Allowing wife a lesbian fling?

[pleasestandup]

I've been married for 15 years and have 3 kids. I love my wife and family, and have a good friendship with my wife and we are a happy normal family. I'm 41, in good shape, successful, well groomed and consider myself to be a pretty good looking man for my age. Over the last 10 years though, sex happens less than I would like (3-4 times a month) and I've tried to keep it interesting and always please her in bed. She enjoys herself (at least she orgasms) but I can tell she is basically not into it very much. This is probably TMI, but she is grossed out by my semen, rare BJ's and doesn't like to kiss me (always first to pull away), all of which makes me feel unwanted. She often sleeps in the kids bed leaving me all alone, and I'm emotionally neglected most of the time. She rarely snuggles up to me or anything like that anymore and I miss it. I suspected she did not want to sleep near me for fear of me initiating sex, so I made an arrangement that I will not "please myself" or initiate sex and leave it totally up to her. (Got the idea on a website called Devotional Sex) This has actually helped a lot, but has the side effect of making me feel very submissive to her now. To me, these submissive feelings are better than feeling neglected, and our intimacy has improved. I give her credit for "doing her duty" as a wife and I toil that maybe I should just be happy with the status quo. Sometimes I wish I had no libido like her, but I digress.

 

Now here is where I might be going off the deep end and need some advice..

 

She claims she is just not that horny anymore, which I know is common for women in 40's. I've had discussions with her about her maybe being bisexual (or even lesbian), just trying to understand why she's not horny for me anymore. She admitted to some fantasies about it, but says she would never act on those feelings. When we watch porn together though she always chooses lesbian porn though. I don't know why she cant open up to me, I would never judge her. She has a close friend that I suspect she is emotionally close with. I've seen a few texts to her that are like "he is out of town, so come on over ;)". Nothing explicit but the wink is kind of suggestive to me, but maybe I am reading into it too much! She had never cheated on me (that I know of) so I trust her.

 

This morning, she mentioned on her next business trip she asked her friend to join her, and my stomach clinched. Am I jumping to conclusions here? This makes me jealous because I think they will have sex together. The strange thing is it also turns me on too, especially since our relationship has this light submissive aspect to it where she is in control now. I would feel humiliated, but I think I would somehow be ok with it if wasn't behind my back. I want her to be happy too, and if she has desires I cant fullfill I don't want to deny her that. I am even open to a threesome, but doubt she would go for this. I feel like a freak for even thinking this. Maybe this is just two friends going on a platonic vacation, and is totally normal. I have not asked her about her relationship with this woman, since I might be wrong (and I'm sure she will say I'm wrong anyway). I'm tempted to bring up this subject though and actually give her permission to have an affair if that's what she wants, as long as she is open with me about it.

 

Am I nieve to think allowing her to have a lesbian affair would not ruin our marriage long term? Does this kind of arrangement ever happen in long term couples, like a wife taking a lesbian lover but not divorcing her husband? My thought is that she would appreciate the guilt-free gift I am offering her and maybe re-ignite the spark in our love life.

 

Looking for a females perspective here. My guy friends say I should call her out and divorce her if she is having an affair. This is the last thing I want! I love this woman and would do anything for her. Would she lose all respect for me if I offer her this "free pass"?

 

Thanks

[Mr. Lucky]

so I made an arrangement that I will not "please myself" or initiate sex and leave it totally up to her. (Got the idea on a website called Devotional Sex)

You've simply traded one set of problems for another, with those new issues currently feeling less onerous because they have a novelty factor.

 

Doesn't seem like a solution to me but neither does allowing your wife to cheat with someone else, male or female. You're doing an awful lot of work to avoid addressing the central issue in your marriage...

 

Mr. Lucky

[jchere]

I found out my wife had an affair about 8 weeks ago. Just a one night thing and we are now doing well and working on repairing our relationship. Part of my problem was my wife's lack of a sex drive, or at least her inhibitions. We had fantastic sex if we got away from things, like a multi day holiday somewhere with nothing to do, and a fair amount of alcohol. At home it was not regular and similar to your situation, she was a great wife by insuring I was taken care of. She would give me a HJ anytime but our sex life became a bit mechanical. I think she felt she was doing her duty, I thought I was not bothering her not interested in sex life. I was willing to live with that, I loved her. So you can imagine my shock when I here she went and had sex with a guy. As my grown up kids pointed out after looking on FB, that the guy was ugly and slightly overweight. My wife and I are both fit and attractive. We have since got a sex therapist and we are dealing with our sexual relationship. We have a long ways to go but it is wonderful.

