Wife found out about affair

[obtuseedge]

the thing that i don't understand - how did you even make it with your W for more than a decade then? i've had this exact relationship you're describing (i'm like you & my partner was like your W) & we didn't even last a year. why even marrying someone you're THAT different from?

 

you probably don't see it - but your posts come off as insults to your W, even though you don't mean it that way. you're basically saying she never developed and grew as a person while you did. your description of her NOW is very different from your description of her in your early posts.

 

i honestly knew this would happen - the inital shock and pain are slowly fading away and you're getting used to the idea of moving on. you saw nothing really happened when the truth got out, no one died, the Earth is still moving and the Sun still rises every morning. it's clear from your posts that you don't want your W or your M, it gets more clear with each post.

 

that's why i think you'll eventually leave. now... will you end up with your xAP? probably. but be careful not to sing this same tune with her 10 years from now.

 

We were a lot younger when we first got together, it was a challenge in the beginning but we connected on other levels, like a sense of humor, I also did like the fact that she was very straightforward and honest, it was a relief being in a relationship with no mind games, and feeling peace of mind. That's how we got together. Over the years, we got really attached to one another and I adored her, but always felt unfulfilled because of the differences. We were both wanting to start a business together and we did run a cafe together for several years, we were focused on the business and not on these other things, later on, that didn't work out but we started another business in which we have operated together.

 

So like that, in a blink of an eye, a decade passes, then this. I've also never have been very good at identifying my feelings as well, which is something related to my upbringing.

[minimariah]

The OP was/is in love with two women at the same time.

 

but that's the thing - i don't think this OP was... or is.

in fact, i don't think he's in love with his W at all at this point and i also think he's slowly realizing & accepting that. he's writing about his W's failures more and more - that's totally different from his first posts about her.

 

i could be totally wrong, of course.

he might make it work with his W, i'm basing my opinion off of his latest posts. i'm aware that things are super fresh and will change, so there is that.

[obtuseedge]

The OP was/is in love with two women at the same time. It is a heart-breaking quandry to be in and is very destabilizing for anyone who has experienced this. To me it makes sense that he isn't sure of his opinion on the M .... YET. That doesn't mean his M is for sure doomed. It is a tangled up ball of yarn that has to be dealt with.

 

And OP, your response to MiniMariah's comment in examining your own views with your compatibility between your W vs xAP also shows you are still idealizing your AP and so your wife will certainly seem "worse" in comparison. That is still the fog of the A and the addiction that is over-riding your brain.

 

In six weeks hopefully you'll revisit the comparisons you've been making and may see things differently. Just don't let yourself believe you are clearly evaluating either of their merits/faults through the lens of clarity at this point.

 

So much will change many many times each day for the next 4-6 weeks while you are in limbo.

 

Hang in there.

 

Thanks for the heartfelt advice.

 

I honestly don't want to be comparing my wife with my xAP. Because this isn't about comparing the two. Obviously there will be inevitable comparisons. However, the fact is, both have pros and cons to their character and personalities and our compatibility, and this isn't about that.

 

This is about whether I can be the husband that my wife deserves, and whether I can be happy in this marriage (which is the primary determinant of the first condition).

[obtuseedge]

but that's the thing - i don't think this OP was... or is.

in fact, i don't think he's in love with his W at all at this point and i also think he's slowly realizing & accepting that. he's writing about his W's failures more and more - that's totally different from his first posts about her.

 

i could be totally wrong, of course.

he might make it work with his W, i'm basing my opinion off of his latest posts. i'm aware that things are super fresh and will change, so there is that.

 

No, I'm not IN LOVE with my wife. But I do LOVE her. There is NO DOUBT about that. The fact is, feeling "in love", that's part of the infatuation stage of the relationship. When you are together for over a decade, that feeling wears off, and then you develop a different type of love.

