Update: On my own now; how we got here

[compulsivedancer]

Doesn't change anything, you knew you were already sleeping with OM. Then when CM didn't go through with it, and also rejecting you doing it the guilt hit since you were already doing it with the expectation that he would give you the OK.

 

To me, if a man rejects sex with a woman he is attracted to there is a reason behind it. YOU were his reason behind.

He doesn't want to be with me any more, either. So even if changed my mind, begged him to let me come back, and I agreed never to mention the K word again, that wouldn't make us unseparated. This is his decision as much as mine. We came to it for different reasons, but we both arrived there.

[Spark1111]

Going out on a limb here....but procreation between loving couples is primal, and if he does not want that, I support your choice to go.....

 

Nothing says end it MORE than one partner NOT wanting to procreate with the other.

 

But you need to find your voice; communicate your needs, and grow your self-esteem before another 8 years, 2 year affair and 2 year unsuccessful reconciliation goes by....

 

Because wherever you go, there you are....still.

 

And no man, no job, no child will help you to happiness. Only you can do that for you.

 

Good luck to you both.

[lovinDKT3]

He doesn't want to be with me any more, either. So even if changed my mind, begged him to let me come back, and I agreed never to mention the K word again, that wouldn't make us unseparated. This is his decision as much as mine. We came to it for different reasons, but we both arrived there.

 

You have to admit you haven't made it hard for him to get there.

 

Two years is barely enough time to get over infidelity let alone adding a child to the mix, your first child.

 

Understand, I get the desire for children. I get you felt you had to make the decision. What I saying to you expected too much too fast, and when it didn't go your way you sabotaged what was let, betrayed him and contacted OM (you know how I feel about that). Still a very unhealthy way to deal with your issue, even if the end game was parting ways.

[Furious]

I wasn't trying to fix this problem by having an affair. I had an affair two years ago. H isn't going to have babies with me NOW.

 

So no matter how much I love him, no matter how hard I work on our relationship, no matter how much I wait....it makes no difference. HE DOESN'T WANT TO HAVE A FAMILY WITH ME...Not now. Not next week. Not next year. Probably not two years from now.

 

He may NEVER want to have children with me. And he can't give me a timeline. When he TRIES to, it's clear he just doesn't. want. to.

 

Why would I want to have kids with someone who isn't interested in them, and won't be excited to have them? H doesn't want to be pressured. And I can't not pressure him. So it's time to leave. It's time to work on me, to move on NOW so that I have TIME, so I can find a guy when I'm READY. So that we'll still have time to have more than one kid together, without rushing.

 

If I don't leave now, I'll never have a chance for this. If I don't leave now, I will ONLY be able to have a chance at this with H, and he - frankly - isn't a very safe bet on this subject. And before he's ready, I'll become a bitter, resentful wife because I ALREADY regret not having kids with him yet.

 

 

 

Before I had children it was like a fairy tale and the baby would be perfect and My husband and I would bond over this sweet child.

 

Except....the pregnancy had complications, I developed gestational diabetes and

had to work up until giving birth. Our daughter was born with thrush and jaundice. Instead if a natural birth I had to have an emergency cesarean. I had to be back at work after three months. Our daughter was colic, and neither me or my husband had a nights sleep. Having an open marriage or hours of sex didn't enter our minds....sleep...sleep....the yearning for a 6 hours of sleep was like having a big orgasm. Who would have thought that a nights sleep and no diapers was a big O.

 

Many young couples think that having a baby will bring them closer, the truth is having a baby will make a couple experience a bonding and also a test to that bond.

 

There's also the finances, daycare, who will call in sick when the baby is sick. Then begins the tag team compromise, who will go out while one stays home with the baby. Also it's hard to go out with an infant, and your cool friends without kids can't understand why you can't get a sitter and go clubbing until 3 in the morning.

 

There will be days when you look back and think how easy it was to just be a couple and laugh at how hard you thought that was.

 

But then your baby has a fever and has a crazy rash and you're at the emergency, and you're scared and all you want is for your child to be ok and give you that goofy smile that lights up your life.

 

This is just within the first year, never mind the next 17 years....

Edited December 11, 2014 by Furious

[beach]

So if you two are good friends but not necessarily great together and don't mind being on your own - what is the purpose of dating again? Especially if you have goals that aren't supported by him for your long term future...?

