The "damsel in distress": Do men like assisting women?

[alphamale]

An example of one of the "inane" type of things I might ask for is if a coworker is standing doing work right next to the trash can, and I have something to throw away, I might hand it out to him and ask if he will throw it away.

 

It's not that I can't throw it away myself but I don't wanna brush my hand past his crotch or ask him to move out of the way entirely, so I ask him a favor to just toss the item into the trash while he's there.

 

That's why I put in the original post that it's the kind of thing that takes 2 seconds and a simple lift of the arm. Sure, it's super inane to ask someone to throw something away for me, but given the alternatives (crotch brushing) I think it's the best choice, and I don't think it's princessy.

surely you have more than one trash can in the office

[Phoe]

surely you have more than one trash can in the office

 

Honestly, more often than not, I will walk all the way to the other side of the building to use that trash can, rather than the one that is 5 feet away from me, because there's someone standing right in front of the trash can using it, and I start to feel bad if I am asking too often.

 

Every now and then I don't feel like walking all that way and will ask "hey, can you toss this in the trash can for me?" but probably 75% of the time I will just walk to the other one.

 

When I had a torn ligament in my ankle it definitely did make a difference though, having to go to the other trash can.

[Frank2thepoint]

This is offensive and I don't agree. "Most of the strong women harp"? Where did you get that? ALL my female friends are strong women and I have never heard anyone harp ever.

 

A strong and independent woman can want a boyfriend besides needing him to help her. As I already pointed out, as a woman, I need a man not because I am looking for a plumber or something, but because I want love, companionship, good moments and memories to look back on, someone to share my experiences and adventures and definitely someone to have great sex with!

 

I'm expressing my experiences with women I've met, had a conversation with, and the women I've dated. A lot of strong, independent women will advertise they are such, but rarely ever admit to wanting love, companionship, good moments, and memories because that would expose their vulnerability, and maybe they think it wouldn't make them look strong and independent. I understand it offends you, but it offends me more as a man when I hear these things, without the woman revealing her vulnerable side. That's what the harping is. Where would a man fit into a woman's life if she didn't express her desire for companionship? How would a man even try to start an emotional connection with such a woman?

 

I don't need a man but I want one. Why should I need one? "Need" implies that I am incapable of surviving alone, which is insulting.

 

Semantics by gender. Men need a woman, while women want a man.

[Phoe]

I'm expressing my experiences with women I've met, had a conversation with, and the women I've dated. A lot of strong, independent women will advertise they are such, but rarely ever admit to wanting love, companionship, good moments, and memories because that would expose their vulnerability, and maybe they think it wouldn't make them look strong and independent. I understand it offends you, but it offends me more as a man when I hear these things, without the woman revealing her vulnerable side. That's what the harping is. Where would a man fit into a woman's life if she didn't express her desire for companionship? How would a man even try to start an emotional connection with such a woman?

 

 

 

Semantics by gender. Men need a woman, while women want a man.

 

One particular word stuck out to me: Vulnerability.

 

And one thing I can definitely say, is that while I may be physically strong and may be handy and totally capable and skilled, I still show vulnerability to others.

 

There big difference is the emotion that's behind it. While I may be able to handle mounting a TV on a wall by myself, there's still an emotion within me that is grateful when someone does offer me help. There's an emotion in me that makes me able to totally admit it when I just cannot do something.

 

Sure, I might be stubborn sometimes due to my own personal expectations, and will try my absolute best at something before giving up. I'm simply determined! And sure, sometimes I won't ask for help when I need it simply due to feeling bad, like I'm irritating someone or being inconvenient...

 

but when that help is given, I am grateful, and humble.

[Shepp]

Honestly, more often than not, I will walk all the way to the other side of the building to use that trash can, rather than the one that is 5 feet away from me, because there's someone standing right in front of the trash can using it, and I start to feel bad if I am asking too often.

 

Every now and then I don't feel like walking all that way and will ask "hey, can you toss this in the trash can for me?" but probably 75% of the time I will just walk to the other one.

 

When I had a torn ligament in my ankle it definitely did make a difference though, having to go to the other trash can.

 

 

Sorry I think that is beyond ridiculous! Where on earth do you work?

