Wife of 31 years had an affair, my story

[bigman1]

please ask yourself how you can say, in light of everything you've told us about your wife's abuse history, etc., that you would be fine with her cheating with another woman in the future? unbelievable.

[velvette]

I don't know the exact statistics....but i am willing to bet...that at least 50% of young girls are molested or raped...and in most cases by family members.

 

I am one of those victims....my daughter is one....my mother is one....my sister in law is one.....on and on

 

it is traumatic.....it is life changing....

 

in this story....Mrs. VBM is who she is....all of the events in her life helped to shape her.

 

Everyone here is very sympathetic....and we would all undo the hurt she suffered as a child. No one is unfeeling about the trauma she suffered.

 

Prisons are full of people who suffered pain as children....they committed crimes....rape, murder, robbery...etc. We understand that they may have done these horrific things because of the traumatic things that happened in their childhoods. But we still hold them accountable for what they have done.

 

In this story....Mrs. VBM is STILL responsible for her actions...regardless of

her background...regardless of her mindset.

 

She may have suffered great anguish as a child....but she has caused her husband to suffer great anguish by her actions. She is still responsible for that pain.

 

IF they choose as a couple to reconcile....

IF they choose to remain together...

There is a lot of work to be done individually and collectively.

 

Mrs. VBM....certainly needs IC....she has to sort through her trauma, and she has to take responsibility for what she has done....regardless of her past. We are not talking about a child.....she has been married 31 years...she has raised a family....

 

It is HER responsibility to help her husband heal from the wounds she has caused him...

 

Stop picturing an 8 year old rape victim and see a mature woman who made very bad choices....and is responsible for those choices.

 

 

Statistics I have seen range from 10-35% of children are sexually abused. Of course, its impossible to know since so many children do not tell. If you are in a family where the predator is a family member of course it may seem much higher.

 

 

The fact that our prisons are full of people who were abused is surely testatment to the fact that as a society we are not handling this problem well.

 

 

In any case, this is not a court of law and Mrs. VBM has not committed a crime. But, if she had, the judge or jury would surely be considering her abuse as a mitigating factor in determining her sentence. It would be up to each juror to accept or reject it as a mitigating factor. So, I'm not sure why you are acting like this is an unheard of concept.

 

 

It should be clear to any rational person that the nature of her actions are tied to her abuse. Its only up to VBM whether or not he sees this as a mitigating factor in his decision to forgive her infidelity or to divorce her or not.

 

 

Further, not looking at the wounded child will not make her go away.

Edited August 25, 2015 by velvette

[66Charger]

This story has come completely full circle. All the post last year are being repeated. All the defenses are still the same. Different lines, but the defense reads identical.

 

What is the likelyhood that 8 months from now this will repeat for a 3rd time?

[Mrs. John Adams]

ok whatever you say.....

[TX-SC]

It should be clear to any rational person that the nature of her actions are tied to her abuse. Its only up to VBM whether or not he sees this as a mitigating factor in his decision to forgive her infidelity or to divorce her or not.

 

 

Further, not looking at the wounded child will not make her go away.

 

I don't necessarily consider myself the most rational person, but...

 

It can be difficult separating fact from fiction when it comes to psycho-babble. I realize that being raped as a child will have a significant impact. However, since I have not been through such a thing, how does going through that result in a person feeling the need to show their vagina and boobs to ANYBODY that will look. And how does THAT then lead to eating out a stripper and then having an affair with a scummy dude off of a webcam? Again, I realize it must be a horrific experience she went through. I could see it leading to distrust, attachment issues, etc. It's just hard to understand how it leads to exhibitionism and cheating?

 

VBM, I have great respect for what you are doing. It really takes a hell of a good guy to do what you are doing. Personally, I feel I would have bailed as soon as I heard her goodbye phone call.

[atreides]

I'm not blind to anything. When an aiplane crashes the cause is always traced back to a series of events that led to the crash. The cause of the crash is always determined to be that initial action. In this case the "crash" never happens if the OM did not call her and start the process of "courting" her. She totally made the choice to cheat AFTER the initial cause due to the intense pursuit of the OM.

