A question for the ladies

[analyzetheworld]

I've never really posted anything like this kind of a question before, but I am not sure how else to do accurate research on this, and it is very important to me, so I'd greatly appreciate it if you women out there would respond.

 

I have recently been told that women are turned off by insecurity in men. Now, I can understand that, to a certain degree, because if a man is more insecure, he is more likely to be clingy, possibly abuse, and get jealous. However, what I also have been told is that women avoid even the hint of insecurity, so men should "fake" being secure, because this will attract women. My first reaction to this was that this must be the kind of thing that players do, in order to get women - to change themselves in order to attract women. According to my thinking, no one should change themselves; each person should accept the other, including good points, bad points, areas of confidence, and areas of insecurity. I really would like to know womens' takes on this; if they truly avoid insecure guys (even just a little) like the plague, or if they don't mind it, as long as the guy does not get abusive, jealous, etc., or if they even feel a closer bond with them, because they too may be insecure in some ways (each person can help the other)

 

A little bit of background on me may help to explain my reasons for asking this question. I basically grew up without a dad, and my mother was not very sensitive/feminine, and did not have a lot of time for me growing up...so, I had to learn to figure stuff out on my own. I have not had a lot of experience dating women, and am trying to educate myself, but want to know how best to go about it. However, when I heard that women stay completely away from insecure guys (of which I am to a certain degree), my first reaction was that I should just throw in the towel, because I would have to get everything in my life taken care of first, before attempting to date (as I refuse to be something that I'm not, just to attract women - I don't think it's fair to me or them). So, I would like to know how open you women are to being with someone who is working through issues in his life, and just being who he is.

 

Thanks a lot, in advance, for your time and input.

[invincible summer]

I've heard it said before that for women there is nothing more attractive than confidence. By this I mean true confidence, not some act or blatant cockiness either. But I guy who is genuinely comfortable in his own skin, comfortable with where he is in life and what he has or doesn't have. Someone who likes himself flaws and all. Now mind you when I was young I'd fall for guys who acted cocky but soon became disenchanted by them because they weren't really confident- they put up a false front. This may work to attract young girls but if your looking for something more than just a romp or someone who knows what they want, a facade will not produce long lasting results. Also a lot of women think they want a guy they can mold or placate our every whim (I'll probably get a lot of flack for saying this) but we really don't,we really don't want a puppy. We want a man. A leader, a protector, a strong man(this does NOT mean rude,abusive or disrespectful either). Of course a lot a of people won't agree with this, But don't take it from me- some tips(I 've senn and agree with- about what a secure man is like:

 

A REAL MAN KNOWS THAT HE IS NOT SMART IF HE THINKS:

 

-having a bad relationship is better than being alone

-need a woman to validate his sense worth

-put a hold on his life until he has a committed relationship

-can't find joy in music, movies, shopping, cooking...or anything unless there is a woman to share it

-forgets that having a relationship can create as many problems as it solves

-need a woman to make himself feel special

 

DEPENDENCY IS A TURN OFF, NOT A TURN ON.

A relationship with a woman whould enrich your life, not define it. If a woman doesn't call you everyday or respond to every single email...in the past i would get anxious. If I didn't konw for sure when I would be seeing her again, I would get nervous. The best way to develop a good relationship is maintain the relationship you already have developed with yourself. A desirable man doesn't rearrange her priorities every time he meet a prospective partner. It is not smart to set up a pattern in a relationship win which she become the God and you a slave.

 

If you are trying to please a woman by behaving as though you are less than you are:

 

-you will start to believe that you are less than you are

-you will end up resenting her

-you will stunt your own growth, and you will limit the relationship.

 

you don't have to prove

 

-yourself worthy

-that you're smart

-that you are good person

-you are terrific

-that you are funny

-that you are sympathetic

-that you are supportive

....ect....

 

 

There is a difference between being caring and being co-dependent. And if you really want to spend your life dealing with other people's problems, you should become a social worker and get paid to do it.

__________________

(I wouldn't of 10 years ago but I know myself a hell of a lot more than I did at 20 0r 25.

[moimeme]

I really would like to know womens' takes on this; if they truly avoid insecure guys (even just a little) like the plague, or if they don't mind it, as long as the guy does not get abusive, jealous, etc., or if they even feel a closer bond with them, because they too may be insecure in some ways (each person can help the other)

 

Some women 'need' men to be the 'big strowng mayun' for them. They freak out if their men appear to be human and - gasp! - sometimes are insecure. All you need do is avoid them. There is definitely not one rule for all women, or even for most women. People of all sorts find people who suit them. Your challenge is to meet the person suitable to you, not to pretend what you are not to fool someoene into accepting you. If you do this, the person will eventually figure out what the real story is and dump you anyway. Be your own self, and as you continue to live and learn, your confidence and security will grow.

[blind_otter]

Confidence should not be confused with mental stability or mental health. I mean, I think we are all aware of our personal shortcomings and stuff like that. The thing is being honest about it, at least that's how it is for me. I am like, I'm a crazy beyotch, but that's just me! I still love myself for all my crazy beyotchiness. See the difference?