[veryhappy]

I was one to suggest you get a divorce soon on your thread about wanting baby. At the time you were not happy hearing that. I lived through such a similar story of a husband postponing kids forever although based on the verbiage he very much wanted them and that made me relate to you more that way than the regular save the m at all costs.

 

 

I applaud you for being authentic, your post was beautifully written and probably many WS would strongly resonate to it. What you say now makes sense to how I perceived your story all along.

 

 

I encourage you to get divorced and not wait for the full year. You don't have a year to waste, and you need time to process the loss and then find someone else.

 

 

Best of luck to you.

[compulsivedancer]

So if you two are good friends but not necessarily great together and don't mind being on your own - what is the purpose of dating again? Especially if you have goals that aren't supported by him for your long term future...?

 

I think that was the point. We thought we wanted to do that, but it's becoming increasingly clear that there is no purpose to it.

[road]

I wasn't trying to fix this problem by having an affair. I had an affair two years ago. H isn't going to have babies with me NOW.

 

So no matter how much I love him, no matter how hard I work on our relationship, no matter how much I wait....it makes no difference. HE DOESN'T WANT TO HAVE A FAMILY WITH ME...Not now. Not next week. Not next year. Probably not two years from now.

 

He may NEVER want to have children with me. And he can't give me a timeline. When he TRIES to, it's clear he just doesn't. want. to.

 

Why would I want to have kids with someone who isn't interested in them, and won't be excited to have them? H doesn't want to be pressured. And I can't not pressure him. So it's time to leave. It's time to work on me, to move on NOW so that I have TIME, so I can find a guy when I'm READY. So that we'll still have time to have more than one kid together, without rushing.

 

If I don't leave now, I'll never have a chance for this. If I don't leave now, I will ONLY be able to have a chance at this with H, and he - frankly - isn't a very safe bet on this subject. And before he's ready, I'll become a bitter, resentful wife because I ALREADY regret not having kids with him yet.

 

 

Do not fault you for getting divorced. Fault you for still justifying your affair.

[aliveagain]

Please accept my comment as one view by a male betrayed spouse. When my ex found out our son was indeed the other mans she wanted to give me another child in hopes of keeping the relationship together. I absolutely refused to have a child with her because until I knew I even wanted her in my life there was no way in hell I was going complicate things by binding myself to her with a child.

 

There is a good chance that CM isn't over your affair yet after all it was with his best friend. He may not feel safe enough with you to commit to having a child with you. Two years out I would absolutely refuse if I was in his position specially if I, as an outsider caught on to your continued interest in other man to the point that I stopped replying to your posts. He doesn't feel safe. A double betrayal is a huge sh*t sandwich to eat, it takes time to recover. One thing we always tell betrayed spouses on this site is believe very little coming out of a wayward spouses mouth, believe their actions. Maybe your actions were not that convincing to him. Just my opinion and not an attack in anyway.

[beach]

I think that was the point. We thought we wanted to do that, but it's becoming increasingly clear that there is no purpose to it.

 

Then it's time to talk about changing the future of what you previously agreed to.

 

 

Be honest with him and allow him to understand how you feel and what you want from life and that the goals don't seem aligned enough to work at the marriage.

[howcouldInotknow]

I am glad this thread is open again. We are all so full of judgement here. We've never lived a day in her shoes. So many here full of anger from their own situations. Let's get a hold of ourselves and choose our words a little more wisely. A person doesn't have to get the point that you're making. The only thing that really matters is what she has learned from this.

I can say this when a woman wants to be a mother it is such a strong urge. It's hard to explain when you don't have a partner who is on the same page it makes you resentful. I walked away from a man who by all accounts was perfection because of my desire to be a mom one day. Saying there is a hole in your life isn't exactly right because a hole makes it sound like something is missing or you're trying to fill it. But it's important that if that desire is there that both parties are on the same page.

[Selfish]

Doesn't change anything, you knew you were already sleeping with OM. Then when CM didn't go through with it, and also rejecting you doing it the guilt hit since you were already doing it with the expectation that he would give you the OK.

 

To me, if a man rejects sex with a woman he is attracted to there is a reason behind it. YOU were his reason behind.

 

I don't know the entire story. But it could also have been his sexual inexperience as well that he rejected it. As of that time, not sure if it has changed, he had only one sexual partner.

