3 months later and where I am at.

[Spark1111]

what frustrates me the most Noirek, is you waffle, vacillate about what you want.

 

TAKE A stand lady and CHOOSE!

 

Make it known. DO it! Pick! decide! Choose! Commit!

 

Start living an authentic life, TRUE to your core!

 

Stop making excuses about IC, having a happy childhood, cuz I don't believe it for one hot minute.

 

Stop being the victim, claiming you are evil, selfish cruel. YOU are using that as an excuse to gain sympathy and to NOT deal with your issues....and there are Many.

 

I feel wallowed in quicksand reading this thread.

 

Pick your H, go NC with your OM, or divorce. OR, have an open marriage if your long-suffering H agrees to it. He is a saint since Most men would have kicked your waffling azz to the curb years ago. maybe you do not respect how kind he is.....

 

maybe, you prefer love that is sometimes cold, not always kind, and not readily available.

 

That is a FOO issue. Examine that in IC. look under 'AttachmenT styles. It starts at infancy. And exists in childhoods perceived as happy.

 

key questions to ask yourself: WHAT are you looking for? WHY are you looking for it? What does it do to make you feel happy and whole?

 

And the biggest question: Why? Why? Why?

 

Pleas get busy with this....You do not want to be here, 10 years from now, wondering why you are still so aloof, ambiguous, and still so unhappy and questioning.

 

Only you can answer these questions and do this for YOU.

[Noirek]

Ten characters

[Noirek]

Dear Noirek,

I do not want to bring you down or hurt you, but I'm a little confused.

 

 

At first your opening paragraph is so very intense that it does make clear straight away who you are and what you feel it's top honnesty.

 

 

In a later paragraph you defend your H and state you love him not the MM anymore, you two are a team, more than just parents, and your sexlife is ok.

You state of the fietish in your mind with reading cheaters novels and getting a "maybe horny"feeling of it.( your black side ?)

So you would like an open M, and here's the question; are you affraid you will fall for another MM or Sm? and that would also include EA, or do you seek exitement in lust and seks, to do things that you maybe been fantasising about?

I think the first option can be dealt with ( if you want too) in IC, and the last option is the most dangerous, because that depends all on your bounderies.

I do hope you find good counseling, because you are realy not a bad woman, and your pain must be inmense. I pray for you.

 

 

Dutchman 1

I am very aftaid that I will cheat again when faced with a new temptation.

 

EAs aren't a temptation. And I know what good boundaries look like. However, when I wanted it bad enough I just jumped past them all right into his bed. Simply put I don't trust myself. And if I don't trust myself I cannot promise fidelity. Just because I am not longer attracted to MM and find him a bit of a chore doesn't mean I am a better person. It just means my feelings have changed. But is it MM himself I am repulsed by? Or is it cheating on my wonderful husband and being this terrible person that repulses me? It makes a difference. The last might mean I will be faithful. The first just means I'm fickle and bored with MM and his constant whining about his wide (see, EAs are not for me)

[Noirek]

what frustrates me the most Noirek, is you waffle, vacillate about what you want.

 

TAKE A stand lady and CHOOSE!

 

Make it known. DO it! Pick! decide! Choose! Commit!

 

Start living an authentic life, TRUE to your core!

 

Stop making excuses about IC, having a happy childhood, cuz I don't believe it for one hot minute.

 

Stop being the victim, claiming you are evil, selfish cruel. YOU are using that as an excuse to gain sympathy and to NOT deal with your issues....and there are Many.

 

I feel wallowed in quicksand reading this thread.

 

Pick your H, go NC with your OM, or divorce. OR, have an open marriage if your long-suffering H agrees to it. He is a saint since Most men would have kicked your waffling azz to the curb years ago. maybe you do not respect how kind he is.....

 

maybe, you prefer love that is sometimes cold, not always kind, and not readily available.

 

That is a FOO issue. Examine that in IC. look under 'AttachmenT styles. It starts at infancy. And exists in childhoods perceived as happy.

 

key questions to ask yourself: WHAT are you looking for? WHY are you looking for it? What does it do to make you feel happy and whole?

 

And the biggest question: Why? Why? Why?

 

Pleas get busy with this....You do not want to be here, 10 years from now, wondering why you are still so aloof, ambiguous, and still so unhappy and questioning.

 

Only you can answer these questions and do this for YOU.

