The winter blues -- how to cope?

[whichwayisup]

TRIPLE dose with vitamin D. This is very important. Same goes with vitamin C. It makes a difference in mood and energy.

 

Yoga and any type of exercise does help ward off S.A.D, keeps your mind and body active.

 

It's hard sometimes but don't give into junk food cravings. Have a bowl of fruit with yoghurt and granola instead of chips and chocolate.

 

Spend time with friends. When you don't feel good, feel blah and low, reach out, get a friend to come hang out with you. It'll perk you up and make you forget how crappy you feel.

 

Hope this helps.

[whichwayisup]

Here'a a very basic question: What's the best way for me to go about finding a good psychiatrist in my area? I haven't done this before and just searching on Google is overwhelming. But I also don't necessarily want to talk about this with friends, so I'm probably not going to get any word-of-mouth suggestions.

 

Try your local colleges and universities. Try the hospital or medical clinics. Google cognitive behaviour therapy, this type of counseling is really helpful when it comes to anxiety, depression, S.A.D etc..

[Standard-Fare]

Well, you already know what's wrong with you. A GP or a psych isn't going to know which AD is most likely to work for you. So either of them is going to use the hit and miss method. But, of course, play it safe.

 

 

For me, it worked to go in with knowledge behind me, knowing the doses of various drugs, knowing the more severe side effects, and knowing how long to give it. Noncompliance is the biggest factor in failure with ADs. I also consulted friends regarding what worked best for them. Read up on dopamine vs serotonin.

 

 

Go in with the knowledge in YOUR hand, and you'll come out safely and on top. (If you decide to go that route). Meanwhile, keep pushing the exercise. And music! Music really helps me.

 

 

Again, good luck!

 

I guess I just don't feel knowledgeable enough to make the decisions on my medication myself. Even if I spent hours researching.

 

And I shouldn't HAVE to. I'm a civilian, not a doctor with years of training. That's why I want a doctor who can give me a thoughtful prescription based on my own conditions/history.

 

I didn't get an answer before when I asked about how to find good psychiatrists in my area. It feels like such a crapshoot on Google, etc. Are there any good resources/databases/rating systems that people can recommend?

[MidwestUSA]

I guess I just don't feel knowledgeable enough to make the decisions on my medication myself. Even if I spent hours researching.

 

And I shouldn't HAVE to. I'm a civilian, not a doctor with years of training. That's why I want a doctor who can give me a thoughtful prescription based on my own conditions/history.

 

 

Do you have a GP who can recommend a psych for you? Just a thought.

 

 

The problem is, either type of doc doesn't know, no matter how much you can describe your predicament, which drug is going to be right for YOU. So there may still be some trial and error involved. And there's nothing to say that the first one they give you may react wrongly with your body and turn you off meds altogether (as if you're not already sitting on the fence;))

 

 

A 'thoughtful' prescription would be the one they've had the most success with, for SAD, in the largest number of treated patients, with the least amount of side effects, at the lowest starting dose. Here's where Google is your friend.

 

 

Is there a large university/teaching hospital near you with a psych department? I'm lucky to live near some of the best hospitals in the states, if I should ever need them.

[Lernaean_Hydra]

I guess I just don't feel knowledgeable enough to make the decisions on my medication myself. Even if I spent hours researching.

 

And I shouldn't HAVE to. I'm a civilian, not a doctor with years of training. That's why I want a doctor who can give me a thoughtful prescription based on my own conditions/history.

 

I can't say I agree with this. Doctors are trained yes and it's true, you are not a doctor however you can't be so complacent about your own mental health and rely on others. Only you know you better than anyone else, including even a physician with decades of training.

 

You have to put in the effort of research, look at the top 10 or 15 antidepressants on the market, see the reviews, compare and contrast their side effects and effectiveness and see which ones you feel you can live with. Midwest and I both recommended Wellbutrin and I suggested Cymbalta. Start there.

[MidwestUSA]

I can't say I agree with this. Doctors are trained yes and it's true, you are not a doctor however you can't be so complacent about your own mental health and rely on others. Only you know you better than anyone else, including even a physician with decades of training.

 

You have to put in the effort of research, look at the top 10 or 15 antidepressants on the market, see the reviews, compare and contrast their side effects and effectiveness and see which ones you feel you can live with. Midwest and I both recommended Wellbutrin and I suggested Cymbalta. Start there.

