Why do a lot of women expect MORE for LESS?

[nofeelings22]

 

And feeling unworthy of love is by far the biggest indicator for things like crime and suicide and other self-destructive behaviours. Not surprising that a lot of the men that clearly feel unworthy of love on LS have also expressed suicidal ideation.

 

It's sad. There are some people who will struggle their whole lives with this. I can remember some in school where it was 100% their genetics. There was almost nothing they could do. They had nobody back then and only through a miracle would have someone now. I think it's probably one of the hardest things in the world to face.

 

Makes anything I've faced in life look like nothing.

 

I really feel for people in that situation....

[Els]

Thanks for sharing, guys. I'd never have expected such positive and constructive dialogue to emerge from this thread, but you fellas certainly proved me wrong.

 

How do you think men (or people, rather, but this conversation was about men) with low internal self-worth could work on it, and how do you think we could help such people? Tool mentioned that counseling helped him back in the day, and that certainly sounds like a good start.

[Mangina]

It's sad. There are some people who will struggle their whole lives with this. I can remember some in school where it was 100% their genetics. There was almost nothing they could do. They had nobody back then and only through a miracle would have someone now. I think it's probably one of the hardest things in the world to face.

 

Makes anything I've faced in life look like nothing.

 

I really feel for people in that situation....

That would be me

[toolforgrowth]

Thanks for sharing, guys. I'd never have expected such positive and constructive dialogue to emerge from this thread, but you fellas certainly proved me wrong.

 

How do you think men (or people, rather, but this conversation was about men) with low internal self-worth could work on it, and how do you think we could help such people? Tool mentioned that counseling helped him back in the day, and that certainly sounds like a good start.

 

Truthfully, neither did I.

 

Yes, counseling was huge for me. If that's not an option, then having a good support group of friends, especially other men. People that you can hang out with without having any expectations. Learning, or in my case re-learning, how to be social.

 

One of my biggest "personal therapy sessions" was when, after over 10 years, I started hanging out with an old friend from high school. He introduced me to scotch and vegan food (I'll never go vegan, but they do have some tasty cuisine), so we'd eat and drink and talk politics, economics, good booze, and food all night long. It was extremely valuable for me to have male interaction and just be a guy for a while without the pressure of competition or validation.

[somedude81]

My Dad says that about himself.

 

He looks like a frog. An old, old bug-eyed frog.

 

Really hope I got my Mom's genes in that respect.

 

But he does act much younger. Somewhere between petulent child and rebellious 13 year old who wants the car.

 

I guess if you average the two out.......

 

Ha ha. I'm constantly being told by young women that I'm much younger than I really am.

 

If a 24 year old woman thinks I'm 24, why should I correct her?

 

My FWB knows how old I am, and she said that I don't look my age at all.

 

Of course my looks won't last forever but for now, my age isn't an issue at the start.

[somedude81]

I would add that this internal self-worth is what is missing from almost all the "nice guys" that we see on LS. When they don't get any messages from OLD to them it means they are not worthy of love.

 

And when they compare this to women who get a lot of messages from who the women deem unworthy of their love (or attraction, or affection etc.) it just reinforces what they already believe.

 

And feeling unworthy of love is by far the biggest indicator for things like crime and suicide and other self-destructive behaviours. Not surprising that a lot of the men that clearly feel unworthy of love on LS have also expressed suicidal ideation.

 

All humans desire sex, love and attention.

 

For some reason, a certain type of man has an extremely difficult time experiencing those things.

 

Going without them for long periods of time can do a lot of damage to a person. The result is plainly seen on this forum and elsewhere.

 

And yes, going without sex, love and attention is something that happens more to men than it does to women. IMO women should be happy that it's something they will never have to live with.

[Weezy1973]

Thanks for sharing, guys. I'd never have expected such positive and constructive dialogue to emerge from this thread, but you fellas certainly proved me wrong.