 

If the OM never came along she never would have cheated. How else do you explain the 30 years of faithfulness? The process started with the OM's aggression period and I'm not blind to anything.

 

There is a difference between saying "opportunity" vs "a predator chased her" cheating always requires opportunity, but it is that what she creates, not the other man.

That the entire point, it is not about the other man or what he did, as you focus and on "how he perused her."

That is chasing the wrong rabbit and wont solve the real issues.

Moreover you cannot explain 30 years of faithfulness because you simply don't know. You may insist you do, but empirically at this point that is a crap shoot. It is one thing for a wayward to marginalize but quite another when a BS does.

This is not a plane crash, this is a series of choices that can be stopped at any time, drastically different.

We clearly still disagree even months out, so be it... what progress then have you made in your marriage?

Where are you with your wife and your faith in her?

[velvette]

I don't necessarily consider myself the most rational person, but...

 

It can be difficult separating fact from fiction when it comes to psycho-babble. I realize that being raped as a child will have a significant impact. However, since I have not been through such a thing, how does going through that result in a person feeling the need to show their vagina and boobs to ANYBODY that will look. And how does THAT then lead to eating out a stripper and then having an affair with a scummy dude off of a webcam? Again, I realize it must be a horrific experience she went through. I could see it leading to distrust, attachment issues, etc. It's just hard to understand how it leads to exhibitionism and cheating?

 

VBM, I have great respect for what you are doing. It really takes a hell of a good guy to do what you are doing. Personally, I feel I would have bailed as soon as I heard her goodbye phone call.

 

 

It does lead to the symptoms you mentioned, but other symptoms frequently associated with CSA are promiscuous sexual behavior and/or impulsive and risk taking behavior.

 

 

Usually there is also extreme shame and/or rage about what has happened. If a child decides not to tell, to push it all down and basically just disassociate from/pretend like it didn't happen, then eventually its all going to come back up at some point.

 

 

Usually, there is something triggering or a series of stresses that make it come back up.

 

 

Behavior that mimics the original trauma is a maladaptive coping mechanism to deal with those feelings. It makes the person feel (initially) like they are in control of those feelings.

 

 

In her original CSA it started with being made to exhibit herself to the rapist. Voluntarily exhibiting herself makes her feel in control. She feels power vs powerless like she felt when she was being abused. She's also getting rewarded by whomever is watching in the way of compliments/validation. Temporary relief of shame.

 

 

The sex with the stripper and the OM were natural progressions from the desire to exhibit herself. Like most garden variety cheaters she was seeking validation she cant provide herself although she has more extreme reasons for needing that validation than most. The stripper and the OM were the first people who accepted her for who she was and told her she was ok for wanting to exhibit herself to strangers. Again, relief from shame.

[Mrs. John Adams]

Well I gotta say....I have learned a lot.....a ons is NOT an affair and because I was molested as a child...I am allowed to be a cheating wife.

 

Wow you guys are awesome!

Thanks for helping a girl out!

 

 

And we wonder why the world has become full of self absorbed irresponsible people? No one is accountable for their actions...it is always someone else's fault.

 

I am responsible for my cheating. I am responsible for causing my husband pain. It isn't my om's fault...it isn't my cousins fault...it isn't my great grandfathers fault...it isn't my lesbian aunts fault.

It is my fault......and it certainly is not my husbands fault.

 

No excuses...no reasons....no feeling sorry for myself....

Edited August 26, 2015 by Mrs. John Adams

[autumnnight]

Maybe the answer is to separate the very real trauma from the unfaithful behavior.

 

I'll admit, one of the reasons this thread tends to trigger me is because.....the rape angle is almost...sarcastically demeaned at times?

 

Here's the thing, maybe one day down the road we find out Ann WASN'T raped. Heck, maybe sometime down the road we find out VBM doesn't exist.

