dump a bad marriage for an old love?

[midlifecrazy]

I may yet use the "what would you do if I had an affair" play just to get her reaction. I would use this in lieu of asking her to sign something giving me permission to go elsewhere for intimacy. The only way I would do something like that is if she were to come to me and say since she can't meet my needs it was ok with her for me to have other women do it. She has to approach me. I'm not crawling to her on my knees begging for permission to be loved.

 

And as we've talked about before this would probably only be a stopgap solution at best. Eventually I would become attached to some other lover. Still it would be the best thing for MW. She has no idea of how her life is going to change for the worse when we split up. Poor,silly,stupid woman. I honestly worry about her, what else can I do after all these years. She's still talking "we" and "us". But I can't go on like this. All I'm feeling is "she" and "I". Kind of like what Outcast said, I deserve better. I have done nothing to deserve to be treated like this. To feel unloved, unappreciated, degraded, dissrespected and unworthy myself. I've worked all my life providing her and our family with everything they needed and most of what they wanted. I've never cheated. I've lavished more love care and attention on them than the average guy I think. I do deserve better. And I'm never going to get it from her.

 

As far as other actions other than seeing a lawyer. I have thought about both moving to a different part of the house and of moving out entirely. There are cases to be made for both and while I think moving out might be the easiest I definetly need legal advice. It may even be a requirement in our state that we live apart pending divorce.

 

Of course I always have the option of provoking her to the point where she up and leaves. She has a lot of other hot buttons other than the sex one. Her financial irresponsiblity is a good one. Or it may last until the first time she trys to initiate sex and I turn her down and tell her why, or when I mention having an affair. Who knows?

 

As I look back over my responses it strikes me that I've said nothing of reconcilliation. That's because I think it's impossible. If somehow this relationship survives I think it will only be as a living arrangement and not a true marriage.

[jhurtinct]

I didn''t read all 300 post, but I was in a simuliar situation only I was the gf who didn't want to have sex ever and showed no effection, question to you is this have you tried to look at it from her prospective maybe it's something she's lacking from you emotionally, only because I was givin everything I needed financially and he took care of me like that, but I just never felt loved emotionally and I started to feel bad about myself because I felt he wasn't there emotionally so in feeling bad about myself and getting depressed I started feeling likesex was all that all he ever thought about so I never gave it to him. I always used to say to him make me feel cared about emotionally, respect me and try some tenderness, best for play ever I might be in the mood more often, so I don't feel like just a peice of a$$.

[Mz. Pixie]

Yeah, J- at the very beginning, that's what we said to him, then we later determined he tried all of that...........

 

I've been in your place and I know how you felt, but this is not that situation.

[Ladyjane14]

I wish there was some way I could make you feel your wife's POV...a way to make you understand it, live it, breathe it....so that you would be able to finally separate the sexual rejection from her rejection of you as a person.

 

Believe me....you wouldn't like being in her shoes for even a minute. I know, I've had a pretty good vantage point from my own perspective.

 

.....at one point in the talk, after she had told me the only reason she ever made love to me was to keep me shut up about it, she said all she had ever been was treated like sh@t all her life and there was no reason to change things now. So what did I want, she 'd do anything I wanted her to do cause she was just a worthless piece of crap that didn't deserve any better,crying all the time.

 

The above statements, when dismissed as self-pity, don't go very far. But if you examine them carefully, sorting the wheat from the chaff....she says she feels like "a worthless piece of crap that didn't deserve any better".

 

You can NEVER know what it is to be a woman. You can't know what it is to be measured by your appearance and your sexuality in a world which worships Youth.

 

How old is she? I'm guessing somewhere in the vicinity of 50.

 

At that age, she's probably put on a bit of a middle-aged spread. Breasts are probably sagging. She's probably marked up a bit by the stretch-marks and scars she got bearing children. Her skin is likely blotchy in places from sun damage....what the previous generation refered to as "liver spots". If that's not enough....there's all the weird growths folks get on their skin as they age. There could be some cellulite or vericose veins. Crowsfeet around the eyes. Lips thinning. Hair thinning and gray. We could go on...and on....and on....

 

The bottom line is that aging is unkind, particularly to the self-image. She could be in really good shape for a woman of 50 years, and in your mind's eye she might still be the same young girl you married all those years ago. But I guarantee you that she is broken inside from the loss of her youth.

