Should I do a second bachelors degree?

[MisUnderstood1]

I just graduated with a BA in Philosophy. I'm almost 27. Can't find a job. Have $40 grand in student loans. I did well and enjoyed my Philosophy courses but the electives I took killed my GPA, hence no grad sch. I didn't bother applying since I knew I didn't make the cutoff average. I just got into another Uni to do a second degree; a BSc in Public Health starting this Fall, with the intention of applying to grad sch in Public Health to become an Epidemiologist. This is essentially a way for me to get a better gpa so I can get into grad sch. This school also has a 2-yr second program degree in Nursing, but it's too late for me to apply for the Fall, so I would have to apply for Fall 2015. I've to take two prereq courses for nursing and I plan to take those this Fall, then apply/change majors to nursing early next year. If I get in, my plan's to work throughout next year (at least, full time from January to August) so I can pay for the second degree myself. Nursing is actually what I really want to do (epidemiology is secondary) and what would allow me to help people. I didn't know about the nursing program at this school until this year. I would've prepared myself for it had I known last year. I want to live my life being of service to people. With either choice, I'm looking at 3 more yrs of sch. I will be 30 or 31 when I finish. The thought of that doesn't make me too happy. Makes me feel like I've spent the majority of my 20s in school.

 

 

My concerns:

 

1) Nothing is set in stone yet. I don't know whether I will get into nursing. Both the public health and nursing schools are in the same faculty (Health Sciences). I'm thinking: since I've already been admitted into PH and it's in the same faculty as nursing, I have a chance to get in. But next year, admission is going to be more competitive for their nursing school and they'll be basing it on gpa (this year you just need to have completed an undergrad degree as well as the 4 prereqs for admission), so the averages of the two prereqs I will be taking in the fall would be counted in my GPA, so I know I've to do really well in them if I want to get in. I just want to take a chance and try to see what would happen. If I don't get in, I can live with that because I know at least I tried. I also don't know how hard/easy it would be to get a job. It's supposed to be a good city for finding work, but I do know someone who moved there a year ago and it took him 6 months to find work, so I know it won't be all that easy. I plan to start applying asap and do anything I can get my hands on. I'm just worried about not being able to find anything at all. I've applied for all sorts of jobs here, even restaurant-type work, walmart, target, etc and still cannot find one.

 

2) More student loan debt. I would have to take out more loans to get me through the Fall, so I'm looking at 50 grand of debt in total, which's terrifying. The 40 grand I owe right now is a huge worry alone. This school's in another city that's supposed to be booming in terms of jobs, so part of the reason why I'm trying to be hopeful that I will be able to get a job is because there're more job opportunities there, at least from what I've been hearing. I'm hoping to start applying as as soon as I get there and find one, work part-time in the Fall then full-time come January. If I do get into nursing and no longer doing PH, I can work throughout next year, well until the program starts in September. But I'm still worried about taking out loans and putting myself into more debt. 50 grand.

 

2) I was a nursing student before at my previous Uni and changed majors b/c I didn't think nursing suited me. I've a very reserved, quiet personality and the clinicals scared me a bit into thinking I wasn't cut out for nursing. I saw everyone else was more extroverted than me and didn't thin I fit in. I was doing quite well in my courses and although the clinicals were hard, I enjoyed the one-on-one interaction I had w/ the patients - this was my fav. part. I've also been told a number of times I will make a great nurse and I believe so too, at least now I do. I've also volunteered at hospitals and I plan to do it again in the Fall. I have been doing a lot of soul-searching and I cannot see myself in any other career except this. Back then, I didn't believe in myself and didn't know all the things I know now. The only thing is to know that had I stuck with it then, I would've finished long ago. Now I'm considering going back to it years later and doing what I should've done long ago. It just makes me sad knowing I let go of it due to fear and lack of self-esteem. I know I've to work on myself before I go back into it and I'm working on that. I just want to give it one more try and if it doesn't work out or I don't get in, I can at least say I tried and maybe then I can say it just isn't meant to be. I just feel like I won't be able to live with myself if I don't give it one more try.

 

3) A one-year post-grad certificate program would enable me to be done with school quicker and get on with my life. There're some things I don't know how to do at my age, like driving; I don't know how to drive. I try not to compare myself to others, but I'm moving at a slower pace in life than most people. I'm living at home right now w/ my parents; I move back last year in August and commuted 4-hours to finish my degree. I love this country (Canada), but I've never traveled outside of it and experience life since coming here. These are things that are good to do in your 20s and things that other people have done. A big part of me just wants to be done w/ school for good and start living more. I feel like I have not been living much, just existing. As for the one-year programs, these're programs that help Uni graduates tailor their degree into specific careers, especially people like me who have liberal arts' degrees and can't find a job. I've looked into careers like Technical writing, market research, copywriting. These programs also have internships so you get experience in the field. I'm creative and really enjoy writing (maybe you can tell by this paper I am writing right now; I really didn't mean for my post to be this long) and thought about having a career in writing, but I think it would be better to do it on the side. I enjoy art and draw & paint too. I know I said I don't see myself in any other career besides nursing, but I know I would make a good writer or artist; I just wouldn't be able to help people. I'm not sure being a copywriter would give me the fulfillment I am looking for. The copywriting program I've looked into is about 9 grand for two semesters, so it is expensive too but the market research program is about 6 grand so this one is cheaper. I was (and still am) interested in market research and I feel like my philosophy degree has given me the skills to thrive in that, although I think you have to be a people person for it. You've to be a people person as a nurse too, so in either case there's no way around it; I just have to get better at it. I'm naturally a very quiet person and it has been hard for me to change. This's another reason why I'm trying to go into the right career; I need something that would align with my personality. Many companies who hire market analyst also hire copywriters/writers, so I could probably do both. There is a school that offers copywriting classes (though you will not get a certificate) and they're cheaper, so I can up my skills this way. I feel like I've wasted my 20s w/ not knowing what to do w/ my life and this option of doing a one-yr program is attractive to me b/c with it, I would be done w/ school next year and would hopefully be able to find a good job I enjoy, and start paying off my loans. I could start this September or in January and either way I'll be done next year. I know I'm not getting younger. The thought of being 30 and just finally starting a career (referring to the nursing option) is disheartening, especially when I could've finished years ago.

