D-Day plus 6 weeks. Wife betrayal, long story... .

[2sunny]

It is amazing how many people can talk about how she has lost nothing unless its tangible.

 

It just doesnt work that way. Funny that because when we talk about what a BS has lost on dday, there is zero argument. The BS has lost his marriage, his trust, his faith, on and o the list goes - i know, i have been there.

 

But never did I ever feel for a second that because i didnt extract some hide off my WS did she not suffer a loss. She knows that the day I discovered about the affair she lost ME. She lost a part of herself she can never ever ever in a zillion years have back: something so precious that her life was wrapped up in it. That she was a faithful and good woman. She lost her dignity, something she did not feel until i knew about her other life.

 

The fact is those BSs who stuck around longer than an hour or two after discovery know perfectly well that every day both BS and WS ar fully aware of what has been lost, between them, and within each other. Adults, even adulterers, are not blind.

 

 

She didn't "lose" her dignity - she willingly forfeited it with her every thought and action throughout years of cheating. It was a

Conscious decision to forfeit it.

[oldshirt]

This situation reminds me of what Dan Savage talks about periodically in his advice column "Savage Love."

 

He talks about the concept of "Price Of Admission." That is basically that everyone has something to offer for which they require a price to be paid (price of admission), and everyone has to pay the other person's price of admission to get what they want from someone else.

 

Traditionally men want love, respect and sexuality which women have to offer. Women's price of admission is love, support, a home, children, protection, security and companionship.

 

Women want support, home, security etc which men have to offer and men's price of admission is love, respect and sexuality.

 

Both genders usually have sexual exclusivity as part of their price of admission and if the exclusivity clause is breached, they typically withdraw their given commodity.

 

Withdrawing your commodity (support, home, security etc) when your partner breaches exclusivity and respect by screwing others in your own home and bed is valid as it is a clear breach of contract.

 

If one does not enforce contractual terms, then it is as if no true contract existed to begin with.

 

There for without the loss of marital comforts during an egregious breach of marital contract, then no true marriage existed to begin with. It was just a roommate arrangement where each party is fundamentally able to do as they please.

 

That is why it is sometimes necessary to divorce in order to save a marriage.

 

By divorcing, you are indicating through action that you hold the marriage contract sacred and that the breach of contract will not be tolerated.

 

By allowing the breach to occur without taking action, you are indicating you do NOT hold the marital contract binding and there for all agreements of marriage are in word only and are thus null and void.

[HermioneG]

The one thing that shouldn't be underestimated in all this is love.

 

The OP loves his wife and all the advice and rants to get him to "kick her ass" out just don't take account of this. If you love someone you will go to the end of the earth to be with them.

 

Fellini is probably one of the most knowledgeable posters on here. No one has read more books and learnt more about affairs than he. All so he can understand the actions of the woman he loves, all so he can love her and have her love him.

 

The OP is the same he loves his wife, wants to forgive her and wants to stay with her.

 

It is easy to say dump her, move on, kick her cheatin' ass. But once love has you in its clutches you are caught. Give the man the chance to make it work. It may or it may not but don't underestimate the power of love in these cases...

 

I think many people on here have read just as many books, if not more than Fellini, and many of us? Are much further away from DDay than he is and have a very clear picture and understanding, one that can unfortunately only be gained through time and perspective.

 

I am not saying Fellini is all wrong in what he advises, although as a long term reconciled person, I think he is quite early in his journey and has ground to cover. For that reason- I think the OP, and others, would be wise to listen to a wide range of voices and experiences- from both betrayed and waywards, at all points in their journey, and see where the consensus converges.

[oldshirt]

It is amazing how many people can talk about how she has lost nothing unless its tangible.

 

 

 

 

Feel bad - yes. Inconvenienced- yes. Remorse/regret- perhaps.

 

LOSS - no. It has to be tangible and something held dear.

[2sunny]

Your W is standing there patting that gamblers table "come on, baby, ante up!" I'll help you win this hand I swear!

 

The reality is it's still a gamblers game - and you're still standing in the casino.

