Abusive? or did it just not work out.

[siochana]

Just a quick one that I would love feedback on.

 

 

I’m one year out since BU, about four months NC.

 

 

I still think of her daily and although the worst has passed regularly get the anger and the depression.

 

 

One thing that is weighing on my mind is whether or not she was abusive towards me. I’ve read the info about signs/narcissists/ BPD etc. but I’m still not sure. Let’s just deal with her actions and then mine. During the course of a three year relationship this is a list of her worst behaviours. Bear in mind that alcohol was usually involved

 

 

Following an argument, threw my clothes out the window of our first floor apartment.

 

 

Slapped me hard across the face on two separate occasions.

 

 

Ripped up a book I had got as a present and threw all over the garden

 

 

Packed her bags and stormed out two or three times only to return a few days later after I had accepted that it was my fault and that she should come back

 

 

Got drunk and told friends of mine I was beating her up (I wasn’t)

 

 

Broke stuff in the apartment, sprayed shaving cream on my suits

 

 

Broke up with me and then proceeded to blame me for it (even months later) what is up with that? As in I gave you so many chances, you’re arrogant, I deserve better.

 

 

Stormed out of bars and restaurants on foot of minor disagreement or for no apparent reasons at all sometimes.

 

 

Now me:

 

 

Worst offence was sending a single flirtatious text to a former colleague. She checked my phone.

 

 

Did get very angry with her on several occasions and did some shouting. Never made personal remarks to her but did was out of control verbally. I will add that it was almost always the result of her criticising me in some way and ( I know now) unacknowledged hurt about the way she had treated me on some occasions listed above.

 

 

For months I blamed myself (and hated myself) because I loved her and did not want to lose her. Even if in the end I was out of solutions as to how to fix it (it was always up to me to fix it you see)

 

 

Trouble is, in most cases she was charming and nice and considerate. She had a great brain and was good to others. She didn’t do a lot of the stuff the abuser is supposed to do.

 

So what gives? Thoughts welcome.

[littleplanet]

Just a quick one that I would love feedback on.

 

 

I’m one year out since BU, about four months NC.

 

 

I still think of her daily and although the worst has passed regularly get the anger and the depression.

 

 

One thing that is weighing on my mind is whether or not she was abusive towards me. I’ve read the info about signs/narcissists/ BPD etc. but I’m still not sure. Let’s just deal with her actions and then mine. During the course of a three year relationship this is a list of her worst behaviours. Bear in mind that alcohol was usually involved

 

 

Following an argument, threw my clothes out the window of our first floor apartment.

 

 

Slapped me hard across the face on two separate occasions.

 

 

Ripped up a book I had got as a present and threw all over the garden

 

 

Packed her bags and stormed out two or three times only to return a few days later after I had accepted that it was my fault and that she should come back

 

 

Got drunk and told friends of mine I was beating her up (I wasn’t)

 

 

Broke stuff in the apartment, sprayed shaving cream on my suits

 

 

Broke up with me and then proceeded to blame me for it (even months later) what is up with that? As in I gave you so many chances, you’re arrogant, I deserve better.

 

 

Stormed out of bars and restaurants on foot of minor disagreement or for no apparent reasons at all sometimes.

 

 

Now me:

 

 

Worst offence was sending a single flirtatious text to a former colleague. She checked my phone.

 

 

Did get very angry with her on several occasions and did some shouting. Never made personal remarks to her but did was out of control verbally. I will add that it was almost always the result of her criticising me in some way and ( I know now) unacknowledged hurt about the way she had treated me on some occasions listed above.

 

 

For months I blamed myself (and hated myself) because I loved her and did not want to lose her. Even if in the end I was out of solutions as to how to fix it (it was always up to me to fix it you see)

 

 

Trouble is, in most cases she was charming and nice and considerate. She had a great brain and was good to others. She didn’t do a lot of the stuff the abuser is supposed to do.

 

So what gives? Thoughts welcome.

 

 

 

The bolded part might offer a big clue.

 

Abusers don't necessarily follow instruction manuals. Whatever they're supposed to do.......

but after a year of thinking it over, I'd say some of the things on your list should make it rather obvious.

Pretty solid incompatibility.

Storming out of restaurants over nothing at all?

