I love him but I don't know what he's thinking anymore

[chimpanA-2-chimpanZ]

What you should do is block this guy's phone number, email, and everything else, so you are never tempted or able to speak with him again. He's not going to initiate contact. There's no loss.

 

I can say with 100% certainty that this guy is not interested in you. You didn't even have a relationship. He repeatedly insisted you were just friends in the six weeks you were "together". Saying "I care a whole lot" while making zero effort to see you, communicate with you, or spend time with you means he's not interested, period.

 

It's pretty self-centered to assume that him being on Facebook for long periods of time has anything to do with you. What if he's talking to a relative? Or a new woman?

 

I'll be honest: when I read this post, I would have guessed you were seventeen or eighteen (talking about cuddling, being in love after six weeks of not-even-dating, parents being out of town, and all that). When you said you were in your later 30s my eyes popped out of my head. You need to forget about this guy and start focusing on your own health first.

[chados]

acting angry,sad etc might not be begging but it will from his point of view come out as a desperate attempt to get him. you invest more time for him then he does for you. this is never a good thing to do in a relationship or while dating.

 

value yourself and people around you will too. if someone doesnt show interest in you while dating the first couple of weeks they will probably never. since you made such a huge attempt to get him you can ruin the possbility to ever get him. doesnt matter if he likes you or not. always invest equally.

 

 

my advice for having a chance on this guy is to simply stop what you are doing. dont talk to him if he doesnt want to. let him work for you and be the price. if he doesnt do that, he's not worthy you.

[chimpanA-2-chimpanZ]

If we went two whole months of me sending tons of messages and him flat-out ignoring me, and then we both felt the chemistry immediately upon reconnecting, it could happen again right?

 

No. You have no idea what chemistry he felt.

 

Especially if enough time passes for the emotional issues to die down.

You barraged him with messages for two entire months; that's pretty hard for someone to forget.

 

I did tell him that I've done this before with others (the ending-it thing).

"It's okay, I'm like this with other people I date." How is he supposed to feel about that? It sounds like you're advertising a serious problem.

 

He's still responding to me, at least, so at least he cares enough not to ignore me again.

It takes no effort whatsoever to send a text or email. Don't equate that with anything like caring.

 

I guess I did apologize, and that was sufficient. I told him he didn't have to respond at all, but he replied with a thumb's up (which I appreciated - he acknowledged it rather than letting me think he was ignoring. He's been very good about replying, because he probably feels bad about ignoring for those two months. I appreciate little gestures like this).

He replied with an emoji. That's not a little gesture, that's really and truly the least possible thing he could do. I have done more for people I can't stand.

 

After he asked for his property back a week ago, he then proceeded to get online about 15 times throughout the day. I'm always on facebook, so I noticed (and okay, I was watching!). He never ever ever does this. He rarely gets on at all. So it really really felt like he was trying to show he was available, and maybe hoping I would want to talk, but afraid to speak up himself.

I mentioned this in your other thread. You have no evidence that it has nothing to do with you. If he wanted to reach out to you, he would have.

 

And then the morning after I sent my thank you message, he liked a facebook status of mine, a link I'd shared with a map about fave books in each state. He never likes my statuses, so this was unusual, and he doesn't read books at all. Then he shared something similar on his wall - a link with a map about fave movies in each state (he's a movie buff). It felt to me like it was a subtle way to get my attention. But a few of my friends said I was reading too much into it, and that he probably just got curious about movies and googled it, and basically said it didn't mean much.

Your friends are absolutely correct.

The reason it's important to me is that if he WAS subtly reaching out and making himself available, it would suggest that he actually does care and still like me, as opposed to having lost interest. Maybe we both would like to talk, but are both scared to speak first. But maybe I'm looking for things that aren't there, and making this all up in my head. What do you think?

I think your account of events may be very different from the reality. You're seeing all these signs and clues where there aren't any, and making inferences about his state of mind based on almost no information whatsoever. Don't have any further contact with this guy unless he initiates it.

[AlwaysPuzzled]

I can say with 100% certainty that this guy is not interested in you. You didn't even have a relationship. He repeatedly insisted you were just friends in the six weeks you were "together". Saying "I care a whole lot" while making zero effort to see you, communicate with you, or spend time with you means he's not interested, period.