Man or women I wouldn't think twice about a quick "do me a favour mate" like that! ....In fact where I work i'd probably be more like "arghhh, why are you always in the way ;)" nowhere near as polite as you were!

 

 

Literally don't waste your time on idiots like that!

That's nothing to do with assisting a women, their just jerks.

[Els]

IMO most of the discussion seems to pigeonhole things into two extremes, neither of which is healthy, and which might be contributing to some of the confusion.

 

Let's flip this around in terms of stereotypical gender roles for a second, and talk about cooking. I think it's safe to say that most of us aren't attracted to men who are completely helpless in the kitchen and unable to fix even the simplest of meals for themselves, or men who feel entitled to being cooked for 100% of the time.

 

But on the other hand, if you feel like treating your SO to a nice home-cooked meal, and you go ahead and do it, what sort of response would you prefer? Probably something like "Thanks, that was a lovely meal." Not so much "Why did you do this?! Are you assuming that I can't cook for myself just because I'm male?! How sexist!" The latter sure as **** wouldn't make me think "Wow, what a strong and independent man!"

 

Fortunately the choice isn't just between these two extremes. Same goes for men doing things for the women they love.

[regine_phalange]

Some men are very happy when they offer assistance, either physically either with their resources. I don't think it's always a romantic gesture, but they feel happy because these moments they feel more connected with their masculine nature.

 

Some examples:

 

I remember once I was in a foreign country carrying this enormous suitcase and the escalators were out of function. I was trying to carry it to the top of stairs until this stranger offered to help. He wasn't much taller or bigger than me but he lifted it nevertheless. I said "thank you, you are a real gentleman" and I could see that what I said made him happy, his eyes sparkled. "Glad to help" he said.

 

I also see it from my brother. When he knows that I want something I can't afford at the moment he buys it for me as a gift and I can see that he feels very proud of himself and very happy.

 

I also had a boyfriend who wanted to give me lifts all the time. Sometimes he even drove me when I was somewhere without him if it was raining or if I was sick. Without me asking him to do so. Sometimes he went out of the way and drove 20 km back and forth. And when I told him that it's very lovely and rare that someone does this, he replied to me "many women don't even say thank you. You, on the other hand, always thank me and say something nice about me, even though it's the 100th time I bring you home. And I like that".

[Phoe]

he replied to me "many women don't even say thank you. You, on the other hand, always thank me and say something nice about me, even though it's the 100th time I bring you home. And I like that".

 

See this makes me so sad. I can't imagine how any person could not say thank you when someone does something for them. It's beyond my comprehension how some can be so selfish and unappreciative.

[Frank2thepoint]

See this makes me so sad. I can't imagine how any person could not say thank you when someone does something for them. It's beyond my comprehension how some can be so selfish and unappreciative.

 

Simple gratitude is slowly dying off and soon will be an obsolete entry in dictionaries and phrasebooks, with a sidenote "no longer used".

[Phoe]

Simple gratitude is slowly dying off and soon will be an obsolete entry in dictionaries and phrasebooks, with a sidenote "no longer used".

 

Well, one thing I can guarantee is that I will always have gratitude, and if I have children, I will teach them gratitude too!

[regine_phalange]

See this makes me so sad. I can't imagine how any person could not say thank you when someone does something for them. It's beyond my comprehension how some can be so selfish and unappreciative.

 

The first couple of times they may say it. But after that they somehow take it as a given that the man will drive them and they don't acknowledge the gesture. It's like when a man expects a woman to cook because, well, she's a woman and that's what women do (I copied elswyth in that one ).

[Emilia]

An example of one of the "inane" type of things I might ask for is if a coworker is standing doing work right next to the trash can, and I have something to throw away, I might hand it out to him and ask if he will throw it away.

 

It's not that I can't throw it away myself but I don't wanna brush my hand past his crotch or ask him to move out of the way entirely, so I ask him a favor to just toss the item into the trash while he's there.

 

That's why I put in the original post that it's the kind of thing that takes 2 seconds and a simple lift of the arm. Sure, it's super inane to ask someone to throw something away for me, but given the alternatives (crotch brushing) I think it's the best choice, and I don't think it's princessy.

When a colleague of mine is by the kitchen bin, I put my hand lightly on his or her shoulder and say 'excuse me please'. They move slightly - if they don't know what I want to do I mention the bin - and I throw away what I need.

