Physical Attraction

[Mysterio]

I was thinking about why some people have a hard time or easy time in this area of dating.

 

Do you believe that your personal PA is helping you or hindering you when you go out looking for love?

 

I don't know why but for me. I just always feel that most of the time when I come to this board or other rship boards. I feel like we as a society are way to preoccupied with Physical looks to the point where we invalidate people way too much.

 

I guess as long as a person is well groomed and presentable. Why bother giving them the heave ho. I do realize that there are some looks that we can never overcome. I also think that after awhile. The Physical looks thing just gets sidelined after time. Its not like after 5/10 yrs of couple being together that its the main glue.

 

Any thoughts on the impact of Physical attraction over time, when all of us are going to gain/lose weight and wrinkle and grey as its the aging process? Despite plastic surgery and hair dye.

[D.Mc.]

Hi Mysterio,

 

There has to be something that each person finds physically attractive about the other. Even 90 y.o. couples will say something about their SO's smile or eyes or whatever, that they still find attractive.

 

Also, I know I'm being judged on my looks as a woman, & I don't feel bad judging men on theirs. I know what I find handsome about a man & look for that. Someone perfectly groomed & dressed immaculately will still be rejected if they don't have what the other person is looking for in face/body/both.

 

The real question is how much of what we find PA in others is actually our own nature/nurture & how much is put into us by the media/western culture? If you view a pic. of a beautiful woman w/slightly messy hair/clothes & no info about her: she's PA. But if you see the same pic. & now it's labeled as the photo when she was arrested w/details about her drug/alcohol use: then somehow you might find her less PA, without even realizing why unless you had seen the unlabeled photo FIRST. What we think about someone influences the way we see their PA as well.

[Lonelyyou]

An interesting topic.

 

I've thought about this before. I feel, for me, that PA is a hindrance. I've met some really nice people who have great personalities and I could imagine having a life with that person's personality. They were caring, non-judgmental, self-less, responsible, sympathetic and great listeners. Unfortunately, I just wasn't physically attracted to them.

 

On the other hand, I've had a really attractive partner who would occasionally turn heads when we went for walks on the street. The relationship ended though because she was very immature, insecure, some what selfish and very demanding.

 

I wish very much that I could force myself to over look the physical side, or even some how hypnotize myself/bash my head in, so that I find unattractive girls, attractive (like the movie Shallow Hal). Unfortunately, I can't. I am hoping that over time, I'll mature further or gain more insight, and physical attributes will naturally become less important in my priority list.

 

I agree with physical traits becoming less important once you are actually a few months into the relationship. I was extremely attracted to my ex when we first met, but after being with her for a few months, I noticed her personality started becoming more important than it was when we first met. That's not to say her physical traits became less important per se, but I definitely wasn't paying as much attention to them a few months into the relationship.

[TouchedByViolet]

I don't think most people will admit it or maybe they just don't realize, but looks are often the most important factor if not a close second. Sometimes personality is more important but neither IME are a true measure of the qualities required for a deep positive long term relationship. For example, things like maturity, loyalty, competency and being genuine are underrated by both genders. They are either consciously not prioritized or simply overlooked till well after the vetting process. Just my experience....

[GemmaUK]

I need to be physically attracted in at least some small way to someone to date them.

If not then nothing will happen and they are just friends.

 

I have dated a couple of men where I was not terribly attracted but their personality (morals and values as well) seemed to shine.

The personality they displayed though was not their true personality - this only came out later on.

I have also dated great looking men who were the same as above.

I've also dated men I was attracted to (in various ways physically) who were just themselves right from the beginning. Those were the ones I had longer term relationships with.

 

However, whether I am hugely attracted or only somewhat attracted and then I discover that they were not being true to themselves initially all bets are off and I quickly lose interest. Those I dated and lost interest in played at being a great guy but could not keep up the facade over time as it was just that..a facade.

 

So yes, I need attraction but I also need the 'real deal' (personality and values wise) from the start.

[irc333]

The only time I've had success when attracting women to me, is when they admittedly told me they care less about looks and love a great personality.

 

That's why my dating life consisted of dates from women that are few and far between. I live in a more superficial area in general.