 

Here's a serious question, though... Is 6 weeks too soon to call it official? I mean, it was way early on when I asked (first time I asked was at 3 weeks, second time at 6 weeks). To me, it felt like a relationship, as we were spending tons of time together, had gotten to know each other really well, and he said he loved me several different times (I get that he probably said it in heat of the moment). But some people like to take it slow on the titles, especially guys, right? As for this second time around, he DID make efforts to spend time with me. I texted first, but he jumped on it and asked me to come over. And he would stay up really late so that we could hang out, despite having to get up super early the next morning. After this period of time, he started a new job and has been working out of town during the week... so I know he was busy and had a lot on his mind. Basically, I'm asking if I jumped the gun here and expected too much too soon?

 

It's pretty self-centered to assume that him being on Facebook for long periods of time has anything to do with you. What if he's talking to a relative? Or a new woman?

 

Yep, you're right. I guess I'm looking for what I want to be there. I can admit that. But on one day, at least, I'm almost positive that he was getting on because of me. For the whole month previous to that, he was barely on at all. Then suddenly on the day he asked if he could pick up his property, he's online the whole entire day? That's a big coincidence. He's done it before - after the first time that I ended it, we both sat online for 2 hours straight before he finally said hello. At the time, I knew what he was doing, because he never sat there online for that long. There was one other similar instance where I was pretty sure, as well. So if he's done it before, and this time coincided with my calling things off, is it that farfetched to believe that maybe he wanted to talk?

 

I'll be honest: when I read this post, I would have guessed you were seventeen or eighteen (talking about cuddling, being in love after six weeks of not-even-dating, parents being out of town, and all that). When you said you were in your later 30s my eyes popped out of my head. You need to forget about this guy and start focusing on your own health first.

 

This makes me feel really good about myself, thanks But it's okay, I get why I come across as way younger than I am. He's my age, btw.

[AlwaysPuzzled]

my advice for having a chance on this guy is to simply stop what you are doing. dont talk to him if he doesnt want to. let him work for you and be the price. if he doesnt do that, he's not worthy you.

 

Thank you! I appreciate everyone's input. It gets hard to see things clearly sometimes since I'm so deeply in it, and I end up confusing myself. I've stopped everything, other than saying hello 3 days ago. Last time I frantically tried to "fix" it after I called things off. This time, I've stuck with it, and haven't chased at all. After he came to get the thing he loaned me, I wrote a nice mssg thanking him for being so calm and kind when he came over (because really, after my angry-ish messages, he didn't have to be that way, ya know? yet he stayed and chatted for a bit, and was very nice, and I appreciated it), and said I was glad we had left things on a good note. So yeah, I'm not chasing him, or doing anything at all at the moment. I agree that this is probably the best way to go. I just wish he would reach out to me at some point.

 

value yourself and people around you will too. if someone doesnt show interest in you while dating the first couple of weeks they will probably never. since you made such a huge attempt to get him you can ruin the possbility to ever get him. doesnt matter if he likes you or not. always invest equally.

 

I don't know who I'm trying to convince here - myself or you guys - but he DID show interest. The first 6 weeks, he did 90% of all initiating. This time around, he wasn't initiating the communication, but when I was with him in person, he was all there in every way. That's where my confusion lies!!! He loved spending time with me - I know this 100% - and he invited me over, I didn't invite myself over. But he would not text me first at all. If he wasn't interested, he wouldn't have wanted me to come over. I would say hello, and he'd say come over, and then he'd call me on the phone and say it would be good to see me, and I'd go. So looking at time spent together, he seemed fully interested; looking at his texting habits, he seemed almost completely uninterested. SO CONFUSING.

[Adele0908]

Thanks Adele <3 How long do you think it'll take him to miss me? Yesterday was really rough - I miss him soo much.

 

A few months at least. Don't stay and wait. You'll go crazy waiting....I've been there. Have you read The Mastery of Love? It's a great book that may help you heal. Don't send any more crazy break up texts, just face your wounds. It will make you a stronger woman.

[chimpanA-2-chimpanZ]

You're his entertainment. I don't mean this in a degrading way, because you come off as a very intelligent, sweet person, but you're entertainment to him. Even if he seemed interested for six weeks, he was very clear to you that it was NOT a relationship and never would be. You need to stop writing this into some special, gentle love story because he hasn't been romantic at all, at any point. He's looking to pass the time.

