Should you tell your partner/spouse when someone makes a move on you?

[autumnnight]

I fully understand that. But to be fair she didn't do anything to stop them either, or more correctly didn't do enough.

 

And NOW we get down to it. And you are wondering why she did not tell you?

[denise_xo]

I am not ignoring those facts, I acknowledge they have and do exist. They do NOT exist in me.

 

I don't think it's fair for men to change their outdated attitudes towards women but then women keep using those same outdated attitudes as a reason to continue their past behavior. In my case I would not judge (I don't have those outdated views) but my wife seems to want to still judge me like I do (she still has those outdated views about me).

 

We live in societies. You're not the only person your wife relates to. It's not outdated, it's happening here and now, on a daily basis.

 

The reality is that she didn't feel comfortable telling you this. You can go on and on about how you don't think it's fair and how you're angry at her, but it's not going to get you very far. I think a better way to approach it would be to openly examine with her how you can strengthen the level of trust and openness in your relationship, and take a "we" approach to the problem rather than a one sided "SHE doesn't trust ME and I feel hurt".

 

What exactly are you doing, practically, to address the issue, besides telling her that you are hurt and you don't approve of how she handled it?

[sandylee1]

I don't care whether society would judge, that is not the issue, I WOULDN'T judge and I was the only person she needed to tell.

 

 

There is no way the whole group would not have found out though. He was a mate of you and others, so how do you explain why you wouldn't want to see him anymore without saying what happened to rest of the group? Comes back to the fact that everyone would then know what happened. That's something she would not have wanted.

 

Even though you would have believed her, what about the rest? Whispers and speculation. You may say it's only your opinion that should matter, but the fact is you and her are not the only people in this world and what others think really DOES matter to most people.

[Mr. Lucky]

And NOW we get down to it. And you are wondering why she did not tell you?

 

Yep, always seemed something like this was bubbling under the surface.

 

OP, don't want to jump to conclusions - what exactly should she have done?

 

Mr. Lucky

[jmanippo]

And NOW we get down to it. And you are wondering why she did not tell you?

 

Get down to what? Of course I am wondering why she didn't tell, I asked it in my opening post.

 

We live in societies. You're not the only person your wife relates to. It's not outdated, it's happening here and now, on a daily basis.

 

You are absolutely correct, and if she was going to tell society the reasons given here are very valid. However we are talking about a much smaller circle, just me and her, and it is not "happening here and now" in our little circle.

 

There is no way the whole group would not have found out though. He was a mate of you and others, so how do you explain why you wouldn't want to see him anymore without saying what happened to rest of the group? Comes back to the fact that everyone would then know what happened. That's something she would not have wanted.

 

That is a valid point. That is reason for her to ask me not to take any action, it is not a reason not to tell. If anything though the group would have thought it was an issue between him and I, I doubt my wife would have even rated a thought as to being part of the issue.

 

Even though you would have believed her, what about the rest? Whispers and speculation. You may say it's only your opinion that should matter, but the fact is you and her are not the only people in this world and what others think really DOES matter to most people.

 

The only whispers and speculation would have been over what happened between him and I. As I just said above I don't think anyone would have drawn any connection between him and my wife.

 

And the elephant in the room still remains, if she spoke up after the first incident we would never have got to this stage.

[jmanippo]

Yep, always seemed something like this was bubbling under the surface.

 

OP, don't want to jump to conclusions - what exactly should she have done?

 

Mr. Lucky

 

What is it with this bubbling under the surface rubbish, it was the question I raised in my opening post.

 

What she should have done was spoken up after the first incident. Then none of this should have happened. Better still the first person that he made a move on should have spoken up and in all likelihood my wife would have never even had a first incident at all.

[Art_Critic]

What she should have done was spoken up after the first incident. Then none of this should have happened. Better still the first person that he made a move on should have spoken up and in all likelihood my wife would have never even had a first incident at all.

 

woulda, shoulda, coulda, you are getting lost in trying to lay blame on the wrong people..

 

IMO blame can only be attributed to one person, the guy who crossed the boundaries of your wife and the others.

