Here are my questions:

 

Should I be trying to "fix" marriage that I do not want to be in, even tho my wife has done nothing wrong?

 

How long of this separation do we need before calling it quits?

 

Should I stay in current marriage until our son moves out (13-15 years from now)?

 

The wife says she doesn't want divorce, should I try to get her to agree before filing?

Edited June 22, 2014 by sbdmsc

[ThorntonMelon]

Should I be trying to "fix" marriage that I do not want to be in, even tho my wife has done nothing wrong?

 

Your wife is correct, maybe not about a mid-life crisis, but you should get help. IC and MC. The rest of the questions are irrelevant until you do this.

 

How long of this separation do we need before calling it quits?

 

Until you don't need to use LS for advice because it's so obvious it's the right thing to do.

 

Should I stay in current marriage until our son moves out (13-15 years from now)?

 

No. Using your kids as an excuse is a cowards way out in my opinion.

 

The wife says she doesn't want divorce, should I try to get her to agree before filing?

 

I wouldn't bother. Not going to happen and it's not necessary.

 

That said, really, really weird to me that she moved out. Doesn't feel to me like she's so unhappy with your arrangement no matter what she's saying. I don't know how to process all of that together.

[FredJones80]

as I felt I am not in love with her

 

You're not going to feel "in love" with her, that is the infatuation stages, the first year or two of the brain chemical doing its work in your head. The stage where you less control your impulses, the kind of feelings you're probably feeling for this new woman.

 

After this you have to choose to love, by touch, doing loving things.

 

Have you been selfish and done things for your wife recently that shows you love her? There is nothing wrong with having alone time, this is healthy, it doesn't matter if your wife does things as long as she doesn't begrudge you this alone time. However you need to make time to do things together, have you been doing this?

 

You say you feel you never loved your wife but I seriously doubt this, you got married to her and had a child so I'm sure you loved her at some point, I think due to the course of time you've lost sight of this.

 

"The 7 year itch" has been proven to occur more around the 10 year mark (Seven-year itch is a myth - a marriage goes stale after ten years and 11 months | Mail Online) which would tally with your situation.

 

If I was you I'd search out a movie called Fireproof and try and put some of the story in to action in your own marriage.

 

Try doing nice things for your wife, date her as if you're a new couple, yes it might feel forced at first but as they say "fake it until you make it" - Don't even worry if you're not getting much back from your wife, you are as responsible for making it work as she is, what difference does giving it a few or 6 months of trying to see how you feel?

 

As far as you've stated there is nothing inherently wrong with your wife, she is a good wife? good to your son? It seems you're just a little bored and have had your head turned by another woman. It's natural to look elsewhere but is giving up a 10 year marriage for something you assume is better worthwhile? What happens if you do give up your marriage, get with this new woman and in another 10 years you find yourself in the same position again? Yet this time you're remarried with another kid.

 

Nothing will strike you down if you choose to follow this new woman, however you've invested a long time and got married to a woman, surely she and you deserve to try and work at it before moving on? Think before you leap.

 

Also remember, the grass isn't always greener.

[sbdmsc]

 

That said, really, really weird to me that she moved out. Doesn't feel to me like she's so unhappy with your arrangement no matter what she's saying. I don't know how to process all of that together.

 

In a way, I feel that her moving out was an attempt to get me to realize how much I miss her and/or need her. If that's true, it did not work.

[sbdmsc]

You're not going to feel "in love" with her, that is the infatuation stages, the first year or two of the brain chemical doing its work in your head. The stage where you less control your impulses, the kind of feelings you're probably feeling for this new woman.

 

 

After this you have to choose to love, by touch, doing loving things.

This statement, if true is rather sad to me. I would want the "in love" feeling for ever. However at this point, I would much rather just be alone and focus on my work. In a way, I feel my time with my son has been better since the separation. Perhaps because I have less time available with him, we are learning to make the most out of it.