 

Funny thing, one woman online, on POF said she was under 5 feet tall, and said "If you're under 200 lbs, you're too skinny for me!"

 

I was like "What??" I was actually curious about this part of her profile and contacted her about it and she said, "In the 25 years of my life (she's over 40), she's never dated a man under 230 lbs".

 

And this woman is a petite, less than 5 feet.

 

 

I was thinking about why some people have a hard time or easy time in this area of dating.

 

Do you believe that your personal PA is helping you or hindering you when you go out looking for love?

 

I don't know why but for me. I just always feel that most of the time when I come to this board or other rship boards. I feel like we as a society are way to preoccupied with Physical looks to the point where we invalidate people way too much.

 

I guess as long as a person is well groomed and presentable. Why bother giving them the heave ho. I do realize that there are some looks that we can never overcome. I also think that after awhile. The Physical looks thing just gets sidelined after time. Its not like after 5/10 yrs of couple being together that its the main glue.

 

Any thoughts on the impact of Physical attraction over time, when all of us are going to gain/lose weight and wrinkle and grey as its the aging process? Despite plastic surgery and hair dye.

[irc333]

I don't think most people will admit it or maybe they just don't realize, but looks are often the most important factor if not a close second.

 

Like I said, it's rare that if I DO attract a woman, the above in their mindset, is switched out (Personality first, then physical).

[AD1980]

My looks definitely are holding me back I see how much easier it is for my good looking friends to attract women..

 

People like to be PC or whatever but looks play a huge factor in the attraction game

[DorothyGale]

I was thinking about why some people have a hard time or easy time in this area of dating.

 

Do you believe that your personal PA is helping you or hindering you when you go out looking for love?

 

I don't know why but for me. I just always feel that most of the time when I come to this board or other rship boards. I feel like we as a society are way to preoccupied with Physical looks to the point where we invalidate people way too much.

 

I guess as long as a person is well groomed and presentable. Why bother giving them the heave ho. I do realize that there are some looks that we can never overcome. I also think that after awhile. The Physical looks thing just gets sidelined after time. Its not like after 5/10 yrs of couple being together that its the main glue.

 

Any thoughts on the impact of Physical attraction over time, when all of us are going to gain/lose weight and wrinkle and grey as its the aging process? Despite plastic surgery and hair dye.

 

Why go out with someone you're not attracted to? It doesn't make sense.

[carhill]

Do you believe that your personal PA is helping you or hindering you when you go out looking for love?

 

Personal physicality has only been a hinderance because of a male surplus, in that women can be far more selective about physical appearance with a surplus of males, both due to numbers as well as the greater percentage of physically attractive men which exists in a surplus, per similar numbers of women.

 

As far as PA style, from a young age, I've had no 'type', even going back to prior to understanding demographics. I've been in the same demographic for 55 years so know it pretty well. My partners, including my exW, have ranged all over the place physically. Even looking back to teenage years, the girls I was attracted to were all over the place. Some were 'hotties', some were retro, some simply bizarre. Still, there was attraction. Wish I had a clearer answer but I simply don't naturally rate people by physical appearance. Never have. Sure, if someone starts a discussion I might offer my observations but it's not my go-to when meeting people. I accept people for who they are, physically. Perhaps that's short-sighted in modern society and one reason for lack of consistent success with women, in that we're on different wavelengths. My only evidence of this is women telling me flat out that I was not attractive to them. This happened a lot in my 20's and early 30's. Since they didn't know me, I presumed their judgment to be physical.

 

That's life!

[salparadise]

In the mating game, everyone does the best they possibly can––optimization. This is one of the most fundamental behaviors encoded into the DNA of both genders. This innate determination to optimize mate selection is what prevents everyone from simply selecting a nice, compatible mate and living happily ever after. But sexual selection optimizes the quality of the gene pool overall––it's persistent because it's effective.

 

History and literature are filled with examples of women being deified for their beauty (Helen of Troy, Cleopatra), and men for power and status. In non-monogamous societies it wasn't unusual for hundreds of the land's most beautiful women to be the property of the king. Men could have as many wives as their wealth would support, the wealthiest having the most and most beautiful, the poor having none. So all virtually women gravitated toward power and wealth based on beauty. This would leave about 1/2 to 2/3 of the male population without reproductive access. Wars helped balance the numbers somewhat, but there were still a lot of unhappy, horny men. Monogamy bettered the lot of men drastically at the expense of women by mandating 1:1 distribution regardless of resources, but optimization persists... because it works. Just be thankful for monogamy.

