Can't take the fakeness of OLD

[Eternal Sunshine]

Please do not take this as an attack.

 

 

I see avatars of average two women on LS. Phoe, and Jen followed by some numbers but I do not remember them now.

 

 

Now these are not full body shots though what I see are two pretty smiles that are inviting, appear to dress youthful, same with their hair styles.

 

 

Your avatar you appear average which is no sin for I am average as well. Though what hurts you is that your smile is lacking, hair and dress appear matronly.

 

 

Men are visual. We have to like what we see before we will approach a woman.

 

 

Next is that you refuse to settle. I have asked why must the man have a college degree. You have yet to answer that.

 

 

I know of many people that went to college and have low paying jobs and many men that never went to college and have well paying jobs and some even own their own business.

 

 

You are unrealistic picky trying to pull in a man much higher rated then you can. To be picky at 18 is one thing. To be as picky as the years roll by does not make sense.

 

 

You even know that as the years go by the pickings only get slimmer.

 

 

You need IC to see why it is that you hold out for the unobtainable.

 

 

In automobile terms you chose to walk because you can't afford a Cadillac and refuse to have a Chevrolet.

 

Not offended at all. As I have gotten older, I realized that looks don't have much to do with anything. Everyone should try to look their best but still reflect their personality in their style (which I do) and that's all we can do there.

[Eternal Sunshine]

You're right here, I'm not emotional and if a graduate student acts like he doesn't have their sh*t together, I don't really have patience, I fire them. With me is just do your f*cking job and spare me the drama. I wouldn't be able to deal with a neurotic partner at all. I leave so fast you wouldn't know what happened. My ex-husband was neurotic and after 20 years with him, I have zero tolerance to that.

 

Can you fire graduate students in US? In Aussie, it's unheard of - we are pretty much stuck with them.

[BluEyeL]

You need IC to see why it is that you hold out for the unobtainable.

 

 

In automobile terms you chose to walk because you can't afford a Cadillac and refuse to have a Chevrolet.

 

In fact this way of thinking is more common than I thought among women. I used to have one friend who spelled it out very clearly for me. We were both 40yo and she said that at our age and the way we look (we both look fine, average, not stunning) we cannot get the very good looking men (they are younger than us for one) and therefore, she chose not to date at all. If she can't have the super attractive movie star, who is also highly educate and smarter than her (she's also a Ph.D. in Computer Science and extremely smart), she'd rather have nobody. Her proposal was that her and I just live together for support into the old age, like the Golden Girls.

 

The reason we're estranged now is because I started to date at 41 and she didn't take that well. I do have another one (also estranged at this point, but only after I found my boyfriend) who has a similar theory, only spun a bit differently: late 30s and 40s available men are broken. The good ones are snatched up early and no woman would let them go so the divorced ones are the ones discarded by women because they're no good. The never married ones are also no good, or someone else would have already taken them. Therefore, there are no good men left for us. We should either look for widowers (tiny fraction) or give up. She's dating a married man (a long distance affair).

 

These are limiting beliefs that women put in the way of having a relationship. They stem from fear and also probably their needs wouldn't be fulfilled by a realistic relationship, so putting the standards at a fantasy level would ensure they continue to stay alone. People are trying to meet their basic needs. Since they don't believe that a man who is not at the highest standard would meet their needs of, maybe, sexual attraction, feeling proud showing him off etc. they are not willing to give back what one needs to give back in a relationship.

 

It is also very common to say, like my first friend above, "see, among all the married couples I know, I don't want any of their husbands". If you convince yourself that all the marriages you see aren't fullfiling and people "settled", it makes you feel better about your own choice, which suddenly becomes more noble and pure, more honest and self-sacrificing in the name of truth. In fact, it is a coping mechanism. And anyway, many many people put others down to lift themselves up so this is no different.

[Taramere]

That being said, I think it's putting he cart before the horse to specify that you will ONLY date people with a certain level of education. Wanting someone who you connect with and who you share similar values with is very important, and chances are good that they will end up with a similar educational background as you. But not necessarily.

 

Agreed. I've encountered plenty of people who would have been more than capable of getting a degree, but who focused on other things. However, I sympathise with ES's feelings about some people who haven't got a degree really devaluing education.

 

As I recall, ES is gifted in an academic area that many people really struggle with, and that's her career. So of course that's one of the big pluses about ES, and one of the things that she's way, way above "average" in. And she wants a man who's likely to place high value on that aspect of her...as well she should.

[BluEyeL]

Can you fire graduate students in US? In Aussie, it's unheard of - we are pretty much stuck with them.

