"We're trying to save our marriage" [update]

[Scarlet2]

I agree with the others, your response should have been no response or indifference. If you insist on still talking to him, I suggest continue to make him wait for a reply so that you aren't at his beck and call. It's like he wants to still hold your hand while he makes his marriage stronger and then once that foundation is reinforced again, he'll no longer be talking to you anymore. That is, until he wants the A to reignite when the marriage falters again.

 

He knows you love and care about him and that you want him to be happy but he should be the one telling you that he wants to be the one to make you happy.

[underwater2010]

A. He is full of crap....she has probably backed off the snooping.

 

B. Why the heck would you want to continue in a relationship with someone not willing to end it with their spouse.

 

C. Cut your sister and BIL out of the picture....they are toxic....why the hell would two married people introduce you to someone that is married and be okay with pursuing a relationship with them.

 

I say forget about him and invest your time into someone you have a future with.

[blue963]

Or they fear you are going to cause problems for them!

[hippetyhop]

Thank you everyone for your replies and thoughts.

 

I played nice for 2 days with him. I have my exit now.

 

Yesterday as we were texting, he was his usual stressed self with work. After a couple one word answers from him, I'm like forget it. I've played that game way way way too long. I didn't reply back. I would generally start conversation or whatnot but not this time. I'm not planning on contacting him either. I have nothing to say to him. Let him find someone else.

 

Childish- yes. However, its my step to fade away. If he does contact me, not even sure if I'll reply back. If I do, it sure as hell wouldn't be the same day. If he brings it up, I have no problem telling him I am not at his beck and calling. He said he wants to talk, but wants to hear from me more than every once in awhile..I think that pretty much falls into that category. I'm just doing what he says.

 

It was like just after he told me they were going to attempt to save it-- I didn't reply. That certainly generated a response the next day. Why should I have to respond back quickly. I shouldn't have even responded back. Doesn't matter- he won't hear from me again....he's getting what he wants.

 

Randomwoman- yes, that is what I'm thinking-- maybe a friendship down the road..just maybe. However, I won't even attempt that unless he's divorced.

 

Scarlet- yes, I think he does that, but he doesn't wait for the foundation to get strong per se to contact me. He waits until he can convince her that he's a good husband and alleviates signs of cheating THEN he contacts me.

 

At one point, we did have a very good relationship. It wasn't always like this. I know what he is capable of giving, but he doesn't want to. Thus, I won't stay. He's good until BS gets suspicious then he ducks. Well, he can keep ducking because until he gives 100% to her and their marriage, it'll be like this.

 

 

C. Cut your sister and BIL out of the picture....they are toxic....why the hell would two married people introduce you to someone that is married and be okay with pursuing a relationship with them.

 

 

I want to clarify this point--my sis and BIL don't know. We met as we were both part of their wedding party. Thus, we had to meet but it wasn't their intentions of hooking us up.

Edited July 10, 2014 by hippetyhop

[Owl]

I'd like to add to this with my best suggestion for you one more time.

 

Go beyond just not replying.

 

Block him. Remove him from your contact lists.

 

Please trust me...we've seen this far more times than you'd believe right now, but it's totally true. You're hurt at the moment, and you fully believe you'll never respond. But a week from now, you'll be missing him, and he'll slip in some comment that'll get past your guard, and you'll reply....and within a few days, the whole affair is back on again.

 

Block him now, while you're angry and hurt, and it will save you a WHOLE LOT of pain later.

[georgia girl]

Hippetyhop,

 

 

Here's my impression. You are still head over heels in love with this guy and hanging on for dear life. The "not replying" is because you're hurt. He started giving one-word answers. Before, it was because he said he was going to try and make it work with his wife. Reading between the lines, you want him to end it with his wife and chose you.

 

 

Here's the deal, though. He isn't. He has made a choice. You can look at it every which way from Sunday and he is still there despite you putting it out there very wide open that you still love him. This guy may want you on the side, but he's staying married despite whatever he may say about his spouse.

 

 

Consider this perspective: let's say you were all single and just dating. And this guy tells you that he's really going to work on his relationship with the other girl he's dating but he'd still like to talk to you every once in awhile. Would you send him a loving message and leave the door open for him to talk to you wen he felt like it? Or would you slam it shut, probably with something like, "I'm too good for you anyway!" and then grieve in private?

 

 

Something about the affair dynamic makes the single partner not look after their own best interests and sacrifice themselves, their dignity, their emotions, their own well-being just to be in another's life. And that person only wants you there part-time.

 

 

Please consider moving on. Just letting go and grieving. Blocking him and healing. It's the shortest path that I can see to your own eventual lasting happiness.