 

 

 

No reason for her to believe the game needs to change at all since you failed to exit the casino. She really wants you to play along a little longer.

[Man Mountain Makino]

Without revealing how (in case she reads this) I can just say I am well aware of private conversations she has had with family where for hours she is in horrific pain/sobbing/misery admitting her unbelievable stupidity and weakness, how much she loves me and never wants to lose me or the kids, the stark realization she faces a future alone and without the benefit of a companion who aids in all life in tales (not so much money as practical parts of life she hasn't done, much like I would have to figure out laundry) etc.

Pal, I'd like to point out that there's no stark reality of a future alone. She is fit and attractive, and her track record she has no problem attracting capable, attractive alpha male types who can provide for her in all areas of life. If you heard her say this privately, it sounds like she was counting on you hearing it. Don't flatter yourself - you're not the only guy who gave her this, or who have been giving it to her on the side.

[beach]

Here is the formula for change:

 

 

 

Dannemiller version: D x V x F > REdit

 

Three factors must be present for meaningful organizational change to take place. These factors are:

 

D = Dissatisfaction with how things are now;

 

V = Vision of what is possible;

 

F = First, concrete steps that can be taken towards the vision;

 

If the product of these three factors is greater than

 

R = Resistance

 

then change is possible. Because D, V, and F are multiplied, if any one is absent (zero) or low, then the product will be zero or low and therefore not capable of overcoming the resistance.

 

To ensure a successful change it is necessary to use influence and strategic thinking in order to create vision and identify those crucial, early steps towards it. In addition, the organization must recognize and accept the dissatisfaction that exists by listening to the employee voice while sharing industry trends, leadership ideas, best practice and competitive analysis to identify the necessity for change.

 

Attribution ConfusionEdit

 

It is often inaccurately attributed to Beckhard because he published the formula in both versions of his widely read book Organization Transitions, part of the Addison-Wesley series on Organization Development. In the original 1977 version, Beckhard and Harris gave full credit to Gleicher.[3] In the second edition from 1987, they did not even mention Gleicher's name once in the entire book, but did present the equation as a formula for overcoming resistance.[4]

 

Gleicher (original) Version: C = (ABD) > XEdit

 

The original formula, as created by Gleicher and published by Beckhard,[5] is:

 

C = (ABD) > X

 

where C is change, A is the status quo dissatisfaction, B is a desired clear state, D is practical steps to the desired state, and X is the cost of the change.

 

PopularizationEdit

 

It was Kathleen Dannemiller who dusted off the formula and simplified it, making it more accessible for consultants and managers.[1] Dannemiller and Jacobs first published the more common version of the formula in 1992.[6] Paula Griffin stated it accurately when she wrote that Gleicher started it, Beckhard and Harris promoted it, but it really took off when Dannemiller changed the language to make it easier to remember and use.[2]

 

 

 

 

Many times the resistance comes from the cheater - but in this case the R is from the betrayed because he's not willing to she wife what D V and F look like.

 

His wife is more likely satisfied with things the way they are "for now" because she has mellowed her consequences by providing tears.

 

Notice it states the PRODUCT of all three of the D V and F must be GREATER than the Resistance.

 

 

Being type A - this may make logical sense for you.

[Appreciate]

This situation reminds me of what Dan Savage talks about periodically in his advice column "Savage Love."

 

He talks about the concept of "Price Of Admission." That is basically that everyone has something to offer for which they require a price to be paid (price of admission), and everyone has to pay the other person's price of admission to get what they want from someone else.

 

Traditionally men want love, respect and sexuality which women have to offer. Women's price of admission is love, support, a home, children, protection, security and companionship.

 

Women want support, home, security etc which men have to offer and men's price of admission is love, respect and sexuality.

 

Both genders usually have sexual exclusivity as part of their price of admission and if the exclusivity clause is breached, they typically withdraw their given commodity.

 

Withdrawing your commodity (support, home, security etc) when your partner breaches exclusivity and respect by screwing others in your own home and bed is valid as it is a clear breach of contract.

 

If one does not enforce contractual terms, then it is as if no true contract existed to begin with.

