Yup OLD still a waste of time

[BlueIris]

I think he went over the top on his summary of women who use OLD too, but out of frustration for sure. ...

 

It's really not okay to call people trash and garbage even in frustration, but thanks for the response. I'll leave the guys to the woman-bash-fest. Best of luck all.

[TouchedByViolet]

Wait a second. What is that?

 

That's hilarious. Can you explain how that works?

 

Essentially the dating app gives all the users a rating based on how often they reply to first messages.

 

Found this equation online (unable to verify the accuracy but you get the idea)

Based on % responses to FIRST messages (tally revised weekly):

>33% of first messages "Often"

<=10% of first messages "Very Selective"

10-33% "Selective"

 

Women are pretty much always very selective and men are often. I only looked at users active in the last 24 hours.

[Moy]

Wait a second. What is that?

 

That's hilarious. Can you explain how that works?

 

 

Message me not, ye peasants!

[PegNosePete]

PS - Can you share the secrets of your experiences, please? What worked/didn't work for you etc?

Sure, happy to share.

 

Have good quality, well lit, preferably outdoors photos. A head shot for the main pic, and at least one full body shot, an activity shot, etc. A good range. Selfies are OK if you practice a lot and avoid public bathrooms, mirrors or anywhere that shows you holding up the phone or staring at the screen like a lemon. No hats or shades. SMILE with teeth showing and make eye contact. Your avatar pic is an example of one that is not terrible, but not great either - your face is too small and at a funny angle, you seem to be grimacing rather than smiling and the background is plain and boring. You don't have to be great looking (from your avatar you're far from ugly, you're in shape and I'd say normal looking like 99% of guys including me). Good pics of an average looking person will get far better success than bad pics of a good looker.

 

Make your profile interesting and exciting. That is not to say you have to have done world-shattering things with your life, you just have to advertise it well. Always be positive. Concentrate on your best points. Try to be original, avoid cliche phrases such as "laid back", "easy going", "partner in crime", "quiet at first but open up later" etc. Make sure your spelling and grammar is all correct and it's well formatted, easy to read, not a "wall of text". Try to show things rather than saying them, for example "I'm funny" is bad, telling about a funny thing that happened to you is good. Using imagery is very good, for example rather than saying "I like early morning walks" you could say "I love nothing better than seeing the sun's golden rays as they first appear over the horizon, and begin to melt the frost on a crisp Winter's morning". See the difference?? One evokes emotion, the other is just a boring cliche. Women are emotional creatures, they will respond better if you can get their juices flowing rather than bullet point factual reasons that they should date you.

 

Message content is not too important. There have been studies that show most women, when receiving a message, will view your profile before even opening the message. Who is sending it, is more important than what they say. That's not to say message content is not important because it is! But it's not as important as good photos and profile. I found the best initial message was 3-4 sentences long, references something in their profile (to prove you've read it), and asks a simple question that doesn't have a yes/no answer. For example a good message might be: "I see you like skiing. I was in Italy last year, I rode my first black run. Have you managed to do any this year?". It's not too long, it shows you've read the profile, it shows a shared interest and conversation topic, it reminds her of her holidays which is a good time (hopefully!), and it's easy and fun to reply to. If your first name is not mentioned on your profile or is not obvious form your username then sign off using it, otherwise no need to add clutter.

Edited January 9, 2015 by PegNosePete

[lino]

Another reason why OLD sucks for men: OLD never sleeps.

 

Case in point, really hit it off with a girl just before christmas, lot of shared interests, went on a date and got on really well, she was very complimentary of me (ive now learned that this is actually a red flag) and how interesting I was yadda yadda. So the 2nd date she invites herself round my house(!) to watch a film, one thing leads to another etc. We spend the next day together getting on well then we both go home for christmas and make plans to meet when we get back. We are texting all over christmas and NYE and arrange to go to the cinema to see a film just after NYE. When we meet to go to the cinema she greets me with a token hug like we are friends. We watch the film and then we walk back to our homes together as we live near each other. When we say goodbye again a token hug and a non-committal agreement to meet up the next weekend. I left it at that point as I have enough friends already thanks, she hasnt been in touch in the meantime so thats thatbut of course she is all over OLD still and must have had someone else swoop in despite all her compliments and us getting on well.

