Is it Cheating? Break up with her?

[Trial]

I need to figure some stuff out. As I'm teetering on breaking up with my LTR, it's tough to find honesty and clarity and am tired of family members and friends who just pat your head like a dog.

 

Craving the anonymous, brutal objectivity of the Internet.

 

The background: My LTR and I have been together for five years. Though we were never "perfect" as a couple we had a lot of similar goals, loved life, and huge physical chemistry.

 

I started out as a beta stuck in the corporate wageslave machine, and she was a socially uncalibrated homeschooler. After five years with her, I'm a stylish, confident guy with his own business. And she is every ambitious girl's dream: a professional in charge of her own schedule (working for my business) and a successful amateur model on the side, to the point of local celebrity. Short story: we have always been good at helping each other out.

 

Along the way, there have been many challenges. She developed several life-crippling illnesses, I found her help and we got them conquered. I hit depression twice, she nurtured me. Things were pretty balanced. We had arguments once in a while, but they were usually over trivial things like what to do on a Saturday.

 

Last Fall, she began to struggle with her own definition of happiness amongst "real life", ie bills, cleaning, jobs, sickness, and stuff everyone deals with. By-the-book Quarter-life crisis. She slipped into depression and developed serious anxiety issues. I tried to make her feel better about this stage in her life journey (been there, done that), but our conversations became more and more strained by the week. Over the brutally cold winter, we struggled as roommates, workmates, and lovers.

 

On the flip side, her amateur modelling career took off, which gave her access to new friends. Being unpopular as a child, this newfound popularity was like a drug. Every Facebook post of her dolled-up face would garner more and more likes, especially from men. If you've ever experienced a rise to fame, validation of one's inner narcissism is like crack to a person who otherwise feels empty inside.

 

All of a sudden, our "real life" of bills, cleaning, jobs, and sickness couldn't hold a candle to the easy escape of swanky people who drank lots of alcohol and said only positive things to her.

 

On March 31, she snapped like a twig. Having not once spent a night away since moving in together, she disappeared for the entire night. I thought she was dead. Turns out she was with another man.

 

It's been a war ever since, trying to save our relationship. She jumped head-first into a by-the-book emotional affair - secret chats, the "out with friends" line, confiding in him, etc. This guy is a smooth cookie, has stronger game than me, and has more similar interests in music to her than I - getting her backstage passes to a live concert to her favorite band for one. He also is more touchy-feely than I am, telling her things like "you're the woman of my dreams." That said, every time I confront this guy about his actions, he pussies out and runs away.

 

As far as physical, she has admitted to making out but doesn't "feel comfortable" talking about anything more that she has done with him. She claims to not have had sex with him, but even if this is true, it is only because I threatened to never speak to her again if she did.

 

She has now moved out and wants two weeks for "space." We have also stopped being intimate in every way (not by my choice), which has been the hardest on me. Though I've been faithful the whole time, even during her emotional/physical affair, it's tough when sex is so easy to come by in today's society, and your partner becomes cold - to not just go indulge in the buffet of singles.

 

After many weeks of grieving, I'm ready to break up. I don't want to, because I love her, but I feel I need to out of self-respect. I can't trust her anymore.

 

She doesn't want to end it, though. Whenever I tell her "it's over - we need to break up", she bursts into tears and starts blaming me for all the hurt I have caused and now of abandoning her.

 

So given that long-winded story, I have a few things that need to be resolved in my mind.

 

a) She completely denies that she has cheated. Her female friends all tell her she has not cheated, apparently after sharing more details with them than me. So, Internet - has she cheated on me?

b) Is there any reason I should trust her ever again? Like to be a wife, or God forbid, mother of my children?

c) Should I break up with her?

d) I feel that, if I break up with her, that I probably won't find better. Mostly worse. And even if I do find a good match, I'll once again get brutalized by the five-year hypergamy itch. Is this a legit feeling or just shortsighted?

 

Please, be brutally honest.

[Elle1975]

On March 31, she snapped like a twig. Having not once spent a night away since moving in together, she disappeared for the entire night. I thought she was dead. Turns out she was with another man.

 

That's more than enough ground for you to walk away. Life is short, why stay with someone you can't trust?

