She knows but doesn't care? [update- wife knows for certain]

[AlwaysGrowing]

Here's the thing. Most (granted not all, but IME, most) BS's want to know. Regardless of who tells them, nor why.

 

Having the affair was interfering in the BS's life.

 

Admitting the affair to the BS isn't interfering...it's a step towards ENDING your interference and taking responsiblility for what you've done.

 

 

Granted, I agree that informing the BS is best.

 

However, it is NOT taking responsibility for anything.....it is putting the burden of NC on the only party that has ZERO control on NC.

[goodyblue]

Taking responsibility does not necessarily mean having a conversation with the BS. Sometimes taking personal responsibility in your part of hurting another and vowing to not put yourself in that position again is enough. The husband is the one that must answer to the wife.

[AlwaysGrowing]

Whatever. I answered the question. So ridiculous. BS' s say they want to know. Suddenly they don't? Jesus, the entire affair is selfish, what do you expect? A bouquet of roses and chocolates with a note sayin 'i have been physically an emotionally involved with your husband, just letting you know. Call me!' Solo did it, sent the text, now the BS can make her own decisions. It would not have mattered what I said, you would have attacked. Enjoy your day.

 

 

Not agreeing and attacking are not the same.

 

For me it understanding our own motives...not sugar coating to make ourselves appear to be better than we are.

 

If the reason is to break up the marriage...own it.

 

Then proceed from there....because there is where you are.

[Owl]

Telling the BS isn't the ONLY step in taking responsibility...but it's a good one in the right direction.

 

It sets the stage for the affair to end. For NC to take place. It will very likely force both Solostand AND the MM to face the consequences for their choice to have an affair...which is part of taking responsibility for that choice.

 

It's not the ONLY thing that Solo needs to do...completely and totally agreed.

 

But it is a move in the right direction.

 

And...I WAS a BS...and I'm in agreemant that her telling was the right thing to do. Not all BS's here are against this action.

 

Solo...as I said, I think it was the right first step. You do have more to take. One of which is TELLING MM that it is OVER, and removing him from your life. That would include the advice you got earlier about finding another group to attend...preferably one that is all female. Blocking any further contact attempts by MM, after you've made it clear to him that it's over.

[cif]

Taking responsibility does not necessarily mean having a conversation with the BS. Sometimes taking personal responsibility in your part of hurting another and vowing to not put yourself in that position again is enough. The husband is the one that must answer to the wife.

 

Certainly. She doesn't owe the BS anything. Giving her a heads up is a courtesy, nothing more.

[goodyblue]

Not agreeing and attacking are not the same.

 

For me it understanding our own motives...not sugar coating to make ourselves appear to be better than we are.

 

If the reason is to break up the marriage...own it.

 

Then proceed from there....because there is where you are.

 

Actually, I agree. But if that is the motive, the OW does not need to tell all of this to BS. It is whatever it is. One only need be honest with one's self and go from there. I did not disclose and have never had a conversation with the ex wife. There was one confrontation where she verbally attacked my children and I shielded them the best I could. And if it ever happened again I would call the police. The scenario is not even something I necessarily agree with, just something.that I know happens. And it happens often.

[ComingInHot]

Goodyblue wrote: "Jesus, the entire affair is selfish, what do you expect?"

 

...Taint that the truth!!

[AlwaysGrowing]

I agree...Solost taking a step is huge.

 

My wishes for her are to get to know and nurture the relationship she has with herself. That Solost becomes a person that does not require another to pilot her life for her or set her worth. That seeking peace will bring her closer to happiness.

[goodyblue]

I agree...Solost taking a step is huge.

 

My wishes for her are to get to know and nurture the relationship she has with herself. That Solost becomes a person that does not require another to pilot her life for her or set her worth. That seeking peace will bring her closer to happiness.[/QU

 

Well stated. I think we all want that.

[2sunny]

 

When does advice start addressing the issues within ourselves and not just the dramatics of it all?

 

 

That's just it - since Solo is so hyper focused on her MM and his crap it's unlikely that she's willing to take a look at the way she participates and how that affects herself and others.

 

Taking an honest look at it she might learn why she drinks and how she has caused harm to self and harm to others.

 

But she keeps ignoring her own best interest with the hope that her MM might "choose her". He's made his choice - he's still at home!