 

I have found that girls IRL who arent OLDing arebt putting themselves out there so hard so you have a chance to get to know them better without having to perform like a ****ing seal to keep their attention before they move on at the drop ofa hat.

 

I've never used online dating but this concept exists in the real world aplenty.

 

Any woman who isn't hideous will have at the minimum, a guy asking her out once every 2 months and that is the minimim

[Moy]

Sure, happy to share.

 

Have good quality, well lit, preferably outdoors photos. A head shot for the main pic, and at least one full body shot, an activity shot, etc. A good range. Selfies are OK if you practice a lot and avoid public bathrooms, mirrors or anywhere that shows you holding up the phone or staring at the screen like a lemon. No hats or shades. SMILE with teeth showing and make eye contact. Your avatar pic is an example of one that is not terrible, but not great either - your face is too small and at a funny angle, you seem to be grimacing rather than smiling and the background is plain and boring. You don't have to be great looking (from your avatar you're far from ugly, you're in shape and I'd say normal looking like 99% of guys including me). Good pics of an average looking person will get far better success than bad pics of a good looker.

 

Make your profile interesting and exciting. That is not to say you have to have done world-shattering things with your life, you just have to advertise it well. Always be positive. Concentrate on your best points. Try to be original, avoid cliche phrases such as "laid back", "easy going", "partner in crime", "quiet at first but open up later" etc. Make sure your spelling and grammar is all correct and it's well formatted, easy to read, not a "wall of text". Try to show things rather than saying them, for example "I'm funny" is bad, telling about a funny thing that happened to you is good. Using imagery is very good, for example rather than saying "I like early morning walks" you could say "I love nothing better than seeing the sun's golden rays as they first appear over the horizon, and begin to melt the frost on a crisp Winter's morning". See the difference?? One evokes emotion, the other is just a boring cliche. Women are emotional creatures, they will respond better if you can get their juices flowing rather than bullet point factual reasons that they should date you.

 

Message content is not too important. There have been studies that show most women, when receiving a message, will view your profile before even opening the message. Who is sending it, is more important than what they say. That's not to say message content is not important because it is! But it's not as important as good photos and profile. I found the best initial message was 3-4 sentences long, references something in their profile (to prove you've read it), and asks a simple question that doesn't have a yes/no answer. For example a good message might be: "I see you like skiing. I was in Italy last year, I rode my first black run. Have you managed to do any this year?". It's not too long, it shows you've read the profile, it shows a shared interest and conversation topic, it reminds her of her holidays which is a good time (hopefully!), and it's easy and fun to reply to. If your first name is not mentioned on your profile or is not obvious form your username then sign off using it, otherwise no need to add clutter.

 

Thanks for the tips. Just a shame that my self-esteem has taken such a battering I'm currently sworn off even looking at women until I can find a way to get it back.

[mr_dave]

I used POF for a few months last year (February - May I think), and managed to get dates with four girls. Not a great return out of the hundreds of messages I sent, but at least there were girls I thought I might like to date..

 

Yesterday curiosity got the better of me and I did a bit of window shopping.

and searched for women 20-28, in a 75 mile radius. My word, the pickings were slim!

Now my standards aren't high by any means, I was looking for a moderately pretty, sporty girl, without children or tattoos, who could write properly and preferred doing active things at weekends, rather than going out and getting drunk. Not too much to ask.

 

So what did I find...

 

- Endless amounts of profiles belonging to overly made-up women with 'Just ask' written in their descriptions. Many that had written descriptions couldn't spell the most simple of words.

 

- Vast swathes of women who listed cocktails/ drinking/ socialising as their only interests. Really?

 

- Venting about being pumped and dumped in their profiles, phrasing it as 'being messed around'. Yet in the same profile they'll say how they like the archetypal 'bad boy' with tattoos, beards etc.

 

- An abundance of single mothers. Not a problem, but not what I'm looking for.

 

-The remainder were girls out of my league, were very attractive, but equally demanding. I wouldn't have had a hope in hell of attracting them.

 

So yeah, not a lot for me to aim at. Of over 1200 profiles I viewed, there were literally two that caught my eye as being attainable and having the qualities I was looking for. I haven't bothered to set up a profile.

[insert_name]

$

Sure, happy to share.

