Becoming more picky about looks?

[Teknoe]

No....my understanding is that he doesnt have any male friends either...Id say its very healthy for a guy to have a circle of male buddies...Doesnt have to spend all his time with them, but its a generally healthy thing..The only guys I am aware of that have no male friends and only female friends are gay..

 

And women will find it more attractive for someone like him to have some friends...

 

TFY

 

Yup. Every healthy guy needs some male friends. Like you said, he doesn't have to see them a LOT... but it's good if you have some guy friends that you can call up in a pinch to talk stuff through.

 

Girls would find most guys without friends (unless he's hot and a lone wolf type) a red flag. Just imagine... who would your best man be? What kind of friends would you invite to a wedding?

 

Unless you got a ton going for you, imagine spending all your time with your dating partner week after week, with no variety. The girl would get bored after 6 months of doing the same stuff. Friends help us grow and enrich our lives... plus they add variety which is the spice of life.

[somedude81]

Luck. A fluke. It happened once, and she didn't stick around long.

 

It wasn't my fault she didn't stick around.

 

Almost everyone here probably knows much more about dating and getting women than you do. Yet, when they try to give you advice, you act like they don't know what they're talking about, and you bring up your one GF as an example to back you up. There are plenty of guys here with a ton of experience dating, you should be very open to what they have to say.

 

The "advice" I've received recently is for some reason focused on making male friends. I've stated over and over and over that I don't want to talk about guy friends.

 

There has to be more stuff out there relating to women that can be of use to me.

 

I've posted about two girls that I'm interested in and will be talking to next week. How about some advice on what I should say to them and what I should focus on?

[xxoo]

Yes, that method of knowing a woman on a deeper level first and then asking her out is what I prefer. It's also exactly what happened with my ex.

 

Once our first date started, everything just flowed so smoothly it felt like we were already in a relationship. The fact that we were "friends" first for several months made interacting with her so natural. That was the first time I've ever experienced that.

 

If your one relationship started from being friendly and building rapport over months preceding the beginning of dating, why are you so adamant about avoiding friendship?

 

If you were similar friends with 3-7 different women at the same time, maybe even women of different ages and body types, can you see that a relationship with one would be more likely to naturally flow from that sort of social give and take than trying to hit on pretty girls you just met?

[xxoo]

I've posted about two girls that I'm interested in and will be talking to next week. How about some advice on what I should say to them and what I should focus on?

 

Keep building rapport. Compliment something. Act happy to see them! Talk about some plans you have for the upcoming month, and if she shows interest, you add, "It's really fantastic. I'd love to take you."

[xxoo]

It wasn't my fault she didn't stick around.

 

It was her desire and her right to end it. That isn't "fault".

 

Getting a girlfriend isn't the hardest part

[somedude81]

If your one relationship started from being friendly and building rapport over months preceding the beginning of dating, why are you so adamant about avoiding friendship?

Because in the end I always get hurt.

 

Even though she had a boyfriend at the time I was starting to develop feeling for her before we started dating. And we didn't even talk outside of class.

 

The final day of class we walked to the bus stop and talked for about ten minutes. I gave her a hug and truly thought that was the last time I would ever see her. She had a boyfriend and it wouldn't be right to stay in touch. So I felt really sad saying bye to her.

 

enigma32 was right that I got lucky and that she dumped her boyfriend and then got in contact with me.

 

In an earlier post you I believe you asked if I can fall for girls who aren't my type if I talk to them/spend time with them enough and the answer is yes.

 

If you were similar friends with 3-7 different women at the same time, maybe even women of different ages and body types, can you see that a relationship with one would be more likely to naturally flow from that sort of social give and take than trying to hit on pretty girls you just met?

 

What's the point of mentioning different ages? Everybody I meet is in college.

 

As for body types, I just have more fun talking to girls I'm attracted to. There isn't anything I can do about that.

 

Regarding hitting on pretty girls I just met, you should know by now that that's not my style at all. But people on this forum are suggesting that I start doing so. Since I wanted a girlfriend yesterday, it doesn't make sense to wait months to ask somebody out a few months down the line. Though I don't know if it would make a difference or not.

 

Things were super easy with my ex because she developed feelings for me before we started dating. But that was also the first time in my entire life that a woman who met my bare minimum physical standards liked me. I really can't just hope it happens again. Sigh.

