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Custody Question


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Hope Shimmers

I am hoping there is someone who might know the answer to this or be able to guide me as to the right steps to take.

 

My ex-husband and I divorced 9 years ago (we were married for over 15 years). We live in the US. Our two oldest kids are in college and the youngest is a teenager. We live in a state that allows children of her age to choose which parent they want to live with.

 

When we divorced we had (still have) a custody agreement that states that we would have joint physical and legal custody of the kids, and it would be every other week physical custody (his place one week, mine the other). We have done that since the divorce. Part of the agreement is that we both live in the same school district as all the kids (which has required me to live within blocks of him to be in the same elementary school district).

 

We divorced shortly after moving across the country from family and friends (for ex-H's job) and I have wanted to move back every second since the divorce, but never could because of the custody agreement. I would never leave my kids.

 

However, now my daughter (the youngest -teenager) has expressed to me that she wants to move back to where we were from because that's where our family is and she is extremely close to my family. She is willing to tell my ex-H that she wants to do this and live primarily with me (a big step, as she has always been too afraid to tell him what she wants - he is not the easiest person).

 

My question is - can this agreement be changed? And if so, based on what? Is my daughter's choice enough to legally get the custody agreement changed or is there no chance that I can move across the country from him (still being agreeable about sharing visitation) with my daughter as that's what she wants too?

 

I don't want to put her through the trauma of telling her dad this (he will be furious) if there is not even a possibility that it can be changed.

 

It has always been about his job and what he wants and for 9 years he has had his way... would be nice if his kids and I could get some consideration too.

 

Thanks for any help.

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I don't know how that can be remedied but one thing I do know is that if you are moving it shouldn't be your teenaged daughter who tells her dad about it.

 

She's a minor and you're the adult. Don't make her have the adult conversation.

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Hope Shimmers
I don't know how that can be remedied but one thing I do know is that if you are moving it shouldn't be your teenaged daughter who tells her dad about it.

 

She's a minor and you're the adult. Don't make her have the adult conversation.

 

Good point. I should have expanded on that.

 

The only thing she can do is say that she wants to live with me primarily. Which allows me to move because the custody agreement would not be weekly anymore. That part would be on me, not her. Even though she wants to move, that part would not have to enter into it except between him and me.

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In thinking about it, I'd have her go stay with family members for an extended period of time before I'd go through the inconvenience of moving to a place that she may hate living in.

 

Has she spent much time there? Does she have any friends there?

 

Life can be pretty lonely for a teenaged girl no matter where she lives. Even worse if she has no friends.

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Hope Shimmers
In thinking about it, I'd have her go stay with family members for an extended period of time before I'd go through the inconvenience of moving to a place that she may hate living in.

 

Has she spent much time there? Does she have any friends there?

 

Life can be pretty lonely for a teenaged girl no matter where she lives. Even worse if she has no friends.

 

Yes, she has friends and family there. She loves her cousins and aunts and uncles and is very close to them. She is very sociable and she makes friends instantly, so I don't worry about her starting a new school.

 

But you raise good points to think about. I need to think about it all. Thank you for taking the time to reply.

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Consult an attorney. Any advisal on here of that nature are best left to the professionals.

 

Take your agreement with you as it sets the premise for what can be modified.

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Hope Shimmers
Consult an attorney. Any advisal on here of that nature are best left to the professionals.

 

Take your agreement with you as it sets the premise for what can be modified.

 

I am going to, thanks. I just was hoping that someone might have some experience in this kind of situation.

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Yes, she has friends and family there. She loves her cousins and aunts and uncles and is very close to them. She is very sociable and she makes friends instantly, so I don't worry about her starting a new school.

 

That's very good!

 

I think it'd be a positive thing for her to be around her extended family now. I just hope that a judge and her dad will see it that way too.

 

Is he very involved in her life? He must be if you share custody and were ordered to live in the same school district.

 

How is he going to handle it? How would you handle it if the situation were reversed?

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Hope Shimmers
That's very good!

 

I think it'd be a positive thing for her to be around her extended family now. I just hope that a judge and her dad will see it that way too.

 

Is he very involved in her life? He must be if you share custody and were ordered to live in the same school district.

