Hit Like a Ton of Bricks -Wife Doesn't love me

[sysyphus]

Despite her resistance, our MC has taken the issue in hand and she has agreed to NC. So in that respect, it is being taken care of. The issue is that in her mind, she would rather talk about "us" than "them" and wants my focus on "us" and not "him". In some ways this is good, she wants to work on the things that damaged our relationship before the OM showed up. I agree mostly, and if she needs to divert from him for now in he rown mind, fine. I'm letting the MC guide the process. We'll deal with each in it's own time. I'ts just a hard thing to see as I watch her try to manuever things to her advantage (and I do the same). I guess that's what MCs are for.

[jmargel]

No.. what she is doing is actually good. If she wanted to deal with the OM with the MC then that would tell me her focus is on that other guy. Right now her focus is on the marriage, not necessarily to put an end to the marriage on what was wrong with it, but to address the issues concerning you two and to fix them. She wants to deal with the 'issues', not the 'topic' which is the OM. Check out my link in my signature.

 

She has agreed to NC with the OM. So, let her do this. From my experience on here & real life going this route is the best.

[Owl]

I agree with the advice you've gotten so far, friend. DO concentrate on your marriage right now...don't try to carry on conversations concerning the OM, her feelings for him, etc... Right now, it's really just too soon for her to deal with...and it's not going to solve your problems.

 

What she's suggesting makes sense. Focus on determining what's wrong in your marriage, and develop game plans to fix it. DON'T let her put all the blame on you, however. A marriage is a two-way street...both of you have made mistakes that lead to this point.

 

Later on, once the NC has pretty much stuck, once she's gone through the withdrawl at the death of the affair...THEN start asking the questions you need to have answered. It's possible by then that you may not need the answers you THOUGHT you did...or you may have totally different questions.

 

Hang in there friend.

[sysyphus]

I guess right now, my biggest fear is that even if we get through the NC period, what if she really still can't let go of him? What if she's full of doubts and regrets? She is very stong minded and stubborn in her convictions (if she's in love, damnit, she's in love and nothing's going to change that!) Is there any anecdotal evidence that suggests that NC works a cetain amount of the time and not for another?

 

After that, my worry is about reconnecting with her. Right now everything feels false and loaded, every conversation has an air of "we're trying to get along". It's very hard to feel natural with her at all right now (she says the same of me). I guess again, I'm counting on a change of heart on her end (actually wanting to fix the marriage more than wanting to want to fix it).

[Owl]

I've pointed out to you how it worked in my case at least. You might try looking for information over on marriagebuilders.com to see if they've got any statistics you can use.

 

I'd suggest that you look at the book "The Five Languages of Love"...I don't remember the author. Chapter 2 or 3 talks about "being in love" vs. "love". Read that, and compare her symptoms to what you see there...should be an eye opener. If she's actually willing to, you might let her read that chapter too. I don't know if it will sink in yet or not, but you never know. Her response is most likely to be "well, maybe so, but MY situation is different!". It's not, but she won't be willing to see that yet.

 

IF you two get to a point where she really is willing to work on your marriage, another book I seriously recommend is "20 (Surprisingly Simple) Rules and Tools for a Great Marriage", by Dr Steve Stephens. My wife and I read that one chapter a nite when we were first working on rebuilding our marriage.

 

You might even consider letting her know that you're posting here, and let her read your posts, and responses. I'd be willing to bet that it would be a real eye opener for her....heck...the two of you could sit down and send me a PM sometime.

 

As far as worrying about what she'll do when NC is "completed"...deal with that when you get there. My money says that if she sticks to it, and REALLY puts effort into fixing your marriage, you'll be AMAZED at how well it can go. She sounds a LOT like my wife...strong-willed, etc... And it worked like a charm! My wife was astounded at how quickly the feelings for the OM faded once she got out of her depression... and how quickly her feelings for me grew right back to what they were. I honestly expect that you'll see much the same thing.