 

How do you think men (or people, rather, but this conversation was about men) with low internal self-worth could work on it, and how do you think we could help such people? Tool mentioned that counseling helped him back in the day, and that certainly sounds like a good start.

 

Yes, I would also strongly recommend therapy or counseling. It's extraordinarily difficult.

 

In my mind, the key is to be introspective and figure out one's own values:

 

To me, what does it mean to be a man; a husband; a father; a son; a friend; an employee? What about health and fitness?

 

Once those things are figured out it comes down to living and behaving in ways that are consistent with those values. Even if it's hard.

 

And it is hard.

 

But, through living in ways that are consistent with one's values, it begins to strengthen one's self worth. You no longer care what others think because you are living by your values! If others disapprove, so be it; but that's on them.

[toolforgrowth]

All humans desire sex, love and attention.

 

For some reason, a certain type of man has an extremely difficult time experiencing those things.

 

Going without them for long periods of time can do a lot of damage to a person. The result is plainly seen on this forum and elsewhere.

 

And yes, going without sex, love and attention is something that happens more to men than it does to women. IMO women should be happy that it's something they will never have to live with.

 

There are some women that could say exactly the same thing. Again, this transcends gender. I've known women who always had a hard time getting a good guy; my GF now, as an example. Her past relationships were absolutely terrible, and she had her share of single stretches too while being a single mom (and somehow, amazingly, she's still a very optimistic and sweet person). Apples to oranges, but in the end they're both still fruit; meaning that while the specific circumstances may be different, they both still produce the same result.

 

Imagine giving sex to a person in the hopes that they'll love you, but in the end they don't and still dump you. I'd wager that this isn't a scenario most men find themselves in, but has been a scenario many women have been in at least once. After such an experience, don't you think you might be a bit more judicious about who you sleep with?

 

We've seen women begin to understand why some men have these jaded thoughts. They're getting it, and it sounds like they genuinely want to help. Is it not possible for us to catch a glimpse of the difficulties that they face on the other end?

[Ninjainpajamas]

It's sad. There are some people who will struggle their whole lives with this. I can remember some in school where it was 100% their genetics. There was almost nothing they could do. They had nobody back then and only through a miracle would have someone now. I think it's probably one of the hardest things in the world to face.

 

Makes anything I've faced in life look like nothing.

 

I really feel for people in that situation....

 

And that's where understandably a lot of the resentment takes place within men...and its not just a minority, a whole lot of guys wish they could do a whole lot better with women in general and not feel so disadvantaged comparatively...they wish they had the same options, regardless of being cheap or superficial, which women at will, feeling or desire can choose to take advantage if desired or just ignore it.

 

Women can feel that low self worth, but still be married, have relationships and/casual sex. Still have a life.

 

Where the man on the other side with the equivalent self worth, can be entirely invisible to women period, and be a pretty good person overall...but no matter what he does, or how hard he tries to meet the expectations of women...they just aren't ever interested.

 

It's easy to understand when women complain about details, not finding the perfect man or just guys who are really into them but it's unrequited...is like a starving person hearing another person complain about his steak being medium instead of rare...and then at the end of the day saying it's equal because they both got problems just different kinds.

 

Furthermore....there's social support for women...there's feminism and an openess present, no one's going to tease or harass a woman for showing emotion...there's even random people on the internet to tell her how she's worth so much and she deserves a great guy..

 

While a man Is just regarded as whiney and he should man up and increase the value of his product to attract women and figure it out...because women don't want a man with low confidence and self worth/respect....that's not a man. A man knows what he wants and how to get it.

 

When women complain about a man the man is immediately on trial...often criticized and blamed and the woman is treated as an automatic victim.

 

When men complain they're seen as weak and faulty, inadequate and irate or overly emotionl...and essentially pitied. And don't forget women love men with positive attitudes and never self defeatist...even if the guys been shet on.