 

But yes, love isn't enough to make one feel fulfilled or that they are living their life to the potential. The fact is, I've felt very bored and unstimulated for a long time in our marriage, and that has been what's left the door open to the affair.

[obtuseedge]

No, I'm not IN LOVE with my wife. But I do LOVE her. There is NO DOUBT about that. The fact is, feeling "in love", that's part of the infatuation stage of the relationship. When you are together for over a decade, that feeling wears off, and then you develop a different type of love.

 

But yes, love isn't enough to make one feel fulfilled or that they are living their life to the potential. The fact is, I've felt very bored and unstimulated for a long time in our marriage, and that has been what's left the door open to the affair.

 

Also, the fact that I didn't write about the flaws in her personality in the beginning doesn't mean I didn't realize they were there before. But one only has a limited amount of time to explain the background to things on this forum, so obviously certain aspects are revealed as the conversation moves forward.

[starglider]

but that's the thing - i don't think this OP was... or is.

in fact, i don't think he's in love with his W at all at this point and i also think he's slowly realizing & accepting that. he's writing about his W's failures more and more - that's totally different from his first posts about her.

 

I know what you mean. It is not the same type of love for both women. One is that addictive drug type of love and one is the love for a good person who deserves happiness. But both types of feelings fall under the general word "love" and this is what makes people feel crazy when two people are in their lives at once. I wish the English language had more words for the wide span of love, like Eskimos do for snow.

[obtuseedge]

I know what you mean. It is not the same type of love for both women. One is that addictive drug type of love and one is the love for a good person who deserves happiness. But both types of feelings fall under the general word "love" and this is what makes people feel crazy when two people are in their lives at once. I wish the English language had more words for the wide span of love, like Eskimos do for snow.

 

Yes, certainly.

 

When I first met my wife, we would call each other constantly, have nights full of endless sex, talk all night long, share things. Yes, there was that issue with the difference in our personalities that prevented us from connecting at certain levels, and yes, it was a concern for me. But a lot of the other aspects of our relationship was good and I really adored her. That's why we lasted this long. The love changes. It's not the same infatuated love that was there in the beginning, it's a more mature love where you care about the other person, their welfare, their soul. Yes, I've done a lot of damage to her and sometimes it fills me with tears. But the love is there.

 

I do certainly love my wife. There is absolutely no doubt in my mind I do. If I didn't, this decision would've been very easy, I would've left right away, just as easily as how my xAP left her abusive husband, a marriage that really didn't have love there.

[minimariah]

No, I'm not IN LOVE with my wife. But I do LOVE her. There is NO DOUBT about that. The fact is, feeling "in love", that's part of the infatuation stage of the relationship. When you are together for over a decade, that feeling wears off, and then you develop a different type of love.

 

yes - romantic love. but your love for your W isn't romantic - it's friendly, it comes from partnership and being with her for so many years, sharing so many memories. your "being in love" phase failed to develop & grow into something ROMANTIC and more which resulted in you two growing apart and you eventually having an A.

 

it's simple - that love SHOULD be enough. it should be enough to make you happy and to make you work on your marriage. the fact that you're totally okay being without her & you're ready for that option speaks volumes.

[fellini]

I would be careful about some of the things you read.

 

"in love" is NOT an infatuation and "love" something else.

 

You can very well be "in love" with your wife after 10 years of marriage. What wears off is the romantic notion of love, but this is replaced with love which keeps people together. It is not true that once this happens we can no longer feel the "in love" aspect of our relationship with another human.

 

I would say to think that is your lot in life is to resign to a mediocre marriage.

 

There are plenty of things a couple can do to feed DESIRE and MYSTERY and PASSION back into a PERMANENT relationship.

 

In fact Esther Perel has written a book on this: Mating in Captivity: Reconciling the Erotic + the Domestic.

 

Another source are the youtube/Ted talks of Helen Fischer "The brain in love".

 

Something I have wondered about reading through these 25 pages of discussion, that I cannot quite get a handle on...

