Can't take the fakeness of OLD

[jay1983]

Um, not quite sure what point you're trying to convey with this post. Of course physical attractiveness is par for the course with regard to dating and being attracted to someone enough to want to continue to date them.

 

What does that have to do with the OP's situation or how you think that there are plenty of "desirable men" and that's the sole reason for her difficulty in finding a normal, attractive and stable guy with which to enter into a relationship with?

 

 

.

 

You just repeated my question. It’s amazing the mental acrobatics some people will go through rather than just accept that these guys have other options.

Edited April 9, 2015 by jay1983

[Weezy1973]

I am not sure I even buy unavailable men theory. Generally, men that are desirable (combination of looks, intellegince, social charisma etc) have a lot of options thus are either never single or super picky. They can get casual sex with number of women too, so are less likely to want to commit.

 

We are attracted to what's attractive; it's all far less subjective than people think. What we want, others want too. I think all this "unavailable men", "commitment phobia" c$%^ is just over-analysing where the truth is far more simple.

 

But I find it interesting that what you list as desirable (looks, intelligence and social charisma) literally has nothing to do with how good somebody would be in a relationship. Relationship type qualities like effective conflict resolution skills, empathy, reliability, dependability, an ability to compromise etc. don't reveal themselves right away. It takes time.

 

But, as you yourself say, you're not attracted to those qualities - what you find desirable is looks, intelligence and social charisma.

[Weezy1973]

I guess this is my issue and why no guy wants to date me.

 

I guess guys think I'm "exhausting." :/

 

I'm not "somewhat successful." I am successful.

 

I don't have a "decent job." I have a career.

 

I am smart, with a BA/MA and extra class credits from NYU.

 

General rule - like attracts like. If education and career are important to you, you will likely have more luck with men that are education and career oriented as well. And if this is the case:

 

It's rare I ever find someone on par with me with OLD. I've gone on dates with dudes who had "High school" listed as their level of education completed.

 

...you need to stop OLD or at least fix your parameters to men that you'll have more in common with. No woman or man ever is single because they're so awesome that they're intimidating.

[KatZee]

...you need to stop OLD or at least fix your parameters to men that you'll have more in common with. No woman or man ever is single because they're so awesome that they're intimidating.

 

Yeah, I'm about ready to get off this carnival ride. I have one more date Friday and then I'm done.

[40 Fonzarelli]

Couldn't disagree with this more. Starting out as a platonic friend first and then becoming something more may work in the movies and TV shows. But in real life, if a woman is friends with you, it's because she isn't attracted to you.

 

If you want to have romantic success with women, you need to make your intentions known ASAP, and ask her out. Then if you two become an item and things develop well over time, you can eventually transition into being friends as well. But starting out as "friends first" is a recipe for disappointment in my opinion. I actually advise women that I talk to, against putting that on their profile. What they really mean is that they want to take things slow and keep sex off the table for a bit. But they still want to find romance. So if they encourage a guy to act like a "friend" they won't feel any attraction to him.

 

When I say friends I still mean in a flirty way. Something strictly platonic with no mutual attraction obviously is not going to go anywhere. Some people prefer to connect on a personality level and the attraction can build off of that. Others start with attraction. I prefer the former.

[Moy]

I've just deleted my POF profile. Two years and NO dates. I've just turned 41 (been using OLD since I was 39) and in those two years the only messages or replies that I have received have been from people who are either moribidly obese or well into their 50s.

 

That's me in my avatar, yet OLD has cruelly shown me what my 'standard' is: 250lbs and approaching 60.

 

I did some googling and it's a widespread phenomenon. Men have no chance, we've been priced out of the game by ridiculously over-inflated standards.

 

Rant over. At least I now know that smashing it in the gym to get in shape (ironically, to combat negative trolling feedback from women on POF) can't even get interest from anybody less than 10 years older than me or 100lbs overweight. The thing is, just because I'm in shape it doesn't mean that I expect an 'athletic' partner, just somebody who hasn't completely let themselves go.

 

 

Two years. No dates. I've actually forgotten what a peck on the cheek, holding hands or even laughing and having a conversation with a woman face-to-face feels like. I give up.