 

Have good quality, well lit, preferably outdoors photos. A head shot for the main pic, and at least one full body shot, an activity shot, etc. A good range. Selfies are OK if you practice a lot and avoid public bathrooms, mirrors or anywhere that shows you holding up the phone or staring at the screen like a lemon. No hats or shades. SMILE with teeth showing and make eye contact. Your avatar pic is an example of one that is not terrible, but not great either - your face is too small and at a funny angle, you seem to be grimacing rather than smiling and the background is plain and boring. You don't have to be great looking (from your avatar you're far from ugly, you're in shape and I'd say normal looking like 99% of guys including me). Good pics of an average looking person will get far better success than bad pics of a good looker.

 

Make your profile interesting and exciting. That is not to say you have to have done world-shattering things with your life, you just have to advertise it well. Always be positive. Concentrate on your best points. Try to be original, avoid cliche phrases such as "laid back", "easy going", "partner in crime", "quiet at first but open up later" etc. Make sure your spelling and grammar is all correct and it's well formatted, easy to read, not a "wall of text". Try to show things rather than saying them, for example "I'm funny" is bad, telling about a funny thing that happened to you is good. Using imagery is very good, for example rather than saying "I like early morning walks" you could say "I love nothing better than seeing the sun's golden rays as they first appear over the horizon, and begin to melt the frost on a crisp Winter's morning". See the difference?? One evokes emotion, the other is just a boring cliche. Women are emotional creatures, they will respond better if you can get their juices flowing rather than bullet point factual reasons that they should date you.

 

Message content is not too important. There have been studies that show most women, when receiving a message, will view your profile before even opening the message. Who is sending it, is more important than what they say. That's not to say message content is not important because it is! But it's not as important as good photos and profile. I found the best initial message was 3-4 sentences long, references something in their profile (to prove you've read it), and asks a simple question that doesn't have a yes/no answer. For example a good message might be: "I see you like skiing. I was in Italy last year, I rode my first black run. Have you managed to do any this year?". It's not too long, it shows you've read the profile, it shows a shared interest and conversation topic, it reminds her of her holidays which is a good time (hopefully!), and it's easy and fun to reply to. If your first name is not mentioned on your profile or is not obvious form your username then sign off using it, otherwise no need to add clutter.

 

Thats great stuff and thabks for taking the time to help, but the one thing that strikes me as I read through this exhaustive list of things that men should do to be successful:

 

All of those things do not apply to womens profiles and yet they all have 'replies very selectively' on their profile.

 

So once again, the man must do all this to make themselves worthy of a reply from an OLD woman. The woman...well all she has to do is be able to breathe and (preferably) not be fat.

 

Case in point right here for exactly why OLD is harder for men.

[Moy]

$

 

Thats great stuff and thabks for taking the time to help, but the one thing that strikes me as I read through this exhaustive list of things that men should do to be successful:

 

All of those things do not apply to womens profiles and yet they all have 'replies very selectively' on their profile.

 

So once again, the man must do all this to make themselves worthy of a reply from an OLD woman. The woman...well all she has to do is be able to breathe and (preferably) not be fat.

 

Case in point right here for exactly why OLD is harder for men.

 

Indeed, but if thirsty men, blinded by lust and desperation stopped indiscriminately spamming average women's profiles with messages white-knighting them and falsely inflating their egos, all in the deluded hope that they might get a bit of Oo-La-La then it would be much easier for men. Women on OLD would then have to put the same amount of effort in, as they wouldn't be receiving anything like the level of interest that they are getting now - '2s who think they're 10s syndrome.'

[BlueIris]

Indeed, but if thirsty men, blinded by lust and desperation stopped indiscriminately spamming average women's profiles with messages white-knighting them and falsely inflating their egos, all in the deluded hope that they might get a bit of Oo-La-La then it would be much easier for men.

 

Take out "average" and change the last part to "then it would be easier for everyone" and you have something meme-worthy there. Seriously. Brilliant. At least put it in your profile cuz it's goooood!

[Moy]

Take out "average" and change the last part to "then it would be easier for everyone" and you have something meme-worthy there. Seriously. Brilliant. At least put it in your profile cuz it's goooood!

