Anyone want to give me lessons...

[ConfusedInOC]

Originally posted by Lil Honey

I would bet money on the fact that most folks would say that it is VERY difficult to just be friends and get over each other at the same time. Generally speaking, one person wants that arrangement so that if other things don't work out, they have someone to "fall back on." The other person likes the idea, because they are having difficulty letting go. I would think that it's going to be difficult being friends and not having contact . . .

 

I think we can, if she chooses to be. It's not on me, it's on her. She said she would like that so I have to take her for her word. Only time will tell.

 

These two sentences tell me that you are still in the hurting stage and haven't gotten to the angry stage. But, of course, I don't know you or her . . . yet, when someone doesn't want to talk to another person, what choice does the other person have?

 

I don't know that I should be angry. I don't see that it will solve anything. I have my ideas of what went wrong and at this point, I don't see us getting back together.

 

A person doesn't HAVE to be "cold hearted" to put away or throw away or sell the things that remind them of the past. Getting rid of things (or putting them away) is one way people (for the most part) get over the other person. So, trust ME . . . she MIGHT.

 

She might with the bear. Maybe. But she isn't going to throw that PC or her $10,000 motorcycle away

 

I don't doubt that she has things from you. How long they (the items) are still there remains to be seen. And if you listen to Alpha, she was in a relationship with you just to GET these things anyway.

 

Alpha isn't correct.

 

If you knew ME, you would understand that I see things from a woman's perspective AND I have been in HER shoes. I ended a 24 year old marriage. I am not mad at my ex. I don't hate him. But I wouldn't expect YOU to understand . . . since you don't even KNOW me or him. *rolling my eyes*

 

I've never been married so any comments I make regarding marrige would be a guess at best.

 

She probably doesn't expect you to, since she may be living in another country soon anyway.

 

For her sake, I hope she is. That's her dream and I hope she's able to realize it.

 

Being on a rollercoaster implies that she didn't know what she wanted. Sounds to me like she DOES know.

 

In this year long saga, we broke up a few times. And some days she was totally into me and some days not. But the fact I am ready to marry and she isn't is part of why she decided to end it. She doesn't think it's fair to me (and has said as much.)

 

When you think of it, none of this has anything to do with being a man (which was your original question). A man can be a man and still love a woman with his whole heart and soul. And a woman can still be a woman and love a man with her whole heart and soul.

 

Agreed. But when the other person can turn you to mush, you do question your manhood.

 

Pretending to be someone you aren't or feel something you don't (or hide something that you do feel) isn't being a man. It is being deceitful and not being true to yourself.

 

Agreed.

 

And BTW, if I were INSULTED, I would not have come back here . . . I am sad for you.

 

Don't be sad for me. I don't want pity, I want answers

[Moose]

Originally posted by alphamale

it is actually more that you know little about how to deal with and control women. they will take advantage of you whenever they can, it is their nature. and if you cannot control them they have little or no respect for you.

 

either you control or she controls, there is little middle ground.

I better not say what's on my mind right now........except......well, no, I better not......

[alphamale]

Originally posted by Moose

I better not say what's on my mind right now........except......well, no, I better not......

[Lil Honey]

I am a woman (last time I looked anyway LOL ). I do NOT control. I do NOT take advantage of ANYONE. It is NOT in my nature. But Alpha is right, if someone attempts to CONTROL me, I will NOT have respect for him. I am a thinking, feeling human being. I have gone 44 years on my own power and I certainly don't suddenly need anyone telling me what to do and when to do it.

 

Now. If we plan on being somewhere at a certain time, it is RESPECTFUL of me to call the other person and let him know if I'm going to be late. If he is going to the store, it is RESPECTFUL of him to let me know, just in case I have something to get or that he can pick up for me. It is RESPECTFUL to let the other person know approximately when you will be back from somewhere. That way other plans can be made around that time or the other person isn't waiting around for you. It has ZERO to do with control. I never told my ex who he could see, where he could go, when he had to be home. BUT I DID expect to be informed.

 

Let's face it . . . control goes hand-in-hand with manipulation and I don't know a single person who likes that or would put up with that. I also don't know a single person who has had it happen to them, yet blames the ENTIRE other gender for it.

 

Control and manipulation only boost the ego of the person "in charge". It can lead to self-loathing, emotional abuse (which isn't a far step from physical abuse, not that one is wore than the other), etc for the person being controlled.

 

It is a relationship, in which there should be compromise and working together. It isn't a tug-of-war. Sheesh.