[autumnnight]

woulda, shoulda, coulda, you are getting lost in trying to lay blame on the wrong people..

 

IMO blame can only be attributed to one person, the guy who crossed the boundaries of your wife and the others.

 

This is obvious to a compassionate person. To a person more concerned with their pride than their wife's trauma...not so much.

 

When an assault victim cannot even feel safe with her spouse, it breaks my heart.

[jmanippo]

This is obvious to a compassionate person. To a person more concerned with their pride than their wife's trauma...not so much.

When an assault victim cannot even feel safe with her spouse, it breaks my heart.

 

Saying this does not make it true. I have stated more than once that there are two separate issues here, one where I am fully supportive of my wife and one where I am not. There is no need to draw the two together and complicate things.

 

Heck, even my wife can see that there are two separate issues, she has thanked me for being supportive and non-judgmental re the assault.

 

I am genuinely surprised that people here are trying to draw the two together.

[hoping2heal]

OP,

 

Thank your lucky stars that your wife is not on this forum and was not able to read the post where you said this (among other things):

 

I fully understand that. But to be fair she didn't do anything to stop them either, or more correctly didn't do enough.

 

I'm not sure I could ever continue on in my marriage to someone if I saw them say something like this after I was sexually assaulted. I'm just not sure I could ever get past that level of betrayal.

 

Here's what your wife COULD HAVE done to stop the incident, since you feel she should have...

 

She could have married another man and never met you or your disgusting excuse for a person aka predatory friend you have there. She had no way of knowing that your friend would do this to her, I can't imagine what woman WANTS to be sexually assaulted and chances are, no...none of the other women spoke about it either. Why? Because people blame the victims who already feel it is their fault and feel shameful. It's nothing anyone ever wants to talk about because of people like YOU who sit there and speculate about how someone who experienced a violating trauma that you did not have to, should have behaved and reacted.

 

I agree with Mr. Lucky...you should ask yourself why your wife felt she couldn't tell you, and as he also pointed out you have already shown why. I can only imagine what you would have said to that poor woman.

[autumnnight]

Saying this does not make it true. I have stated more than once that there are two separate issues here, one where I am fully supportive of my wife and one where I am not. There is no need to draw the two together and complicate things.

 

Heck, even my wife can see that there are two separate issues, she has thanked me for being supportive and non-judgmental re the assault.

 

I am genuinely surprised that people here are trying to draw the two together.

 

She may say that, but every time you harp on how she should have told you, I guarantee what she HEARS is that you blame her.

 

Do you have a time machine? No. That means neither of you can go back and do it another way. The "telling you when it happened" ship has sailed. Concentrate on your wife instead of your need to be right.

[carhill]

So, OP, having read the responses, where do you feel you should go from here, accepting that the past is the past?

 

If you want to resolve this issue to more transparency in the future, that's possible. You can do that alone, or with help. How depends on the two of you.

 

IMO, though I can never be sure, I feel two keys to my exW's transparency on such matters were, one, she got professional counseling after being raped as a teenager and, two, my door was always open for anything that was on her mind, and in a non-judgmental fashion. So, if old wounds were triggered, OK. If something bugged her about the actions of a client, OK. IMO, that's an environment which both partners facilitate. Each plays their role, and the roles are constantly changing, hence why marriage is rarely if ever on autopilot, rather hands-on flying. Lose focus and it's a smoking hole in the desert. Hope things work out for you!

[Almond_Joy]

I fully understand that. But to be fair she didn't do anything to stop them either, or more correctly didn't do enough. If anyone of them women spoke up earlier a majority of this could have been avoided. I ask myself what if my mate didn't catch his wife cheated with our ex-friend? That means my wife and the other probably wouldn't have come clean and this would still be a hidden issue for our group today.

 

There are some strong overtones of blame here. You've said multiple times in this thread you don't blame her but the statement in bold up there IS blaming. "It's her/their fault things came to this for not telling after the first violation." That's what that reads like and that sentiment echoes under everything you're saying.

 

How can you believe your support is not tainted by this accusation? You don't think your wife feels this criticism of her actions and carries it with her along with everything else? "You've had a terrible experience and I'm here to support you BUT you shoulda coulda woulda...." C'mon man.