It wasn't nothing at all.

 

I wouldn't necessarily slap a disorder du jour on her, though.

Whatever her thing was, something about you seriously pissed her off.

 

A year apart and 4 months NC is on the right track.

I wouldn't waste a lot of time analyzing...............

unless this shows up in your next relationship.

[siochana]

The bolded part might offer a big clue.

 

Abusers don't necessarily follow instruction manuals. Whatever they're supposed to do.......

but after a year of thinking it over, I'd say some of the things on your list should make it rather obvious.

Pretty solid incompatibility.

Storming out of restaurants over nothing at all?

It wasn't nothing at all.

 

I wouldn't necessarily slap a disorder du jour on her, though.

Whatever her thing was, something about you seriously pissed her off.

 

A year apart and 4 months NC is on the right track.

I wouldn't waste a lot of time analyzing...............

unless this shows up in your next relationship.

 

Thanks LP,

 

I think you are definitely right. As much as it pains me to admit it ( because she was the first woman I was considering marrying and Im 35) we obviously werent compatible.

 

However what do you mean by " It wasnt nothing at all" in relation to the restaraunt storm outs?

 

Also, What do the things on my list make obvious? That she is nuts or that I made her nuts? I suppose what really ****s me up is thinking that I catalysed or caused the behaviour.

 

On the other hand, I never had this level of madness with other girlfriends but she was the first one I lived with and we both live far away from family so it put a real strain on things.

 

I would like to forgive her and myself but Im not there yet which is a real pain. A year later I want to be done with it and just think of her with her new boyfriend not thinking about me at all and me stuck and well, I suppose that makes me mad and sad!

 

Thanks.

[jbelle6]

She doesn't sound BPD or NPD in the least. She sounds like a nasty drunk.

[d0nnivain]

I don't know if it was abusive. It certainly wasn't healthy for you & she clearly is in need of anger management.

[siochana]

She doesn't sound BPD or NPD in the least. She sounds like a nasty drunk.

 

 

Yes, but she was pretty unrepentant about stuff she did while drunk ( actually not even drunk it might have just been a glass or two) when she sobered up.

 

 

Imagine: she wanted me to go to anger management classes, and I agreed to, and she was the one doing the bat**** crazy stuff. She had me convinced that I was the problem.

 

 

What I was guilty of was blowing my top from time to time. I do not absolve myself completely of this but I will say if a man is constantly being criticised for his performance as a partner a snapping point is reached. Also, I forgave her straight away pretty much for her worst behaviour and that was a big mistake.

 

 

Even three months after we broke up ( she left) I was too blame for everything.

 

 

I think there is a special kind of abuse if you are with someone who puts all the blame on the shortcomings in a relationship on the other person. When you are in love, you are vulnerable, you can get lost.

 

 

I accepted her worldview that I was the problem for far too long. in fact, it was only months after the break up that I realised that no man should ever have his clothes flung out a window or be struck in the face by a woman. there is literally no excuse.

 

 

Lesson learned. I think the point is we should all recognise abusive behaviours for what they are and walk away.

[Lani]

Most times if you feel as though you've been abused then it's likely you have.

We all have our own boundaries and it sounds like she broke yours.

 

At this stage I don't really think it matters though. You need to move on from the relationship because it didn't work, trying to figure this out will only bring back more memories you don't need anymore.

[Michelle ma Belle]

Most times if you feel as though you've been abused then it's likely you have.

We all have our own boundaries and it sounds like she broke yours.

 

At this stage I don't really think it matters though. You need to move on from the relationship because it didn't work, trying to figure this out will only bring back more memories you don't need anymore.

 

I've spent many years working with and advocating for abused women and children. Abuse comes in all forms and it's not unusual for substance abuse to exasperate things.

 

Consider yourself very fortunate to be free of her. Not many can.

 

I would also echo Lani when she tells you that it's time to move on and stop trying to analyze an obviously very toxic relationship that happened over a year go.

 

I'm curious why you feel you needed to bring this up again after all this time?

[siochana]

I've spent many years working with and advocating for abused women and children. Abuse comes in all forms and it's not unusual for substance abuse to exasperate things.

 

Consider yourself very fortunate to be free of her. Not many can.