 

Keep building rapport. Compliment something. Act happy to see them! Talk about some plans you have for the upcoming month, and if she shows interest, you add, "It's really fantastic. I'd love to take you."

Ok, I'll keep building rapport and throw in a compliment. I'm always happy to see girls I like

 

I don't know of any future events though. I'll have to look around and see what's out there. I just got back from a Pirate themed thing in my city but it was much smaller than I expected. Not really exciting to talk about.

[somedude81]

It was her desire and her right to end it. That isn't "fault".

 

Getting a girlfriend isn't the hardest part

 

Nor was it my fault.

 

I had absolutely nothing to do with the break up. I can't be blamed.

 

That's why I take offense when people point out that the relationship was short or that she didn't stick around for a long time. They are trying to say that I screwed up, when that is absolutely not the case. Getting dumped was something that happened to me for reasons I had absolutely no control over.

 

And yes, I do blame her and I'm still mad at her. I will most likely continue to feel that way until I can replace her.

[xxoo]

Because in the end I always get hurt.

 

Not that time! That time, you got a girlfriend!

 

If you were friends with a few different people, ALL your focus would not be on one person. You'd be less invested in each, more natural, and probably have better results. And there would be more chance that one of them would develop interest in you, both by the numbers and by the way your interactions would be more relaxed on your end

 

In an earlier post you I believe you asked if I can fall for girls who aren't my type if I talk to them/spend time with them enough and the answer is yes.

 

Then why don't you try spending time with the women who DO show interest in you, and see if you in fact fall for one of them, even though you were not initially attracted?

 

 

 

What's the point of mentioning different ages? Everybody I meet is in college.

 

As for body types, I just have more fun talking to girls I'm attracted to. There isn't anything I can do about that.

 

You are 33 and in college. I graduated at 30, and there were students older than me. I can not believe that all the women on campus are early 20s.

 

 

I don't know of any future events though. I'll have to look around and see what's out there.

 

Do that. Rule number one about getting women interested is be interesting. Have things going you. Have plans!

[xxoo]

Nor was it my fault.

 

I had absolutely nothing to do with the break up. I can't be blamed.

 

That's why I take offense when people point out that the relationship was short or that she didn't stick around for a long time. They are trying to say that I screwed up, when that is absolutely not the case. Getting dumped was something that happened to me for reasons I had absolutely no control over.

 

And yes, I do blame her and I'm still mad at her. I will most likely continue to feel that way until I can replace her.

 

As long as you hold onto the victim identity, you'll remain a victim.

 

Do you want a lasting relationship? Then obviously you need to do somethings differently to achieve that. You didn't necessarily "screw up", but you do have to develop yourself into the kind of man a woman would want at her side through life's challenges.

[xxoo]

As for body types, I just have more fun talking to girls I'm attracted to. There isn't anything I can do about that.

 

This makes me sad. Some of my best life experiences have been with people I did not want to sleep with. I've learned so much, shared so many laughs, and gotten so much wonderful support and advice from people whose bodies were not sexy to me.

 

You are really, really missing out on some of the best stuff life has to offer by being so fixated on sex

[BlueIris]

Nor was it my fault.

 

I had absolutely nothing to do with the break up. I can't be blamed.

 

That's why I take offense when people point out that the relationship was short or that she didn't stick around for a long time. They are trying to say that I screwed up, when that is absolutely not the case. Getting dumped was something that happened to me for reasons I had absolutely no control over.

 

And yes, I do blame her and I'm still mad at her. I will most likely continue to feel that way until I can replace her.

 

Nonsense. True for everyone: Someone breaks up with you and you have no idea why and didn't see it coming? That itself is very strong evidence that you had not established a deeper connection, and didn't even know and understand her. Refusal to examine one's role in a failed relationship is yet another interpersonal skills issue, and recipe for stagnation.

 

You can stick your fingers in your ears and say, "no, no, no, no" all you want. But as the years tick by, the majority of women are growing and learning about themselves and relationship skills, and it's only going to get tougher for you.

Edited September 22, 2014 by BlueIris

[KaliLove]

Nor was it my fault.

 

I had absolutely nothing to do with the break up. I can't be blamed.