 

But, that is neither here nor there. I am not sure what your point is in all this. I think ending this marriage was a good thing. As she knows the whole thing could have been a lot less messy. A little more introspection from her self and a little more clear communication on marriage boundaries and future plans might have saved a lot of heartache on both there parts.

 

What is done is done. The marriage is over. She is moving on and so should we. Not every marriage should be saved. And just because a spouse is wayward and has remorse for those actions doesn't mean they have no option but to reconcile.

[atreides]

((CD))

 

I have been so busy that I missed the break up and have not been here in a while. I certainly was rooting for you two. However, I am still rooting for you two as you each find your own way.

 

The only gripe i have is that for you, you still did not allow enough time to heal. Also i cringed a bit at the "sexual" comparisons. Infidelity is an addiction, you have heard me say it over and over, and the lure of it is still for many even when it is not infidelity and another dependency is a very dark and very large cloud to come out of. There are no cliches and as with time it will be more clear.

Also, i would not look at it as "should have" ~"could have" before the affair. Look, you are mixing reasons for further justification and this time, i will say you don't need one.

No marriage is perfect, certainly mine has not and all of my family, but we don't need to re-write it if it does not work out.

I think all you need to say here is that you two wanted different things in life and raising children is a very big one, for many a reason for divorce when there are differences.

I think you held out hope, especially as the house you were going to get was going to come through and it looked like the beginning of a family in the near future. Part of this was your posts in expecting a quicker healing or to move past and reach your goal. I remember you saying and I paraphrase "it's been a year" but i say this in conjunction to your main goal, creating a family.

Your affair got caught up in an addiction, your break up is about differences in goals of life. They should not be mixed nor made to be dependent on each other.

 

I so wish you the best of luck, but I would encourage to look beyond the "lure" that the affair had in using it to compare you state of life now and with time in your future ahead, that you truly find someone whom can share in making a family with you.

 

((CD))

Edited December 11, 2014 by atreides

[anne1707]

Robert, other than the back and forth between realist and anne, I think everything was pretty on topic. Even the mean stuff.

 

Which to be fair I did not start and I also pulled out of first as I knew it was not fair on you and your thread

 

The point of my earlier posts was not to attack (as some may have thought) but that it is so important for you to learn from your past mistakes. This includes learning to not compromise or hope things will change as you may have done when you and CM got married, that two way communication is vital and that there are far better ways of dealing with a problem in a marriage than having an affair. It's learning about your reasoning and attempts to justify these past decisions so that you can identify what behaviours you have to/may need to change or watch out for future situations that are inappropriate and tackling those in a healthier manner. Above all, it is about taking responsibility for what you did and being accountable for that, if not to CM but at least to yourself.

 

This is not something exclusive to you. This is something for every WS and also for every BS, whether choosing to reconcile or divorce.

[badkarma2013]

I don't know the entire story. But it could also have been his sexual inexperience as well that he rejected it. As of that time, not sure if it has changed, he had only one sexual partner.

 

But, that is neither here nor there. I am not sure what your point is in all this. I think ending this marriage was a good thing. As she knows the whole thing could have been a lot less messy. A little more introspection from her self and a little more clear communication on marriage boundaries and future plans might have saved a lot of heartache on both there parts.

 

What is done is done. The marriage is over. She is moving on and so should we. Not every marriage should be saved. And just because a spouse is wayward and has remorse for those actions doesn't mean they have no option but to reconcile.

 

*****************************************************************

Well Said...AS i have stated as a BH,I have been extremely harsh (that is is a understatement) on most WWs here since my D-DAY...However this post by CD has struck a chord in many of us here......

 

Some hurts cannot be Forgiven and some Damage cannot be repaired...

 

We are all here watching the destruction of a marriage and All the hopes and dreams that went with it.....

 

Regardless of who did what...again ,THERE IS NO EXCUSE FOR INFIDELITY..BUT if one reads this closely... WE ALL CAN SEE everyone involved screaming for help and there was no relief in sight...

 

In the end boundaries were crossed ...poor choices were made and after the

A, nothing was left .....

 

Many of you here may call me a HYPOCRITE from my previous post and my almost hatred of WWs... and that is ok....But this post hit me hard and as i said no condemnation from me today...The whole GODDA%N thing makes me sad.....

[veryhappy]

 

And no man, no job, no child will help you to happiness. Only you can do that for you.

.