[ExpatInItaly]

A) Yes, she cheated.

 

B) No, you shouldn't trust her again. She has proved herself a bad candidate for long-term commitment with you.

 

C) Yes, you should break up with her.

 

D) You can't find better? Oh, please. This is a girl who is emotionally immature and enjoys having her cake and eating it too. Then cries like a child when you want to walk away. It's all about her and her desires. She doesn't priorities your feelings at all. She stomps all over them, as evidenced by her cheating. You can do far, far better than this.

 

This relationship has run its course. She isn't in love with you anymore, or she wouldn't have stepped out on you. She has a lot of maturing still to do. Seriously, she needs to grow the eff up and understand that her crap-tastic behaviour has consequences. Don't waste your life with someone who doesn't respect you.

[Diezel]

You can't find better than a woman who trolls social media for attention, disappears away for a night, and admits to making out with another man?

 

And you confront... HIM?

 

You should take the opportunity of those two weeks to box up all of her stuff and have her move out once her "timeline" is over.

 

Also, those two weeks she is taking? She mentally imposed that so that she can say that she is "single" and try out whatever she wants to try during that time. If she doesn't like it, if it doesn't work out, if she gets dumped, she'll come back to you. Do you want that? If at the end of two weeks, she is still unsure and needs more time, she'll say it too.

 

Honestly, you should just escape this situation. Also, you can't break up with her, she already broke up with you... you just seem to legitimately think they you two are "taking a break". That's not what it is. She broke up with you but is keeping you in tow just in case everything else fails.

 

And I will tell you this, if she does come back and you do take her back, SHE WILL DO IT AGAIN.

 

Fair warning.

[No Limit]

Yes, she cheated. Yes, you should break up with her.

[Try]

On March 31, she snapped like a twig. Having not once spent a night away since moving in together, she disappeared for the entire night. I thought she was dead. Turns out she was with another man.

Spending the night with another man is cheating even if she did not have sex (which they did). When you are in an exclusive relationship, you are not allowed to date other men much less go on a date with them that includes sleep overs.

 

She jumped head-first into a by-the-book emotional affair - secret chats, the "out with friends" line, confiding in him, etc. This guy is a smooth cookie, has stronger game than me, and has more similar interests in music to her than I - getting her backstage passes to a live concert to her favorite band for one.

Going to a concert with another man is a date. Again, it is cheating to be dating other men.

 

As far as physical, she has admitted to making out but doesn't "feel comfortable" talking about anything more that she has done with him. She claims to not have had sex with him, but even if this is true, it is only because I threatened to never speak to her again if she did.

She has made out with him and done more that she talks about with her friends but that she does not want to talk about with you. Cheaters want you to consider only pen** in V**** full on intercourse to be "sex". Thus her making out with (which is feeling each other out as they kiss), giving hand jobs to each other, and having oral with each other would not be having "sex" to a cheater, but no matter how you look at it she is cheating. You do not have to have her agree to calling it cheating, for you to be able to call it cheating; you get to make that call.

 

She has now moved out and wants two weeks for "space." We have also stopped being intimate in every way (not by my choice)

4 months after she spent the night with this other man and began to cheat with him in your face, she has stopped being intimate with you in every way while admitting to making out with and more with the other man. She is now being exclusive with the other man, where being intimate with you would be cheating on him. Not only is she cheating on you, but she is sharing her relationship with this other man to her friends, such that these friends no longer see you as her man.

 

You cannot break up with her because she has already broken up with you. She is just keeping you around as a backup plan as she tries out living with the other man in an exclusive relationship for the next two weeks. Your relationship is over with her. For your own dignity and self respect it is time that you acknowledge that it is over between the two of you, and officially end it forever with her.

Edited July 31, 2014 by Try

[lolablue17]

Of course she cheated... But I think her cheating is the minor problem here.

 

The real problem is the arrogance and selfishness. It's all about her. after she spent the night with another man she should have taken responsibility - mainly pay attention to your feelings and decide which course does she want to go in life and YOUR FEELING should be a major element in her decision.

 

But she doesn't care about you at all. All those month she is hurting you minute after minute, and it doesn't bother her. She doesn't see you, she looks through you as if you're transparent, or not exist.