 

I look for a guy who is complimentary to my craziness. At least now I do. This is what personal experience has taught me. But it doesn't mean you shoudn't be continually challenging yourself to strive to be a better person though. That's the thing, a lot of people use what you're hinting at as an excuse to never really address the things they should address, personally and emotionally. Because to me being who you are isn't the same as working on your issues. It's kind of one or the other.

[analyzetheworld]

I've heard it said before that for women there is nothing more attractive than confidence. By this I mean true confidence, not some act or blatant cockiness either. But I guy who is genuinely comfortable in his own skin, comfortable with where he is in life and what he has or doesn't have. Someone who likes himself flaws and all.

 

Thanks invincible summer for that key thought. That is something that I'd been wondering about for a while. I mean, this makes common sense, but unfortunately, society makes the whole gender issue a bit confusing for someone who is trying to figure it all out.

 

A relationship with a woman whould enrich your life, not define it. If a woman doesn't call you everyday or respond to every single email...in the past i would get anxious.

 

This really isn't an issue for me, but I can completely agree with you on it, and appreciate you taking the time to include it.

 

--

 

There is definitely not one rule for all women, or even for most women. People of all sorts find people who suit them. Your challenge is to meet the person suitable to you, not to pretend what you are not to fool someoene into accepting you.

 

Thanks for the reminder moimeme; there are all types of people out there - true enough. I think that the only way people can develop a close relationship is if they stay true to who they really are...that is why what I heard confused me so much, because it seemed as though the person was saying that women (in general) perfer to have a man appear to be something he's not, because that is what they are attracted to; or if they don't perfer it, at least they don't care, as long as he keeps up the facade. To me, this seemed ridiculous, and that is why I wanted to get some opinions on it.

 

--

 

Confidence should not be confused with mental stability or mental health. I mean, I think we are all aware of our personal shortcomings and stuff like that. The thing is being honest about it, ... That's the thing, a lot of people use what you're hinting at as an excuse to never really address the things they should address, personally and emotionally. Because to me being who you are isn't the same as working on your issues. It's kind of one or the other.

 

I had never really even thought of that perspective on this whole issue blind_otter. I am not dealing with that in this case, but can see how it would be easily masked. As for me, I hold myself to a fairly high standard to work on stuff that needs to be worked on - whether that be physically, emotionally, or mentally. True that being who you are is not the same as working on your issues, necessarily, but I think that if someone is being who they are, those issues will arise naturally, and then they have a choice of whether or not to work on them.

 

--

 

Thanks to all 3 of you for your input; much appreciated.

[Mz. Pixie]

When I first met my bf he came across very secure and comfortable in his own skin. He is comfortable in his own skin and secure- in the fact that he's a good person and deserves a good relationship- since he brings alot to the table.

 

However, as well fell in love he opened up emotionally more to me and I could see that he was insecure a bit (his xwife cheated on him etc). He was very open and honest with me and communicated to me that he needed reassurance from time to time because of his past. I have no problem giving him that when he needs it. He's not a whiny blubbering mess nor is he overly jealous. He just likes to know he's the only one.

 

To me a bit of it's not a turn off. You don't want too much, and you don't want the guy to show it too soon but a little bit of this prevents someone from being cocky IMO.

[analyzetheworld]

Mz. Pixie, thanks for sharing your experience and advice. I apologize it has taken me a while to get back on here and reply.

 

Something that I find to be a bit of a double standard, the more I get to know the whole dating scene, is that it seems to be socially acceptable for the woman to be insecure in some ways - like more reserved and such, but taboo for a guy to be like this, and women avoid such a guy. In my book, this is frankly hypocritical, as I don't think women should expect any more of a man than they do of themselves. Speaking from a man's point of view here, it really turns me off, when I see the whole "game".

 

A woman looks for a man to give her attention...those guys that are insecure don't have the capacity to do this at times (mostly not because of their own faults, but rather because of their upbringing in most situations). So, the guys who end up giving attention are the guys who are full of themselves (AKA players)...then women complain about how screwed up all men are, and say that they are not going to date anymore - meanwhile, the guys who are nicer (by the way, it is also taboo to be nice these days) are ignored, because they don't "play the game" and give attention - they actually try to be real (what every girl says she wants), and get rejected because of it.

 

So, my whole conclusion on the dating thing is that the whole thing is a big game - one in which you either get played or play others - I refuse to play. I think each side (women and men) play because they are both insecure deep down, but are too afraid to show it. If guys NEED a woman, they are insecure; if women NEED a guy to notice them, they are insecure. So, the only real people that have the balls (figuratively speaking ) to be who they really are, are, ironically, labeled as insecure, while those who truly are, are labeled as secure. I'll wait till I meet someone who is not about trying to get notches on her belt by seeing how many guys she can get to notice her. When someone wants a guy who is real, then there is a possibility.

 

So, thanks again to all of you who answered.