 

I can see by her responses that she's low self-esteem. How could you possibly think that she's sexy given all that nature and time has heaped upon her? Isn't it more likely that you just want to 'get off'? Isn't it more likely that your interest in sex is just a bodily function....a means of relieving your own tensions? What could it possibly have to do with her?

 

How can she believe that your interest in sex is about her?

 

Here's a contradiction for you:

me "I need for you to know how big a problem this is for me and that you're willing to work on it"

 

her "no,I'm not"

So what did I want, she 'd do anything I wanted her to do....

 

Do you REALLY think she was saying what she meant? And if so....which one of those things was it?

 

I told you before, that it is imperative that you be able to understand her POV. It's really the very same "leap of faith". You can't really feel her pain. She can't really feel yours either.

 

While it's true, that if no action is taken....no changes are likely. And it's true that she must be the one to make certain changes. It's equally true that those things will NOT happen if you are too busy 'licking your wounds' to take her POV into consideration....and treat it with the same care that you would your own.

 

It's a tricky business....separating the wheat from the chaff. I spent the better part of ten years doing it in my own relationship. One thing I realized, after the marriage crisis, is that I had a great tendancy toward hoarding chaff. I'd spent the better part of ten years throwing out the wheat!

 

I do recommend that you follow up your discussion with an action. Like I said earlier....there are lots of actions you can select from.

 

One simple one would be to keep talking about it.....to be persistant, to listen to her concerns, to address them one by one. And above all, NOT to personalize them.

 

It occurs to me that 'poor body image' is just ONE aspect of loss of libido in women. That's not including previous sexual abuse, or hormonal changes due to menopause. There's a host of physiological and psychological possibilities. The problem is multi-layered....and most likely NOT about you.

[Outcast]

Lady J, it's not about the sex. It's not only about the sex. These two aren't a team. They aren't partners. They are two humans coexisting in a home and she won't make ANY attempts to fix it.

 

So please explain how she deserves all the consideration and compassion and he none?

[Ladyjane14]

Lady J, it's not about the sex. It's not only about the sex. These two aren't a team. They aren't partners. They are two humans coexisting in a home and she won't make ANY attempts to fix it.

 

So please explain how she deserves all the consideration and compassion and he none?

 

Maybe she doesn't.

 

Then again, maybe she does. MLC is the only one who knows.

 

He has posted respectfully in regards to her as a loving mother and grandmother. And while there's some trouble in regards to fiscal matters, the main problem seems to be loss of intimacy. Not just as lovers, but as companions as well.

 

There are HUGE communication problems. They don't talk to each other. And they don't listen effectively. If the communication problems were solved....they'd probably have a very good chance at reconciliation.

 

Have you read The Three States of Marriage over at marriagebuilders? I recommend it if you haven't, and also to MLC of course!

 

It seems to me, that MLC and his wife have been in a state of Withdrawal, maybe for a quite awhile. Now, MLC is the state of Conflict. He wants to have his needs met. He wants a return to Intimacy. And there IS the possibility of a return to Intimacy....but it can't happen when the "Taker" is in charge. (That makes more sense once you've read it in context, I swear! )

[midlifecrazy]

I get her POV as being sex is diry and disgusting but unfortunately necessary for procreation. Maybe she thinks this way because someone molested her before she even knew what sex was about. But since I desire an active sex life especially since we're done having kids, I must be a sex obsessed pervert.

 

I can only go by what she has told me since she steadfastly refuses to discuss the issue seriously. Jhurt, we've been through all that. If she's felt unloved it's not for my lack of trying. The woman has a lotta, lotta issues to deal with and she just won't even try to do it. But she has told me she's not interested in sex at all and that I'm not normal because I am.

 

What about her POV am I not getting? That I can get anyway, since she WILL NOT talk about it with me or anyone. You know I've tried to get her to seek help but she won't go. And when I finally did get to go with me for counseling she still wouldn't even try to take advantage of the help being offered. She's told me to leave it alone, forget about. What the hell can I do if she won't help herself? Drug her? Commit her? I don't think there's anything a person can do to help someone who doesn't want to be helped.