 

 

So, what would you do if you were in my shoes? Would you pursue a dream (nursing) even though you're not sure if it would work out? (and even if it does, it would take a few years to get there). Or do something that's more immediate - one-year program? Some days I think I'll go with the former and then the more I think about it I start gravitating towards the latter, so I am just going back and forth with my thought and can't seem to be certain with one choice. This's essentially a life-changing decision and I'm trying to be careful with it and do the best thing for myself. I'm being pulled into nursing and part of me also wants to do a one-year program and just get on with life. Any advice? What would you do?

Edited July 10, 2014 by MisUnderstood1

[scooby-philly]

I think I can relate to your situation - not directly, but the feeling.

 

 

My story very briefly - Very isolate childhood - dad a workaholic know it all and recovering alcoholic, mom - an unedcated, sexuall abused, recovering drug user (though she relapsed for 2-3 years on/off when I was 9-12 years old), and also a paternal grandmother who lived with us who was shame based and not outgoing. So I had to make a lot of important life decisions without my parents support and without advice. I picked my college, major, and first career without really getting input from others or being self-reflective. Went into the seminary - i'm not religious - and was a hs teacher for 6 years. Earned my MA in education. left the seminary 5 years ago this summer - managed to work my way into corporate training. I don't know if I want to stay here - though the money is vastly superior to HS teaching - the politics and focus on hitting deadlines kills me sometimes! But, even though I've learned a lot the past 5 years, I don't think like a lot business people - i.e. I don't see everything in dollars and cents and I don't go chasing after the latest fad or tech - nor am I out to climb the ladder of success.

 

But - to the both of us I'd say - who cares about fitting it. It seems like the main motivator is that you fear not fitting in. Let me tell you - I never fit it, and a lot of people I respect for their competence and skill don't fit in either. Work requires people of varying skills, interests, and personalities. So what if other people are verbose and you are not - nursing also requires you to pay attention to the patients and perform tasks and think. None of those require you to be overtly gregarious. Of course, you have to talk to co-workers and patients to do you job and do it well, but it's a job! It may just take you longer to form the lasting relationships that some people seem to have - and I'll tell you from experience that a lot of "fast" friends end up leaving as fast as they come in.

 

As for the student loan - that's a real concern. I was lucky enough to do well enough academically in HS to originally get a full-scholarship to the place I did undergrad at, so even with tuition raises after enrolling, I ended up with under 10 grand in debt for a very well respected catholic university. My religious order paid those loans back while I was studying and teaching as a member and I earned my masters in ed during that time - so I am lucky. THE MOST IMPORTANT THING to consider is... Does the possibility of $50 grand in debt really alter your plans or life style. I mean, create a chart or spreadsheet - consider the cost of a one-year program and then what you'll make after it, and consider the cost of going for nursing, and what you'll make for it. Figure in the appropriate amount of raises over the years - perhaps 1-1.5% on the conservative side, and see - can you live within what you'll require between paying back the loans, a mortgage or rent, and other stuff.

 

The other major consideration is - what are you doing right now to help you achieve your dream. Most people wouldn't consider doing a nursing degree a dream - it's not "fantasy" world - ala becoming a writer or movie director. And you seem willing to re-locate for whatever you need to do. The question is if the program doesn't start till the fall of 2015 - is that correct? - what can you do between now and then, besides keeping an income coming in, to prepare yourself? Can you volunteer at a nursing home or other place and get to know the nurses? Are there professional organizations you can join to find mentors, discuss options, rate programs, etc. Can you identify the courses you struggled with and get some help - friends, online courses, to help you study for them.

 

The question of living at a different pace is not one to worry about - people living too frenetically either burn out, burn outhers out, or jhave things collapse around them.

 

I just turned 33 and I would love to be a writer - not a novelist perhaps, but write for magazines/newspapers. But, I'm not foolish enough to just jump out of what I have. I'm 33 and I live with my parents in the US. Part of it was breaking up with a fiancee I was living with a year ago - and part of it is I spent the first six years of my working life living a vow of poverty. Now, am I "behind" my peers - yes if you think you have to have x,y,z by a certain age. But I have no real regrets. I wish I had made different choices at certain points where I wasn't my best and hurt myself or others. I wish I had taken more opportunities to do things instead of worrying about being perfect, I wish I knew now - about myself and the world - back then, but I'm also making new friends, doing new things now, and becoming better for it. It may sound selfish - but that's what we all are inherently, and having taught for 6 years and lived a vow of poverty - I think I've gotten to a point where I'm okay just taking care of myself for a while and letting things happen naturally while persuing my dreams and making my life into what I want it to be.

 

For you - I wish the same thing. Take small steps and see what happens. I just met a guy who's 61, was a law librarian for 30 years, got laid off 10 years ago, spent 6 years going back to school - got a ba and master's - is 100,000 grand in debt and has been unemployed for 2 years while looking for a job after earning is masters. That situation makes yours look laughable (Just some perspective)

[pink_sugar]

I would go with #3. To be brutally honest...you cannot really do anything with a Philosophy degree...but if all a job requires is just a bachelors in general, no matter what it is, you may not need a second degree. A lot of jobs just want a Bachelors degree, period. But if you have experience...the degree focus doesn't matter nearly as much. Go for the certification and if you end up with an employer that is willing to pay for you to go back to school, then by all means, do it!

 

I also didn't learn to drive until I was 22. I prefer to take public transit when I can, honestly. Having a car can be very expensive and I prefer to save my money for other things, like travel.

Edited July 10, 2014 by pink_sugar

[Els]

I just graduated with a BA in Philosophy. I'm almost 27. Can't find a job. Have $40 grand in student loans. I did well and enjoyed my Philosophy courses but the electives I took killed my GPA, hence no grad sch. I didn't bother applying since I knew I didn't make the cutoff average. I just got into another Uni to do a second degree; a BSc in Public Health starting this Fall, with the intention of applying to grad sch in Public Health to become an Epidemiologist.

 

Have you looked up the supply and demand of epidemiologists - both where you live and elsewhere? Even in the best case scenario where you graduate from your 2nd degree with good results and get into a fully funded grad school programme AND graduate from that... then what if you can't find employment as an epidemiologist? You would be in your mid 30s (including the time taken in grad school), with a huge amount of student debt and uncertain prospects.