 

I would also echo Lani when she tells you that it's time to move on and stop trying to analyze an obviously very toxic relationship that happened over a year go.

 

I'm curious why you feel you needed to bring this up again after all this time?

 

 

Hi Michelle,

 

 

I will attempt to give you as honest an answer as I can.

 

 

It doesn't feel like "all this time" to me. Its been a year and I think about her and what happened daily. I would prefer if it were not so but it is and I'm working on trying to stop through CBT methods.

 

 

The baseline point is that I really loved this woman, like no other before and was intent on marrying her ( even if I had doubts arising from arguments and incidents like the ones described)

 

 

It has taken me a year to process things. Its the first time too that someone I really loved left me. I was crushed at her loss and my dreams were crushed.

 

 

I suppose the difficulty arises (and perhaps this defies logic) in believing that I should be glad to be free of her. I still, being honest, part of me at least, blame myself for not doing more to do the things that were necessary to save the relationship. I am also disgusted with myself, my sense of manhood offended, by the way I was so forgiving of behaviours that were totally beyond the pale. I am also disgusted that I lost my temper with her and shouted at her. To my credit, I never personally abused her I was, I know now, communicating feelings of hurt and fear arising from her behaviour and the situation in general, that at the time I did not understand. I didn't have the prescence of mind to say: stop, you are hurting me and its not fair on me. Instead, every time she cried, I blamed myself and thought about what I must have done to cause it.

 

 

In other words, I spent a long time during the relationship and afterwards blaming myself for our failings as a couple. It took a massive toll on me. I didn't tell anyone about the worse excesses of her behaviour until long after we broke up. I realised then, that I had been traumatised by these events but at the time, like a good stoic man, refused to acknowledge to myself that I had been hurt and was hurting. I didn't understand what was happening to me which precipitated the anger when it arose.

 

 

I foolishly sent her love letters to get her back. I begged. For a few months on and off. When, after about 6 months and therapy I realised that I shouldn't have been humiliated by having her storm out of a restaurant I brought her to on Valentine's day for example, I sent her some emails criticising her for the abuse. I also told her mother, who had texted me a few times, about the fact that she had told friends of mine I was beating her up. My friends only told me about that after the break up. It might have been ill advised but it was my way of saying that I realise now what you did was very wrong and you should too. You shouldn't treat a decent man like that.

 

 

She is with a new guy now and I often wonder if she does the same to him. Does she treat him like that? Will he ever have to pick his clothes out of a flower bed at 1 in the morning.

 

 

The thing is ( the thought I have most trouble with) is that she only behaved that way because it was me and that the guy she is with now never pushes her buttons like that.

 

 

Do you think this is credible?

 

 

Thanks.

 

 

And yes, slowly but surely, day by day, I am healing. But I analyse stuff for a living so doing so in respect of my personal life is, unfortunately, a personality trait.

[Michelle ma Belle]

Hi Michelle,

 

 

I will attempt to give you as honest an answer as I can.

 

 

It doesn't feel like "all this time" to me. Its been a year and I think about her and what happened daily. I would prefer if it were not so but it is and I'm working on trying to stop through CBT methods.

 

 

The baseline point is that I really loved this woman, like no other before and was intent on marrying her ( even if I had doubts arising from arguments and incidents like the ones described)

 

 

It has taken me a year to process things. Its the first time too that someone I really loved left me. I was crushed at her loss and my dreams were crushed.

 

 

I suppose the difficulty arises (and perhaps this defies logic) in believing that I should be glad to be free of her. I still, being honest, part of me at least, blame myself for not doing more to do the things that were necessary to save the relationship. I am also disgusted with myself, my sense of manhood offended, by the way I was so forgiving of behaviours that were totally beyond the pale. I am also disgusted that I lost my temper with her and shouted at her. To my credit, I never personally abused her I was, I know now, communicating feelings of hurt and fear arising from her behaviour and the situation in general, that at the time I did not understand. I didn't have the prescence of mind to say: stop, you are hurting me and its not fair on me. Instead, every time she cried, I blamed myself and thought about what I must have done to cause it.

 

 

In other words, I spent a long time during the relationship and afterwards blaming myself for our failings as a couple. It took a massive toll on me. I didn't tell anyone about the worse excesses of her behaviour until long after we broke up. I realised then, that I had been traumatised by these events but at the time, like a good stoic man, refused to acknowledge to myself that I had been hurt and was hurting. I didn't understand what was happening to me which precipitated the anger when it arose.

