Hurting from doing 'the right thing'

[Josmatjes]

I don't really know how to address your questions. We officially said goodbye today. I know where my heart should be, but at this moment it feels like it's breaking...not just for AP, but the pain my husband feels, the loss of innocence. This is the lowest I've ever felt in my life.

 

Been there....

[jbrent890]

I don't really know how to address your questions. We officially said goodbye today. I know where my heart should be, but at this moment it feels like it's breaking...not just for AP, but the pain my husband feels, the loss of innocence. This is the lowest I've ever felt in my life.

 

The thing is I think you do know how to address her questions, you just want to to. I'm sorry but who cares that you ended it today, your husband thought that you ended months ago. You need to be honest with him and tell him that it didn't end. Sassy's post deserves a standing ovation. You are not going to be able to successfully R with your husband starting off with this lie. It's time for you to do the right thing by your husband and be honest with him. Nothing baffles me more than when Waywards think they can fix their marriage by continuing to lie to their spouses to get what they want. Isn't that the same type of selfish behavior that got you into the affair in the first place?

[Blu72]

First of all, no one can tell you how to feel or how you should act. Only you know the true meaning behind your affair and what your marriage can survive. I find it hypocritical for anyone who has gone thru this to tell you otherwise or to suggest you have no remorse. Stay strong in NC. I wish you luck and hope you find peace.

[jbrent890]

First of all, no one can tell you how to feel or how you should act. Only you know the true meaning behind your affair and what your marriage can survive. I find it hypocritical for anyone who has gone thru this to tell you otherwise or to suggest you have no remorse. Stay strong in NC. I wish you luck and hope you find peace.

 

Is Sassy hypocritical? Yes. Is she wrong? No. A truly remorseful spouse doesn't get caught and take the affair deeper underground. I know what's going to happen. I will be very surprised if she tells her husband she continued the affair. She is going to start her R with a lie. I sense it, Sassy senses it, and I'm pretty sure a lot of other people reading this thread will sense it to. And the rationalizations she will come up with to not tell. OP, I would love nothing more than for you to prove me wrong.

[Rainbowlove]

It's completely normal for her head to be all F'd up about ending her affair and feeling sadness for having to say goodbye to her XAP.

 

That relationship just ended. Everyone knows she has to mourn that ending.

 

That's the really difficult part about ending an affair and going back into your marriage. She now has to feel crappy about losing XAP and try to reconnect with H. That's going to take time.

 

Jesus, I knew I wanted my marriage, my wife and family, but it wasn't until recently that I reached in difference about my XAP - 16 months down a very long, dark, depressing road.

 

For those of us who have ended our affairs, our hearts are broken, our minds cannot think straight, our emotions are running all over the place. She has a lot of sorting and sifting to do through her emotions.

 

Logically, the OP is saying the right things. She just needs time to fully grieve her XAP, unravel what the affair has really done, get back to who she was before her affair, find love again with her H (if she can).

 

Keep NC. Keep in counseling. Do your work. Stay on course.

 

You had better block your XAP for good. There cannot be one more shred of contact. Sassy is right. Until yesterday, your affair was ongoing. Should you tell you H? Maybe. Probably. That's your call. If hubby finds out, all bets are probably off.

 

Do the right thing. Get your integrity back. Get your sanity back. Get your life back.

 

Get back to yourself.

Edited March 7, 2015 by Rainbowlove

[Rainbowlove]

I don't really know how to address your questions. We officially said goodbye today. I know where my heart should be, but at this moment it feels like it's breaking...not just for AP, but the pain my husband feels, the loss of innocence. This is the lowest I've ever felt in my life.

 

You have to feel the pain. I'm sorry. In order to get beyond it, you have to move through it. That means grieving every ounce of it.

 

You will grieve XAP, you will feel horrible for what you've done to H, kids, family and yourself.

 

You have a very long road a head of you, but many of us have walked it and are here to tell you you can get there.

 

Step by step, day by day...making the right decisions, staying NC, staying in IC, getting into MC, talking to H, and recommitting yourself to who you want to be in life.

 

Think about your kids. They need you whole. They need you happy. You've probably been a mess for a long time, emotionally absent from them....not fully present.

 

That's not who you want to be to them. You know they deserve all of you, as does your husband, as do you.

 

You can get there. It is possible.

 

The hard work has only just begun. Get ready for a fight for self.