 

Sometimes I think the misunderstanding you have with men lies in social interaction.

[Emilia]

IMO most of the discussion seems to pigeonhole things into two extremes, neither of which is healthy, and which might be contributing to some of the confusion.

 

Let's flip this around in terms of stereotypical gender roles for a second, and talk about cooking. I think it's safe to say that most of us aren't attracted to men who are completely helpless in the kitchen and unable to fix even the simplest of meals for themselves, or men who feel entitled to being cooked for 100% of the time.

 

But on the other hand, if you feel like treating your SO to a nice home-cooked meal, and you go ahead and do it, what sort of response would you prefer? Probably something like "Thanks, that was a lovely meal." Not so much "Why did you do this?! Are you assuming that I can't cook for myself just because I'm male?! How sexist!" The latter sure as **** wouldn't make me think "Wow, what a strong and independent man!"

 

Fortunately the choice isn't just between these two extremes. Same goes for men doing things for the women they love.

I assume your post was directed at me for example but not quoting my post. For the record, this is a public forum where people are allowed to have different views without them being called unhealthy. My views are different from yours because I am not submissive when it comes to men. I'm pretty sure I am allowed to hold that view.

 

Now back to the point, your analogy is not correct since we are not talking about doing something for people in a relationship.

 

A more appropriate analogy would be cooking for a male colleague without his asking for it and then indeed it could be an appropriate response on his part to protest about crossing boundaries.

 

So just to be back to the original post which is NOT about behaving in relationships.

[PinkInTheLimo]

A lot of strong, independent women will advertise they are such, but rarely ever admit to wanting love, companionship, good moments, and memories because that would expose their vulnerability, and maybe they think it wouldn't make them look strong and independent.

 

Before I show my vulnerability I want to get an idea of how reliable a guy is. I am not immediately going to show him the deepest of my emotions and I guess a lot of strong, independent women feel the same after having trusted too often guys on who we could not count.

 

For the rest I think it is only obvious to thank someone if they do something for you. But I am not going to repeat constantly how great a guy is just because he held a door open for me or treated me to a drink. Ego stroking and building up self-confidence is not my job.

 

There some things I am not good at that I hope my future man will be good at: driving a car or fixing something in the house (even though in my case it is less not knowing how to do certain things than not wanting to do them). But I would only accept that my partner does these things if he is actually good at them. If he is a bad dangerous driver or makes a mess of practical things, the relationship would not last long. I have little respect for incompetent guys.

[PinkInTheLimo]

It's the male version of making a woman feel like a queen and many women like being treated like a queen. Everybody likes being praised by their partners really.

 

Of course we all like to be praised by our partners. But there's got to be something to be praised...

I have no problem to acknowledge that someone is good at something, has really helped me... absolutely not. But he has to have helped me and not have made a mess.

 

I have not yet met a lot of guys who made my life easier instead of miserable and difficult...

[Woggle]

Of course we all like to be praised by our partners. But there's got to be something to be praised...

I have no problem to acknowledge that someone is good at something, has really helped me... absolutely not. But he has to have helped me and not have made a mess.

 

I have not yet met a lot of guys who made my life easier instead of miserable and difficult...

 

If somebody makes you miserable than you shouldn't be with them in the first place. In my world if a woman qualifies for me to want a relationship with her than by default she is worthy of praise. It's a good way to treat your mate. If your mate can't be the one welcoming and friendly spot in this messed up world then why be with them?

[PinkInTheLimo]

If somebody makes you miserable than you shouldn't be with them in the first place. In my world if a woman qualifies for me to want a relationship with her than by default she is worthy of praise. It's a good way to treat your mate. If your mate can't be the one welcoming and friendly spot in this messed up world then why be with them?

 

Why do you think I am single ?

[hotpotato]

Of course we all like to be praised by our partners. But there's got to be something to be praised...

I have no problem to acknowledge that someone is good at something, has really helped me... absolutely not. But he has to have helped me and not have made a mess.

 

I have not yet met a lot of guys who made my life easier instead of miserable and difficult...