 

How is he going to handle it? How would you handle it if the situation were reversed?

 

Thanks... her dad won't see it that way. It's about him.

 

We divorced because of many years of emotional/verbal abuse and at the end, physical abuse (that's when I left). He is an acceptable father to the kids though, even though he has no patience and yells a lot (so they tell me - nothing new there). He would not handle it well. I believe that my daughter really wants this and that she would be happier.

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I believe that my daughter really wants this and that she would be happier.

 

That's the most important thing. I'm glad you're getting a lawyer and hopefully she will get to speak up about what her preferences are.

 

It sounds pretty exciting! I hope it works out for guys!

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LivingWaterPlease

I live in the USA, had joint custody with ex and when my kids were twelve they were able to choose which parent they wanted to be with and when, legally. In my state by the time a child is 12 or 13 their wishes as to whom they live with are respected.

 

Know another child from another state who had the same experience around the same time. That child chose not to see one of his parents again.

 

Mine chose just to limit visitation with said child's father at the age of 12. At the age of 15 my child chose to terminate visitation with father.

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Thanks... her dad won't see it that way. It's about him.

 

We divorced because of many years of emotional/verbal abuse and at the end, physical abuse (that's when I left). He is an acceptable father to the kids though, even though he has no patience and yells a lot (so they tell me - nothing new there). He would not handle it well. I believe that my daughter really wants this and that she would be happier.

I'm just curious how you'd feel if the shoe was on the other foot and he was considering, with her in tow, a move to another state :confused: ???

 

I don't see any regret, concern or speculation on your part that this would deprive her - and him - of their ongoing relationship. Raising a healthy teenager takes both parents and a Father's part in not easily replaceable.

 

Any reason this can't wait until she attends college?

 

Mr. Lucky

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What state are you from? In some, judges almost never give the approval (which is what you will need) to at least one where move aways are nearly always granted.

 

Just know that regardless, the parent that moves away is nearly always ordered to pay for all the flights for the other parent's time.

 

As another poster put it, if your ex proposed the child move away with him to another state, would you gladly agree? If not, you might want to think more about your proposal.

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While I don't have any experience with this... I would think your best bet would be to consult an attorney as to what your rights are. Custody agreements do get changed. I also assume that they would want to know that you have a job there and would be able to support her. Changing the custody agreement would also change child support payments. In this case, your ex would have to pay more if he isn't around her as often as he is now. I can see that being a factor as to why he would not agree to it. How is their relationship? Why does your daughter want to move away? You know how teens are... fickle. She may get out there and change her mind. How many more years until she is 18? Is this something that can wait?

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Hope Shimmers

Thanks everyone!

 

I'm just curious how you'd feel if the shoe was on the other foot and he was considering, with her in tow, a move to another state :confused: ???

 

I've already moved to another state for him (here), as have all of his kids.

 

If she wanted to live with him more than she wanted to live with me, then I would have to entertain the idea if that was what they both wanted.

 

I don't see any regret, concern or speculation on your part that this would deprive her - and him - of their ongoing relationship. Raising a healthy teenager takes both parents and a Father's part in not easily replaceable.

 

Probably because I would make sure that he had plenty of time with her - just not in the form of every other week - and because SHE no longer wants to live that way and no longer wants to spend a great deal of time with him (because he is who he is - which is why we are divorced).

 

 

Any reason this can't wait until she attends college?

 

Because she has repeatedly brought it up now. And because then she would miss out on growing up with her family. She has brought it up over and over and I no longer want to ignore it with her.

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I've already moved to another state for him (here), as have all of his kids.

Not the same thing, you moved as a family.

Because she has repeatedly brought it up now.

And she's a young girl, 13, 14, 15 years old? Were she deciding she wanted to live with her boyfriend, would you let her make the call? Sometimes as a parent we have to advocate on our child's behalf with a longer-term view in mind.

 

Look Hope Shimmers, I'm some anonymous guy on the Internet simply offering some experienced-based input. But I couldn't help be struck by the fact that your original post didn't even consider the impact of splitting a parent/child relationship. It's not a minor thing...

 

Mr. Lucky

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The main problem I see is as exactly what Mr Lucky is saying. You say he's abusive but he wasn't too bad to have her there half her life unsupervised.