Edited April 20, 2015 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[fitnessfan365]

^^^

 

That sucks man! Sorry to hear it. But to echo what you said, POF SUCKS! Complete waste of time. So you're definitely not alone there. With that said, if that's what your judging your online dating experiences on, you should try other sites.

 

I've met plenty on Match and OK Cupid. It's funny because my GF technically met me on both. She wrote me an email on OKC. But I wasn't really feeling her profile, so I didn't respond. Then a few weeks later, she viewed me on Match but didn't write. Liked her Match profile better, and she had a few new pics up. So I wrote her and referenced seeing her on both sites joking that her combination of persistence and hard to get had got my attention. She wrote back and on the next email I sent I asked for her number and got it.

Edited April 9, 2015 by fitnessfan365

[Moy]

^^^

 

That sucks man! Sorry to hear it. But to echo what you said, POF SUCKS! Complete waste of time. So you're definitely not alone there. With that said, if that's what your judging your online dating experiences on, you should try other sites.

 

I've met plenty on Match and OK Cupid. It's funny because my GF technically met me on both. She wrote me an email on OKC. But I wasn't really feeling her profile, so I didn't respond. Then a few weeks later, she viewed me on Match but didn't write. Liked her Match profile better, and she had a few new pics up. So I wrote her and referenced seeing her on both sites joking that her combination of persistence and hard to get had got my attention. She wrote back and on the next email I sent I asked for her number and got it.

 

You're probably not ugly or 5ft8 like me though.

[Eternal Sunshine]

But I find it interesting that what you list as desirable (looks, intelligence and social charisma) literally has nothing to do with how good somebody would be in a relationship. Relationship type qualities like effective conflict resolution skills, empathy, reliability, dependability, an ability to compromise etc. don't reveal themselves right away. It takes time.

 

But, as you yourself say, you're not attracted to those qualities - what you find desirable is looks, intelligence and social charisma.

 

I get what you mean but I need at least some of the initial attraction to even be excited enough to get to know someone better. Relationship type qualities take time to reveal. During that time there has to be something else that generates my desire to keep dating a guy.

[SawtoothMars]

I get what you mean but I need at least some of the initial attraction to even be excited enough to get to know someone better. Relationship type qualities take time to reveal. During that time there has to be something else that generates my desire to keep dating a guy.

 

Have you ever had a situation where you didn't find a guy super attractive at first but over time attraction grew?

 

Attraction with women is kind of fuzzy, because so many different things play into it.... and it isn't just "does he look like Brad Pitt". However, this shouldn't be just a love at first site kind of deal.

[SawtoothMars]

I've just deleted my POF profile. Two years and NO dates. I've just turned 41 (been using OLD since I was 39) and in those two years the only messages or replies that I have received have been from people who are either moribidly obese or well into their 50s.

 

That's me in my avatar, yet OLD has cruelly shown me what my 'standard' is: 250lbs and approaching 60.

 

Two years. No dates. I've actually forgotten what a peck on the cheek, holding hands or even laughing and having a conversation with a woman face-to-face feels like. I give up.

 

Hmm... You need your own thread for this. There is likely nothing wrong with you physically.

 

Giving up won't get you what you want. Life will always favor those who keep trying despite the odds. I'm not sure how the UK dating market goes... but ever English woman I've ever tried to date was totally insane. I think that means you just have to work harder than people in other areas... which is fine because it only takes 1.

[road]

You're probably not ugly or 5ft8 like me though.

 

 

I'm not female. Do not claim to be a fashion expert. Though if you put up photos of you dressed as you are in your Avatar all I can say is burn your clothes.

 

 

People complain about OKC, POF. How have they found pay sites? How is E harmony, match.com, Farmers only.

[Imported]

I like online dating sites! I keep finding women on there that I see around my local area, some on a fairly regular basis. Sometimes it is hard to read women. It's like they are weird. No, really. They're weird.

 

 

They romanticizes wanting a guy, but act like...."strange".... in real life. Or a complete blank. Just knowing they are single and looking clues me in better.

 

 

Of course contacting them online would be stupid on my part. I just go up to them in person.