[sysyphus]

You might even consider letting her know that you're posting here, and let her read your posts, and responses. I'd be willing to bet that it would be a real eye opener for her....heck...the two of you could sit down and send me a PM sometime.

 

She knows I'm here and is glad I've found some support -if noting else it takes some of the tension out of the house for me to have this outlet and support. I hinted that if she wanted to see what others had to say, she said she felt uncomfortable with reading this stuff b/c she doesn't like being both the topic of conversation and the bad guy. I explained that really, no one here has declared her a bad guy, but honestly , right now I don't think she'd be receptive to read some of the hard truth regarding situation that has been discussed here. Maybe down the line, but unless she asks, I'm not going to press it. If I get the sense that she is more open to it, I'll get her over here.

 

I've told her , "man, you won't beleive this guy Owl! Same exact situation!" I hoped that might peak her curiosity, but frankly, I think she feels so much guilt and such a burden in terms of deciding the fate of our future as well a certain amount of resistance to fixing things that I think she'd rather just do the MC thing for now with as few extracurricular activities as she can get away with.

[whichwayisup]

Sys, give her some time...She isn't willing to SEE herself as the badguy. She is not a bad person, just what she did was bad. Either way, now may not be the time...Who knows, maybe she will surprise you, jump on the site and have a peak.

 

She can see noone is bashing her, we're all just trying to give you help and some support.

 

I think what you are doing, letting her know bits and pieces is the right way of handling it. Makes her curious and soon enough she will come to you.

[Ladyjane14]

Originally posted by Owl

Her response is most likely to be "well, maybe so, but MY situation is different!". It's not, but she won't be willing to see that yet.

 

It really is SHOCKING to see the commonality in the process of extramarital affairs. Just the phrase, "I love you, but I'm not in love with you". Geez, if you read in a forum like this one, and received a dollar everytime you saw that phrase.....well, the IRS might have to put you in another tax bracket!

 

There's nothing new under the sun.

 

All in all though, I agree with allowing the MC to guide the process. It won't be productive to create an atmosphere that overwhelms your wife at this time. And I have to commend you on your patience Sysyphus.

[Owl]

Originally posted by Ladyjane14

And I have to commend you on your patience Sysyphus.

 

 

LOL...tell her bro. Learned patience camping mobs for your epic quest!!

[sysyphus]

OL...tell her bro. Learned patience camping mobs for your epic quest!!

 

Sorry to dissapoint, I'm a relative noob, just EQ2 -the wife's the uber one! Part of our problem could have been avoided if I had played with her earlier on, but man, Ijust didn't like EQ1 -too ugly (not to give too much away but I'm a game dev -i'm really picky about what I play!) EQ 2 however is quite lovely! But yeah, been camping a bunch of late (although she tells me respawns are much faster on 2!)

[sysyphus]

One thing that I really do need to emphasize for the sake of clarity, is that the unhappiness in the marriage came first, the OM much later. I know the focus of this group is on the actual infidelity, which is very serious. But I don't think any of us (or at least most of us), are completely innocent in creating the conditions that may have lead to that. Yes, our spouses crossed a line, but I don't think most of them are bad at heart, particularly my wife. As sad and hurt as I am, it tears me up to see the guilt she feels. Despite the fact that she can still act coldly towards me, and express the warmth she feels towards the OM, there is still that overwhelming guilt and regret she feels and all I want to do is forgive and help her heal. I just hope that eventually, she will come around and see that we both need to heal and can support each other and hopefully find our way back to each other.

 

BTW, can't say if she talked to OM today or not. she seems pretty chipper, and wnet out ahnd got me my favorite dinner (lamb and asparagus), could be overcompensating over guilt, but I'm not going to read too much into it (could be the bottle of wine we had with dinner ). until the NC policy is officlally in place, I'm not going to tear myself up speculating.