 

 

Sorry for the tough love. I really mean well for you. GG

[hippetyhop]

Hippetyhop,

 

 

Here's my impression. You are still head over heels in love with this guy and hanging on for dear life. The "not replying" is because you're hurt. He started giving one-word answers. Before, it was because he said he was going to try and make it work with his wife. Reading between the lines, you want him to end it with his wife and chose you.

 

 

Here's the deal, though. He isn't. He has made a choice. You can look at it every which way from Sunday and he is still there despite you putting it out there very wide open that you still love him. This guy may want you on the side, but he's staying married despite whatever he may say about his spouse.

 

 

Consider this perspective: let's say you were all single and just dating. And this guy tells you that he's really going to work on his relationship with the other girl he's dating but he'd still like to talk to you every once in awhile. Would you send him a loving message and leave the door open for him to talk to you wen he felt like it? Or would you slam it shut, probably with something like, "I'm too good for you anyway!" and then grieve in private?

 

 

Something about the affair dynamic makes the single partner not look after their own best interests and sacrifice themselves, their dignity, their emotions, their own well-being just to be in another's life. And that person only wants you there part-time.

 

 

Please consider moving on. Just letting go and grieving. Blocking him and healing. It's the shortest path that I can see to your own eventual lasting happiness.

 

 

Sorry for the tough love. I really mean well for you. GG

 

Georgia-- yes, you are right and no apologies about the tough love. Reality checks go far. I am still head over heels for someone whose been in my life despite the circumstances for the past 2 years, but its changing based on his actions. Once the A got too much for him, he backed off. Once she becomes suspicious or something goes down like this, he doesn't contact me. After the dust settles, he generally reappears (can't say for certain after this time). Then she gets suspicious when she sees my number on his log and then its weeks of disappearing again.

 

I think in a sense mostly every OP (I'm not speaking for all-but read the board) wants them to leave their MP for them, or they are given the false hopes.

 

The point you make is dead on not only to me, but to others in the same boat: he chose her over me and that was his decision, and yes, it does hurt. Only they know for whatever reason: love, fear, children (3 kids under 6), hard to divorce and move on. Regardless-- he didn't choose me.

 

The issue with blocking is that I do not have the option on my phone. I will need to check with the phone company to make sure they don't charge for it. I can add him to a 'blacklist' but it still notifies of any contact he'd attempt. I tried this with a friend as a test. It doesn't help when you know there is a message from a blacklist user :/

 

I'm not sure if its because I'm angry or a step in the right direction, but I have no inclination to reach out to him for anything. We weren't talking on his birthday (no LC or no NC) and I still didn't feel the need to wish him a 'happy birthday' as I just didn't want to start talking to him again.

 

So long as he doesn't contact me, I'm good. I don't wish, pray, and hope he does as it may be the same repetitive pattern. Maybe he's serious this time and just won't contact. I just want to tell him "if your M is that bad, then leave. If I'm this bad to you that you keep drifting in/out, then don't contact me." Even little things don't bother me anymore..for example, I would see a person in passing or whatnot with his name and I'd get mad/anxious, but I don't anymore. I would hear a song and get upset, but I don't anymore. I don't know if its me just so fed up and not caring and getting over him, or what..but its up to me to put a stop to this.

Edited July 11, 2014 by hippetyhop

[hippetyhop]

Well, someone called it. I wasn't strong enough to not answer.

 

Although I didn't initiate any conversation with him, he did text me Friday night mentioning his run. I'm not sure if he was doing it to be friendly or if he was looking for me to start any inappropriate talk (his text was: wow, it was a hot day for a run). Although I made jokes, I didn't make any sexual innuendos. I did reply (I know I shouldn't have) and I kept it platonic, I never did hear back from him when I asked a general question. If he doesn't want to talk to me, then he should just stop. Just leaving me hanging is doing nothing but making me more angry at him.

 

Such a random text.

 

I still won't reach out to him and I'm still not going to wait around for him.

 

I don't feel sad either. Just wondering why these random texts? Are these breadcrumbs to keep me lured?

Edited July 13, 2014 by hippetyhop

[beach]

Well, someone called it. I wasn't strong enough to not answer.

 

Although I didn't initiate any conversation with him, he did text me Friday night mentioning his run. I'm not sure if he was doing it to be friendly or if he was looking for me to start any inappropriate talk (his text was: wow, it was a hot day for a run). Although I made jokes, I didn't make any sexual innuendos. I did reply (I know I shouldn't have) and I kept it platonic, I never did hear back from him when I asked a general question. If he doesn't want to talk to me, then he should just stop. Just leaving me hanging is doing nothing but making me more angry at him.