 

That's why I take offense when people point out that the relationship was short or that she didn't stick around for a long time. They are trying to say that I screwed up, when that is absolutely not the case. Getting dumped was something that happened to me for reasons I had absolutely no control over.

 

And yes, I do blame her and I'm still mad at her. I will most likely continue to feel that way until I can replace her.

 

If you were perfect, why do you think she broke up with you? Never mind whatever BS reason she gave you. Why do YOU think it happened?

[serial muse]

Hate to tell you this, but there is a name for most guys with a bunch of female "friends" that arent hoping one day that these friends will give them a crack...They are called homosexuals..

 

I dont care what anyone says....Most guys that have female friends usually secretly hope one day they are going to wind up in a sexual encounter of some kind..I know women dont like to hear this and its kind of objectifying, but its mostly true..Not that these guys are going to get creepy or anything, and I know this wouldnt likely be something that any woman would say up front, but if the woman came right out at the outset of the friendship and said something like "you know, pal, just realize that you will NEVER get anywhere with me"..I wouldn't in the least bit be surprised if the guy doesnt move forward on being that persons true friend..

 

.02

 

TFY

 

TFY, it helps if you follow the whole conversation there before you reply. In this post, I was specifically responding to carhill, who said that SD has suggested he had platonic female friends in the past. And my point was that those "platonic" female friends weren't. So, you're actually agreeing with me. No need for this snarky "hate to tell you this" stuff.

 

That said, I don't think you should speak for all men when it comes to whether or not they find value in women as friends. And there's a big difference between finding female friends attractive and only being friends with them in the hopes that you'll get in their pants.

[somedude81]

If you were perfect, why do you think she broke up with you? Never mind whatever BS reason she gave you.

 

This thread is starting to focus too much on my ex, which is not something I want to talk about.

 

So I will answer this one last question.

 

Why do YOU think it happened?

 

Because she wasn't ready to be in another serious relationship so soon after exiting one.

 

She was with her boyfriend from 17 to 20.

 

Breaks up with him and then starts dating me three weeks later.

 

Several months down the line she realizes that something is off her feelings, she's not where she should be emotionally, she's not completely detached from the guy before me and realizes that she needs to be single.

 

She would have dumped anybody. Unfortunately it was me.

[carhill]

Well, those platonic female friends were nothing of the kind - he has also said that he was "friends" with them in the sense that he hoped it would turn into something more. Sure, he's cutting out the middle man now, by not even trying to befriend them on the path to more. But they were never friendships for the sake of friendship. So, I stand by my assertion.

 

Reading minds again?

 

 

 

He has certainly said that he has difficulty with shy women, in that they are less likely to indicate interest and that, for him, is too difficult to interpret. If you read my post carefully, you'll note that I did not say that somedude would refuse to date a woman who's shy (or refuse to have contact with them). Those are not words I used. I simply said that he won't date them. Why? Because they're too much work.

 

And he himself has also acknowledged that he believes that friendship is a natural state for women but not so much for men. I find it hard to believe that anyone, man or woman, would support him in that way of thinking.

 

Citation? Search the thread. There's nothing. Prove it! You're stating your own perceptions as facts. Poor debating tactics.

[Teknoe]

So you keep saying. The truth is, you don't know why she didn't stick around, because she didn't care enough to talk to you about it before she split.

 

 

 

You ask for advice, then you say you don't want to talk about that advice. Having friends is a big deal. I wouldn't date a woman who had no friends and I wouldn't expect any woman with options to date a guy who had no friends.

 

 

 

I have read enough of your threads to see that you ignore, argue with, or belittle every decent piece of advice you are given.

 

 

 

There is not some magical thing you can say to a woman to make her want to date you. You aren't getting the advice you want because it doesn't exist. You can't just say this thing to a pretty girl, and have her overlook your shortcomings and decide to date you, just because you said that magical thing. If you get really lucky, you might be able to talk a girl into dating you, but somewhere down the road, she will most likely do what your ex did. Leave.

 

You want dating advice? Here it is. Be a better person. This is the advice people have been giving you, which you keep ignoring.

 

You want women to notice you in school? Quit failing your classes. My English teacher complimented me in class recently over some comments I made about some reading we had to do. I immediately noticed some pretty young girl eyeing me across the room. I am not a great looking guy. Would she have noticed me if I didn't find some way to stand out? Probably not.