 

Thanks again for all the wonderful ideas and support. You guys really are the best, I'm lucky to have found this place.

 

Will update as things progress.

[Owl]

Sys-

 

I think pretty much all of us agree with you on most of what you've said. It's very rare for infidelity to occur in a relationship that isn't having some kind of trouble already. If there weren't problems, why would someone go outside of the relationship to begin with?

 

Again, I doubt that any of us here think that the WS is an evil person...unless they're some kind of serial cheater or someone who is deliberatly hurtful and hateful towards their spouse. My wife made a bad choice, and it cost her and I a LOT of pain...but it's also done a lot to actually fix the things that were wrong in our marriage prior to the affair.

 

I was thinking about your situation, and I'm wondering if your counselor isn't a little wiser than we gave him credit for. I think that he deliberately didn't end contact right off the bat for a decent reason...I think that he deliberately gave them time to work things out prior to the NC...so that there is a sense of closure that they both can walk away with, even if they don't resume contact at the end of three months. Kind of a chance to say goodbye. My wife and I had talked about why she had IM'ed and called her OM those last times...and while part of it was the hope that it would rekindle, another part of it was their need to put an end to things, so to speak. And I've seen a number of people on this board and on the OM/OW section that have had that HUGE desire to to get closure on the affair...to discuss the end of it, so to speak. I think that perhaps that was your counselor's reasoning in giving her some time to establish the NC. And I really hope it works out for you that way.

 

If it helps any too, I felt the same way you did through the whole healing process with my wife. I hated how I felt about the whole thing, I couldn't stand the pain that she'd caused....but at the same time, I still loved her with all of my heart, and couldn't stand seeing her feel so horrible throughout all of it, and know that I couldn't do anything to help her get through it.

 

I think that you're lucky that your wife is showing signs of guilt this early...I know my wife did feel that way, but she was totally unable to show it at first. It might be a good sign for you. But...don't get to worked up over anything...it's going to be a rough time when the NC actually kicks in.

 

Hang in there friend.

[sysyphus]

Thanks again Owl , I think you're right about our MC -you'd love this guy he's very down to earth and practical about everything. Has an anecdote for all occasions. For example, he was talking about the relative relationship the OM and I had in this situation: "It's kind of like the idea of a ham and egg breakfast, the chicken is involved, but the pig has a lot more to lose!". Not sure I appreciated being the "pig", but had to laugh at that one!

 

You know, I really think Friday and night and Saturday may have been both a watershed and an all time low. Things looked pretty grim, but since then we seem to have come to grips with the situation and are learning to live with it. There's even bit a lot more levity in the whole relationship. I think too that being out here has improved my outlook immensly and that takes a lot of pressure off. Thanks again for listening and for all the support.

 

I don't like reading tea leaves, but it seems to me that maybe my wife is in fact beginning to see the slim chance of her realtionship with OM getting off the ground in RL. She said someting Friday night that only comes to me now: "I would never move the children away from you (he lives like a 1000 miles away), so it may well be that I would never meet him." She ahs also, from the beginning said that her first priority is her happiness, not with someone else, but with herself. The more I think about it, the more her focus does seem to be on the marriage -she's still full of doubts, but that is where she is thinking -I think. Only time will tell.

[Owl]

About a month after the affair ended, we'd had to drive to our counselor's other office, which is about 45 minutes away. We drove, and were for some reason pretty nervous about the visit. Well, we got there, and the visit was (like normal) pretty tough emotionally, but at the end it felt like we'd accomplished a lot. It was that visit that he recommended the "20 Rules" book I'd suggested to you earlier. We bought it, and since my wife wanted to drive, I decided to read the intro and table of contents to her. I made it to Chapter 15..."Make Mutual Friends". (Bear in mind that this was a guy that we had both gamed with, and was "supposedly" my friend as well)

 

She looks at me....gets a sheepish grin on her face....and says....."Well, I tried!".

