CRUSHED: He has another woman at his house tonight...

[Poppygoodwill]

YOu might be jumping to conclusions, or you might be right. You have a history that makes you afraid, and this is the first guy you've dated for a while, which makes you very sensitive and potentially OVER sensitive. That's your issue to manage, no matter what new relationship you get into.

 

Either way, whatever he's done, it's 'legal' because you haven't had The Talk. YOu can choose to be hurt, but you'd be wrong to portray it as a betrayal because you know you haven't established your exclusiveness.

 

I think what you've learned here is that you are really ready to discuss being exclusive, and you need to do that ASAP. Given your reaction to what you saw, you probably should have brought it up before now because clearly you are attached to him and feeling vulnerable.

 

So I think forget blaming him for whatever he may or may not have done. Sit him down and say you realize that, given how far it's gone and that youv'e met his child, you feel it's time to be exclusive and ask if he wants to do that.

 

His reaction will tell you everything you need to know.

[preraph]

You don't even know if the visitor was male or female, young or old! You've gone completely overboard. For all you know, the mom came to get the son or the grandma came to visit the son. Anyway, it's too early for this to be any of your concern and too early for him to have to account to you for his time. You're overly insecure and you'll never stay in a relationship until you fix you.

[Winterina]

You don't even know if the visitor was male or female, young or old! You've gone completely overboard. For all you know, the mom came to get the son or the grandma came to visit the son. Anyway, it's too early for this to be any of your concern and too early for him to have to account to you for his time. You're overly insecure and you'll never stay in a relationship until you fix you.

 

 

 

The point is not that he might have been with another woman. She is aware that he is entitled to do so as they have not had the talk. The problem is in the fact that he might have lied to her. She would have to accept another woman factor that she was told about in her situation, but not the lies about it. Every relationship, even the one that is FWB, open relationship, etc., needs honesty. Lying does not help in any situation as trust is required for ANY relationship to work...

 

 

My advice to the poster is to talk to him!!! Open up and tell him EXACTLY what you feel. Don't hold back. Tell him you saw someone's car. If he is serious about you, he will acknowledge your feelings and will give you all the explanations you need. He will like you the way you are, even with your insecurities which every normal person has to some extent. If he is a player he will be an ahole about it, give you guilt trips and play shame game. I had both kind of men in my life and both exist out there so nobody can tell you which one is he until you talk to him. Let us know what he said.

[contact1]

Instead of going around in circles coming up with all these theories of what "might" be happening, why not go there and ask directly? Comon people, most of us are adults here, not high school kids that should be running around with rumors and notions, do the grown up thing and confront this.

[mangetout]

Well, duh. People are "human". And as they say, to "err is human".

But I can say water is wet, the sky is blue and those are all FACTS. But to say ALL people lie, cheat, deceive, betray... is an absolute and in that, an opinion just because the human condition is a variable.

 

There are two essential things that are pretty worrisome in this post and indicative of where they are both at:

 

#1: ALLEGEDLY, this guy was with someone else last night. All we have was that a car was parked in a spot. Think about it. That's IT. She didn't see someone in the window, she didn't see someone walk in or out of the house. All she saw was a parked car. (If the situation were reversed and it was a man driving past - I am almost sure a lot of the women would chalk this up to the OP being a "psycho" and not trusting his girlfriend. Let's be objective here.)

 

Now regardless of whether or not, the OP was lied to:

 

#2: OP decides that something doesn't ring true and rolls past his house to "confirm her gut instinct".

 

This relationship is already doomed. If she brings it up to him, he'll deny it. Him denying it will either be true or not. There are no other options. The problem is... if he denies it, this relationship is doomed regardless. She will either believe him and he realizes that there are underlying trust issues or he denies it and OP continues with the trust issues.

 

There is no win-win in this situation from now on.

 

And I think that's what EVERYONE posting in this thread needs to realize. There is incomplete information that has now affected the OP into an unbothered state. No matter what the truth is, it's the possibility of information and how it was achieved that has rocked this "relationship" to its core. The assumptions are running wild and everyone can draw their own conclusions, but the reality is simply this: The bond of trust is gone from this relationship in the OP's eyes.

 

Once that veil comes down, it'll never be the same.