 

There's a lot more sympathy and understanding being given out to women than men, and yet still the advice for men is to improve and take care of your own crap if you want to be worthy to women...just read the posts, everyone tries to be empathetic to women and protect her feelings..for men it's either cut and dry or cruel. The same sympathy and understanding is not given out for sure...but we all accept the fact when women vent they just need a shoulder to cry on, not practical advice unless extremely urgent...otherwise she can just see where it goes and she shouldn't everything it too much.

 

I really can understand where men like this are coming from...and its odd to me that married women or women in relationships would sit there and indulge in meaningless arguments and debates without ever having the desire to understand nor validate their emotions...for that may risk leverage in the rigidly of their defensive posture.

 

I know these guys aren't perfect, but it isn't right how men are treated either and never given much empathy and understanding or validation for their feelings...which maybe that's why they lash out so much at you.

 

But it seems to be a good target for women with a chip on their shoulder for entirely different kind of men...the men with at least some options.

 

It may not be easy being a woman...but if men could choose the challenges they had to face, many would choose woman problems in a heartbeat...it wouldn't even be a split second of a decision....just to experience the tiniest shred of emotional support, let alone the "meaningless" casual sex or attention.

[BlueIris]

All humans desire sex, love and attention.

 

For some reason, a certain type of man has an extremely difficult time experiencing those things.

 

Going without them for long periods of time can do a lot of damage to a person. The result is plainly seen on this forum and elsewhere.

 

And yes, going without sex, love and attention is something that happens more to men than it does to women. IMO women should be happy that it's something they will never have to live with.

 

Need and desire motivate most people to change. That’s the “some reason” you mention above. Quite often, people who are not getting their needs and desires met have not changed or resist change. People who grow and change are more likely to get their needs and desires met.

[Imajerk17]

I don't know NiP. You do bring up some good points in your last post. At the end of the day though, I don't feel maligned for being a heterosexual male. I just really really like being a guy.

Edited December 16, 2014 by Imajerk17

[Ninjainpajamas]

I don't know NiP. You do bring up some good points in your last post. At the end of the day though, I just really really like being a guy.

 

You get to keep your penis, you just get their problems and they get yours;)

[Mangina]

And that's where understandably a lot of the resentment takes place within men...and its not just a minority, a whole lot of guys wish they could do a whole lot better with women in general and not feel so disadvantaged comparatively...they wish they had the same options, regardless of being cheap or superficial, which women at will, feeling or desire can choose to take advantage if desired or just ignore it.

 

Women can feel that low self worth, but still be married, have relationships and/casual sex. Still have a life.

 

Where the man on the other side with the equivalent self worth, can be entirely invisible to women period, and be a pretty good person overall...but no matter what he does, or how hard he tries to meet the expectations of women...they just aren't ever interested.

 

It's easy to understand when women complain about details, not finding the perfect man or just guys who are really into them but it's unrequited...is like a starving person hearing another person complain about his steak being medium instead of rare...and then at the end of the day saying it's equal because they both got problems just different kinds.

 

Furthermore....there's social support for women...there's feminism and an openess present, no one's going to tease or harass a woman for showing emotion...there's even random people on the internet to tell her how she's worth so much and she deserves a great guy..

 

While a man Is just regarded as whiney and he should man up and increase the value of his product to attract women and figure it out...because women don't want a man with low confidence and self worth/respect....that's not a man. A man knows what he wants and how to get it.

 

When women complain about a man the man is immediately on trial...often criticized and blamed and the woman is treated as an automatic victim.

 

When men complain they're seen as weak and faulty, inadequate and irate or overly emotionl...and essentially pitied. And don't forget women love men with positive attitudes and never self defeatist...even if the guys been shet on.

 

There's a lot more sympathy and understanding being given out to women than men, and yet still the advice for men is to improve and take care of your own crap if you want to be worthy to women...just read the posts, everyone tries to be empathetic to women and protect her feelings..for men it's either cut and dry or cruel. The same sympathy and understanding is not given out for sure...but we all accept the fact when women vent they just need a shoulder to cry on, not practical advice unless extremely urgent...otherwise she can just see where it goes and she shouldn't everything it too much.