 

There for without the loss of marital comforts during an egregious breach of marital contract, then no true marriage existed to begin with. It was just a roommate arrangement where each party is fundamentally able to do as they please.

 

That is why it is sometimes necessary to divorce in order to save a marriage.

 

By divorcing, you are indicating through action that you hold the marriage contract sacred and that the breach of contract will not be tolerated.

 

By allowing the breach to occur without taking action, you are indicating you do NOT hold the marital contract binding and there for all agreements of marriage are in word only and are thus null and void.

 

This is very interesting. It makes sense except that it makes marriage seem very fragile.It seems like people who really love each other would make some allowances or exceptions because they choose to help each other or because they honor each other as partners in a marriage. Plus, with so many women financially independent, the balance is tipped in their favor. There are also people whose marriages are balanced but they simply decide to trade up. Maybe better love, better sex, better security, or what have you.

 

And it's a matter of expectations and communication. Obviously, no one says "don't lose your job or I'll replace you" because they might not even realize that's an underlying possibility.

[fellini]

She didn't "lose" her dignity - she willingly forfeited it with her every thought and action throughout years of cheating. It was a

Conscious decision to forfeit it.

 

And who are you to know how a WS, my WS, his WS feels? If I say my WS discovered after dday that she had lost her dignity, its because i know something you do not.

 

And it is not uncommon for many WS to emerge from affair fog and realise for the first time what the cost of infidelity is for their friends, their families, their children, their spouse, their colleagues and themselves.

 

Anyone who has gone through recovery under the same roof as their WS knows perfectly well that there is plenty of punishment for the WS if she is remorseful.

 

Even when a WS is just initially remorseful for getting caught - an understandable feeling considering where they are emotionally- living through the trauma of their BS is not a picnic, and the result can be clearly a deeper more authentic remorse.

[oldshirt]

And who are you to know how a WS, my WS, his WS feels? If I say my WS discovered after dday that she had lost her dignity, its because i know something you do not.

 

And it is not uncommon for many WS to emerge from affair fog and realise for the first time what the cost of infidelity is for their friends, their families, their children, their spouse, their co

 

Anyone who has gone through recovery under the same roof as their WS knows perfectly well that there is plenty of punishment for the WS if she is remorseful.

 

Even when a WS is just initially remorseful for getting caught - an understandable feeling considering where they are emotionally- living through the trauma of their BS is not a picnic, and the result can be clearly a deeper more authentic remorse.

 

 

All of those things are negated if the WS is a narcissist or a sociopath. They won't feel true remorse because they have no grasp of other people's pain and only see things through the filter of their own wants.

 

All their tears and all their apologies and all their promises are simply manipulations to so they don't lose anything and to get away with it.

 

There is reason to believe Betrayed' s wife may have some of those tendencies. If so, other people's hurt feelings aren't going to influence much.

[2sunny]

And who are you to know how a WS, my WS, his WS feels? If I say my WS discovered after dday that she had lost her dignity, its because i know something you do not.

 

And it is not uncommon for many WS to emerge from affair fog and realise for the first time what the cost of infidelity is for their friends, their families, their children, their spouse, their colleagues and themselves.

 

Anyone who has gone through recovery under the same roof as their WS knows perfectly well that there is plenty of punishment for the WS if she is remorseful.

 

Even when a WS is just initially remorseful for getting caught - an understandable feeling considering where they are emotionally- living through the trauma of their BS is not a picnic, and the result can be clearly a deeper more authentic remorse.

 

My comment had little to do with " feelings" and more to do with actions.

 

How can you "lose" something when you purposely threw it away?

 

It wasn't "lost" it was intentionally tossed out.

[drifter777]

Why do we argue about what we think OP should do? None of us are wrong or right - we are just providing our advice and judgements based on our personal experiences. Nothing to argue about and it strikes me as childish & selfish to read the posts on much of this thread. I'm sure I'm just as guilty so save your flames.