[mikethemechanic]

Why go out with someone you're not attracted to? It doesn't make sense.

Right! don't let anybody with bad eyebrows tell you **it about life.

[DorothyGale]

Right! don't let anybody with bad eyebrows tell you **it about life.

 

I wouldn't buy shoes I didn't like.

 

I wouldn't read a book that didn't interest me.

 

Why would I date someone I'm not attracted to?

 

 

**BTW - I actually wouldn't date anyone since I'm married but I still feel the same way.

[irc333]

Right! don't let anybody with bad eyebrows tell you **it about life.

 

Because, the thing is, as soon as the single person starts to reach a certain age. Let's say their 40s, typically with the women, their friends and family start to say to them, "Hey, listen, remember that guy that had that crush on you in church...you've known him for years, though he may not have all his hair and not necessarily the tallest of the bunch, you might want to consider going out with him."

 

Their own peers and family start to realize their finale single person of the bunch or social network is the only one left single...they are aware of their age. They had excused for a time when they were younger. like in their 20s where they could afford to "run around" or "sew their oats", but then they have realized at the age of 40 something that ...well... "Son/Daughter, it's about time you kinda settle down, make a life for yourself, and date that plain jane/jack that was your neighbor for all these years...you know, the one that brought you flowers every day?"

[salparadise]

This is a bastardization of Darwin's Theory of Evolution. It's survival of the fittest (which means most adaptable to ensure for longer lifespans which ensured for breeding potential), not optimization.

 

Not quite. The survival of the fittest relates to natural selection as described in "On the Origin of the Species by Means of Natural Selection." After that he published a book on sexual selection entitled "The Descent of Man, and Selection in Relation to Sex." I don't believe optimization to be incorrect in any sense.

[mikethemechanic]

Because, the thing is, as soon as the single person starts to reach a certain age. Let's say their 40s, typically with the women, their friends and family start to say to them, "Hey, listen, remember that guy that had that crush on you in church...you've known him for years, though he may not have all his hair and not necessarily the tallest of the bunch, you might want to consider going out with him."

 

Their own peers and family start to realize their finale single person of the bunch or social network is the only one left single...they are aware of their age. They had excused for a time when they were younger. like in their 20s where they could afford to "run around" or "sew their oats", but then they have realized at the age of 40 something that ...well... "Son/Daughter, it's about time you kinda settle down, make a life for yourself, and date that plain jane/jack that was your neighbor for all these years...you know, the one that brought you flowers every day?"

I guess bad boys to women are like vampires something so sexy about a vampire. Even though they know they shouldn't be with them.

[ThaWholigan]

Everybody has things they find physically attractive, either superficially or otherwise. Some physical attributes are more universally attractive than others, but there isn't that much of a monopoly IMO.

 

As far as how much my looks have helped me, I think they've helped a bit. I don't think I'm an ugly dude, I'm decent and have an OK physique. On my part, I could look a lot better than I do with more exercise and probably a better fashion sense .

[Kid_Charlemange]

Well this is a tender subject with me, documented in my own LS thread here: http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/dating/489767-giving-someone-chance

 

Bottom line: Very compatible woman who was thrilled with virtually everything about me gave up after two months because of my appearance. Says she tried really, really hard to get past it, and I believe her.

 

This is unusual, I guess; generally people won't go out with someone at all if they aren't attracted, let alone six dates over two months, and a lot of sex to boot. But it's no less a deal-killer after two months (or two years -- see below) than it is at first, I guess. At least for most people. I'm probably 5th percentile attractive, so I'm outside the bell curve. The rules change when you get to the fringes, I guess.

 

My last LTR went two years, and as we were breaking up my ex specifically pointed out my looks, basically saying "I lowered my standards for you because I felt sorry for you and I thought you were a really good guy. Now the sympathy has worn off and it turns out you've had some problems in previous relationships. Why should I settle for you?"