 

Stay strong.

[Rainbowlove]

Most truly remorseful WW I've seen here are disgusted. With themselves, with AP, and every little thing they did in the affair. Love? Nope. There are no feelings of love. At least not for AP

 

Don't you think this takes time, Sassy?

 

I was disgusted and felt badly about my involvement with XAP after it ended and for what I did to myself, my wife and son, but getting to that place of feeling nothing for a former affair partner takes a long time. It's a long, dark, scary, lonley, painful road.

 

Just wondering if you really think she should be at indifference already?

 

She hasn't done all the work and grieving yet to get there. True indifference is a long way out for her...

[Rainbowlove]

A truly remorseful spouse doesn't get caught and take the affair deeper underground. I know what's going to happen. I will be very surprised if she tells her husband she continued the affair. She is going to start her R with a lie. I sense it, Sassy senses it, and I'm pretty sure a lot of other people reading this thread will sense it to. And the rationalizations she will come up with to not tell. OP, I would love nothing more than for you to prove me wrong.

 

Jbrent890, I don't know your story. That's okay, I don't need to to see you have some projecting of your own hurt and experience going on here.

 

Nothing in her post suggests she's taking her affair underground. Nothing.

 

Going cold turkey no contact his hard business. She should have continued minimal contact with him, no...but, let's face it, many of us do when we are initially ending it.

 

Anyone who tells you they went NC in the 1st day and never ever spoke to their XAP again after that initial Dday is probably lying. Not saying it can't happen, but it's defintely not the norm.

 

Does that mean she's going to keep up the contact and resume her affair? Going based on what the OP is saying, and not our own personal experience and fear, no...she doesn't sound to me like that is her goal.

 

Does that mean it won't happen, no.

 

Your point is valid. She needs to stop the contact. She risks being suspectable to her affair partner. She is risking her marriage and family and their over-all recovery.

 

I don't think going underground is her intension.

[Southern Sun]

Is Sassy hypocritical? Yes. Is she wrong? No. A truly remorseful spouse doesn't get caught and take the affair deeper underground. I know what's going to happen. I will be very surprised if she tells her husband she continued the affair. She is going to start her R with a lie. I sense it, Sassy senses it, and I'm pretty sure a lot of other people reading this thread will sense it to. And the rationalizations she will come up with to not tell. OP, I would love nothing more than for you to prove me wrong.

 

I want to respond to this. I felt this from my husband and feel it from the BSs on this site, and that is - you all demand IMMEDIATE and TOTAL remorse. Not one more second of confusion, grief, or second-guessing is tolerated. I told my husband after D Day that I wanted to stay, I wanted to make things right between us, but I did not pretend there was no ambivalence. He was ambivalent too, and I don't blame him. The difference was that I didn't just heap my confusion about everything onto him. I felt that would be cruel, and that I just needed to be a big girl and deal with it...through IC or whatever, but not put him through it. He didn't need to hear every thought that passed through my head.

 

As time went on, xAP and I talked on the phone a few times and emailed here and there. We actually discussed getting together to say goodbye, but that was circumvented yesterday. It's over.

 

I know you will disagree, but I don't necessarily feel like I am starting R with a lie. I feel like I am human, I did the work to get strong enough, and I did it.

 

My husband knows the full extent of the affair - all of the important details and even some things not necessarily important, but very painful to him. I will consider whether I should tell him there was additional contact, but I don't know. Right now, I feel like I've done what I committed to. I was always working towards the goal of NC. It's done now and I will not go back.

 

I think I needed to get there on my own to feel right about it. There are times NC 'by force' just doesn't work. As wrong as it was, there was a relationship there. I know some As aren't emotional, but unfortunately, mine was. I think me going NC by choice is more likely to lead to a successful reconciliation.

 

BS certainly have a right to demand immediate and total remorse, and can choose to D if that's not what they get. But from what I've read and experienced personally, that may be jumping the gun...if the BS and the WS both deep down want to make it work together.

[Southern Sun]

You have to feel the pain. I'm sorry. In order to get beyond it, you have to move through it. That means grieving every ounce of it.

 

You will grieve XAP, you will feel horrible for what you've done to H, kids, family and yourself.

 

You have a very long road a head of you, but many of us have walked it and are here to tell you you can get there.