My comment to you would be you need to find your sexual fulfillment and so does your wife. You need to talk about it and talk about it now. Do it in the sense of asking what would it take for you and her, together and individually, to have full sex lives? Start with fantasy, move to lesbian tendencies. Do not let it fester like I did! You may be wrong and if you are then maybe it will jolt her into realizing you need her to sexually satisfied too. If you are right then she needs to test that water and you should know about it. Perhaps you cannot save the marriage but just talk and talk openly.

[carhill]

Not even getting into the lesbian affair thing, was your adherence to the 'devotional sex' principles reflected in increased 'devotion' by her outside of the bedroom, meaning affection and emotional intimacy?

 

For this to work out, IMO, there should be work on both sides and bend (healthy compromise) on both sides.

 

Personally, if I were faced with your dilemma now, knowing what I know about marriages, I'd have that FL100 down at the court as soon as I found things going sideways with no attempts at bend. When a woman loves a man and wants to be married to him, there's no ambiguity. Accept no substitutes.

 

She can have the lesbian affair while being the respondent in a divorce lawsuit. Perhaps it will assuage her stress. Good luck!

[Toodamnpragmatic]

Most things are okay to good in the marriage and sex is much more important to us and we let our spouse control it. Then we wonder if the sex we do get is just obligational sex and if the spouse O's we at least have that.

 

Not easy.....

[whichwayisup]

Cheating is cheating, it doesn't matter if it's with another man or another woman, she would be (or has been) going against her marriage vows.

 

It's bad enough not only is sex rare, but hand holding, cuddling, kissing, any form of intimacy is gone. And, her sleeping the kids bed is a bad idea! Kids shouldn't have to share their beds with their parents, even more if she is doing this to not share a bed with you.

 

She admitted to some fantasies about it, but says she would never act on those feelings. When we watch porn together though she always chooses lesbian porn though. I don't know why she cant open up to me, I would never judge her. She has a close friend that I suspect she is emotionally close with. I've seen a few texts to her that are like "he is out of town, so come on over ".

 

Talk to her about this and also let her know that you are NOT comfortable with her going away with this woman. Tell her something feels off and if she plans on or has been cheating on you, it's got to stop immediately! (DO NOT mention that it kind of turns you on and you'd possibly do a 3 some, that's a door you shouldn't open at this point in your marriage, you two have so many other issues to deal with, adding another person to your bedroom will only complicate things on so many levels!)

 

Tell her that you won't be putting up any cheating and if she is or has, you need to know the truth no matter what.

[central]

I think you're going about handling this backwards. Rather than be submissive and wait for her to initiate, take the lead. Read "No More Mr. Nice Guy" and perhpas "The Five Love Languages" and work through the latter with her.

 

Do NOT accept any cheating, same sex or otherwise. In circumstances where you want sex and she does not, and if you have not found any other solution (including marriage counselling and hormone testing), the next step would be to propose an open marriage where YOU get to have sex with someone else since she does not want to. Catering to her every whim when you should be growing a pair will only make your situation worse, and you'll get even less sex and/or be cuckolded.

[pleasestandup]

Thanks for the insightful replies. It helps to have an impartial viewpoint on this. I have tried so many things, I'm really getting desperate (if thats not obvious by now). I bought that book suggested and will read it over the next few days to see if that helps. At the end of the day, I don't think she really loves me the same way and that may be my fault for not being the alpha male. I've become too accommodating to her needs and lost my balls in the process.

 

A big problem is my self esteem is damaged from being neglected for so long. I feel so unsexy with her, and I cant express my desire for her without being made to feel like a horn dog. Even though we started this dev sex thing a few months ago, its really been very similar over last 10 years with her calling most of the shots. At least now, part of the deal is I can massage her which is nice for both of us. But to answer the question above, its all one sided. She has changed very little in her behavior towards me, and not lived up to her role in Dev Sex. Interestingly, I think this is why it feels good to be her sub since I have such low self esteem now. The comments above really are true about not addressing the real problem.