 

Yeah, no foo. But maybe you can tell me since you know so much what exactly part of my childhood would be responsible for my actions and mental state? My shrink didn't seem to think my cheating was related to any sort of growing up issues. But you seem to be a person who is always right. And quite insulting while you are at it.

[Dutchman1]

I am very aftaid that I will cheat again when faced with a new temptation.

 

EAs aren't a temptation. And I know what good boundaries look like. However, when I wanted it bad enough I just jumped past them all right into his bed. Simply put I don't trust myself. And if I don't trust myself I cannot promise fidelity. Just because I am not longer attracted to MM and find him a bit of a chore doesn't mean I am a better person. It just means my feelings have changed. But is it MM himself I am repulsed by? Or is it cheating on my wonderful husband and being this terrible person that repulses me? It makes a difference. The last might mean I will be faithful. The first just means I'm fickle and bored with MM and his constant whining about his wide (see, EAs are not for me)

 

 

Dear Noirek,

From your thread it indeed looks like you dont trust yourself, but realy would like to have the confidance not to hurt yourself and your family anymore.

Maybe you should make a choice who you would like to be.

Is it a single woman who gets all the lust and action, and not to forget your Fetish of getting a warm feeling reading cheating novels, that is the cheater in you perhaps.

I sence you would prefer to be faithful, so instead obsessing over what you don't want to be, concentrate and seek IC for the part in you that want to be faithful.

Not gonna scare you; I read and know a bunch of lady's who went for the "playboy mansion life" they are my age now (52) the had maybe a hundred lovers, A P@ssy you( I've been told) probably could park a RV in, and nobody ever realy loved them, and all their lust and fantasies get old with them. Scarry and sad.

I still think you could be in your safe zone with your family intact if you make a choice and a psy can talk with you and find out how to obtain your goals.

 

 

Dutchman 1

[Noirek]

Dear Noirek,

From your thread it indeed looks like you dont trust yourself, but realy would like to have the confidance not to hurt yourself and your family anymore.

Maybe you should make a choice who you would like to be.

Is it a single woman who gets all the lust and action, and not to forget your Fetish of getting a warm feeling reading cheating novels, that is the cheater in you perhaps.

I sence you would prefer to be faithful, so instead obsessing over what you don't want to be, concentrate and seek IC for the part in you that want to be faithful.

Not gonna scare you; I read and know a bunch of lady's who went for the "playboy mansion life" they are my age now (52) the had maybe a hundred lovers, A P@ssy you( I've been told) probably could park a RV in, and nobody ever realy loved them, and all their lust and fantasies get old with them. Scarry and sad.

I still think you could be in your safe zone with your family intact if you make a choice and a psy can talk with you and find out how to obtain your goals.

 

 

Dutchman 1

 

There is a slight difference between having only been with two people and having slept around the block. People love putting things to extremes.

[Dutchman1]

Dear Noirek.

Believe me I did not mean that you were a woman like that.

Sorry if I might have hurt you.

I do understand you seek a open M, and that you say that your H can " bang " hoever he wants.

You've been with two men , ( that is a lot less than JEZUS's Maria Magdalena)

Would you be in that open M want to be with your old MM ( the one that hurt you ) or a fresh one ? And for the long turn, or a ONS ?

Why do I ask silly questions.

I'm married to the best and most beautiful and most loving woman ever.

My sexdrive is as high as it was at 20. My wife was in a accident 12 years ago, and is one of the first people with a 3d printed pelvis and hips. Sex is almost inpossible , and she came with the idia of this open M. I'ts a one way deal, as long as I only snuggle and hugg her.

I am in this for relief , not romance, I see about 5 woman for benefits.

I see 5 woman to prevent me to get in a EA, but it is still hard not to fall in love because they all have different skills and preferences, from vanilla to the rough.

My point is: Open M or FWB never work out in the long run. The E is a always part of a longterm relation, in or outside the M.

And a pure PA would be ( funny example)

1 the doorbell rings.

2 It'seems Bob.

3 Bob follows the lady into the kitchen.

4 woman drops panty's and bends over.

5 they do there thing.

6 Bob says after 30 minutes, see you next week, and the woman says oké Bob.

 

I said I know woman that had the fun life, and after the exitement went, they became a hollow shell, they don't know if they really loved, and don't know if they were really ever loved.