 

Step by step, day by day...making the right decisions, staying NC, staying in IC, getting into MC, talking to H, and recommitting yourself to who you want to be in life.

 

Think about your kids. They need you whole. They need you happy. You've probably been a mess for a long time, emotionally absent from them....not fully present.

 

That's not who you want to be to them. You know they deserve all of you, as does your husband, as do you.

 

You can get there. It is possible.

 

The hard work has only just begun. Get ready for a fight for self.

 

Stay strong.

 

Honestly, I've never felt so low in my life as I did last night. Well, I think D Day was lower. It's a different kind of sadness now. There's a level of acceptance, but acceptance of what I've done and the consequences of what I've done. I've broken my husband's trust and his spirit, I've stolen time from my children, not being present (physically and emotionally), AND (wrong as it is) I've said goodbye to someone who meant a great deal to me. And the goodbye came at the very moment there is a painful divide between me and H, which makes it even harder. He has been in IC himself and working on his own healing. Some of that healing actually has put some distance between us. I am lonely everywhere I turn, yet I know I created this. I permanently scarred my marriage and don't feel husband and I are on the same side yet. I can't really talk to friends or family about this. And I ended the one relationship that I haven't tarnished with lies or betrayal, though it needed to end.

 

So yeah. I'm in a pretty lonely, dark place. Affairs are f'ing awful.

[elaine567]

I felt this from my husband and feel it from the BSs on this site, and that is - you all demand IMMEDIATE and TOTAL remorse. Not one more second of confusion, grief, or second-guessing is tolerated.

 

Yes, I totally get that, and up till now I did not really understand the enormity of it all, from the POV of the WS in a serious relationship with the AP.

Not a ONS, not a lust filled affair, not a one-sided push and pull angst filled pairing, not a "just for fun" romp, but a serious relationship

If you split it from the rights and wrongs, you get down to two people with a deep connection, a deep connection that through circumstance must be torn apart.

On here we get people broken hearted for months and years over relationships that end, so why would it be any different for a WS and an AP, torn asunder, by circumstance.?

Why would a WS not be heart broken over the loss of her AP?

Why would she magically be able to push it all aside and concentrate on the BS as if nothing had happened?

Not only does she have to push it all aside but she has also to wear a hair shirt, support a grieving, angry, potentially aggressive, mentally unstable BS and pick up loving the BS again in a fractured marriage, and show sufficient remorse as well.

She may be to "blame", but it does now sound to me that the BS demanding immediate "remorse" and total commitment is a tall order.

[purplesorrow]

Honestly, I've never felt so low in my life as I did last night. Well, I think D Day was lower. It's a different kind of sadness now. There's a level of acceptance, but acceptance of what I've done and the consequences of what I've done. I've broken my husband's trust and his spirit, I've stolen time from my children, not being present (physically and emotionally), AND (wrong as it is) I've said goodbye to someone who meant a great deal to me. And the goodbye came at the very moment there is a painful divide between me and H, which makes it even harder. He has been in IC himself and working on his own healing. Some of that healing actually has put some distance between us. I am lonely everywhere I turn, yet I know I created this. I permanently scarred my marriage and don't feel husband and I are on the same side yet. I can't really talk to friends or family about this. And I ended the one relationship that I haven't tarnished with lies or betrayal, though it needed to end.

 

So yeah. I'm in a pretty lonely, dark place. Affairs are f'ing awful.

 

Your husband will probably continue to detach emotionally until he feels you are safe. He is just protecting himself. Detaching puts him on the same playing field as you. You have been detached from and even more so during the affair. You are in for a long bumpy ride. If your husband does find out you continued contact, it will take you all back to dday, day one. No one can demand immediate remorse but your spouse probably feels like I did. If you could see the anguish and torment you caused for him and your family but stay in contact with the person that helped you to do it, it would be heartbreaking. I didn't ask my stbx to go nc, that was his decision and it was going to show me where his heart really was. Good luck. I hope you find your peace.

[anika99]

I want to respond to this. I felt this from my husband and feel it from the BSs on this site, and that is - you all demand IMMEDIATE and TOTAL remorse. Not one more second of confusion, grief, or second-guessing is tolerated. I told my husband after D Day that I wanted to stay, I wanted to make things right between us, but I did not pretend there was no ambivalence. He was ambivalent too, and I don't blame him. The difference was that I didn't just heap my confusion about everything onto him. I felt that would be cruel, and that I just needed to be a big girl and deal with it...through IC or whatever, but not put him through it. He didn't need to hear every thought that passed through my head.