 

It took me a minute. And then we broke up laughing so hard that we nearly wrecked. We had tears in our eyes, and missed the exit we needed to take, ending up with us taking a long route home. The other funny thing about that is this...we had both decided to get a new wedding band set, since I'd lost my band a while prior (doing electronics, you want to keep all jewelry off when you work with high voltage). And on our detour route home, we found the set that we wanted....and the ring that I've got on my finger while I type this.

 

You're gonna have up days and down days....and up weeks and down weeks. But it does start to level out in time, and you will get to where you can deal with things. Hang in there friend.

[sysyphus]

Talked the wife today. She was telling me about a conversation she was having with one of her guildmates and found what she said heartening. She was talking about how the guild officers (herself included ) had a lot of RL issues and couldn't be as participatory as they had been. What she said was "two of us are having marital problems, one is trying to fix a marriage, the other is ending one -she clarified that she was the one trying to fix one. She then went on to say to her friend "I' won't be playing for 3 months, maybe six months, maybe forever". FWIW, I take a certain amount of hope in the idea that she can say "maybe forever", that it is a possible reality to her. It's not a lot I know, but I'm grabbing every scrap I can

[whichwayisup]

Take that as a good sign and work with it...Baby steps for now. One day at a time.

 

Seems she knows how serious this is and is willing to give up on afew of her pasttimes...I'm happy for you Sys.

[sysyphus]

I just got off the phone with my wife. She's having a bad day. Apparently some of her friends are feuding and she's caught in the middle and the kids are driving her nuts. She sounded really upset -out of proportion, then she told me. "I talked to OM today about cutting off contact and I'm feeling really sad". I volunteered to come home ,and so I'm heading out. I'm not sure what I can do other than relieve her of the kids and let her have her bad day in peace.

 

I get the feeeling this is the beginning of a really hard road. I'm so happy that it seems it's begun, but man I feel so awful for her and for the fact that she's crying over the loss of him. I feel dread, fear, hope, sadness, even a touch of jealousy and anger. This is the single most weird situation I can imagine. Don't really know how to feel, but I do know that I want to support her in any way she'll let me.

[whichwayisup]

Sys, you're handling it as well as you can...Be proud of yourself. I think you're strong and actually being really supportive and understanding of her pain...

 

IT is weird, you got that right. Go with what is in your heart. Your kindness and understanding is paying off, as hard as this is for you. You're a good person Sys.

[Owl]

Dude-

 

You're doing all the same things and feeling all the same things I've done. Looks like you're the next "Owl" on this board, as I work to spend less time here and more time working on other things. Hang in there, and good luck to you!

[sysyphus]

Not sure that I'm near qualified to be the next Owl, but I appreciate the sentiment. I've never been the sort to go too far out of my way to extend a hand to strangers, but this expereince has changed me in that way too. I have a big debt that I am happy to repay to all of you and to anyone else that I can.

 

Yesterday went OK. The kids were holy hell -the 19 month old took zero naps and could not be placated and the 4.5 YO was just her usual attention-craving self -a typical day! Did my best to keep them out of mom's hair. Mostly she was just exhausted. I'm sure there was a lot more going on underneath, but she wasn't showing it to me. We hung out last night (playing EQ again) and had a really good time. As much as that game was a vehicle for the infedlity, I see it now as a tool to get us to have fun together, and find a fun common goal. Frankly, we're a great team in-game and in RL, so things are working well on that front. Lots of serious relationship work to be done and a lot to forgive and forget, but I'm ready fo that too.

 

Tonight I go solo to the MC. Not sure what we'll be discussing. I know with my wife it was about her issues, and what she was willing to do as far as working on the relationship (which resulted in the NC deal). I'm eager to do whatever it takes and recognize that I contributed plenty to the problem. I also have a number of issues with my wife that were there before all of this, so I imagine we'll touch on them as well. A tad nervous (the paranoid in me still imagines the MC saying "Son, I've got some bad news for you, last week you wife and I were talking....") but mostly hopeful.