 

Why do you say you woke up and realized it was your wife you TRULY wanted to be with, and not the AP. What did you SEE in her that suddenly ended your confusion? What changed? If she is still the same person, what changed for you to see this in a new light?

 

 

 

 

No, I'm not IN LOVE with my wife. But I do LOVE her. There is NO DOUBT about that. The fact is, feeling "in love", that's part of the infatuation stage of the relationship. When you are together for over a decade, that feeling wears off, and then you develop a different type of love.

 

But yes, love isn't enough to make one feel fulfilled or that they are living their life to the potential. The fact is, I've felt very bored and unstimulated for a long time in our marriage, and that has been what's left the door open to the affair.

[Timshel]

Are there no children in the marriage? If not, separate. I see this as the best way to either find each other again or to walk away. I think you and your wife are too close to the fire to see the light. Sometimes people need space. So what? Being under each other is not helping. As my dad used to say, "I'm going to the mountain." It was his time to reflect, meditate if you will. He only went for a day trip on our property but it applies.

We need silence to hear our own voice. I think we need silence to see the soul but no matter.

Go to the mountain dude. Find a path that is not convoluted. How do you want to live the rest of your life? Your choices effect others so it's important and this is not a fricking dress rehearsal and life is astonishingly short.

[minimariah]

I know what you mean. It is not the same type of love for both women. One is that addictive drug type of love and one is the love for a good person who deserves happiness.

 

one is love & the other isn't and i have no idea why so many people confuse that. it's clear what you're supposed to feel for someone you're romantically involved with - like, we KNOW what kind of love you're supposed to feel for your boyfriend, girlfriend, partner, spouse. if you don't feel that love, that exact type of love? then you don't love that person.

 

but of course, that sounds "too simple" & people get defensive so they start with a "i love her as a good person, as a friend, as someone i've known for many years" stories. of course you love that person, you don't hate them. but if that love isn't any different from the love you feel for your best friend? that's not the kind of love you're supposed to be feeling.

 

we don't need new words for love, we just have to stop calling everything and every kind, nice, sweet feeling "love". like, stop with this "gradation" of love. you know what is romantic love supposed to feel like - if you don't feel that, you don't love that person. it's seriously as simple as that.

[minimariah]

Why do you say you woke up and realized it was your wife you TRULY wanted to be with, and not the AP. What did you SEE in her that suddenly ended your confusion? What changed? If she is still the same person, what changed for you to see this in a new light?

 

i don't think he saw it because of his W.

i think he saw it because of how disappointed he got in some of his xAP's actions. his turning to the W wasn't because of the W but because something he saw in the xAP made him think his W was a better choice.

[VeryBrokenMan]

Have you two read the five love languages? You should read it together. I'd be curious as to what her form of language is... And yours too...

 

I can recommend that book highly. Not everyone "loves" the same way. It helped us see how the other one expresses their love.

[Popsicle]

 

This is about whether I can be the husband that my wife deserves, and whether I can be happy in this marriage (which is the primary determinant of the first condition).

 

Are you better looking than your wife?

 

If so, this might be why the problems

 

Why Pretty Women Prefer Plain Men - Netscape Love

 

There was a study done on this, you can look it up if you want to read more.

[fellini]

thanks for this, but really I want to know what the OP feels, not what a stranger thinks

 

i don't think he saw it because of his W.

i think he saw it because of how disappointed he got in some of his xAP's actions. his turning to the W wasn't because of the W but because something he saw in the xAP made him think his W was a better choice.

[obtuseedge]

I would be careful about some of the things you read.

 

"in love" is NOT an infatuation and "love" something else.

 

You can very well be "in love" with your wife after 10 years of marriage. What wears off is the romantic notion of love, but this is replaced with love which keeps people together. It is not true that once this happens we can no longer feel the "in love" aspect of our relationship with another human.

 

I would say to think that is your lot in life is to resign to a mediocre marriage.