 

Dear LadyJane,my friend, I mean that sincerely and I value your input immensely. But don't you think it would be nice if she would try to see my POV? During the talk I told her one thing I had realized after my health crisis last year (what the hell, it was a heart attack) was that I could have died without ever have experincing the level of intmacy I hoped to have had in my life. She pooh-poohed it. Almost mockingly like she was making fun of anyone having such thoughts. And this was early on in the conversation before we ever really got rolling.

 

As far as her conflicting statements. the first one is correct, judging from all the past experience. The second one was a challenge,"let's see if you're really the scum you sound like and try to take me up on it but I don't have to worry because I know you're too nicey-nice to take advantage". I did tell her what I wanted her to do, though. That was to get some help dealing with her issues. Of course that set off another tirade of "leave it alone" etc.

 

And now, since I'm on a rant I think I'll go nuclear. After all the woman armed me long, long ago. Might as well use it now.

 

With regards to having an affair, well I got a freebie coming if you come right down to it. You see I guess she had the 7 year itch. And she scratched it. This was after we'd had 2 kids and in the middle of one of the recessions back in the 70's. I was laid off and she went to work to help supplement my unemployment check while I stayed home with the kids. This was one of only two times in our marriage that she held a fulltime 5 day 40 hour week job. I think it lasted 3 months at most before I went back to work.

 

Anyway one day she confessed to me that she'd had an affair with a guy who worked with her. I was floored of course. And more than a little suprised. Even back then she showed little or no interest in sex. With me anyway. So I was pretty astounded by the whole thing. When I asked her why she answered as she still does everything today "I don't know".

 

Well there were the kids to consider, the affair was over as was her job and I went back to work, a different and much more stressful assignment, so I just let it go. It occurs to me as I think about it, I don't think she ever actually apologized to me for doing it. She did tell me that for some reason she told her sister about it. So now there's me, her, her lover, her sister, I think a couple of her female co-workers oh and several hundred thousand LS'rs who know about it.

 

I still wonder why it happened. My best theories are that maybe she thought the reason she wasn't interested in sex was me and she just wanted to experiment and find out if she was missing out on something. Or she was p#ssed off she was working and saw this as a way as getting back at me. Or maybe she was just dumb. All of these possibilites suck.

 

One day a few years later I mentioned the affair. I don't remember the context, maybe I was still trying to find out why. Anyway she flew off the handle at me. Said how could I mention it to her, she wanted to put it behind her and never talk about it again. That was pretty bold since I was the wronged party. Seems to me I should have the last say about when its ok to stop talking about it. But we haven't since then. Anything to keep her happy and spare her delicate psyche.

 

The funny thing is she has a very selective memory. The same thing happened to her bother a while back. His wife had an affair. My wife thought she was a whore, slut, trash, tramp, you name it. I would not be at all surprised if I said something to MW about her affair today she would deny it ever happened.

[Mz. Pixie]

MLC- that is so sad and something I wish you would have shared before.

 

Let me add, there is really no free pass, hon. No matter what you think or say when it comes right down to it, you don't want to cheat.......you just want the perfect solution and there just isn't one.

[midlifecrazy]

A few more random thoughts here. If I ever bring up the subject of her infidelity again as in "it was ok for you, why shouldn't it be ok for me" or something like that, I think it will touch off a battle of apocalyptic proportions. If I could sell the pay-per-view rights to HBO I'd probably clean up. So until I'm absolutely ready to part ways with her that subject will remain off limits.

 

About sharing the story, this is the first time I've told anyone. I've always beleived if you want to keep a secret, keep it a secret. I guess we're a pair of secret keepers.

 

Hmm, it's getting close to the time LLDG often shows up in my town. I think I'll go for a drive. Just out of curiosity, mind you.

[Ladyjane14]

.....don't you think it would be nice if she would try to see my POV?

 

It would be more than simply "nice". In fact, it's imperative if you're going to elicit any change.

 

I'll be honest with you....I'm not sure if that's ever going to happen. The goal has ALWAYS been to create circumstances that were favorable to her for adjusting her outlook.

 

Your communications with one another are just so bad. I'm at a complete loss to tell you how you could improve them. You know I've always rallied for professional counseling, and preferably BEFORE you managed to frustrate yourself to the point where it wouldn't seem worth it to you to try anymore.

 

It seems to me that you're approaching that point.