 

Lolz me, too. Thats why im single. Ive been the pillar of the relationships in the past (read: a lot of work for me). I think some guys bail because we both know he wont be adding much to my life. I can match or outshine many average men. A man would have to be very very exceptional. I tried praising the last ex a lot, but maybe it came across as forced. I think it best when a woman has a genuine need for a man then she comes with the praise, doing nice things, asking for help, etc.

 

Some women have that vulnerability which makes them attractive to men whether in a relationship or not. They just 'got it.'

[SycamoreCircle]

I feel like the modern world has been stratified in such a way that a woman really only has need for the man she chooses. So, for instance, last week when sexy...bubble-lipped...married Dominique asked me if I could open a bottle for her, I obliged but I didn't stick around for thank yous or any kind of sentiment. And I made sure that I performed the task efficiently, dutifully and monastically. That's it.

[blackcat777]

When I started reading about the masculine/feminine balance in great detail, I decided to go for a "90 day no pants challenge." As in, I literally did not wear pants (skirts! had the most fun time revamping my wardrobe EVER!), and I literally did not make any decisions. It was a fashion and philosophy experiment. My answer was, "I can't answer that, I don't wear the pants!"

 

It sounds funny and I say this a bit tongue in cheek, but in taking that much time to observe my own thought processes... where I unconsciously reach out to control a situation, especially in going ahead and DOING something, asking or demanding, rather than chilling the F out and letting my man do it when he's ready... The whole experiment provoked some lasting changes in my relationship for the better, changes in my confidence and perspective for the better.

 

There are women who "know" how to make men do things in a superficial and manipulative way, and I don't see how that behavior brings any lasting happiness. The key is GRATITUDE and appreciation.

 

I think the whole "man as provider" idea comes from our biology having evolved through hunter/gatherer days, and there is some sense in respecting a balance that is natural to our biology.

 

I defer to my boyfriend to make decisions. He loves it. There's nothing hotter than watching him grab the car keys and tell me he's driving because he's the man. It's fun to let him lead.

 

I read somewhere that "women need to feel good to do good, and men need to do good to feel good." I've read a lot that the decision process for men carries more weight and importance than it does for women, and a man needs that trust from a woman to feel his best. (The caveat is that women retain veto power, saying no to what doesn't feel good, is dangerous or immoral.)

 

And, just because women CHOOSE to allow their man to lead, does not mean they lack in value, intelligence, independence, or power. It just makes no sense to keep two people in the driver's seat, so to speak. The ride will be much nicer if one person drives, and if the other person makes sure the radio is playing good music.

 

The dynamic of a man taking the lead is only a bad thing if either partner lacks in a strong sense of self-confidence or worth. Just because my boyfriend leads doesn't mean I'm helpless, don't have my own life, or don't have things to add to his life. I know he can be my man based upon the continuous good decisions he makes. I love watching him in action... and I know he loves a challenge.

 

It's okay to set your lover up for victory. Hello, red hot victory sex.

[Phoe]

In response to the "not wearing the pants" bit that drifter talked about - I couldn't imagine trying to do that! It would be fully impossible.

 

I am a natural leader. Not in an "I'm the boss, I wear the pants!" type of way, but moreso in a way where gradually, over time, I gain respect, show that I am trustworthy, show that I am intelligent and good at making decisions, and am logical, rational, and levelheaded under pressure.

 

Back in school, I was always put into leadership roles, and now at work, I am put into leadership roles. My manager once told me that I am one of only a handful of people that he relies on fully, trusts implicitly, and he values my insight and my ability to handle any issue that's thrown at me. My coworkers respect me, and ask my opinion regularly. I naturally lead, not in a way where I would be barking order left and right, but in a way where people come to me when they need direction. Even today, someone came to me and said "There are only 3 people who I trust in this building. The manager, the supervisor, and you." and then he proceeded to ask my opinion on an issue.

 

I do happen to work in a male dominated field, so most of my coworkers are men. I rarely sense that people are leery of me being a female in my position, I mostly get "Hey, you're a chick who handles her own, and it's pretty darn awesome, good for you!"

[mammasita]

Again, I relate. I really think we're sistahs from anotha motha lol.

 

I once emasculated my ex husband by putting together an entertainment center by myself because he was taking too long. I grabbed the tools from him and did it myself. I'm a leader at work and always have been in male centric fields. Oooooh he was pissssed at me for a couple days and I didn't know why. I was young though, about 24 and just newly pregnant with my son. I had NO idea what I was doing to his ego.