 

OP: Your story makes me nothing but horribly sad. No one deserves to be put in the position you are suffering through right now. All of us BS's remember d-day, the early days there after, and the results of the whole stinking mess. We think we can steer you away from disaster and truly want to save you pain and misery. But you are on your own to survive and try to figure out how to move forward while sinking in a sea of sh*t.

 

The facts have been repeated her dozens of times. Serial cheaters rarely, if ever, change their spots. The nature of her affair(s) - long term and in your home - are death knell's to every marriage I know of. But I completely understand where you are and why you are there. Right now just do whatever you have to do in order to end this immediate crisis of pain, anger, and confusion. You need as much of a break from all of it as possible. As someone pointed out, not making a decision IS a decision you can make. You have a business trip coming up and I hope you take advantage of the time away from her to just rest from all of this. Not that you can really put it out of your mind, but you might be able to lower the volume if you don't have to look at her for a few days. If there is any way you could take an extra day or two for yourself on the trip I really think it would do you good.

 

oldshirt's analogy of your marriage being exposed to radiation is spot on. The thing you don't yet know is whether the dose is truly fatal. This is what you have to try to determine. The defense mechanism of denial will make accepting the true amount of damage this has done to you & marriage very difficult. Time away and/or a good IC can help you punch through the denial and see things more realistically. I always urge IC because you need a cool, experienced head in your corner advising you.

 

PS - you think your wife is remorseful right now? Let me assure you that there is NOTHING more remorseful then an addict the day after they use and screw up your life. They mean every word of remorse and ever promise they make. They believe they will NEVER do it again. And then they do it again. It's the nature of the disease and all loved ones are collateral damage until they can get clean and sober. IF they can ever get clean and sober.

Edited August 27, 2014 by drifter777

[James-London]

This thread is full of people are talking past each other.

 

old shirt seems to be defining "loss" as the loss of something tangible (i.e. financial security etc.). That seems a pretty arbitrary definition in my view. I agree with Fellini who says that the wife has lost the trust of OP, she has lost the feeling that she is a good and faithful wife. Obviously, she had no right to feel like the perfect wife, but that is still something she felt and valued. And now she's lost it. Same thing with the trust of OP.

 

sunny2 and oldshirt seem to both be still talking about "consequences". As OP mentioned in his posts (and me also), what kind of consequences can she pay? He can't ask her mother to have her grounded. What is done is done. Clearly, any relationship where he tries to control her will be impractical and wrong from first principals. Ultimately, all he can do is try to forgive or divorce her, neither of which he really wants to do. I tried to sketch out what I think it might take for OP to trust and forgive again, but its certainly a long shot.....

 

We are on page 28 now, no doubt it will be 30 by the end of the day. I'm not sure what more there is to say on this? I sincerely hope OP is currently taking a break from this.

[Stellar Wench]

All of those things are negated if the WS is a narcissist or a sociopath. They won't feel true remorse because they have no grasp of other people's pain and only see things through the filter of their own wants.

 

All their tears and all their apologies and all their promises are simply manipulations to so they don't lose anything and to get away with it.

 

There is reason to believe Betrayed' s wife may have some of those tendencies. If so, other people's hurt feelings aren't going to influence much.

Exactly why I suggested at least 6 months of IC before making a final decision. If she has a diagnosis, the therapy can take years and is often not successful. It isn't appropriate for us to armchair diagnose her, but it is appropriate for us to point out common factors to head the OP in the right direction.

[oldshirt]

 

 

old shirt seems to be defining "loss" as the loss of something tangible (i.e. financial security etc.). That seems a pretty arbitrary definition in my view. I agree with Fellini who says that the wife has lost the trust of OP, she has lost the feeling that she is a good and faithful wife. Obviously, she had no right to feel like the perfect wife, but that is still something she felt and valued. And now she's lost it. Same thing with the trust of OP.

 

if we were talking about a normal, healthy person you are probably correct. However if someone does have some kind of personality disorder, all this talk of trust and feelings etc means nothing because they don't care about other people's feelings or trust.

 

They only understand what actually harms them.

 

sunny2 and oldshirt seem to both be still talking about "consequences". As OP mentioned in his posts (and me also), what kind of consequences can she pay?