 

I am also worried to hear that you dropped out of nursing initially... so now you are really starting on your third degree. IMO, you should wait for a while to be certain of what you really want to do before you set yourself up for more loans. It would help if you worked in hospitals for some time as a medical aide or ward clerk or something, to see what life really is like for a nurse, or an epidemiologist. Or join shadowing/intern programmes or such.

 

As for copywriting/technical writing, I don't think a post-grad cert is even necessary for you to start (I'd think a portfolio would be much more important given that you already have a primary degree), but that wouldn't be such a big gamble to take.

[writergal]

.

 

So, what would you do if you were in my shoes? Would you pursue a dream (nursing) even though you're not sure if it would work out? (and even if it does, it would take a few years to get there). Or do something that's more immediate - one-year program? Some days I think I'll go with the former and then the more I think about it I start gravitating towards the latter, so I am just going back and forth with my thought and can't seem to be certain with one choice. This's essentially a life-changing decision and I'm trying to be careful with it and do the best thing for myself. I'm being pulled into nursing and part of me also wants to do a one-year program and just get on with life. Any advice? What would you do?

 

I was in your shoes while I was in my late 30s too when I decided to pursue my dream of becoming a teacher. Why did I wait so long to try? That's for another thread. But at least I tried it so I don't have to wonder anymore "what if?"

 

If nursing is your true calling, then I think you'd do yourself a HUGE disservice by not pursuing it. Forget about the student loans and job market for a second.

 

Realistically, you can easily repay your student loans back on a nurse's salary (yes, you may have to borrow more financial aid for nursing school but so what). You can defer your student loans and then once you get a nursing job, do an income-based repayment schedule so that you can afford the monthly payments. Don't let money get in the way of pursing your dream career.

 

And you can apply your philosophy degree to your role as a nurse too, believe it or not. Many patients will benefit from having a nurse with your education background, especially in philosophy which basically teaches you how to be a reasonable person. A nurse who is reasonable and empathetic to other points of view is a nurse a patient can trust. You will have patients with easy personalities and difficult personalities. Well, the critical thinking an analytical skills you picked up from your philosophy degree will benefit both you and your patient.

 

Don't give up your dream career to be miserable in another line of work that will leave you feeling hollow and unsatisfied inside. Just go for it. Carpe diem!

[GoreSP]

I work in a University and my answer is NO! Keep in mind here that I didn't read your full post I'm just answering your question based on what I've witnessed in the past 7 years I worked with University students...

 

I see students completing degree after degree after degree and they end up at 35 and don't have any experience beyond the ****ty student jobs they get while studying or TAships.

 

EMployers see graduates come in with degrees and don't want to start at the 'bottom of the lader'. They come in expecting high salaries and great benefits and job security. Employers don't like that.

 

Start in the mail room. Work your way up. Take the contract. Take the secretary job.

 

If you keep going to school past your 30s, when you start applying for the good paying jobs, you will never get them because a) you will have no experience and b) these jobs usually go to the people who have been working there for years and have a union because it's part of the agreement.

 

Find a job. If you absolutely must keep taking courses for whatever reason, do it part-time.

[melodicintention]

Defer! When you are in school, you can defer your loan. I graduated in 1998 and am still deferring my loan. They aren't jumping down my throat. Can't find a job and trying to start a biz personally. I am also considering going back to school at Musician Institute to furtehr my music study. Probably won't get a "job" job with this course work, though I do plan to hire myself to begin a tour before long.

 

If you feel you could use more school do it now, don't wait 15 years later like me.

 

And also, I have a degree in communications and ended working in radio, then somehow became a technical writer for governmetn and major fortune 500 electronics companies. WTF how did I end up hear I ask myself all the time!?!? You rarely go the course you expected, nor the course your degree trains you for. I can't deal with technical writing though it pay WELL, my heart is dying so I'm going back to being a starving artist/student.

 

At the end of the day, do what it takes to be HAPPY.

[MisUnderstood1]

I think I can relate to your situation - not directly, but the feeling.

 

 

My story very briefly - Very isolate childhood - dad a workaholic know it all and recovering alcoholic, mom - an unedcated, sexuall abused, recovering drug user (though she relapsed for 2-3 years on/off when I was 9-12 years old), and also a paternal grandmother who lived with us who was shame based and not outgoing. So I had to make a lot of important life decisions without my parents support and without advice. I picked my college, major, and first career without really getting input from others or being self-reflective. Went into the seminary - i'm not religious - and was a hs teacher for 6 years. Earned my MA in education. left the seminary 5 years ago this summer - managed to work my way into corporate training. I don't know if I want to stay here - though the money is vastly superior to HS teaching - the politics and focus on hitting deadlines kills me sometimes! But, even though I've learned a lot the past 5 years, I don't think like a lot business people - i.e. I don't see everything in dollars and cents and I don't go chasing after the latest fad or tech - nor am I out to climb the ladder of success.

 

But - to the both of us I'd say - who cares about fitting it. It seems like the main motivator is that you fear not fitting in. Let me tell you - I never fit it, and a lot of people I respect for their competence and skill don't fit in either. Work requires people of varying skills, interests, and personalities. So what if other people are verbose and you are not - nursing also requires you to pay attention to the patients and perform tasks and think. None of those require you to be overtly gregarious. Of course, you have to talk to co-workers and patients to do you job and do it well, but it's a job! It may just take you longer to form the lasting relationships that some people seem to have - and I'll tell you from experience that a lot of "fast" friends end up leaving as fast as they come in.

 

As for the student loan - that's a real concern. I was lucky enough to do well enough academically in HS to originally get a full-scholarship to the place I did undergrad at, so even with tuition raises after enrolling, I ended up with under 10 grand in debt for a very well respected catholic university. My religious order paid those loans back while I was studying and teaching as a member and I earned my masters in ed during that time - so I am lucky. THE MOST IMPORTANT THING to consider is... Does the possibility of $50 grand in debt really alter your plans or life style. I mean, create a chart or spreadsheet - consider the cost of a one-year program and then what you'll make after it, and consider the cost of going for nursing, and what you'll make for it. Figure in the appropriate amount of raises over the years - perhaps 1-1.5% on the conservative side, and see - can you live within what you'll require between paying back the loans, a mortgage or rent, and other stuff.