[Rko28]

As much as online dating has helped me meet new people that I wouldnt usually meet over the years, for pure excitement and the feeling of "wow" you cant beat real life moments, you know like randomly bumping in to someone or thhe girls friends coming over to you and asking if youre interested in such and such.

 

It all does seem a bit too "planned" for my liking but it does work

[Frank2thepoint]

That's the mentality in NYC. Couple that with the fact that NO ONE is looking to get into a real relationship or settle down. I am only one of a whole load of people I know who are single, single for YEARS. And we are not ugly women.

 

I agree that the mentality in the Big Apple is if you get something, the person immediately thinks they can get better. It happens to both genders. But I do disagree with you that no one is looking for a relationship in NYC. Statistically, more men than women in NYC want a relationship. Among single women in this great city, only 25% are willing to entertain the idea of a relationship. Majority of women are enjoying casual dating/flings, with a few that have given up on dating entirely.

 

 

I am wondering if the women on this thread complaining would be more likely to find a relationship that makes them very happy, if they were to relax their expectations on what they expect to have happen on a first meet, and give the guy more of a chance.

 

I concur. Many of the women that have a hard time with dating is due to unrealistic expectations they have of the man. Many women expect instant and complete chemistry from the first date. I can understand if there was zero chemistry and the man is boring. There's no point after that. But even if there is a little chemistry and connection building up, many women toss the guy away because the sparks they were expecting wasn't similar to how it's described in some romance novel.

 

 

And I also don't understand the "pressure" issue with regards to chemistry, chemistry can take time to build, I have felt chemistry on the first meet, and in some cases I didn't feel it until the 3rd or 4rth date...much like meeting someone in real life actually...I give it 4 dates to feel that click....

 

I'm glad a woman chimed in about how chemistry can take a little time to build, and that she is patient enough to give it a chance, if there is at least a little brewing from the onset.

 

 

After I have met 100+ men, I find it hard to feel any excitment at the prospect of another blind date.

 

You and Gaeta are in the same boat it seems. Dating 100+ men means you are definitely doing something wrong. I remember you started a thread or posted in one nearly a year ago about how you are emotionally unavailable, and can't seem to connect with any guy you meet. I believe you admitted that you didn't even want a relationship. From what I gather from your posts, you place a lot of emphasis on immediate chemistry and attraction, and you tend to pick the wrong guys to date. You even had mutliple dates with a guy that was disrespecting you by checking out other women. If those are the type of men you choose to give your time and energy to, then maybe you feel you don't deserve a good guy, or a good guy is boring for you.

[Redhead14]

100+ men, with little to no success!

And, the ones that did go a little further down the road were with dates who were not good for them. This is the hallmark of a serial dater. A person who is emotionally guarded to a spectacular degree.

[BluEyeL]

I'm not "somewhat successful." I am successful.

 

I don't have a "decent job." I have a career.

 

I am smart, with a BA/MA and extra class credits from NYU.

 

It's rare I ever find someone on par with me with OLD. I've gone on dates with dudes who had "High school" listed as their level of education completed. .

 

I am really sorry you've been through so much dissapointment. It does suck and I am sorry for you (and other women in the same boat) because I've been there and I know how it feels (somewhat, since we don't all have the same personalitie) I really really do not think is your education. I am not sure how old you are. I'm 43, I'm a single mother with a child full time (minus) and no family around to take the burden (minus), I'm not skinny therefore not hot (I'm size 12 US so minus), I have a Ph.D. in Engineering and I am a professor at a high profile university, lead a research group and all that stuff (theoretically minus). Plus, I'm an immigrant, with a heavy accent, so a bit more difficult to relate to (possible minus). I have never been on a date with someone with high school diploma. I never even responded to those. Minimum bachelor's. Most men I've been out with had a Masters at least. Maybe you shouldn't respond to people with no university education, since they're more likely to find your too educated.

 

I've never been told I'm intimidating or exhausting. So I'm really not sure that the problems you are encountering are related to your career or education. Maybe the type of men you're going for? Or something else? But education and career are just nice things to think as being obstacles. Maybe you could think of other explanations? Perhaps you like to debate/have strong opinions and are not afraid to confront people you just met (trying to find out what exhausting means)? Those don't have to do with education.