 

as people have tried to say, it's not about making her pay. It's no longer providing her his time and money and resources. Those are the things she wants from him. It won't be untill she loses those things that she will get it. As long as he keeps providing those things, it's all just crocodile tears and manipulation.

 

It's not about punishing her. It's about no longer investing his most valuable commodities into her.

 

 

Clearly, any relationship where he tries to control her will be impractical and wrong from first principals.

 

it's not controlling her. It's him protecting his resources and commodities so she isn't using him any more.

 

It's not control. She is free to do as she wishes (which she has been doing for years and years) it just wont be on his dime and in his house and he won't be investing any more of his resources into her.

 

 

Ultimately, all he can do is try to forgive or divorce her, neither of which he really wants to do.

 

a legal separation where she no longer resides in the house, the child care arrangements are split and he does not interact with her or support her untill he has gathered all the facts and instituted some kind of game plan is a viable option. Under that scenario she does not live in the nice, safe marital home they built, she is not supported by his income and must find work, she does not have 24/7 access to her children and she is not able to maintain a charade to her friends and family that she is the perfect wife with the perfect life.

 

Under that scenario she has experienced a tangible loss of the lifestyle she enjoyed. As it stands now with the OP maintaining the status quo, she experienced no tangible repercussions or hardships due to her actions.

 

There is a big difference between being embarrassed about going to the CD clinic but still living in your big nice house in your clean, safe neighborhood with your children with you and all your friends and neighbors thinking you are fabulous.

 

It's a whole other world when you wake up alone in the middle of the night in a little apt and your kids aren't there and you have to go on a job hunt the next day to pay the rent and all friends and neighbors know you were living a lie on your loving husbands dime for the last half dozen years.

 

Which scenario do you think she is going to be more likely to do some soul searching and putting in genuine effort to fix herself and the situation she has created ??????

 

It would also be a litmus test for the OP. If she starts bring guys home to her new place to fill those voids, then he has his answer.

 

.

 

Responses above.

[2sunny]

Yes old shirt - your suggestions above do show action that promotes change.

 

And it puts the responsibility of that onto his wife.

It also may make her a bit scared that a) oh no, look what I've done/created! And b) oh dang, life has changed since I messed things up. And c) dang, I better not do that again because this working hard to pay rent thing is difficult. And d) I miss my kids, husband and comforts of home he provided for me when he trusted me.

[James-London]

Oldshirt,

 

I could disagree with you, but I would just be guessing (like you are doing) about what is important to someone I have never met before. You could be right that all she cares about is losing a financial security - there are people out there like that. But I highly doubt it. From the description of her, I would say she is also concerned for her reputation and she is worried about losing her kids. She's probably even worried about losing OP too. I think it is highly unlikely that she only cares about the tangible things you say. Don't forget the WS was going out an earning money for the family too. So, she's not a complete sponge, despite everything we can say about her. If she just wanted the money then she could just get a divorce and a decent settlement out of it.

 

As to whether she should move out, I completely agree. That is something I suggested a few posts back. But I suggested that to get her out of OP's face so he can think straight. To do this to prove that there are "consequences" still doesn't make sense to me. So - he puts her somewhere else, he does a legal separation. Fine. But that is not a permanent solution. Either he then has to divorce or take her back. If he takes her back, she learns that she will be sent to live somewhere else for a month, a year, whatever.

 

There's still plenty of stuff that needs to come out about why she was doing this, what she really wanted from the marriage, from the OM, from herself. Alternatively, she could just be completely nuts or really insecure... These are all things OP has to work out, if he has the inclination too. I covered all this stuff in my previous posts.

 

Right now, OP is focusing on the paternity test that I believe is due out tomorrow.

 

Responses above.

[beach]

OP - what's really important for you to move forward and consider reconciling?

 

What are deal breakers for you to consider call it quits?

