Camaro Guy Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 (edited) My friend was reading this and he introduced it to me this past weekend. It's a book by Robert Greene, the man who created the 48 Laws of Power, 33 Strategies of War, and Mastery. I haven't read the other two but they're on my to-do list. 48 Laws of Power was great. Now he writes a book on seduction. I'm only a couple of chapters into the book but man. What an eye opener! This book puts every single "game" or pickup or seduction book to shame. This book uses historical examples fictional or nonfictional to get it's point across. I'm talking John F. Kennedy, Marilyn Monroe, Soren Kierkegaard, Marilyn Monroe, Errol Flynn, Richelieu, Lord Byron, Cleopatra, Lenin, Mao Zedong, and even more. I mean the list is endless. Then he breaks down seduction into several pieces, the first component that is there are like 18 seduction types that everyone falls into. Rake, Siren, Charismatic, Charmer, Natural, etc. These aren't hard and fast and many people can often fluctuate between two. However, your personality usually puts you as one. When I think back on all the interactions with my friends and girls, I have identified a lot of my friends as one or another type. Girls I have interacted with, I can see how they're a certain type too. He says certain types interact and have a better chance of success with other types. This book is largely amoral which means you can assign whatever moral standing to it you like but I view it as something that gives me choice. I've been taking heavy notes on this and I've learned a lot. I now realize why being a virgin is undesirable: because you're not desired. People say they don't like people who sleep around but that's only if they brag about it. Desirability is often a multiplier effect and it works in triangles. The more people who desire you, the more people desire you. No one wants to talk to that guy at the party who no one is talking to. No one wants to eat in an empty restaurant. If you seem oblivious to the attention, it makes you even more desirable. I firmly believe that this book will set me up on a path to success with women. With life! Life is seduction! I can't wait to go deeper. Has anyone read this? Edited February 18, 2015 by Camaro Guy Link to post Share on other sites
todreaminblue Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 nope havent read it....i think being true to you and others...might be a book title that should hold more interest if it is a serious relationship you are after.....deb 3 Link to post Share on other sites
AVarma Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 nope havent read it....i think being true to you and others...might be a book title that should hold more interest if it is a serious relationship you are after.....deb Seriously what's the point of reading these books and changing who you are? It seems to be really soul crushing! 3 Link to post Share on other sites
Satu Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Be the same person on the inside and outside. Simplicity is good. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
ascendotum Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Seriously what's the point of reading these books and changing who you are? It seems to be really soul crushing! It would already be soul crushing being the 'empty restaurant' guy. If that person doesn't change (now under new management) then he wont get want he wants, and will just end up with a desperate customer down the line. So far it seems the book is doing a good job of giving him inspiration and some hope based on changes he can make. Its a positive thread. Saying 'just be yourself and the right person will eventually love you' is not going to work for some. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
ThaWholigan Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 I have the book, very interesting read! Have you identified what type you are yet? If you have, how do you plan on magnifying your strengths? Link to post Share on other sites
No Limit Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Why did you write Marylin Monroe twice? Well, I guess the virgin part counts mainly for men. There seem to be plenty of guys who love the idea of being #1. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Lernaean_Hydra Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Seriously what's the point of reading these books and changing who you are? It seems to be really soul crushing! Why does anyone change? To better themselves and be more successful at their endeavors. I don't see how it's soul crushing unless you (general you) are the type of person who believes everyone is fine just the way they are in every aspect. Change is good. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
d0nnivain Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 I'm glad you are finding enlightening reads on your path to self fulfillment. Understand that with any pop psychology book, it's not a step by step instruction manual to be taken literally. It's a guide based on a principle, usually have some self confidence. If you find some nuggets of truth, great. But take it as gospel at your own peril 2 Link to post Share on other sites
ThaWholigan Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Why does anyone change? To better themselves and be more successful at their endeavors. I don't see how it's soul crushing unless you (general you) are the type of person who believes everyone is fine just the way they are in every aspect. Change is good. I think rather than just change, it should be viewed as growth rather than deviation 3 Link to post Share on other sites
Author Camaro Guy Posted February 19, 2015 Author Share Posted February 19, 2015 I have the book, very interesting read! Have you identified what type you are yet? If you have, how do you plan on magnifying your strengths? I do not know why there is so much opposition to this book. Seduction is present in every aspect of our everyday lives. A child seduces his mother when he wants candy from the store. You seduce your boss to get a pay raise. Seduction was invented by women to use on men since men had the physical upper hand. Now, we can't rely on brute strength and power anymore, instead we must insinuate what we want. That is where seduction comes into play. It's mainly thought of as being in the romantic arena but it applies to everything. Wholigan, it is a great book. I see myself in a variety of types and I have identified most of my friends as either Rakes or Charismatics. I myself see myself as a cross between Charmer, Charismatic, and the Natural. Now That I know what types to seek out and avoid, I can make better judgments. This will always be in the back of my mind when meeting people. That way, I can have better effects on some people than others. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
mario_C Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 Seriously what's the point of reading these books and changing who you are? It seems to be really soul crushing! Most of these books exist because many people have no idea who they really are. I agree, it's a little sad. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
BearMox Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 I'm familiar with Green's work. Knowledge like this makes you feel important and belief in it will change your perspective on life, thus your experience. I have a question: do you think this knowledge could endure 15 or more years of raising children, building a home, reputation, legacy, mastery, family, friends and empower you to serve people better? If so, I'll put it on my list. Link to post Share on other sites