 

 

I foolishly sent her love letters to get her back. I begged. For a few months on and off. When, after about 6 months and therapy I realised that I shouldn't have been humiliated by having her storm out of a restaurant I brought her to on Valentine's day for example, I sent her some emails criticising her for the abuse. I also told her mother, who had texted me a few times, about the fact that she had told friends of mine I was beating her up. My friends only told me about that after the break up. It might have been ill advised but it was my way of saying that I realise now what you did was very wrong and you should too. You shouldn't treat a decent man like that.

 

 

She is with a new guy now and I often wonder if she does the same to him. Does she treat him like that? Will he ever have to pick his clothes out of a flower bed at 1 in the morning.

 

 

The thing is ( the thought I have most trouble with) is that she only behaved that way because it was me and that the guy she is with now never pushes her buttons like that.

 

 

Do you think this is credible?

 

 

Thanks.

 

 

And yes, slowly but surely, day by day, I am healing. But I analyse stuff for a living so doing so in respect of my personal life is, unfortunately, a personality trait.

 

Sweetie, this is CLASSIC victim mentality. I know the tables are turned where it's the woman abusing the man but it doesn't change the fact that she was over the top abusive.

 

I've seen this scenario literally thousands of times where the victim, despite how horribly their partners treated them, remained steadfastly in love and loyal and forever made excuses or justified their partner's every inappropriate behavior. It is also VERY common for victims to blame themselves for their partners behavior. You're not that special in this department I'm afraid.

 

All of this is extremely toxic and very damaged thinking fueled by an equally toxic and damaged abuser.

 

You have to come to a point where you sincerely understand that whatever was or is going on with your ex is HER problem and NOT yours. How she treated you or how she behaved in your presence has NOTHING to do with you and everything to do with her own demons she's clearly struggling to slay.

 

It's fine to have empathy and compassion for her because you still care about her as a human being but to sit around and continually torture yourself into thinking that you somehow brought out the worst in her is COMPLETELY UNTRUE!!! Please believe when I say that.

 

I know it's easy for me to scribble down a bunch of words mirroring back to you what's happening and hoping something I say will stick or motivate you into believing that the reality you THINK is real isn't real at all. It's not easy and I understand this.

 

You mentioned that you had some therapy which helped you come to some realizations but I'm curious what else your therapist has been advising you? Do they think she was abusive or that you were a victim of domestic/relationship abuse? Are you still going to therapy?

[Hoosfoos]

Yes, she was highly abusive, and has issues with alcohol. Be glad she's gone, because it would never have gotten any better. People don't change.

[Craft81]

Sounds like my last ex, but she is an alcoholic and has diagnosed BPD with narcissistic traits. What you went through is nothing compared to what I went through. Be glad you are done with her.

[siochana]

Sweetie, this is CLASSIC victim mentality. I know the tables are turned where it's the woman abusing the man but it doesn't change the fact that she was over the top abusive.

 

I've seen this scenario literally thousands of times where the victim, despite how horribly their partners treated them, remained steadfastly in love and loyal and forever made excuses or justified their partner's every inappropriate behavior. It is also VERY common for victims to blame themselves for their partners behavior. You're not that special in this department I'm afraid.

 

All of this is extremely toxic and very damaged thinking fueled by an equally toxic and damaged abuser.

 

You have to come to a point where you sincerely understand that whatever was or is going on with your ex is HER problem and NOT yours. How she treated you or how she behaved in your presence has NOTHING to do with you and everything to do with her own demons she's clearly struggling to slay.

 

It's fine to have empathy and compassion for her because you still care about her as a human being but to sit around and continually torture yourself into thinking that you somehow brought out the worst in her is COMPLETELY UNTRUE!!! Please believe when I say that.

 

I know it's easy for me to scribble down a bunch of words mirroring back to you what's happening and hoping something I say will stick or motivate you into believing that the reality you THINK is real isn't real at all. It's not easy and I understand this.

 

You mentioned that you had some therapy which helped you come to some realizations but I'm curious what else your therapist has been advising you? Do they think she was abusive or that you were a victim of domestic/relationship abuse? Are you still going to therapy?