 

I don't see how you can support your wife when you blame her, the two shouldn't co-exist in a situation like this. And though I understand your frustration and hurt, and do think they're important to be addressed, your wife is likely not equipped to work through this issue and the assault. If you're going to have a constructive discussion about your concerns and feelings, your wife needs to be able to process and carry what happened to her in a healthy way first.

 

Honestly with the way you're feeling about things - again valid and understandable - it doesn't seem like you should be her only source of support through this. Right now I would think she is not in a position to help thoroughly resolve your feelings either. I hope that you both find some solace and support through other sources besides each other. I know you're trying but in this thread, your support and sympathy sounds paltry in comparison to your anger. And I'm sure she's trying but she's also got this monster of an incident to try and come to terms with.

[Popsicle]

A friend put his hand down your wife's pants? Yeah, that was totally inappropriate of your friend to do AND your W for not telling you.

 

Something innocuous I can see not telling you (women get hit on all the time) but he put his hand down her pants!

[jmanippo]

There's been a number of posts here that have basically painted me as an uncaring husband. I think I need to set the record straight. I'm sure some wont want to listen and that's their choice but I will explain nonetheless.

 

I see what has happened as two separate issues and I have treated it that way. I came here to discuss the second issue, the issue of why my wife (and the others) didn't tell earlier. That does not mean that I am constantly harping on about this to my wife, in fact it has barely been mentioned as I have been focusing on supporting her after finding out about the assault. I haven't mentioned that much here as that is not the reason of the thread. I actually started this thread to play out in advance how the discussion with my wife might proceed when the time is right.

 

Instead of being able to do that I have been attacked for making her feel bad because I keep on at her about not telling. That has never happened.

 

As I said earlier I am genuinely surprised that people here cannot separate the two issues.

 

For the record I am supporting my wife. We spoke about counseling but she is not interested so I have contacted a counselor myself and will be going to discuss the ways I can best support my wife. I thought that was a better place to discuss that aspect of what happened than here.

 

I probably never should have mentioned the assault in my original post to avoid what happened here, I guess you live and learn. I thought a little detail may have given more insight so people could accurately comment. Instead people have focused on that detail instead of answering the question asked.

 

I just want to reiterate that I am supporting my wife in every way possible, the not telling has been mentioned but it was only after initially being told when I was angry and it wont be addressed again until the time is right (but it will be addressed).

 

I do appreciate everyones comments but I think we have drifted a little off track and are focusing too much on the assault, that is not the purpose of this thread but that doesn't mean that it is not my focus in real life.

 

I'm sure some here have already labelled me and there will be no coming back from it, but I thought I might as well address what has happened in the hope some are still open enough to listen to what I am saying. I'd like to think that I am a better man than what some have accused me of here.

[Million.to.1]

I would be curious if your wife knew he tried this type thing with the other women in your group or did she think these advances were exclusive to her.

 

Yeah, did the other woman know this happened to more than just them?

 

OP, i know you said "they are woman they would talk", but I'm not so sure.

 

From what you have explained about the group dynamics consisting primarily of couples, speaking up about a incident like that would seriously rock a lot of boats. I doubt if the woman discussed it with each other. I think most would have thought is was an isolated incident and was handled at the time, and didn't want to cause issues within the group. It would be very hard to mention it to only 1 or 2 other people without them telling their spouses etc. It's an all or nothing declaration.

 

Although I agree with you that if your wife had spoken up to you about the first incident, much of this could have been avoided. I understand many of the reasons why she didn't though.

The reasons have been covered by other posters here and I think you should reflect on them. Her decision to keep it to herself was emotional, not based on the logic you are applying to the situation. We don't always do what's right when we struggle to make sense of things and I think dwelling on why these woman didn't speak up won't help you move forward.