[BlackOpsZombieGirl]

I've just deleted my POF profile. Two years and NO dates. I've just turned 41 (been using OLD since I was 39) and in those two years the only messages or replies that I have received have been from people who are either moribidly obese or well into their 50s.

 

That's me in my avatar, yet OLD has cruelly shown me what my 'standard' is: 250lbs and approaching 60.

 

I did some googling and it's a widespread phenomenon. Men have no chance, we've been priced out of the game by ridiculously over-inflated standards.

 

The first link was even written by a feminist who contributes to Jezebel!

 

Rant over. At least I now know that smashing it in the gym to get in shape (ironically, to combat negative trolling feedback from women on POF) can't even get interest from anybody less than 10 years older than me or 100lbs overweight. The thing is, just because I'm in shape it doesn't mean that I expect an 'athletic' partner, just somebody who hasn't completely let themselves go.

 

This is the typical profile of people messaging me on POF. Note the tone of her profile:

 

Two years. No dates. I've actually forgotten what a peck on the cheek, holding hands or even laughing and having a conversation with a woman face-to-face feels like. I give up.

 

Wow. Maybe you should consider moving to the U.S. lol:confused: That woman's POF profile was HORRIBLE!!!! I mean, I guess she can't really help what she looks like....but, holy hell!!! Talk about a mean, snobby, demanding and extremely insecure person!! I doubt she gets any hits on her profile.

 

It's too bad you deleted your POF profile. I wanted to take a look at it to see what you wrote so I can try to figure out why you're only getting responses from the types of women that you're NOT attracted to. Your avatar shows that you're into fitness, you're healthy and have a great smile! I just don't understand why (and how) you've gotten no dates in TWO years! That's just crazy. Maybe you should try OKC. I tried that for a few months and got some "ok" responses from a few decent guys but then deleted my profile because I wanted to take a hiatus from dating on OLD for a while.

 

Have you tried IRL dating in your locality? If so, how did that go?

 

.

Edited April 20, 2015 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[True Gent]

I've just deleted my POF profile. Two years and NO dates. I've just turned 41 (been using OLD since I was 39) and in those two years the only messages or replies that I have received have been from people who are either moribidly obese or well into their 50s.

 

That's me in my avatar, yet OLD has cruelly shown me what my 'standard' is: 250lbs and approaching 60.

 

I did some googling and it's a widespread phenomenon. Men have no chance, we've been priced out of the game by ridiculously over-inflated standards.

 

The first link was even written by a feminist who contributes to Jezebel!

 

Rant over. At least I now know that smashing it in the gym to get in shape (ironically, to combat negative trolling feedback from women on POF) can't even get interest from anybody less than 10 years older than me or 100lbs overweight. The thing is, just because I'm in shape it doesn't mean that I expect an 'athletic' partner, just somebody who hasn't completely let themselves go.

 

Two years. No dates. I've actually forgotten what a peck on the cheek, holding hands or even laughing and having a conversation with a woman face-to-face feels like. I give up.

 

Your experience of OLD seems particularly poor and negative. 2 years and not one date?! Either your profile is really poorly written, or your messages are really poorly written, or both.

 

Your height isn't the problem I'm 5'7" and I've had a mixture of dates from POF and Match. I'm now into the teens on the number of women I've met. I've met 2 this month, and will possibly have another 3 to meet in the next week or so.

 

I get replies and I get messaged first, by women attractive enough to meet. Are you sure that your jadedness isn't coming off in your profile? Your posts on here seem very negative. I'm not having a go, but if you give off a hint of that when OLD you will get nowhere at all.

 

I won't deny OLD is HARD work. You only get out what you put in, good photos and cleverly worded messages are a must! The amount of messages girls get is massive compared to men, you must stand out with what you say and keep it breif. Never start a message with "Hi" or "Hey there", It can be very time consuming, but dedicating an hour or two to specifically compose messages to a carefully selected few usually pays off.

 

I usually start my messages with "I noticed that you..." Or "I was wondering (followed up by something relevant to her)..."

 

Always include a question in a first message and only briefly say "Hi by the way, I'm (whatever your name is)" At the end of the message, let your profile do the talking about you. Even then keep some mystery, don't include everything in there.