 

I hope she's not a lesbian, and that there is some hope for me if I can "man up" and get her to dig me again. I know women love it how an alpha male can make them feel, and at this point I'm completely broken in! I used to be so confident but its gone now! I realize I need to work on myself first, because I am sick of being the "nice guy". I could've lived with being her sub and having sex once every two weeks, but you are all right, the idea of her cheating is really too much.

 

Thanks again for listening, this has been very therapeutic for me to express in writing.

[oldshirt]

I have an extensive background in swing and I am all for 3somes and women exploring their bisexuality but this has absolutely nothing to do with bisexuality or lesbian fantasies or porn etc at all.

 

This is purely a loss of desire and attraction issue.

 

I hate to break it to you but putting her in charge of the bedroom and you becoming passive and submissive is the absolute WORST thing you could do at this point.

 

What your capitulation and surrender has done is reduced the whining and arguing, it hasn't increased her desire.

 

Her respect and desire for you is probably decreasing by the day and you handing her over to another woman is just going to accellerate that process. It would just be a matter of time before the generosity with the duty-sex stops and you'll be one of these guys on here whining you haven't had sex in the last year.

 

Delete this devotional sex website from your computer and check out "Married Man Sexlife" and sign up on the forums there and get the books by Athol Kay.

 

In a nutshell you need to be becoming more assertive and taking more initiative and leadership in the home and in the bedroom and thise books and website are a good resource to help you do that.

[oldshirt]

A few other points -

 

- I agree with getting "No More Mr Nice Guy". But do get the Athol Kay books ASAP. The books compliment each other and the folks over at MMSL reference 'nice guy' a lot.

 

- her contacting this friend when you are out of town or going to conference with her likely means they are hitting the clubs and getting hit on by dudes more than it does doughnut-bumping on each other.

 

- the 'Love Languages' book is good for actual relationship issues and break downs, but it doesn't address issues like attraction or desire. Nothing you have said indicates she doesn't feel loved or appreciated or connected but rather a loss of desire and attraction.

 

- women cannot respect men that they can manipulate, dominate and control. And they cannot desire men they do not respect. Hense she cannot desire you if she can control and dominate you.

 

- No more Mister Nice Guy will help you address the manipulation issue and the passive/submissive issue and "Married Man Sexlife Primer" and "The Mindfull Attraction Plan" will help you address the attraction issue.

 

- put and end to her in the kids bed IMMEDIATELY. If she wants to be a wife, she needs to sleep in the marital bed period. If she goes to read them a story and falls asleep, wake her ass up and haul her back to bed.

If she insists on sleeping in other beds then have her hand over her wedding rings and get her own apartment and then she can sleep wherever she wants.

[Popsicle]

More than likely you are just fantasizing.

[Toodamnpragmatic]

Stop the sub and the massages. I hate the words alpha & beta, but yep be a man.

 

As for her being attracted to a female or being a lesbian, face it that you don't have the equipment to battle that if that is really her feelings. However right now it is all conjecture (because of the lack of sex and response) and you are letting your mind wander....

[Mr. Lucky]

I could've lived with being her sub and having sex once every two weeks, but you are all right, the idea of her cheating is really too much.

I'm unclear as to how encouraging her to have a lesbian affair, whether or not it's in her wheelhouse, helps or benefits you?

 

What did you hope to get out of it ???

 

Mr. Lucky

[dclan]

I've been married for 15 years and have 3 kids. I love my wife and family, and have a good friendship with my wife and we are a happy normal family. I'm 41, in good shape, successful, well groomed and consider myself to be a pretty good looking man for my age. Over the last 10 years though, sex happens less than I would like (3-4 times a month) and I've tried to keep it interesting and always please her in bed. She enjoys herself (at least she orgasms) but I can tell she is basically not into it very much. This is probably TMI, but she is grossed out by my semen, rare BJ's and doesn't like to kiss me (always first to pull away), all of which makes me feel unwanted. She often sleeps in the kids bed leaving me all alone, and I'm emotionally neglected most of the time. She rarely snuggles up to me or anything like that anymore and I miss it. I suspected she did not want to sleep near me for fear of me initiating sex, so I made an arrangement that I will not "please myself" or initiate sex and leave it totally up to her. (Got the idea on a website called Devotional Sex) This has actually helped a lot, but has the side effect of making me feel very submissive to her now. To me, these submissive feelings are better than feeling neglected, and our intimacy has improved. I give her credit for "doing her duty" as a wife and I toil that maybe I should just be happy with the status quo. Sometimes I wish I had no libido like her, but I digress.