 

 

 

Agree. And to throw one more in there, a straight SSRI reuptake inhibitor - Celexa or Lexapro. That way all three bases are covered.

 

 

LH, I was shocked to read of your experiences as a teen. How horrible. Glad to see you came thru the other side. I've been on a dose of Wellbutrin that was too high, and had to drink to offset the effects. I wanted to crawl out of my skin. I'm just glad I didn't seize. But at a lower dose, it has saved my life (as I know it).

[FitChick]

Forget pharmaceuticals. Take 1000mg vitamin D3 twice a day. I get mine from Trader Joe's-- cheap.

[Copelandsanity]

Forget pharmaceuticals. Take 1000mg vitamin D3 twice a day. I get mine from Trader Joe's-- cheap.

 

I take 2400 IU of vitamin D from various supplements (multi, Bone-Up, regular Vit D3), plus I use a light therapy box 60 minutes a day on my desk at work in the morning time.

[Els]

For me it's not necessarily about the cold, although I don't love that.

 

It's the darkness. When the sun sets at 4:30 as it has been lately, I feel like the walls are closing in on me. To my body/mind, that signals that the day is over, yet in practical terms I realize I "should" be awake for another six-plus hours, doing productive things. I feel guilty and worthless when I end up just binging on Netflix and falling asleep as early as I possibly can.

 

The inability to exercise outdoors is also stifling to me. In the warmer months I'm always riding my bike, hiking, etc. That simply can't be replaced by a pitch-black walk to the gym and an hour on the elliptical.

 

Ah, okay, I get that. Yes, the early sunsets do get to me too. IMO it's made worse by daylight savings - timezones should just stay an hour later so the sun sets at 5.30. Then at least many people would still be able to get some sun after work.

 

Is there anything engaging that you enjoy that could be done without sunlight? Learning a new skill or a new hobby at home? Or going out to eat or such?

 

Not in those places it doesn't. SAD is caused by an absence of sunlight and cold cloudy weather.

 

Yes, this is true for seasonal depression. The poster I quoted, even though she used the term SAD, seemed to be speaking of depression in more general terms though, especially as she was trying to causally link it to antidepressant prescription. That's as ridiculous as saying that bacterial infections only emerged after microbiological science was established.

[Standard-Fare]

Ah, okay, I get that. Yes, the early sunsets do get to me too. IMO it's made worse by daylight savings - timezones should just stay an hour later so the sun sets at 5.30. Then at least many people would still be able to get some sun after work.

 

Is there anything engaging that you enjoy that could be done without sunlight? Learning a new skill or a new hobby at home? Or going out to eat or such?

 

To me, darkness always just signals "Show's over, there's nothing more to be had out of this day," and I've never been able to rid myself of that mentality.

 

I remember even back in school, I'd have a hard time doing homework/studying once the day turned dark, because it just felt like pure deep hopeless nighttime -- too late to make a difference.

 

When it's dark out now, I just revert to sedentary habits of watching TV, eating, Internet. And it doesn't make me happy. If I found a way to make more productive use of the dark hours, I'm sure I'd be a much more happy and effective person. But I'm not sure how to flip that switch. I'm not even sure antidepressants could help.

 

Does anyone else have success with this? (If you're posting to strangers on an Internet forum right now, my guess is, probably not. )

[Els]

To me, darkness always just signals "Show's over, there's nothing more to be had out of this day," and I've never been able to rid myself of that mentality.

 

I remember even back in school, I'd have a hard time doing homework/studying once the day turned dark, because it just felt like pure deep hopeless nighttime -- too late to make a difference.

 

When it's dark out now, I just revert to sedentary habits of watching TV, eating, Internet. And it doesn't make me happy. If I found a way to make more productive use of the dark hours, I'm sure I'd be a much more happy and effective person. But I'm not sure how to flip that switch. I'm not even sure antidepressants could help.

 

Sounds like you're a morning lark. How about going to bed earlier and waking up earlier to do more stuff then? I'm a huge night owl and have always preferred working at night, but we're all different.

 

Does anyone else have success with this? (If you're posting to strangers on an Internet forum right now, my guess is, probably not. )

 

Well, it's barely dusk here, and almost summer. But really, what was the point of this statement? People are taking time out of their day/night to try and help you by posting on this thread. It doesn't mean anything about them or what else they might be doing.

[OwMyEyeball]

First off, the people suggesting medication as a first-line of defense are off their rockers. What utter nonsense to suggest powerful mind-altering drugs for a seasonal affliction that has a relatively minor impact on the person's life.