 

The other major consideration is - what are you doing right now to help you achieve your dream. Most people wouldn't consider doing a nursing degree a dream - it's not "fantasy" world - ala becoming a writer or movie director. And you seem willing to re-locate for whatever you need to do. The question is if the program doesn't start till the fall of 2015 - is that correct? - what can you do between now and then, besides keeping an income coming in, to prepare yourself? Can you volunteer at a nursing home or other place and get to know the nurses? Are there professional organizations you can join to find mentors, discuss options, rate programs, etc. Can you identify the courses you struggled with and get some help - friends, online courses, to help you study for them.

 

The question of living at a different pace is not one to worry about - people living too frenetically either burn out, burn outhers out, or jhave things collapse around them.

 

I just turned 33 and I would love to be a writer - not a novelist perhaps, but write for magazines/newspapers. But, I'm not foolish enough to just jump out of what I have. I'm 33 and I live with my parents in the US. Part of it was breaking up with a fiancee I was living with a year ago - and part of it is I spent the first six years of my working life living a vow of poverty. Now, am I "behind" my peers - yes if you think you have to have x,y,z by a certain age. But I have no real regrets. I wish I had made different choices at certain points where I wasn't my best and hurt myself or others. I wish I had taken more opportunities to do things instead of worrying about being perfect, I wish I knew now - about myself and the world - back then, but I'm also making new friends, doing new things now, and becoming better for it. It may sound selfish - but that's what we all are inherently, and having taught for 6 years and lived a vow of poverty - I think I've gotten to a point where I'm okay just taking care of myself for a while and letting things happen naturally while persuing my dreams and making my life into what I want it to be.

 

For you - I wish the same thing. Take small steps and see what happens. I just met a guy who's 61, was a law librarian for 30 years, got laid off 10 years ago, spent 6 years going back to school - got a ba and master's - is 100,000 grand in debt and has been unemployed for 2 years while looking for a job after earning is masters. That situation makes yours look laughable (Just some perspective)

 

Thanks for sharing your story.

 

I definitely worry about fitting in and not being liked, but one thing I know about myself now is that I'm never going to fit in with people. I've never ever fit in with people before. Wherever I go and whatever I do, I just seem to be the lone ranger/the one who usually ends up hanging out by herself. Honestly, it sucks but I've come to accept it and I'm used to being with my own company now. Sometimes I fake it and try to act extroverted when I'm with people, but after a while it gets tiring for me. Plus I don't like pretending and I don't like following the crowd either. I don't mind if I don't fit in, but when it comes to a job and working w/ co-workers, my only concerns are us getting along and them respecting me, me not being the subject of gossip and being able to work co-cooperatively on the task/s at hand. These're the only things I care about when it comes to a job. I don't care about fitting in nor them being my friend. I've learned to be okay with just being by myself.

 

I called nursing a dream because it's something I would like to do now. I didn't mean for it to sound like it's a fantasy. I know it's not going to be a walk in the park. The first year is from September to August and the second year starts the next month again (September) until the following August, so the program is nonstop for 24 months. From what I know, they do give "breaks" inbetween - maybe a few days (I'm not too sure how many days these breaks are) but it would be 24-months of nursing sch. Yes, the program I'm planning to apply for Fall 2015. If I do decide to attend the school, I will be taking three classes this Fall. Two of them are the prereqs required for the nursing program (Stats and Microbiology) and the other will be a PH (Public Health) course. Ironically, the prereqs courses are also part of the core courses I've to complete for the PH program, so it works out that way b/c I would be fulfilling the requirement for both programs. Btw, I did get many course waivers for the PH program (similar to how transfer credits work) and just have to complete 21 courses in total to get the PH degree and the 3 courses I would take in the Fall would count towards that.

 

What else would I be doing? I'm going to look for a part time job and/or volunteer at a hospital. I went to a local library yesterday to take out a few books on Stats. I was never able to get more than a 65/68% in math in high school (my lowest marks in high school was always in math) and I know I've to get higher in this Stats class. They do not have a cut-off average for admission, just that next year will be "competitive" and the better you do in your prereqs the higher your chances of getting admitted, so I'm trying to prepare myself by reading some books and doing exercises.

Edited July 13, 2014 by MisUnderstood1

[MisUnderstood1]

I would go with #3. To be brutally honest...you cannot really do anything with a Philosophy degree...but if all a job requires is just a bachelors in general, no matter what it is, you may not need a second degree. A lot of jobs just want a Bachelors degree, period. But if you have experience...the degree focus doesn't matter nearly as much. Go for the certification and if you end up with an employer that is willing to pay for you to go back to school, then by all means, do it!

 

I also didn't learn to drive until I was 22. I prefer to take public transit when I can, honestly. Having a car can be very expensive and I prefer to save my money for other things, like travel.

 

Merci.

 

I have looked up a number of jobs and many want experience. Ex: I've seen job postings for copywriters & technical writers and the majority want 2-3 years experience. The majority of the job postings for technical writers I've come across list at least 2-3 years of experience as a requirement.

[FitChick]

Get a job, even part time, in a hospital, convalescent home or assisted living facility. You may not have the stomach to be a nurse, cleaning up vomit and worse, taking temps rectally, giving baths to obese people, etc.

 

With your personality, you should look for a job in a medical research facility or lab, perhaps editing notes or writing reports. You might have to start doing secretarial work. In which case, you need to know Word and Excel and type at a decent speed.

 

People mock professional students.

[MisUnderstood1]

Have you looked up the supply and demand of epidemiologists - both where you live and elsewhere? Even in the best case scenario where you graduate from your 2nd degree with good results and get into a fully funded grad school programme AND graduate from that... then what if you can't find employment as an epidemiologist? You would be in your mid 30s (including the time taken in grad school), with a huge amount of student debt and uncertain prospects.

 

I am also worried to hear that you dropped out of nursing initially... so now you are really starting on your third degree. IMO, you should wait for a while to be certain of what you really want to do before you set yourself up for more loans. It would help if you worked in hospitals for some time as a medical aide or ward clerk or something, to see what life really is like for a nurse, or an epidemiologist. Or join shadowing/intern programmes or such.

 

As for copywriting/technical writing, I don't think a post-grad cert is even necessary for you to start (I'd think a portfolio would be much more important given that you already have a primary degree), but that wouldn't be such a big gamble to take.