 

Such a random text.

 

I still won't reach out to him and I'm still not going to wait around for him.

 

I don't feel sad either. Just wondering why these random texts? Are these breadcrumbs to keep me lured?

 

Those are stupid texts to make sure you're still thinking about him. Designed to keep you hanging.

 

Notice he didn't ask a question? Notice it didn't require a reply? Yet you replied..

 

 

Blocking him would stop those stupid texts that feed his ego and reduce you to accepting less than you deserve.

 

It would put you in a position of taking some of your power back - after all, you've handed him all your power in the past.

 

Contrary action is what would bring you a new result - but that requires you blocking him.

 

Will you do that?

[hippetyhop]

Those are stupid texts to make sure you're still thinking about him. Designed to keep you hanging.

 

Notice he didn't ask a question? Notice it didn't require a reply? Yet you replied..

 

 

Blocking him would stop those stupid texts that feed his ego and reduce you to accepting less than you deserve.

 

It would put you in a position of taking some of your power back - after all, you've handed him all your power in the past.

 

Contrary action is what would bring you a new result - but that requires you blocking him.

 

Will you do that?

 

As angry as I am, honestly, it felt good to hear from him. I was so in the moment that I didn't even think that his answer didn't generate a reply.

 

So if I don't reply, he'll eventually just go away? Does it really work like that? I thought after I didn't respond back to him he'd just go away.

 

Parts of me wonder if it at all bothers him that I'm not contacting him..or, if its a relief. Although I didn't contact him after he told me they were trying to save their marriage. I got a text from him the next a.m. making sure I was 'ok'. Isn't that a hint since I didn't reply I was? In a way a different circumstance

 

I can't block his number. My phone doesn't give me that choice--I can blacklist, but it still notifies me when he texts. The only way to block him through my phone company is to get a new number. I can't do that as its a business phone; not good for business. So its either stay strong and ignore and blacklist and have the urge not to look at any messages he may or may not send.

Edited July 13, 2014 by hippetyhop

[beach]

When you ignore him long enough - he will likely stop.

 

This you can control.

[hippetyhop]

When you ignore him long enough - he will likely stop.

 

This you can control.

 

You hit the nail on the head.

 

So he's testing me?

 

I don't know your story but easier said than done. However I find it slight progress and baby steps for me not initiating contact and leaving conversation as is.

 

I see how this might play into him potentially wanting to try to reignite the affair if things blow over. Or I'm naive and think this is post affair friendship chit chat.

Edited July 13, 2014 by hippetyhop

[AmyBamy]

I haven't read all the responses, only the OP. But, he's simply going through the motions of "trying to save the marriage" out of obligation it sounds like. A lot of men do this because they think that they are expected to. Even though they know and realize that the marriage is never going to be what they want, not with that person, they still try so that they can say that they tried everything. Especially if they have kids. They want to try everything, even when they know that nothing is going to change (it rarely does, and the wife that they are not in love with does not morph into someone that they are not - they KNOW who their wife is and if she was what they wanted, they wouldn't be having an affair).

 

It's up to you what you do, but I would lay low and take yourself out of the equation for now. You can take your time processing whether or not you want to continue on with him later when his marriage fails, as it most likely will considering his texts and half hearted reconciliation attempts.

 

We humans are very guilty creatures. So even when we know it's useless, we will still try - still give it that last ditch effort just to make sure that there isn't any chance to make something work and not complicate our lives. He will either realize he was right and it's not going to work and leave, or he will realize he was right and it's not going to work but he will stay anyway. In the meantime, you can do you and if you are interested when he's done going through the charade, then you can make your decisions then.

[Hope Shimmers]

I haven't read all the responses, only the OP. But, he's simply going through the motions of "trying to save the marriage" out of obligation it sounds like. A lot of men do this because they think that they are expected to. Even though they know and realize that the marriage is never going to be what they want, not with that person, they still try so that they can say that they tried everything. Especially if they have kids. They want to try everything, even when they know that nothing is going to change (it rarely does, and the wife that they are not in love with does not morph into someone that they are not - they KNOW who their wife is and if she was what they wanted, they wouldn't be having an affair).

 

It's up to you what you do, but I would lay low and take yourself out of the equation for now. You can take your time processing whether or not you want to continue on with him later when his marriage fails, as it most likely will considering his texts and half hearted reconciliation attempts.

