He filed, asked for sole custody

[jakrbbt]

His lawyer met with him this morning, or that was the plan last I'd heard.

 

For some reason she waited until 4:30 to call my lawyer and leave a message. He had already left. I spoke to his assistant. H's lawyer will be sending over a fax with some "clarifications" or "changes." She made some comment to the effect that we are "close" to an agreement. Whatever that means to her.

 

Trial is so close, less than 2 weeks away now.

 

I wanted so badly to relax this weekend and enjoy the idea that the end is near. I'm running out of steam-- and I have never, ever run out of steam for anything in my life. Even the bar exam seemed short to me. I've gone years without vacations at work. Days and weeks alone with an infant, ultra-marathon training runs, bring it on! But now, I have tasted fatigue.

 

It feels defeating to pay all my bills on my new debt (that I incurred when I moved out and paid H's rent et c)-- knowing that I'll end up deeper in the hole and scraping by after haggling with H over the divorce agreement. I'm struggling to prove myself at work after a year of being distracted and slow there. I'd wanted a better life, but for awhile I'll be just cleaning up this mess. At least I have a steady job and a profession.

 

I have to believe that the quality of my and my son's life will improve just as a result of the marriage ending-- even if we struggle for a year or two.

[beach]

I hope you have a clause that states when he earns more you pay him less.

 

Have you been checking to see if he's earning money lately?

[kenmore]

Jac, your lives are so similar to ours in some ways. The things you say and how you say them remind me of how we used to be.

 

One thing: going through a legal assistant. My wife told me she has spent over a thousand dollars hiring a paralegal and wants me to send all paperwork through her. My thought (I haven't said anything yet) is BS. I'll serve papers and talk to my wife and she can give the paralegal the papers if she wishes. That's what I'm supposed to do.

 

Really, don't let that hurt you. Do what you feel is the right thing. Screw the middle man. My wife's petition was delayed by a month because her paralegal sent it to the wrong address. Do I feel guilty about the delay? LOL

 

If any delay hurts you, be sure to bring it up in court. Don't let him get away with anything!

 

I guess I have told you this before, but I see a similarity in how we feel. We both still love our spouses, but they continue to hurt us.

 

Please take my hand and say enough! Screw this. We have been through enough.

 

I will be looking for your support when my time comes, but please know you have mine now. Everything is so crappy...I even have a cold now. It's hard to be positive, but here I am for you. Just like you were there for me a couple of months ago.

 

Be strong and my best wishes for you! Please let us know how things go!

 

Ken

[BetrayedH]

I hope your standard answer to any of his requests is no!

 

He needs to grow the F up! He can learn how to fill out his own forms. He also knows how to ask his sister to do everything for him.

 

Don't help him with anything. Start letting him get used to doing things for himself.

 

Just say no. No is a complete sentence. And actually you don't even owe him any answer - you could ignore him... That would be more useful.

 

Beach is such a stickler.

 

That said, she's right that this should be kind of a theme for you for a while. Either "no" or no response might be a good default position to have for a while.

 

To give some perspective, my ex and I are just now getting to be pretty flexible with one another and we're about 2 1/2 years post divorce. There's no longer anyone trying to "get back together" or manipulate (or even irritate) the other person. We're both moving on in separate directions. But it's taken us a long time to get here. And even with us being amiable, we had our attorneys draft a temporary modification to our agreement and submit it to the court this last summer when we needed to make a rather significant temporary change to custody. We've done years of limited contact to get to the point where we're willing to engage and do each other favors (our kids are getting older and have a lot of competing extracurriculars).

 

It may be worth considering to really limit contact and question every message and whether it really NEEDS to be sent. It reduces any opportunity to be manipulated, sends a message that you're not down with that anymore, and helps you both detach (which is a message that he needs to hear thru your actions).

[Yasuandio]

Actually, it sounds like things are going great to me. It is going to come to an end - a REAL END POINT. As of the next month, for sure, it will be "Forward March, for Jakrabit and her little baby soldier! That is the best news in the world.