loverboy69 Posted February 19, 2015 Share Posted February 19, 2015 Why did you write Marylin Monroe twice? Well, I guess the virgin part counts mainly for men. There seem to be plenty of guys who love the idea of being #1. Now that I'm in my 30's I hate being the first. I'd rather be the last. Link to post Share on other sites
ascendotum Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 Wholigan, it is a great book. I see myself in a variety of types and I have identified most of my friends as either Rakes or Charismatics. I myself see myself as a cross between Charmer, Charismatic, and the Natural. Now That I know what types to seek out and avoid, I can make better judgments. This will always be in the back of my mind when meeting people. That way, I can have better effects on some people than others. RE: the bold comment...do you mean as your C/C/N type and when it comes to women you need to need to identify and seek out a certain type, and also write off certain types of women that would not respond positively? When it comes to people in general though you cant avoid always avoid them...ie your boss. Are you supposed to seek out the equivalent? Is this book just meant for men? I ask because I wonder if a woman can be classed as a Rake. Link to post Share on other sites
ThaWholigan Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 I do not know why there is so much opposition to this book. Seduction is present in every aspect of our everyday lives. A child seduces his mother when he wants candy from the store. You seduce your boss to get a pay raise. Seduction was invented by women to use on men since men had the physical upper hand. Now, we can't rely on brute strength and power anymore, instead we must insinuate what we want. That is where seduction comes into play. It's mainly thought of as being in the romantic arena but it applies to everything. Seduction is manipulation basically. And everybody manipulates - it's a fundamental part of human interaction and a largely amoral concept within the framework of social intelligence. Basically can be used for good - or bad, as it is commonly associated. I often quip to my brother that his brash honesty is a manipulation tactic. He had to agree, because deep down it's the truth . How else do you maneuver a scenario into your favor, or someone else's favor, or everybody's favor? Wholigan, it is a great book. I see myself in a variety of types and I have identified most of my friends as either Rakes or Charismatics. I myself see myself as a cross between Charmer, Charismatic, and the Natural. Now That I know what types to seek out and avoid, I can make better judgments. This will always be in the back of my mind when meeting people. That way, I can have better effects on some people than others. This is a good way to look at it, and always remember that this is no silver bullet. The human element is a fickle one, so you can't seduce everybody. But knowing your strengths in this area and how to magnify them - and also developing your style of communication - both verbal and non-verbal - is vital. You'll have a better idea of the kind of people who you will attract and who will be of benefit and who benefits from your presence aswell. I recognize elements of myself in the Charismatic and the Star. I'm too atypical to be a Rake . I have the height, but not the movie star looks or the persona. Link to post Share on other sites
Popsicle Posted February 20, 2015 Share Posted February 20, 2015 I have not read it but I'll tell you what, we definitly need more seduction AND romance in the world now. it has become bereft. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Ethan78 Posted February 21, 2015 Share Posted February 21, 2015 Is this book just meant for men? I ask because I wonder if a woman can be classed as a Rake. No, for women as well. At least the first part of the book as I recall. I would be interested in people's comments on one thing. Women don't seem to mind if a man has acquired the social skills naturally that make him a seducer, but if a man who doesn't have those skills tried to learn them then women seem to object to that. Why? Or more precisely what is wrong with learning to flirt, act confident, use other people's emotions to seduce them at an older age? Link to post Share on other sites
Author Camaro Guy Posted February 21, 2015 Author Share Posted February 21, 2015 No, for women as well. At least the first part of the book as I recall. I would be interested in people's comments on one thing. Women don't seem to mind if a man has acquired the social skills naturally that make him a seducer, but if a man who doesn't have those skills tried to learn them then women seem to object to that. Why? Or more precisely what is wrong with learning to flirt, act confident, use other people's emotions to seduce them at an older age? It's funny that you mention this because in the book, it mentions that seduction is supposed to seem natural, not contrived. You ever hear from a woman "it just happened that way" or "we just fell in love"? That's what they're talking about. They want romance to a seemingly natural progression of emotions, otherwise it shatters the whole illusion. This runs contrary to seduction which is usually a very planned process akin to chess or cat and mouse. Women like the ones described are not called "Rakes". That's the male term. They're called "Sirens". I've met many women like this before. Very alluring, very sexually attractive, very unnerving. They know the effect they have on men and they use it to devastating effect. These types of women are the women that the most frightening to me because I don't want to be taken advantage of by them in social contexts. My fears of being in a bad spot weren't unfounded and they were further confirmed through this book. I had one girl who was like this wring me out like a wet towel to get what she needed. I should have seen it coming but I was way too blind. She was definitely one these women. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Ethan78 Posted February 21, 2015 Share Posted February 21, 2015 It's funny that you mention this because in the book, it mentions that seduction is supposed to seem natural, not contrived. You ever hear from a woman "it just happened that way" or "we just fell in love"? That's what they're talking about. They want romance to a seemingly natural progression of emotions, otherwise it shatters the whole illusion. This runs contrary to seduction which is usually a very planned process akin to chess or cat and mouse. I've heard stories of guys who are naturally socially confidence being shown books on seduction, and recognising that the behaviours described in the books are things they are already doing. It seems whether it is "planned" or not, adjusting yourself to another person's desires is a reasonable social game. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Endles Posted February 21, 2015 Share Posted February 21, 2015 It's funny that you mention this because in the book, it mentions that seduction is supposed to seem natural, not contrived. You ever hear from a woman "it just happened that way" or "we just fell in love"? . "Spark", "click", "attraction".....can't be forced. Bull...****. You do need to learn the difference between being "it" and looking like you're trying to be "it". Link to post Share on other sites
Author Camaro Guy Posted February 22, 2015 Author Share Posted February 22, 2015 "Spark", "click", "attraction".....can't be forced. Bull...****. You do need to learn the difference between being "it" and looking like you're trying to be "it". That's what this book teaches. You don't want to come off as too contrived. Link to post Share on other sites
CrystalShine2011 Posted February 22, 2015 Share Posted February 22, 2015 Hmm, tell us how it is! Link to post Share on other sites
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