 

 

Okay, now I have to go study . . . I'm down to the wire now. LOL

[Moose]

[color=red]HA!!!![/color]

[ConfusedInOC]

Originally posted by Lil Honey

I am a woman (last time I looked anyway LOL ). I do NOT control. I do NOT take advantage of ANYONE. It is NOT in my nature. But Alpha is right, if someone attempts to CONTROL me, I will NOT have respect for him. I am a thinking, feeling human being. I have gone 44 years on my own power and I certainly don't suddenly need anyone telling me what to do and when to do it.

 

Now. If we plan on being somewhere at a certain time, it is RESPECTFUL of me to call the other person and let him know if I'm going to be late. If he is going to the store, it is RESPECTFUL of him to let me know, just in case I have something to get or that he can pick up for me. It is RESPECTFUL to let the other person know approximately when you will be back from somewhere. That way other plans can be made around that time or the other person isn't waiting around for you. It has ZERO to do with control. I never told my ex who he could see, where he could go, when he had to be home. BUT I DID expect to be informed.

 

Let's face it . . . control goes hand-in-hand with manipulation and I don't know a single person who likes that or would put up with that. I also don't know a single person who has had it happen to them, yet blames the ENTIRE other gender for it.

 

Control and manipulation only boost the ego of the person "in charge". It can lead to self-loathing, emotional abuse (which isn't a far step from physical abuse, not that one is wore than the other), etc for the person being controlled.

 

It is a relationship, in which there should be compromise and working together. It isn't a tug-of-war. Sheesh.

 

 

Okay, now I have to go study . . . I'm down to the wire now. LOL

 

I agree with all of this.

 

She made no compromises. School is what is most important to her, not a relationship. Who knows, this whole thing might have just come down to bad timing.

[Mz. Pixie]

Someone who makes no compromises for a relationship is not "in" that relationship.

 

Alpha, I really love ya and sometimes your comments are right on but I disagree with you about the fact that you think all women are out for something. That's totally not true in my case. There are exceptions to all rules. As whether a woman is a user and she's mature- then IMO she's not mature. Mature women do not play games. I'm intelligent enough to play them. I just do not choose to.

 

I really don't think this is about you COC, it's about her. She's just not into a relationship right now. I would agree you were very giving to her. It's HER issue that she didn't appreciate it, not yours that you treated her with respect and love.

 

I had to chuckle when I read what you wrote about dinners out. My bf is very big on dining out and he's spoiled every woman he's ever dated by taking them to expensive dinners. I'm just not like that and I haven't been alot of fancy places. It blows his mind when he wants to go out to a fancy place and I say it doesn't matter to me where we go. Sometimes I still let him take me, but it's rather more for him than me since he likes it so much!

[ConfusedInOC]

Originally posted by Mz. Pixie

Someone who makes no compromises for a relationship is not "in" that relationship.

 

Alpha, I really love ya and sometimes your comments are right on but I disagree with you about the fact that you think all women are out for something. That's totally not true in my case. There are exceptions to all rules. As whether a woman is a user and she's mature- then IMO she's not mature. Mature women do not play games. I'm intelligent enough to play them. I just do not choose to.

 

I really don't think this is about you COC, it's about her. She's just not into a relationship right now. I would agree you were very giving to her. It's HER issue that she didn't appreciate it, not yours that you treated her with respect and love.

 

I had to chuckle when I read what you wrote about dinners out. My bf is very big on dining out and he's spoiled every woman he's ever dated by taking them to expensive dinners. I'm just not like that and I haven't been alot of fancy places. It blows his mind when he wants to go out to a fancy place and I say it doesn't matter to me where we go. Sometimes I still let him take me, but it's rather more for him than me since he likes it so much!

 

Heh, don't get me wrong, I love the fancy dinners too but I think I like the romance in them. I guess I really want that in a relationship and it seemed I was doing all the romantic things, not her.

 

I am sitting her trying to think of any romantic things she did and truthfully, not many at all.

 

She's nice, don't get me wrong. Was very generous during Christmas. Liked to curl on the couch with me (and complained once that I didn't do it when she was over, but she was watching some reality show and I didn't want to bother her).

 

Man how I miss that....

[ReluctantRomeo]

Originally posted by ConfusedInOC

Man how I miss that....

 

You're not the only one. Be strong, Confused - better times will come.