 

As time went on, xAP and I talked on the phone a few times and emailed here and there. We actually discussed getting together to say goodbye, but that was circumvented yesterday. It's over.

 

I know you will disagree, but I don't necessarily feel like I am starting R with a lie. I feel like I am human, I did the work to get strong enough, and I did it.

 

My husband knows the full extent of the affair - all of the important details and even some things not necessarily important, but very painful to him. I will consider whether I should tell him there was additional contact, but I don't know. Right now, I feel like I've done what I committed to. I was always working towards the goal of NC. It's done now and I will not go back.

 

I think I needed to get there on my own to feel right about it. There are times NC 'by force' just doesn't work. As wrong as it was, there was a relationship there. I know some As aren't emotional, but unfortunately, mine was. I think me going NC by choice is more likely to lead to a successful reconciliation.

 

BS certainly have a right to demand immediate and total remorse, and can choose to D if that's not what they get. But from what I've read and experienced personally, that may be jumping the gun...if the BS and the WS both deep down want to make it work together.

 

I agree that nobody can demand or make you feel remorse. You won't be able to feel it until you have truly ended the affair though.

 

 

I also agree that you don't necessarily have to tell your husband every single thought that crosses your mind. I think talking to him openly and honestly might go a long way to building trust and intimacy but you if you are not ready for that then you are not. I hope someday you get there.

 

 

However, by continuing contact with your AP behind your husband's back for months after he discovered the affair you have continued to deceive, manipulate and manage your husband. That has nothing to do with him demanding immediate remorse and everything to do with continued lies and deception perpetrated by you. Your husband thought you ended contact months ago so he still believes in lies. The work on the marriage has been a joke and you are making a fool of him and wasting his time by pretending. You think you know what's best for everyone and that you get to decide what your husband knows and what he doesn't know. You are trying to manage him and control his actions and choices by lying to him. That is very arrogant of you and not at all conducive to building a healthy marriage. Why do you get to know the facts and the truth of your marriage while conceal those things from your husband?

[road]

OP, are you still working there?

 

 

If so then you can not be in NC.

[purplesorrow]

Yes, I totally get that, and up till now I did not really understand the enormity of it all, from the POV of the WS in a serious relationship with the AP.

Not a ONS, not a lust filled affair, not a one-sided push and pull angst filled pairing, not a "just for fun" romp, but a serious relationship

If you split it from the rights and wrongs, you get down to two people with a deep connection, a deep connection that through circumstance must be torn apart.

On here we get people broken hearted for months and years over relationships that end, so why would it be any different for a WS and an AP, torn asunder, by circumstance.?

Why would a WS not be heart broken over the loss of her AP?

Why would she magically be able to push it all aside and concentrate on the BS as if nothing had happened?

Not only does she have to push it all aside but she has also to wear a hair shirt, support a grieving, angry, potentially aggressive, mentally unstable BS and pick up loving the BS again in a fractured marriage, and show sufficient remorse as well.

She may be to "blame", but it does now sound to me that the BS demanding immediate "remorse" and total commitment is a tall order.

 

What you suggest a BS do? Hold and console their WS while they grieve over a person that helped bring so much pain in their lives? No one can demand immediate nor get immediate remourse. But actions that show a desire to get there helps. It's a tall order to ask someone to stay after an affair too.

[Southern Sun]

Yes, I totally get that, and up till now I did not really understand the enormity of it all, from the POV of the WS in a serious relationship with the AP.

Not a ONS, not a lust filled affair, not a one-sided push and pull angst filled pairing, not a "just for fun" romp, but a serious relationship

If you split it from the rights and wrongs, you get down to two people with a deep connection, a deep connection that through circumstance must be torn apart.

On here we get people broken hearted for months and years over relationships that end, so why would it be any different for a WS and an AP, torn asunder, by circumstance.?

Why would a WS not be heart broken over the loss of her AP?

Why would she magically be able to push it all aside and concentrate on the BS as if nothing had happened?

Not only does she have to push it all aside but she has also to wear a hair shirt, support a grieving, angry, potentially aggressive, mentally unstable BS and pick up loving the BS again in a fractured marriage, and show sufficient remorse as well.