 

So what about some debt? Jack will pay it off fast. Big deal. It is almost over. Haha! Yas

 

PS. Like (Nancy Reagan's popular slogan), whenever Husband says or asks for something, JUST SAY NO TO DRUGS. Cause he is a drug. A drug from which you must withdraw.

[kenmore]

jakrbbt, how is he able to afford an attorney? Please tell me you are not covering it.

[BlueIris]

His lawyer met with him this morning, or that was the plan last I'd heard.

 

For some reason she waited until 4:30 to call my lawyer and leave a message. He had already left. I spoke to his assistant. H's lawyer will be sending over a fax with some "clarifications" or "changes." She made some comment to the effect that we are "close" to an agreement. Whatever that means to her.

 

Trial is so close, less than 2 weeks away now.

 

While unnerving, this is typical in settlement negotiations, whether in family court or civil court- heck, plea agreements in criminal court are often negotiated.

 

The statement, "we are close," is usually a statement of intent and willingness to settle, to be open to discussion. It's also standard to send over "clarifications and changes." Sometimes terms truly are ambiguous and it's good to state lack of understanding or point out ambiguity because understanding and informed consent are needed for a binding agreement. Last thing you want is an agreement that the parties interpret differently because you'll just end up in battling, annoyed or back in court down the road.

 

Changes? Eh, also typical. It's a negotiation between parties, not a take it or leave it command or dictate.

 

It's funny because settlement negotiations themselves can be a very leveling, healing process that forms the basis for respectful negotiation for years to come. Being able to see the other side is great for co-parenting, and unless something horrendously wrong, you'll be co-parneitng for many years.

 

Good luck! Sounds like good progress! I'm happy for you!

Edited January 25, 2015 by BlueIris

[jakrbbt]

Wow, love the positive responses. Yes, we are likely just going to be negotiating financials now. And there, I'm in familiar territory.

 

I hope.

 

I was looking at a house with a great yard. I was looking at my debts. I want my money to go toward caring for my son, period. Anything beyond that can go to savings, or having a higher quality of life for both me and my son. None of it should go to H, except maybe a temporary or lump sum that reflects a desire to avoid the more-expensive option of trial. (And for me, the sum I've offered will hurt my pocketbook, a lot.) H is able-bodied and skilled, our marriage was short, none of our state's laws entitle him to any financial support from me, and our child is still so young.

 

He is a manipulator. It's called being "character disturbed" or "character disordered." Once we have a court order-- the more detailed, the better-- I won't worry as much about trying to keep him from manipulating me. At that point, I'll just tell him flat-out, I don't have time to do your taxes and stuff and you need to ask me before coming over.

 

If he's a disturbed character, he'll violate the order. He'll do it anyway whether I try to placate him or not.

 

So I guess what I'm hearing from all you is, start out not-placating him. He might still do crappy things, but that's better than if I spent my life trying to still walk on his eggshells in the hope he'll be less threatening. Set the tone of co-parenting as, we are two parents following a court order and going our separate ways.

 

I'm pretty sure he had his mother watch our son all day yesterday while he went sailing (there are some signs)-- though he would never admit it. That bothers me. We have a first right of refusal that that would have violated. It just bothers me. It means he only wants 50% for financial reasons. That is why he'd rather not follow the right-of-refusal, and let baby and me have more time together when he wants to take off and go sailing, because then H might get "caught" and I might go for more parenting time and child support. He mentioned that fear to me once.

 

I'm not paying for his lawyer. I'd only have to pay attorney fees to him if I did something that was so outrageous, and that he had to litigate in court, that the court considered it something he never should have had to pay a lawyer to even deal with. I actually considered asking that he pay my attorney fees at one point. That was after he offered a parenting-time plan, implemented it with me, and then retracted it and kept switching it around and sending my lawyer letters and filing affidavits for a parenting-time hearing just because he learned that he could get more child support from me if he changed his parenting-time agreement to one with more overnights. And lied in the affidavits, provably, so we had to refute the overt falsehoods in our responses.