 

Your wife has never been here to represent herself. All we can do is try to guess what's going on in her mind. I've played Devil's Advocate quite a bit on her behalf. Having experienced a loss of libido myself, I can understand how she might be feeling.

 

During the talk I told her one thing I had realized after my health crisis last year (what the hell, it was a heart attack) was that I could have died without ever have experincing the level of intmacy I hoped to have had in my life.

 

See, if I were in her shoes....I'd be scared to death that my husband would EXPIRE in the act! Have y'all talked about that? Could it a factor at all? There are so many things that could be fueling this.

 

You're frustrated. And in more ways than one. That's understandable. But the BIGGEST mistake a man can make when dealing with a woman's low libido is personalizing it.

 

You choices are really pretty simple when you boil it all down. You can either pull out all the stops.....and FIX the communications problems. Or, you can abandon the relationship and move on. Like I said before, you've got the keys to your own cage. All you have to do is decide which of those two doors you're going to use them on.

 

I know you feel like you can't effect any positive change with a person who currently seems unwilling to try. But you haven't pulled out all the stops yet.

 

Look at it this way..... If you were working on your job, and faced with a really huge problem, what would you do? If you were the kind of guy who just said, "Oh well, that's too big of a problem for me to solve".....you'd probably be posting to us from the public library by now.

 

So, if you can find creative solutions in other aspects of your life....how is this so much different?

 

Could it be that you just don't want this relationship anymore? And if so, what stops you from leaving it?

[midlifecrazy]

omg,OMG,OMG I admit I was just being kind of "cocky" (? ) in my last post when I mentioned seeing if LLDG was around town. I drove by the convience store I had seen her at most often recently,I had to pass it anyway, but didn't see her truck there. So I went on to the supermarket to buy a lotto ticket. Didn't see her truck in the parking lot there either.

 

So I parked and went in. And there she was right in front of me. She was standing at the office with her back to me waiting to rent some DVDs. (if she's a LSr and stumbles on this thread she'll know who she is for sure). You have to get the lotto tickets at the office too so I got in line behind a couple of other guys who were also waiting. She looked back over her shoulder and kind of gave me a smile. After she got her videos she went over to the produce section and began checking out the bagged salad selection.

 

I was standing there trying to decide what to do next. The office was shorthanded and taking forever to wait on people. I thought I'd get my ticket and then maybe go talk to her but it was taking so long. She however seemed to be taking an equally long time to decide on a bag of lettuce. A hope entered my mind, could it possibly be that she was waiting, giving me a chance to approach her?

 

I couldn't wait any longer. I knew I wanted to talk to her and who knew when an opportunity like this would present itself again. I was desperately afraid that she'd leave and I'd blow my chance.

 

So I took it. I left the line and headed over to where she was. And none too soon either. She had finally picked out her item and was getting ready to leave. I said her name and she stopped and looked at me. "Do you remember ...?" I asked. And she said "Ohhh yeeaaahhh...":love:

 

Well we had a nice talk right out there in the center of gossip central for the the town. Nothing out of line just catching up,ahh but it was lovely though.

I think now of a thousand more things I wish I'd said or asked. I loved seeing her smile and I'd almost swear she had a twinkle in her eye. And there was a lot of eye contact.

 

And then it was time to leave. I went back to get my ticket and she went to the express line adjoining the office and both of us had to wait again so we talked across the counter with still a lot of eye contact and smiling. Then when she finally did leave we said goodbye and I had to cut myself off because I caught myself saying 'Bye babe" only it came out "bye bay" Then I left the store and I saw her leaving in a different vehicle than the one I'd seen her in before.

 

And I was high as a kite! I don't care who saw us talking or if it gets back to Mrs MLC. If she has any questions about it I'll answer them. It was a job though trying to contain my excitement and keep a silly grin off my face all night. I don't think I'd have the temperment to be able to carry on an affair and keep it concealed. Oh, and no this wasn't a dream or a fantasy. This was the real deal.

 

Now I've never been much of a believer in signs and portents and such. But I have to admit that some of this has been a little more than passing strange. The way DG (she's not Long Lost anymore) keeps showing up at the oddest and most opportune and appropriate times in my life (in my view). The dreams which strangely seem to be following a logical kind of progression. And this one, the last time DG and I were together was during the time of Hurricane Camille. Need I say more? Strange things happen in this world.