 

There are plenty of things a couple can do to feed DESIRE and MYSTERY and PASSION back into a PERMANENT relationship.

 

In fact Esther Perel has written a book on this: Mating in Captivity: Reconciling the Erotic + the Domestic.

 

Another source are the youtube/Ted talks of Helen Fischer "The brain in love".

 

Something I have wondered about reading through these 25 pages of discussion, that I cannot quite get a handle on...

 

Why do you say you woke up and realized it was your wife you TRULY wanted to be with, and not the AP. What did you SEE in her that suddenly ended your confusion? What changed? If she is still the same person, what changed for you to see this in a new light?

 

I said that there were a couple times when I woke up and I suddenly really felt strongly about saving my marriage.

 

Again, I have kept going through many extremes, so it's been difficult. I don't trust my impulses.

[obtuseedge]

one is love & the other isn't and i have no idea why so many people confuse that. it's clear what you're supposed to feel for someone you're romantically involved with - like, we KNOW what kind of love you're supposed to feel for your boyfriend, girlfriend, partner, spouse. if you don't feel that love, that exact type of love? then you don't love that person.

 

but of course, that sounds "too simple" & people get defensive so they start with a "i love her as a good person, as a friend, as someone i've known for many years" stories. of course you love that person, you don't hate them. but if that love isn't any different from the love you feel for your best friend? that's not the kind of love you're supposed to be feeling.

 

we don't need new words for love, we just have to stop calling everything and every kind, nice, sweet feeling "love". like, stop with this "gradation" of love. you know what is romantic love supposed to feel like - if you don't feel that, you don't love that person. it's seriously as simple as that.

 

You may be right. I haven't felt romantic towards her in a long time. I do adore her. I don't know if it's the same though? I don't feel that passionate romantic love.

[beach]

Have you considered a time frame for the renewed M?

 

Maybe 6-12 months to decide if things have changed enough to feel like things are getting better or not?

 

It may help to map out a plan of action for both of you - at which time you can both decide if the M is satisfactory and worth staying - or not.

[obtuseedge]

Are you better looking than your wife?

 

If so, this might be why the problems

 

Why Pretty Women Prefer Plain Men - Netscape Love

 

There was a study done on this, you can look it up if you want to read more.

 

Well, my wife is DEFINITELY a very physically attractive woman, I'm not just saying that because she is my wife. But she definitely gets a lot of male attention.

 

But yes, I'm probably more attractive than her on an objective level. Many of her friends have told her how lucky she was to have a really good looking husband. Also, when one of my coworkers found out about why I was moving from the office, they told me they saw it coming all along, the natural chemistry between my xAP and I, the fact that she was drop dead gorgeous and that I was very handsome.

 

Anyways, perhaps this is part of it. But honestly, in the beginning of our relationship, I was extremely sexually attracted to my wife, we just moved on. I've had past gf's who were very beautiful as well, and after a couple years, it just dies down. It's just the natural course of things.

[obtuseedge]

Have you considered a time frame for the renewed M?

 

Maybe 6-12 months to decide if things have changed enough to feel like things are getting better or not?

 

It may help to map out a plan of action for both of you - at which time you can both decide if the M is satisfactory and worth staying - or not.

 

Well, there is no definitive plan yet. But I hope I can gain some clarity within the next 2-3 months.

[minimariah]

You may be right. I haven't felt romantic towards her in a long time. I do adore her. I don't know if it's the same though? I don't feel that passionate romantic love.

 

it's not the same.

 

people in general think it's normal that the romantic, passionate love disappears over the years so they deal with it when it happens because they think it can't last - which is the biggest myth ever.

 

and you definitely don't adore her - you adore your xAP. adoration is a very strong feeling and your actions and words about your W simply don't match the definition. adoration is something similar to the infatuation, worshipping - it's that type of feeling and you definitely don't feel that for your W, based on everything you wrote so far. you love her and think she's a great woman and you wish her the best and want her to be happy... but really, is there even a difference between the love you feel for your W and a best friend?