 

Now here is where I might be going off the deep end and need some advice..

 

She claims she is just not that horny anymore, which I know is common for women in 40's. I've had discussions with her about her maybe being bisexual (or even lesbian), just trying to understand why she's not horny for me anymore. She admitted to some fantasies about it, but says she would never act on those feelings. When we watch porn together though she always chooses lesbian porn though. I don't know why she cant open up to me, I would never judge her. She has a close friend that I suspect she is emotionally close with. I've seen a few texts to her that are like "he is out of town, so come on over ;)". Nothing explicit but the wink is kind of suggestive to me, but maybe I am reading into it too much! She had never cheated on me (that I know of) so I trust her.

 

This morning, she mentioned on her next business trip she asked her friend to join her, and my stomach clinched. Am I jumping to conclusions here? This makes me jealous because I think they will have sex together. The strange thing is it also turns me on too, especially since our relationship has this light submissive aspect to it where she is in control now. I would feel humiliated, but I think I would somehow be ok with it if wasn't behind my back. I want her to be happy too, and if she has desires I cant fullfill I don't want to deny her that. I am even open to a threesome, but doubt she would go for this. I feel like a freak for even thinking this. Maybe this is just two friends going on a platonic vacation, and is totally normal. I have not asked her about her relationship with this woman, since I might be wrong (and I'm sure she will say I'm wrong anyway). I'm tempted to bring up this subject though and actually give her permission to have an affair if that's what she wants, as long as she is open with me about it.

 

Am I nieve to think allowing her to have a lesbian affair would not ruin our marriage long term? Does this kind of arrangement ever happen in long term couples, like a wife taking a lesbian lover but not divorcing her husband? My thought is that she would appreciate the guilt-free gift I am offering her and maybe re-ignite the spark in our love life.

 

Looking for a females perspective here. My guy friends say I should call her out and divorce her if she is having an affair. This is the last thing I want! I love this woman and would do anything for her. Would she lose all respect for me if I offer her this "free pass"?

 

Thanks

 

A woman also posted a similar topic....about her being married to her husband for a long time, and having sexual desires for women.

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/marriage-life-partnerships/493932-how-do-i-leave-my-husband-without-hurting-him

 

You may find some insight there.....probably the same situation, from the woman's perspective. Might help you understand a bit.

 

In fact given the close dates of both your posts, I actually wonder is she is your wife posting

[JamesM]

I am guessing that she is already pursuing the lesbian angle to see if that is the problem. And if it isn't, then my guess is that she will determine it is your marriage.

 

But standing back and letting her suggest when sex will be...trust me, that doesn't work if she has no interest in sex with men or you. Short term maybe. Long term no. It is like a relief for her. No pressure.

 

You have a choice. Fight for her or let her go.

[pleasestandup]

The last few days has been so enlightening. I've read "Married Man Sex Life Primer 2011" and "5 love languages", and I want to thank you for help!

 

Reading them opened my eyes to what the problems really are, and found myself in strong agreement to the conclusions in MMSL! It was so refreshing and I feel empowered now. I wish I had known about this 10 years ago, seriously.

 

I think its interesting how my turning to Devotional Sex signaled the low point in my marriage. I hit rock bottom so to speak, with how I viewed my self. Now I am determined to be the kind of man I want to be and get in touch with my Alpha traits again. A high value male that knows how to stimulate dopamine in women. Athol Kay is ****ing brilliant and probably has saved my marriage.

 

My take after reading his book:

Anyone struggling with low self esteem in their marriage (like i was) and not getting sex every few days needs to read this book now and follow his advice. The reality is that if you don't step it up, your wife will be drawn to another man because you are not giving her what she needs. It's not her fault, once you understand she is biologically drawn to alpha males. If she tells you she's not into sex anymore its because you don't turn her on anymore as a beta male. She will meet an alpha male someday and that dopamine will be like crack to her, and then your toast. Fight for her by becoming that man she wants! The alternative is you do nothing, and both live in an unhappy marriage, wondering where the passion went. Its only been a week and I already have seen great response from my wife. Laid three times this week!

 

By the way, I booked tickets to go with her on her business trip and she's glad Im going with her instead of her friend.

Edited September 22, 2014 by pleasestandup