 

I don't really think DG and I will ever get together but who knows for sure. There definitely seems as if there might still be a spark between us. She's my age too, in her 50's and still fine looking but maybe she hasn't heard that for awhile or gotten the attention she needs. If she would have me, I sure as hell would have her! Sorry, MzP, but I've been driven back to the wall. I think I really do want to, at least if it was with DG.

 

So there's what I've been doing today. LadyJ, yes I am at that point because I know now there is nothing more I can do to try to improve things. I don't know what more stops there are to pull out and I can't communicate with her because she simply refuses to participate. And frankly I'm tired of trying.

 

As to the heart thing, I'm in better shape now than I have been for quite awhile before that. In fact after I mended last year MW actually said to me once, because of my increased mmmm stamina, that she wished she had her "old" (pre-op) hubby back.

 

The work scenario? Sometimes things are unsolvable. They simply can't be fixed. There was a lttle puzzle I used to try to work. It was supposedly insoluble. I worked on it off and on for years before I finally decided they were right and gave up on it. Sounds familiar when I put it in writing.

 

The doors, pictured as one door with me pacing back and forth in front of it. Sometimes stopping. Sometimes putting my hand on the handle. Where I feel I'm at right now is standing still in front of it and its open waiting for me to step through. What's keeping me from exiting? I've been examing that very question myself.

 

One thing keeps running through my head though. Tomorrow DG has to return those videos.

[Mz. Pixie]

MLC- you're now experiencing the high that I experienced when the OM started flirting with me. I know exactly what you're talking about........

 

It's wrong, but it does feel good. So, there ya go...... I'm glad that at least it made you feel good, but I don't want you to be a cheater. Only because I know how bad it's going to hurt and feel when it comes out to everyone. It's not a place you want to be in my friend, trust me.

[midlifecrazy]

Depending on your POV I suppose this run in with DG is either the best thing or the worst thing that could happen. If you think there's hope for the marriage it's bad because it's a disrupting influence and distracton. On the other hand if you feel the marital situation is hopeless, this gives me hope that I might be able to find happiness with someone, sometime.

 

All I know is how great it felt to once again at least be able to feel that someone was interested in and attracted to you. I guess I know which camp that puts me in.

 

I still can't get over the coincidence that now when I am at the low point of expectation for our marriage, when I know how MW feels about being intimate with me, up pops DG basically served up to me on a silver platter. Reminding me of the way it's possible to feel. Saying "take it if you want it". Fate? Intelligent design?

 

It's been about a year now since I first came to the conclusion that if I ever was to find happiness it probably wouldn't be within this marriage. Family events conspired to delay a decision for 6 months. And for the past 6 months, inspired by the good members of LS I have been trying desperately to salvage it.

 

What's keeping me from leaving? Being a "good guy". concern for MWs welfare, fear of the unknown, worry that my family will think less of me, concern that maybe, just maybe MW might be right and there IS something wrong with me. In the end, actually, nothing.

[Horse]

I haven't posted on this thread before, but I have been following along.

 

I am amazed that you are still married. Is it love or fear of failure?

 

What I think. I think you wife is stuck in victim mode and she does things to sabotage anything good in her life, so she can continue to see herself as the poor victim. If you could live without sex, she would find some other way to sabotage your relationship. She is driving you away, and when you finally do give up, she will continue playing the victim role saying you abandoned her in her time of need.

 

I don't think there is anything more that you can do to help her.

 

You tried your best. It's time to move on without anger or regret.

[Mz. Pixie]

Hon, there's not a thing in the world you can do to make them NOT think less of you. There is NO good way for it to play out. You're talking to someone who lost everyone in their life but about three or four people. I was someone with lots of friends- a large circle- and a dear best friend who I thought would stick with me through everything. She knew of the affair and supported me, but she did not support me when the heat got hot and everyone jumped ship. Her loss.

 

You're going to be the bad guy, no doubt about it. What I encourage you to do is be the bad guy in a lesser way- which is to get out before you do anything else.

 

Don't build this chance encounter with DG up to something it's not. You have no idea what her personal situation is. This is a prime example of why you cannot even think of having an affair, you're too needy right now.