 

I really can understand where men like this are coming from...and its odd to me that married women or women in relationships would sit there and indulge in meaningless arguments and debates without ever having the desire to understand nor validate their emotions...for that may risk leverage in the rigidly of their defensive posture.

 

I know these guys aren't perfect, but it isn't right how men are treated either and never given much empathy and understanding or validation for their feelings...which maybe that's why they lash out so much at you.

 

But it seems to be a good target for women with a chip on their shoulder for entirely different kind of men...the men with at least some options.

 

It may not be easy being a woman...but if men could choose the challenges they had to face, many would choose woman problems in a heartbeat...it wouldn't even be a split second of a decision....just to experience the tiniest shred of emotional support, let alone the "meaningless" casual sex or attention.

This is why I left feminism when I had a problem it was not important

[toolforgrowth]

NiP, you wrote a heartfelt post, one that I feel needs an honest answer.

 

And that's where understandably a lot of the resentment takes place within men...and its not just a minority, a whole lot of guys wish they could do a whole lot better with women in general and not feel so disadvantaged comparatively...they wish they had the same options, regardless of being cheap or superficial, which women at will, feeling or desire can choose to take advantage if desired or just ignore it.

Yes, there are a whole lot of guys who wish that. But there are also a lot of women, too. One of my GF's exes beat her up pretty bad once a long time ago, and another became a tweaker. I know she wished for better options too.

 

It also doesn't help to blanketly state that all women are cheap and superficial and take advantage at will. Women are like all people; some bad, and some good. The good ones take offense. As do I when radfems blanketly state all men are evil. You and I know both of those things aren't true.

 

Women can feel that low self worth, but still be married, have relationships and/casual sex. Still have a life.

Au contraire! I guarantee you my ex wife's affair was fueled by a sense of low-worth and lack of self esteem. And she lost her marriage and the life she had with her complete family as a result.

 

Where the man on the other side with the equivalent self worth, can be entirely invisible to women period, and be a pretty good person overall...but no matter what he does, or how hard he tries to meet the expectations of women...they just aren't ever interested.

One who devotes all their time into meeting the expectations of the opposite sex does not have the equivalent self worth. By voluntarily placing their expectations above your own, you are choosing to have your expectations be lower by default. Try starting to meet some of your own expectations instead, it feels pretty good.

 

It's easy to understand when women complain about details, not finding the perfect man or just guys who are really into them but it's unrequited...is like a starving person hearing another person complain about his steak being medium instead of rare...and then at the end of the day saying it's equal because they both got problems just different kinds.

Yes, there are some women like that. You don't have to like the choices they make, but they can make them. I'm not invalidating your feelings and can honestly relate based on prior experiences, but their freedom to make those choices doesn't end because we don't agree. It's a long road to acceptance, my friend, but it's a great place to be.

 

Furthermore....there's social support for women...there's feminism and an openess present, no one's going to tease or harass a woman for showing emotion...there's even random people on the internet to tell her how she's worth so much and she deserves a great guy..

 

While a man Is just regarded as whiney and he should man up and increase the value of his product to attract women and figure it out...because women don't want a man with low confidence and self worth/respect....that's not a man. A man knows what he wants and how to get it.

I absolutely agree with this. Men are socially taught to suppress emotion, and it's extremely unhealthy. As a result, women have far more support options available to them than men. But there are options. If you can, I highly recommend counseling; this is an excellent support option available to men. Spend time with friends, and integrate with them without any intention of trying to impress a lady. It REALLY takes the pressure off and allows you to actually enjoy life.

 

Yes, there can definitely be whining happening, which as you pointed out is essentially the result of low confidence and self worth. But the key isn't to boost your confidence for women's sake, it's to boost it for your own. You gotta learn how to be single, man.

 

When women complain about a man the man is immediately on trial...often criticized and blamed and the woman is treated as an automatic victim.