 

We humans are very guilty creatures. So even when we know it's useless, we will still try - still give it that last ditch effort just to make sure that there isn't any chance to make something work and not complicate our lives. He will either realize he was right and it's not going to work and leave, or he will realize he was right and it's not going to work but he will stay anyway. In the meantime, you can do you and if you are interested when he's done going through the charade, then you can make your decisions then.

 

All due respect HH, but I totally disagree with this.

 

His (lack of) contact toward you is more about disinterest than guilt. He isn't "going through any motions" with his M. His M has been the same as it was when you met him. He is just a man who wants to have his cake and eat it too, and he wants it on HIS terms. It's up to you to decide if that's what you want out of your life.

[sisa]

I also doubt that the married person who can perform the affair for so long would suddenly feel guilt.

 

It's probablity lose interests for AP or either feel too much trouble for maintain two relationship. also the risk control.

[AmyBamy]

I also doubt that the married person who can perform the affair for so long would suddenly feel guilt.

 

It's probablity lose interests for AP or either feel too much trouble for maintain two relationship. also the risk control.

 

Not guilt about the affair necessarily, guilt about not "trying everything possible before ending the marriage". My exMM went through this after our affair. He needed to know that he had done everything possible before he could just admit that he and his ex wife were never going to work out. It took him a minute to come to that conclusion, but once he did, he was done. It's hard to give up a marriage, no matter how miserable it is. People tend to stick with what they know out of fear of the unknown - until it gets so miserable that they just can't do it anymore. That's what I see happening here with OP.

[hippetyhop]

Thank you again everyone for the replies.

 

Yes, they have 3 small kids (6, 4, 3). I think that plays a factor as well.

 

I'm pretty sure trying to balance 2 relationships isn't an easy feat for him right now. I think with everything, his M might be worse off than when we first started the A. At that point, he had his freedoms. He was able to see me as he wished. He was able to contact me without any repercussions. Now he's likely on house arrest with a work permit. The trust she has with him likely dismal and they are rocky. He may not want to risk anything due to that.

 

In May, she became very, very suspicious of my number and he told her it was just a friend. After that, we went from not texting to using email back to texting to using email and now texting is okay. Now, I just don't contact him.

 

If he lost interest in me, then just let me go entirely. His actions towards me now aren't exactly making me think anything nice about him, let alone wanting to have any type of physical contact with him. If his text was his way to grab attention, its not helping his case either.

 

 

Not guilt about the affair necessarily, guilt about not "trying everything possible before ending the marriage". My exMM went through this after our affair. He needed to know that he had done everything possible before he could just admit that he and his ex wife were never going to work out. It took him a minute to come to that conclusion, but once he did, he was done. It's hard to give up a marriage, no matter how miserable it is. People tend to stick with what they know out of fear of the unknown - until it gets so miserable that they just can't do it anymore. That's what I see happening here with OP.

 

So you think he is trying to make it or break it with one last attempt? If this is what he is doing, I hope he's doing it to make him happy as I reiterated in the messages to him--make sure he's doing it so that he's happy. He never responded even if it was "I am happy with this". It was the opportunity to do so since he told me he could never see me again.

 

I'm not pushing anything nor waiting around. If I find someone, so be it. At least I can say I tried.

Edited July 14, 2014 by hippetyhop

[Owl]

I'm not pushing anything nor waiting around. If I find someone, so be it. At least I can say I tried.

 

People that "try" plan on failing.

 

Those that "do"...succeed.

 

That's why everyone keeps telling you to ACTIVELY end the affair, not passively 'hope' he goes away (while continuing to hope he doesn't in secret).

 

OWN taking action on your side.

 

Stop 'trying'...start DOING.

 

(See my signature)

[AmyBamy]

You say, "at least I can say I tried".... that is exactly what I think he is doing with his last attempt at "saving" the marriage. This is human nature really. We don't like to have regrets so we hang in there until we are almost 100% convinced that it can't/won't work. People do it with marriages all the time. They stay past abuse, neglect, everything, so that when they look back, they can say that they tried, that they did everything they possibly could to make it work and it still didn't work. It's an insurance against future guilt, nothing more. It has nothing to do with happiness really. Everything to do with trying to do the right thing even at our own expense.

[hippetyhop]

Owl- When I said I tried- I meant in the sense of being there for him. He opted not to. Not that I tried to find someone else to have a real and non-toxic R with.

 

 

 

Amybamy-- thank you for the explanation. It really helps put things in perspective. Putting it into perspective as to where I am with this does make complete sense.

 

 

 

I'm not doing anything to lure him back. I don't know if he expects me to. I'm letting him fix his M although I'm not sure what his position is re. trying to fully reconcile. He can never come back and say that I attempted to hinder him reconciling. I'm giving him his space to fix it.