[Outcast]

What's keeping me from leaving? Being a "good guy". concern for MWs welfare, fear of the unknown, worry that my family will think less of me, concern that maybe, just maybe MW might be right and there IS something wrong with me. In the end, actually, nothing.

 

I vote 'fear of the unknown'.

 

Have you ever lived on your own? I suspect that you really can't stand the idea of going home to an empty house and that's what's keeping you where you are.

 

I also think that grabbing on to this new woman that you barely know would be a huge mistake but it seems that's where you're headed because at least that would mean you wouldn't be alone.

 

Really, you can get used to being on your own and make peace with it. Yes, it's a pain to be the only person doing the chores, the only person responsible for the bills, the shopping, etc etc but you cope.

 

Remember 'a life lived in fear is a life half-lived'. If you were to die next week, would you be glad you just hung in there clinging to what's safe instead of reaching for more?

[midlifecrazy]

Oh, no, MzP those were reasons I cited for not having left yet. I wasn't referring to having an affair. Like I said I've seriously been debating this for about a year. One of the conclusions I reached last fall was that no matter what happened I would ALWAYS be my kids and grandkids father and grandfather. I think deep down that's the reason I still hesitate. I'm afraid of what effect this will have on the family. Actually it might be minimal. After all the kids are grown with families of their own. The grandkids would just have to take turns seeing grandma and grandpa at different times in different places. Still the thought persists that it could turn them against me. That I could be percieved as the villain who ran off and abandoned mom/grandma for no good reason. I hope they can understand that there is a reason and as hard as I've tried I just can't fix it and I just can't take it anymore.

 

Horse,you're absolutely right about her being in victim mode. I've often thought that but it was never made more clear to me than it was in our last confrontation. I don't really think she can help herself but she's not even willing to acknowledge it or try to fix it. The reasons we're still married are the ones I've already mentioned. Yes reluctance to admit failure does play at least a small part. Love? I care for her, I don't want to see her unhappy. I'm concerned about her well being. But about the best I can do in the love department anymore is to say I love her like a sister. Which is probably fine with her. As far as an intimate, loving man/woman relationship, that's gone, dead. She starved it to death.

 

MzP, I can see how easily one can fall into an affair just from this little flirtation. When you've been without for so long, my gawd, it's intoxicating isn't it? Like a drug almost, you just keep wanting more and more. I feel like a freakin' teenager again. I think of the things I want to say and I can hardly wait to see DG again, even though I know nothing will probably ever come of it.

 

The best way I can describe it is to think of Christmas, with the tree and lights. The presents and food. Just all the happiness. Then imagine yourself in hot,bright dusty July. And then from somewhere you get a whiff of aroma from a pine tree and all those great memories come flooding back.

 

Hmm, guess I AM pretty needy.

 

But I can wait until things are settled between MW and me. I think. I hope.

 

Our prodigal returns home again this weekend so I don't want any discussions until next week anyway and I really need to get some legal advice before going too far but I guess to me it is over. I don't think at this point there's anything MW can do to fix things. Her window of opportunity has almost closed.

[Mz. Pixie]

Sad really.

 

I was thinking more along the lines of the family being upset because your wife has never really worked etc and how will she be supported??

 

Yes, it's like a drug really. When my A first started I stayed awake for days just from the sheer excitement, playing everything over and over in my head. Wierd, wierd stuff.

[midlifecrazy]

That's what I mean by having concern about her well being. If we part ways she'll have to go out and do something past experience has shown she hates to do. That is get a full time job and support herself. She can do it. She has the skills to do it. She just doesn't like to do it (work not sex but I guess it applies to both).

 

But actions have consequences and sometime soon she may have to face the results of her refusal to even try to meet me half-way in working on our relationship. The problem is I haven't yet hardened my heart against her that much yet, fool that I am. Still I'm working on it and every sharp word or criticism, every incident of apathy or neglect makes it that much easier.

 

I did try to run into DG again but the timing was off I guess because I didn't see her. I know she's still in the fantasy realm and and that I probably have as much chance at winning the lotto and I do of being with her. But it's what she represents to me that I crave. A happy, joyous, passionate time of being alive that I once had and can only hope to have again someday.