 

I've looked up jobs ads for epidemiologists. I found a few, but also found other jobs just requiring an MPH, so an MPH (with a specialization in epidemiology) doesn't limit me to work only as an epi. If I don't find work an an epi, I could probably find one requiring an MPH and that would be fine. I've also looked at tons of linkedln profiles of people who are epidemiologists in the country and found a lot, actually. Many of these seem to be young people. Going by their profiles, they went straight to MPH programs after their undergrads and were able to find work after. But you are right. I have thought about the possibility of not being able to find work after, for one reason or another. From my research, the job growth for epidemiologists is supposed to increase, but who knows? Things change. The possibility of what you said is always there.

 

Your second paragraph relates to one of the reasons why I'm not whole-heartedly sure about nursing. Short story: I tried to volunteer at a hospital a year ago. It was a long process. had to get a police record check done, references, update my health record, etc and I did everything just so I could get the volunteer position. I went to the initial 5-hour training, then started the position, but guess what? I only went there for about a month and then I stopped going. This's an acute care hospital for elderly patients. Our job as volunteers was to aid the process of them getting better. We had a list of activities & exercises we had to be doing with them to test and improve their cognitive and physical abilities. We had a binder of the patients we were to see on the floor and we recorded everything we did, anything unusual that we noticed w/ the patients, etc. The Doctors and Nurses found the program very helpful and they always noticed improvements w/ their patients who were participating in it. The lady I was shadowing (training with) was more bubbly than me. We had to go in there and be like, "Hi, how are you?! How're you today?!". I didn't have that in me and thought I wasn't cut out for it. After that I thought that maybe Nursing isn't really what I'm meant to do. I definitely enjoyed talking to the patients. We often asked them questions about their childhood and grandkids and they seemed to light up when they were talking about those things, but I was just afraid of going into their rooms and starting the conversation. This was just 3hours/week but that 3 hours seemed like eternity. I couldn't wait to leave. This's another reason why I'm not 100% sure about Nursing. If I can't even stick to a volunteer position like that, how will I get through my clinical placements when/if I get admitted to Nursing school? The volunteer position reminded me of my clinical placements in first year, in a way. The only difference is, of course, we just just volunteers and not nursing students and obviously had fewer obligations. I don't know if this means I should forget about Nursing or that, on the contrary, it is something I am meant to do and stop running away from. I don't know. The reasons I left Nursing school the first time are very similar to the reasons I stopped volunteering. I've volunteered in the past at another hospital and stuck with it, so I'm not sure if my fears are growing. I know there're different areas of Nursing, so If I am able to get through nursing I would find my niche. I don't want to let go of it because of fear.

[MisUnderstood1]

I work in a University and my answer is NO! Keep in mind here that I didn't read your full post I'm just answering your question based on what I've witnessed in the past 7 years I worked with University students...

 

I see students completing degree after degree after degree and they end up at 35 and don't have any experience beyond the ****ty student jobs they get while studying or TAships.

 

EMployers see graduates come in with degrees and don't want to start at the 'bottom of the lader'. They come in expecting high salaries and great benefits and job security. Employers don't like that.

 

Start in the mail room. Work your way up. Take the contract. Take the secretary job.

 

If you keep going to school past your 30s, when you start applying for the good paying jobs, you will never get them because a) you will have no experience and b) these jobs usually go to the people who have been working there for years and have a union because it's part of the agreement.

 

Find a job. If you absolutely must keep taking courses for whatever reason, do it part-time.

 

If do go through with an MPH, I am definitely concerned w/ not being able to find work, for whatever the reason. Yes, I would be in my mid-30s then or close to it, jobless, with lots of debt over my head. I imagine I would be very suicidal at that point. But let's say I do find work, I would just be starting the process of paying off my loans in my mid-30s, which doesn't sound appealing. I admit part of the reason why I wanted to go into epidemiology was because the name sounding cool, just so people would look at me and be like, "You're an epidemiologist, wow", and I could show all the people who thought I wouldn't amount to anything that I've made something of my life.

 

I have already confirmed my admission to the school (I did so before I wrote my initial post above), but I haven't paid the $80 tuition deposit. It's supposed to be due on Monday, the 14th. I haven't paid since I haven't made up my mind. It is non-refundable, so I'm trying to be careful because if I pay and later decide not to go, that money would be a waste. Of course, confirming the admission doesn't mean I have to go.

 

If I decide not to go to this school at all and do neither nursing nor PH, I do think it would be a good idea to do a one-year program to support my degree. I know this degree alone likely won't get me anywhere. I've already begun the process of applying to the colleges online months ago, but I've not completed them yet and will pick up where I left on Monday. I just need to do a few more things, like send them my transcripts and submit a letter of intent for one.

 

I had an interview yesterday. My first. It was supposed to be for an office admin job, but when I got there I was told the candidate they select would be doing HR work. He/she would just be covering for another employee who's away for two months but after those two months the new person would be doing sales & marketing work. This's a new employment agency and they're trying to get more companies to be interested in them. I, or whoever gets the job would be calling companies and visiting them, finding out if they need workers, visiting the other companies w/ their workers to make sure things're going well, stuff like that. I've to go for a second interview, this time w/ their boss and I should be hearing from them on Monday, so I will wait for that call. If I don't hear from them, then I'll follow up.

Edited July 13, 2014 by MisUnderstood1

[MisUnderstood1]

Defer! When you are in school, you can defer your loan. I graduated in 1998 and am still deferring my loan. They aren't jumping down my throat. Can't find a job and trying to start a biz personally. I am also considering going back to school at Musician Institute to furtehr my music study. Probably won't get a "job" job with this course work, though I do plan to hire myself to begin a tour before long.

 

If you feel you could use more school do it now, don't wait 15 years later like me.

 

And also, I have a degree in communications and ended working in radio, then somehow became a technical writer for governmetn and major fortune 500 electronics companies. WTF how did I end up hear I ask myself all the time!?!? You rarely go the course you expected, nor the course your degree trains you for. I can't deal with technical writing though it pay WELL, my heart is dying so I'm going back to being a starving artist/student.

 

At the end of the day, do what it takes to be HAPPY.

 

Do you have to be super good with computers and software to be an effective technical writer? What're the skills required to do well in the field? Did you get a lot of time to work by yourself or were you often working with others? What did you like most and least about your job?