 

SSRI's? For SAD? Are you f*cking out of your minds? Oh, but Google will steer you on the right path? My God, that has to be some of the worst advice I've ever seen around these parts. Want to know my counter-argument? Google it.

 

As for ways OP can navigate around the winter blues:

 

- Vitamin D

 

- Light boxes

 

- Intense exercise

 

- Meditation

 

- Higher emphasis on socializing (even light socializing)

 

- Accept your depression! For the most part it's your body slowing down, not some bottomless chasm into oblivion. If you're going from there into suicidal ideation or some seriously dark thoughts what you need is therapy to help you understand the root of those, not a bottle of Prozac or Effexor. Those are intended to stabilize you to the point where therapy can be properly introduced. They are NOT the cure to what ails you, especially not for SAD.

[Rejected Rosebud]

First off, the people suggesting medication as a first-line of defense are off their rockers.

 

I think that is kind of out of line, there are people here who have been through a lot and meds have helped them, I don't think they're off their rockers or that they learned it from google.

 

For the most part it's your body slowing down, not some bottomless chasm into oblivion. If you're going from there into suicidal ideation or some seriously dark thoughts what you need is therapy to help you understand the root of those,

 

That is not really true, there are congenital predispositions to psychiatric disorders, the kinds that talk therapy does not touch and if you're headed to suicidal ideation you are already in serious trouble. I didn't learn this from Google.

[MidwestUSA]

I think that is kind of out of line, there are people here who have been through a lot and meds have helped them, I don't think they're off their rockers or that they learned it from google.

 

That is not really true, there are congenital predispositions to psychiatric disorders, the kinds that talk therapy does not touch and if you're headed to suicidal ideation you are already in serious trouble. I didn't learn this from Google.

 

Thanks, Rose. As one whose life has literally been saved by pharmacology, I appreciate that.

 

 

It's good to respect the viewpoints of others, and be open to any and all suggestions. Evaluate them, then accept or disregard. Pretty simple really. Do some research, find out what might help, starting with the least invasive/disturbing to the body. Trial and error with a lot of patience.

 

A trip to a GP who knows your history is a good first step.

 

 

Closed mindedness is such an unattractive trait.

[most_distant_galaxy]

Do you eat well? Enough vitamin D and omega-3? My grandmother has this, I also have this in smaller doses. My grandmother benefited from cod liver oil. In hard days I benefit from keeping all my house lights on and taking vitamin D supplements.

[Haydn]

Yes this is a feature in our household.

 

 

 

QUOTE=most_distant_galaxy;6008475]Do you eat well? Enough vitamin D and omega-3? My grandmother has this, I also have this in smaller doses. My grandmother benefited from cod liver oil. In hard days I benefit from keeping all my house lights on and taking vitamin D supplements.

[OwMyEyeball]

Thanks, Rose. As one whose life has literally been saved by pharmacology, I appreciate that.

 

 

It's good to respect the viewpoints of others, and be open to any and all suggestions. Evaluate them, then accept or disregard. Pretty simple really. Do some research, find out what might help, starting with the least invasive/disturbing to the body. Trial and error with a lot of patience.

 

A trip to a GP who knows your history is a good first step.

And it's also good to challenge what in my opinion is bad advice. The OP is struggling with lethargy, not a mental disorder. There's no pathology here.

 

Suggesting someone try anti-depressants for the winter blues is akin to suggesting to someone complaining of a mild headache to go straight for the morphine.

 

These drugs are intended as the option of last resort, not the vanguard treatment for common ailments.

 

I've had enough of my own experiences with Wellburtin, Paxil, Prozac and most recently, Effexor, along with plenty of my own research, direct questions to psychiatrists and GP's to form my own opinion on these drugs.

 

My conclusion: Don't reach for them unless you've tried everything else. At this point I don't care whose feelings I hurt to get that message across to anyone considering psychoactive drugs. ESPECIALLY for something as mundane as the winter blues. The idea that you can just go on and off these drugs with no serious consequences is dangerous.

 

Closed mindedness is such an unattractive trait.

If I had LS confused with a dating site that might be an issue for me.

[Standard-Fare]

@OwMyEyeball, your points aren't falling on deaf ears here. As you've seen I've been hesitant about meds throughout the thread. Like you I also have my own experiences with them... I was on Paxil for a couple years in college (over a decade ago).