 

It is not out of the realm of possibility that one day a BS or WS may stumble onto LS who HAS had childhood rape mixed into the issue, and they are going to refer to THIS thread for help. What would we say to them?

 

Call it what you want, psycho-babble, whatever, childhood rape (any rape actually) does leave an impact. In fact, it is VERY common for rape victims to actually have rape or exploitation fantasies as a way to be in control of their victimhood (since they weren't the first time around).

 

It is also true that even with our baggage, we ARE responsible for ALL of our choices. We cannot say "the sad little girl in me made me cheat." Should that sad girl be addressed? Yes. Does she give the adult a free pass? No.

 

I guess I'm just not seeing why it is so hard to hold a person accountable for cheating AND have respectful empathy for their trauma. Surely we don't have to make fun of and demean their experience in order to remind them they are still at fault for cheating....

[Mrs. John Adams]

Autumn..I love what you said here and I agree with it.

 

I of all people do understand the trauma that this story reveals about ann...and I am sympathetic towards her.

 

 

 

We all have "stuff" in our lives....and that "stuff" plays an important role in who we are....but we cannot use it as a cop out. I don't think ann is using it to excuse her behavior....but I think some posters here do.

 

 

Vbm turns a blind eye to almost everything said....so we can all just talk to each other while he lives in his own world.

[velvette]

Well I gotta say....I have learned a lot.....a ons is NOT an affair and because I was molested as a child...I am allowed to be a cheating wife.

 

Wow you guys are awesome!

Thanks for helping a girl out!

 

 

And we wonder why the world has become full of self absorbed irresponsible people? No one is accountable for their actions...it is always someone else's fault.

 

I am responsible for my cheating. I am responsible for causing my husband pain. It isn't my om's fault...it isn't my cousins fault...it isn't my great grandfathers fault...it isn't my lesbian aunts fault.

It is my fault......and it certainly is not my husbands fault.

 

No excuses...no reasons....no feeling sorry for myself....

 

 

No one has said anything of the sort.

[understand50]

Maybe the answer is to separate the very real trauma from the unfaithful behavior.

 

It is also true that even with our baggage, we ARE responsible for ALL of our choices. We cannot say "the sad little girl in me made me cheat." Should that sad girl be addressed? Yes. Does she give the adult a free pass? No.

 

I guess I'm just not seeing why it is so hard to hold a person accountable for cheating AND have respectful empathy for their trauma. Surely we don't have to make fun of and demean their experience in order to remind them they are still at fault for cheating....

 

Autumnight,

 

Spot on. Yes, you can have compassion for the past trauma, you can see how it impacted the behavior that led to the cheating. You can also hold them accountable for the cheating, but you do have some idea of why.

 

We all have "stuff" in our lives....and that "stuff" plays an important role in who we are....but we cannot use it as a cop out. I don't think ann is using it to excuse her behavior....but I think some posters here do.

 

Yes, some posters do give her a pass, I don't, I do try an acknowledge Ann's hard work in trying to make admins, and courage in telling VBM her deepest darkest secrets. Look, I believe that a WS, who see the huge hurt and pain inflected on their spouse, who then works to change, and give remorse, should be supported. When a WS comes to LS, I try to support them in the actions needed to do to try and get back to being a moral person, or if the transgression is a one off, understanding how they could slip, but not be a evil person. We must help the transgressed, and those that are reaching out to stop transgressing.

 

Vbm turns a blind eye to almost everything said....so we can all just talk to each other while he lives in his own world.

 

In my opinion, VBM, has decided to reconcile or at least stand by Ann until he is sure of here well being. He has stated the apart from the affair, the marriage is "good". I do not think he is giving Ann a pass, he just know a lot more about why she did this, and it is not only his opinion, the IC states as well. Now she is going to a psychologist (?), so what they will say, maybe VBM will let us know, but his "take" is being backed up in multiple ways.