Edited July 13, 2014 by MisUnderstood1

[Els]

 

Your second paragraph relates to one of the reasons why I'm not whole-heartedly sure about nursing. Short story: I tried to volunteer at a hospital a year ago. It was a long process. had to get a police record check done, references, update my health record, etc and I did everything just so I could get the volunteer position. I went to the initial 5-hour training, then started the position, but guess what? I only went there for about a month and then I stopped going. This's an acute care hospital for elderly patients. Our job as volunteers was to aid the process of them getting better. We had a list of activities & exercises we had to be doing with them to test and improve their cognitive and physical abilities. We had a binder of the patients we were to see on the floor and we recorded everything we did, anything unusual that we noticed w/ the patients, etc. The Doctors and Nurses found the program very helpful and they always noticed improvements w/ their patients who were participating in it. The lady I was shadowing (training with) was more bubbly than me. We had to go in there and be like, "Hi, how are you?! How're you today?!". I didn't have that in me and thought I wasn't cut out for it. After that I thought that maybe Nursing isn't really what I'm meant to do. I definitely enjoyed talking to the patients. We often asked them questions about their childhood and grandkids and they seemed to light up when they were talking about those things, but I was just afraid of going into their rooms and starting the conversation. This was just 3hours/week but that 3 hours seemed like eternity. I couldn't wait to leave. This's another reason why I'm not 100% sure about Nursing. If I can't even stick to a volunteer position like that, how will I get through my clinical placements when/if I get admitted to Nursing school? The volunteer position reminded me of my clinical placements in first year, in a way. The only difference is, of course, we just just volunteers and not nursing students and obviously had fewer obligations. I don't know if this means I should forget about Nursing or that, on the contrary, it is something I am meant to do and stop running away from. I don't know. The reasons I left Nursing school the first time are very similar to the reasons I stopped volunteering. I've volunteered in the past at another hospital and stuck with it, so I'm not sure if my fears are growing. I know there're different areas of Nursing, so If I am able to get through nursing I would find my niche. I don't want to let go of it because of fear.

 

Facing your fears is one thing, but the bolded is another thing entirely. IMO there are just some things that we are not cut out to do personality-wise. For instance, I could never be a model. Even if I had the looks, I'd have a higher chance of winning the next Nobel prize for my research than being a successful model. It would just be unnatural. That is just the way I am. Acknowledging our natural affinity is a strength, not a weakness.

 

So yes, from the bolded, I really don't think you are cut out for nursing work. I think that you have an ideal in your head about helping people, but the actual nature of the work does not suit you. There is nothing wrong with that, but it might be a fact that you have yet to acknowledge. If you feel that a different sort of environment would be helpful, then you should look into volunteering in that particular environment, and see what your natural response is before you decide.

 

On the other hand, if you had said something like, "I loved volunteering in a hospital but I failed my first nursing semester", I would have encouraged you to keep working at it because that is something that you can change with effort and determination.

Edited July 13, 2014 by Elswyth

[Eternal Sunshine]

Els is so smart

[Leigh 87]

I am an older student at age 28 and I am simply doing a bachelors and then a masters.

 

Or a bachelors and a one year diploma which is cheaper.

 

PLUS I volunteer in my field which means I will get a job over a person with three degrees but has no experience whatsoever.

 

Two degrees will eat you alive financially, you wont be able to have a family unless you have a partner that earns good money.

 

Why not get an entry level job NOW and work your way up, whilst also doing part time study, in a cheaper diploma or something?

 

I think volunteer work or getting an entry level job NOW, like ASAP is your best bet for future job security because it = experience.

 

Experience is what matters. You can take night classes or study part time whilst you work.

[Bigcitydreamer]

I'm in a similar situation as you. I did a bachelors degree in business admin and am now doing fast track nursing (24 months) at the age of 26. I almost have a year done and will be finished by the time I'm 27- almost 28.

 

The last year has been incredibly stressful. I had no student loan debt prior to the nursing degree but I've had to take out loans to do this.

 

I don't want to impose my values on you, and everyone is different but I would not recommend going back to school yet if I was you. As I said every day is a struggle. I think about quitting often due to being super broke and extremely busy. It's very depressing at this age to be in the same situation as most 18 year olds.

 

I will say I don't regret my situation but if it was any bit harder or the situation any bit worse I wouldn't be doing this. For example if I fail a course and am forced into the 4 year program I would bail on nursing and work in accounting. As many posters have said job experience almost feels more valuable than education these days. My friend never went to school at all and makes well over 40$ an hour as a manager for a company. She worked her way up and now they are paying for her to go back to school because they feel that since she is so high up she needs the education to back it up.

 

It all depends on what you want to do with your life though. If it was me I'd work first for a couple of years and start paying down your debt and if you still have the desire to go back to school you can do so as school will always be there. Good luck with whatever you chose.

[MisUnderstood1]

I got into the 1-yr college post-grad program for marketing research at the two schools I've applied to. One starts next month in September and has a one-month internship/work placement at the end and other program starts in January 2015 (has no internship/work placement). Based on the research I've done, the former is a better program b/c I've looked up the alumni from the program and they're all working in the field now. I also read better online reviews from students who have studied at this sch. This program, I believe, would be more impressive to employers. Coupled with my degree, they would be a good combination. For the second school, I couldn't find much info about the alumni who did the program and some of the reviews from other students who studied other programs at the sch weren't too great.

 

-If I choose the first school and start next month, my student loans would total $52 grand. I do have to pay a $500 tuition deposit to reserve my spot in the program and I've to pay by next week. based on what I've read, I believe it is refundable. I've called the Registrar to ask other questions. It never occurred to me to ask if the fee is refundable or not, but I will do that on Monday. I don't even want to pay then change my mind later. I want to be sure before I pay. It's a 2-semester program and I'll be done by May next year.

 

-If I choose the second my student loans would remain at $42 grand. If I go with this choice I plan to pay for it myself. I haven't found a job yet, tho. This is the only reason this option is attractive to me; it starts in January so that gives me time...4 months... to make the 10-grand I need to pay for the program. It's also not far from my city.... about 2-3hrs away, so I could possibly commute by bus & subway. It's also a 2-semester program and I'll finish next year August.

 

*It's not that I'm necessarily passionate about the field. There're aspects of if that I like, but it doesn't really excite me. I also know there will be group work and presentations towards the end of the program, as well as a social event we meet alumni and other folks in the industry. I've always ran away from social situations, so with this program it seems I will be doing things I dread the most. I have to stop being quiet and shy. I mainly want to do this program because I believe I will be able to find a job. I'm tired of being jobless and not being self-sufficient at my age. I just want to be at a better position by next year; have a job and be happier; not feeling sorry for myself like I do not. At least I know after completing it, it shouldn't take me long to find work. The certificate is also transferable in terms that I can find work with any research company, not just marketing research. I have looked up job ads and some require public speaking, some don't; so I know I can find something that suits me, hopefully. Market research's also supposed to be a good field for people with reserved personalities, that's one of the main reasons I got interested in the first place, but there're areas that require one to be more extroverted.