 

In all honesty, I think the interaction your ex-friend had with the woman of the group while in the friendship circle was one based on flirting/ flattery etc. Maybe he is handsome and charming and gave them attention and it was safe and he was a their husband's friend and it was ok and they liked it. Woman like attention, and sometimes from men that aren't their partners. No harm really. Then he made a physical advance and they questioned their contribution to him feeling it was ok to do that. They worried that that gave a signal it was ok. They felt guilty. They kept quite because they felt responsible. If they all felt their own experience was an isolated incident at the time, then it's understandable, not necessarily right, but understandable that they didn't speak up.

Edited January 3, 2015 by Million.to.1

[denise_xo]

You are absolutely correct, and if she was going to tell society the reasons given here are very valid. However we are talking about a much smaller circle, just me and her, and it is not "happening here and now" in our little circle.

 

And the elephant in the room still remains, if she spoke up after the first incident we would never have got to this stage.

 

I actually started this thread to play out in advance how the discussion with my wife might proceed when the time is right.

 

As I said earlier I am genuinely surprised that people here cannot separate the two issues.

 

I was angry and it wont be addressed again until the time is right (but it will be addressed).

 

I do appreciate everyones comments but I think we have drifted a little off track and are focusing too much on the assault, that is not the purpose of this thread but that doesn't mean that it is not my focus in real life.

 

To the first bold: When I said we live in societies, it means that the way we think is informed by the societies and cultures we live in. Not by the mind of our husbands alone. To think that her reaction would only be coloured by your own personality is extremely naive. As someone said upthread, it is also very likely that she thought that telling you would imply telling your entire group of friends. Otherwise, it seems you would be breaking your own principles - if you knew that a good friend of you was assaulting your wife, I assume that you'd want to tell the other husbands in that close circle who also have him as a close friend, to avoid this happening to their wives. Right?

 

To the second bold: People are able to separate the two issues, but the way you write about the not-tellling-bit has caused concerns about how you are handling the sexual-assualt-bit. Surely, it's understandable that there may be connections between the two, even if you'd like to treat them separately? In fact, how you deal with her sexual assault will to a great extent determine if she'll tell you if something similar (god forbid) happened to her in the future.

 

To the third bold: I have to say it's not very clear what the purpose of your thread is. As I said in an earlier post, you seem to keep asking why, why, why, when your wife has already given you the answer. Several posters here have also given you reasons why she may have reacted the way she did, but you have dismissed them all as invalid. If that's how you communicate with your wife over this (dismissing her reasons as invalid and saying they can't be true, then turning to a message board to try to find the 'real' answer but repeating the procedure there), then I'm not that surprised she didn't tell you.

[Rainbowlove]

Considering 1 in 5 girls is sexually assaulted by the time they are 18, I'm wondering if she's experienced this type of assault before? And if so, I'm not surprised by her silence.

 

Step 1.

 

Educated yourself on sexual assault and victim responses.

 

Step 2.

 

Find support for you and your wife. There's help out there. I think you both could benefit from it.

 

Another question. If I missed it, I apologize.

 

Has anyone turned him in to the authorities? You seem to be blaming your wife for her silence. Actually, all the women for their silence. Saying if they spoke up, they could have prevented the whole thing from happening.

 

Did you turn your friend in and file charges? If not, you are doing nothing to prevent it from happening. His next victim can blame you too.

 

It goes both ways.

[Popsicle]

Your anger should be focused on the man who did this not on your wife. Often times the husband is more afraid to confront and face another man that he directs his anger towards and blames the woman because it's easier, but that is misdirected.

[denise_xo]

Educated yourself on sexual assault and victim responses.

 

This. There's plenty of research that addresses why victims of sexual assault stay silent. I think you will see from that research that husbands' personalities are not the main variable in that picture. Ask your counsellor to provide you with some trusted research findings on the topic. Your attitude to this question is very out of line with what research, and you need to de-center yourself from the equation. Your personality isn't the determining factor here.

[jmanippo]

To the first bold: When I said we live in societies, it means that the way we think is informed by the societies and cultures we live in. Not by the mind of our husbands alone. To think that her reaction would only be coloured by your own personality is extremely naive. As someone said upthread, it is also very likely that she thought that telling you would imply telling your entire group of friends. Otherwise, it seems you would be breaking your own principles - if you knew that a good friend of you was assaulting your wife, I assume that you'd want to tell the other husbands in that close circle who also have him as a close friend, to avoid this happening to their wives. Right?