 

If he wanted to talk to you on Facebook, he would have. He did not spend hours gazing at your name on his chat list, hoping you'd say something. Maybe he was waiting for the Comcast guy to show up. Maybe he was talking to a friend he hadn't seen in years. Who knows? Assuming it has anything to do with you is dangerous thinking.

 

Don't talk to him. Block him from everything. And spend some time with yourself---what made you think you were in love after six weeks with a guy who insisted you were just friends? How can you prevent these kinds of scenarios in the future?

[AlwaysPuzzled]

You're his entertainment. I don't mean this in a degrading way, because you come off as a very intelligent, sweet person, but you're entertainment to him. Even if he seemed interested for six weeks, he was very clear to you that it was NOT a relationship and never would be. You need to stop writing this into some special, gentle love story because he hasn't been romantic at all, at any point. He's looking to pass the time.

 

I've considered this possibility, and it's honestly the most depressing, soul-crushing thought Can a "just friends" situation like this ever grow into more? I'm still unsure whether or not I expected too much. I know I couldn't expect total commitment within 6 weeks (and I didn't), but don't some people wait a few months to even give something a title? I tried to rush things. How do we know he wouldn't have grown more attached as time went on, if I had been able to just enjoy the moment?

 

This second time around, he talked about doing things in the near future. He said we should go out some time (I like just hanging at his house, because I'm a homebody and just prefer to do that), and we talked about all these different restaurants we were going to try. And I didn't put much stock in this, but he talked about moving out of state for work, and asked me several times if I wanted to go with him; he has all these dreams about moving here and there, so I didn't take it seriously, but still.

 

what made you think you were in love after six weeks with a guy who insisted you were just friends?

 

A lot of it was the infatuation and excitement, honestly. But I did fall in love with his personality and who he is as a person, and I felt like we connected and understood each other. I mentioned somewhere on this thread or my other one that I've NEVER felt as comfortable around someone as I felt with him. I was able to relax and totally be myself. I honestly felt like I'd found my soul mate.

[elaine567]

Watch this and learn - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qrKN2aiOj_s

[AlwaysPuzzled]

Watch this and learn - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qrKN2aiOj_s

 

A lot of those are sadly familiar :(

 

What I don't understand is how he can be so into it/me while we're together in person (trust me, he really really was), but then care nothing about me once we part ways. This is what's making it so hard for me to move on. If while together he showed any signs whatsoever of not being interested, then maybe I could understand. The only thing I can come up with is that it's because of his dismissive-avoidant attachment style. The first time around, he wasn't like that - he was still texting on the days we didn't see each other, and he was much more all the way in it. But this time, well, I've explained how he was.

 

During this second period of getting together, he was talking about moving out of state for work (and he actually asked me several times if I wanted to move with him, but I knew he was just kind of dreaming), and I asked him if he'd miss his parents. He said "I won't miss ANYBODY!!" He wasn't talking about me, because he had just asked me to come with him. But his parents, family, friends -- he wouldn't miss any of them at all. This falls in line with his attachment style, IMO. He also often talked about just wanting to run away from everything, and not wanting any responsibility, and how he can't make promises.

 

Given his way of being in life, isn't it possible that it's not that he's just "not interested"?

 

As for him not ever initiating texts... like I said, he was very excited for me to come over when I did text. He just seemed to have some stubborn refusal to text first. He's VERY strong-willed, and when he puts his mind to something, he easily follows through. So again, could there be some other reason besides him just not being interested? For all I know, it might have bothered him that he did almost all of the initiating the first time around, and then maybe he lost some trust when I ended things, and decided this time around that he just wasn't going to text first (this is just an example of a possibility other than him not being interested).

 

I don't understand his hot and cold behavior. Seems he has two sides that are completely contradictory to each other. His ex told me he would be really sweet one night and then do a complete 180 the next day, so he did the same with her. When he disappeared on her, she could have thought he was over it and uninterested, but he always went back.

 

None of this is healthy, I know. But I have this deep pain in my chest and I can't seem to move on.

[AlwaysPuzzled]

A few months at least. Don't stay and wait. You'll go crazy waiting....I've been there. Have you read The Mastery of Love? It's a great book that may help you heal. Don't send any more crazy break up texts, just face your wounds. It will make you a stronger woman.

 

I'm trying not to wait, but god it's hard. Thoughts of him consume me.

 

I'll look into the book, thank you!!!

[eye of the storm]

AlwaysPuzzled, have you thought about going to some IC. It is really helpful for finding out why you repeat patterns and engage in destructive behavior.