 

You have a very good chance to find a better girl for you. You can't ever trust her not because she is a liar. But because she is a selfish drama queen and she will tell you "honestly" every word that will fit her immediate interest.

 

Then she will change her mind 180 degrees, hurting you and crying for more and more drama on your expense.

 

If you call her today and tell her it's over for ever, and you start dating from tomorrow - at least you'll get back your self respect and dignity. I guaranty that you feel much better after you do that.

 

Better today than tomorrow.

[Man Mountain Makino]

Friend,

 

Your long term girlfriend is dating some guy. The best thing you can do for yourself, and the worst thing you can do for them, is to back out of the relationship and let him have 100% of her, and all the hassles included.

[Smthn_Like_Olivia]

I feel that, if I break up with her, that I probably won't find better.

 

What is your definition of better?? Are you referring to looks? Career? Because if you are, then your head is in the wrong place. "Better" is not how someone appears in society. BETTER is how they make YOU feel and how they complement you as a person. Better is feeling secure with a person and connecting on both a physical AND emotional level. From all you describe here, you can ABSOLUTELY find better. You just have to let go, clear your head, and WANT IT.

[giblesp]

I think you need to brutally honest with yourself.

 

It sounds like that you and this girl had a good, close relationship in the past.

 

But in the PRESENT you are with someone who sleeps with other men(she's definitely sleeping with him dude), and doesn't sleep with you. You're really settling for scraps from the table. You're being insecure, by not standing up to life and saying, F this I deserve more.

Do this, and you'll get a woman who treats you right. Sounds like you've a good heart and will go the distance. But DO NOT take sh*t from people, in the hope of getting back to the good old days. Do not tolerate the abuse you are currently on the receiving end of.

 

She'll actually respect you more, if you tell her that you're not tolerating her selfish behavior anymore and you need to move on.

 

Its far better to pull out now and have your good memories.

 

You can definitely have a better experience than the one you are having now.

[Dork Vader]

I can guarantee you she has slept with him.

 

 

She has every single sign that she has. She's even admitted to getting physical with him. So please tell me, why would she just kiss him?

 

When you try and dump her and she blames you. 1. she is attempting to justify her actions and 2. she is trying to shift responsibility blame away from her.

 

 

Cheaters also will destroy your self esteem. Which is what she has done and is doing.

 

 

There are so many red flags I can't even list them. Find someone who actually cares about you. If she cared she would not have done ANY of this. If she was committed she would not have done any of this.

 

 

Be confident and strong when you dump her. Block her on facebook, completely remove her from your life. Once you're ready to end it call her and just say I can't continue to let you treat me like this. We are over. Get off the phone with her and block the number.

[Justanaverageguy]

Ok you got a text book case of woman falling for another guy and is now stuck in the "infatuation / sexual attraction" vortex. Been there and done that it is a crazy place. Don't kid yourself here - she cheated and is continuing to cheat right now. When a woman says she "needs space" or even better the "I need time to figure out what I want". That is woman code for .... I need some space so I can go have sex with another guy without feeling like I am cheating. You need to stop pretending that isn't happening because I can tell from what you wrote that it is.

 

To better explain some of her behavior there are 2 very powerful emotions your partner is conflicted between at the moment.

 

1 - The sexual attraction she feels for the new guy

2 - The attachment she feels for you - her long term partner

 

The reason you got the crazy reaction from your partner when you said you are leaving her is because women in this stage are quite honestly very confused and torn between there long term partner and their lovers. She is not sure if she wants to be with you or with him. Women in this stage think that by taking a break and having the chance to be with their affair partners they will be able to decide which one they "love" and want to be with. She thinks that you, her long term partner is going to hang sitting on the bench while she has her little fling and wait for her to figure it out.

 

As for what you should do .... really up to you. Do you want to be with a cheater .... could you honestly move past this ?? Only you can answer that. I can tell you what normally happens - which is guys turn into a pathetic mess. Crying, begging and pleading for their partner not to leave. Regardless of what you want .... don't do that. Firstly because if you do actually want to try and save the relationship nothing is more pathetic and unattractive to a woman. It will make you seem weak and desperate. Secondly because if you want to leave her then you want to do so with some dignity.

