Racial Discrimination or Personal Preference?

[Topaze]

When someone says:

 

I don't find Asian men attractive.

 

I don't find Black SKIN attractive.

 

Black women are unattractive and I would never date a Black woman

 

Is that racial discrimination or personal preference?

 

Let's look at some definitions:

 

 

2 entries found for racism.

rac·ism ( P ) Pronunciation Key (rszm)

n.

The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.

 

Discrimination or prejudice based on race.

 

 

 

racial discrimination

 

noun

 

discriminatory or abusive behavior towards members of another race

 

 

Discrimination" is any different or unequal treatment on a categorical basis that disregards individual merit.

 

The key is categorizing people and not considering or evaluating them based on individual merit.

 

Webster's Third New International Dictionary Unabridged (1966) – discriminate 2: "to make a difference in treatment or favor on a class or categorical basis in disregard of individual merit (~ in favor of your friends) (habitually ~ against a certain nationality)."

 

The American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language, Third Edition (1992) – discriminate 2: "To make distinctions on the basis of a class or category without regard to individual merit … was accused of discriminating against women; discriminated in favor of his cronies."

 

The Random House Unabridged Dictionary, Second Edition (1997) – discriminate 1: "to make a distinction in favor of or against a person or thing on the basis of the group, class or category to which the person or thing belongs, rather than according to actual merit … The new law discriminates against foreigners. He discriminates in favor of his relatives."

 

In other words:

 

She's Black= I don't find her attractive automatically and I rule her out even if I have never met her.

 

He's Asian = He isn't sexy or appealing and I would never date him (even though I have never met him.)

 

How can that NOT be racial discrimination? Let's call this for what it is and stop shoving it under the "personal preference rug" and pretending that it's okay.

[tokyo]

What if someone says he doesn't like blondes? Or overweight people? Or short people? Or stupid people?

[Topaze]

That wouldn't be RACIAL discrimination. The operative term is RACIAL.

[tanbark813]

There is a huge difference between basing your judgment of someone's character on their race, and basing your level of attraction on their race. Call it what you want, but you can't force someone to be attracted to you. They can't even force themselves to do so out of fear of being called a racist.

[monkey00]

topaze, you're analyzing this too much.

 

It isnt racism if someone truly does have a personal preference for what type of people they are willing to date. sure they may never have met the race or someoen from it before and judge beforehand they arent willing to date them. But that's only because of negative stereotypes that they might not even give it consideration....and when they do meet that someone who breaks all those stereotypes they would give it consideration.

 

But i'd like to state that most people in general would prefer to date within their own race....it's quite common.

[Mr Spock]

He's shorter than me, That's an automatic turn off.

 

She's got a big freaking gunt flap, That's an automatic turn off.

 

He has man boobies. That's an automatic turn off.

 

 

All white people are unattractive, I'd never date a white person.

 

It may make someone prejudiced. But not racist. Not dating you isn't discriminating against you.

[Mr Spock]

I CAN see your issue with a person having a pre conceived notion that since they don't like black people, all black women are ugly. And I'm sure there ARE people out there like that. But just because a man is not Attracted to black women does NOT mean automatically that he doesn't like black people. Or has an agenda against blacks.

 

See what I mean?

[tanbark813]

Calling someone a racist also isn't a good way to get them to fall in love with you.

[Topaze]

Originally posted by CurvyGurl

You're not going to get a load of people to come in here to tell you what's wrong and why men don't date you.

 

Of course I won't and that's not what I was asking. I am asking men to be honest about why they automatically rule out and don't date Black women whether it be me or Tyra Banks or whomever. I don't have a problem with someone saying...I have met you Topaze I don't find you PERSONALLY as an individual attractive or there is something about you PERSONALLY that makes me feel that we would not be a good fit.

