Cheaters with personality disorders

[Mrs. John Adams]

How about this scenario...what if you asked your husband for a divorce...and he said no...we can't afford to divorce and you said..ok I am going to have an affair.

 

Now..you pursue an affair.

 

But you keep it a secret. Later...your husband finds out and he is devasted.

 

Is that cheating?

 

( this is an entirely created scenario....it did not happen to us)

[Timshel]

How about this scenario...what if you asked your husband for a divorce...and he said no...we can't afford to divorce and you said..ok I am going to have an affair.

 

Now..you pursue an affair.

 

But you keep it a secret. Later...your husband finds out and he is devasted.

 

Is that cheating?

 

( this is an entirely created scenario....it did not happen to us)

 

I am going to assume the scenario of "we can't afford it" can be interchanged with "no, I don't want one", kids or any reason that essentially pulls it off the table. Uncontested divorce can be achieved mutually/amicably so that money is not a true issue.

 

So with the assumption that divorce is not an option for whatever reason. Why would the affair be a secret? WS has informed BS that they do not want to be married, they want out. If that kind of candor is present, why would it stop? Wouldn't it follow that same spouse would say, look, I met someone and I plan on pursuing an R with them? We either become singularly focused on resolving our issues or I really must insist on the D. If the marriage is perceived to be beyond repair, then saying no to D really is not an option.

 

If WS has the cognition to want out before an A and communicates this, the honesty would start the minute they asked for a divorce. That's the worst of it. Why would the honesty stop?

[Mrs. John Adams]

very good and interesting points....since the subject has switched to divorce...I just wondered if telling your partner divorce was desired...if it would change the mindset.

 

Some seem to think that cheaters should be honest and ask for divorce instead of cheating...and now some are saying even betrayed spouses should be honest and divorce...

[SolG]

I'd like to offer a slightly different perspective. I offer the following quote from Howard and Korver's excellent book on ethics:

 

'The story of the errant physicians illustrates how even the most accomplished people can get caught in ethical compromise. Often, they are just not paying attention. It also points to a chilling fact: the same can happen to all of us--if we're not ethically alert and astute.

 

Ethical compromises both big and small hurt us, and we underestimate how much. For one thing, one compromise can lead to another as we let our standards slip. One can get started going downhill on the proverbial slippery slope, where each compromise becomes easier and we fall asleep to their consequences. As we develop bad habits, no matter our accomplishments and virtues, we may find ourselves in shocking situations.

 

What causes most people the greatest pain is that the compromises create barriers in relationships. As we engage in ethically questionable acts, we find certain subjects hard to discuss with friends, family or colleagues. We lose spontaneity and authenticity. We have to expend energy to maintain our deceits. This effort creates a kind of mental overhead, an ongoing expense, and sometimes an additional investment in more compromises to cover the first one. People sense our distance as we try to cover our tracks, and in turn distance themselves from us.

 

Our compromises become all the more of a burden as they erode our sense of integrity. Even if we feel extenuating circumstances justify our acts, we are often embarrassed by them. To protect our pride, we usually do try to keep them private--and out of papers and the gossip mill. We may dwell on the errors, or block them out. Either way we may find we remember small compromises for years. It's as if they happened yesterday. They weigh on our character.

 

But we can learn to avoid this lowly road--a road we often choose out of ignorance, carelessness, or just plain convenience. We can choose to spot temptations early on and use our newfound awareness as a foundation for skillful ethical decision making. Our journey starts by sensitizing ourselves to the range of compromises we already make, to how deeply caught up in them we are, and to their long trail of consequences for both our character and our relationships.'

 

While I'm sure many of you are familiar with the study of ethics from a professional perspective, it's important to note that it is an area equally applicable to all facets of life and relationships. IMO (particularly as a very newly xOW), I see As not as indicative of PDs, but as ethical failures.

 

xMM and I have discussed this recently at length. Neither of us had ever had an A before, and before it neither of us would have believed it possible. But it is as this excerpt says, one small compromise after another until we were completely enmeshed. We knew it was wrong, but blindly just followed our hormones and hearts with nary a deliberate thought for consequences at all until far too late. And I believe that this is probably not an unusual route for As to take.

 

If we'd been awake to the factors surrounding ourselves in our lives that resulted in the temptation and the facets of temptation itself, as some of you say you are, then we would have chosen a far more healthy way to deal with them as opposed to indulging in an affair.

 

Some of us really are naive and unaware; relationship dumbarses to put it bluntly. Does this excuse the behaviour? Absolutely not. But it does mean we have the potential to be truly remorseful, pay our dues, put it behind us and learn and grow from this perhaps grossest of all relationship ethical failures.

Edited February 22, 2015 by SolG

[Mrs. John Adams]

wow...that was extremely insightful and interesting...thank you for posting that

[Auspecial]

I'm not sure on this one.

 

There are a lot of men who are trained from early that its their right and entitlement to screw around.