[bathtub-row]

It is what it is. Just like you said I would be trickle truthed and I had to come back here and say you were right, there is a likelihood I am miserable and unable to forgive in a year or two, or even I find she is cheating again now or in the near future and I'll have no choice but to come back here and say you were all right again. That doesn't change the fact that I look at her and I look at my kids and I look at my life and I just can't end it all yet, I just can't... not when there is still hope. In a way it would all be "easier" if like many of your spouses she showed doubt in our marriage after D-Day, indecision, wouldnt go NC, 't unwillingness to go to IC/MC, unwillingness to not blame me etc. because then it would make the decisions so much easier and more black and white.

 

No one here will ever have the right to say they they were right in this situation. There is no way to know what the outcome will be, and you can only do what you think is best.

 

Because of the love you have for your wife and children, I firmly believe this merits another chance. Of all the twisted and dysfunctional relationships out there, I just don't think yours falls into that category. Has your wife done something horrible? Absolutely. She's got problems, that's for sure. But just as important, I think your marriage has the capacity to survive, more than anyone else's I've ever heard about. You're not being too easy on her and there's no benefit in divorcing her to make a point. You're doing the right things, betrayed. Even if it doesn't work out, you'll always know you gave it your best shot.

[betrayedandhurting]

Ok a few updates...

 

1. The paternity results came back a day early and for the first time in 8 weeks I can say it is good news. No matter what happens in my marriage I know those kids are mine, and they are amazing.

 

2. I am on the road for work 3 or 4 days a week as a pilot. The reality of divorce for me is that I likely would have my kids on my days off which is basically what I have today. Divorce for my wife would be eye opening, in 9 years she has spent perhaps 6 or 7 nights away from them in total (and those were "fun" nights away with me), and only on a single occasion more than 1 consecutive day... so I told her to leave. I don't work until Sunday so tomorrow she is moving out to her Mom's until she returns Saturday night after they go to bed and I leave Sunday morning. Until I decide otherwise this is a trial separation for me to see the realities of what life would be like without my wife and for my wife to see what it will be like the half of the week she sits alone by herself, no husband, no kids. If she chooses to cheat or gets fed up and wants a divorce... good, she made my decision for me. If I find I'm happier without her and my kids get plenty of quality time then also good, that makes my decision easier. Do we have a set time frame? I don't know... I don't want the kids to suffer (they are broken up about this but hopeful since we said we "hoped" this wouldn't be permeant but I refused to promise) so I doubt this will be more than a month UNLESS I decide to go forward with a divorce immediately because I just want her to have a taste of life as it will be if she doesn't get with the program but not make my kids suffer needlessly if I am not prepared to move forward with a divorce yet. I don't know, but I know that I have to do this otherwise she literally suffers no consequence at all.

 

PS: She begged for me not to do this and is *devastated* to have to be away from the children but when I held firm she said "I understand and will do anything you ask of me. I will not cheat. I will do anything and for any length of time for you to see I will do what is necessary to fix this."

Edited August 28, 2014 by betrayedandhurting

[betrayedandhurting]

No one here will ever have the right to say they they were right in this situation. There is no way to know what the outcome will be, and you can only do what you think is best.

 

Because of the love you have for your wife and children, I firmly believe this merits another chance. Of all the twisted and dysfunctional relationships out there, I just don't think yours falls into that category. Has your wife done something horrible? Absolutely. She's got problems, that's for sure. But just as important, I think your marriage has the capacity to survive, more than anyone else's I've ever heard about. You're not being too easy on her and there's no benefit in divorcing her to make a point. You're doing the right things, betrayed. Even if it doesn't work out, you'll always know you gave it your best shot.

 

Thank you. I know everyone will point to the adultery as abuse etc. but lets "ignore" it for a second. My wife and I have known each other from 14. I am 38 now. We have been together for 19 years, 14 of it married. We have been good to each other in the context of marriage (again minus that pesky detail I just learned about) and we weren't abusive to each other. We make the other laugh and have built a life together. Now I get the cheating and the length and manner change my perspective on everything and we may well not survive, but I love the girl, I love how we are when we are together... I'm willing to give it time to see if I can get past the point where the mind movies and bad memories and lack of trust that exist today make life with her not worth it and see at the same time if she decides that she desire validation from me... I'm willing to give it and even do a damn better job of it, but only if I'm the only man for her forever. I am not going to be the fool again, if I get treated this way again it will be painful but the decisions will be over at least, no more wondering what to do or "if" we will make it... it will just be over. I'm praying for a miracle. I'm a God believer and tomorrow morning I meet with my pastor to ask him to pray for my family.