 

I DO have a HUGE problem and think that it is TOTALLY unacceptable for men or women to rule out an entire race of people based on their race. When a man goes on eharmony speaks with me or any other Black woman at length and then suddenly cuts off communication as soon as I tell him I am Black without even seeing my picture...he isn't rejecting ME....he is rejecting BLACK women.

 

When a woman goes on a dating site and indicates that she will only date White men and not even consider an Asian man.... even if he has every other quality she is looking for.....just because he is Asian....that is not rejecting an individual....it is discriminating against a whole race of people site unseen. In this day and age, it's inexcusable.

 

 

 

You're not going to get a lod of men to come in here and give you details of why they're attracted to certain people and why, if they HAVE dated black women, won't they date YOU?

 

Some men have already given their opinions.

 

Been there, done that, I'm now dusting with the tee shirt. You are not going to get a board to tell you why men don't date you. That answer has to come from with in you.

 

No, it has nothing to do with me as an individual. These men have not even taken the time or trouble to get to know ME as an individual. They have ruled out me and ALL other Black women and not even CONSIDERED us just because we are Black.

 

Could it be that the men just dont like you? Could it be you give off a vibe that no man, black, white, asian, what have you, would be interested?

 

When a man goes onto a dating site and puts in his profile that he will date White or Asian women but leaves Black and a whole host of other categories blank, how could that have anything to do with the vibe that I am giving off? He hasn't even met me. He doesn't even know that I exist....yet he has already decided that, based on my colour, I am unattractive and unsuitable.

 

For me, when things end up the same way, every time, no matter who I date, there is is but one logical common denominator and that is ME. That is when I start to look at myself and ask 'If I were a man, would I date me?" More often than not the answer is no.

 

Once again, this is not an individual thing. I have dated and dated a lot....just not attracting the quality of men I would like and the reasons given have nothing to do with me as an individual/

 

Topaze, you're asking an AWFUL lot of white men to be ok with dating a black woman.

 

Yes I am. An awful lot of white women seem to be okay with dating Black men.

 

They really have to be ok with crossing cultural boundaries and many just are not.

 

I have stressed that I am not focusing on scenarios where there are cultural boundaries....I have deliberately left that out of this discussion.

 

You've GOT to accept that and move on without calling them racist. IT's a preference that they just cannot ( or are extremely unwilling) to change.

 

No, it's racial discrimination and nothign is going to change THAT!!

 

It is 2005 and high time that people got beyond this foolishness though and if it takes discussions like this to get people talking and thinking....so be it. I have achieved my objective.

[KissMyTiara]

Topaz, check out your own quote:

"The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others."

 

There is an ENORMOUS difference between one's level of attraction for another person based on what they look like and judging and/or discriminating against someone because of their race. Like Tanbark said, you can't force someone to be attracted to you anymore than you can force yourself to be attracted to someone else.

 

I personally can't date short men, or overly-pale men with excessive back hair, or men with man-boobies, or men with comb-overs or mullets (or both!), or men who wear white socks with suits. These are my personal preferences. If someone says "I don't find black people attractive and therefore won't date them," that's a preference, not a judgment about their character.

[Topaze]

Originally posted by tanbark813

Calling someone a racist also isn't a good way to get them to fall in love with you.

 

If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck and quacks like a duck....guess what? It's a duck.

[tanbark813]

Okay, I get it now, we're talking about online preferences selections for dating sites. I don't know if you've noticed, but there are also categories for age, height, income level, even "body style" (though they should just call it weight). Why are you focusing sooooo much on the race preference?

 

Unless you yourself are willing to date someone of any race, age 18 to 100, a height of anywhere from 3' to 8', weight of anywhere from 100 lbs to 500 lbs, and any income level then you have no right to tell people they can't have their own preferences. Just because someone has a preference for certain races for their own, personal romantic relationships doesn't make them a bad person, nor does it mean they would discriminate against blacks--or any race for that matter--when it comes to friendships or business.

[tanbark813]

Originally posted by Topaze

If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck and quacks like a duck....guess what? It's a duck.