 

 

You have the man, three children and several jobs. Please explain exactly how somebody without a job but needing one, without a man but wanting one and childless not by choice would find that calm tinkle of happiness in the western world. Cleaning, painting the nails and volunteering can only do that much. I believe your statement would be highly offensive to many childless women who've wanted them for years. Yes, children are wanted and bring happiness and thank god for that because unwanted kids are wounded and become people who hurt themselves and others.

[compulsivedancer]

You have the man, three children and several jobs. Please explain exactly how somebody without a job but needing one, without a man but wanting one and childless not by choice would find that calm tinkle of happiness in the western world. Cleaning, painting the nails and volunteering can only do that much. I believe your statement would be highly offensive to many childless women who've wanted them for years. Yes, children are wanted and bring happiness and thank god for that because unwanted kids are wounded and become people who hurt themselves and others.

I think she's actually saying the opposite - that I can have the man, the job AND the kids, and that may not be enough to make me happy. I have to make myself happy or none of those things will be enough.

[beach]

CD are you still seeing a counselor?

 

 

Keep moving forward. No need to go back to what you know does add total happiness to your life.

 

Keep changing things until you find what works best for you.

[lilmisscantbewrong]

I wish both of you the best. Being on both sides of this and currently recovering, when I hear of couples finally making the decision to end the marriages (there seem to have been a lot on this board lately), my heart drops and I get very sad - for a number of reasons.

 

 

There is no judgment here - just a wish for you to continue recovery, if not together, on your own. I would advise you to seek counsel and continue for awhile. You are going to have to really figure out the WHYS and come to terms with why you had an affair. I think you are getting there, but I don't think you have truly owned it yet.

 

 

The reason you must do this is so that you do not carry this into another relationship. I am one that believes that these "lessons" follow us in one way or another and pop up many times in your life, in a different form, until the lesson is learned and we grow from it.

 

 

Best of luck to you

[compulsivedancer]

CD are you still seeing a counselor?

 

Yeah, but she was sick this week and I kind of needed to talk... Which might be part of what prompted me to post on here.

[NateGrey]

Going out on a limb here....but procreation between loving couples is primal, and if he does not want that, I support your choice to go.....

 

Nothing says end it MORE than one partner NOT wanting to procreate with the other.

 

Um what? Not everyone wants kids, his not wanting kids with her means nothing. It's also possible in his gut he didn't want kids because he knew the type of woman he was married to? Who wants to have kids with someone who will cheat on their spouse? How can you respect your children if you can't respect the person you made vows to never betray in such a way?

 

You can't fault the guy for not wanting kids, doesn't mean he didn't love her or anything. He also dodged a HUUUUUGE bullet by not having kids with her. Like a Texas sized bullet. If he had given into her wanting children now he'd be trapped in a marriage with a cheater, probably afraid to leave because leaving means seeing those kids 50% less.

[Sub]

Who wants to have kids with someone who will cheat on their spouse?.

 

Yeah, I don't think he had that much foresight to KNOW she was going to have an A and factor that into his lack of desire to have children. Seriously, who does that? If you're going to take that route, why not question who wants to marry someone that will cheat on them?

[NateGrey]

Yeah, I don't think he had that much foresight to KNOW she was going to have an A and factor that into his lack of desire to have children. Seriously, who does that? If you're going to take that route, why not question who wants to marry someone that will cheat on them?

 

You'd be surprised at what a persons subconscious can pick up on.

[Sub]

Then he only has his subconscious to blame for getting married to her in the first place.

 

I'm not defending CM's actions here, but that one's a doozy.

[NateGrey]

It's not difficult to understand: part of the reason he might of never wanted kids with her is because maybe deep down he knew it was a huge mistake? I never said it was set in stone, and of course ideally one would be best to have those thoughts consciously and not subconsciously.

 

You said his subconscious would then be blamed for getting married, well sure, but then it'd also be blamed for giving him the massive super speed needed to dodge one hell of a bullet. Almost like the subconscious let him down, KNEW it, and stepped the F up to make it right.

 

Of course this is just one theory I tossed out, he might not of wanted kids merely because he didn't want kids, and it had nothing to do with how much he loved her or how much of the writing on the wall his subconscious mind picked up. It's possible he just genuinely believed he wasn't with a cheater, but still didn't want kids because not everyone wants kids.

Edited December 11, 2014 by NateGrey