 

This guy is not healthy for you. You know it. But you are riding this chemical high for him and ignoring all the red flags. When a poster mentions them to you, you respond with "I know but".

 

And your friends are also trying to warn you. Listen to them too.

[AlwaysPuzzled]

AlwaysPuzzled, have you thought about going to some IC. It is really helpful for finding out why you repeat patterns and engage in destructive behavior.

 

This guy is not healthy for you. You know it. But you are riding this chemical high for him and ignoring all the red flags. When a poster mentions them to you, you respond with "I know but".

 

And your friends are also trying to warn you. Listen to them too.

 

Hi. I've been to counseling in the past, but they always wanted to focus on issues other than relationship problems (family problems when I was younger, that kind of thing). Maybe I just haven't found the right fit yet. I agree it would be helpful.

 

It does seem like just about everyone thinks I should move on. And you're right, the red flags have been there all along, and I've chosen to ignore them in favor of his good qualities, and how perfect things could be "if only". What I can't get over is how amazing things were in the beginning. We meshed SO well, but then everything changed. I don't know how to let go of what was. It was honestly the happiest I've been with someone in a really long time. I'm sitting here crying again as I type this. I've been crying for months now over this guy.

[chimpanA-2-chimpanZ]

Can a "just friends" situation like this ever grow into more?

 

It can when both parties want something more. He doesn't, so it won't.

 

I'm still unsure whether or not I expected too much. I know I couldn't expect total commitment within 6 weeks (and I didn't), but don't some people wait a few months to even give something a title? I tried to rush things. How do we know he wouldn't have grown more attached as time went on, if I had been able to just enjoy the moment?

Because if he HAD been interested, he would have told you. He would have said "I really care about you and like what we're doing, but I'm not ready, but I'm sure I will be soon." And you would have kept dating until he was ready to be your SO/boyfriend/whatever. But you weren't even dating and he was clear about that, multiple times.

 

This second time around, he talked about doing things in the near future. He said we should go out some time (I like just hanging at his house, because I'm a homebody and just prefer to do that), and we talked about all these different restaurants we were going to try. And I didn't put much stock in this, but he talked about moving out of state for work, and asked me several times if I wanted to go with him; he has all these dreams about moving here and there, so I didn't take it seriously, but still.

He enjoys your company, but he can't be bothered to contact you himself and actually spend time with you unless you initiate it. You definitely should not take anything he says or does seriously.

 

A lot of it was the infatuation and excitement, honestly. But I did fall in love with his personality and who he is as a person, and I felt like we connected and understood each other. I mentioned somewhere on this thread or my other one that I've NEVER felt as comfortable around someone as I felt with him. I was able to relax and totally be myself. I honestly felt like I'd found my soul mate.

 

But you couldn't be yourself, could you? When you opened up about what was going on he cut you off, then ignored you completely, and now you're writing a post about how if you'd played things differently (i.e. not been totally honest and open about your feelings) maybe you would be in a different place.

 

This isn't love. You're infatuated with someone who has been clear he doesn't have romantic feelings for you. He will be friendly when you're actually around him but he doesn't care enough to make contact. I'll say it again: this isn't love.

Edited November 24, 2014 by chimpanA-2-chimpanZ

[chimpanA-2-chimpanZ]

Seek counseling as soon as possible. It is not healthy to spend months crying over someone you never dated or send them hundreds of messages even after they ignore you.

 

I think it is very significant that your friends think you should move on. Our friends love us unconditionally and are biased towards us; they support us long after everyone else has given up. If your friends are telling you to forget it you should heed their advice.

 

[Divasu]

Seek counseling as soon as possible. It is not healthy to spend months crying over someone you never dated or send them hundreds of messages even after they ignore you.

 

I think it is very significant that your friends think you should move on. Our friends love us unconditionally and are biased towards us; they support us long after everyone else has given up. If your friends are telling you to forget it you should heed their advice.

 

 

This. I spent a long time crying/mourning over a fling. It was not about him, it was about things that had festered inside me for YEARS.

[elaine567]

This. I spent a long time crying/mourning over a fling. It was not about him, it was about things that had festered inside me for YEARS.

 

Yes I think, lost "loves" can stir up all sorts of feelings and the crying is not necessarily just about that failed relationship.

Losing someone can trigger insecurities, some of which are deeply hidden normally.