 

When, at one point, he filed a request that I have two nights per month with my son-- that was a stress I shouldn't have had to deal with. Hugely stressful, bad for our son even, it was so stressful. And for no reason at all. I had to litigate all that with my lawyer. Thank God my fantastic parents live nearby, and my mother basically came over and co-parented with me a bunch of times during that low point. Part of me thinks, Jakrbbt, you have a basis to ask for attorney fees for that bag of shenanigans.

 

The other part of me thinks, Jakrbbt, live up to your LS name and sprint away fast, never to look back. Drop him like a hot potato, drop your anger, and cut your losses. You have a job, you have good parents, you don't have to go scrapping after this creep for recompense.

 

The other night I had a dream that H and I were traveling in the southern united states, where I've always wanted to visit. We were back in a lukewarm romance. A hurricane came, and there was barely time to get out of a flooded building. In the dream, H shoved past me and dashed to the door, barely making it, and leaving me behind to die where he'd knocked me over.

 

I gotta figure out how to get him totally out of my life, without cutting off his opportunity to be in our son's life.

[BetrayedH]

You're on a perfectly good path. Keep trying to find a balance between accomodation and manipulation. Don't be an overt beotch and don't be a doormat. Keep trying to detach and to set boundaries. Keep analyzing and asking yourself these questions without getting stuck in analysis paralysis. This is how you ensure that you've been "reasonable" throughout the process. Don't let people play games with you and don't play games with them. And you can feel proud about how you proceeded. And you can defend it.

 

And before you know it, you'll be divorced.

[jakrbbt]

Still waiting for H's lawyer to draw up the proposed order.

 

My attorney sent her a letter last week, confirming that it's his understanding that the matter is settled. He added that he'd appreciate a fast turn-around on the proposed order, as our trial date is approaching.

 

I'm nervous again about what he'll do. I guess it's the old feeling, from when we lived together and he'd be forever sneaking out or on his phone texting his "troops" about how to get me and, basically, how to use our son to exploit me.

 

He's heading to that city 2 hours away where he periodically works. Why on earth would that make me nervous? But it does. I'm afraid he'll eventually try to not only move up there but move our son up there.

 

And there's the old feeling that something bad is coming from him, that I wouldn't have seen coming. But the divorce offers far more regulation and oversight than the marriage ever did. There's not that much he can really do, right? I gotta get over that.

 

We keep sending each other little updates about our son-- whenever he learns a fantastic phrase or some milestone, which is almost every day, given his age. Maybe less contact would be good.

 

The other day H came to get baby, baby was unexpectedly still sleeping. H wanted to cuddle with me in bed while waiting for him to wake. He said he was sad about being unemployed, was cold, and loved me.

 

I told him no. I didn't even give him an explanation-- I didn't feel like it. He was offended, and made a comment to that effect, and I didn't respond to that at all. I was about to just wake baby, but just then he woke up.

 

 

I thought about sending a "don't be hurt" email, but no way. I sent no email at all. But I was pretty bothered the next day and night, and couldn't figure out why.

 

When it was my turn to get our son, H made a great show of respecting various boundaries of mine. And I noticed he's taken care of his insurance and tax stuff himself, rather than asking me again for help.

 

Can't someone with a crystal ball just come and tell me that it does not matter, for me and my son, what my husband does? That we will pretty much be able to live the life we want anyway?

[jakrbbt]

As an afterthought, you know what, I am just going to go ahead and live the life I want to. I won't worry about whether H or his family sabotage some effort.

 

I'd like to get my son into a certain private school right near my house, that I went to as a child. So I'll go ahead and make the preparations, get on the waiting list. All those efforts, I'll do. If H wants to later sabotage, what can I do except stand up to him at that point?

 

Time to figure out what I want to do, that is different from what I did in the marriage. This might be fun!

 

And I might be divorced by vanentine's day.