 

When men complain they're seen as weak and faulty, inadequate and irate or overly emotionl...and essentially pitied. And don't forget women love men with positive attitudes and never self defeatist...even if the guys been shet on.

I will agree that there is an element of victimization behind some of the feminist rhetoric. While they do have very legitimate complaints (equal pay), there can be an underlying theme of women always being portrayed as victims. I don't find anything empowering about being a victim.

 

There is also truth to men complaining being seen as weak or faulty. Complaining is something everybody does. Hell, by his own admission it was George Carlin's motif. But I would call anyone weak and faulty if all they did was complain and not take any action to fix it, male or female.

 

There's a lot more sympathy and understanding being given out to women than men, and yet still the advice for men is to improve and take care of your own crap if you want to be worthy to women...just read the posts, everyone tries to be empathetic to women and protect her feelings..for men it's either cut and dry or cruel. The same sympathy and understanding is not given out for sure...but we all accept the fact when women vent they just need a shoulder to cry on, not practical advice unless extremely urgent...otherwise she can just see where it goes and she shouldn't everything it too much.

Doesn't a woman have to be worthy to you? Or will any woman do? Of course she's going to pick a man she feels worthy of her. And it's okay if that man isn't you. You don't want every woman in the world, either.

 

Of course women need practical advice; they're people. And you're making a lot of assumptions about a woman's intentions in a relationship.

 

But I definitely agree that men can be shot down even if they have a legitimate argument.

 

I really can understand where men like this are coming from...and its odd to me that married women or women in relationships would sit there and indulge in meaningless arguments and debates without ever having the desire to understand nor validate their emotions...for that may risk leverage in the rigidly of their defensive posture.

If you're worried about your lady's defensive posture, then you're not in a healthy relationship. You gotta end it and learn how to express your angst in a healthy way so you don't carry this baggage into your next relationship, or else it'll poison it. I learned that the hard way.

 

I know these guys aren't perfect, but it isn't right how men are treated either and never given much empathy and understanding or validation for their feelings...which maybe that's why they lash out so much at you.

No, it's not right that men don't have many options for a healthy outlet of their negative feelings. Although I gotta say, I took up mixed martial arts and kicking and punching an 8 foot punching bag was really therapeutic. lol And maybe we could be using LS to help each other instead of arguing with the gender we want to sleep with.

 

On the flip side, it's really hard to empathize with someone who lashes out at you, and apologizing might produce better results than justification.

 

But it seems to be a good target for women with a chip on their shoulder for entirely different kind of men...the men with at least some options.

 

It may not be easy being a woman...but if men could choose the challenges they had to face, many would choose woman problems in a heartbeat...it wouldn't even be a split second of a decision....just to experience the tiniest shred of emotional support, let alone the "meaningless" casual sex or attention.

I tend to think that a fair number of women who engage in meaningless casual sex do so out of their own lack of self worth; they're simply expressing it differently.

 

I really don't think that's the case. I'm glad that I don't have to come home and worry if my spouse will beat the crud out of me; I'm glad I don't have to watch the person in the cubicle next to me get paid more for simply having a wing-dang-doodle; and I'm glad that I don't have to worry about being sexually assaulted while out in public. Well, I guess it's technically feasible, but really, what are the odds in comparison?

 

People only walk all over you if you let them. This applies to men and women, and believe me, women get walked over all the time too. You honestly have some legitimate complaints, but the thing is, they are all within your ability to fix. You're not ready for a relationship right now, at all. I was single for 1.5 years on purpose. I was no good to myself or any woman in that emotional state. During that time I got even closer to my little girl, I got a job in IT I've always wanted, I started making a lot more money, and I developed an awesome circle of friends. These are all successes...no relationship required.

Edited December 16, 2014 by toolforgrowth
had the wrong person named.

[somedude81]

There are some women that could say exactly the same thing. Again, this transcends gender. I've known women who always had a hard time getting a good guy; my GF now, as an example. Her past relationships were absolutely terrible, and she had her share of single stretches too while being a single mom (and somehow, amazingly, she's still a very optimistic and sweet person). Apples to oranges, but in the end they're both still fruit; meaning that while the specific circumstances may be different, they both still produce the same result.