 

So regardless of what you want .... you should implement the 180 and the no contact rule. Sticky post at the top which explains the purpose of the 180. It is essentially the opposite of the begging, crying man who refuses to let go. You need to turn the power tables and be the one in control of the situation to show you are a confident, assertive man. Not a beta as you said. Women lose all respect for men who have no spine, no self respect and are willing to be a backup player sitting on the bench waiting for her "to figure out what she wants". You need to let her know you aren't going to wait around for her to figure it out.

 

Regardless of if you want to move on or if you want to try and win her back don't settle for her terms. You are better then that - find your balls again brother.

Edited September 29, 2014 by Justanaverageguy

[Trep]

Just so everyone knows, this exact story (word for word) has been posted multiple times throughout the year.

[Justanaverageguy]

Nah looks like this is actually the originally. Its 2 months old. Someone just commented on the old thread and dragged it back to the top.

[JS84]

I swear every time i read threads like this my ****ing blood pressure goes up. Have some self-respect and dump her. Ya she wants two weeks of mutually agreed on "space" so she can **** her boy toy who she's probably already ****ing while you hang back twiddling your thumbs. And if her Plan A falls though and she needs to go back to Plan B, Plan B is you by the way, she'll have you there waiting.

 

 

a) She completely denies that she has cheated. Her female friends all tell her she has not cheated, apparently after sharing more details with them than me. So, Internet - has she cheated on me?

 

Yes

 

b) Is there any reason I should trust her ever again? Like to be a wife, or God forbid, mother of my children?

 

Umm no. This is the reason why we date. To weed out potentially ****ed up spouses and co-parents we'd have to deal with in the future. Kind of like your girlfriend.

 

c) Should I break up with her?

 

....yes -_-

 

d) I feel that, if I break up with her, that I probably won't find better. Mostly worse. And even if I do find a good match, I'll once again get brutalized by the five-year hypergamy itch. Is this a legit feeling or just shortsighted?

 

Stop over thinking it. You have a bad hand right now. Time to fold and reshuffle the deck. Don't just hold onto the same bad hand for life because you're too afraid to risk going for something better that you deserve.

 

No offense when I say this but man up and toss that chick. When people SHOW YOU WHO THEY ARE BELIEVE THEM.

Edited September 29, 2014 by JS84

[No Limit]

1. She has cheated. Had sex with that other man, and if her "fame" really got to her he won't be the last.

2. No, there's absolutely no way to trust her. Also get tested for STDs please.

3. If you ever want to have stuff like family, or a GF that is honest to you and won't risk your own health for 10 minutes of fun, you should break up right away.

4. You will feel worse for a while, that is true. However, as long as you stick to full NC from day 1 you'll get better.

 

Refrain from taking her back though should she decide to get down to earth in a couple of years. There's plenty of people who randomly got local fame - myself included during my highschool time - and they didn't snap. She's simply self-centered, as is sadly often the case with full-blown career people. You deserve better.

[Spectre]

On March 31, she snapped like a twig. Having not once spent a night away since moving in together, she disappeared for the entire night. I thought she was dead. Turns out she was with another man.

 

It's been a war ever since, trying to save our relationship. She jumped head-first into a by-the-book emotional affair - secret chats, the "out with friends" line, confiding in him, etc. This guy is a smooth cookie, has stronger game than me, and has more similar interests in music to her than I - getting her backstage passes to a live concert to her favorite band for one. He also is more touchy-feely than I am, telling her things like "you're the woman of my dreams." That said, every time I confront this guy about his actions, he pussies out and runs away.

 

This makes your gf sound like she is 14 years old. I don't even see why whether or not a guy can get you backstage passes to concerts would be a factor in a relationship..other then for a selfish teenager who hasn't even graduated high school yet.

 

As for him being "smoother" no dude, he's just trashier and willing to throw free concert tickets, etc. at a chick to get her to get with him. That is not being smoother, that is being sleazier.

 

Though we already have red flags. The fact she was accepting backstage passes, etc. from a guy obviously interested in her? Yeah, she couldn't be that into you. No concert is THAT awesome you cheat on a guy to get backstage passes.

 

As far as physical, she has admitted to making out but doesn't "feel comfortable" talking about anything more that she has done with him. She claims to not have had sex with him, but even if this is true, it is only because I threatened to never speak to her again if she did.

