Likelihood of adultery on this one?

[Mirages]

I'd like some speculation as to the percent chance that my wife has cheated on me. If means nothing to me, we are already apart, I am just trying to assemble the puzzle and see if my bearings might be realistic; no decisions to re-kindle will occur, we are staying split due to a number of personality disorder/violent tendencies:

A decade back (early in marriage): A mutual friend couple of 5 years suddenly falls apart. The woman goes in hate with my then wife, woman never sees me again and disappears from society. The man (suspected adulterer) ends up 2 hours away, no way of finding him, the tentacles of the internet cannot find him. During the last year my wife had been talking about him hanging around the house when she was there, as if she was annoyed. Actually this man's personality, achievements, looks were very similar to me. I suspect wife was trying him for an affair, may or may not have scored... I do know his mate of 7 years was prettier, brighter, kinder, more stable than mine by leaps, if they did anything, he had little motive to start it.

A few years ago: Wife is in a volunteer organization, she spoke about a certain man a lot, too much, to me. After 3 years she detaches fully from that organization, nothing else manifests. That organization was/is a loveshack of sorts! He was slightly lower on the totem pole of attractiveness, average guy.

 

2012: Wife orchestrates another womans' divorce against a man (couple) we knew for many years, my (then) wife even tries to line up the stars to get him arrested, a week later she is in heavy chat with him. She had been very chatty with him in the prior year. After his separation I discover long paragraph emails from them. Content observed was non-romantic, some is advice from him on how to "win" divorce. I had very limited viewing access to that data, i.e. 30-60 seconds. During my separation she had been staying the night in both directions perhaps 5 times that I know of (usually with kids under 10 in house they were in, eww...). The guy is a bit bright, socially dim, not good looking, sloppy jolly guy. He is a pushover, has been run over in life a few times by tyrants. After my separation began this man who knew me, did a full disconnect from me, zero communication to me. He moved to an unlisted residence (i.e. no valid listing in internet, I found it, but I don't really care).

 

2013/14: During the end of my marriage I was spied on obsessively by this marvelous wife, and accused of adultery in a very public manner, even to my son. For the record not a shred of evidence exists for that, not one name, hug, phone call, etc... It was a "You must be..., if you are leaving me..." Projecting her own matters on me, eh?

 

Additional details: Wife's career was 8 hours a week (lots of time), and Facebook junkie. I never pried into her FB, emails, etc, until very late in this. Wife is a 3.5 on the 1-10 "looks" scale, a 5 on intelligence, a 2 on emotional stability. I.e. she may have tried these men, but got canned, not sure.

 

So I am just doing the post divorce mental cleanup: What are the odds that I was a victim of adultery? Entertain me with your best guess percentages. I never wanted her not to cheat on me. I knew she was too crazy to continue to trust in marriage, dangerous to me, and I thought her cheating was the best out. So I am comfy with either answer. FYI, she fought me tooth and nail on every detail of divorce, including my initiating it, I know her pers. disorder well, not trying to diagnose her in this thread.

[Arieswoman]

Mirages,

I am sorry if you are confused an unhappy over your wife's possible infidelity but I think you need to ask yourself ;-

 

1. Why does it matter what a load of anonymous posters think?

 

2. What are you trying to get out of this? Does chewing over they why & wherefores make it any better for you?

 

3. Why don't you ask your wife about this?

 

4. If you are now divorced, why does it matter anyway?

[oldshirt]

I'll throw out a 5% just because she stayed at that one guys house during your separation.

 

 

Other than that, I see no evidence other than her existing is a world where there are other men.

 

The percentage that I think you are paranoid and off kilter is around 85%

 

And the percentage that I think you need to put this all out of your mind and focus on moving on towards the future is 99.999999999999999%

[Mirages]

I hear you. The issue is not disturbing to me per se. Just trying to put the pieces together, more for theological reasons than practical ones. I don't need to bias this one way or the other, I can accept either reality. If I was certain I would not be posting

[Arieswoman]

Mirages,

I am not sure what you mean by this ;-

 

Just trying to put the pieces together, more for theological reasons than practical ones.

 

perhaps you can elucidate?

[Mirages]

You may be familiar with the Christian perspective on divorce being legitimate due to adultery? I am comfortable with my actions, but the Christian perspective is a part of my bearing on such matters, that is why I am attending to this. Most men it seems have a vendetta against the cheaters, I am practical, never did...

[Arieswoman]

Mirages,

Yes, I am familiar with this perspective, in that the Christian church's teaching is that a marriage is "a union between one man and one women for life". I also understand that a man "may not put his wife aside" except for adultery.