 

When I say 'average' - and I should have chosen my words more carefully - I was referring to guys messaging women who they aren't even attracted to, as they have the belief of "She's not even that hot, she's BOUND to fall for my charms!'

 

But then the recipients of said deluge of messages begin to 'believe the hype' and soon become princesses, thus creating a false economy that men have been priced out of. But it's men who have flooded that market/economy with counterfeit money (insincere messages.)

[BlueIris]

When I say 'average' - and I should have chosen my words more carefully - I was referring to guys messaging women who they aren't even attracted to, as they have the belief of "She's not even that hot, she's BOUND to fall for my charms!'

 

But then the recipients of said deluge of messages begin to 'believe the hype' and soon become princesses, thus creating a false economy that men have been priced out of. But it's men who have flooded that market/economy with counterfeit money (insincere messages.)

 

As to the second paragraph, consider this. It is possible that there are other reactions.

 

It IS spam. How are spam recipients bad or at fault for getting spam, and ignoring it, getting annoyed by it, missing important things because they're buried in spam and so on?

 

Don't men also do all of that re spam and not consider themselves arrogant or princess-y for not caring about spam? I think most of us don't feel flattered or arrogant when we get spam, or if we get more spam than a friend does.

 

What's more, people who really want or need to reach me don't get upset if their emails get sent to my spam folder or I miss an email. They know about spam and understand.

 

There might be some princess-y types, but there are also LOTS of women who just get spammed and react with no ill will or nasty attitude, just as anyone else reacts to spam. Heck, even if you don't get LOTS of spam, if a high enough % of your email is spam, you kind of lose interest.

 

I agree about not spamming on OLD. It’s annoying and pointless for everyone, and actually undermines the sincere.

Edited January 9, 2015 by BlueIris
way too long

[LookAtThisPOst]

Right, it is a numbers game as there was a time where I had succinctly had chosen women that would be great matches. Esp. with the common and even some with some of the more obscure interests and beliefs. I had become quite beffudled when even the most compatible of women would not respond.

 

That beings aid, I turned it into a numbers game.

 

 

I don't think there is any way to fix OLD. The advice to men is to play the numbers game, message a bunch of women, forget all about the people who ignore our message, and work with the ones who actually respond. Ok. Let's think about what that entails. We are expected to carefully read a profile, craft a funny, witty message that entertains the recipient and shows we read the profile. Rinse and repeat perhaps hundreds of times until it gets somewhere. Right... not a chance. Most guys who have played OLD for a while learn that pics trump all so there is no need for all that. Just say hi, and if she likes you, she will respond. My problem is that the only women responding online were ones I wouldn't ever dream of dating. The kind of women I generally date in the real world never responded to my messages online. That left me with few options. Either get used to meeting those women I didn't find interesting (who at least gave up sex quickly) message the type of women I normally date and get zero responses, or quit OLD altogether.

[HazyCosmicJive]

I don't think there is any way to fix OLD. The advice to men is to play the numbers game, message a bunch of women, forget all about the people who ignore our message, and work with the ones who actually respond. Ok. Let's think about what that entails. We are expected to carefully read a profile, craft a funny, witty message that entertains the recipient and shows we read the profile. Rinse and repeat perhaps hundreds of times until it gets somewhere. Right... not a chance. Most guys who have played OLD for a while learn that pics trump all so there is no need for all that. Just say hi, and if she likes you, she will respond. My problem is that the only women responding online were ones I wouldn't ever dream of dating. The kind of women I generally date in the real world never responded to my messages online. That left me with few options. Either get used to meeting those women I didn't find interesting (who at least gave up sex quickly) message the type of women I normally date and get zero responses, or quit OLD altogether.

 

 

This is exactly why I don't bother. The effort-to-reward seems like it would be very high.

[insert_name]

I don't think there is any way to fix OLD. The advice to men is to play the numbers game, message a bunch of women, forget all about the people who ignore our message, and work with the ones who actually respond. Ok. Let's think about what that entails. We are expected to carefully read a profile, craft a funny, witty message that entertains the recipient and shows we read the profile. Rinse and repeat perhaps hundreds of times until it gets somewhere. Right... not a chance. Most guys who have played OLD for a while learn that pics trump all so there is no need for all that. Just say hi, and if she likes you, she will respond. My problem is that the only women responding online were ones I wouldn't ever dream of dating. The kind of women I generally date in the real world never responded to my messages online. That left me with few options. Either get used to meeting those women I didn't find interesting (who at least gave up sex quickly) message the type of women I normally date and get zero responses, or quit OLD altogether.