 

Going to a meeting for AA with the hopes of seeing your MM is not going to help you stay sober - that is not the reason for the meetings.

 

I hope you get a sponsor and work your steps!

 

I hope you start looking out for YOUR best interest as a priority.

 

I hope you put your sobriety as your top priority.

 

MM will go away eventually - if YOU ignore him long enough!

 

Yes, all of this is up to YOU, not him!

 

YOU CAN CONTROL this part about your life. Change the things YOU CAN!

 

If you don't get to the root of your anger and fears - you're likely to drink again.

[goodyblue]

That's just it - since Solo is so hyper focused on her MM and his crap it's unlikely that she's willing to take a look at the way she participates and how that affects herself and others.

 

Taking an honest look at it she might learn why she drinks and how she has caused harm to self and harm to others.

 

But she keeps ignoring her own best interest with the hope that her MM might "choose her". He's made his choice - he's still at home!

 

Going to a meeting for AA with the hopes of seeing your MM is not going to help you stay sober - that is not the reason for the meetings.

 

I hope you get a sponsor and work your steps!

 

I hope you start looking out for YOUR best interest as a priority.

 

I hope you put your sobriety as your top priority.

 

MM will go away eventually - if YOU ignore him long enough!

 

Yes, all of this is up to YOU, not him!

 

YOU CAN CONTROL this part about your life. Change the things YOU CAN!

 

If you don't get to the root of your anger and fears - you're likely to drink again.

 

Sometimes it takes one person longer to get from point a to point b than another. I feel Solo is doing what she feels is best for her and there is no pushing. She must make this journey. Your feelings on the matter may not match her introspection. Give her time.

Edited September 29, 2014 by goodyblue

[2sunny]

Sometimes it takes one person longer to get from point a to point b than another. I feel Solo is doing what she feels is best for her and there is no pushing. She must make this journey. Your feelings on the matter may not match her introspection. Give her time.

 

I disagree.

 

I've seen a few that look like Solo - handing all their power to a man - and waiting for the "right time" on doing their steps.

 

Those few are dead. Dead because they waited to take action. Dead because they didn't change things.

 

Sure, anyone can wait - I'm just encouraging her to take action that could help her to help herself.

[Sub]

In any other scenario, I think this sort of thing could warrant being picked apart in regards to its methods and intentions. But relative to the absolute debacle that's been created by the parties involved to this point, ANY step like this is a positive one in the long-term. Definitely better than the hamster-wheel-like status quo at this point.

[the_artist_1970]

Here's the thing. Most (granted not all, but IME, most) BS's want to know. Regardless of who tells them, nor why.

 

Having the affair was interfering in the BS's life.

 

Exactly! I wanted to know and I was very glad the xap told me.

[truncated]

Read this thread through, and from what i can tell, the lady who started it seems to have some issues with knowing who she really is. There are mentions of alcohol abuse, being the other woman, etc., and neither of those seem like good choices to make if one wants to be true to who they really are.

 

i would suggest that she try and take a step back from the situation and ask herself, if she were in the shoes of this guys wife, what would she want to have happen? forget about all the assumptions of what she knows/doesn't know, etc., and focus on that.

 

her answer will be a good indication of who she is at heart, underneath all this other stuff. If she feels, in her heart, that she would hate to be in the position of a betrayed spouse, the she needs to further ask herself what she would want to have happen. That will reveal who she is at heart.

 

Strip away all the external cr@p, and get to the heart of the matter. Right now, it seem like no one, not ever the woman herself, really acres about what's best for her.

[Lovebug66]

I'm with Owl that most BSs want to know, I certainly did and would have taken the truth no matter how I got it. Would someways have been better than others? Maybe, but I really don't think it matters in the long run with what we are talking about here.

 

I also agree that telling her was just the first step. I will just put out there that I believe the more you get heavily involved in really working your program, the next right steps will follow. I believe you are a good person, but you have let your emotions rule over your morals this whole affair. You feel entitled, you are letting your past keep you in victim mode, in other words, you are thinking with your alcoholic brain. If you really live your program all those justifications are going to sound silly to you. You have to get away from MM, he is feeding all this bad stuff in your head. I don't care about all the nice things he's done or how well he has supported you, he only has done that for his own selfish reasons. He likes you off balance, you are much easier to manipulate then.