 

Brilliant logic. So then I guess gay people are sexist, right?

[Topaze]

This thread is about racial discrimination. If someone wants to open a thread about preferences in dating in general (e.g. what's superficial and what's not) feel free. That's a WHOLE other topic and a very worthwhile one considering the divorce rate in North America is over 50%. Clearly there is a LOT of room for improvement in terms of the criteria that people use to select partners. For this thread, however, let's stick to the topic:

 

Is it okay to rule out a WHOLE race of people, sight unseen, based on race? Would we not be further ahead to deal with people as individuals based on individual merit and compatibility instead of race?

 

I am not just focusing on on-line scenarios. I used those examples to point out that this is beyond and individual thing and deal with the arugment someone made is that "it must be the vibes that YOU are giving out". I find it absolutely fascinating when people, by their own admission discriminate and then blame the victim.

[tokyo]

If you say black women, honestly to me, it's the same as blonde women, small, skinny, whatever women, it's just a part of their appearance. For the men, it's probably less about the race, but more about the looks. Period.

[tanbark813]

Originally posted by Topaze

This thread is about racial discrimination.

 

No, this thread is about preference. For some reason you're on a crusade to make it about racial discrimination. You seem to be the only person who considers preferences based on race to be racist.

 

I'm starting to think the reason you have so much trouble dating is because you go around calling everyone a racist.. lol..

[KissMyTiara]

Originally posted by Topaze

Of course I won't and that's not what I was asking. I am asking men to be honest about why they automatically rule out and don't date Black women whether it be me or Tyra Banks or whomever. I don't have a problem with someone saying...I have met you Topaze I don't find you PERSONALLY as an individual attractive or there is something about you PERSONALLY that makes me feel that we would not be a good fit.

 

I DO have a HUGE problem and think that it is TOTALLY unacceptable for men or women to rule out an entire race of people based on their race. When a man goes on eharmony speaks with me or any other Black woman at length and then suddenly cuts off communication as soon as I tell him I am Black without even seeing my picture...he isn't rejecting ME....he is rejecting BLACK women.

 

Don't take it so personal! Sheesh! Maybe they just don't find the features of a black woman attractive - you're a black woman, you know what they are. Dark skin, lighter palms and soles, larger facial features, different texture to the hair, etc. Maybe the person generally only likes blondes with blue eyes...there aren't a he!! of a whole lot of black women with natural blonde hair and blue eyes!!

 

Good for you that you are attracted to every single race of men. I am NOT racist, nor do I prejudge people. But I'll tell you this, while I am attracted to and will date white men, hispanic men, and black men, I am NOT attracted to nor will I date Japanese, Korean, Vietnamese, or Chinese men, nor will I date an Indian man, or most men from the middle east. It's a preferance. It's what I am attracted to.

 

RACIALLY SPEAKING, each RACE has distinct physical characteristics. If you know that you are NOT attracted to a certain physical characteristic, (i.e., hair texture of black people, eye shape of Asian people, etc.), then what on Earth is wrong with nixing them from your dating pool?? ESPECIALLY when you are dating online, that is the perfect place to make your preferences known and to be able to be picky so that you can find someone who is attractive to you and just as attracted TO you.

 

I have achieved my objective.

 

And just what is that?

[KissMyTiara]

Originally posted by tanbark813

 

 

Brilliant logic. So then I guess gay people are sexist, right?

 

 

Originally posted by Topaze

This thread is about racial discrimination. If someone wants to open a thread about preferences in dating in general (e.g. what's superficial and what's not) feel free. That's a WHOLE other topic and a very worthwhile one considering the divorce rate in North America is over 50%. Clearly there is a LOT of room for improvement in terms of the criteria that people use to select partners. For this thread, however, let's stick to the topic:

 

Is it okay to rule out a WHOLE race of people, sight unseen, based on race? Would we not be further ahead to deal with people as individuals based on individual merit and compatibility instead of race?