 

And that's a FACT.

 

I said people. I didn't say ALL people.

 

And to lie, cheat and deceive isn't something that's uncontrollable just because you are human. You chose to do those things.

Some people don't because Boundaries, morals and a strong intregity is more important than hurting people.

 

Seems like the OP knows that something is wrong. She doesn't need to details all the facts. Don't assume

[mangetout]

Instead of going around in circles coming up with all these theories of what "might" be happening, why not go there and ask directly? Comon people, most of us are adults here, not high school kids that should be running around with rumors and notions, do the grown up thing and confront this.

 

Exactly. Ask the guy.

[Ninjainpajamas]

Chances are high that you are exactly right, but people who don't understand how you're feeling in this situation and all the little bells going off in your head aren't going to be able to relate from an objective point of view...if your gut tells you that strongly, then trust it, don't let other people or even yourself "talk" and convince yourself into something that you pretty much already know is true...all you really need is the damning evidence, but like in most cases in life it's like seeing a land mine but in order to make SURE it's a landmine...well, you've just got to go over there and step on it first then *boom*, well you're all over the place now and in pieces...but no no no, at least now you FOR SURE things were going to blow in your face.

 

I understand people are telling you that it's your fears and insecurities, but I think it's more of your intuition that's kicking in here ever stronger from your experiences...now you're learning to trust your gut rather than having it blow up in your face, now you kind of know the signs, the feelings and the vibe..and the way this guy has been with you in two months is looking really bad to me...he's telling you he wants to take it slow, but he's introducing you to his kid and having you over for Christmas...the guy is obviously playing with two decks, I don't know how people can't see through stupid ***** like this, it must be embarrassing the kind of things you learn the hard way in life.

 

So really look at how that makes any sense, it doesn't...it's basically the push/pull hot and cold behavior guys exude to latch women in, gain those "deep" emotions and then tie you up to their barn like a horse so they can ride you anytime...it's not exactly rocket science, he knows if he stays in the gray area he can get the best of both worlds without exclusivity or a commitment.

 

However, being that it's only two months or so...that little gray area is perfect for people to play around with, and the fact that you won't bring up a conversation just makes the process all the easier. So while you're sitting there thinking things are going well, this guy already has his "game" set into motion...he's going to cut you loose as soon as you start pushing too far and you know that too, that's why you're giving things time and letting it develop...he's not bringing up exclusivity or commitment for a reason...what is it that people seem to not understand about this?

 

It doesn't matter that you can see this developing it into more, that's the hook...you keep thinking that so you keep playing along, you're your own worst enemy. And until you get that big definite answer, you stick around...you just "deal" with the hoops and the "game" thinking you're going to win that big prize in the end.

 

Very doubtful he will give it to you, and you really should advance your own game if you want to be able to repel guys like this...you can't just sit there and wait around like you're being driving around as a passenger and just waiting to see if he takes you to the place you want to go, it's true you can't pressure too much but if you can't outsmart the guy, if you can't ask questions to find out where he is emotionally and mentally and you can't take that to heart or use your head because you're too "invested" and see "potential" then you've only got yourself to blame...you control your part in this situations and women all too often sit there like a passive passenger just hoping things will magically come together, and make excuses galore or claim they just want things to go "organically"...since when did people become flowers in a garden anyway? I am starting to despise that word.

 

You need to control your own fate and destiny, your inaction is enabling, your passivity is an open door to being manipulated and played, your lack of communication simply condemns yourself...if you need your answer, then get them and if you have a gut feeling then learn to trust it, but don't play around and do it half-way, if you know you know, then make the right decision or just suffer the consequences and then come back to LS and complain about it and be more confused...whatever works for you.

[truth_seeker]

I agree with Ninja - go with your gut.

[No Limit]

He's probably into FWB rather than a relationship. Or perhaps you're the OW of the real girlfriend, who knows.

Only one way to find out.