 

Exactly. The cost/benefit of OLD to men even on a free site is ridiculously poor. Even a free site you can end up losing on as you may not lose money but you will lose time and self esteem. Putting yourself on the line and all for what? A load of bang average women in both appearance and personality who dont even try and sell themselves because they dont have to.

 

I really feel disappointed in OLD. in the last 6 months I've put as much effort in as my situation allows- my friends are fed up with my constant haranguing to get photos out and about to try and convey an interesting life, I've re-written my profile numerous times trying various different approaches, soent ages thinking of witty opening messages related to profiles and all for what? 30 messages sent on OKC and 4 first dates (2 ending in rather desperate hookups) and 12 messages sent on match all with no response whatsoever. Total waste of time, including the dates. The joke of it all is that I get told that by getting 4 dates I have actually done well! That just about sums the whole sorry mess up if 4 dates for 40 odd messages is a good return!!

 

Learn from my mistakes men and steer clear. My biggest regret is actually that I wont get the time investment back.

[DukeNukem47]

I feel like one of these threads pops up once a week (possibly even once a day).

 

Basically, if you are male and not in the Top 10% looks-wise, do not bother using OLD. Just meet women in the real world.

 

Got it?

[ascendotum]

Total waste of time, including the dates. The joke of it all is that I get told that by getting 4 dates I have actually done well! That just about sums the whole sorry mess up if 4 dates for 40 odd messages is a good return!!

 

Learn from my mistakes men and steer clear. My biggest regret is actually that I wont get the time investment back.

 

4 dates with 2 ending up physical over 4 months I consider not too bad. I get why others are saying you did well. lol

I agree with enigma that there is no way to fix it really with the free sites. EH I consider a good attempt to approach OLD differently, where it is not primarily based on how good looking someone is or how young or how much $ they make. It matches people on computability and does not give them free reign to contact whoever they want. Of course I can understand why taking that freedom of choice away from people pisses them off, but at the same time the process is much less shallow in theory.

 

One of my friend's female friend was talking about some new guy she had met online and he was in his 30s and an okay guy, and she had a 'we'll see how it goes' approach to whether this guy was going to work out. The way she talked it was like the guy was so so, and she wasn't overly enthused... another guy that disappoints. At some point later she was showing my friend some pics on her phone and the one with the guy she was dating came up and I stuck my head over her shoulder to have a squiz. The guy looked to be in his 20s (easy 10yrs younger then her), and was a full on body builder. Hilarious. I wonder if she'll be one of the women complaining about being 'tired of getting messed around'

[FitChick]

Thats great stuff and thabks for taking the time to help, but the one thing that strikes me as I read through this exhaustive list of things that men should do to be successful:

 

All of those things do not apply to womens profiles and yet they all have 'replies very selectively' on their profile.

You're wrong. What PegNosePete told you is what I do and say in my own profile and what I advise others. If you are too lazy to make an effort, you reap what you sow.

 

Moy, you need to get someone to take a pic of you outside, even if it's just sitting on a park bench or standing near a fountain. Your avatar pic just looks odd. You are attractive but need a better pose, background and lighting. As for the obese women insulting you it was probably due to them knowing you'd never be interested in them so they wanted to take you down a peg. Sick people with low self esteem. Don't let strangers define you. Stay off of POF. Bottom feeders.

 

Many years ago I was on OK Cupid and it said I replied often but that was because I rejected a lot of people and always declined politely.

Edited January 10, 2015 by FitChick

[Moy]

I don't think there is any way to fix OLD. The advice to men is to play the numbers game, message a bunch of women, forget all about the people who ignore our message, and work with the ones who actually respond. Ok. Let's think about what that entails. We are expected to carefully read a profile, craft a funny, witty message that entertains the recipient and shows we read the profile. Rinse and repeat perhaps hundreds of times until it gets somewhere. Right... not a chance. Most guys who have played OLD for a while learn that pics trump all so there is no need for all that. Just say hi, and if she likes you, she will respond. My problem is that the only women responding online were ones I wouldn't ever dream of dating. The kind of women I generally date in the real world never responded to my messages online. That left me with few options. Either get used to meeting those women I didn't find interesting (who at least gave up sex quickly) message the type of women I normally date and get zero responses, or quit OLD altogether.