 

This boggles the mind. She tells you some, but says she isn't comfortable talking about anything more? Again, I have to ask: is this person 14 years old? I am being serious. Tell me this is not an adult.

 

Even if you believe she did not sleep with him, she at least blew this guy, you know that right? Since obviously it went further then making out, but not actual sex? Yeah, she probably at the very least was giving out blowjobs like they were going out of style to this guy.

 

Though as you said..if you go "did you have sex with him and if you did I will never speak to you again?" of course she is going to say no. Is it possible she did not sleep with this guy and is being truthful? I don't know, but I would say at the very least she blew this guy, and that is reason enough to kick her to the curb. Hell, the accepting the back stage passes and kissing was enough to do that, but it's like she went out of her way to give you as many reasons as possible to dump her.

 

She has now moved out and wants two weeks for "space." We have also stopped being intimate in every way (not by my choice), which has been the hardest on me. Though I've been faithful the whole time, even during her emotional/physical affair, it's tough when sex is so easy to come by in today's society, and your partner becomes cold - to not just go indulge in the buffet of singles.

 

Dude why do you want to have sex with her? She's cheated on you, she is damaged goods now..you don't really know WHAT this person has been doing.

 

It is also mind boggling that she says she is the one who needs space. What? Space for what, more cheating?

 

After many weeks of grieving, I'm ready to break up. I don't want to, because I love her, but I feel I need to out of self-respect. I can't trust her anymore.

 

I'm surprised it took you this long to realize you need to dump her. I believe that you love her, I really do because the fact you didn't boot her to the curb immediately shows that. That is why it sucks that she absolutely 100% does not have a shred of love for you. So yes, you are correct: you need to respect yourself and acknowledge you deserve better. Nobody is deserving of a perfect mate, but we ALL deserve someone who won't cheat on us.

 

She doesn't want to end it, though. Whenever I tell her "it's over - we need to break up", she bursts into tears and starts blaming me for all the hurt I have caused and now of abandoning her.

 

First off if she doesn't want it to end..WHY is she saying she needs space? This does not compute. Plus, what the hell? This girl sounds either like she is still in high school or just never emotionally matured past the age of 15 or something. She accuses you of abandoning her because you leave her for cheating? She bursts into tears and cries when you say it is over, even though if anyone should be crying..it is you. This is all just one big sign that she cares only for herself. This is not love, this is a sick twisted version of love you would find in an evil parallel universe.

 

a) She completely denies that she has cheated. Her female friends all tell her she has not cheated, apparently after sharing more details with them than me. So, Internet - has she cheated on me?

 

If this was a cartoon steam would be coming out of my ears now. Seriously, she has admitted to at least making out, so how on Earth do her friends say she has not cheated? I am genuinely curious at the reasons these people give for this. Sit these "friends" down and ask for an explanation. I honestly want to believe she is just saying "oh my friends say I didn't do anything wrong!" as a lie and that she legitimately does not have actual human beings telling her these things..because my faith in the human race will then be at an all time low if it is true. I can understand women supporting their friend, but heck that only goes so far. I could see people trying to downplay what she did(though that would still be wrong), but only someone who has already hopped aboard the crazy train would actually say this is not cheating.

 

So..yes, yes, yes 1,000 times yes this woman cheated on you.

 

b) Is there any reason I should trust her ever again? Like to be a wife, or God forbid, mother of my children?

 

The second her lips touched another mans is when it was clear you should never trust her again. Definitely do not have children with her. That is the last thing you need. No kids, no marriage, get this person out of your life.

 

c) Should I break up with her?

 

Yes, please do so immediately. She is playing you for a fool.

 

I feel that, if I break up with her, that I probably won't find better. Mostly worse. And even if I do find a good match, I'll once again get brutalized by the five-year hypergamy itch. Is this a legit feeling or just shortsighted?

 

I think this is short sighted to think you won't find better. Especially since honestly you could find a used blow up doll from the early 1980's and THAT would still be better. Yes, you can find better. I'm almost afraid to ask about the other women you have dated if this woman has you fearing you won't find better.

Edited September 29, 2014 by Spectre