 

moving out and being on your own for some time might be the best thing to do for you personally.

 

thanks for this...

 

what are you thanking me for?

the response wasn't to you personally, i wasn't answering your question for YOU - i was simply commenting and discussing the OP's sudden realization that his W is the right choice. it's clear where it came from - that is... if you actually read his earlier posts & followed his story.

Edited March 15, 2015 by minimariah

[truncated]

but that's the thing - i don't think this OP was... or is.

in fact, i don't think he's in love with his W at all at this point and i also think he's slowly realizing & accepting that. he's writing about his W's failures more and more - that's totally different from his first posts about her.

 

i could be totally wrong, of course.

he might make it work with his W, i'm basing my opinion off of his latest posts. i'm aware that things are super fresh and will change, so there is that.

 

There could be something to this.

 

It doesn't sound like he loves either woman, but he loves how they both make him feel, which is different in either case.

 

There are times when I hate the way my husband makes me feel. Times when he can do things that drive me nuts, but I still love him. If the op's words are an accurate representation of how he feels, that isn't there with either of these women, and he could have these feelings with anyone, or even on his own.( i don't know if what I said made sense, but maybe you understand what i am getting at)

[Popsicle]

Well, my wife is DEFINITELY a very physically attractive woman, I'm not just saying that because she is my wife. But she definitely gets a lot of male attention.

 

But yes, I'm probably more attractive than her on an objective level. Many of her friends have told her how lucky she was to have a really good looking husband. Also, when one of my coworkers found out about why I was moving from the office, they told me they saw it coming all along, the natural chemistry between my xAP and I, the fact that she was drop dead gorgeous and that I was very handsome.

 

Anyways, perhaps this is part of it. But honestly, in the beginning of our relationship, I was extremely sexually attracted to my wife, we just moved on. I've had past gf's who were very beautiful as well, and after a couple years, it just dies down. It's just the natural course of things.

 

I don't think you read the study. The point was that the attractive husbands were less able to be satisfied, and thus were not good husbands to their W's, which in turn made the W unhappy. That is what you alluded to were questioning yourself before in the post I quoted.

[truncated]

one is love & the other isn't and i have no idea why so many people confuse that. it's clear what you're supposed to feel for someone you're romantically involved with - like, we KNOW what kind of love you're supposed to feel for your boyfriend, girlfriend, partner, spouse. if you don't feel that love, that exact type of love? then you don't love that person.

 

but of course, that sounds "too simple" & people get defensive so they start with a "i love her as a good person, as a friend, as someone i've known for many years" stories. of course you love that person, you don't hate them. but if that love isn't any different from the love you feel for your best friend? that's not the kind of love you're supposed to be feeling.

 

we don't need new words for love, we just have to stop calling everything and every kind, nice, sweet feeling "love". like, stop with this "gradation" of love. you know what is romantic love supposed to feel like - if you don't feel that, you don't love that person. it's seriously as simple as that.

 

 

I think you are dead wrong, and that this view is a huge problem for a lot of people.

 

When you love someone, it should encompass a whole range of things. My husband is my best friend, and he is also someone I feel romantiv about. I can't have one without the other.

 

Too many people get caught up in the "he's like my best friend, so that can't be love". If that is all there is, then I agree. On the other hand, if a;l there is is "romance" ( or whatever other term you want to use) then that isn't love either.

 

It's the combination of the two that will make a relationship last. If there is only the one, it's very hard to sustain.

 

For me, there were times when my heart was broken and I couldn't feel any "romantic love" for my husband, but it was the deep friendship and partnership that got us through. There have been times when we haven't exactly been friends, but the romantic love got us through.

[truncated]

I said that there were a couple times when I woke up and I suddenly really felt strongly about saving my marriage.

 

Again, I have kept going through many extremes, so it's been difficult. I don't trust my impulses.

 

 

temporary insanity?