 

You are making many assumptions and that is fair enough because you only know what has been posted here, and as already explained that is very limited because it was not the area I wished to focus on.

 

My wife and I have been through a lot, I already have her deepest secrets stored never to be shared, she already knows I will never tell. I know because I know our whole lifes situations, i know because of our past that my wife would have (should have) felt absolutely confidant that if requested I would never utter a word and yes that includes to the group. And while that would be breaking my own principles my loyalty to my wife trumps all.

 

People are able to separate the two issues, but the way you write about the not-tellling-bit has caused concerns about how you are handling the sexual-assualt-bit.

 

As I said in an earlier post the way I write about the not telling bit on an internet forum is worlds away from how I am dealing with my wife and what she has gone through (where the not telling has barely been mentioned at all). People are pulling the two together because it's convenient and makes for a sensationalist commentary but it is miles from the facts.

 

I have to say it's not very clear what the purpose of your thread is. As I said in an earlier post, you seem to keep asking why, why, why, when your wife has already given you the answer.

 

As per my first post we have a close knit group of 6 couples, we know that 3 out of 6 of the women were propositioned by a single friend of the group. None of them spoke up and I think that 100% not speaking up is way over the odds. I wanted to discuss that.

 

Several posters here have also given you reasons why she may have reacted the way she did, but you have dismissed them all as invalid.

 

Yes they have and it's not that I haven't listened, it's that some of the responses are irrelevant. Giving a reason why someone didn't speak up after an assault is not an answer to why 3 out of 3 women did not speak up after a simple proposition from another group member. People may want to drag the thread down that road but that is not what I wish to discuss.

 

Educated yourself on sexual assault and victim responses.

 

There is a number of things wrong with that comment. You are assuming that I am not educated on the matter (for the record I am, more than you would know). Just because I have chosen not to talk about that part of what happened here does not mean I don't care or don't understand it's effects.

 

But to get back to he point of the thread, understanding victim responses after an assault in no way applies to the question of why no-one spoke up initially. That is before any assault occurred.

 

Find support for you and your wife. There's help out there. I think you both could benefit from it.

 

And if you read my last post before this one you will see I touched on that even though it is nothing to do with the purpose of the thread.

 

Your anger should be focused on the man who did this not on your wife. Often times the husband is more afraid to confront and face another man that he directs his anger towards and blames the woman because it's easier, but that is misdirected.

 

I am certainly not afraid to confront him and maybe in time that will happen. At the moment I am respecting the wishes of my wife to not take it any further.

 

This. There's plenty of research that addresses why victims of sexual assault stay silent.

 

*sigh*

 

There may well be bucket loads of research and I may or may not be helping my wife the right way. All that is totally irrelevant to this thread which is about why 100% of wives (in our case) have decided to remain silent after a proposition, not an assault. That makes any reply regarding how some women act after an assault irrelevant.

 

I am in no way dimishing what people feel after an assault just pointing out that it is not relevant to what is, well should have been discussed here.

 

This constant trying to hijack the thread to make it about the assault and how I am dealing with it is ridiculous.

[Rainbowlove]

You never answered.

 

Did you turn him in?

[jmanippo]

You never answered.

Did you turn him in?

 

In the post just above

 

I am certainly not afraid to confront him and maybe in time that will happen. At the moment I am respecting the wishes of my wife to not take it any further.

[William]

As a reminder, here is the topic:

 

"So why do women keep quiet to their partners when another man makes a move on them? Doesn’t the husband or fiancé or even boyfriend deserve to know. Even is it is their best friend?

 

I’m not trying to bash women here, obviously my (ex)friend is a complete loser, he is nothing to me now but that doesn’t excuse my wife’s lack of respect to me by not telling me. And it’s not just my wife not telling as I have explained. So what’s the go with that?"

 

The thread is titled:

 

Should you tell your partner/spouse when someone makes a move on you?

 

Responses addressing the topic are welcomed. Feel free to share personal experiences relevant to the topic. Thanks!

[jmanippo]

Thank You William