 

 

Have you been selfish and done things for your wife recently that shows you love her? There is nothing wrong with having alone time, this is healthy, it doesn't matter if your wife does things as long as she doesn't begrudge you this alone time. However you need to make time to do things together, have you been doing this?

She does begrudge my sports and alone time. I have encouraged her many times to go out with her friends or do things for herself. She would always say things like "Someone has to take care of the kid" or "Someone has to cook" while I am there to do all those things.

 

 

You say you feel you never loved your wife but I seriously doubt this, you got married to her and had a child so I'm sure you loved her at some point, I think due to the course of time you've lost sight of this.

 

"The 7 year itch" has been proven to occur more around the 10 year mark (Seven-year itch is a myth - a marriage goes stale after ten years and 11 months | Mail Online) which would tally with your situation.

 

If I was you I'd search out a movie called Fireproof and try and put some of the story in to action in your own marriage.

 

I will look into this 7 year itch and will watch the movie suggested as well.

 

Try doing nice things for your wife, date her as if you're a new couple, yes it might feel forced at first but as they say "fake it until you make it" - Don't even worry if you're not getting much back from your wife, you are as responsible for making it work as she is, what difference does giving it a few or 6 months of trying to see how you feel?

 

This is probably the hardest part. Over the past couple months, my wife and I have done lots of talking and explaining on what we are and aren't feeling. It certainly was not an easy thing to do and I'm just concerned that doing "nice things" for my wife would sort of send the wrong or perhaps misleading message that suddenly my feelings for her have returned.

 

 

As far as you've stated there is nothing inherently wrong with your wife, she is a good wife? good to your son? It seems you're just a little bored and have had your head turned by another woman. It's natural to look elsewhere but is giving up a 10 year marriage for something you assume is better worthwhile? What happens if you do give up your marriage, get with this new woman and in another 10 years you find yourself in the same position again? Yet this time you're remarried with another kid.

 

Nothing will strike you down if you choose to follow this new woman, however you've invested a long time and got married to a woman, surely she and you deserve to try and work at it before moving on? Think before you leap.

 

Also remember, the grass isn't always greener.

 

Yes, she is a good wife in a sense that she's great with our son, she's been very loyal etc.

I agree that I was little bored with the status quo and had my head turned by another woman, however I don't see myself marrying her, or perhaps any woman after this. It's odd but I feel that I would be perfectly happy alone, trying to spend time with my son whenever possible. - I realize this is once again a very selfish way of thinking.

 

Thank you for the responses and sorry about my seemingly endless rant .

[FredJones80]

This statement, if true is rather sad to me. I would want the "in love" feeling for ever. However at this point, I would much rather just be alone and focus on my work. In a way, I feel my time with my son has been better since the separation. Perhaps because I have less time available with him, we are learning to make the most out of it.

 

Usually "in love" is the first year or 2. Known as "Romantic Love" - This type never lasts because it is caused by a chemical change in the brain. Over time this fades.

 

What you have is Committed Love.

 

You may find this interesting : Will Meek PhD | Counselor Vancouver WA | Counseling Psychologist Therapist | Marriage Counselors in Vancouver WA

 

For your situation have a read of :-

 

MarriageMoment.org: Can Lost Love be Regained?

Hate Your Husband? (or Your Wife?) | Psychology Today

 

and also

 

The 'Grass is Greener" Syndrome | Relationships in Balance

 

I have plenty more links that might be of use to you.

 

However I'm sure you've made up your mind - I just find it sad how at some point you loved this woman enough to marry her and now you're looking for an out.

 

"A successful marriage requires falling in love many times, always with the same person." - Mignon McLaughlin

[Oberfeldwebel]

This relationship won't mend itself, you will need to get marriage counseling to fix it. How long? I think in a couple months of counseling you will no if you want to reinvest yourself in the relationship or terminate. Also don't start a new relationship, until you are finished with this one. I believe you owe this to your wife and son to give it a try.