 

Why your lover cheated on you can never be answered, and will haunt the BS. In my first post, I stated that Ann, may not really know herself. I think in many cases this is so. Why, we can come close, in how it happened, and the actions leading up to it, knowing that that at each step a line was crossed. We ask, why did you not see what was going on? What was going to happen? It all boils down to the fact that for every WS out there the only answer is "They wanted to have sex, at that time with the AP". One must accept that truth. I believe that VBM accepts this from Ann, and does hold her accountable. He just has more knowledge on how she found herself in the situation. The talk about this OM, is really not relevant, Ann's behavior was placing her in situation where at some time and date she was going to cheat. It was the next step, the next high. Who she did it with, could have been any willing male.

 

This brings up the EA. I do not get the whole EA thing to some extent. I see where you can get upset, if the actions are leading to a physical affair, but I see no issue with being good platonic friends with the other sex. In Ann's case, backed up with a poly for what it worth, she recognized where it was going, and ended it.

 

As for the Female ONS, VBM just does not give that much weight. I understand that. I know that I am a callow pig in some ways, it is a failing, but if my wife came to me and said the same, my first thought would be, mmmmmm FFM Threesome? BTW, she would never want to do this, but my first thought would be....... Each of us is different, we must accept that he does not worry about it.

 

For the striping, as you should know, he was with Ann, and a bunch of friends, and all the wife's went up topless. He thought it was fun. When he learned she went with out him, he still dos not not give it much weight. This would horrify me, but it is his take. Again, he places that weight on the actual cheating. For the Web cam work, I am sure he is not happy about it, but he does understand why she did it. I think he is grateful she has opened up about this part of her life. Not happy that it happened.

 

So I do not understand, why the post about VBM rug sweeping. For all reconciliations to work, at some point the BS must accept what happened, what the WS did. They can forgive it, but does not mean they excuse it.

 

My 2 cents

[Mrs. John Adams]

Ok folks....

 

I am the biggest advocate of reconciliation on the planet...so let me assure you...I am glad in vbm's story...he has chosen to reconcile.

I am a fww...so I certainly understand and sympathize with the ww in this story.

 

I understand and have the utmost sympathy for anyone who has been abused..sexually or otherwise.

 

I am not the bad guy here.

 

What I don't tolerate well is excuses, trickle truth, and lying....and there has in my opinion been a whole lot of lying going on. Trickle truth= lying.

 

When you have committed adultery....and you have decided to reconcile one of the most important things to recovery is honesty and truth. That means putting your cards on the table...that means revealing all the ugly parts to your bs....how else can they heal if you only tell them little parts at a time? You keep reopening the wound.

 

I am going to be very honest here... In my opinion vbm is 99% of the problem...not the solution. Yes... I admire him for sticking by his wife...yes I admire him for his complete and utter support of her. Bravo...he has done that well.

 

Now...all that matters in this story is vbm and ann. My opinion, your opinion....is totally irrelevant. If her promiscuity is not an issue for him...wonderful...because he is the one in the story that has to cope with it.

 

Why he still seeks other people's opinions is beyond me. His mind is made up and by his own admission whole healing is around the corner because he has done everything right. Good for him...I am tickled pink that he has it all figured out.

 

I have not commented on this thread for the past few months because I get extremely frustrated. I feel it is time for me to shut up again. I do think vbm loves when the thread is active....I think he enjoys the banter....and I am quite certain he will continue to share with all of us the drama that I am certain still lies ahead.

I wish him well....I hope he lives happily ever after.

[TX-SC]

I'm not saying there can be no correlation, only that I have a hard time understanding how the two could be related. He's a good man, and likely doing the right thing by helping her through this and staying married. Personally, I would have divorced her. Part of being married is sharing your pain and issues with your spouse. She did not. Instead she slept around and did cam shows for strangers. If my wife is that closed and deceptive, I would not be able to move forward with the marriage.

 

Her pain is likely genuine, and I am by no means saying that physiologist are quacks. But, they do come up with some strange **** sometimes. That's why I said it's hard to tell what is psych-babble. I see them as extremely helpful in acting as a non-biased ear to help you through things. It's when they start categorizing actions that I start losing interest.