 

 

 

Re. the texts- I’m not sure if this means anything, but I’m not necessarily bothered by the texts per se. I guess what I’m trying to say is that it doesn’t upset me, however, I’m just wondering ‘why’. These vanilla texts aren’t hindering me to hold onto that anything will happen between him and I.

 

 

 

My thinking is that he’s concentrating on fixing his M and why he’s sending it is besides me. What good is it to him for me to reply to a non-chalant text? He wants to be ‘friends’ and the reply I’m giving is just that; not anything more or less. Is that enough to rub his ego to make him think I’ll return to the A?

[beach]

You say, "at least I can say I tried".... that is exactly what I think he is doing with his last attempt at "saving" the marriage. This is human nature really. We don't like to have regrets so we hang in there until we are almost 100% convinced that it can't/won't work. People do it with marriages all the time. They stay past abuse, neglect, everything, so that when they look back, they can say that they tried, that they did everything they possibly could to make it work and it still didn't work. It's an insurance against future guilt, nothing more. It has nothing to do with happiness really. Everything to do with trying to do the right thing even at our own expense.

 

You keep typing about HIS marriage.

 

What about looking after YOURSELF? YOUR life...?

 

When do YOU become your top priority instead of him and his life?

 

 

And yes, he keeps texting to see if you're willing to participate even though he isn't offering you anything.

 

Offering "friendship" is crap - if he were your friend his wife would know you as well.

Edited July 14, 2014 by beach

[Spark1111]

well, based on what I have read and lived, it is normal for a WS to be jolted by their spouse's suspicion to lay low and end the affair under the guise of saving the marriage.

 

But there are two problems with that: The spouse has no idea they have a marriage that needs saving AND the AP is politely back-burnered to "friend."

 

So polite and intermittent contact continues...

 

Once he is reasonably assured her suspicions have abated he will contact you again declaring you to be the love of his life. Hot sex will ensue.You have so kindly encouraged him to save his marriage, have abided by his parameters of less contact and have still remained friendly towards him. He knows you love and care for him.

 

Or, she remains suspicious of you and he finds someone else.

 

No offense here, but with three children six and under, that is ONE busy woman.

 

I was just wondering if she gets a chance to take a break from those babies and go for a run....

[Spark1111]

Hippety.....another thought as a mother of three, close in age, myself: IF he leaves her to be with you, you and he will share custody, and every other weekend, you and he will parent three chaotic little ones....

 

Is this the future you envisioned?

[hippetyhop]

Beach:

 

How do you know I'm not a priority to myself and I'm not taking care of myself and I'm not bettering myself? Just because I ask questions re. the marriage all of a sudden he's my top priority? Because I'm posting here I'm not taking care of myself? I would think it would be better to discuss everything and be open instead of being a tightly sealed bottle who is ready to explode.

 

Why are YOU posting here on this forum? Why aren't YOU taking care of YOURSELF? I've gone days without messaging him. If he was my top priority, I'd be reaching out to him right now and trying to make something work. I'm still trying to wrap my head around all of this and everything that went down.

 

I'm not sure if you've ever been the OP in an A. If you haven't, then you don't know what we go through. The ups/downs when someone who claims they love you puts you through this. You can take the stance that its our fault or whatnot for putting ourselves through this continuous cycle. However, since a lot of our feelings and the 'what ifs' are contingent upon their M, its not unusual for these questions to run through our minds.

 

Its hard to move on from this and all these questions are IMO part of the grieving process. Like I said--I'm not waiting around for him, however, my feelings are still hurt and I still have questions/thoughts. That is typically what happens when you grieve. You have questions and thoughts. Why are BS able to grieve the end of the M or be angry during their R and we aren't? Why are they allowed to ask questions and we aren't? Why aren't they told to just move on or get over it or don't worry about the OP when they ask what is so special about them that their spouse ran to them? (rhetorical question btw--but my drift should be understood). This doesn't go away with two snaps and a twist.

 

I think its healthy for questions to be asked from all sides of an A. MP, BS, OP. I'm not picking on the BS as I think their questions are just as valid, but I don't like to be badgered for asking mine.

 

You think your tough love is helping, but it doesn't. We aren't ready for a reality check yet. We want to grieve at first. So my apologies if my questions bother you.

[beach]

The only thing you can control is how you participate.

 

Think of it this way---> each and every time you communicate with him it feeds his ego at the expense of costing you a little piece of your self esteem and pride. Is it worth handing him all your power?

 

It serves him well to keep this up but it doesn't look like it serves you well.