 

I also have seen some people destroyed by pills. One friend of mine has completely lost her personality and become an absolute zombie, due to careless diagnoses and prescriptions. She's completely addicted to opiods (on top of the antidepressants/anti-anxiety stuff she takes). Another friend spends her days jacked up to an unnerving degree on high doses of Adderall, though she doesn't have any condition that warrants it. But guess what, she couldn't sleep (of course not, she's on speed), so then her doc gave her Ambien for night. She now takes three Ambien nightly.

 

So I totally agree that there's a real problem in this society with pills being recklessly overprescribed by doctors who just want you in and out.

 

As far as my "winter blues," I've done some thinking and absorbed lots of opinions, and I think I'm going to try to deal with this without meds for now.

 

I'm going to work to improve my nutrition, take vitamins (including high doses of Vit C), and force myself to get off my lazy ass and exercise at least four times a week. If I do that for a while and still feel like sh*t, then I might try some meds.

[Maleficent]

I'm one of the many people who experiences Seasonal Affective Disorder: depression that starts with the onset of winter and lasts until spring. I'd like some insight from others who know about/experience this condition.

 

In the past few weeks it's been hitting me hard, and I can admit I'm not functioning on a high level. I'm putting minimal effort into my job and social life, and I waste my free time with napping or binge-watching TV. I've also been going to sleep early/waking up late. It's pathetic and I'm not proud of myself but I truly feel like I have zero energy or motivation. In the warmer months I am a much more active, social and positive person.

 

I'm unsure of the best way to deal with this. I've already made a couple travel plans this winter to warm-weather locales, so that should help get me out of my funk temporarily. I do try to exercise but my lethargy's made that difficult lately. I'd like to avoid medication if possible but I admit I need some help beyond myself.

 

I'm also dealing with SAD. Staying regularly active makes an incredible difference. I also take Vitamin D every (alternate 1 day of 1000UI and 1 day of 2000UI).

I also have light therapy but find it's a little inconvenient to use every morning...

 

I'm trying to get my insurance company to reimburse a trip to Cuba every February but they're really not open to the idea.

[Maleficent]

@OwMyEyeball, your points aren't falling on deaf ears here. As you've seen I've been hesitant about meds throughout the thread. Like you I also have my own experiences with them... I was on Paxil for a couple years in college (over a decade ago).

 

 

Considering anti depressants can take up to 6 months to reach full effect, you really don't need to take them only for SAD because you'd be taking them only 6-7 months per year. Unless you decide to take meds constantly, I Wouldn't look at this option for SAD.

[Standard-Fare]

Considering anti depressants can take up to 6 months to reach full effect, you really don't need to take them only for SAD because you'd be taking them only 6-7 months per year. Unless you decide to take meds constantly, I Wouldn't look at this option for SAD.

 

I'm not a stranger to depression in general. I've considered whether it would be a good idea to do them year-round.

 

When I took them in the past, I really needed them. My mind was simply not functioning properly. My thoughts were running in an endless little loop and I couldn't focus on anything or feel any pleasure. I couldn't get through a 30-minute TV show... could barely listen to a full song. The antidepressants did help my brain get out of this rut.

 

But once I stabilized, I didn't see any benefits to the antidepressants on a day-to-day basis. I wasn't "happier," more energetic, more productive, anything. So eventually I got off them, and I didn't notice much difference.

 

I've had a couple times in the past 10 years when I've fallen into that rock-bottom hole and come very close to starting meds again, but somehow I've always recovered.

 

I'm not in that dark place right now. I'm just listless and lazy. I want to see if I can pull myself out.

[Divasu]

You can be hesitant with taking medication but if you are hesitant about getting in to see a Professional to assess the situation and possibly help you, or at least be open to that, then you are wasting your own time.

 

Until then, no one can help you.

 

If you think you can self-manage SAD all on your own, good-luck. You will certainly need it. My mother chose that route (solely self-managing, no therapy), and she became a Xanax addict before she knew it.

 

So, seems to be that unless you live in an area with no seasons, this "thing" will continue to be present for the rest of your life. SAD is a subtype of major depression. And once you have major depression, look out.

[OwMyEyeball]

OP - Here's my winter blues battle plan. The only time it's failed me is when I've failed to implement it.