 

I admit your MM sounds a lot like my WH and maybe that will discount my POV in many eyes here. But I believe the alcoholic or addict MM runs on pretty much the same pattern and I say that because of how many people I know in my program who tell the same story I do, there is so little variance. I say that because the things you write are what the OW said to me. I say that because you can see him gaslighting his wife. In saying that, here's what I think could be happening coming up.

 

She has the anonymous text, she is either going to try and find more evidence or confront him. I don't think she will call you right away because she is very confused from all the gaslighting. I found out the A on my own and had OW phone number immediately, and it took a long time for me to call. If she goes the evidence route she is more likely to call you. If she confronts, he is going to deny deny deny, he will make her think she is crazy and she may never call. My WH had all kinds of reasons why I needed to stay far away from the OW, like telling me she goes to the looney bin all the time or that her H is the type to hunt him down with a gun. I would bet good money that you are just some crazy lady from AA who follows him around and you are totally mentally unstable and he is nice to you because he's afraid you will kill yourself or something if he's not supportive. Of course once I did talk to the OW, my WH lies came tumbling down like a pile of bricks, that is why he wanted us to stay away from each other. Your MM has tried to get you to believe his W is crazy and horrible too to keep you away from her, but you have been able to see thru some of her actions that she isn't. She doesn't have the benefit of seeing what you have seen, and it will be much easier for her to believe what he tells her, just like you used to. I don't know if she will ever contact you because quite frankly he has probably made her crazy. It's not that she doesn't want to know, she has been convinced that she can't find the truth. If she does, I can't stress enough to be gentle and understanding with her. I'm not saying you have to put up with her screaming at you, but you can say I feel horrible for my part in this and I understand your anger with me, but now I am trying to do the right thing and help you and that isn't going to happen if we are yelling. She will want to believe you, and the more open, honest and kind you are with her about everything (even the anonymous text), the more chance she will. Then both of you can get away from this POS and both be so much better off.

 

Apologies for my long windedness, I have a year of stuff I've been saying in my head to get out

[Lovebug66]

Apparently I was not long winded enough

 

I can't stress enough that you MUST get totally away from MM. I don't think just not answering his calls is enough, you have tried this before and he will just come knocking on your door. I think you need to tell him flat out that you don't want him contacting you in any way ever again and if he won't respect that I would look into finding out your local stalking laws. I'm dead serious. You need to do everything in your power to keep him away from you for your own health. And you need to be strong and stay as far away from him as you can. The longer you are away from him, the better you will feel and be able to see things more clearly.

[solostand]

Well its no news to report really.

 

She has not called, not that I expected her to right away. One of the reasons I gave my phone number is so she can look up his phone records and see that number hundreds - probably thousands - of times, two three four times a day coming from his phone. So that would be a little bit of proof for her.

 

I was really busy at work so didn't think about it at all today. Phone turned off at work. Turned it on to hear message from MM saying "I love you". So I guess she hasn't confronted him yet.

 

He has been successful so far in convincing her its just a "friendship". Coupled with the age difference, and our joint AA involvement, she's probably been satisfied with that, although I know from the questions she has asked she doesn't really believe it.

 

I don't think she knows actually what to do. There is the bias towards believing your spouse.

 

And I am not drinking and I am going to a different AA meeting.

[solostand]

And if he throws me under a bus, well, I have enough proof to throw him under a Subway Train.

[2sunny]

I still doubt she knows.

 

He's an even bigger jerk than I thought.

 

It's disgusting that he would leave you that message at this point!

 

I bet he's intercepted your messages.

 

Your being played for a fool.

 

 

Going to meetings isn't necessarily being "involved with AA".

 

Do your steps and help OTHERS. That is AA.

 

What you are doing is going to meetings under a disguise - your agenda to see your MM. That isn't the intention of meetings.

 

Your making a mockery of yourself. No one to blame but you.

[solostand]

Look there's plenty of meetings in my town - I am going to DIFFERENT meetings and actually have been going to different meetings all along.

 

The one meeting that we used to go to regularly together I considered our "cover" because half the time we weren't even AT that meeting, but in my bed or out somewhere else.

