One Big Lie

[fleafly]

TMW, I dont know what to say, I just got on hear and saw this, I almost fell out of my chair. Im sure you realize that in my state of mind I cannot offer much advice, but I will be here to support you. You have been there for me, I just went back and read my thread with your postings, I can imagine how devastating this is for you, I am so sorry.

 

I do have a question though. Were the two of you seeing the same counselor?? Since your wife was in individual counseling, I wonder, did your wife tell him/her the real situation months ago?? I know in our case since both of us see the same person, everything she or I tells him is confidential to the other spouse so, if thats the case....

why the hell wouldnt the counselor told her to come clean?

[Ladyjane14]

Originally posted by Owl.....

What she's been doing ONLY works if it's kept a secret. Affairs almost ALWAYS die in the light of exposure. You really do need to tell everyone...your family, her family, the OM's family...EVERYONE. And THEN start thinking about what you need to do next. She'll think you're doing it to get revenge...which isn't true at all. The intent is to END the affair, and for her to finally be accountable for her actions.

 

 

Owl, that was a lovely post, btw. You explained the precepts of exposure much better than I did. It really isn't a matter of revenge at all, even though a WS will inevitably see it as such. Exposure really does END an extramarital affair. It cannot exist as what it was before. It will either evolve or end.

 

Originally posted by Fleafly...

Were the two of you seeing the same counselor?? Since your wife was in individual counseling, I wonder, did your wife tell him/her the real situation months ago?? I know in our case since both of us see the same person, everything she or I tells him is confidential to the other spouse so, if thats the case....why the hell wouldnt the counselor told her to come clean?

 

These are good questions. The answers to which may possibly warrant hiring a new therapist.

[izzybelle]

tmw,

 

i too am stunned by what's happened, i've seen some of your other posts and i am truly sorry!!! i can't even imagine the pain.

 

i will be the lone voice here, however. i do agree that telling her supervisor's boss may make sense but i believe that may only go so far. without proof, they probably won't fire his butt. as for telling his wife.... i wouldn't. in all honesty, that part of the A is his to deal with, if your W wanted to do it..., i still have mixed feelings. i know you're angry and hurt and have every right to be, but exposing this and telling the whole world will accomplish what? embarrassment? humiliation? isn't this a "private" matter between you and your W? will telling people make her more likely to come back because she's too embarrassed not too? is that really the way you want it? the days of the scarlet letter have passed, personally, i'd much rather see you channel your anger into repairing your marriage or figuring out what to do. talking to him is one thing but i don't see that there's anything to be accomplished by telling his W. and there's always the chance that his W will boot him out the door, and then what will happen? he'll be free and your W will be .....? i hope you see where i'm going with this. revenge while it may feel sweet at the time has a tendency to create a bitter outcome.

 

please, please, please, just think things through before you do anything that could have dire consequences down the road.

[whichwayisup]

Izz, you've made some excellent points...But you play with the bull - Ya get the horns! She should have to suffer consquences of her actions. I don't think it is unfair of him to do this.

 

I'm sure co-workers know what is going on. The gossip mill moves fast and it wouldn't surprise me some knew for a while. In most office environments EVERYBODY knows somebody who is sleeping with someone else.

 

It's easy to pick up on other energy around - Especially sexually charged energy between two people in a work place.

 

And it is full blown affair, not a little on going play thing...This time around it was planned out and intentional - Not just a wee mistake.

[izzybelle]

But you play with the bull - Ya get the horns! She should have to suffer consquences of her actions. I don't think it is unfair of him to do this.

 

i understand BUT .... from what i've read here from those women who have been WSs .... don't they suffer the most knowing what they've done to their families? what they've done to the kids? what they've done to the spouse they "promised" to be faithful too? IMHO THOSE are the sharpest horns, the other's don't matter. what the world at large thinks about the affair makes NO difference. it's what HE and HIS W choose to do on their own. it's their marriage, their family, their future.... and if they choose to make it work, he's ruined his W's relationship with his family? i understand that she needs to be accountable for what she did, but all i can see coming from that is adding more difficulties to the possibility of making it work. i know if i had a spouse that cheated and we decided to tell my family, they would have wanted nothing to do with him.... i can't possibily see how that would create much of a positive future.