 

I'm so glad to have found you all. I think the timing couldn't have been better. At the time I got here, we had hit an all time low (I hope!) and I was in complete dispar, unable to cope and a real mess. Because of you guys I feel stonger and more able to handle what's coming. I'm not sure I would have been ready for her NC announcement yesterday if it weren't for you guys. I think I might have been a lot more anxious and paranoid about the whole thing. You've given me a lot of perspective this week. Thanks.

 

Will update after my MC session.

[jmargel]

I'm so happy that it seems it's begun, but man I feel so awful for her and for the fact that she's crying over the loss of him

 

Dude you have the wrong attitude here. She should be comforting you, not the other way around. She cheated on you! If you have taken this approach with her the whole marriage it's no wonder she doesn't respect you. By tolerating her doing this you are teaching her it's ok. Keep comforting her 'over the loss of him' and you'll find yourself to be single and her still striving to get back with him.

 

Stop babying her. She is the one that hurt you. When she whines about missing him, etc.. Don't say a word. Act cold. Comforting her is *not* going to help you, her or the marriage. It'll only hurt it.

[sysyphus]

Stop babying her. She is the one that hurt you. When she whines about missing him, etc.. Don't say a word. Act cold. Comforting her is *not* going to help you, her or the marriage. It'll only hurt it.

 

She isn't whining about him, she's just an emotional wreck. All I'm trying to do is give her space and relieve her of the additional stress of our needy kids so she can deal with whatever it is she's going through. I really don't think compassion is the same as babying and repaying hurt with coldness isn't going to help with her.

[Ladyjane14]

Practicing sympathy can be a great tool in gaining access to your softer emotions.

 

If anger and resentment run unimpeded, you can't know what the rest of your feelings are, because they'll just be bottled up behind the fiercer ones.

 

I commend Sysypus in his handling of the situation. Patience is a virtue. So, what does he have to lose in it's practice?

 

If the whole thing ends up 'going south', it's gonna do it anyway no matter what he does. So, why not put his best foot forward while he's got the chance?

[whichwayisup]

That's great Sys! I'm really happy for you and I totally agree with LJ. You must do whatever you can so you can live with yourself. You are being very supportive of your wife, not babying her. No point in making her feel worse than she already does.

 

JM, You always give incredible advice, my hats off to ya, but I don't agree with you on this one...Nothing personal. I don't think this will do any harm, infact I think she'll always treasure that her husband had it in his heart to allow her this time and be there for her and also to pick up the slack around the house and kids.

 

Isn't easy I'm sure, but it is working now so stick with it.

 

Have a good MC session - Look forward to reading your thoughts later on.

[Owl]

JM-

 

Go over to Marriagebuilders and read about Plan A again. He's trying to help his wife deal with the whole withdrawl thing that in truth has ALREADY started since he discovered the affair. It sound to me like she's BEGUN to give up on the fantasy of her OM, and reality is starting to set in with her. It's EXACTLY what I went through with my wife.

 

If he takes a "cold"approach, it could have the exact opposite affect here, since this affair was PURELY emotional. If HE goes cold, she very well could turn to the only source of warmth she has left....her OM.

 

This doesn't mean he has to be a doormat...nor should he. He HAS to set some boundaries, some limits in what he will accept from his wife at this point! No contact being the highest priority among them.

 

Not every situation is exactly the same, but out of all the situations I've seen here on LS, his is VERY close to mine. And bluntly, it sounds like he's handling it in a very adult and mature fashion. So far, out of all the situations I've seen like this from my experience in playing EQ (this seems to be pandemic in online games, btw), MY marriage is the only one I've seen so far that has really progressed to a point where we'll recover. And Sys's situation seems to be going a LOT like mine...so I hope he sticks to what he's doing.