 

Believe me, this MM is so bad at computers and phones there is no way he could have intercepted that message. He doesn't even know HOW to send a text. I tried to teach him once but he couldn't do it and didn't really want to learn. All of our communication has been over the telephone and in person.

[whichwayisup]

Solo, have you actually ended the affair? Or in your mind it's over but you haven't told him yet? Sorry I can't remember if you've told him or not.

[solostand]

Practicing NC, or trying to. I have not spoken to him since Friday. My phone carrier does not having a blocking feature, which means he can still call and leave messages (like the one today).

 

He knew I was feeling unsatisfied Friday, but we did not fight and I did not tell him it was over. Just decided in my head.

Edited September 29, 2014 by solostand

[whichwayisup]

Practicing NC, or trying to. I have not spoken to him since Friday. My phone carrier does not having a blocking feature, which means he can still call and leave messages (like the one today).

 

You're in NC, but did you actually tell him that you're done and ending the affair?

 

Not telling him leaves the door open in case you change your mind.

 

You should tell him that you texted his wife. Let the chips fall where they may.

[Got it]

Practicing NC, or trying to. I have not spoken to him since Friday. My phone carrier does not having a blocking feature, which means he can still call and leave messages (like the one today).

 

He knew I was feeling unsatisfied Friday, but we did not fight and I did not tell him it was over. Just decided in my head.

 

Solo - do you want to be done? Or do you want to say you are done to see if it changes the outcome? I feel like you are still hedging your side to just wiggle your toes over the edge and not actually take the leap.

 

It is your call to be in the affair or not. He has shown you where he is. He is happy to accept the dynamics and expectations that you two have agreed upon. He will continue to be there, ready and waiting when ever you want. But what do you want?

 

CLOWN STORY

 

" A man found himself in the middle of a long hallway. In the middle of this long hallway was a solitary door. He walked up to the door and knocked on it. It was answered by a clown who proceeded to beat the life out of him. The next day, the gentleman was in the hallway once more, and once more found his way to the door and knocked on it. Again, it was answered by the same clown and again, the clown beat him senseless. This occurred for 4 more days - the man would be in the hallway, go to the door, knock on it, and the clown would answer the door only to beat him senseless once more.

 

On the 7th day, the man was once again in the hallway. He walked up to the door and knocked on it - but no one answered. So, he went looking for the clown.

 

My husband and I often say, when we're discussing how we used to allow prior relationships to hurt us AGAIN and AGAIN, that we're NO LONGER looking for the clown.

 

I see women here who continually allow their xMM (or MM) to hurt them again and again and again. The key word here, though, is "allow." When we allow someone to continually hurt us and abuse us emotionally, it becomes the rule rather than the exception.

 

I just want to tell those who are hurting to STOP looking for the clown. "

 

 

 

 

 

So, this is from the Clown's perspective:

 

Wow, she finally found me, she must really want me. I'm going to treat her like ****, disrespect her, lie to her, give her just little bits of my time and make promises I have no intention of keeping. She surely won't stay around after that.

 

Hmmmm....I can't believe she's come back looking for me again. I would have thought that by treating her so bad to begin with she wouldn't want to be treated like that anymore. I'm going to treat her like **** some more, give her some even bigger lies and give her hope when I know there isn't any.

 

WOW, she is back for more? I thought for sure she'd have gone away by now. After all, I have really been an ******* to her. I've given her nothing but pain and heartache, yet she seems to enjoy all these bad things I can give her. I'm thinking she must be enjoying this.

 

OMG - this is great! She has come back again and I now know for sure that I don't ever have to change. That no matter how bad I treat her, no matter what I say or do, no matter how much I lie to her, hurt her, give her hope - she is just going to accept it. I don't have to change my life, ruin my family, put anything of my own in jeopardy because she has proven to me she will continue to keep coming back for me. No matter how bad I treat her.

 

And, I keep getting to have someone on the side who I can have sex with, who I can call when I'm lonely, hurting or just need someone to understand my problems. I can fit her into my life because she is waiting around and always available to me no matter what. She is so happy for the 5 minutes we get together that I don't have to give more than that.

 

Wow, I LOVE being the Clown. I have it made!!

 

I feel sorry for the one who keeps looking for me.