 

and i'll share this.... my now ex-in-laws were convinced that i was having an affair, which i wasn't, but they wouldn't believe me and treated me like shi! for the better part of my marriage. needless to say, i finally had enough of a LOT of things there and left. turning family against one of the partners rarely has the outcome we desire. immediately, sure, it adds that pressure, that humiliation, the need for regret.... but what about 1yr., 3 yrs., 5 yrs down the road? i've been there with in-laws who insisted i was a whore when i had done nothing to deserve it....it doesn't help save a marriage, it does more damage than good. that's why i said and i'll repeat.... think this through. what may feel now in the present like a good idea may come back to bite you in the butt later. when we're upset and hurt it's the now that matters, we want to do something to make the pain go away, we don't think before we act, that's why people say things in the heat of the moment that they regret. as hard as it is to keep quiet, at this time, i do completely believe that it's best if there's any hope in saving the marriage.

[pragmatic]

Originally posted by izzybelle

as hard as it is to keep quiet, at this time, i do completely believe that it's best if there's any hope in saving the marriage.

 

Your point is well worded and valid, but I'm sure you understand that unless the affair ends, there is no marriage. Most times the only way to kill the affair is to expose it to the light of day.

 

How many affairs would happen if it weren't possible to keep them secret? I'd say close to none.

 

Also, keep in mind, that part of the addiction of many (most?) affairs is the "excitement" of the illicit relationship.

 

No one is advocating taking out an ad in the paper, but TMW needs all the help he can get if he wants to stay married - the OM's wife can provide that help, but only if she knows about what she is married to.

[izzybelle]

the OM's wife can provide that help, but only if she knows about what she is married to.

 

or she can kick his butt out the door and both marriages may end. i have friends in that position right now. the H found out, talked to the MM, his W found out, both marriages are now over. it's a chance and it could be playing with fire and it's hard to say who's going to get burned! it doesn't always work out the way we want, and i know either way is a chance.

 

i don't know what happened to B52srock, but i remember she exposed her H's A to everyone. and please i'm not saying that that caused what i knew of the result at one point.... but i do believe that at least shortly after the exposure her H was living with the OW.... just be careful......

 

it could go either way. and i understand that the affairs need to be exposed to the light of day but hasn't that already happened to for the 2 people who matter MOST in this? TMW and his W? and ironically, the person my in-laws thought i was having an A with was my boss!

[pragmatic]

Originally posted by izzybelle

just be careful......

 

it could go either way.

 

I agree very much with this sentiment.

 

It's too early to do anything dramatic - Thumb knows as well as anyone that any action/decision must wait until heads are clear - but if it looks like Mrs. Thumb needs "help" breaking off all contact, the OM's wife needs to be brought into the fight.

[kimizmat]

I was reading your post today....I'm new to this place and am going through a similar situation. I just wanted to say that you're not alone. I don't have a chance of the H coming back, but can relate to the affair thing. Please remember this: It has little or nothing to do with you. This is something my therapist has been repeating to me and it does help and it is true. You're still a great person who is worthy of respect.

 

I couldn't help but notice the Tool quotation you have. Nice to recognize another fan. :0)

 

Best of luck to you.

[Ladyjane14]

Originally posted by izzybelle

......i don't see that there's anything to be accomplished by telling his W. and there's always the chance that his W will boot him out the door, and then what will happen? he'll be free and your W will be .....? i hope you see where i'm going with this. revenge while it may feel sweet at the time has a tendency to create a bitter outcome.

 

Exposure is not about revenge. It's about changing the dynamics that allow the affair to thrive. I can certainly understand why a WS would consider it to be a vengeful action though. It stirs up a whole hornet's nest.

 

I can't speak for Thumb, but I can tell you that not every BS is so desperate to maintain the marriage that they are willing to live with someone who honestly does not want to be with them. It follows that IF the two WS's end up together then they were not following their hearts in regards to their respective marital relationships.

 

Honestly, if my husband wanted to be somewhere else....I wouldn't want him to be with me out of obligation to his family. I only want him if he wants me. Our marriage is only meaningful if it means something to BOTH of us.