 

 

Hi Michelle,

 

 

Thank you for taking he time to write that post. Your analysis comforts me.

 

 

The therapist I saw was a very kind woman who would frequently allow us to run as much as 10 or 15 minutes over time to continue our discussion.

 

 

I think she was more interested in helping me move through the grieving process than classifying me as a victim of abuse. Keep the focus on me kind of thing. She also said a few times that in a relationship its always two people contributing to all that is good and ill about it.

 

 

She did say that I didn't have enough self respect in the relationship and that I allowed core personal boundaries to be breached and that not allowing that to happen again should be my key lesson going forward.

 

 

I would be interested to know, in your opinion, if you think she will behave like that again. Part of me thinks yes, part of me thinks no: its only together that she reacted, she was the potassium and I was the water kind of thing.

 

 

thanks again.

 

 

And thanks to other posters who have contributed.

[turnera]

She just sounds like a spoiled princess. Girls are sometimes raised to believe they can act like that because the man is supposed to be man enough to STOP her. You didn't. The more you accepted, the more outrageous she became.

 

Now let's talk about why you accepted it, and why you then chose to resort to yelling. Have you read No More Mr Nice Guy? Get it.

[Jewels7]

I think this is probably a form of the abuse. She did slap you and that is abuse. You should write all this down and when you feel you are starting to forget the bad and miss her, pull it out and read it. I do this for my ex and it helps me.

[Michelle ma Belle]

Hi Michelle,

 

I would be interested to know, in your opinion, if you think she will behave like that again. Part of me thinks yes, part of me thinks no: its only together that she reacted, she was the potassium and I was the water kind of thing.

 

It's hard to say for sure because I don't know you or her or anything about your situation apart from a few things posted on here BUT I will tell you that abusers very rarely change their spots. IF they do, it isn't without YEARS of intense therapy and/or a major life-changing moment. Like I've said, I've worked in this genre for many years and I have yet to see or hear it happen with any of the clients I've personally worked with.

 

Abusers are technically sociopaths who vet out their victims. They're no different then (and I really hate this connection but it might better explain things) a pedophile vetting out their targets. Abusers will choose partners who are vulnerable, insecure, have low self-esteem, damaged in some way, perhaps even unstable or traumatized previously. These people make it EASY to control, manipulate and overpower. As the victim becomes more dependent and powerless, the abuser becomes more powerful and aggressive.

 

You will NEVER see an abuser with a someone who is the polar opposite of the characteristics I just described.

 

If your ex is indeed an abuser, and by all accounts she seems to fit the profile, I would be willing to put money down that her new boyfriend is in the same boat as you once were. No question about it.

 

My concern with you now is your obsession with needing to KNOW that she is continuing her abuse and that it wasn't just an isolated incident with you.

 

If you're not already, I strongly encourage you to continue therapy and work on THIS detail. It is extremely important to your own recovery so that you don't end up in another situation like this again.

 

Good luck.

[travelbug1996]

Keep the focus on you. While it is important to own the part you played you also have to be careful not to take all the blame or take on the victim mentality.

 

Who cares if she's different with a new guy? It shouldn't matter. She's not a part of your life anymore. Next time set boundaries with the verbal disrespect or any other emotional and mental games people play.

 

Take care of yourself first. Honor yourself. Respect yourself. That way anyone coming into your life has to fall in line with how you treat yourself.

[siochana]

She just sounds like a spoiled princess. Girls are sometimes raised to believe they can act like that because the man is supposed to be man enough to STOP her. You didn't. The more you accepted, the more outrageous she became.

 

Now let's talk about why you accepted it, and why you then chose to resort to yelling. Have you read No More Mr Nice Guy? Get it.

 

I suppose the premise of this book, applied to my situation, is that if I had ben firmer with her the behaviour would have changed? Maybe. Hard to say.

 

She wasn't spoiled. She came from a very modest background. She had psychological issues.

[siochana]

Keep the focus on you. While it is important to own the part you played you also have to be careful not to take all the blame or take on the victim mentality.

 

Who cares if she's different with a new guy? It shouldn't matter. She's not a part of your life anymore. Next time set boundaries with the verbal disrespect or any other emotional and mental games people play.