[kenmore]

Jac, here are my responses. Not necessarily what you want, but reality that I know it here in California. Things are probably different there.

 

Good that you went through your first steps!!! I'm so glad you are on the same pages so far. I hope you two can work things to your liking!

 

I had my first open house today and the person I'm hosing with is awesome! Meaning he moves property, can be very influential concerning referring me etc, but he's also a dick.

 

I see you are in some arrangement that you like. That's why I checked in here: to hear what's going on with you. I'm hoping nothing crappy comes down the pike.

 

As for how he'll react and what he'll do, I'm wondering the same! OMG, I had such a weird exchange with my wife! She started it by saying she'll bring my birthday gift to an open house I was hosting, but when I contacted her during it, she said to leave her alone and to basically drop dead. This showed me how hard it is to predict how a spouse will act. I now hold the opinion that they are typically dickheads and that's what we should expect from them.

 

Sorry---off topic. Hey Jac, expect the worst. You won't be disappointed. That said, there are good people in your world (--->Ken) who only wish you not only the best, but a great time getting there!!!

 

Ken

[beach]

Still waiting for H's lawyer to draw up the proposed order.

 

My attorney sent her a letter last week, confirming that it's his understanding that the matter is settled. He added that he'd appreciate a fast turn-around on the proposed order, as our trial date is approaching.

 

I'm nervous again about what he'll do. I guess it's the old feeling, from when we lived together and he'd be forever sneaking out or on his phone texting his "troops" about how to get me and, basically, how to use our son to exploit me.

 

He's heading to that city 2 hours away where he periodically works. Why on earth would that make me nervous? But it does. I'm afraid he'll eventually try to not only move up there but move our son up there.

 

And there's the old feeling that something bad is coming from him, that I wouldn't have seen coming. But the divorce offers far more regulation and oversight than the marriage ever did. There's not that much he can really do, right? I gotta get over that.

 

We keep sending each other little updates about our son-- whenever he learns a fantastic phrase or some milestone, which is almost every day, given his age. Maybe less contact would be good.

 

The other day H came to get baby, baby was unexpectedly still sleeping. H wanted to cuddle with me in bed while waiting for him to wake. He said he was sad about being unemployed, was cold, and loved me.

 

I told him no. I didn't even give him an explanation-- I didn't feel like it. He was offended, and made a comment to that effect, and I didn't respond to that at all. I was about to just wake baby, but just then he woke up.

 

 

I thought about sending a "don't be hurt" email, but no way. I sent no email at all. But I was pretty bothered the next day and night, and couldn't figure out why.

 

When it was my turn to get our son, H made a great show of respecting various boundaries of mine. And I noticed he's taken care of his insurance and tax stuff himself, rather than asking me again for help.

 

Can't someone with a crystal ball just come and tell me that it does not matter, for me and my son, what my husband does? That we will pretty much be able to live the life we want anyway?

 

Jak - you really could benefit from creating distance from him and establishing some SOLID boundaries that you stick to.

 

Allowing him to be close when you're laying down and even listening to him describe wanting to lay with you and cuddle? Jac, you haven't established any healthy boundaries with him that protect yourself.

 

You keep sending him mixed signals. You could use some expert help and I hope you get a counselor to help you establish healthy boundaries... Because it's what consistently trips you up time and again with him.

 

Please, please consider it. It will help YOU be happier.

 

 

And please stop helping him hurt you. Yes, I do think you help him by not establishing that boundary. Just stop being his friend! He's using you and willing to cause you harm. He IS the enemy and you need to learn how to deal with such a jerk.

 

Tell him no to EVERYTHING! That includes entering your home.

[Yasuandio]

Do what you need to do in the interest of your son, period.

 

Yas

[jakrbbt]

Jak - you really could benefit from creating distance from him and establishing some SOLID boundaries that you stick to.

 

Allowing him to be close when you're laying down and even listening to him describe wanting to lay with you and cuddle? Jac, you haven't established any healthy boundaries with him that protect yourself.