 

Yeah, you can. You can give them unsatisfactory for research and if they get two Us they are expelled from the program. Or, you can tell them you don't want to be their advisor anymore and they also get mad and leave. I didn't have to give them two U's, I gave one to a girl recently. And if I gave them one, they get mad and they leave on their own. So I do "encourage" them to go away. I have another one in the works. I can't deal with him. He doesn't have funding and he has to TA, he is mad about it and in general very entitled, rude and he thinks he's the center of the universe. We'll pull the funding completely, even the TA, and since he threatened to leave, I'll encourage him to leave, since he doesn't seem to be happy anyway.

 

So yeah, there are mechanisms. If you pull the funding in general they have to leave. Or you can fail them on the exams.

[Imajerk17]

A few more random thoughts.

 

1. Everyone is to some extent, "broken". We all have baggage, blind spots, mistakes, ect. I think it's really more about our self-awareness and our drive to become better people.

 

2. As far as "no good ones left", I don't agree with it. There are plenty of great men and women in their 30s and 40s who want to meet someone awesome to settle down with. Given the luck of the draw with finding someone, relationships working out or not, focusing on career, being late social bloomers ect, that someone who'd make a good husband or wife could still be single at 35 or 40 isn't hard to believe at all.

 

3. I don't think there is anything wrong with insisting on only communicating with guys who e.g., are intelligent and who can appreciate intelligence in a woman. In fact, I think both ES and KatZee who both have advanced degrees who save themselves a lot of energy if they insisted upon some career success in the men they pursue. That isn't unreasonable--my understanding is that MOST people online have at least a college degree.

 

4. What I find irritating about the *ahem* Whining Women on this thread is the not taking responsibility. About whether you are being proactive enough about making contact with the men who are more likely to be into you, and in your screening mechanisms. ES, you've met a 100 men, and not 100 random men but 100 *preselected* men. You weren't willing to give ANY of them a third date?? KatZee, have you at least tried writing men whose profiles interest you? This includes not just looks or an exciting lifestyle but things such as intelligence and similar values. Lowering your standards to include men whom you don't seem to have much in common isn't taking responsibility.

 

On that note, BlueEyeL is giving awesome advice. She approaches dating quite differently from most of the rest of the women here, and she is the one is a serious relationship. I am surprised you all aren't picking her brain more.

Edited April 16, 2015 by Imajerk17

[Mrlonelyone]

I can say the same thing as ES when it comes to people in their 30's and dating. This is true even while bisexual.

 

Most are married or practically married living together. The ones who aren't...

 

They don't want a committed relationship.

 

Too damaged to form a relationship due to past experiences (and in my case discomfort with their sexuality.)

 

They don't match a very short list of criteria. Education, stable direction in life (know what they want).

 

Yes I have to find them attractive.

 

 

With OLD, the problem is most of the people in their 30's there seem to be looking to hook up. If one is like me bisexual and gender not conforming in behavior...then I get married couples looking for a third person. :/

 

 

This is part of why I am open to dating people in their 20's. I am under 35 so it is not a nasty big age difference yet. I am biologically male and for me society will accept it a bit more. I just need a tomboyish woman who can accept a 5'10" 175lb strong but not afraid to wear a "pink" but actually blue track suit male.

 

is that too much to ask?

 

ES Have you ever considered dating guys in their 20's. Society cast a disapproving eye...but maybe they would be better for you?

[Rejected Rosebud]

We don't " struggle " to find good relationships.

 

We could have a good relationship. If we wanted to.

 

Sadly, the men who have WANTED relationships with us, have not been men we felt passionate about. If we succumbed to a relationship with these men, we would always wonder " what if " it felt as good as one of the men who evoked great passion.

 

The trouble is, we need intense chemistry. We need to be enamoured with each other

Are you speaking for yourself and the OP? Are you sure you two are completely alike to one another because from reading your posts all I can see alike is that you both live in the same country and are having struggles finding a good relationship.

[Anela]

Please do not take this as an attack.

 

 

I see avatars of average two women on LS. Phoe, and Jen followed by some numbers but I do not remember them now.

 

 

Now these are not full body shots though what I see are two pretty smiles that are inviting, appear to dress youthful, same with their hair styles.

 

 

I know you weren't attacking, so please don't take my response as one, either (or defensive). ES is usually smiling in her pictures, and she dresses well.

 

I smile at people, but I've been spoken to by men, several times lately, when I was absorbed in something. I had no idea that anyone else was around.

[jay1983]

I still can't grasp the 100 dates thing.