 

Take care of yourself first. Honor yourself. Respect yourself. That way anyone coming into your life has to fall in line with how you treat yourself.

 

I verbally disrespected her too.

 

I think it was almost always in self defence or in a misguided attempt to stand up for myself. I fought her but my tactics were wrong.

[siochana]

It's hard to say for sure because I don't know you or her or anything about your situation apart from a few things posted on here BUT I will tell you that abusers very rarely change their spots. IF they do, it isn't without YEARS of intense therapy and/or a major life-changing moment. Like I've said, I've worked in this genre for many years and I have yet to see or hear it happen with any of the clients I've personally worked with.

 

Abusers are technically sociopaths who vet out their victims. They're no different then (and I really hate this connection but it might better explain things) a pedophile vetting out their targets. Abusers will choose partners who are vulnerable, insecure, have low self-esteem, damaged in some way, perhaps even unstable or traumatized previously. These people make it EASY to control, manipulate and overpower. As the victim becomes more dependent and powerless, the abuser becomes more powerful and aggressive.

 

You will NEVER see an abuser with a someone who is the polar opposite of the characteristics I just described.

 

If your ex is indeed an abuser, and by all accounts she seems to fit the profile, I would be willing to put money down that her new boyfriend is in the same boat as you once were. No question about it.

 

My concern with you now is your obsession with needing to KNOW that she is continuing her abuse and that it wasn't just an isolated incident with you.

 

If you're not already, I strongly encourage you to continue therapy and work on THIS detail. It is extremely important to your own recovery so that you don't end up in another situation like this again.

 

Good luck.

 

Its funny you should say that; I was very low when we met and she once remarked that she like me when we first met.

 

Thanks again Michelle. You know I dont think she knows she was an abuser. She probably thought I deserved it or provoked it.

 

I'll move on. I expect I will only fully move on though when i meet someone else.

[Michelle ma Belle]

Its funny you should say that; I was very low when we met and she once remarked that she like me when we first met.

 

Thanks again Michelle. You know I dont think she knows she was an abuser. She probably thought I deserved it or provoked it.

 

I'll move on. I expect I will only fully move on though when i meet someone else.

 

Of course not. This is part of the sociopaths psyche. They NEVER think they have a problem but rather turn it around and make you think YOU are the problem, always!

 

Consider this an experience to chalk up and learn from. Please continue to work on yourself so that you don't become an easy target for another abuser in the future.

 

You deserve better than that.

 

Good luck.

[Michelle ma Belle]

I would also like to add that violence (physical, verbal, emotional) is a LEARNED behavior. We are not naturally born to be violent but rather it's what we see or experience around us whilst growing up.

 

You say that she had psychological issues which does not surprise me. Children exposed to some kind of violence are indeed damaged emotionally. Usually girls exposed to violence by watching their mothers become victims while boys become the abusers by watching how their father behaves. Obviously there are exceptions to this as seen by your ex.

 

Abusers are basically just grown up bullies. And bullies are, at their very core, very insecure, have low-self esteem and self-worth, anxious, stressed and fearful of losing control and having the tables turned on them. It is also good to note that abusers have a very distorted sense of reality and lack healthy social skills.

 

It's important to protect yourself from these types of people but at the same time they are a product of their upbringing. Having compassion isn't a bad thing but you have to understand that that isn't the same as putting yourself in harms way over and over again thinking you can help them or change them. You can't. Their epiphany and subsequent recovery is theirs alone.

[siochana]

I would also like to add that violence (physical, verbal, emotional) is a LEARNED behavior. We are not naturally born to be violent but rather it's what we see or experience around us whilst growing up.

 

You say that she had psychological issues which does not surprise me. Children exposed to some kind of violence are indeed damaged emotionally. Usually girls exposed to violence by watching their mothers become victims while boys become the abusers by watching how their father behaves. Obviously there are exceptions to this as seen by your ex.

 

Abusers are basically just grown up bullies. And bullies are, at their very core, very insecure, have low-self esteem and self-worth, anxious, stressed and fearful of losing control and having the tables turned on them. It is also good to note that abusers have a very distorted sense of reality and lack healthy social skills.