 

0500 - Light box simulated sunrise and gentle alarm (over 30m)

 

0530 - Turn on larger, broad area light box; 15min of light exercises (push ups, pull ups, dips, planks, squats, sit ups); energetic music

- 15min of stretches

 

0600 - Breakfast; include Omega-3 oil in whatever I'm having (to keep things simple I have the same breakfast every day); take Vitamin D

 

0630 - Meditation; Vipassana technique; 1 hour

 

0730 - Shower and get ready

 

0800 - Start the day (sun has risen by now)

 

1100 - Light lunch

 

1230 - Intense exercise (CrossFit these days, though when I lived further north I'd go cross country skiing for an hour) and stretching

 

1730 - Light box on while fixing dinner; light music

 

1800 - Dinner w/ light box

 

2000 - Meditation; 1 hour

 

2100 - Light reading in bed w/ light box sunset simulator set on 30m countdown

 

2130 - Asleep (usually before that)

 

Adjust the schedule anyway you see fit. Key takeaways are:

 

- Simulated sunrise sunset

- Light box

- Exercise

- Routine!

- Caffeine (not mentioned above, but a very good pick-me-up)

- Vitamin D

- Meditation (while the above address the physiological underpinnings of the winter blues, meditation intercedes against the psychological violence that turns depression into a torturous experience)

- Avoid alcohol! It's called a depressant for a reason

 

Within a few days of adopting this schedule and ardently sticking to it my mood and energy levels drastically improve. That's always been the case. Me, the guy with Social Anxiety Disorder, General Anxiety Disorder, Dysthymia, Major Depressive Disorder, Seasonal Affective Disorder. Oh, and Adult ADHD. Every symptom related to those "disorders" vanishes. No medication. Only willful action spurred on and supported by loved ones and, at times, coffee. The biggest issue I run into when applying this lifestyle is complacency - I feel so good that I allow myself to slip up in key areas and so begin my slow descent back into Hell. I'm getting better at catching myself and certainly allow for some flexibility in the routine. My summers would probably also benefit from a bit more strictness in my lifestyle.

 

Medications have their place, but in my experience they should only be introduced when all other methods have failed or the person is no longer able to function in their work and social environments.

[whichwayisup]

I'm not in that dark place right now. I'm just listless and lazy. I want to see if I can pull myself out.

 

You start off with small tasks to get you motivated. Build upon that. You can pull yourself out of it, just be tough/harder on yourself to get stuff done and accomplished. Even invite a trusted friend to come over and keep you company while you do some chores in the house. Might help push you.

 

0500 - Light box simulated sunrise and gentle alarm (over 30m)

 

Very cool. (I have an image of your alarm going off then slowly this S.A.D light comes on glowing sunrise..) Except no way am I gonna start my day at 5am.

[OwMyEyeball]

You start off with small tasks to get you motivated. Build upon that. You can pull yourself out of it, just be tough/harder on yourself to get stuff done and accomplished. Even invite a trusted friend to come over and keep you company while you do some chores in the house. Might help push you.

That's a really helpful tip. It's better to start off small and build in increments, especially when trying to bring yourself out of a funk.

 

 

Very cool. (I have an image of your alarm going off then slowly this S.A.D light comes on glowing sunrise..) Except no way am I gonna start my day at 5am.

The lamp is in my Top 3 life purchases. The dawn function work very smoothly by gradually and subtly brightening the lamp LED's over a 30 minute period (sunset/sunrise time can be adjusted to user preference). I'm awake before my eyes open. My mind believes it's a bright, cheerful morning and has already got me ready to get out of bed long before the gentle alarm starts to chime. There's always a bit of a shock when I finally do open my eyes and realize "Oh yes ... this trickery again." But by then I'm wide awake and just have to reach over to flick on the larger lamp to douse the whole room in a pale blue light. The most important thing is to have a routine for the first couple of hours out of bed. It becomes habitual rather quickly.

 

The sunset feature is also pretty cool and when I combine it with inspiring or light-hearted reading makes an immense difference in how I feel the following morning. The gradual dimming of the light gets me groggy by the 20 minute mark. Once I turn the lamp off (I rarely wait for it to go all the way to dark), lay the book aside and hit the pillow I'm off in lala land within a minute.

 

What I do on either side of my sleep makes a world of difference to how I go about my day.

 

Waking up at 5 AM isn't so bad provided I'm asleep by 10PM. With the light lamp I'm able to very easily maintain a summer sleep cycle. Once mid-spring comes around I put the lamp aside and build my day around the natural sun cycle.