 

Yes, I feel bad for her trauma. I have two daughters and a wife. It would kill me if something happened like this to them. And, as many have said, her cheating should not be viewed in light of her past. She needs to own it and deal with it.

[bigman1]

You know, I think that my issue, apart from the inconsistencies previously detailed, is the fact that none of this seems remotely healthy. At the core, cheating is about betrayal. It is about shared intimacy with another person to a degree that should only be shared with one's spouse. (Absent agreement in the case of those into open marriage)

 

Let me start with EA's. I think that is assigned a bit too often to valid relationships. Of course, if one is dealing with infidelity, the labels probably fly fast and free. That being said, I see no problem with close friendships with opposite sex friends. I have had several and NONE ever crossed the line. I treat them like my sister or a female cousin. Whatever joke, comment, or conversation that I had with any female friend was something that I was absolutely fine with my wife hearing, reading, or having with another man if I were not there. Still, his wife had one.

 

Now with that preamble, let me say why I think this whole debacle to be unhealthy. The fact that in the abstract one may think of one's wife having sex with another woman to be sexy ignores the harsh reality of the betrayal. It is still a real betrayal. Even if you are into swinging, etc., it is still a betrayal if you are kept in the dark about it. While I don't get open relationships, I do get secrecy, hiding and improper conduct. That

VBM is not bothered by the fact that it was a woman his wife had sex with is not the issue. (1) She exposed him to STD's without his consent. (2) She deceived him in order to do it and (3) kept it secret for years. Neither of those are healthy.

 

If she wants to betray him in the future with a woman, well...he seems okay with that. Not healthy. Suppose she actually fell in love with a woman? it does happen. From a bisexual female friend of mine I learned that a lot of GNO's were just opportunities for married women to have same sex hook ups. Blew my mind. Still, would VBM be okay if she told him she was going to hook up with a woman and then, well, just could not help herself and fell in love? Is he in an open marriage or not? Open= different rules. Not open = cheating no matter the sex of the AP. His position is not clear, thus not healthy.

 

He can do what he wants. Still, calling it one affair is utterly ridiculous. It was years of lying, betrayal, and duplicity. That is the problem. Why she did it, we see. Why dis she lie. Why did she hide it. Why did she expose him to STD's. Acting out, I get. Hiding out, well, that is not the product of abuse, it is good old fashioned deceit. There is just a strong tone of unhealthy coping and rationalizations. I wish them good luck.

[understand50]

I have not commented on this thread for the past few months because I get extremely frustrated. I feel it is time for me to shut up again. I do think vbm loves when the thread is active....I think he enjoys the banter....and I am quite certain he will continue to share with all of us the drama that I am certain still lies ahead.

I wish him well....I hope he lives happily ever after.

 

Mrs JA,

 

That would be a shame, so I would hope you keep your two cents in. I had wondered what had happened to John and you, when you went "off" the air, and felt you could have added to several threads. Have also pointed out both of you to folks asking if reconciliation is possible.

 

You and John, have a unique viewpoint. I believe that all posters have something to add, and OP's should read and take what they can from everyone. I am a real strong, reconciliation guy, but I know that divorce is the only way in many threads. I have also advised divorce, when I felt that what is necessary for a true reconciliation is not happening.

 

I feel your voice was and will be missed.

 

My 2 cents worth.

[Mrs. John Adams]

Thank you...John and I are great....I had some health issues but I am doing well.

John kept up with this thread for entertainment if for no other reason.....he is a little less talkative and a lot less tolerant than I am...lol

 

 

Anyway...on with the show.....

[velvette]

 

 

No excuses...no reasons....no feeling sorry for myself....

 

 

Actually, the best thing that could happen for Mr. & Mrs. VBM is for her to have a giant pity party for herself preferably in the context of a caring relationship with her therapist.

 

 

She should feel sorry for herself. She experienced something horrific through no fault of her own. It damaged her and robbed her of things only she can define.