So like you say that you do not want to cheat, but you are afraid that you cannot trust yourself, I recommend a good psychator, because there are medications that will help you with your boundaries. These will not make you lose your sexdrive, and don't make you nomb or a zombie.

Make your one life a happy one.

 

Dutchman 1

[Morbius]

I married my first who 18 yrs later cheated and the next person I met and fell in love with is my current husband.

 

I've never felt I missed out or needed to get it out of my system, but I do understand some people do feel this way. I think talking it through with a counsellor may help.

 

What to me is coming across in your posts is that your husband wants to work this out with you and you do too. But I get the sense you are scared. Perhaps scared you might mess it up? I don't know.

 

Get into counselling asap, hopefully you can talk it through with someone with experience who can help.

 

From my POV, Noirek is honest, and pragmatic. She is justifiably concerned that if opportunity presents itself she would succumb. This is profound. I do not like what she did, but reading her thread and posts I am awed by her practicality and not beating around the bush. She confessed and her husband supported her. He is as much part of her recovery as she is. Yes, recovery.

 

She is an amazing woman who fell yet because she is amazing her husband forgave. I can see now why early on she tortured herself, calling herself all the vile nasty things she believed she was. Yet her H stood by her and that drove her deeper into despair. She made a horrible choice and was selfish and I understand, her posts revealed the myriad of reasons. Noirek fell down a slippery slope.

 

Her later posts show the struggle she had, not wanting to 'fail' her H and child again, but she is no longer putting herself down. She woke up and is fighting to recover and become whole. To recognize it is to overcome it. She is doing what must be done, and with counseling and the continued support of posters and her family her chances of failing are nearly impossible.

Nothing is 100% when it comes to emotions. Nothing. Noirek understands this, and with counseling she will be better equipped and stronger to face down this challenge. A good 97% of success.

 

It is sad such an amazing person failed, but I believe her honesty and dedication will keep her from failing again.

 

A pity more WS aren't this honest.

My money is on this fWW to never fail her family again.

[merrmeade]

However, I don't trust that the feelings won't return.

Healthy and smart. Doesn't mean you're insincere or in danger at all. Just means you know yourself.

[Noirek]

Communication between MM and I has been over for a week. I happened to see him last week and felt nothing. I'm waiting to hear back from a counsellor but may have to call again tomorrow. Life goes on. I'll leave this thread be for now. Too soon to see if it will last.

[Morbius]

Communication between MM and I has been over for a week. I happened to see him last week and felt nothing. I'm waiting to hear back from a counsellor but may have to call again tomorrow. Life goes on. I'll leave this thread be for now. Too soon to see if it will last.

 

I admire your honesty and commitment. Don't be gone for too long, you are an inspiration to a lot of people, myself included.

 

To recognize it is to overcome it, and you certainly have. In another thread, you mentioned infidelity is breaking a plate, it can be glued back together but will never be whole again.

 

I have read your many threads, and the many issues your family had. A difficult time. A tough time. You slipped, made a poor choice, but this is my belief.

 

You broke your marriage, but instead of of a china plate, yours because of the myriad of troubling issues, your marriage was a plate of glass. This glass was cracking long before you cheated. You know this to be true. Your infidelity broke what was already weak.

 

You have swept up all the pieces and with your honesty and love for your husband, your husbands accepting of his issues, and his forgiveness and love for you, something wonderful is happening.

 

These fragments you have collected are not being glued together instead with your honesty, and wisdom for recognizing the truth these pieces are in the furnace being melted. And when this is poured, the mold is not a plate, but something new and strong will harden with absolutely no cracks.

 

This new marriage you and your husband are creating will be in the shape of a heart, not a fragile heart but a solid piece of strong love. No cracks here.

 

A bit dramatic? Yes, but an honest assessment.

 

Noirek, your marriage will be crack free again, with you and your husband at the controls of the forge.

 

You are amazing, you just need to believe. Best wishes, good fortune with counseling..

 

.

[Cephalopod]

This is the most amazing thread I have ever read. I am truly speechless.

[Noirek]

This is the most amazing thread I have ever read. I am truly speechless.

 

Thank you for the compliment, you are too kind.

[Confused48]

I truly am a very broken person or in fact evil. But I am choosing to make good descision everyday.