[idoltree]

I've considered this possibility, and it's honestly the most depressing, soul-crushing thought Can a "just friends" situation like this ever grow into more? I'm still unsure whether or not I expected too much. I know I couldn't expect total commitment within 6 weeks (and I didn't), but don't some people wait a few months to even give something a title? I tried to rush things. How do we know he wouldn't have grown more attached as time went on, if I had been able to just enjoy the moment?

 

It's not unreasonable to expect someone to commit to you within 6 weeks. He either wasn't interested in commitment with you or he's such an avoider that he's incapable of it in general. Stop looking to what you did wrong. Sometimes figuring it out is as easy as "Okay, I thought he was my future but he's not. If he was, things would not have been this complicated."

 

If a guy wants to commit to you, he will. Simple as that. Let this one go and find one who is capable. I already told you how I think you need to do some work on yourself to be able to be attracted to someone who is capable.

 

A lot of it was the infatuation and excitement, honestly. But I did fall in love with his personality and who he is as a person, and I felt like we connected and understood each other. I mentioned somewhere on this thread or my other one that I've NEVER felt as comfortable around someone as I felt with him. I was able to relax and totally be myself. I honestly felt like I'd found my soul mate.

I don't think you fell in love with him. You fell in love with who you thought he was.

 

Who does this guy's behavior remind you of? Think back to when you were a kid. Because there is someone and that is who this is all about. I know this by your anxious pursuit of an avoider, and the fact that you've attached all of these magical qualities to him and made it into such a fantastic opportunity for yourself. In the real world, this guy and the way he treats you is just not a catch. This is about you frantically trying to correct some lingering emotional trauma from your past.

 

I guess all he wants to really do is run. He had this pattern in a previous relationship, as well. I'm friendly with an ex of his, and she said that he would disappear for days or a week at a time, but that he'd always go back to her. He would either go off and cheat or stay at a guy friend's house drinking. He broke up with her on her birthday (but came back), dipped out on a New Year's Eve party they were throwing together (to go off and be with another girl), missed an important event at her mom's (because he was too hungover). It sounds like he ran any time something came up that would make them closer.

Why in the world would you want to be with this guy given this description of his previous conduct in a relationship? I know why - because if you can "win", it means that you're worthy.

 

Honey, this seems to be about YOU and your need to win him over in order to prove something to yourself. Honestly, once you start delving into these tendencies of yours, you'll realize that none of your heartbreak and desperate feelings had anything to do with this guy. He's just a symbol to you, which is good, because he sounds like quite a jackass.

[AlwaysPuzzled]

Thanks everyone <3 You all make really good points. I can see, logically, how this sadness and depression over him is a manifestation of deep insecurities and past hurts. Definitely.

 

I keep typing and erasing things here. Probably most of it is a repeat of things I've already said. I just can't get over how good it felt to be with him, and how perfectly he fit into my life for those first 6 weeks. That seems like such a short amount of time, but we were together so much right from the start. I could write pages and pages about what I find so appealing about him and about how he made me feel.

 

I'm getting what you guys are saying, I promise. I guess my mind and my heart are still in a constant struggle. I won't lie, I still want him back in my life.

[AlwaysPuzzled]

Another angle to this is his alcoholism. We were both drunk probably 80% of our time together. He is the happiest, sweetest, most fun drunk you will ever meet. He's very high-functioning, in that he gets up and goes to work, works hard, gets stuff done in his life. So it was hard for me to see it as a problem. I'm naive about it and don't really understand it very well, I guess.

 

It's possible that our time together felt so magical because we were drunk for most of it, huh?

 

When he was sober (aka hungover) he was always more reserved, quieter, colder over text, etc. He says he always feels like crap every day from drinking the night before, but that he's strong and just has to push through it and get his work done.

 

Does anyone think this could account for his lack of commitment and his hot-and-cold nature? I remember one night when we weren't drinking, and we were on the couch watching a movie. He had his arms crossed and was very pulled into himself, whereas he was normally extremely affectionate and touchy-feely. I remember feeling confused and rejected and surprised that he was acting so different. It was only later that I realized that it was because we weren't drinking. I think he has a hard time opening up unless drunk (I'm the exact same way).

 

Not sure what my point is, just still trying to work through all this. Thanks for listening <3

[Adele0908]

Seek counseling as soon as possible. It is not healthy to spend months crying over someone you never dated or send them hundreds of messages even after they ignore you.