 

It's important to protect yourself from these types of people but at the same time they are a product of their upbringing. Having compassion isn't a bad thing but you have to understand that that isn't the same as putting yourself in harms way over and over again thinking you can help them or change them. You can't. Their epiphany and subsequent recovery is theirs alone.

 

Its funny, even though you are probably right, I wince at her being described like this. Who knows? I met her parents and her family. They were lovely, lovely people. I cant imagine her being exposed to anything like that. One day when she totally over reacted to a minor transgression on my part ( that was her speciality. I used to say to her, I am responsible for my actions; I am not responsible to your over reactions to my actions) her father rolled his eyes and in a quiet voice said something about her always being like that.

 

They didnt know then the extent of the crap that went on. But you know, its never all bad. Lots of good, all that **** I listed happened over the space of three years.

 

Ah who knows, the only people who will ever know for sure what happened is me and her. and what does it matter now except for the fact that I am still haunted by it which is really, really annoying.

 

Reading the dumper's threads was revelatory: lots of people feeling the guilt for hurting people. When we broke up she blamed all of it on me. Even a couple of months later at an ill fated meet up she said strange things like, I gave you so many chances". She said she deserved better than me. It cut me to the quick.

 

Anyway, Brazil Mexico is about to start. Happy to continue chatting about this or just leaving this thread as a record and guide for some other people who are walking through the fog with tears in their eyes.

[Downtown]

Abusers are technically sociopaths who vet out their victims.

Michelle, although I agree with much of what you say, I cannot agree with this statement. With respect to folks who are verbal and emotional abusers, the psychiatric community offers a number of different causes. These include drug abuse, hormone changes, bipolar disorder, and personality disorders (PDs).

 

With respect to folks who are physical abusers (i.e., "batterers"), empirical studies indicate that such behavior is strongly associated with PDs, especially BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder). A 1993 British Columbia study, for example, found that 90% to 100% of the spouse batterers had a full-blown PD and about half of the batterers had BPD. It found that the remaining batterers with PDs had narcissism, sociopathy, or other PDs. See Melton's summary of the study results at 50% of Batterers are BPD.

 

These distinctions between PDs are important because it means that batterers -- i.e., physical abusers -- are not all alike. Instead, some of them are unstable but capable of being very caring and loving (e.g., the BPDers) and some of them are the reverse: very stable but incapable of loving (e.g., the sociopaths and narcissists).

 

This also means that a large share of the abusers are not manipulative and coldly scheming as you describe them. Instead, that subgroup of abusers are so emotionally unstable that they are very reactive to whatever mood they are experiencing at the moment. Indeed, they tend to be so reactive that they usually are not very good at manipulation, which typically requires careful planning and flawless execution to be successful.

[siochana]

Michelle, although I agree with much of what you say, I cannot agree with this statement. With respect to folks who are verbal and emotional abusers, the psychiatric community offers a number of different causes. These include drug abuse, hormone changes, bipolar disorder, and personality disorders (PDs).

 

With respect to folks who are physical abusers (i.e., "batterers"), empirical studies indicate that such behavior is strongly associated with PDs, especially BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder). A 1993 British Columbia study, for example, found that 90% to 100% of the spouse batterers had a full-blown PD and about half of the batterers had BPD. It found that the remaining batterers with PDs had narcissism, sociopathy, or other PDs. See Melton's summary of the study results at 50% of Batterers are BPD.

 

These distinctions between PDs are important because it means that batterers -- i.e., physical abusers -- are not all alike. Instead, some of them are unstable but capable of being very caring and loving (e.g., the BPDers) and some of them are the reverse: very stable but incapable of loving (e.g., the sociopaths and narcissists).

 

This also means that a large share of the abusers are not manipulative and coldly scheming as you describe them. Instead, that subgroup of abusers are so emotionally unstable that they are very reactive to whatever mood they are experiencing at the moment. Indeed, they tend to be so reactive that they usually are not very good at manipulation, which typically requires careful planning and flawless execution to be successful.

 

 

 

Hi Downtown,

 

 

Interesting stuff.

 

 

Would you care to weigh in on the question I asked in my OP. Based on the facts as I laid them out, do you think I was the victim of abuse/ that my ex had abusive tendencies or perhaps the explanation is more mundane.

 

 

Or perhaps you would need further context.