[Mr. Lucky]

I am admittedly selfish in the way that I do have hobbies such as snowboarding and water skiing that my wife does not partake in and she, on the other hand does not spend any time with her friends or have any hobbies that would provide her with any alone time.

I've had friends try to continue to live their single life after marriage, seldom works out. Without being fortunate enough to live near the site, both water skiing and snowboarding are "road trip" activities that require an investment in time, energy and funds. Unless you're both on board, tough to consistently work into marriage and fatherhood.

 

How often do you engage in these activities?

 

Mr. Lucky

[Striver]

I am on the opposite side of your situation. W became unhappy because raising our three small children was harder than she thought it would be. Started an EA with an old friend and didn't tell me of any issues until she had completely checked out of the marriage. I was only told 3 weeks ago, 2 weeks for the EA.

 

W acts like she can barely be in my presence. She says she wants me to hate her (so she can move on to OM), but I don't mind her presence. Her actions are abominable, no doubt, hurting our family with her fast track divorce attitude, but yes she is the one who finds me intolerable.

 

W of course has no intention of ending the EA or stopping contact with OM.

 

You are never going to have feelings for your W again unless you make an effort. Get rid of the other person and give it some effort. My W doesn't believe in doing this, probably never will.

[larryblanchard]

Although relationships bring a lot of joy and comfort to people's lives, they can be very hard to navigate at times.You can try this out but this is why it's very important to get advice for relationships based on one's stage of life.The bottom line is that a couple should make sure they are getting relationship advice from the right sources.

[RonaldS]

My XW moved out, as it turns out, to get me to realize how special she was, how much I loved her, how good our marriage and my life with her was, and to get me to have to realize how bad my life would be without her.

 

Talk about your all-time backfire....

[umirano]

Lots of bad advice here IMO. If you could be with your wife and if there were some sort of connection you'd already feel it and you would have asked completely different questions. You don't miss her, you're having a great time on your own and with your son. From what I gather the only thing that worries you is breaking up the family.

 

IMO, you'll be just fine separated or divorced. And so will she. You need to explain to her that there are no romantic/loyal feelings anymore. It isn't her or something she did, it just isn't there and both of you will be better off focusing on what makes you happy. It will also benefit your son. You can maintain a cordial friendly RS, but you don't have to pretend being something you aren't: A happy, loyal couple.

 

Separating was a good move. If you still have the slightest doubt, continue separated for a few months. Maybe go to therapy, if you must. You could get confirmation that it really isn't a phase or a temporary distraction. If nothing changes in a year or so you should get the divorce, preferably cooperating with each other and with a good co-parenting agreement. Talk to a lawyer soon also, as he may have important information on how to best go about the whole divorce business.

 

Good luck

[2sunny]

In a way, I feel that her moving out was an attempt to get me to realize how much I miss her and/or need her. If that's true, it did not work.

 

It didn't work because you're so focused on the other woman.

 

 

Make a decision.

 

You either are all in for the marriage and your wife or your not!

 

As long as you're focused on your OW - your W isn't likely to look appealing.

 

 

When you decide - put energy into that relationship only.

 

No M can be great when your effort and energy is spent/focused outside the marriage.

[jbelle6]

If your wife had as many hobbies as you, who would have been there to watch your young son?

[Misadventure]

This statement, if true is rather sad to me. I would want the "in love" feeling for ever. However at this point, I would much rather just be alone and focus on my work. .

 

The "in love" feeling does not last... committed love is what happens.. and you need to BOTH WORK on continuously falling in love with each other as you both grow and life evolves.

 

Sadly, this is why MANY MANY people divorce because they don't grasp this concept (stbx did not understand this as well).

___________

 

Here is my question to you... reading what you wrote.. were you ever "in love"? I don't hear that in what I am reading. It sounds like you met someone you loved and could have a life with but not someone who excited you...like ever. And probably the same for her. Just sounds like you had a very "adult and nice" marriage. Where is the hook? What made you say "this is the one!".. what made her say that about you?