 

 

Accepting that and feeling sorrow over it rather than shame and disgust with herself or feeling that she is somehow to blame for what happened to her is the first step in healing and learning she can live with that hurt in healthy ways without damaging herself and others by self medicating with aberrant behavior.

 

 

Its also a powerful step in feeling empathy for the hurt she has inflicted on VBM.

 

 

Hard to have empathy for someone else when you have none for yourself.

 

 

VBM should hope to see that, encourage it and understand if its not present her therapy is not working.

[Mrs. John Adams]

nope...totally disagree...but then you seem to be the expert and i am just the

FWW who has lived 32 years in successful reconciliation

[JohnAdams]

I must admit that all we have is experience and I usually do not comment on something unless I have experience and can relate to the situation. We have lived it, we are successful. We have not done it by the text book, but, we are here and happier than ever. Some of the advice here is unbelievable. Have you ever experienced adultery? Those who have not have no clue.

[velvette]

nope...totally disagree...but then you seem to be the expert and i am just the

FWW who has lived 32 years in successful reconciliation

 

 

What exactly do you disagree with?

 

 

That is exactly how the therapeutic process works if the psychiatrist knows what they are doing.

 

 

What exactly is it that you think VBM and his wife should be doing that they are not?

 

 

I've lived almost ten years in successful reconciliation with a H who was abusing me and serially cheating. He was also raped as a child. I was also raped as a young adult. So, you are the only one claiming expertise either mine or yours. All I claim is experience that is almost identical to VBM's and success at working through it. Any other "expertise" I present, is the expertise of professionals and the combined experience of people in similar situations.

 

 

Not everyone who is abused has the same experience or is affected exactly the same way. Some people turn their pain inwards and hurt only themselves. Some just live in denial forever.

 

 

There is no need for you to invalidate other peoples experiences simply because they differ from yours.

[velvette]

I must admit that all we have is experience and I usually do not comment on something unless I have experience and can relate to the situation. We have lived it, we are successful. We have not done it by the text book, but, we are here and happier than ever. Some of the advice here is unbelievable. Have you ever experienced adultery? Those who have not have no clue.

 

Same question for you as I asked your wife. What is it that you think VBM and his wife should be doing that they are not doing?

[JohnAdams]

Same question for you as I asked your wife. What is it that you think VBM and his wife should be doing that they are not doing?

 

If VBM is happy that is all that counts. He says he is satisfied with what Ann is doing, so, all of the rest of us are really just debating moot points.

[velvette]

I disagree. The BEST thing is she could do is to take some of HER power back by pressing formal charges against her abuser...then following through with it until she feels she has some control over the result of what he did to her (and probably many others). I'd find out if he's still alive and have him charged with rape.

 

That would help her to move forward and be contrary action to having been his victim all these years.

 

And I hope she will.

 

 

Sadly, that is unlikely to be possible given the statute of limitations in most states. Even if she lives in a state where the statue has been redefined to start running when she realizes as an adult that a crime was committed against her, she will be hard pressed to prove that she just realized that.

[undercover_lover]

What exactly do you disagree with?

 

 

That is exactly how the therapeutic process works if the psychiatrist knows what they are doing.

 

 

What exactly is it that you think VBM and his wife should be doing that they are not?

 

 

I've lived almost ten years in successful reconciliation with a H who was abusing me and serially cheating. He was also raped as a child. I was also raped as a young adult. So, you are the only one claiming expertise either mine or yours. All I claim is experience that is almost identical to VBM's and success at working through it. Any other "expertise" I present, is the expertise of professionals and the combined experience of people in similar situations.

 

 

Not everyone who is abused has the same experience or is affected exactly the same way. Some people turn their pain inwards and hurt only themselves. Some just live in denial forever.

 

 

There is no need for you to invalidate other peoples experiences simply because they differ from yours.

 

 

 

I don't take what mrs ja has said as invalidating. She is sharing her experience with the subject just as you are.