 

I think it is very significant that your friends think you should move on. Our friends love us unconditionally and are biased towards us; they support us long after everyone else has given up. If your friends are telling you to forget it you should heed their advice.

 

 

I disagree with this. In my view, sometimes when people spend years avoiding their own emotions and hurts, and instead become numb....a person comes along, usually a romantic partner, that *breaks us open*.

 

I'm saying this because I have experienced this. Counseling could help....but I feel that what we really need to do is learn to feel our own pain. I don't know if you are a man or a woman, but for women, we are very much tied to our emotions.

[AlwaysPuzzled]

Because if he HAD been interested, he would have told you. He would have said "I really care about you and like what we're doing, but I'm not ready, but I'm sure I will be soon." And you would have kept dating until he was ready to be your SO/boyfriend/whatever. But you weren't even dating and he was clear about that, multiple times.

 

But you couldn't be yourself, could you? When you opened up about what was going on he cut you off, then ignored you completely, and now you're writing a post about how if you'd played things differently (i.e. not been totally honest and open about your feelings) maybe you would be in a different place.

 

Great points. On the first point, is it possible that some people are just so shut down that they feel unable to say something like that? If he felt pressured, perhaps he withdrew and just wanted to avoid the conversation. His ex said he would never talk about feelings or relationships, and she was with him for 3 years. And one time I was trying to talk to him about some little misunderstanding, and he said "I don't argue, let's just forget it." Some people avoid what they perceive to be conflict. When I brought up the topic of what we were, it was in the midst of "conflict", so that could truly account for why he wouldn't say what a "normal" person might say. You could be right and he just didn't care, but I just don't know if it's that black and white. He certainly acted in every way like he cared (I'm talking about the first time around here).

 

On the second point, you're SO correct. I did try to explain myself, and at first he tried to just go on as if nothing had happened, and when that didn't take, he cut me off and ignored me. Again, it could go back to him being emotionally stunted and reserved. I have no idea what he was thinking during those two months. I told him numerous times to just tell me or block me if he wanted me to stop; he never did. He just kept reading them and not responding. I didn't know if he was "punishing" me with the silent treatment, or getting an ego boost out of my chasing him, or what. Back to what you were saying, though, you're right - I couldn't be my full emotional self with him, and when I wonder if things would have been different if I had done things differently, that would have meant holding back parts of myself. I get it.

[AlwaysPuzzled]

It's not unreasonable to expect someone to commit to you within 6 weeks. He either wasn't interested in commitment with you or he's such an avoider that he's incapable of it in general. Stop looking to what you did wrong. Sometimes figuring it out is as easy as "Okay, I thought he was my future but he's not. If he was, things would not have been this complicated."

 

If a guy wants to commit to you, he will. Simple as that. Let this one go and find one who is capable. I already told you how I think you need to do some work on yourself to be able to be attracted to someone who is capable.

 

I don't think you fell in love with him. You fell in love with who you thought he was.

 

Who does this guy's behavior remind you of? Think back to when you were a kid. Because there is someone and that is who this is all about. I know this by your anxious pursuit of an avoider, and the fact that you've attached all of these magical qualities to him and made it into such a fantastic opportunity for yourself. In the real world, this guy and the way he treats you is just not a catch. This is about you frantically trying to correct some lingering emotional trauma from your past.

 

Why in the world would you want to be with this guy given this description of his previous conduct in a relationship? I know why - because if you can "win", it means that you're worthy.

Honey, this seems to be about YOU and your need to win him over in order to prove something to yourself. Honestly, once you start delving into these tendencies of yours, you'll realize that none of your heartbreak and desperate feelings had anything to do with this guy. He's just a symbol to you, which is good, because he sounds like quite a jackass.

 

More great points, thank you. I bolded some things that really stuck out. I do think he's incapable of commitment, given his past relationship history and the way he lives his life in general. I guess a lot of women get stuck trying to change or convince a commitment-phobe to be with them. In my heart, I know we had a connection. I'm not sure why no one else can see that, but I felt it, and I know he felt it. Maybe he feels it easily with people, and it meant less to him than it did to me. For me, that kind of connection is hard to come by. I rarely meet someone whom I feel so excited about and so comfortable with at the same time. I honestly don't know if he's a jackass or not. He's very kind and compassionate, loves animals, has a very calm presence about him. And in person, he was all these things with me (kind, considerate, generous, attentive, etc) - every second of our time together, in every way. He was NEVER anything that could even come close to being called assh0le-ish. Still having a hard time understanding that. I could never be so into someone in person and then just shut off the emotions when we part. It makes no sense to me whatsoever. I guess it's his dismissive-avoidant attachment style that causes this? I might start a new thread about that, and see if anyone knows any way to get through to these types and form an emotional connection with them. ((I realize that's probably counterproductive - trying to figure this out and find a way to connect with him, when I should be moving on.))