 

IOW, she dated me for two years, we slept together at least 100 times, and at one point we were talking about getting married or moving in together. But as time went on, the positives that I had offered early on began to wane, and they no longer overshadowed my lack of attractiveness.

 

It happens. Men do this routinely when they get older, and dump their wives who had been when them for decades for younger, hotter women. I guess it's human nature.

[salparadise]

Optimization differs from sexual selection. Sexual selection is based on physical attributes, whether to draw the eye of the female or to fight for the right to mate.

 

Optimization is a man-made construct, at least in relation to wealth accumulation and the singular focus of superficial beauty within women. As with all things natural, mankind's penchant for idealization creates a tragic mockery of such. Take the field of evolutionary psychology where confirmation bias has all but destroyed its credibility.

 

Pretty much any theory or idea that we discuss is a man-made construct. I am talking about an individual organism attempting to optimize its genetic/reproductive potential by being selective in choosing a mate. That concept is not necessarily limited to physical attributes.

 

But let's not get distracted arguing something that's not even central to the main point. You said that I had bastardized Darwin's theory of natural selection by making it about sex, and you were wrong––I was talking about another of his books, another generally accepted theory, which you somehow forgot to acknowledge (let alone apologize) because it's important to you to call me wrong.

 

We understand that you can't help to attack anything that isn't measurable as pseudoscience. I'm not going to try and defend evolutionary psychology or any theory. It's ok tbd - you can be wrong and still have a cute tush.

[guest569]

It happens. Men do this routinely when they get older, and dump their wives who had been when them for decades for younger, hotter women. I guess it's human nature.

 

Wow, that is really depressing. But it does happen a fair bit.

 

I have never found myself in a situation with an ugly yet otherwise perfect man? Probably because I wouldn't pursue someone I thought was unattractive, and I would be insulted if someone who thought I was unattractive pursued/dated me. It pretty much says "I have given up on the hot ones but you will do. Only because I am desperate". aww.

 

There are a few members here who think "settling" is a good thing to do but I think it is insulting to the person you are "settling" on, they deserve more than that.

 

I have found myself with attractive men with horrid personalities and my attraction plummets when I see their true colours. Physical and personal connection are equally important to me.

[GoodOnPaper]

There are a few members here who think "settling" is a good thing to do but I think it is insulting to the person you are "settling" on, they deserve more than that.

 

If you think you can make a good life with that person, does it make a difference? At some point, moving on to the next stage in life with less than 100% certainty outweighs further self-destruction at the current stage. Not a perfect situation and not without it's own drawbacks but maybe in the long term, more good is done than harm.

[FitChick]

Looks get you in the door. Then your personality keeps you there.

[Kid_Charlemange]

I have never found myself in a situation with an ugly yet otherwise perfect man? Probably because I wouldn't pursue someone I thought was unattractive, and I would be insulted if someone who thought I was unattractive pursued/dated me.

 

I think that's normal. The experience I described, that's the first time I've ever heard of anyone going that far, only to pull back because of the lack of attractiveness. *shrug* Nothing I can do about it.

[Kid_Charlemange]

Looks get you in the door. Then your personality keeps you there.

 

Usually, but I found the exact opposite in this last case.

 

Normally my lack of looks don't even get the door opened.

[DorothyGale]

Because, the thing is, as soon as the single person starts to reach a certain age. Let's say their 40s, typically with the women, their friends and family start to say to them, "Hey, listen, remember that guy that had that crush on you in church...you've known him for years, though he may not have all his hair and not necessarily the tallest of the bunch, you might want to consider going out with him."

 

Their own peers and family start to realize their finale single person of the bunch or social network is the only one left single...they are aware of their age. They had excused for a time when they were younger. like in their 20s where they could afford to "run around" or "sew their oats", but then they have realized at the age of 40 something that ...well... "Son/Daughter, it's about time you kinda settle down, make a life for yourself, and date that plain jane/jack that was your neighbor for all these years...you know, the one that brought you flowers every day?"

 

I wouldn't say that to someone whose in their 40's, 50's or 90's if they were single. That would be the same thing as saying:

 

"Hey since your life is meaningless because you're single why don't you pair up with ANYONE? They don't even have to be in your species just as long as you're not single."

Edited August 17, 2014 by DorothyGale