[2sunny]

Ok a few updates...

 

1. The paternity results came back a day early and for the first time in 8 weeks I can say it is good news. No matter what happens in my marriage I know those kids are mine, and they are amazing.

 

2. I am on the road for work 3 or 4 days a week as a pilot. The reality of divorce for me is that I likely would have my kids on my days off which is basically what I have today. Divorce for my wife would be eye opening, in 9 years she has spent perhaps 6 or 7 nights away from them in total (and those were "fun" nights away with me), and only on a single occasion more than 1 consecutive day... so I told her to leave. I don't work until Sunday so tomorrow she is moving out to her Mom's until she returns Saturday night after they go to bed and I leave Sunday morning. Until I decide otherwise this is a trial separation for me to see the realities of what life would be like without my wife and for my wife to see what it will be like the half of the week she sits alone by herself, no husband, no kids. If she chooses to cheat or gets fed up and wants a divorce... good, she made my decision for me. If I find I'm happier without her and my kids get plenty of quality time then also good, that makes my decision easier. Do we have a set time frame? I don't know... I don't want the kids to suffer (they are broken up about this but hopeful since we said we "hoped" this wouldn't be permeant but I refused to promise) so I doubt this will be more than a month UNLESS I decide to go forward with a divorce immediately because I just want her to have a taste of life as it will be if she doesn't get with the program but not make my kids suffer needlessly if I am not prepared to move forward with a divorce yet. I don't know, but I know that I have to do this otherwise she literally suffers no consequence at all.

 

PS: She begged for me not to do this and is *devastated* to have to be away from the children but when I held firm she said "I understand and will do anything you ask of me. I will not cheat. I will do anything and for any length of time for you to see I will do what is necessary to fix this."

 

So happy you know the kids are yours!

 

I think it's a smart move you just made - for MANY reasons - but most of all so that you have a chance to think on your own without her tears and persuasions.

 

Have some fun with your kids!

[Buckeye2]

It’s good to hear that you are making progress and I hope your actions bear fruit.

 

 

The goal of many people in R seems to be to become soul mates again. I think this is unreasonable because you will never be able to blindly trust her like you once did. A more reasonable goal is to be happy enough to enjoy life. You will find out if you’re happier with her or without her. That’s all that counts. A happy man makes the best father.

[aliveagain]

The time apart is a good thing, you need to think clearly without her influence. She needs to feel what her world will be like without you in it. Excellent decision, now you need to start to work on you.

[fellini]

The time apart is a good thing, you need to think clearly without her influence. She needs to feel what her world will be like without you in it. Excellent decision, now you need to start to work on you.

 

 

 

First of all, OP is going to be thinking with her influnce regardless of where she is, in this case he will be influenced by her lack of presence. And he said it as he meant it: to see if he might in fact be just as happy apart as together. He may still love his wife but choose not to live with her.

 

I seriously seriously hope that this whole excercise is not just to get her to feel what her world is without OP, because that is a completely disfunctional purpose to be with someone.

 

This woman needs to find out if she is going to be happy being with, and only with, her spouse. If her happiness continues to be in having multiple sources of narcissistic supply, and those needs are required to be met in intimate conditions, then she needs to know that and to be mature enough to say so, and say goodbye to her H. If she uses this time apart to address her emotional entanglements with her attachments to men outside the marriage, and believes that SHE can be happy in a monogamous relationship, then there is hope.

 

All the love in his heart cannot make his wife happy. All her fears about not being with her H cannot provide her with the security that comes from marriage. They both need to be in this marriage not from fear of loss, but from the desire to give and to receive.

 

It cannot be about what she will feel not having him, it has to be about what she feels about them committing to each other. Maybe for the first time.

Edited August 31, 2014 by a LoveShack.org Moderator