 

I think you should see a counselor for you...figure out these answers truly before any proceedings and advise her to do the same. It doesn't sound to me like you have an interest in really wanting to reconnect with her because you can't live without her but more out of because you feel guilty (and to be honest, you should on some level...you had an emotional affair).. but if your heart is not invested, you need to let your wife meet someone who will give her the love, the excitement and commitment that she deserves and has been lacking.

 

If you both decide on divorcing, and you are the breadwinner.. don't be an azz.... Ultimately, you went outside the marriage emotionally and then after, physically. Regardless if it was because of lackluster lovey feelings, your wife was the one left holding the sack - o -cr.a.p...Divorce is not fun, so if you are going to do it, do it with as little scarring as possible and be financially generous.

Edited June 25, 2014 by Misadventure

[sbdmsc]

If your wife had as many hobbies as you, who would have been there to watch your young son?

 

Yes - and I mean it. Throughout the years, I continuously encouraged her to "hang out" with friends or find something that would make her happy. I would feel guilty about taking 2 - 3 day trips in winter to go snowboarding. I always felt that this was to regain some sanity as my work is stressful enough.

[sbdmsc]

Thanks umirano,

 

I really appreciate all the advice I'm getting here. It seems most of it is on the other side of the spectrum but your reply made me feel better.

 

I feel that in my case, staying married would be the easy road and by all means, I think I could stay in it for many more years. My fear is 30 years from now, when I'm in my mid to late 60's, it will be too late to act if I realize I've had it.

 

I am very honest with her in saying that my feelings are not there but this seems impossible for her to comprehend or understand since we have been married for such a long time.

 

 

Lots of bad advice here IMO. If you could be with your wife and if there were some sort of connection you'd already feel it and you would have asked completely different questions. You don't miss her, you're having a great time on your own and with your son. From what I gather the only thing that worries you is breaking up the family.

 

IMO, you'll be just fine separated or divorced. And so will she. You need to explain to her that there are no romantic/loyal feelings anymore. It isn't her or something she did, it just isn't there and both of you will be better off focusing on what makes you happy. It will also benefit your son. You can maintain a cordial friendly RS, but you don't have to pretend being something you aren't: A happy, loyal couple.

 

Separating was a good move. If you still have the slightest doubt, continue separated for a few months. Maybe go to therapy, if you must. You could get confirmation that it really isn't a phase or a temporary distraction. If nothing changes in a year or so you should get the divorce, preferably cooperating with each other and with a good co-parenting agreement. Talk to a lawyer soon also, as he may have important information on how to best go about the whole divorce business.

 

Good luck

[sbdmsc]

Here is my question to you... reading what you wrote.. were you ever "in love"? I don't hear that in what I am reading. It sounds like you met someone you loved and could have a life with but not someone who excited you...like ever. And probably the same for her. Just sounds like you had a very "adult and nice" marriage. Where is the hook? What made you say "this is the one!".. what made her say that about you?

 

Missadvature, I think you are 100% correct in saying we had very "adult and nice" marriage. I am not sure how to answer your question whether or not were we ever "in love". When we met, I was traveling a lot, she was always open to come along. She really was my best friend and we spent all of our time together. We never really had mutual friends, instead we stayed in touch with our own group of pre-marriage friends. I never really became close to her "crowd" and she never became close with mine.

Her family loved me and asked me often when was I going to propose. It seemed like the right thing to do at that time and I think we happy for first few years. Sorry but that's the best I can answer. To this day, she says she loves me very much, even after this separation and all. I can't say the same without lying so I'm not.

Edited June 28, 2014 by sbdmsc

[Mr. Lucky]

Lots of bad advice here IMO. If you could be with your wife and if there were some sort of connection you'd already feel it and you would have asked completely different questions. You don't miss her, you're having a great time on your own and with your son. From what I gather the only thing that worries you is breaking up the family.