Edited November 24, 2014 by AlwaysPuzzled

[Adele0908]

Another angle to this is his alcoholism. We were both drunk probably 80% of our time together. He is the happiest, sweetest, most fun drunk you will ever meet. He's very high-functioning, in that he gets up and goes to work, works hard, gets stuff done in his life. So it was hard for me to see it as a problem. I'm naive about it and don't really understand it very well, I guess.

 

It's possible that our time together felt so magical because we were drunk for most of it, huh?

 

When he was sober (aka hungover) he was always more reserved, quieter, colder over text, etc. He says he always feels like crap every day from drinking the night before, but that he's strong and just has to push through it and get his work done.

 

Does anyone think this could account for his lack of commitment and his hot-and-cold nature? I remember one night when we weren't drinking, and we were on the couch watching a movie. He had his arms crossed and was very pulled into himself, whereas he was normally extremely affectionate and touchy-feely. I remember feeling confused and rejected and surprised that he was acting so different. It was only later that I realized that it was because we weren't drinking. I think he has a hard time opening up unless drunk (I'm the exact same way).

 

Not sure what my point is, just still trying to work through all this. Thanks for listening <3

 

Firstly, *like attracts like*. You both are drinkers, so you have that in common.

 

If you both have to drink every time you are together, my guess is that you both have wounds that you are suppressing. You both may use alcohol to forget about those insecurities or wounds.

 

Alcohol reduces inhibitions. It affects a certain part of the brain, I think it's the limbic system, but I'm not sure. The limbic system is linked to emotions. It increases the neurotransmitter GABA in the brain, which other drugs also do, like Xanax, which is an anti-anxiety drug. So alcohol, through the inhibitory neurotransmitter GABA, inhibits emotions. I need to confirm this though.

 

So basically, you both must have high levels of anxiety, or high stress hormones.

 

If you want to change the relationship, or attract a man who is not a heavy drinker or drug user, you have to change yourself, because remember, *like attracts like*.

 

It doesn't make sense to leave him, because if you leave, and then work on your own emotional blockages, you won't get to see if you've actually changed. You need him there to mirror your own levels of anxiety. Your mate is your mirror. You attract who you are being. You need to really get this. You don't attract people at random. It's science. It's physics, but it's also spiritual. You even admitted it yourself. You are the same way, less open unless you are drunk.

 

I read this post and see how your still so hyper-focused on him and what he is doing, and its understandable. But this is more about you than him. You need to ask yourself why you drink so much, why you can only relax around him with alcohol. It's not a crime, but at least be aware of WHY you do it. Could it be because you don't trust him or yourself? Do you feel like he won't really like you if he knew the *real you*?

 

I understand that you have questions in your mind, but in my experience, people reflect back to you who you are being. If he is not committing, you are not committing. If he's hot and cold, you are hot and cold. And you are hot and cold. You were hot for him at first, during the first six weeks, and then your fears took over, and you instead became suspicious and distrusting. Men want to be trusted, so when you distrust him, it feels like a slap in the face to him. When you trust him and believe in him, it feels loving to him. It feels like a cool drink of water in the hot Sahara desert, to have his woman be trusting and open.

 

You could come up with a million questions about "why did he do this" or "why did he do that". And that is understandable, you want to understand his behavior. But you won't be able to answer all those questions here. Books, experts and self-study are the way to go in my opinion. When I started the inward journey a few years ago, it was because of a man who didn't want to commit to me and I was devastated. I watched him commit to another woman a few months after I left him. I've experienced many other painful situations. Enough became enough and I decided to dive deep into my childhood wounds, relationship with my father, past trauma, and the whole nine yards. I also read books to understand men. If you want a book list, I can pm it to you.

[AlwaysPuzzled]

Thank you Adele!!!

 

So basically, you both must have high levels of anxiety, or high stress hormones.