 

What grounds did you use to divorce your wife, may I ask?

[BetrayedH]

No way to tell from the limited information here. If you were considering staying married then I'd be advising you to investigate. At this point, I gather that would be a pretty big invasion of her privacy.

 

You have a couple of red flags (the fact that she accused you of cheating is actually the biggest one I read in your post - cheaters are always the most paranoid about cheating) but nothing substantial.

[Mirages]

The grounds include that I, like all people, am a sinner, realize that, and am willing to accept Christ's forgiveness. I also know Deut 24, and some of the Greek behind the passages in Matthew, it is not a polemic a decree as some may make it.

 

The secular grounds include advice from the medical community, as her abuse was causing me stress that was not going to keep me afloat. Deliberate sleep deprivation was one of her tactics, there were many more we won't get into.

 

Another broad perspective was that after a lot of help, including professional help, it was very evident that I was not going to satisfy her (nobody can), and I have certainly tried. As humans, both within religious and secular expectations, we make a good effort, we are not typically expected to move mountains with a crowbar, we leave that to Archimedes or God.

[Mirages]

(the fact that she accused you of cheating is actually the biggest one I read in your post - cheaters are always the most paranoid about cheating)

Interesting thought. Does the pattern of strong attachment to a man/couple and then full detachment, and/or "hate" with the woman involved tell us anything about it. The 2012 line came out with the woman in hate with mine as well. Friendships of healthy people come and go, this one was a fishing line, then war. Now I must cautiously evaluate that her emotional state might just be the reason for such, not sure.

[BetrayedH]

Interesting thought. Does the pattern of strong attachment to a man/couple and then full detachment, and/or "hate" with the woman involved tell us anything about it. The 2012 line came out with the woman in hate with mine as well. Friendships of healthy people come and go, this one was a fishing line, then war. Now I must cautiously evaluate that her emotional state might just be the reason for such, not sure.

 

I might be inclined to speak with both the woman (from early in your marriage) and the woman from 2012. If your W cheated with either of their husbands, they might freely share that with you.

[Arieswoman]

Mirages,

I notice you quote Deuteronomy 24 and not the New Testament,

 

Is remarriage after divorce always adultery?

 

so I am not too sure where you are going with this line of reasoning.

 

However, if your wife was suffering from a mental illness/condition you could (under English Law) obtain an annulment.

 

Maybe you could clarify?

[Mirages]

The matter of divorce in my country, and at this time, is water under the bridge. I am "Mid-atlantic," i.e. the other side of the pond.

 

If you are curious how the theological gears churn in my head, I am glad to share: By the way, I have used and appreciate the GotQ website you link. It is more Calvinistic than I, but well intended and presented as a site.

 

I follow the NT as well.

 

Consider the Greek word Moichia = Adultery, & Porneia which has a broad range of definitions.

 

Matt 5:28 In essence every person has committed adultery at some point, even a lustful glance...

 

Matt 5:32 and 19:9, etc. we can start to gather that the cause of a violation permitting divorce may be simply that anyone having the slightest lustful glance. Wow, now this line would begin to match the Deut 24 perspective.

 

I cannot be conclusive on this topic, as Jesus, Paul, and Moses took different approaches. Moses= OT, the prior standard, Jesus= the current standard, Paul = an intelligent man, wrote a lot of canonical letters, but cannot be thought of to supersede Jesus (His no divorce and remarriage line in 1 Cor 7).

 

Where the scriptures are clear, I am clear, where they are muddy, I resort to convictions and the Holy Spirit to establish a path. The scriptures are clear that we are sinners, and observation corroborates that, I accept it.

 

Just some thoughts since you asked.

Edited October 13, 2014 by Mirages

[Arieswoman]

Ok, Mirage, I sort of see where you are coming from.

 

I still don't see why it is important to know if she cheated or not?

 

If the divorce is finalised and you have forgiven her, then from a Christian perspective, that is all you are required to do, concerning her, in this life.

[Mirages]

I still don't see why it is important to know if she cheated or not?

 

After the meteor passed over the Ural Mtns. in Russia in 2013, injuring some folks, the experts looked into the event in great detail. They cannot reverse it, or prevent future injuries...

 

Some of us are just analytical by nature, at this level, it just has some meaning, but by no means obsession, to me.

[Lightitup]

Hi mirages. I am very analytical and was left with uncertainties post separation as well so I can relate to your desire to put some closure on this. However, no matter what likelihoods for/against cheating in your marriage, simple answer is that there will be many things about her you'll never know or understand. Healthiest thing is to accept that. You have faith in a higher power, so have faith in yourself that you've made the correct decision without needing further justification IMO.