 

IMO, you'll be just fine separated or divorced. And so will she. You need to explain to her that there are no romantic/loyal feelings anymore. It isn't her or something she did, it just isn't there and both of you will be better off focusing on what makes you happy. It will also benefit your son. You can maintain a cordial friendly RS, but you don't have to pretend being something you aren't: A happy, loyal couple.

 

Separating was a good move. If you still have the slightest doubt, continue separated for a few months. Maybe go to therapy, if you must. You could get confirmation that it really isn't a phase or a temporary distraction. If nothing changes in a year or so you should get the divorce, preferably cooperating with each other and with a good co-parenting agreement. Talk to a lawyer soon also, as he may have important information on how to best go about the whole divorce business.

 

Good luck

Marriage isn't an article of clothing to be used until it no longer suits you and then discarded. sbdmsc, you made a spoken commitment to this person and an unspoken one to your young son. You owe them both your best effort which, based on what you've posted, seems unrealized here.

 

There's something else going on here that's more about you than it is about your marriage. Let's say you end up with this co-worker or any other available and attractive (to you) woman. As that new relationship ages, you'll end up at the same plateau that currently affects your marriage. And then what? Cut and run? On to the next one?

 

At some point, you're going to have to do the work to understand the dynamics of a LTR. For your son's sake, now would be a good time to start...

 

Mr. Lucky

[sbdmsc]

Mr. Lucky, thank you for the response. I realize my situation is not ideal and completely my fault. From my current point of view, I can't imagine ever marrying anyone else as I understand I would likely end up hurting them too.

Is it possible that marriage isn't for everyone?

 

Marriage isn't an article of clothing to be used until it no longer suits you and then discarded. sbdmsc, you made a spoken commitment to this person and an unspoken one to your young son. You owe them both your best effort which, based on what you've posted, seems unrealized here.

 

There's something else going on here that's more about you than it is about your marriage. Let's say you end up with this co-worker or any other available and attractive (to you) woman. As that new relationship ages, you'll end up at the same plateau that currently affects your marriage. And then what? Cut and run? On to the next one?

 

At some point, you're going to have to do the work to understand the dynamics of a LTR. For your son's sake, now would be a good time to start...

 

Mr. Lucky

[FredJones80]

Mr. Lucky, thank you for the response. I realize my situation is not ideal and completely my fault. From my current point of view, I can't imagine ever marrying anyone else as I understand I would likely end up hurting them too.

Is it possible that marriage isn't for everyone?

 

Regardless of finger pointing, it doesn't matter if you marry or have a LTR, what some people are telling you here is unless you work on your own side you may forever repeat this pattern.

 

Do you honestly think in 5, 10, 15 years time with someone else without marriage that is going to make the slightest difference? It's not guaranteed but when you hit a certain point with or without marriage you may, just may, find yourself repeating this same situation.

 

I stand by what I said, I feel you must of loved your wife at some point by the fact you married her and had a child. All relationships over a long period will change. I am not blaming you, all I urge you to do is put in the effort before you throw something away, perhaps you have been consciously doing this for years but what does another 6 months matter?

 

Why not try, yes it may be forced at first but you never know, you may rediscover why you fell in love in the first place. As Oberfeldwebel suggested, why not try marriage counselling while doing your own re-dating or re-courting at the same time.

 

One of the most inspiring posts I've ever read here can be seen below, take a read :-

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/breaking-up-reconciliation-coping/coping/437625-i-finally-understand-why-my-last-relationship-failed#post5319687

 

I think people (and myself) may be less "hostile" if you hadn't mentioned this other woman. Perhaps we can't fully understand if she is the cause or the result, perhaps even you can't. I think someone else said here or in another thread, with marriage counselling you may even find the issue is in some other part of your relationship and not where you initially think it is.