 

 

 

*As for getting a second degree, I am not doing that anymore. I've thought about it a great deal and no, it's not a good idea. Plus, I've found a way for me to get an MPH and I can try that later if I still wish to. Right now I just want to decide on which college to attend, or whether I should even go at all.

Edited August 9, 2014 by MisUnderstood1

[Bigcitydreamer]

Those are some interesting options there, both seem "decent". What worries me is that you said yourself that you are not particularly passionate about either of the courses. Seriously if there is ONE thing and ONE thing only that I would recommend is do not go back to school for something you are not passionate about. With a bachelors degree you are already in a half decent place, adding a 1 year program that costs money and wastes time is not the smartest option in my opinion.

 

By keeping on going to school for random things you are essentially pushing off the inevitable- finding the right career for you. Don't get me wrong I truly believe in the importance of education and I'm not suggesting you never go back to school. But at this stage in your life I'd think it was more important to work and figure out for sure what exact career you want before spending time and money.

 

This topic resonates with me and I feel like I have some pretty solid advice. Although everyone is different and what works for one might not for the other.

 

I started off doing a bachelor of commerce degree (5 years and work terms) and I failed out the first semester lol as I was 18. I spent a lot of time trying to get back in the program and did the following year. Then I failed out again further along in the program by somewhat of a choice. I was feeling disheartened by the work term I had done and wasn't sure if I wanted to be a chartered accountant anymore so I didn't study for finals and failed a course. I then chose to graduate with a business degree as I had the credits and felt it was good enough. Anyways to sum up fast I got a job and my boss informed that she had previously worked in my role and had done the bcomm program at my school! So we started at the exact same place in the chain regardless of her having a more difficult and specialized degree. So as you see my experience has shown that a degree does not=a better job and more money. Desire to work in a specific field and enjoying what you do and being good at something matters more.

 

Those 2 programs you mentioned sound a but flakey no offence. I wouldn't go further in debt for a random whim that you think will bring you more money in the end. If however you are positive you want to work in marketing then this wouldn't be a bad way to go.

 

 

 

 

I got into the 1-yr college post-grad program for marketing research at the two schools I've applied to. One starts next month in September and has a one-month internship/work placement at the end and other program starts in January 2015 (has no internship/work placement). Based on the research I've done, the former is a better program b/c I've looked up the alumni from the program and they're all working in the field now. I also read better online reviews from students who have studied at this sch. This program, I believe, would be more impressive to employers. Coupled with my degree, they would be a good combination. For the second school, I couldn't find much info about the alumni who did the program and some of the reviews from other students who studied other programs at the sch weren't too great.

 

-If I choose the first school and start next month, my student loans would total $52 grand. I do have to pay a $500 tuition deposit to reserve my spot in the program and I've to pay by next week. based on what I've read, I believe it is refundable. I've called the Registrar to ask other questions. It never occurred to me to ask if the fee is refundable or not, but I will do that on Monday. I don't even want to pay then change my mind later. I want to be sure before I pay. It's a 2-semester program and I'll be done by May next year.

 

-If I choose the second my student loans would remain at $42 grand. If I go with this choice I plan to pay for it myself. I haven't found a job yet, tho. This is the only reason this option is attractive to me; it starts in January so that gives me time...4 months... to make the 10-grand I need to pay for the program. It's also not far from my city.... about 2-3hrs away, so I could possibly commute by bus & subway. It's also a 2-semester program and I'll finish next year August.

 

*It's not that I'm necessarily passionate about the field. There're aspects of if that I like, but it doesn't really excite me. I also know there will be group work and presentations towards the end of the program, as well as a social event we meet alumni and other folks in the industry. I've always ran away from social situations, so with this program it seems I will be doing things I dread the most. I have to stop being quiet and shy. I mainly want to do this program because I believe I will be able to find a job. I'm tired of being jobless and not being self-sufficient at my age. I just want to be at a better position by next year; have a job and be happier; not feeling sorry for myself like I do not. At least I know after completing it, it shouldn't take me long to find work. The certificate is also transferable in terms that I can find work with any research company, not just marketing research. I have looked up job ads and some require public speaking, some don't; so I know I can find something that suits me, hopefully. Market research's also supposed to be a good field for people with reserved personalities, that's one of the main reasons I got interested in the first place, but there're areas that require one to be more extroverted.

 

 

 

*As for getting a second degree, I am not doing that anymore. I've thought about it a great deal and no, it's not a good idea. Plus, I've found a way for me to get an MPH and I can try that later if I still wish to. Right now I just want to decide on which college to attend, or whether I should even go at all.

[MisUnderstood1]

I've been looking for work and so far nothing tangible has come up yet. I've mainly been doing part-time warehouse/factory work this summer, making $11/hr. I've been applying for other jobs requiring a degree that pay more and other jobs that don't. I did get one interview last month from that new employment agency I wrote about, but I never heard back from them for the second interview. I called the individual who had called me just to inquire if they had found someone, but I couldn't get a hold of her.

 

A company looking for a writer (unpaid) also contacted me a week ago. I've applied for it since last month. Had to send them examples of my writing, so I sent them stuff I've written: a short story (I made this up that day!), some writings about philosophical topics, one health-related topic. They emailed me that they're interested in me and reminded me that it is unpaid but they'll provide references if I need them in the future. I will also get my own profile on their website. I don't mind that it isn't paid; I would just appreciate the experience. I replied them; told them I am still interested and thanked them for considering me out of their candidates. I haven't heard from them since.

 

I've applied for about 10 new jobs a week ago, mostly entry level-type or recent graduates work and I haven't heard from any of them yet. So yes, I have been looking for work; just haven't found any yet. The only reason I want to go for the program is because I think it'll help me find work; a better paying one too. There're parts of it I would like.

 

I live at home right now. I get along with my mom, but not so much with my Dad. We aren't on speaking terms and being here is just awkward - one of the reasons why I would like to move out.

Edited August 9, 2014 by MisUnderstood1

[MisUnderstood1]

Never mind.