She may be to "blame", but it does now sound to me that the BS demanding immediate "remorse" and total commitment is a tall order.

 

Wow, Elaine, you hit the nail on the head with this. My husband at one point asked me, if you loved him, how could you get over him 'just like that'? My response: I didn't say I did. That actually seemed to make sense to him. It was confusing to him, knowing that AP and I expressed 'I love you' and then I just walked away. I told him that it was something I was working through, but that I knew I couldn't come to him and ask him for help with that part of it. He got it. I'm sure it hurt, but it made a lot more sense than the alternative.

 

I'm not saying that BS don't have a right to make immediate and total remorse a condition of reconciliation. I just think that perhaps more marriages could recover if given a little time, assuming WS is making appropriate effort.

 

This is the hardest thing I've ever gone through in my life to date. My husband would say the same.

[Southern Sun]

I agree that nobody can demand or make you feel remorse. You won't be able to feel it until you have truly ended the affair though.

 

 

I also agree that you don't necessarily have to tell your husband every single thought that crosses your mind. I think talking to him openly and honestly might go a long way to building trust and intimacy but you if you are not ready for that then you are not. I hope someday you get there.

 

 

However, by continuing contact with your AP behind your husband's back for months after he discovered the affair you have continued to deceive, manipulate and manage your husband. That has nothing to do with him demanding immediate remorse and everything to do with continued lies and deception perpetrated by you. Your husband thought you ended contact months ago so he still believes in lies. The work on the marriage has been a joke and you are making a fool of him and wasting his time by pretending. You think you know what's best for everyone and that you get to decide what your husband knows and what he doesn't know. You are trying to manage him and control his actions and choices by lying to him. That is very arrogant of you and not at all conducive to building a healthy marriage. Why do you get to know the facts and the truth of your marriage while conceal those things from your husband?

 

I appreciate your opinion but don't agree. I know where my thoughts and feelings have been since D Day. I know that the conversations I had with my xAP were 'wrapping up' talks, bringing things to closure. They were never conducted with a tone or intention of continuing the affair. I don't believe the effort we have put into reconciliation has been a joke. I am in a different place than I was on D Day. I am not intending to be arrogant. I am just trying to survive this and make the best decisions I can.

[Southern Sun]

OP, are you still working there?

 

 

If so then you can not be in NC.

 

No, I quit the job, so we can be totally NC.

[anika99]

Yes, I totally get that, and up till now I did not really understand the enormity of it all, from the POV of the WS in a serious relationship with the AP.

Not a ONS, not a lust filled affair, not a one-sided push and pull angst filled pairing, not a "just for fun" romp, but a serious relationship

If you split it from the rights and wrongs, you get down to two people with a deep connection, a deep connection that through circumstance must be torn apart.

On here we get people broken hearted for months and years over relationships that end, so why would it be any different for a WS and an AP, torn asunder, by circumstance.?

Why would a WS not be heart broken over the loss of her AP?

Why would she magically be able to push it all aside and concentrate on the BS as if nothing had happened?

Not only does she have to push it all aside but she has also to wear a hair shirt, support a grieving, angry, potentially aggressive, mentally unstable BS and pick up loving the BS again in a fractured marriage, and show sufficient remorse as well.

She may be to "blame", but it does now sound to me that the BS demanding immediate "remorse" and total commitment is a tall order.

 

Oh the tragedy!! How dare anyone think of being honest and open at a time like this!

 

 

Nobody is saying the things you have just said. They are saying if the OP is serious about reconciling her marriage then she needs to stop deceiving her husband. Do you consider it somehow wrong for a BS spouse to expect honesty from the WS? If the OP is going to spend years being heartbroken over her AP then perhaps her husband should know that so that he and the OP can decide how to move forward.

 

 

Ironically the OP's ongoing deceit is what is causing her husband's expectations which seem to outrage you so much. If he knew the truth I'm pretty sure he'd give up on demanding remorse from his wife. People are confused and can't know the right things to do if they don't even know the truth. It's funny how people will deceive other people and then become indignant when those people don't understand them or know their true feelings. If the OP wants to spend years crying over her affair then she should say so her husband knows what he's facing.

[Southern Sun]

What you suggest a BS do? Hold and console their WS while they grieve over a person that helped bring so much pain in their lives? No one can demand immediate nor get immediate remourse. But actions that show a desire to get there helps. It's a tall order to ask someone to stay after an affair too.