[Tayken]

Takyn, most people simply dont walk around with their head up their butts all the time. Do you know the old saying? Where there is smoke, there is fire! I have been eaten up by a hunch and had to see for myself. I've been lied to, cheated on, all kinds of horrible things and have been in the dating filed a long time. This is the first person i have dated in 2-3 years. Is this right? Probably not. Am I NOT allowed to protect myself? Had I went up to door, pounded on it, and slit whoevers tires was there into a million ribbons, then YAH call me psycho! I just had a look. You are missing the point here...is this guy had someone else at his house. He lives alone, does not have company, and his kid was not there. And he TOLD me he was alone. I needed to know this before my emotions got worse! Now I am trying to figure out if I should stick it out because we are not exclusive to see if he makes that move, or to run screaming in the other direction. If I need help Mister, its from all the crap I have had to endure over years of putting my heart and soul into people who have been all the wrong types and scarring myself. I simply do not want to be blindsided again.

 

 

Get the username right first...most sane people also don't do a drive-by the house of the person they are dating. That is just scary as hell...do you have anything else to do at all, or is the relationship the main focus in your life?

 

You know the old saying...idle minds breeds....

[Eighty_nine]

Get the username right first...most sane people also don't do a drive-by the house of the person they are dating. That is just scary as hell...do you have anything else to do at all, or is the relationship the main focus in your life?

 

You know the old saying...idle minds breeds....

 

Scary as hell to drive by someone's home, which I'm guessing is relatively close to her own, based on a gut feeling? I swear there are some men who troll these boards looking to make women feel bad. I've done the same thing in the past and I'm sure other women reading this have, too. Is it a sign of insecurities and relationship issues? Sure. But "scary as hell"... Nope.

 

Also... How does a car ride and some worries = this relationship being the center of her life?

[CryMeARiver]

Tayken, whatever man. Move on to the next thread.

 

 

Thanks for the posts everyone. He was texting me early this morning and wants to have dinner tonight. He says I should have stopped and woke him up...and says it was a guy but no explanation of who it was. I think he is full of crap. Either way, I will find out all this evening...wish me luck. Wish I had stayed single, so much better this way. I have pulled an ex before out of a car with another woman...about ready to have sex. Been thru so much I cant tell you. That had me to pull out of dating game for some time just to recenter. This guy came along and was charming and pursued me hard so I thought why not? I had just been praying that if there was someone out there, send them along. God sure has a sense of humor...

[contact1]

Well at least you are going to talk about it. Next time though, if this relationship doesn't work out, be clear on your expectations of a relationship. You can't fully hold the blame on him if it was another woman there, when the exclusivity talk was not done nor any statements of expectations of the relationship.

 

Oh and actually try to listen to what he's saying, don't go in the mind set "You are just lying and I know it was a woman there", because honestly, if that is how you are going to go into it, don't even bother and just end it, since you have already made up your mind on the situation.

 

 

PS - I have friends stop by my place all the time unexpectedly when I am planning to be alone, guys do this a lot.

[chimpanA-2-chimpanZ]

I still don't understand why you went by his house in the first place. Driving by someone's house for "snooping" (by your own admission) is worrisome. It's also worrisome to be so absolutely certain that it's a woman and he's lying to you.

 

Lots of people have trust issues, and I understand why you'd be suspicious. You shouldn't ignore your gut instincts, either. But if you're already at the point where you believe he's a two-timing lying sack of crap who needs nighttime surveillance you're in real trouble.

Edited December 29, 2014 by chimpanA-2-chimpanZ

[ascendotum]

Scary as hell to drive by someone's home, which I'm guessing is relatively close to her own, based on a gut feeling? I swear there are some men who troll these boards looking to make women feel bad. I've done the same thing in the past and I'm sure other women reading this have, too. Is it a sign of insecurities and relationship issues? Sure. But "scary as hell"... Nope.

 

Also... How does a car ride and some worries = this relationship being the center of her life?

Close by is another assumption, just like who's car this is, just like he lied to her (guest could have invited themselves over). I am wondering if she drove by later in the night and why she is more sure the person is a woman because they stayed over and not just a friend or relative.

As much as you think Tayken is trolling, if the genders were reversed in this story, for sure the word stalker would have been used by now by one or more woman. Seen it before on a very similar thread not that long ago except in that one the guy got out and verified it was a dude walking around in her place + txted her again and she verified she was on her just lazing in a bubble bath or something like that. I agree with D, that this scenario wont work out. He'll lie or tell the truth and wont be believed + he'll be put off with the fact that she's spying on him.