 

I hope I'm not telling you how to suck eggs, but 2 years with nothing at all doesn't seem right to me. It is not your height, any women being derogatory about that aren't worth your time.

Edited April 20, 2015 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[KatZee]

I've never been told I'm intimidating or exhausting. So I'm really not sure that the problems you are encountering are related to your career or education. Maybe the type of men you're going for? Or something else? But education and career are just nice things to think as being obstacles. Maybe you could think of other explanations? Perhaps you like to debate/have strong opinions and are not afraid to confront people you just met (trying to find out what exhausting means)? Those don't have to do with education.

 

I've never been called intimidating or exhausting either, I was kind of saying that half in jest based on what another poster wrote. He said that he didn't want to date women who were smarter than him or more successful because they were too much work and "exhausting." Whatever that means.

 

The only issue with dating and myself is the lack of connection. I can't lie and say I'm not shallow. I am. I need to be physically attracted to the person I'm dating. I've met people who then showed up only vaguely looking like their photos.

 

And the guys I have found attractive, turned out to be dudes that don't want to settle and just want to explore every opportunity, spin the plates, date tons of women.

[KatZee]

I'm not female. Do not claim to be a fashion expert. Though if you put up photos of you dressed as you are in your Avatar all I can say is burn your clothes.

 

What's wrong with his clothes?

 

He's wearing a white shirt. And you can't see anything else.

[road]

I'm 43, I'm a single mother with a child full time (minus) and no family around to take the burden (minus), I'm not skinny therefore not hot (I'm size 12 US so minus), I have a Ph.D. in Engineering and I am a professor at a high profile university, lead a research group and all that stuff (theoretically minus). Plus, I'm an immigrant, with a heavy accent, so a bit more difficult to relate to (possible minus). I have never been on a date with someone with high school diploma. I never even responded to those. Minimum bachelor's. Most men I've been out with had a Masters at least. Maybe you shouldn't respond to people with no university education, since they're more likely to find your too educated.

 

I've never been told I'm intimidating or exhausting. So I'm really not sure that the problems you are encountering are related to your career or education. Maybe the type of men you're going for? Or something else? But education and career are just nice things to think as being obstacles. Maybe you could think of other explanations? Perhaps you like to debate/have strong opinions and are not afraid to confront people you just met (trying to find out what exhausting means)? Those don't have to do with education.

 

 

I had a job in a big city many years ago. There were 2 tall for women, heavy side, average looking, made the effort to do hair and dress nice, mid 30's, Master's, hand good careers with benefits, and all they use to say was they want in life was a BMW. I did not make up this term. I am quoting what they said openly during lunch time.

 

 

A BMW?

 

 

Yes a BMW.

 

 

A black man working. That worked steady at a 40 hr a week job. They did not care if the job paid minimum wage, or dead end job as long as they can and will hold that job. Be faithful and treat them right.They did not want a bum or be a sugar momma.

 

 

They saw there market value.

 

 

They saw their biological clock ticking.

 

 

They saw that many black men were not going to college, unemployment for blacks was high, and many of them wanted to dog around instead of be family men.

 

 

They saw reality. Which is if all that is bad about a man is that he did not go to college, and did not make a good salary but had all the other good things and none of the bad traits he was their ideal man.

 

 

Problem with women is that they believe all of the feminazi agenda and see their self worth inflated.

 

 

Everyone men and women want a 10. No reason to not try for one. Though to be in denial of one's relationship market value will have lots of people complaining that they can not have relationship. Instead of having a relationship.

Edited April 9, 2015 by road

[BluEyeL]

I had a job in a big city many years ago. There were 2 tall for women, heavy side, average looking, made the effort to do hair and dress nice, mid 30's, Master's, hand good careers with benefits, and all they use to say was they want in life was a BMW. I did not make up this term. I am quoting what they said openly during lunch time.

 

 

They saw there market value.

 

 

They saw their biological clock ticking.

 

 

They saw that many black men were not going to college, unemployment for blacks was high, and many of them wanted to dog around instead of be family men.

 

 

They saw reality. Which is if all that is bad about a man is that he did not go to college, and did not make a good salary but had all the other good things and none of the bad traits he was their ideal man.