[Anela]

I agree with most of your posts and assertions but I have started doubting whether 2. is true. As always, it's down to compatibility, but I started to understand that a broken person will often more likely to 'get' what a relatively healthy one won't. So on the side note, don't write them off just yet. Of course that depends on your definition of broken too.

 

I made that mistake with the guy who ended up messing with my head (severely). I wasn't broken, and I thought that we were at the same level in that way. I was wrong: he was really messed up, and now, so am I. I walked right into what I'd been trying to avoid all along. Another mistake I made was not going "no contact". I don't usually cut people out of my life, so the self-esteem got chipped away, bit by bit. And then everything else that happened in my personal life, started up. I felt broken at that point, and hugely resentful of those who did their best to break me, as well as ashamed that I hadn't sorted my life out to the point where I wouldn't have been around for it to happen.

 

I had another guy, a few years younger than me, really trying to "woo" me. He had a girlfriend (a friend of mine), and she adored him, despite the fact that he was on social security for anxiety issues, was a regular drug user (and overdosed, twice!), parroted a lot of crap about women - the same sort of thing you see here - and wrote about polyamory, a few years before he admitted to his girlfriend that was the lifestyle he wanted. Somehow, despite knowing me and what I did and did not want, he tried to win me over. I have a romantic streak, and a very practical streak, and this guy ran into the practical one. The first guy had hit the romantic one, and I was reeling from that. This second guy was full of red flags - I couldn't see anything else. I ran from that, and he finally gave up a year ago (at least, I think he's given up). He, and a few others, felt like vultures to me, trying to take advantage of me when things were highly unstable.

 

I've had to remind myself of my good points, and that I do still have them. I gave up on the idea of dating, because another "broken" person would not work, and a healthier man might see me as loaded with red flags.

[BluEyeL]

A few more random thoughts.

 

 

On that note, BlueEyeL is giving awesome advice. She approaches dating quite differently from most of the rest of the women here, and she is the one is a serious relationship. I am surprised you all aren't picking her brain more.

 

Thanks IMJ, that's nice of you to say.

 

They are not picking my brain because they think I settled.

[Woggle]

ES has a very negative view of relationships and is very afraid of commitment. She has even admitted it on here and that is fine. Not saying that as an insult but if someone is like that own it instead of blaming the opposite sex. Two of the women posting in this thread outright admit they avoid relationships and there is nothing wrong with that but it doesn't say anything negative about the other gender.

[Anela]

ES has a very negative view of relationships and is very afraid of commitment. She has even admitted it on here and that is fine. Not saying that as an insult but if someone is like that own it instead of blaming the opposite sex. Two of the women posting in this thread outright admit they avoid relationships and there is nothing wrong with that but it doesn't say anything negative about the other gender.

 

Who is the other one? I've posted above as to why I've essentially given up. I had an extremely negative experience, and others in my childhood that involved men - I got past those, only to meet a man who dragged me down, and he exemplified the attitudes that I fight against here. He, and others, are out there doing damage, and I do place blame where it's deserved, just not on an entire gender.

[Woggle]

Who is the other one? I've posted above as to why I've essentially given up. I had an extremely negative experience, and others in my childhood that involved men - I got past those, only to meet a man who dragged me down, and he exemplified the attitudes that I fight against here. He, and others, are out there doing damage, and I do place blame where it's deserved, just not on an entire gender.

 

I don't like calling people out personally for the most part because it always comes across as an insult but the ones who has the most posts after the OP.

[Anela]

I don't like calling people out personally for the most part because it always comes across as an insult but the ones who has the most posts after the OP.

 

I wasn't sure if you were talking about me. I don't want you to call out anyone else.

[Woggle]

I wasn't sure if you were talking about me. I don't want you to call out anyone else.

 

It's not you.

[Sunfire73]

I am an OLD success too. I get what the OP is saying but its self defeating. You really won't get good results with a negative attitude. You just have to take a break, or mix it up with other social activities. Once you close your mind about it, it won't do any good. I approached OLD with an Open mind, and made sure to have fun along the way even if it resorts to nothing. The more I had experience it with the more I became good at it. I only met 20 guys, and found my bf after. We've been together almost 2 yrs now, and going stronger and talking about future plans now. He's not perfect and we both brought decent amount of baggage (we're both divorced with kids) but we looked past that just see if we are comfortable with each other, have the same goals, values and make each other a better person. It's the easiest relationship for me by far. Now, 2 of my friends have just started OLD and asking me some tips.

[xxoo]

Thanks IMJ, that's nice of you to say.

 

They are not picking my brain because they think I settled.

 

I think you won the jackpot!