 

You want to be able to attract a pretty young girl with options? You need to step it up. Plenty of guys are after those women. Taller, better looking guys with good jobs. You can't become taller, but you can do a lot. Rock school. Quit failing and kick its azz. Work your behind off to make sure you get a good job. Yes, that includes networking. Networking=a reason to talk to/befriend people even when sex isn't an option. Yes, that includes guy friends. One of my best friends got into his career because I helped him.

 

There is so much more. You have threads full of good advice. You should be pouring over them. Or, you can just keep telling people not to give you their good advice, and just keep asking what you should say to some random girl no one here knows.

 

 

Best post in this entire topic so far, hands down.

 

Topic creator would be wise to reread the above, and let it stew for a while. Life and learning how to have and maintain healthy relationships is a process. You can't skip steps. Well, you can, but when you do, look where it gets you.

[somedude81]

TFY, it helps if you follow the whole conversation there before you reply. In this post, I was specifically responding to carhill, who said that SD has suggested he had platonic female friends in the past. And my point was that those "platonic" female friends weren't. So, you're actually agreeing with me. No need for this snarky "hate to tell you this" stuff.

 

That said, I don't think you should speak for all men when it comes to whether or not they find value in women as friends. And there's a big difference between finding female friends attractive and only being friends with them in the hopes that you'll get in their pants.

 

You seem to have missed a post of mine which was actually directed at you. Here you go

 

On the contrary, I've become friends with several girls in the past that I had no interest in. I just thought they were cool and we had common interests.

 

Trouble started to happen when we would spend a significant amount of time together and I would start to develop feelings.

 

 

 

 

 

Saying that I won't date shy girls because I can't interpret their signals of interest is a really odd conclusion to come to. That's like me saying that you won't eat beef because you can't kill a cow with your hands and it's too much work.

 

Doesn't make any sense does it?

 

That said, of course I'd date a shy girl if I can figure out that she likes me.

 

Feel free to reply after you've read my post.

[thefooloftheyear]

TFY, it helps if you follow the whole conversation there before you reply. In this post, I was specifically responding to carhill, who said that SD has suggested he had platonic female friends in the past. And my point was that those "platonic" female friends weren't. So, you're actually agreeing with me. No need for this snarky "hate to tell you this" stuff.

 

That said, I don't think you should speak for all men when it comes to whether or not they find value in women as friends. And there's a big difference between finding female friends attractive and only being friends with them in the hopes that you'll get in their pants.

 

No where did I state that I speak for all men..I have no idea how you can make that leap...Just pointed out something about how men interact with women who are "so called" firends...And as a man, ill always have a better perspective on this than you or any other woman ever will-with all due respect...It might be the same as me telling you what its like to have menstrual cramps....but I dont know...Point is as I read your post/replies I can sense that you really dont have a good handle on how the male mind works..But thats only my opinion...if I am wrong Ill stand corrected...

 

 

Healthy heterosexual men rarely have a variety of platonic female friends..I have a wide variety of male friends and none have any female friends that I have ever heard them speak of or see hanging around..Heck, I have somehow managed to survive a long time, never had any trouble attracting/interacting with women in a relationship sense, got married-had a kid, yet never had any true female friends in my entire life except long time admin/personal asst..(she has worked for me for years and is like a sister)..

 

I guess i just quarrel with those that say a guy like SD needs to have female friends to start to be successful with women...I am saying in no way is that really necessary...He can if he wants to, but it wont help him or make him any more or less attractive than he is right now..His problems have nothing to do with that...

 

TFY

Edited September 22, 2014 by thefooloftheyear

[somedude81]

So you keep saying. The truth is, you don't know why she didn't stick around, because she didn't care enough to talk to you about it before she split.

 

 

 

You ask for advice, then you say you don't want to talk about that advice. Having friends is a big deal. I wouldn't date a woman who had no friends and I wouldn't expect any woman with options to date a guy who had no friends.

 

 

 

I have read enough of your threads to see that you ignore, argue with, or belittle every decent piece of advice you are given.