 

Problem with women is that they believe all of the feminazi agenda and see their self worth inflated.

 

Everyone men and women want a 10. No reason to not try for one. Though to be in denial of one's relationship market value will have lots of people complaining that they can not have relationship. Instead of having a relationship.

Yeah, I'm with you here on most points, except on the fact that women see their self worth inflated.

 

I think many women actually have low self esteem. Because if they didn't, they wouldn't look for men to validate them, but they most often do.

 

Anyway, other than that, yes, you have to be realistic about your 'market value' in terms of superficial qualities and orient yourself towards relationship sustaining qualities.

 

I didn't have to go out with people who didn't finish college, but I did take out of any equation the way a man looks like. So I've been out with short and fat men, short and skinny, tall and fat, tall and hot and everything in between. Given I decided looks don't matter for a long term relationship and if I keep searching for someone who looks like Bradley Cooper (because Brad Pitt is old news) AND who wants a relationship AND who is emotionally stable AND who is kind AND who is financially stable, AND who wants me, I will be 100 before I find him and then still he won't want me LOL.

 

Don't get me wrong, I did reject plenty of guys because of lack of attraction, which is a tiny bit different than just looks. Sometimes I would meet a guy and say "fuc.k no!". But overall, looks were at the very bottom of my criteria. Otherwise I'm pretty darn sure I'd still be searching now. Even those who didn't pan out, they were pretty decent people, they just had their own issues to deal with and therefore the weren't really ready for what I wanted.

 

I do believe in female attraction being able to build up from a small initial pit and bit of connection and I always gave decent men (at least) about 4 to 5 dates before moving on.

 

But yeah, I didn't have to forgo the education criterion, so I didn't.

[BluEyeL]

I've never been called intimidating or exhausting either, I was kind of saying that half in jest based on what another poster wrote. He said that he didn't want to date women who were smarter than him or more successful because they were too much work and "exhausting." Whatever that means.

 

The only issue with dating and myself is the lack of connection. I can't lie and say I'm not shallow. I am. I need to be physically attracted to the person I'm dating. I've met people who then showed up only vaguely looking like their photos.

 

And the guys I have found attractive, turned out to be dudes that don't want to settle and just want to explore every opportunity, spin the plates, date tons of women.

 

Some men feel the need to be superior to a woman in terms of how much money they make or education. It's harder and harder for them to achieve that since women are doing better and better. Not going to lie, being educated does narrow your dating pool. So if you, say, are top 10-15% in terms of income and career, and given that many men prefer to feel superior, your dating pool shrinks to the top 10-15% of the male population (in terms of education/career/money.

 

Among that pool, a lot of them are married (at least half), a lot of them are not conventionally physically attractive (maybe short, maybe fat, maybe bald etc), a small percentage are conventionally physically attractive (are tall, slim or muscular, have hair). Let's say top 3% of the male population are single and are beyond Uni education/or are rich enough to compensate for less. So you are looking for a guy in the top 3% of the male population. Among those, at least half just want to play the field. Why? Because they were married and don't want to do it again, are on the rebound, are emotionally unstable. Some don't have relationship building qualities: are angry, confrontational, narcissistic.

 

So what does that leave you with? Maybe top 1% of the male population. Those are sane, good looking, successful so they don't feel inferior. Among the 1%, all have a lot of options. How many of them will want YOU?

 

Some said here that "approaching looking for love as a business project doesn't lead to good things". I really think everyone would benefit from having the realism that comes with that approach. Just for the initial sorting through the online dating profiles and first dates.

[KatZee]

So what does that leave you with? Maybe top 1% of the male population. Those are sane, good looking, successful so they don't feel inferior. Among the 1%, all have a lot of options. How many of them will want YOU?

 

I really don't think I even understand what you're saying.

 

I don't think I mentioned anywhere that I'm looking to date the top 1% of the male population? In one post I said I've had dates with guys who have had "High School" listed as the top level of education completed.

 

I don't think I've even been on a date with anyone who had a master's degree.

 

I don't go into anything looking at it like a "business transaction." One of the guys I really liked the most had just a year or two of college and then he dropped out.