[ashley83]

You're so cute ConfusedinOC......you are very attractive and from what I've read of your posts...you have an awesome personality and seem like a beautiful sensitive person on the inside, which is rare to find these days in a person.............you'll find someone that deserves you and will be happy....i know how it feels, like you're best friend has died, im goin through it too

[ConfusedInOC]

Originally posted by ashley83

You're so cute ConfusedinOC......you are very attractive and from what I've read of your posts...you have an awesome personality and seem like a beautiful sensitive person on the inside, which is rare to find these days in a person.............you'll find someone that deserves you and will be happy....i know how it feels, like you're best friend has died, im goin through it too

 

 

Thank you.

 

I'm handling it fine, but like I said, the missing companionship is what's killing me the most. And when I go to bed, the bed is cold and empty without her.

[whichwayisup]

And when I go to bed, the bed is cold and empty without her.

 

That's a tough one Confused. Fall asleep with the TV on, that could help abit too. Or (I'm saying this for ALPHA's reaction - I'm evil!) cuddle up with a stuffed animal or make sure you have alot of pillows in bed there too. Just cozier.

 

you have an awesome personality and seem like a beautiful sensitive person on the inside, which is rare to find these days in a person.............you'll find someone that deserves you and will be happy.

 

I agree and that is the confidence you have to carry with you as much as you can. When you're least expecting it, you'll catch somebody's eye!

[ConfusedInOC]

Originally posted by whichwayisup

That's a tough one Confused. Fall asleep with the TV on, that could help abit too. Or (I'm saying this for ALPHA's reaction - I'm evil!) cuddle up with a stuffed animal or make sure you have alot of pillows in bed there too. Just cozier.

 

Funny you mention that. For Valentines Day I bought her a really nice "Vermont Teddy Bear." She sleeps with it every night, guilt free. Doesn't bother her that *I* gave it to her. She has it and that's all that matters.

 

I try to read before going to bed, say a prayer of thanks to God (and mostly apologize for not being nearly as good a Christian as I should be...and then I ask "why me?!") and dream of riding the twisty canyons of SOCAL in a world of no cops, no cross traffic and endless sun.

 

I fall asleep pretty quickly and don't think of her.

 

I agree and that is the confidence you have to carry with you as much as you can. When you're least expecting it, you'll catch somebody's eye!

 

I've always been very confident but for some reason, love grabs me by the nads and drops me to my knees. I don't understand it.

[mental_traveller]

Originally posted by ConfusedInOC

...in how to be a man?

 

Before you laugh, let me explain. I grew up without a father. No fatherly influence in my life whatsoever. I never learned how to be the kind of guy that keeps a women interested in them.

 

I act too much like a chick sometimes. I need to learn how to get rid of that part of my life and act like a man. And what's most pathetic about this is I am 36 and I STILL don't farking know how to be dark, mysterious and keep women interested.

 

I'm not bad looking. I am not skinny and weak (I work out 3x a week and bench over 245lbs and weigh almost 170 at 5'10'). I am good conversationalist. I'm a romantic. I like to tinker and work on bikes and cars. I like computers and slapstick comedy. I love the NFL. I am a former Marine.

 

Emotionally when I meet a women I fall in love with, I become a big pile of MUSH. I forget how to be a man. I basically lose my nads.

 

Men (and women), how do I correct this problem so the next time I meet someone I fall in love with, I won't turn them off?!

 

Yeah I know, it's an ultra-pathetic question from an ultra-pathetic guy but I would hope that in-between the jokes and insults there would be some good, tangible information I can use to make a better man of myself.

 

My advice? You are who you are, don't think you can be someone else or pretend to be something you're not. In any case, being the stereotype macho guy is not necessarily that great. I have a friend who is more emotional/sensitive that most guys, and far from being a disadvantage he seems to get a lot of women precisely because of that. Putting on an act can work for one night, if you are just out to score, but in the long run the real you will come out, and people will just feel fooled or that they misjudged you. So just be yourself and women who are into that will come into your life in due course.

 

Rather than being more of a "man", I think you just need to become a bit more independent and less needy. You can be independent, take relationships on your own terms, and still be sensitive/emotional and caring of another person. It's just that if they get out of line, you don't put up with any of their crap. Set your boundaries and stick to them.

[alphamale]

Originally posted by mental_traveller

My advice? You are who you are, don't think you can be someone else or pretend to be something you're not.

 

So just be yourself and women who are into that will come into your life in due course.

so you do not advocate self-improvement and self-education, MENTAL_TRAVELLER? We should just maintain the status quo? You're saying we should not try to improve our weaknesses?