 

I don't think Thumb should concern himself with whatever fallout the MM has to deal with. MM already made his choices in committing adultery on two fronts...in his own marriage, and in someone else's. It shouldn't make the slightest difference to Thumb in determining his course of action. MM had his chance to choose his own course. Thumb is at no obligation to sweep the truth under the rug for ANYONE.

 

.... and if they choose to make it work, he's ruined his W's relationship with his family? i understand that she needs to be accountable for what she did, but all i can see coming from that is adding more difficulties to the possibility of making it work. i know if i had a spouse that cheated and we decided to tell my family, they would have wanted nothing to do with him.... i can't possibily see how that would create much of a positive future.

 

Exposing to family members is also necessary.... not only for Thumb who will need their support, but also for WW who will need acceptance based in TRUTH. Otherwise, she'll always have the white elephant in the room, the certain knowlege that 'if-they-all-only-knew-the-truth', they couldn't possibly love her anymore. Love is proven by knowing another person's faults and mistakes.....and then accepting them anyway.

 

If the in-law's get out-of-hand, then a recovering BS can, and should, straighten them out.

 

Of course, Thumb will have to make decisions on what is ultimately best for him and for his family.

[sadhubby]

sorry thumb im blown away i remeber your story becuase it was similar to mine .but know i see it was even more dark than my problem.a married man older than her such crap he will kik her to the side to save his marriage in a heart beat he is using her how pathetic..why do women fall for this crap i still dont understand why my wife did this maybe there are some more skeletons in her closet.god they lie so well why such pain comes from this i agree from the other posts.they know deep down that they are wrong but find ways to justify there actions..i say expose and gain back your dignity man becuase it will help you leave this idiot.. thumb someone else out there is waiting for you to love , it is gods way man .. and she will be so sorry after the dust settles and relizes what a man she had..hang in there thumb...

[fleafly]

I cant believe that any one would even think that the OW should not know about this. What the hell is that? Why do you feel that the only two people that matter is on one side of the coin. The only people that NEED TO KNOW ( and one already knows) are the betrayed spouses. Period. No shouting on the rooftops, as I agree with IZZY on not letting family know, you situation is exacty what I didnt want in my case, as far as people taking sides. That was my decision. But how would you feel if you were the OW? What you dont know doesnt hurt you?

 

Or just let the OM continue on his way, wrecking marriages as he goes without consequence, great idea. I wonder how his wife would feel about that.

[uberfrau]

Are fees for failed marriage counseling refundable?

 

She must have lied to the counselor-what a waste of time and money.

 

As for telling the OM's wife, i say GO FOR IT. The goal is to end the affair, and if the the OM's wife knows, the likelihood of it ending is greater.

[brashgal]

I disagree with telling the family - they will side with the BS no matter what, they may not be so accepting of the affair and families can get into the middle of marriages and kill them. I speak from my own experience. I wish I had not shared so much of what happened in my marriage with my parents.

 

I wish I had outed the first OW (who was also married) when I found out about my exh's first affair. I think it would have killed it and we would have had a chance to work on our marriage. As it was they kind of limped along for another year after I found out and then he got involved with OW2 who left her husband finally. My ex lives with her today - musta been true love, eh? By then there had been too much damage to my marriage. Wish I had known about LS back then, I would have made different choices and not tortured myself.

[izzybelle]

i know that only TMW is going to able to assess the situation and choose the path that will be best for him.

 

but my point is that there is no guarantee that outing the MM may help. i'm sure in many cases that BS can put pressure on ending the A but it doesn't always work that way. IF what i was accused of with my boss had been true and someone had chosen to tell his W, it wouldn't have mattered. she was already planning on divorcing him.... she would have just chosen to screw him worse financially than she did. i also have another friend who left his W for his OW. her H knows what's going on and doesn't care. my friend and his OW go on vacation together, she spends the night at his house. granted that's an odd situation but i don't think it's safe to assume that telling the other BS is the answer that will automatically allow things to work. if the dedication to work on the marriage isn't there, then it won't matter who knows .... if the dedication to work on the marriage is there she should want to end the A WITHOUT extra help from the MMs wife. and while i understand that the marriage needs the A to end in order to work, the dedication to fix things has to be there or nothing anyone does or says is going to matter.