 

I do FOR SURE. I'm highly prone to anxiety, about anything and everything. He seems extremely calm, but maybe it's because he's always drinking. He also smokes weed all day long. So maybe this is all to calm himself. He says he does get anxiety when he's hung over, but that he just has to be strong and push through it. My own anxiety when I'm hung over is such that I can't go anywhere or do much of anything.

 

You need to ask yourself why you drink so much, why you can only relax around him with alcohol. It's not a crime, but at least be aware of WHY you do it. Could it be because you don't trust him or yourself? Do you feel like he won't really like you if he knew the *real you*?

 

Hmm. Your last sentence applies to him, I think, just fyi: he said one time that he's "boring when he's not drinking." For myself, I think I use it to simply relax and open up; I'm super-reserved and a bit closed off otherwise. He was usually drunk by the time I got over there, and I'd pour some wine the second I walked in the door. We went to the river one time, sober, and he was talking about how he wished we could drink there, and later in the car he was talking about how there's not much to do when you can't drink. And this whole time, I was sitting there worrying about how we weren't holding hands or being physically close, and letting my insecurities overtake me. So that is a good example of how we were while sober!

 

It doesn't make sense to leave him, because if you leave, and then work on your own emotional blockages, you won't get to see if you've actually changed. You need him there to mirror your own levels of anxiety. Your mate is your mirror.

 

But I already HAVE "left" him And he wasn't my "mate" this second time around I would give anything to hit the rewind and delete button and go back to that day I ended things the first time. I wish I had come here to this site back then. I don't know what to do! I wish that I could have him in my life, and I agree that it would be beneficial for healing and growth. But I don't think he wants to hear about, or deal with, my issues any more. I don't think I could approach him and tell him that I recognize where my behaviors came from, and ask him to stick around and work through them with me. And if I can't say that, what could I say? Just trying to slip back into things by saying hello wouldn't work either. I already told him I can't handle him coming and going and all that. I always do this - when I find that I'm getting really attached to someone, I become terrified of getting hurt, and I end it trying to avoid getting used or left. But I can't tell him any of this - can I? He may not care. And he's certainly not one to talk about these kinds of things.

 

I understand that you have questions in your mind, but in my experience, people reflect back to you who you are being. If he is not committing, you are not committing. If he's hot and cold, you are hot and cold. And you are hot and cold. You were hot for him at first, during the first six weeks, and then your fears took over, and you instead became suspicious and distrusting. Men want to be trusted, so when you distrust him, it feels like a slap in the face to him. When you trust him and believe in him, it feels loving to him. It feels like a cool drink of water in the hot Sahara desert, to have his woman be trusting and open.

 

I have to say a big WOW on what you said here. You are SOO correct. I didn't really consider that I'm hot and cold as well, but I so am. I became extremely cold and emotionless when I ended things that first time. That was actually the day we had gone to the river, so my anxieties were building all day up until the moment I ended it over text. He may not have seen it coming. I *felt* in the moment that he didn't care about me at all, and that he would be unaffected by my ending things. Maybe it really was like a slap in the face. As far as me not committing... I want a commitment, but I guess I'm really not committing as long as I have one foot out the door, ready to flee the second I get scared, huh?

 

I wish so much that I had talked to you back then, before I freaked out and bailed the first time. Has too much damage been done at this point to try to work things out with him? I feel that this is the case. I've bailed three times now (the second time was shortly before the third and final time - but then I said hey two days later and he invited me over, and we just ignored that I had even written that message). He may not have believed me this last time, since it's an obvious pattern that I have. But I've now stuck with it for coming up on two weeks, so I guess he knows I meant it this time. So much damage. He'll never see me as that cool drink of water, and I don't think I could even come close to being that way unless he also changed his ways and was more communicative and at least a tiny bit reassuring at times. What to do?

 

When I started the inward journey a few years ago, it was because of a man who didn't want to commit to me and I was devastated. I watched him commit to another woman a few months after I left him.

 

I'm so sorry for all the pain you've gone through. I can obviously relate! It's horrible, isn't it? Good for you for taking control of your own healing and self-care. I hope you feel you've made progress, and that you're approaching peace in relationships. Watching a man commit to someone else is every woman's worst nightmare. I fear this will happen with him.

 

I also read books to understand men. If you want a book list, I can pm it to you.

 

That would be fantastic, if you have the time. I'll have to start off with buying one or two at a time. I'm thinking it might be good to start with He's Scared, She's Scared and Why Men Love Bitches.