 

At the same time, I don't look down on people who do this sort of verification (esp when it verifies wrong doing), just that in this situation, the guy is not a bf yet just a prospective bf.

[Tayken]

Scary as hell to drive by someone's home, which I'm guessing is relatively close to her own, based on a gut feeling? I swear there are some men who troll these boards looking to make women feel bad. I've done the same thing in the past and I'm sure other women reading this have, too. Is it a sign of insecurities and relationship issues? Sure. But "scary as hell"... Nope.

 

Also... How does a car ride and some worries = this relationship being the center of her life?

 

I rest my case, and obviously there is no surprise why you condone it based on your own words. You are also young and full of drama based on your other posts.

 

I see a restraining order in your future if you take into adulthood. A person who had done drugs / robbed a bank / killed is more likely to not think there is anything wrong with these acts either...you get the gist.

 

As for the troll comment...I only see one troll on their hands in an avatar stalking someone

 

Close by is another assumption, just like who's car this is, just like he lied to her (guest could have invited themselves over). I am wondering if she drove by later in the night and why she is more sure the person is a woman because they stayed over and not just a friend or relative.

As much as you think Tayken is trolling, if the genders were reversed in this story, for sure the word stalker would have been used by now by one or more woman.

Exactly...she is too young to comprehend this, and like I said hopefully she doesn't carry on with this behaviour into adulthood.

[SincereOnlineGuy]

If it were July... then I'd be more quick to buy into the OP's fear... but on a weekend night between Christmas and New Year's ????

 

 

Shouldn't we keep the jury out until we at least consider that it could have been any far-flung, random house guest ??

[elaine567]

I have been dating this wonderful new man for a couple months now and we have not had the exclusive talk...been too scared to bring it up and he hasn't. We had a nice xmas and I met one of his kids. Yesterday he called and texted sweet messages, felt like we were moving closer. Last night, something hit me and I drove to his house. A strange car was parked in front of his garage, with his car right beside it. he told me he was going to sleep and had an early day. I without a doubt know someone else is there...not a buddy or family member. I felt like I had been shot.

 

This is a man who looks like a bf, who talks like a bf, and acts like a bf. OK the exclusivity talk hasn't been had, but to all intents and purposes...

 

The OP, like countless people here before her had a hunch, something told her something wasn't quite right, something told her she had to check it out.

SO like countless people on here, before her, she decided to snoop, she didn't go through his personal effects, she didn't check his messages, she didn't hire a PI, she merely drove round past his house.

She didn't then hide in the undergrowth, she didn't look in his windows, she didn't take sneaky pictures, she didn't unload them to social media, she merely saw the car in the drive, was devastated at the perceived implications and drove home.

 

This is not stalking, this is a woman in a "relationship" (we can argue all night about how serious it was), she suspects her man is seeing someone else, she looks for clues, and unfortunately found one.

 

Saying this is "stalking" or creepy is an example of double standards, we have men on here, checking phones, emails, rummaging through laptops, handbags, drawers, wardrobes and cupboards, installing key loggers and VARs in rooms and in cars, showing up unexpectedly to the woman's work, even checking her knicker drawers, when they suspect anything is going on, to tons of support from other men.

We on the forum keep advising people not to ignore red flags, and ignoring historic red flags is the source of deep regret for many, but when one presented itself here, it is somehow deemed "creepy" for the OP to investigate...???

 

All the OP did here, was drive around to his house...

[Diezel]

Saying this is "stalking" or creepy is an example of double standards, we have men on here, checking phones, emails, rummaging through laptops, handbags, drawers, wardrobes and cupboards, installing key loggers and VARs in rooms and in cars, showing up unexpectedly to the woman's work, even checking her knicker drawers, when they suspect anything is going on, to tons of support from other men.

We on the forum keep advising people not to ignore red flags, and ignoring historic red flags is the source of deep regret for many, but when one presented itself here, it is somehow deemed "creepy" for the OP to investigate...???

 

All the OP did here, was drive around to his house...

 

Get off your high horse, please, or your "throne" or whatever it is you are rolling your eyes from.

 

I, for one, do not condone the use of keyloggers or checking phones, etc, etc, etc... the "double standards" are equally displayed by both genders and there are many who fight against those.