 

Also, your analogy doesn't quite work bc scientists study those things to understand more for future events that could happen. You and your exW however are a closed book. She has no hold on you any longer and you are spending valuable mental energy on something that no longer matters. Best of luck.

[dreamingoftigers]

I might be inclined to speak with both the woman (from early in your marriage) and the woman from 2012. If your W cheated with either of their husbands, they might freely share that with you.

 

Frankly, this may smack of a generality.....

 

But if these friendships with these two women went from love to HATE because she cheated with their husband.....

 

AT LEAST one of them would have told you about it.

 

These are women.

 

We don't tend to protect the sanctity of OW's marriage.

 

But just for the record.......you don't seem to be extending non-judgmental compassion toward your "personality-disordered unpleasable" ex-wife.

 

With the view you have of her it seemed almost like you married her because you viewed her like "less than" and that would help you feel better in comparison.

 

Lots of contempt still shines through your posts describing her.

 

And no, it doesn't just sound objective.

You are practicality hoping she cheated on you so that you can be "guilt-free" about this.

 

Just from my own experience learning about certain kinds of conflict, could you tell me if shews depriving you if sleep by trying to talk about her feelings and frustrations while you tried to logically, rationally help her manage her feelings or solve her problems? just watching her grow increasingly negative to the point of anger? Does that sound familiar?

[dreamingoftigers]

With the view you have of her it seemed almost like you married her because you viewed her like "less than" and that would help you feel better in comparison.

 

Or that somehow you were "tricked" or "manipulated" into marrying this contemtible individual, somehow helpless against the tide.

 

My presentation may seem incredibly rude,

 

I just see full-force blaming her for the marriage and now even post-humously exploring a (pardon me) far out possibility of adultery.

 

What were your flaws in the marriage.

 

In what ways were you a 2/10 as a husband or person?

How did that affect your marriage.

Did those areas affect your marriage?

Did it cause you to commit adultery?

[Mirages]

simple answer is that there will be many things about her you'll never know or understand. Healthiest thing is to accept that

Lightitup, I think it bears noting that I am extremely analytical and strategic in all matters of life, all the while accepting that this manner is unusual, often beneficial, but turns into an OCD of sorts when under stress.

 

AT LEAST one of them would have told you about it.

The second one did make the accusation, the 2nd one disappeared, haven't seen her. I did not want to include #1's accusation in my assessment, I just didn't hear facts to corroborate from her; by default "Innocent until proven guilty."

 

But just for the record.......you don't seem to be extending non-judgmental compassion toward your "personality-disordered unpleasable" ex-wife.

With the view you have of her it seemed almost like you married her because you viewed her like "less than" and that would help you feel better in comparison.

Lots of contempt still shines through your posts describing her.

Agreed, there is a need for adjustment in my presentation. My marriage was intended to sacrifice greatly to an individual that needed help. I do not establish status by those around me, actually am a bit introverted, so I was just being charitable at the young age many years ago. My upbringing and a few serious med issues that nearly cost me my life scarred me a bit, and I suspect that may have contributed to me not being as socially prepared at 20 as some were.

 

 

In what ways were you a 2/10 as a husband or person?

Did those areas affect your marriage?

Sure, in the critical assessment of a friend of mine: I was a parent, not husband, and in his estimation could not be, as long as I retained the parental role (me/her ages are the same f.y.i.). I came to terms with the flaw in our marriage after some very crazy events, but remained faithful, attempting, and often sharing joy, it had similarities to what I've seen in Alzheimers marriages. A sad sacrificial love, not really worried about myself, genuinely concerned for the other. Some call it co-dependency.

 

I also coped by spending my time in personal study to an extent that was more than most, but not extreme.

 

Did it cause you to commit adultery?

No, never a hug, phone call, meeting with any other. Up to the current day, I really do not live for myself; the concept of caring about my state of pleasure is a burnt fuse; not to sidetrack... I view adultery as something that does not benefit oneself, but in my case, I don't seek pleasures, not really my game.

 

Sleep deprivation:

That was one significant example of many, the actions were clear deliberate abuse, done in a mocking manner, just short of what is done to hostages to get them to speak. Use of bright lights, mockery, loud noise, I perceived it as an attempt to disable my ability to work/think, it did lead to a serious medical issue, since recovered. I don't care to develop this thread into an assessment of her wrongs, but they were malicious, and very similar to the abuse she received as a child, not just an attempt to chat late in the night.

 

But to return to course, I just viewed this as a matter of curiosity as I close the books on this divorce. Nobody comes out a winner, I am still civilized in my conduct and generosity to her, which is extensive.