 

Children fare better when both parents are involved in their lives. That's just a fact.

 

I think your best bet would be to get a position that pays substantially more than you currently earn and you can use the move as a financially strategic one but taking her away from her father to be with extended family members probably won't happen.

 

Are you able to provide for her without his support? That may be something that the two of you can work out between yourselves if you waive support for full custody and have him agree that he won't fight you on the move.

 

See if you can negotiate with him and let him know your daughter wants to move. Who knows? Maybe money is more important than seeing her on the regular.

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Hope Shimmers
Not the same thing, you moved as a family.

 

Perhaps, but I gave up my excellent career and job to do so. It was all done for him.

 

I don't see how it is even comparable to use the analogy of a 14 year old wanting to live with her boyfriend.

 

Look Hope Shimmers, I'm some anonymous guy on the Internet simply offering some experienced-based input. But I couldn't help be struck by the fact that your original post didn't even consider the impact of splitting a parent/child relationship. It's not a minor thing...

 

So you are saying that the only way to have a parent/child relationship is every other week custody, and that families with more traditional custody arrangements have absolutely no hope of maintaining the child's relationship with both parents? I don't get that.

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Hope Shimmers
The main problem I see is as exactly what Mr Lucky is saying. You say he's abusive but he wasn't too bad to have her there half her life unsupervised.

 

Children fare better when both parents are involved in their lives. That's just a fact.

 

I think your best bet would be to get a position that pays substantially more than you currently earn and you can use the move as a financially strategic one but taking her away from her father to be with extended family members probably won't happen.

 

Are you able to provide for her without his support? That may be something that the two of you can work out between yourselves if you waive support for full custody and have him agree that he won't fight you on the move.

 

See if you can negotiate with him and let him know your daughter wants to move. Who knows? Maybe money is more important than seeing her on the regular.

 

He was abusive to me, not the kids.

 

That's just it - I don't plan to take her away from him. We can still do three-day weekends, vacations, summertime.

 

She hates the every-other-week exchange and always has. I just think she is old enough to exert some opinions.

 

Thanks to everyone who has offered input - I appreciate it!

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Consult with a legal advocate . Most courts appoint a liason for the youngster. Its extremely rare that the child makes the final decision to the courts. It would need to stem from abuse, neglect or threats of abduction. The judge decides not the child. I sense some resentment and that is emulated to the child trying to do what they think is the right thing. I mean this objectively thinking, what is the probability that your opinions of this childs father has permeated into her opinion? Sometimes kids pick up on the parents turmoil. Again your agreement will play a part in what rights can be challenged and what can be modified.

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I am hoping there is someone who might know the answer to this or be able to guide me as to the right steps to take.

 

IMO, a collaborative approach, including use of a mediator as practical, would go a long ways to getting the court's stamp of approval on any modifications you and your lawyer deem in the best interests of your child(ren). The prior poster makes a good point about tone. Focus on win-win-win, meaning a solution which addresses all POV's, yours, your ex-spouse's and that of your child(ren). This positive POV trickles down to the child as that of a parent who respects and values the perspectives of loved ones and seeks to find collaborative ground to address those perspectives. Does everyone get what they want, totally? No! Get in front of a judge with the right attitude though and you'll be amazed at how well they're read things. Judges are smart and they rarely tolerate crap but they'll go a long ways to make things work for co-parents willing to work with each other.

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While there are many aspects to consider for everyone involved...

 

Your exH may consider it more easily if you keep the money the same or offer to reduce the child support money in exchange for moving away.

 

He most likely wants some benefit in exchange for not seeing her as often.

 

Are you willing to make that trade off?

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its hard to say, i see how you say you would never leave your kids, i am sure you ex would also say the same that he would never leave his kids. if your daughter wanted to move with him back some where while you were settled , what would you do. you gotta look at both sides of the picture., clearly theres some tension between you and your ex, maybe instead of making your daughter be the ping pong ball, you should go over there like an adult, and sit down with him, and talk about it one on one. your daughter can decide afterwards, but until then, you two need to figure it out. this has nothing to do with her and id hate my parents for ever for putting me in a situation like that, even if i did want to leave with one of them. do the right thing

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