[Thumbs Wife]

Hello...this is Thumbing My Way posting under my wifes login....I just registered her on LS.

 

She is not too web or mess board savy, but when she is ready she will post. She might lurk for while.....not sure.....

 

THanks again everyone....I have not had a chance to read all the responsed since my last post....I will repsond tomorrow....

 

as for my wife....watch for her thread or her user name......please help us.....my heart calls to all of you.....

[reservoirdog1]

I agree that shouting it from the rooftops is a bad idea. TMW wants to encourage his WW to work with him to fix the marriage, and putting her under the microscope with her friends and family won't help that. As long as they're reconciling, he should keep it largely between them.

 

As for the OM's W, however, she should definitely be told. It's not about revenge; the purpose for doing so is to get her working on HER marriage, and making it as hard as possible for OM to keep on pursuing TMW.

 

It's possible that, after exposure, OM may leave his W. But that simple fact isn't determinative. If, as a result of that, TMW's WW leaves and runs off with OM, then if you ask me, that was going to happen anyway. And if it was going to happen anyway, it's better for TMW to know now than a year from now.

[izzybelle]

personally, i'd be much more likely to want to work on my marriage if i heard it from my spouse and not the spouse of the person my H was having an affair with. but i recognize that my views on many things here don't run along the same lines as most of you.

 

to thumb's wife.... i'd say welcome to LS but somehow that feels hollow because i wish for you that you'd never had any reason to find this board. yes, we're all a bunch of strangers, and some of us strange to go with that , but i trust your H has told you that most here are here for support and to give it when we can. the advice can be harsh at times. and while i may be off base in suggesting this, and i apologize if i am, there is another section of this site for those who have become involved with someone who's married - the OW/OM forum. you may find some support there for ending the A. and again, i apologize if i'm out of line.... i do wish you both the strength to weather this storm together.

 

izzy

[Israfil]

to Thumb's Wife:

 

I DO welcome you here.

 

First, it is rare indeed to have two sides of a story - hopefully by providing your thoughts as well this community can better advise you. Second, everyone makes mistakes - we've all made a few, and (at least I) will not vilify you for yours. And three, we are here for you too.

 

If you do post here, I think it would be extremely courageous.

 

You are both in my thoughts.

[whichwayisup]

Hi Thumbs wife...I hope we all can help both of you through this.

 

Oh I have to say...Israfil, great post and you said some really nice words...

 

It's a good sign that you're willing to come here, read and when you feel comfortable enough to start your own thread. It will help and we all are rooting for you both to work together, be 100% open and honest and get back on track.

 

Afew suggestions so you can understand what your husband is going through right now. And this is not meant to be put at your harshly...So don't take it the wrong way...

 

Read Owl's thread http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t49539/ it will help you understand more and maybe you'll see some things in yourself that you may unfortunately have to own up to.

 

I do wish ya the best and same goes for your husband. Alot of caring and supportive people here, but one thing. Some are pretty honest and see it as they call it. Just be abit prepared for some hard advice and hard facts that could come your way. I'm not trying to scare you but hearing it will only benefit you and help you along even more.

 

Take care.

 

WWIU

[Merin]

TMW.. My heart goes out to you..

 

I'm sure this has devastated you.. I don't have a lot to offer my friend.. except how very sorry I am.

[veronese]

I wish there were words to comfort you right now. I really feel for you wanted to let you know I'm thinking of you too.

 

veronese

xx

[latesleeper]

tmw,

 

i just read about what happened, and am very sorry! i feel for you, and for what it's worth, am sending positive vibes your way, or at least, hug vibes.

 

remember you are in shock right now. please be kind and gentle to yourself.

 

take care, we're all thinking of you (as you can see).

[sylviaguardian]

Thumbs,

((()))). My heart goes out to you. I can imagine how devasted you feel and how raging you are inside. I don't know what to say. This just seems so unbelievable that obviously the only answers can come from your wife. It seems strange to me that she would continue with counselling if she really loves this guy. No wonder you feel like a fool. But perhaps she wasn't as calculating and conniving as you think? Perhaps she went to the counselling because deep down she wanted to save the marriage? I don't know - only she knows the answer to that.