 

You keep sending him mixed signals. You could use some expert help and I hope you get a counselor to help you establish healthy boundaries... Because it's what consistently trips you up time and again with him.

 

Please, please consider it. It will help YOU be happier.

 

 

And please stop helping him hurt you. Yes, I do think you help him by not establishing that boundary. Just stop being his friend! He's using you and willing to cause you harm. He IS the enemy and you need to learn how to deal with such a jerk.

 

Tell him no to EVERYTHING! That includes entering your home.

 

I want to be clear that I was not laying down or even in the bedroom. But our son was sleeping, and I didn't want to wake him. H said we should both take a nap together in bed, and that he loved me bla bla bla.

 

I didn't think it had gone far enough where I couldn't even let him into my house when he comes to get our toddler.

 

But I agree that we need distance, and that if we're "friends," then he may well continue to manipulate.

 

There is a difference between being civil, and being friends. It's awkward to go backward from friendship or intimacy into basic civility. I hate awkward, but I'll do it.

Edited February 1, 2015 by jakrbbt

[Yasuandio]

This last post is pathetic, in my opinion. Do awkward or die? Is this what it has come down to, really? And you are actually an attorney? Well, maybe it does make sense.

 

Yas

[jakrbbt]

This last post is pathetic, in my opinion. Do awkward or die? Is this what it has come down to, really? And you are actually an attorney? Well, maybe it does make sense.

 

Yas

 

I'm not sure I understand. Unless the implication is that lawyers are fine with awkwardness. No, I don't think my job is awkward, because it's not personal. I dislike awkward situations in my personal life and I'm afraid I avoid them. But I can be in an awkward situation if it's necessary.

[Yasuandio]

Attorneys bill out, attorneys sell out. Sometimes, it might be awkward. So what? Y

[jakrbbt]

Ah-- well, I do all public-interest law. But I see your point.

 

When something is contrary to one's way, the choice to do it has to be deliberate. Otherwise we (I, at least) slip up. I'd like to be friendly with the person who has my son half the time. But only if that's realistic.

[beach]

Ah-- well, I do all public-interest law. But I see your point.

 

When something is contrary to one's way, the choice to do it has to be deliberate. Otherwise we (I, at least) slip up. I'd like to be friendly with the person who has my son half the time. But only if that's realistic.

 

God Jak - how many fricking times have you been told here? You cannot be friends when it looks this way! Unless you plan on being manipulated for the next 20 years by being his complete doormat!!!

 

Get some professional help. You really NEED it.

 

He's offering you sex and screwing you over completely - and you STILL want to be his friend? God that is sick.

 

You have real codependency issues to address.

[BetrayedH]

I'm curious...do you have anything stipulated about whose home will act as the child's residence, for the purposes of establishing his school district? My ex and I agreed that her home would act as the kids' official residence but we also stipulated that neither of us is permitted to move more than 30 miles from the marital home (we later mutually agreed to change it to 35 miles and documented it).

 

You ought to have something in place to prevent him from trying to move your son away, changing schools, etc.

[jakrbbt]

I wanted to see my counselor a couple times before posting an update.

 

Things are likely to go pretty well if I set up my life and stop catastrophizing.

 

We are divorced now. He agreed to my offer with some small adjustments. So we have joint custody and 50/50 parenting time, and a small an temporary spousal support amount. I still think that it was the right thing to do. Or, the right thing to try. If I'd gone to trial and come out with sole custody, I'm convinced my H may have all but disappeared from our son's life. And I'd have felt bad about not at least trying for the thing that would be best for our son- 50-50 and joint custody. If it does not work, my lawyer has explained to me how to get it altered and when that would be likely et c.

 

We have a provision that he can't move 60 miles away, at least without giving me notice and then I'd be entitled to petition for a change the parenting-time arrangement.

 

But also, he has just gotten a job, in our current city. It's not a known number of hours and it's not a set schedule. But it is nice to see him with a job, and if it proves too hectic for him, he'll figure something out. I need to stop worrying about it.