 

Did you learn this in IC? My IC, who appears to me to be the most kind hearted person on earth, said to me, "Confused, in reality I am a bad assed S.O.B. that no one would want to be around for more than two minutes. However, I consistently make the choice not to act like one."

 

So sometimes it really is NOT what is in your heart that matters most. It is in your actions.

[m.snow]

you said you would not divorce your husband and that's out of the topic. i hope you stick with that.

 

but your statement that you may fall into another ea & pa if the opportunity arises is quite frightening to contemplate.

 

you said it is up to your husband to divorce you.

 

if by any chance you fall madly in love with another person & divorced your husband. part of that blame will be placed on him for not divorcing you right?

 

i hope you place value on "for better or for worse" in your marriage like your husband does.

 

come hell or high water, i hope you wont divorce your husband. if the temptation arrives.

[Cephalopod]

I admire your honesty and commitment. Don't be gone for too long, you are an inspiration to a lot of people, myself included.

 

To recognize it is to overcome it, and you certainly have. In another thread, you mentioned infidelity is breaking a plate, it can be glued back together but will never be whole again.

 

I have read your many threads, and the many issues your family had. A difficult time. A tough time. You slipped, made a poor choice, but this is my belief.

 

You broke your marriage, but instead of of a china plate, yours because of the myriad of troubling issues, your marriage was a plate of glass. This glass was cracking long before you cheated. You know this to be true. Your infidelity broke what was already weak.a

 

You have swept up all the pieces and with your honesty and love for your husband, your husbands accepting of his issues, and his forgiveness and love for you, something wonderful is happening.

 

These fragments you have collected are not being glued together instead with your honesty, and wisdom for recognizing the truth these pieces are in the furnace being melted. And when this is poured, the mold is not a plate, but something new and strong will harden with absolutely no cracks.

 

This new marriage you and your husband are creating will be in the shape of a heart, not a fragile heart but a solid piece of strong love. No cracks here.

 

A bit dramatic? Yes, but an honest assessment.

 

Noirek, your marriage will be crack free again, with you and your husband at the controls of the forge.

 

You are amazing, you just need to believe. Best wishes, good fortune with counseling..

 

.

 

This is the most amazing thread I've ever read. I hope I can become as admired as Noirek. Wow. All I need to do is get married, cheat on my wife, then continue to have contact with my AP in total disregard for my wife's feelings, and I can be a star on this site too!

[Hope Shimmers]

This is the most amazing thread I've ever read. I hope I can become as admired as Noirek. Wow. All I need to do is get married, cheat on my wife, then continue to have contact with my AP in total disregard for my wife's feelings, and I can be a star on this site too!

 

This is sarcastic and rude.

 

I've noticed that people who 'criticize' her are just reacting out of their black and white beliefs without any kind of understanding of the particular situation or person. And, at least Noirek is here exhibiting self-reflection and opening herself to opinions from others, of which she is brutally honest. Which is more than we can say for a lot of people.

[understand50]

This is the most amazing thread I've ever read. I hope I can become as admired as Noirek. Wow. All I need to do is get married, cheat on my wife, then continue to have contact with my AP in total disregard for my wife's feelings, and I can be a star on this site too!

 

Noirek has admitted that she did a bad thing. She is working on putting it right, all the time writing about her deepest issues, and wondering if she is "good" enough to do this. She has struggled, and has let us look at her struggling.

 

She got more guts than most.

 

If LoveShack is to be more then just a place to cast aspersions, and tell people how bad they are, we must admit, that people can change. Noirek is letting us look at her journey. I hope we all acknowledge that this a privilege, as it is when everyone who show us the dark side of their relationships. This has to to be one of the worst times in their life. We should all hope for the best outcome for her, her husband and her family, as we should for everyone who comes here. We need to not forget, this is a real person's life we are talking about.

 

As a group, we need the voices of all. The reformed and reconciled wondering spouse, the divorced wondering spouse, the accepting and reconciled betrayed spouse, and the divorced betrayed spouse. Each has their take and should be heard.

 

I wish Noirek luck.

[Hope Shimmers]

Noirek has admitted that she did a bad thing. She is working on putting it right, all the time writing about her deepest issues, and wondering if she is "good" enough to do this. She has struggled, and has let us look at her struggling.

 

She got more guts than most.