 

As you might already know I love quotes and links, but you might find this interesting :-

 

"A report, issued by the Institute for American Values suggests that on average unhappily married adults who divorced were no happier five years after the divorce than were equally unhappily married adults who stayed married when rated on any of 12 separate measures of psychological well-being. Moreover, two-thirds of unhappily married people who remained married reported that their marriages were happy five years later. Even among couples who had rated their marriages as very unhappy, 80 percent said they were happily married five years later. The data suggests that if a couple is unhappy, the chances of their being happily married five years later are 64% if they remain together but only 19% if they divorce and remarry. The report, issued July 11, 2002 seems to crumble the myth that at least divorce makes unhappily married adults happier."

 

Source : Does Divorce Make People Happy?: Findings From a Study of Unhappy Marriages - Stronger Marriage - strongermarriage.org

 

Another interesting thing to think about...

 

"Past statistics have shown that in the U.S. 50% percent of first marriages, 67% of second, and 73% of third marriages end in divorce."

 

Ie; the chance of your first marriage is high, but those who divorce once are even more likely the second and third time to divorce again and this can be applied to future relationships or over a few years, ie; like married but not - you're more likely to give up easier.

 

BTW, I don't agree that your wife doesn't agree with your alone time, its healthy, it doesn't matter if she wants hers or not, that is her choice, but she should allow yours... then again we all know women nag when they don't have everything their way (ducks!) but them nagging you and still having your alone time and them nagging and you not having it are two different things.

 

Anyway ultimately you'll do what you want no matter what people tell you here. I just hope you consider the advice carefully that everyone has given before you make a rash decision. Although I fear you won't and you have no intention of doing anything, you're running through the motions here to make yourself feel better, I figure this is evident because the fact you've so quickly jumped on the only piece of advice that falls in line with your thinking, or the advice you are wanting to hear...

 

In response to : "but your reply made me feel better."

 

On the other hand would you of even come here if you were certain about your decision?

 

Anyway good luck to you and your wife/child.

Edited June 29, 2014 by FredJones80

[sbdmsc]

Although I fear you won't and you have no intention of doing anything, you're running through the motions here to make yourself feel better, I figure this is evident because the fact you've so quickly jumped on the only piece of advice that falls in line with your thinking, or the advice you are wanting to hear...

 

In response to : "but your reply made me feel better."

 

Fred, as always, I appreciate your reply including the links and quoted articles. I did jump on the one post that was aligned with my thinking because it was unexpected and in contrast with everything else I read here.

 

On the other hand would you of even come here if you were certain about your decision?

 

I am not certain about any of this which is why I posted in these forums to begin with. I also have not filed for divorce yet.

[Mr. Lucky]

Is it possible that marriage isn't for everyone?

Certainly that's possible.

 

But what in its place? Alone? Serial monogamy? Endless dating?

 

You've been specific about the downside of your current relationship. Left unsaid has been info on what you see taking its place...

 

Mr. Lucky

[FredJones80]

I am not certain about any of this which is why I posted in these forums to begin with. I also have not filed for divorce yet.

 

I guess it depends how long you've been feeling this way and what you've done to combat that.

 

Regardless, nothing is going to resolve, fix or change if you continue to sit there. I suggest you try work at it for 6 months in your own way, date, treat her well etc, get marriage counselling. You never know, it may work out and in 12 months or 2 years time you are glad you hung in there.

 

If you have no chance of doing those things then in the nicest sense, piss or get off the pot. Doing nothing will only lead one way, further down. If you're waiting to hit rock bottom before bailing or in the hope your wife will bail first then it is pretty unfair.

 

Make a move my friend.

[missjuli]

I just want to offer my support and understanding. My situation has a lot of similarities to yours. Though there are no children in my picture, I too married someone I wasn't in love with. My soon-to-be-ex husband was and still is a great guy. I feel guilty for walking out on him and I'm sure you feel guilty too. That's normal. The guilt should not hold you in a marriage you aren't happy with.

 

The big indicator to me is that you don't miss her. I don't miss him either.