 

I think he was sad after the divorce finalized, and I was . . . tired. I was inexplicably lazy the whole week after our divorce was final. I still have not even checked my personal emails.

 

My counselor does not think that I need to block my ex from my house or even that that would be constructive right now. Instead, he thinks that I have to figure out what things to say no to, and what things I'm ok with, when it comes to our divorced co-parenting situation. Then, I need to simply say no to requests that truly aren't beneficial or healthy for me and my son. I have to believe that either he will not retaliate, or that if he tries to, it won't matter. I am actually finding that he does in fact take no for an answer.

 

 

As it is, my ex and I have helped each other a few times with sickness and schedule changes. I find that that is different from when I over-offer to help with money, with groceries, or with letting him sleep in and make me late to work getting our son. Cooperating is different from enabling.

 

But now I need to focus on work and on getting a life, so to speak. It's great to try for cooperative co-parenting. But as for friendship, I'd like to have other key people in my life who are not my ex.

 

Part of the difficulty is that our son is so small. He's so important to us both, of course. So I gravitate toward any friendship that incorporates my son. Plus I am busy: If I'm not working, I'm spending time with my toddler.

 

If only it were like the '70s, when parents just visited each other for coffee while their kids played together. I've tried meeting other parents, and it's all playgroups with scheduled activities and parking nightmares and Martha Stewart dishes--stuff that no single working lawyer with a toddler can even manage.

 

I could try to date. A number of my closest friends are intelligent men whom I've either dated or had flings with. I love dating. In some ways I feel I have been single for years: the marriage was short, and the relationship itself had no intimacy for years. But in another sense-- the sense of being entangled with another person-- I have not been single.

 

It's just clear to me that I need to construct a life out of the things I want. But I don't know how one does that, and besides, I have no time! Any free time I get, I should be working. I'm on the verge of a reprimand at work because my production plummeted during the marriage and divorce.

 

So, I'm a newly-divorced extrovert, a bit bored and lonely, kind of recovering from the horror and frantic work of an unexpected custody dispute. The good news is that my son is thriving beautifully, my ex is in many ways stepping up as a single father, he has a job and possible plans for graduate school in the fall and at least some inclination to keep functioning as a single dad without me paying for his life. I'm super relieved about getting along with him, but that's not the point. The point is, now I get to have a life of my own. What that is, I don't know yet, and I dislike not knowing. I hope I can keep moving forward.

[Mr. Lucky]

So, I'm a newly-divorced extrovert, a bit bored and lonely, kind of recovering from the horror and frantic work of an unexpected custody dispute. The good news is that my son is thriving beautifully, my ex is in many ways stepping up as a single father, he has a job and possible plans for graduate school in the fall and at least some inclination to keep functioning as a single dad without me paying for his life. I'm super relieved about getting along with him, but that's not the point. The point is, now I get to have a life of my own. What that is, I don't know yet, and I dislike not knowing. I hope I can keep moving forward.

 

Having fretted over a number of bogeymen in your divorce and custody battle, are you really going to do the same thing as regards your newly single life?

 

Woman, have some faith! I'd guess an attractive, intelligent and available solicitor would be considered a catch in most circles. This is a special time, you have an unlimited set of possibilities. Carpe diem!

 

Mr. Lucky

[Yasuandio]

Bravo. Freedom. Done and done. Well done and done, in fact. At lightening fast speed!

 

NOW, the CAREER is number one, get cracking, girl. You can turn this around. Volunteer your time, take on some popular, news-grabbing pro-bono, "promote, promote, promote" your firm, and that's it. Career is number one, (along with you and your number one son).

 

Yas

[beach]

This is good progress. You're divorced and it didn't turn out so bad.

 

Now it's time for you to stop worrying so much about him and start looking out for your best interest. Keep saying no to him.

 

Ask your counselor what you need to say no to - and how to do that. Then do it.

 

And work more on your codependent issues so that you don't choose the same type in your future - this is critical, or you will likely choose the same type of guy next time too.