 

All the OP did was drive around to his house with a SPECIFIC PURPOSE. She might as well had installed a keylogger, or checked his phone, or went through the email, because it's the SAME thing. The cause and effect are just the same as many of those things that you mentioned.

 

"Creepy"? Not really, but a blatant display of unresolved past issues. Definitely. She'll never view this "relationship" (This isn't really debateable - You can't just say for all "intents and purposes", it doesn't work like that) the same because of that and that's something she needs to work on REGARDLESS of whether he lied or not.

 

There is a rift in her mind about this man now, and probably there always will be. And she already said she asked him about who was there, so there is a rift in his mind too.

 

What bothers me is the "guilty until proven innocent" attitude of some of the very people who are condemning those with double standards. Sounds like a whole lot of projection to me.

[Rydo]

I'm not going to read this whole thread so in reply to first couple of posts I dont think this guy has done anything wrong.

 

You aren't exclusive and have not had that talk at all. Even if he had 4 women in his house and told you he was going to bed then he is allowed to do that. The same as you are allowed to do what you want with who you want.

 

I'm not sure it has to be more complicated than that.

 

And if a girl came by my house to check up on me i would consider that stalker behaviour and wouldn't want to see her anymore. If you are this bad when you aren't exclusive how bad will it get when you are?

[elaine567]

"Creepy"? Not really.

 

That was the point I was trying to make.

 

It is not creepy to follow through on a hunch. I do not think men rummaging through personal effects on a valid hunch is creepy either, but I do get upset when the OP is branded a "stalker", when others are carrying out detailed examinations behind their partner's back and are getting a pat on the back for it.

Whether the OP has trust issues or not, something told her something was not right here and she proved she was correct. Something didn't add up and there it was, a car in the driveway.

 

The OP may in fact be super-sensitised and whilst most of us may have gone to bed happy that night and wouldn't have given it a second thought, experience has taught her otherwise.

 

Yes, it will cause a rift, but is that not what happens in any relationship where something just doesn't sound right and the facts then paint a picture.

Whether this man is "innocent" or "guilty" remains to be seen. At the moment it is conjecture and the real truth may be hard to establish. She may just have to take his word for it, unless she knows the registration number and can find out exactly whose car that was.

 

Just because someone has trust issues it doesn't necessarily mean that every red flag they see is baloney, does it?

[SycamoreCircle]

OP, I can empathize with your feelings of distrust and the impulse to check up on him. Having been horribly deceived, I would probably do the same thing. Because there was no agreement to exclusivity, had I discovered something I would not have placed the blame on him. I would just chalk it up as not for me.

 

What I find disturbing about your behavior, where it crosses the line and becomes pathological, in my opinion, is the text you sent him about dropping something off. That was not your real intention. It was deceitful.

 

In the future, do not undertake deceitfulness to uncover deceitfulness.

 

Get in your car, drive by his house, look in the interior of the strange car sitting in the driveway, but when he steps out the front door and asks, "What are you doing?" be honest.

[Rydo]

Saying this is "stalking" or creepy is an example of double standards, we have men on here, checking phones, emails, rummaging through laptops, handbags, drawers, wardrobes and cupboards, installing key loggers and VARs in rooms and in cars, showing up unexpectedly to the woman's work, even checking her knicker drawers, when they suspect anything is going on, to tons of support from other men.

We on the forum keep advising people not to ignore red flags, and ignoring historic red flags is the source of deep regret for many, but when one presented itself here, it is somehow deemed "creepy" for the OP to investigate...???

 

All the OP did here, was drive around to his house...

 

I sorta see what you mean. However for it to be double standards you would have to be seeing the same person responding differently in each situation.

 

I think this is stalker behaviour and also think the people who suggest PI's or VAR's have issues. I cant be held accountable for what some guys say on other threads, this isn't me showing double standards.

 

The only slight bit of double standards I show is that I don't go onto those threads and say its crazy. However I would if the person was only dating and others were suggesting the use of a PI etc. I guess I just pick my battles sometimes.