 

But if you wouldn't dream of dating them, why message them in the first place?

[Moy]

You're wrong. What PegNosePete told you is what I do and say in my own profile and what I advise others. If you are too lazy to make an effort, you reap what you sow.

 

Moy, you need to get someone to take a pic of you outside, even if it's just sitting on a park bench or standing near a fountain. Your avatar pic just looks odd. You are attractive but need a better pose, background and lighting. As for the obese women insulting you it was probably due to them knowing you'd never be interested in them so they wanted to take you down a peg. Sick people with low self esteem. Don't let strangers define you. Stay off of POF. Bottom feeders.

 

Many years ago I was on OK Cupid and it said I replied often but that was because I rejected a lot of people and always declined politely.

 

The pose in my avatar pic, chin up, was the day that I shaved my beard off just before Christmas. Not a natural pose, I know but I hope that explains it somewhat.

 

And thank you for the feedback/advice. Much appreciated.

[FitChick]

Moy, why not practice talking to women in real life? Simple things like a quick compliment "I like your hat!" You might get a smile and a thank you. Happened to me today wearing the same hat as the one in the photo. Two different men. One was about 70 and the other wasn't attractive but I smiled, said 'thanks' and kept on walking. They smiled at my acknowledgment. Don't expect a long conversation unless she initiates one. As you get more positive replies your confidence will build. You can start with little old ladies if you are afraid to talk to women your own age. Elderly women are invisible and lonely so I often compliment them on a scarf, hat or brooch.

[Moy]

Moy, why not practice talking to women in real life? Simple things like a quick compliment "I like your hat!" You might get a smile and a thank you. Happened to me today wearing the same hat as the one in the photo. Two different men. One was about 70 and the other wasn't attractive but I smiled, said 'thanks' and kept on walking. They smiled at my acknowledgment. Don't expect a long conversation unless she initiates one. As you get more positive replies your confidence will build. You can start with little old ladies if you are afraid to talk to women your own age. Elderly women are invisible and lonely so I often compliment them on a scarf, hat or brooch.

 

I wouldn't dare talk to women in real life. I've had my confidence crushed to the point where I rarely leave the house and when I do, I wear a cap pulled down and look at the floor.

 

In addition to the negative feedback on POF, I also fell for someone in autumn/fall of 2013. She was so appalled at the thought of somebody like me finding her attractive that she still refuses to speak to me now. I didn't even ask her out!

 

As for speaking in public to strangers, have you not seen the Shoshana Roberts 10 hours in NYC video? Saying hi to a woman is now considered sexual assault. Wayyyyy too risky.

[Moy]

After about 6 months of trying to get somewhere online, I was pretty depressed. I seriously started to think that for some reason, women just didn't want me any longer.

 

This. So much of this.

[FitChick]

Are you a spiritual person? Become a monk.

[ascendotum]

I wouldn't dare talk to women in real life. I've had my confidence crushed to the point where I rarely leave the house and when I do, I wear a cap pulled down and look at the floor.

 

In addition to the negative feedback on POF, I also fell for someone in autumn/fall of 2013. She was so appalled at the thought of somebody like me finding her attractive that she still refuses to speak to me now. I didn't even ask her out!

 

As for speaking in public to strangers, have you not seen the Shoshana Roberts 10 hours in NYC video? Saying hi to a woman is now considered sexual assault. Wayyyyy too risky.

 

Okay don't try to give flirty comments to pretty women striding past like in the Shoshana clip (which was biased for a notorious part of town), but do so with women that you meet that might be shop assistants or on the train/bus trip next to you or standing in line for movie/bank/shopping, or an older/heavier women in the free weights section of your gym, etc. Like FC said start with regular middle aged women or that would get a big kick out of getting compliment and you wont give you attitude a younger sexier woman could well give you. Just build up over time..

 

There are probably some confidence/self esteem hypnosis scripts/audio clips online on various sites that you could download for free and listen to each night going to sleep and see if they help a little at all.