 

Did she really have a hard time getting a good guy, or was her past taste in men absolutely horrible?

 

Here's the thing, I don't believe that women have difficulty finding good guys. For whatever reason they chose to be with men who are not good to them.

 

Women seem to be far more likely than men to stay in bad relationships when when she isn't married to the guy or doesn't have kids with him. This makes no sense to me. If a guy cheats, is abusive, or unaffectionate, WALK AWAY!

 

Also, if a woman is ending up with bad guy after bad guy, that just means her picker is broken.

 

Imagine giving sex to a person in the hopes that they'll love you, but in the end they don't and still dump you. I'd wager that this isn't a scenario most men find themselves in, but has been a scenario many women have been in at least once.

 

Sorry, the phrase "giving sex" is ridiculous. I would never want a woman to give me sex.

 

What I do understand is putting time, energy and affection into somebody and having them dump you regardless. That happens to both genders.

 

After such an experience, don't you think you might be a bit more judicious about who you sleep with?

 

That's exactly what women should do. Yet many women seem to prefer men that aren't good for them at all. If women had any common sense they would be chasing after nerds and not musicians and athletes.

 

 

We've seen women begin to understand why some men have these jaded thoughts. They're getting it, and it sounds like they genuinely want to help. Is it not possible for us to catch a glimpse of the difficulties that they face on the other end?

 

I admit that I have a very hard time seeing the troubles that women have. From my point of view, the problems that women commonly have in dating are stupid simple to solve and most are completely preventable.

 

The most common problem men seem to have is actually getting a date with somebody they like.

[elaine567]

I admit that I have a very hard time seeing the troubles that women have. From my point of view, the problems that women commonly have in dating are stupid simple to solve and most are completely preventable.

 

What are the problems women commonly have in dating that are simple to solve and preventable?

[sillyanswer]

Ha ha. I'm constantly being told by young women that I'm much younger than I really am.

 

If a 24 year old woman thinks I'm 24, why should I correct her?

 

Because honesty is a good thing (that many women find attractive) and because revealing a hidden truth that you didn't have to disclose is a way to demonstrate honesty. I'm sure there are other reasons, too.

[elaine567]

There's a lot more sympathy and understanding being given out to women than men, and yet still the advice for men is to improve and take care of your own crap if you want to be worthy to women...just read the posts, everyone tries to be empathetic to women and protect her feelings..for men it's either cut and dry or cruel.

 

I think because women tend to adopt a victim stance or a stance that induces empathy/sympathy. Why is he doing this to me? I love him so much.

Why doesn't he love me? Is he just using me for sex?

The woman is usually weak, defeated and needs bolstering. She is usually willing to listen or accept help.

 

Men tend to start angry and with a sense of entitlement.

That b*tch... she is crazy. I do everything for her, why doesn't she give me sex, I want sex wah, wah, wah!!! I want a hot woman, why can't I get a hot woman? It's not fair.

Not so much sympathy evoked and if an attempt is made to help, it can get shot down in flames by the angry man.

 

I am not saying all men with dating issues are angry and entitled and all women are weak and defeated, but it is a lot easier to work with weak and defeated people to give them a lifeline, than have to fight off angry and entitled people who often won't listen and won't take help, as it all someone else's fault.

[Toodaloo]

Sorry, the phrase "giving sex" is ridiculous. I would never want a woman to give me sex.

 

So glad someone else has picked up on that... Sex isn't "payment" or a "gift" it should be a consensual act of sharing between two people

 

I admit that I have a very hard time seeing the troubles that women have. From my point of view, the problems that women commonly have in dating are stupid simple to solve and most are completely preventable.

 

Ditto for us. Having spoken to single in RL they are having the same problems as I do. Its all simply meeting someone that they connect with and have a bit of physical attraction to. Sometimes you get one with out the other but you need a combination of both for it to work.