[cdt76]

Takyn, most people simply dont walk around with their head up their butts all the time. Do you know the old saying? Where there is smoke, there is fire! I have been eaten up by a hunch and had to see for myself. I've been lied to, cheated on, all kinds of horrible things and have been in the dating filed a long time. This is the first person i have dated in 2-3 years. Is this right? Probably not. Am I NOT allowed to protect myself? Had I went up to door, pounded on it, and slit whoevers tires was there into a million ribbons, then YAH call me psycho! I just had a look. You are missing the point here...is this guy had someone else at his house. He lives alone, does not have company, and his kid was not there. And he TOLD me he was alone. I needed to know this before my emotions got worse! Now I am trying to figure out if I should stick it out because we are not exclusive to see if he makes that move, or to run screaming in the other direction. If I need help Mister, its from all the crap I have had to endure over years of putting my heart and soul into people who have been all the wrong types and scarring myself. I simply do not want to be blindsided again.

 

I believe you did the right thing. I agree with another post that said you should have rang the doorbell. Spending months dating someone, getting close to them and having it be one sided is not a good path to be on. Catch them early and be done with it. I snooped a girls phone one night and found out she was sexting him while I was in her bed. So yea, kick him to the curb and move on. No more wasting your time on someone who doesn't make you a priority.

[Redhead14]

I have been dating this wonderful new man for a couple months now and we have not had the exclusive talk...been too scared to bring it up and he hasn't. We had a nice xmas and I met one of his kids. Yesterday he called and texted sweet messages, felt like we were moving closer. Last night, something hit me and I drove to his house. A strange car was parked in front of his garage, with his car right beside it. he told me he was going to sleep and had an early day. I without a doubt know someone else is there...not a buddy or family member. I felt like I had been shot. We have a date tonight, not sure what to do.

 

 

I know in this messed up dating world, unless you have the talk all is free reign. I am now hurt and confused and wondering if he is stringing me along. I spent xmas night with him and his child and we had a great time. I want to be exclusive but not sure what will happen...can he be getting closer to me while figuring things out with other women? Is he just stringing me along? What should I say to him?

 

 

I fear losing him at this point because I felt it could grow into something. I also cant help but think all of our time together has been a practiced script, used for all women in his life. I understand men date several sometimes and decide on one sometimes...but how can I process this? I feel I will never be able to trust him; it would be very hard to be intimate with him at this point although we have not been in a couple weeks (despite spending a great deal of time together) he never initiates which was a huge red flag that made me think he was seeing atleast someone else. I am so floored and heartbroken this morning. Not sure if I should see him for dinner tonight. He will find a text from me when he gets up as I told him I was dropping off something of his on his door step. I did it in case I was caught snooping...I know, its wrong but had a strong feeling...so he will know I was there. I didn't leave anything. What should I say to him people? I don't want to lose it and cry and make demands. I am scared of what he may say to me. Why me?

 

First of all, you've only been dating a couple of months. You should always assume at that point that they are dating others. Secondly, you have been intimate with him without having a talk about exclusivity. He owes you nothing. You should not be snooping or stalking or what have you.

 

What you should do now is open the discussion regarding exclusivity in a casual way. At some quiet point, you should just comment on the fact that that you enjoy spending time with him and highlight a couple of things you like about him. Then you explain what you want for yourself in general from your dating experiences. Explain that you have stopped seeing other people and if he still wants to date other people, then you say you would like to continue seeing him on a casual a basis until you both decide to be exclusive with one another. Of course, this conversation should have happened before intimacy (and a woman hopes the man will bring it up first), but since it didn't, you are entitled to take control of the situation.

 

One of three things will happen . . . he will either say he doesn't want exclusivity with you and likely tell you to move on or he will say he wants to do that. If he says he has to think about it, you say "take the time you need". Do not be whiny or ask why. And, then pay attention to his actions and how be treats you from that point for say about a month. If he's showing you more and more that he wants to be with you, you give it a little more time. If he wants to be intimate with you and has not responded to the "talk", you tell him you're moving on.

 

If he says he doesn't want that when you do have that talk, be prepared to leave right then and there. Do not be whiny or ask why, just wish him all the best for his future. If he says he wants time, sex is off the table for a while. And don't say that specifically, just make it so that the opportunity doesn't exist. Don't go on dates to his house and if you're out on a date, just say you need to go home because you have things to do or something. Don't make it appear that sex is a weapon or tool of manipulation.