 

The point is, you don't have to be the damsel in distress, but try to find a good balance between being you, channeling that inner vixen (watch the millionaire matchmaker!!!!) and letting a man be a man.

[PinkInTheLimo]

Lolz me, too. Thats why im single. Ive been the pillar of the relationships in the past (read: a lot of work for me). I think some guys bail because we both know he wont be adding much to my life. I can match or outshine many average men. A man would have to be very very exceptional. I tried praising the last ex a lot, but maybe it came across as forced. I think it best when a woman has a genuine need for a man then she comes with the praise, doing nice things, asking for help, etc.

 

Some women have that vulnerability which makes them attractive to men whether in a relationship or not. They just 'got it.'

 

I once went to a matrimonial agency and the lady there told me that it was easier to couple average people: average looks, average intelligence, average career.

Most difficult to couple are the very succesful women and the totally unsuccesful men. Unfortunately these two groups are also not interested in each other.

 

It took me a long time to understand this but it's been difficult for me to find a relationship because I am not average. I don't feel better than other people but I have a higher than average intelligence, a stronger than average character and I am also more sensitive than average. The result is that I have certainly also achieved more than an average woman.

But when it comes to relationships, as you say it very well I outshine a lot of guys. I am smarter, have a better career, am better organised, have higher standards and values. And I can't hide it and I also don't want to hide it.

I've often noticed in dating that I generated jealousy in guys just by being who I was.

 

A lot of better than average guys have no problem marrying an average woman. Better than average women on the contrary have a problem with that.

[hotpotato]

In response to the "not wearing the pants" bit that drifter talked about - I couldn't imagine trying to do that! It would be fully impossible.

 

I am a natural leader. Not in an "I'm the boss, I wear the pants!" type of way, but moreso in a way where gradually, over time, I gain respect, show that I am trustworthy, show that I am intelligent and good at making decisions, and am logical, rational, and levelheaded under pressure.

 

Back in school, I was always put into leadership roles, and now at work, I am put into leadership roles. My manager once told me that I am one of only a handful of people that he relies on fully, trusts implicitly, and he values my insight and my ability to handle any issue that's thrown at me. My coworkers respect me, and ask my opinion regularly. I naturally lead, not in a way where I would be barking order left and right, but in a way where people come to me when they need direction. Even today, someone came to me and said "There are only 3 people who I trust in this building. The manager, the supervisor, and you." and then he proceeded to ask my opinion on an issue.

 

I do happen to work in a male dominated field, so most of my coworkers are men. I rarely sense that people are leery of me being a female in my position, I mostly get "Hey, you're a chick who handles her own, and it's pretty darn awesome, good for you!"

 

Yes, they are fine with it because they are not dating you. There are many things a man can like or respect in a woman that dont make her sexually or romantically appealing.

[Starship]

Lolz me, too. Thats why im single. Ive been the pillar of the relationships in the past (read: a lot of work for me). I think some guys bail because we both know he wont be adding much to my life. I can match or outshine many average men. A man would have to be very very exceptional. I tried praising the last ex a lot, but maybe it came across as forced. I think it best when a woman has a genuine need for a man then she comes with the praise, doing nice things, asking for help, etc.

 

Some women have that vulnerability which makes them attractive to men whether in a relationship or not. They just 'got it.'

 

True.

 

It would take me 30 seconds 'to get a man'. Put on a dress, heels, hair down and stand in the Walmart parking lot with the hood of my car up. When we used to wear a more distinct nurse's uniform it would have taken me 15 seconds (also helped I was 30 years younger)

 

I don't want 'a man'...but a certain type of man...like my partner.

 

The sexes are always looking for opportunities to meet each other. These forums are full of 'how do I meet...' The damsel in distress is just another window of opportunity for a man and woman to meet, interact, assess each other as a potential mate. Society had made it acceptable for a man to approach a strange woman who needs help. In contrast...if I was just walking to my car...usually not appropriate to approach me.

 

Men can talk to me in a check out line...ask me to dance at a dance...chat over a beer after playing coed sports...otherwise, not a lot of windows of opportunity. The damsel is distress is just one more option.