 

The most common problem men seem to have is actually getting a date with somebody they like.

 

Which is exactly the same for women

 

 

As for the OP question women expecting more for less? I think that OP has been dating and meeting the wrong sort of women. There are plenty of men out there who are superficial too...

 

The way I look at it is this.

 

There are 24 hours in a day

Sleeping = 8 hours (16 left)

Working inc travel = 12 hours (4 hours left)

Cooking cleaning = 1 hour (3 hours left)

 

3 hours x 5 = 15

15 hours a week x 52 weeks = 780 hours (or 32.5 days)

 

Add on weekend time so

Sleeping = 8 (16 left)

Cooking and cleaning etc = 3 (13 hours left)

 

13 x 2 = 26

26 hours a week x 52 weeks in a year = 1352 (56.33 days)

 

So in a year you have the equivalent of 88/89 days with someone. Thats 12 weeks... Imagine what you could do with a 12 week holiday?!

 

Now I don't know about you but I couldn't spend all that time having sex constantly so I want to make damned sure they are going to be fun to spend time with and that I am going to get on with them outside the bedroom.

 

Its basic maths.

[xxoo]

Women can feel that low self worth, but still be married, have relationships and/casual sex. Still have a life.

 

Where the man on the other side with the equivalent self worth, can be entirely invisible to women period, and be a pretty good person overall...but no matter what he does, or how hard he tries to meet the expectations of women...they just aren't ever interested.

 

If a man were truly invisible to women, that would be very sad.

 

Much more often here, we are hearing from men who have had some attention from women, but the women were deemed unattractive to him. That's quite a different story.

[elaine567]

If a man were truly invisible to women, that would be very sad.

 

Much more often here, we are hearing from men who have had some attention from women, but the women were deemed unattractive to him. That's quite a different story.

 

Entitlement seems to be the issue.

 

1)She is "hot", therefore she is mine.

Oh no, she is not interested, she must be a b*tch, crazy, or a gold digger...

 

2)She is interested! She looks OK, I suppose, no, I'm not interested!...Where was that one with the great boobs...

[GoodOnPaper]

Entitlement seems to be the issue.

 

1)She is "hot", therefore she is mine.

Oh no, she is not interested, she must be a b*tch, crazy, or a gold digger...

 

2)She is interested! She looks OK, I suppose, no, I'm not interested!...Where was that one with the great boobs...

 

Sounds like women shouldn't ever settle but guys should. I agree that guys need to dig a little deeper and figure out how they are drawn to women beyond superficial appearances, but is take-what-you-can-get really going to inspire the typical struggling guy to seek and maintain a satisfying relationship?

[xxoo]

Sounds like women shouldn't ever settle but guys should. I agree that guys need to dig a little deeper and figure out how they are drawn to women beyond superficial appearances, but is take-what-you-can-get really going to inspire the typical struggling guy to seek and maintain a satisfying relationship?

 

No one should settle. (fwiw, my idea of settling has to do with feelings, not lists and standards and body measurements)

 

The hypocrisy is complaining about the other gender being too picky when the individual is also picky. Everyone should be picky about something so important.

[elaine567]

Everyone should be picky about something so important.

 

One of the most important decisions of your life.

[toolforgrowth]

Sounds like women shouldn't ever settle but guys should. I agree that guys need to dig a little deeper and figure out how they are drawn to women beyond superficial appearances, but is take-what-you-can-get really going to inspire the typical struggling guy to seek and maintain a satisfying relationship?

 

Men who believe they must take what they can get have, by definition, low self worth. If a guy is struggling, then maybe he needs to try something different. They say insanity is doing the same thing over and over while expecting different results.

 

It's very easy to blame other people for our problems. It's much harder to look inside ourselves and make changes to solve those problems.

 

Nobody should settle, men or women. If this thread was filled with women complaining about how they have no success with men, I'd be giving them the exact same advice.