 

 

 

There is not some magical thing you can say to a woman to make her want to date you. You aren't getting the advice you want because it doesn't exist. You can't just say this thing to a pretty girl, and have her overlook your shortcomings and decide to date you, just because you said that magical thing. If you get really lucky, you might be able to talk a girl into dating you, but somewhere down the road, she will most likely do what your ex did. Leave.

 

You want dating advice? Here it is. Be a better person. This is the advice people have been giving you, which you keep ignoring.

 

You want women to notice you in school? Quit failing your classes. My English teacher complimented me in class recently over some comments I made about some reading we had to do. I immediately noticed some pretty young girl eyeing me across the room. I am not a great looking guy. Would she have noticed me if I didn't find some way to stand out? Probably not.

 

You want to be able to attract a pretty young girl with options? You need to step it up. Plenty of guys are after those women. Taller, better looking guys with good jobs. You can't become taller, but you can do a lot. Rock school. Quit failing and kick its azz. Work your behind off to make sure you get a good job. Yes, that includes networking. Networking=a reason to talk to/befriend people even when sex isn't an option. Yes, that includes guy friends. One of my best friends got into his career because I helped him.

 

There is so much more. You have threads full of good advice. You should be pouring over them. Or, you can just keep telling people not to give you their good advice, and just keep asking what you should say to some random girl no one here knows.

 

And now it makes sense, especially after reading your post in R3D2's thread. You actually don't have a clue how dating works. You don't have any real advice to give. But you have no trouble getting women, you say, so of course you know what you're doing. The answer is that all this stuff just comes natural to you. You don't have to work at all. You just be yourself and stuff just happens.

 

Unfortunately that doesn't happen for some of us. Certainly not me.

 

The only classes I really struggled at were math related. I've gotten A's and B's in many other classes. Guess how many women offered to by my FWB or follow me around offering me BJ's in the parking lot. Zero. And yes, I've had professors acknowledge me in class.

 

Of course I'm trying to be a better person. But that is the most generic, useless advice to give in the entire planet. You could literally post "Be a better person" in every single thread on this forum. Guess how people would take that.

 

LuckyLady13 actually gave me some really good advice a few days ago.

 

How come she could give me advice on what to do when you couldn't?

[ascendotum]

If you were perfect, why do you think she broke up with you? Never mind whatever BS reason she gave you. Why do YOU think it happened?

 

Woah, there can be a big gulf between not doing anything wrong and being perfect. If he was perfect for her should would not have dumped him, but that does not mean he did stupid things to turn her off him, or didn't do the typical things needed to sustain a relationship. There are a lot of relationship breakup stories on here and its rare for the person telling the story to take blame. Sometimes they are oblivious to their own flaws, but other times the other person changes or were misguided in hoping the other person would change or they never saw the relationship as being anything serious long term.

 

His gf was 20-21, a lot of change goes on peoples lives around that time. She could have easily have liked him at face value when she first met him + maybe she was also a bit down in confidence at the time + also unhappy with her current bf and not wanting to be alone, monkey branched to SD, without giving any real thought to what she wanted in relationship just that her current bf wasn't doing it for her. Six months later her confidence is higher and the initial excitement of the honeymoon phase is over with SD, she starts to evaluate things, she's got to know him a lot better and decides her needs are not being met, but she doesn't tell SD what she really wants or how he is falling short in her expectations. Sure he could have maybe impressed her more if he did this did that or talked of bigger plans for the future or showed her a more exciting life, but that does not necessarily mean he ****ed up. Lots of older guys/women with younger girls/guys relationships don't go the distance and it more often than not, the younger person's restlessness for experiencing more in life than the older person not behaving like the ideal bf/gf.also ones person's ideal might not be another's and often young people really don't know what they do /dont want until they experience it.

[suladas]

This thread is starting to focus too much on my ex, which is not something I want to talk about.

 

So I will answer this one last question.

 

 

 

Because she wasn't ready to be in another serious relationship so soon after exiting one.

 

She was with her boyfriend from 17 to 20.

 

Breaks up with him and then starts dating me three weeks later.

 

Several months down the line she realizes that something is off her feelings, she's not where she should be emotionally, she's not completely detached from the guy before me and realizes that she needs to be single.

 

She would have dumped anybody. Unfortunately it was me.

 

That is the EXACT definition of a rebound...........

[Anela]

Reading minds again?