 

You are right when you said that it is time for TMW to take a stance. You cannot put up with this behaviour any longer. At the moment you need the truth. Can you get someone to take the kids for the weekend? You need to make it clear to your wife that you need to talk and that you will no longer accept lies. You DESERVE to know where you stand on this.

 

It is time for you to take a deep breath and let your wife see that you are not going to be the safety net anymore. It's scary, I know, but you really don't deserve this. You deserve so much better. It is time for her to make a decision and to realise that her actions have consequences.

 

A couple of other things - I would not involve your family too much. I told my father what had happened and boy do I regret it now. All the hurt and pain I've caused him. Do you have some friends you can turn to instead? Another thing - I would hold back on telling the OM's wife. I have processed the same thoughts myself and my conclusion was that if I told the OW's husband and he her turfed her out, and I did the same to my H what would be the logical conclusion? You are practically throwing them together. Wait to see if this relationshipp between them is really in the running or not. My gut feeling is that it is not.

 

What you will have to think about is whether or not you would still want your wife, knowing perhaps that she has stayed because their relationship has turned out to be just dreams. You need to make that clear to your wife also. She cannot go on keeping all her options open.

 

I would consider asking her to leave for a while anyway. Things have got to the stage where your kids will probably realise that things are going on anyway. It is not up to you to leave - it's her choice, she must face the consequences.

 

You are right when you say that you were the only one REALLY trying. It's time now to stop bending over backwards. Thumbs - I am so sorry for your hurt, but I know you have strength inside you. YOu will have to reach inside and pull some of it out. Sometimes we reach a stage in our life where we feel that we have been exploded apart. This is one of them. There are certain things that will hold you together until you can rebuild - your friends, your kids, your faith and the knowledge that you are a good person. Sometimes bad things happen to good people, I'm afraid. But at least you can still look in the mirror and like what you see.

 

Thumbs, you have helped so many people here with your kind words - now its time for us to do the same for you. Sending you a little prayer.

 

Syl

[ThumbingMyWay]

First of all, I like to thank EVERYONE of you who have supported me and those how are now supporting my wife on her thread.

 

As I look back to MY progress thru the whole MC thing…..I must say that I am a changed man. Through MC and faith in God, the attitude of my heart has changed. My 100% commitment to FIND ME through counseling has worked. What I have learned so far will help me continue on my journey for inner self peace. I am grateful and blessed. The Grace of God has touched me…and I will never be the same.

 

 

I have not slept or eaten a full meal in the last 3 days. I am tired and sick to my stomach. I am beaten down emotional and physically….but my love for my wife outweighs my disgust.

 

My situation has to be the first of its kind…..I have read over 100 different infidelity stories here on LS and on MB. Never have I every read one like mine….unfortunately for me….I am living it. This is my life test set forth in front me by God. And by the grace of God….WE will pass this test.

 

My wife is sick and in great need of emotional and psychological help. And we are making efforts to get her this help.

 

I have chosen to remain committed to this marriage relationship. The love I carry in my heart is great. It is pure genuine love….

 

I remain here because…..the last 8 months…I have given 100%...while my wife has given NONE. My wife has stated that she was not here for us because of the OM. She was in a fog. And she has now hit rock bottom. She has committed to me in TRUTH that she does not want to give up…and that she is now ready to TRY….wait she is ready to DO…there is no try.

 

So with the notion that she didn’t give 100% before and has now finally realized the magnitude of her actions…..she is now willing to give her whole self to making this right. The first go around it was just me. So now that we BOTH will give 100%....my heart and what is left of my spirit tells me to recommit my soul and faith to making this right. Because how will I ever know if it can be right….now that we both are truly 100% committed, I need to see where this relationship will go.

 

 

I think someone posted on my wifes thread or maybe here……that all the advice I have given to others…I must now use on myself. That is what I am going to do.

 

 

Strawberry baby…..I fell in love with you the first day I saw you….and that love is still deep and true. Where ever this journey leads us…..please know that my love will guide you…..follow me to the truth.

 

I read a verse from the Bible last night….I now use it in my signature….you want to be free of pain…..then read it, remember it, embrace it, let it into your heart…..it is now the mission verse of my life