 

There are a lot of men and women who just feel entitled in general. Maybe these have a higher statistic of PD.

 

There are people who have s addictions. I'm not sure if this is classified as PD.

 

The biggest female cheater I have ever known is a self-proclaimed BPD,which I agree with after spending objective time with her (at first I thought she was just beating herself up.) At this point I also think she may have NPD traits.

 

I also know many more men who cheat non-stop and these may be partially PD, but also many just feel it is their God-given right to sow the earth.

[Auspecial]

If everyone who used deception for personal gain at some point in their life were adjudicated as disordered, there wouldn't be many humans left untouched in the world.

 

I mention this because of the word 'cheating' and what it means. Deception goes on all the time, as does betrayal of trust, ill-gotten gains by nefarious means, moral and legal depravity, etc, etc. The world is full of people and the vast majority of us are imperfect in the realm of deception of others, yup, including those who trust us.

 

The way I see it is, today, I didn't deceive anyone, presuming I'm not lying. Will I tomorrow? I don't know. The future is unknown.

 

One thing I noted about actually interacting with and caring for someone with demonstrated and diagnosed mental disease and defect is that they were completely unaware of their disease and lived their morbid deceptions as authentic reality. As a layperson, to me, it was that complete unawareness of the change, the scope, and the effects on others that defined the disease process. Are PD'ers similarly afflicted? IDK. That's up to brain specialists to figure out.

 

Nice post, but just to add: there are many with PD out there who do have insight to what has happened to them, and work with it. The exception being NPD. I honestly believe those folks are evil. They do not give one good f, athough they fake their way through.

[truncated]

Nice post, but just to add: there are many with PD out there who do have insight to what has happened to them, and work with it. The exception being NPD. I honestly believe those folks are evil. They do not give one good f, athough they fake their way through.

 

 

i once read a theory that borderline personality disorder is caused by someone with a predisposition to developing this condition being abandoned by a parent as a very young child and being raised by a parent/guardian who doesn't show them love and affection or make them feel worthy.

 

They end up becoming like a bottomless pit in their need for love and acceptance on the one hand, and on the other, they will push someone away who they feel is getting to close. They are feel uber entitled to whatever they want to have, and see the rest of us as only being of worth in so far as we are useful to them by providing an emotional feed. If that dries up, they lash out.

 

If this theory is correct, it's quite sad that someone had such a messed up childhood, but that doesn't make them easy to be around, much less to be in a romantic relationship with.

[autumnnight]

i once read a theory that borderline personality disorder is caused by someone with a predisposition to developing this condition being abandoned by a parent as a very young child and being raised by a parent/guardian who doesn't show them love and affection or make them feel worthy.

 

They end up becoming like a bottomless pit in their need for love and acceptance on the one hand, and on the other, they will push someone away who they feel is getting to close. They are feel uber entitled to whatever they want to have, and see the rest of us as only being of worth in so far as we are useful to them by providing an emotional feed. If that dries up, they lash out.

 

If this theory is correct, it's quite sad that someone had such a messed up childhood, but that doesn't make them easy to be around, much less to be in a romantic relationship with.

 

I think if you dig around in a person's past who had BPD, you do usually end up seeing trauma, abandonment, etc. It is so important that a child be raised by loving and present parents

[JohnsonBaby]

So someone who cheats once in every relationship is a serial cheater or is it someone who have alot of different partners during a relationship ?

[elaine567]

So someone who cheats once in every relationship is a serial cheater or is it someone who have alot of different partners during a relationship ?

 

To me a serial cheater is someone that has had more than one affair.

[autumnnight]

So someone who cheats once in every relationship is a serial cheater or is it someone who have alot of different partners during a relationship ?

 

A person who cheats repeatedly is a serial cheater.

[Auspecial]

i once read a theory that borderline personality disorder is caused by someone with a predisposition to developing this condition being abandoned by a parent as a very young child and being raised by a parent/guardian who doesn't show them love and affection or make them feel worthy.

 

They end up becoming like a bottomless pit in their need for love and acceptance on the one hand, and on the other, they will push someone away who they feel is getting to close. They are feel uber entitled to whatever they want to have, and see the rest of us as only being of worth in so far as we are useful to them by providing an emotional feed. If that dries up, they lash out.

 

If this theory is correct, it's quite sad that someone had such a messed up childhood, but that doesn't make them easy to be around, much less to be in a romantic relationship with.

 

Yes, the few Borderlines I know were quite tumultuos in their relationships and caused havoc i general. The only person I know with BPD who seems stable is a women who when I knew her, was writing a book about her experience with it, and had a ton of insight. She was also on like three different psych meds, and very committed to taking them. I know a male with it who is a living nightmare, and another woman with it who has some insight but still can't control herself from doing some damage.

 

Anyway, I digress. I wanted to point out that there are also other personality disorders, and I understand these to be spectrum disorders so not everyone is same.