 

If LoveShack is to be more then just a place to cast aspersions, and tell people how bad they are, we must admit, that people can change. Noirek is letting us look at her journey. I hope we all acknowledge that this a privilege, as it is when everyone who show us the dark side of their relationships. This has to to be one of the worst times in their life. We should all hope for the best outcome for her, her husband and her family, as we should for everyone who comes here. We need to not forget, this is a real person's life we are talking about.

 

As a group, we need the voices of all. The reformed and reconciled wondering spouse, the divorced wondering spouse, the accepting and reconciled betrayed spouse, and the divorced betrayed spouse. Each has their take and should be heard.

 

I wish Noirek luck.

 

This is a fantastic post.

 

I too think that she has more courage than most. Some of the people who are judging her do not have the same kind of courage to look at themselves with so much introspect and delve into the issues that make them "not perfect" - especially as she is doing so with all of us here to see, all the while knowing that many will only cast stones.

 

Hang in there Noirek.

[Cephalopod]

So you all just expect everyone to agree with you?

 

Well I don't.

 

If she had courage she would stop talking to her OM. It takes courage to do the right thing sometimes. This is the worst time of their lives because she refuses to do what is right.

 

If she had true courage she would put aside her needs, divorce her husband, whether he wanted the divorce or not, so that he can be set free and find someone who will respect and truly love him. She can then stay single and enjoy the poly lifestyle to her hearts content. She is putting that burden on him however, almost like she is daring him to divorce her, because frankly she doesn't have the will power and decency to do so herself.

 

You all see progress and forward movement. I just don't see it. She is exhibiting the same selfish behavior now as she was at the beginning.

 

You are all concentrating on her. I only care about what this is doing to her husband.

Edited June 21, 2015 by Cephalopod

[Hope Shimmers]

So you all just expect everyone to agree with you?

 

Well I don't.

 

If she had courage she would stop talking to her OM. It takes courage to do the right thing sometimes. This is the worst time of their lives because she refuses to do what is right.

 

If she had true courage she would put aside her needs, divorce her husband, whether he wanted the divorce or not, so that he can be set free and find someone who will respect and truly love him. She can then stay single and enjoy the poly lifestyle to her hearts content. She is putting that burden on him however, almost like she is daring him to divorce her, because frankly she doesn't have the will power and decency to do so herself.

 

You all see progress and forward movement. I just don't see it. She is exhibiting the same selfish behavior now as she was at the beginning.

 

You are all concentrating on her. I only care about what this is doing to her husband.

 

Yes, we are all concentrating on her, because she is the one posting. That's how it works here. You have no idea of her situation and you are just generalizing, and it is not fair.

 

I have read your posts. I'm sorry for your brother. But your coming on here and attacking this particular poster is just projection.

[Confused48]

Hope and Ceph,

 

You both make good points. Ceph, it seems obvious to me that Noirek should cut off contact with the OM or leave her H. clearly the only decent thing to do. That being said, I appreciate her posting about her failure in order to give us the perspective of that situation.

 

Ceph you go to far though saying you know what is best for her H. Noirek herself should not make that assumption, much less strangers on the internet.

 

Both of you should keep Norirek and her BH in mind. Hope, you of course have more in common with the OP, being a fOW. You don't know what it is like to be a BS but that doesn't mean we shouldn't consider him when talking to the OP. Ceph, if we just focus on the BS we won't have any WS here, getting help, and helping us.

[Cephalopod]

I'm a former BH, so I naturally side on the betrayed. But point taken.

 

This has nothing to do with my deceased brother. His WW is paying dearly for what she did. I don't wish that on Noirek. I really don't, that's why I want to do what I can to encourage her to stop. I see her side, I understand she has issues, but she also has a husband who is waiting for her to step up and consider his needs. The only end game she sees right now is possible divorce. She needs to understand that this is about the loss of so much more. She will lose far more than her husband and marriage.

[Noirek]

Thank you from those who offer encouragement.

 

And in case anyone missed it I have been NC for nearly 3 weeks.

[aliveagain]

I promised myself that I would not post on your thread again, your "I'm evil" and therefor can do whatever I want selfish cheater in a fog don't give a sh*t how my husband feels because I am totally going to self destruct and take everyone down with me attitude was a little hard to take.

 

Having said that, 3 weeks shows a change and deserves encouragement so what better day than Fathers Day should a former betrayed father break his promise to himself and give encouragement to someone who I hope is a former wayward wife. Way to go Noirek, and I mean that sincerely, your worth it.