 

Totally agree, which is why I never asked my BS to console me. I disentangled myself on my own and would never expect him to empathize with me on this point. I believe his pain takes priority over mine and understand that staying with me is a gift I don't deserve, but hope to earn.

[elaine567]

What you suggest a BS do? Hold and console their WS while they grieve over a person that helped bring so much pain in their lives? No one can demand immediate nor get immediate remourse. But actions that show a desire to get there helps. It's a tall order to ask someone to stay after an affair too.

 

I know, it is a terrible situation from both sides, I wasn't dismissing the BSs pain.

Having been on this forum for a while the pain that BSs suffer is very apparent to me. Some show that pain in just about every post they write.

I am also very aware of the pain of the OW (often young and single) who is being pushed and pulled by a MM.

 

I was only appreciating the pain of the WS in this situation, as very often their pain is minimalised, as they are "to blame" and "in the wrong", so deserve everything they get...

[Southern Sun]

Oh the tragedy!! How dare anyone think of being honest and open at a time like this!

 

 

Nobody is saying the things you have just said. They are saying if the OP is serious about reconciling her marriage then she needs to stop deceiving her husband. Do you consider it somehow wrong for a BS spouse to expect honesty from the WS? If the OP is going to spend years being heartbroken over her AP then perhaps her husband should know that so that he and the OP can decide how to move forward.

 

 

Ironically the OP's ongoing deceit is what is causing her husband's expectations which seem to outrage you so much. If he knew the truth I'm pretty sure he'd give up on demanding remorse from his wife. People are confused and can't know the right things to do if they don't even know the truth. It's funny how people will deceive other people and then become indignant when those people don't understand them or know their true feelings. If the OP wants to spend years crying over her affair then she should say so her husband knows what he's facing.

 

God, if I am going to spend years crying over this affair, then I will bow out of this marriage! I think Elaine was just saying that in general, when relationships end, people can and have taken years to get over them. And affairs, even if they are wrong, are relationships that may elicit a period of mourning. However, that is the LAST thing I want. I am trying to heal and be ONE person, committed to my marriage, with a heart that is devoted to one.

[elaine567]

Oh the tragedy!! How dare anyone think of being honest and open at a time like this!

 

Nobody is saying the things you have just said. They are saying if the OP is serious about reconciling her marriage then she needs to stop deceiving her husband. Do you consider it somehow wrong for a BS spouse to expect honesty from the WS? If the OP is going to spend years being heartbroken over her AP then perhaps her husband should know that so that he and the OP can decide how to move forward.

 

Ironically the OP's ongoing deceit is what is causing her husband's expectations which seem to outrage you so much. If he knew the truth I'm pretty sure he'd give up on demanding remorse from his wife. People are confused and can't know the right things to do if they don't even know the truth. It's funny how people will deceive other people and then become indignant when those people don't understand them or know their true feelings. If the OP wants to spend years crying over her affair then she should say so her husband knows what he's facing.

 

Sorry if I sounded outraged, that was not my intent. I was merely voicing my thoughts in order to get a handle on this.

I was perhaps just realising that many WSs are going to be heart broken for years over affairs long since finished; something in this forum, I hadn't really considered fully, as the posts I read are usually from the BS perspective, and it is all about remorse, STDs, sex, surveillance, reconciliation or divorce; kids and the ongoing pain of the BS.

[Ronnie33]

I don't think it's so cut and dry. I think that a WS can truly want to reconcile, feel remorse but still grieve the loss of the AP as they are reconciling. If they cared about that person and even if they still love their BS it still hurts to lose someone that was a part of your life, even if that part was built out of lies and deceit. I never understand why that is so hard for some people to understand. It's like being in a toxic open relationship with a person, when it ends it still takes a while to get over even though you know it's the right thing. Emotions are emotions, you can't just shut them off over night.

[Ruffian1]

I am lonely everywhere I turn, yet I know I created this. I permanently scarred my marriage and don't feel husband and I are on the same side yet. I can't really talk to friends or family about this. And I ended the one relationship that I haven't tarnished with lies or betrayal, though it needed to end.

 

So yeah. I'm in a pretty lonely, dark place. Affairs are f'ing awful.

 

 

So, yes, this is the consequences of our choices. No way around them.

 

 

I hope you are not using your BS as plan B.

 

 

Don't do that to him.