 

 

NOOOOOOOOOOOO this thread is NOT about racial discrimination. You can call it that all you want, but what you are describing is not racial discrimination, it's ROMANTIC PREFERENCE.

[Pocky]

This is a pointless debate. Everyone discriminates racially. And, for as long as my spirit resides in this body, I'll screw who I want.

[KissMyTiara]

I agree. Let's all just screw who we want, be them white, black, brown, purple, or polka dotted.

[Mr Spock]

Yes I am. An awful lot of white women seem to be okay with dating Black men.

 

Now THAT is a stereotype. And it's also not true.

 

 

If a man doesn't desire black women sexually, is that his fault? It's the same mindset as people stating homosexuality is a concious choice (OH THE HORROR) Does it make him a bad person? Is every white man here who fell in love with a non black woman somehow ripping you off?

 

Would I be racist if I stated I find other races than my own less attractive? I certainly don't wish harm upon different nationalities, I just may not want to f*ck them as much.

[HokeyReligions]

The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.

 

OK. Lets back up to one of your definitions. Look at the clarifying statement that you quoted.

 

and that a particular race is superior to others

 

Not everyone who says they are not attracted to [color] skin believes that a person with [color] skin is inferior. It IS a preference.

 

To state that anyone expressing their opinion on a race, any race, because they don't find the features normally associated with that race is also saying that they are superior is an assumption, and you know what they say about assumptions.

[Topaze]

Originally posted by tanbark813

No, this thread is about preference. For some reason you're on a crusade to make it about racial discrimination. You seem to be the only person who considers preferences based on race to be racist.

 

I'm starting to think the reason you have so much trouble dating is because you go around calling everyone a racist.. lol..

 

Sorry, I am the one that started this thread, remember. If you will note the title it is Racial Discrimination or Personal Preference and I posted the opening post making it clear what the focus was to be.

 

If you wish to start a thread about personal preferences in dating...feel free. As I have already stated, it is a worthwhile topic but NOT the focus of this particular thread. I really would like to see this issue explored as it came up in another thread a few times and was not related to THAT thread. Let's stop taking things off track or it will never be possible to discuss any issue in depth.

 

Also, let's focus on issues not psychoanalyzing people.....I doubt that you are a qualified therapist.

[Topaze]

Originally posted by HokeyReligions

OK. Lets back up to one of your definitions. Look at the clarifying statement that you quoted.

 

and that a particular race is superior to others

 

Not everyone who says they are not attracted to [color] skin believes that a person with [color] skin is inferior. It IS a preference.

 

To state that anyone expressing their opinion on a race, any race, because they don't find the features normally associated with that race is also saying that they are superior is an assumption, and you know what they say about assumptions.

 

Please read ALL the definitions....the key here is that people are being treated differently because of their RACE..... However, I will challenge you on the superiority thing too. Clearly there is an evaluation going on here when people are saying that Black women, Asian men etc. aren't attractive....they are IN essences showing a preference based on RACE that makes it clear that they find White people more attractive....better....superior...

 

It is fascinating to watch people try to justify their own prejudices...absolutely fascinating. I am just going to listen for a while and see what other excuses people will use.

[tokyo]

Originally posted by Topaze

Sorry, I started this thread and if you will note the title it is Racial Discrimination or Personal Preference and I posted the opening post making it clear what the focus was to be.

 

If you wish to start a thread about personal preferences in dating...feel free. As I have already stated, it is a worthwhile topic but NOT the focus of this particular thread. I really would like to see this issue explored as it came up in another thread a few times and was not related to THAT thread. Let's stop taking things off track or it will never be possible to discuss any issue in depth.

 

Also, let's focus on issues not psychoanalyzing people.....I doubt that you are a qualified therapist.

 

If the thread title is "racial discrimination or personal preference" then why is it not allowed to talk about personal preferences? And why should we accept your definitions?