Edited September 1, 2014 by MisUnderstood1

[ColumbusOhGirl]

From talking to graduate school admissions board, the recommended taking or re taking the pre requisite courses to get into the program. Make sure you have good grades on the pre reqs. If you already have good grades on the pre reqs I would still apply. Pads your application with top notch recommendation ketters, volunteer for charities in your field and include a letter from yourself explaining why the elective course grades were not so good

[MisUnderstood1]

^ Are you talking about applying as a non-degree student? I have thought about that. I don't think I need any specific "prerequisite" courses to get into an MPH program, at least none of the schools I've looked into mentioned anything like that, just the usual requirements of a good GPA, letters of recommendation & extra-curriculars, if applicable. From what I know, the main goal is to improve one's undergraduate record to get into grad school, so you can take any courses in any courses you want. Some people are non-degree students who take courses for personal interests, but for a non-degree student trying to get into a particular program it would definitely be a good idea to take courses in that program itself and do well in them, to show you can do them. This is what I would do, of course. The websites of the schools I've looked at state that taking courses as a non-degree student doesn't guarantee entrance into the program, which's why I'm hesitant to take this route. I wouldn't want to waste time and money, then not get in. I have really thought about this option, tho. It's still at the back of my head.

Edited September 10, 2014 by MisUnderstood1

[MisUnderstood1]

Story time...

 

 

Last week, I went to the school offering the market research post-graduate program. I got a carpool ride just to go to the first class. The guy who gave me a ride is about the same age as me. I didn't ask his age; I just figure it out. He said he has a Psychology degree and graduated in 2010. First he said 2008, then 2010. So I figured he must be around my age or 1-2 yrs older. Anyway, he said he's angry at School b/c the only job he could get with his Psychology degree was data entry - what he has been doing since he graduated. He's moving to my city now and looking for another job. I felt bad for him, but it was comforting to know there're other pple with degrees who have a hard time gaining jobs matching their education.

 

It was a tiring 5.5-hour drive. When I got to the school, it was very crowded. I guess b/c it was the first day of school, new and returning student everywhere. I just wanted to get away. At the beginning of the class, we had to introduce ourselves and when it was my turn, I screwed up. First of all, the Prof said I had to speak louder (he had said that to someone else too, but still) and then I stumbled on my words b/c I was so nervous. It was embarrassing. He talked about that particular class and what it would involve, what we would be doing in the program itself and other stuff. It's a small program, made up of only 24 people. Pretty much all the people who attended the first class are in the program, well, minus me now. He told us we would be doing a lot of group work and presentations, activities I dread. When he was talking about the program itself, my mind wasn't fully present. We had two classes that day, but I didn't go to the second. It was already 6pm and I needed to catch the last greyhound back to my city. Aside from that, I had already lost the little drive I had to do the program. Sooo, I've crossed market researcher off my list, as it doesn't seem like it would suit me. I'm glad I went, 'cuz it was only by going that I realized it wasn't the right program for me. Thankfully, I hadn't paid. I had the $500 tuition deposit with me, but I wanted to wait until the end of the class before paying, just to see how I felt, and I'm glad I did.

 

Now I'm back at square one. I know I need to do something meaningful and be helping people directly somehow, otherwise I'm going to be very miserable. Being a market researcher would likely leave me feeling empty. I still have epidemiology on my mind. I'm also thinking about counselling/therapy too and helping people in that manner, but to get into any of these programs I really have to do another degree that would take 4-semesters (equivalent to 2-yrs or 1.5 yrs). There is another 1-yr/2-semester certificate program (with a work placement) I like, but it starts next year September. Whatever I decide, I won't be taking any more loans, that's for sure. I'm going to start volunteering at my local hospital next week. The volunteer positions here are different than those at the Hospital at my Uni city and I did volunteer here in high school and in my second yr of Uni during the summer and I enjoyed it then. I still have my T-shirt and was told I don't have to do another volunteer orientation again, but since it has been so long I would likely need another one. I'm still jobless, so might as well start volunteering. I went to apply for some jobs today. Will be going to another place tomorrow morning. What has my life turned to? Sigh. I don't even know what to think anymore. I am not happy at all.

Edited September 10, 2014 by MisUnderstood1

[MisUnderstood1]

I know a lot of people told me not to, but here I am. I moved a week ago to do the second degree in PH. Since I got transfer credits, it'll take me 4 semester to finish. I will actually be at the school for three and my last would be a placement, which can be done anywhere in the country or overseas, if I want. So far I love the PH classes I'm taking. I went to speak with my academic advisor a few days ago and with the way the program is set up, I will graduate in April 2017 (I will be pretty much be 30 then), although technically I will be done next year December (2016). Add two more years to that for an MPH. Right now I'm having second thoughts, mostly because of my age & student loans and because I think I will be burnt out by the time I finish; worries I've always had but they're now dawning on me a lot more now that I'm here. A part of me doesn't want to spend my entire 20s in school. My parents helped me out to come here, especially with the tuition money & other expenses. I kinda want to start paying them back and taking care of them instead. My Dad's 69 now and will be in his mid 70s when I finish. My studying habits are a lot better now. I've been going to the library and staying there late doing what I need to do and as I've said, I absolutely love my PH courses and the other courses I'm taking too, but I don't think going through with this would be wise, based on the things I mentioned above. I think it would be better for me to just work then do an 8-months pgd in September (one I'm truly interested in, unlike the one I wanted to do last year September) and just move on with my life thereon. There other ways to do an MPH later after that if I still want to. This's a really small city and it would be next to impossible to find a job here, so staying isn't an option and I will have to move. I haven't paid my tuition yet; we've till Feb 1st to pay. I will have to give my landlord a month's notice so they can find someone else and return my damage deposit. I can leave anytime but will lose my deposit if I do that. I don't plan to tell my parents if I go through with this; I don't want to worry them. I haven't completed decided but have to by next Tuesday - the last day to return my textbooks and get full refund; spend about $400 on books alone. All that said, I feel like I'm here for a reason, lol, and maybe I should just stick with this.

 

You can call me crazy or confused... maybe I am both. And I might appear like a quitter (especially because a similar thing happened with the college I went to in September). But I actually had very little interest in that particular course as I found out and I hadn't moved to that city at all). I'm just trying to find out what works and where I fit before wasting more money & time.

Edited January 13, 2015 by MisUnderstood1