 

Yeah Outcast, I have lived alone. It never bothered me. In fact if I end up living alone again I know it will only be for as long as I choose to. Oh I imagine I'll have company. I would want to have a lot of tryouts before I ever settled down long term with someone again.

[Outcast]

She just doesn't like to do it

 

Well not that many people do (work, not sex). So she gets to join the rest of her fellow human beings in that. Nobody's above having to do things they don't want to, particularly when it comes to earning one's own keep.

 

When my folks divorce, my mom fought tooth and nail to not have to work. Once she got working, she loved her job and became a valued part of her organization. She was one of those people who always hated the idea of doing things until she actually got doing them.

[midlifecrazy]

Kind of an odd feeling in the air. MW seems to be back in a state of blissful ignorance. It's as if the confrontation last weekend never took place. Or maybe thinks the problem has been dealt with, is over and she's won. All I know is that she seems to be in noticeably better spirits. But....

 

I on the other hand have adopted a "hands off" policy toward her. Like you were in a workplace with real strict sexual harassment guidelines. I've been treating her like a co-worker. polite,cordial, co-operative. But no displays of affection, no intimate talk (I don't mean sexual, I mean as people who are close to each other talk, and NO touching.

 

About Wednesday I think it started to dawn on her that something was off. She's made a point of kissing me if she goes somewhere. That's unusual. It seems as if shes start fishing for reassurance. Sadly I have none to give her.

 

A change in plans, we won't have company this weekend. I may use the "what if I had and affair"card. It wouldn't be a good solution, probably even make things worse but I'm at the end of the line here. I'll not get real heavy about it,just casually bring it up and gauge her reaction

[Outcast]

Why? Because her anger at the thought would mean she loves you?

 

Really, you've been threatening to do this since day 1 - what do you think it will achieve? Do you think she will finally realize what it would mean to lose you and fall into your arms?

 

I don't get it.

[Ladyjane14]

A change in plans, we won't have company this weekend. I may use the "what if I had and affair"card. It wouldn't be a good solution, probably even make things worse but I'm at the end of the line here. I'll not get real heavy about it,just casually bring it up and gauge her reaction

 

There's no point in going there if you are done with the marriage. You'd only be adding to the problem.

 

If you're not going to say what you mean....why say anything at all?

[midlifecrazy]

Yeah, Outcast, that's exactly what I expect to happen (geez!)

 

Actually I didn't have time to get to where I was going with that last post. MzPixie gets it I think. And LadyJ, you actually touched on it in one of your responses although I don't think you seriously meant it. I guess I have the forelorn hope that perhaps if we could agree to an arrangement that frees MW from any sexual obligations to me and frees me to seek that fulfillment elsewhere we might be able to maintain this marriage.

 

I know this would put us in a minefield of possible emotional complcations. I also know that this is by no means a novel idea. "Arrangements" are made every day and most likely have been ever since there have been men and women. And really it's not like I'm 25 and planning on screwing around for a long, long time. I'm old enough that I think I'll surely be winding down within a few years. I would like to live little before I die. This is almost sounding like your standard "midlife crisis" deal I realize but those of you who have followed this whole long story know that's not the case I hope.

 

Anyway I don't imagine we'll come to that kind of arrangement but she may surprise me. I figured if we were watching tv and the subject of infidelity came up I'd just toss out the "what would you do .." question. Anticipated responses;

" Are you having one?'

"Do you want to have one"

"I can't believe you asked me that. Is that all you think of"

"Leave you"

"I'd just be hurt"

"Go ahead, do whatever you want to do. I don't care" (Bingo, we have a winner).

 

She has actually used that last line on me before when I was in the mood and she didn't want to be bothered. And it didn't involve touching her or going out and hooking up.

 

My most likely response to her,"Oh,I was just curious".

 

LadyJ, one thing I noticed in your posts, you've never addressed the subject of HER infidelity. And MzPixie, I luv ya, but it seems to me that,yeah MW did get a free pass on her affair.

 

I realized one more thing too. I didn't have a lot of relationships before MW and the ones I did usually ended more or less by mutual consent or we just drifted apart. In the only other serious relationship I was in I was the one who got dumped. I really have no experience in being the one to initiate a break up. It's hard.

 

But I have started trying to decide on an attorney.

[Outcast]

You know darn well the 'have your cake and eat it' option is lame.