 

 

 

 

 

Citation? Search the thread. There's nothing. Prove it! You're stating your own perceptions as facts. Poor debating tactics.

 

Hey, she isn't attacking him here. He has said that he sees no point in having friends, and people - myself included - have mentioned how friends can not only be good for him, but also help him to find a girlfriend!

 

What if the girl he doesn't think is cute (now) likes him romantically? What if he becomes friends with her, and ends up thinking she IS cute, and they have a nice relationship?

 

He could also benefit from just having her as a friend.

[somedude81]

His gf was 20-21, a lot of change goes on peoples lives around that time. She could have easily have liked him at face value when she first met him + maybe she was also a bit down in confidence at the time + also unhappy with her current bf and not wanting to be alone, monkey branched to SD, without giving any real thought to what she wanted in relationship just that her current bf wasn't doing it for her. Six months later her confidence is higher and the initial excitement of the honeymoon phase is over with SD, she starts to evaluate things, she's got to know him a lot better and decides her needs are not being met, but she doesn't tell SD what she really wants or how he is falling short in her expectations. Sure he could have maybe impressed her more if he did this did that or talked of bigger plans for the future or showed her a more exciting life, but that does not necessarily mean he ****ed up.

 

The bold is brilliant. It's actually something I thought of before but didn't really know how to express it and also thought I may have been a bit out there.

 

So here's what's up.

 

She was with him for three years. The last year and a half the relationship was toxic. She was unhappy and being emotionally abused by him. She had low self-esteem and confidence.

 

Many women seem to have trouble leaving these types of relationships for reasons I don't really understand.

 

She meets me and after time getting to know me, she falls for me. I become the motivation for her to leave her toxic relationship. If she didn't meet me, there is a very good chance that she would still be with him right now and be very unhappy.

 

Through lots of support, understanding, compliments and just being an awesome boyfriend, I help build up her confidence. This became very apparent in how she behaved in bed at the start of our relationship and how she was towards the end.

 

So after dating me for a few months, she has higher self-esteem, she's happy, though she feels that something is off with her feelings. She's not as attached as she thinks she should be. She realizes that she doesn't need a man in her life to be happy; and I get the axe. Now she's truly single for the first time in her life since she developed breasts.

 

Essentially I rescued her, fixed her up through love and support, and then she ran away.

Edited September 22, 2014 by somedude81

[Lani]

Hey, she isn't attacking him here. He has said that he sees no point in having friends, and people - myself included - have mentioned how friends can not only be good for him, but also help him to find a girlfriend!

 

What if the girl he doesn't think is cute (now) likes him romantically? What if he becomes friends with her, and ends up thinking she IS cute, and they have a nice relationship?

 

He could also benefit from just having her as a friend.

 

But the thing is Anela that he doesn't want friends. Period. Because they won't have sex with him. Which is so beyond ridiculous it's not even funny. anymore.

 

It's this inherent attitude that is holding him back, yet he refuses to see it.

How can one seriously expect to hold down a relationship with a woman when they can't even be bothered maintaining a friendship?

 

Like you say, he could benefit from having her (hypothetical her) as a friend. However he won't see that because no sex = no benefit.

[Lani]

The bold is brilliant. It's actually something I thought of before but didn't really know how to express it and also thought I may have been a bit out there.

 

So here's what's up.

 

She was with him for three years. The last year and a half the relationship was toxic. She was unhappy and being emotionally abused by him. She had low self-esteem and confidence.

 

Many women seem to have trouble leaving these types of relationships for reasons I don't really understand.

 

She meets me and after time getting to know me, she falls for me. I become the motivation for her to leave her toxic relationship. If she didn't meet me, there is a very good chance that she would still be with him right now and be very unhappy.

 

Through lots of support, understanding, compliments and just being an awesome boyfriend, I help build up her confidence. This became very apparent in how she behaved in bed at the start of our relationship and how she was towards the end.

 

So after dating me for a few months, she has higher self-esteem, she's happy, though she feels that something is off with her feelings. She's not as attached as she thinks she should be. She realizes that she doesn't need a man in her life to be happy; and I get the axe. Now she's truly single for the first time in her life since she developed breasts.

 

Essentially I rescued her, fixed her up through love and support, and then she ran away.

 

Or.. in short.. you were a rebound.