[Weezy1973]

75 Percent Of Married People Settled, Lost Their ?True Love? [study]

 

I really don't think there are that many studies out there in respect of this issue. I quickly found this one though. Any studies would have to be at the anonymous individual level and not with couples together. I realize the divorce stats for couple in their 20s is worse than for couples in their 30s, but I don't necessarily believe its because the later group is happier. I think people make better long term decisions at that age but I also think for many, pragmatism takes over more than passionate love....for the reasons ES gave for example (basically less options + longer check-off lists compared to 20s). Off the top of my head I can think fo 4 friends who were settled for (imo) in their mid 30s. Two lost their houses and have to share custody of their child (within 3 yrs). Two are still together. None of them married. They were/are all in defacto relationships, so they probably wont figure up in the divorce stats. Just an example of how the stats may be not so B&W.

 

So first, obviously not exactly an academic journal that's doing the study....second the study is mis-reported. The study suggests that only 1 in 7 people feel they're not with "the love of their life."

 

One in seven not with the 'love of their life' - Telegraph

 

Same study. But relationships definitely are about compromise - if you're someone that sees compromising as "settling" perhaps being in a realtionship really isn't for you!

[RedRobin]

I just find that people that don't have at least a degree under-value education. They tend to make snarky comments about how education is useless. I have spent 10 years in school (post-high school) and I don't see how I can have much in common with someone that has such a different value system. I also don't care about money - beyond the point that I need a certain amount to live. I am not motivated by it. People that choose a career in research and academia didn't do so to make the most amount of money. So bussinessy people of the type "Joe the plumber never went to school and is earning million dollars" are missing the point. They seem to be unable to grasp any value system beyond material.

 

My fiancée never finished college and was one of the smartest, most curious persons I have ever met. My ex H had two degrees and was a huge snob. Heck, I have three degrees and people here accuse me of being an ass all the time, lol.

 

I say go for the seekers, the curious, and the passionate... Forget about the diploma. If they are secure in their abilities and life choices, they will not degrade education. They will love the seeking, curious, passionate part of you that chose your path to knowledge.

[ascendotum]

So first, obviously not exactly an academic journal that's doing the study....second the study is mis-reported. The study suggests that only 1 in 7 people feel they're not with "the love of their life."

 

One in seven not with the 'love of their life' - Telegraph

 

Same study. But relationships definitely are about compromise - if you're someone that sees compromising as "settling" perhaps being in a realtionship really isn't for you!

 

I agree the study is not from an academic journal, does not mean that its rubbish, but of course it would be better if we knew it was performed with people qualified in statistics. Seems it was performed on patrons at an opera festival, so likely a biased population sample. It does seem like the DM article is referring to the same study/survey. The DM article talks about 73% having to 'make do' with their partner and 49% would leave their partner to be with someone better. I could not find your (1/7) figure in the article, though it talks about 17% meeting the love of their life bit not being with them because they are married to someone else. If that's the figure you are referring too, then I still don't think that negates the other % quoted.

 

I totally agree compromise is not exclusively the same as settling, but I do consider it can be in some respects. It really depends on how the individual processes it in their mind. If there is any regret or anguish over compromising what they presumably would have ideally preferred in a partner then I think it can be considered the same. Compromising also doesn't necessarily mean you are with someone inferior or that they cannot bring immense joy to your life.

[Weezy1973]

I could not find your (1/7) figure in the article...

 

"One in seven adults is in a long term relationship with someone they do not class as 'the love of their life', a study has revealed.

 

The research found of those, 73 per cent have 'made do' with their partner because their 'true love' slipped through their fingers."

 

 

People actually tend to idealize their partners rather than be objective. Most people think their partner is "above average" in terms of attractiveness, which is statistically impossible!

Edited April 17, 2015 by Weezy1973

[ascendotum]

"One in seven adults is in a long term relationship with someone they do not class as 'the love of their life', a study has revealed.

 

The research found of those, 73 per cent have 'made do' with their partner because their 'true love' slipped through their fingers."

 

 

People actually tend to idealize their partners rather than be objective. Most people think their partner is "above average" in terms of attractiveness, which is statistically impossible!

 

lol. Yeah I started at the article heading this time. Very deceptive the way it was reported in the other article, plus even in the DM one they could reference it again in the body of the story that the %'s are based on a smaller subset of the population. cheers

[Leigh 87]

I totally agree with the study.

 

 

Most people aren't with a partner who they consider the love of their life.

 

 

Most men in relationships admit to me that they HAD infact, met women in their past who they DID feel more in love with than their current. But they just assumed that the deep " in love " feeling wasn't important, since it fades or does down significantly anyway. Yet they were never limerent or infatuated with their wife's. Not even at the beginning.