[mental_traveller]

Originally posted by alphamale

so you do not advocate self-improvement and self-education, MENTAL_TRAVELLER? We should just maintain the status quo? You're saying we should not try to improve our weaknesses?

 

Yes I agree with you that you can improve. What I mean is that you can't change your personality 180 degrees. A 5'5 guy with a small frame can work out and become well-built, but he is never going to have a big-boned 6'2 body.

 

I actually just edited my post, trying to say something similar. I.e. if you are the "sensitive" type of guy, that doesn't mean you have to be a pushover. Equally, a traditional "man" can improve by communicating his feelings a bit better.

[alphamale]

Originally posted by mental_traveller

What I mean is that you can't change your personality 180 degrees.

well MENTAL_TRAVELLER. the only people who can change their personalities 180 degrees are schizophrenics and dual-personalities. who mentioned anything about doing that? it is impossible.

 

one should evaluate their weaknesses and strive to improve them. whatever those weakenesses may be.

 

if a man thinks he is fairly weak in dealing with women then he should work actively to improve those skills. and people do it every day.

 

life is all about learning and experiencing new things.

[ConfusedInOC]

Exactly.

 

Emphasize your strengths.

Minimize your weaknesses.

Make improvements where you can.

 

Nobody SHOULD make a 180* change because you're not improving, just "reversing" your direction.

[KissMyTiara]

I REALLY wish I could refer to this entire thread in others where you have attacked me for no good reason, but alas, I feel compelled to....help you. ARGH.

 

Originally posted by ConfusedInOC

I have a problem with understanding how to be myself when head over heels in love and not turning into a mushy wussy guy.

 

Aren't you being yourself when you're being a mushy-wushy guy? Wouldn't you rather be with a woman who WANTS a mushy-wushy guy?? Why would you want to change your inherent personality characteristics if those characteristics are inherently GOOD?

 

Originally posted by ConfusedInOC

 

Now, HOW DO I STOP DOING THIS?! How can I prevent myself from doing this again? What lessons can I teach myself to learn this?!

 

I certainly don't think you're lacking in the self-confidence department (besides maybe a penis issue or two). But in order to maintain your identity and not turn into someone else when you're in love, the answer is simple: Get a life. I don't mean that in an insulting way, I mean that if you have a life, your own life, things you enjoy, things you do, people you share time with, etc., BEFORE you meet a woman, then when you fall for one, you incorporate her INTO your life instead of making her your life.

[alphamale]

Originally posted by KissMyTiara

Get a life.

that's about it in a nutshell, K.M.T.

[ConfusedInOC]

Originally posted by KissMyTiara

I REALLY wish I could refer to this entire thread in others where you have attacked me for no good reason, but alas, I feel compelled to....help you. ARGH.

 

I don't "dislike" you KMT, but even you'd have to agree our morals clash.

 

Aren't you being yourself when you're being a mushy-wushy guy? Wouldn't you rather be with a woman who WANTS a mushy-wushy guy?? Why would you want to change your inherent personality characteristics if those characteristics are inherently GOOD?

 

The mushy part comes from falling madly in love. I know men that are madly in love and don't show it. I wear my emotions on my sleeve and it's hard for me to subdue them. This last experience has taught me that I had better learn to do it or I'll end up repeating the same mistaks.

 

I certainly don't think you're lacking in the self-confidence department (besides maybe a penis issue or two). But in order to maintain your identity and not turn into someone else when you're in love, the answer is simple: Get a life. I don't mean that in an insulting way, I mean that if you have a life, your own life, things you enjoy, things you do, people you share time with, etc., BEFORE you meet a woman, then when you fall for one, you incorporate her INTO your life instead of making her your life.

 

When the person you are in love with is your companion and best friend and you do everything together, that person becomes a huge part of your life. It's easy to suggest "getting a life" but much harder to do when that person is no longer in your life anymore. It takes time.

 

My biggest issue is controlling my emotions when I really love someone.

[KissMyTiara]

Originally posted by ConfusedInOC

I don't "dislike" you KMT, but even you'd have to agree our morals clash.

 

I've made stupid choices in my life, that is true. But that doesn't make me any less immoral than you are. Mr. Christian, didn't someone die for our/my sins? Aren't I entitled to some forgiveness? Anyways...

 

The mushy part comes from falling madly in love. I know men that are madly in love and don't show it. I wear my emotions on my sleeve and it's hard for me to subdue them. This last experience has taught me that I had better learn to do it or I'll end up repeating the same mistaks.

 

Just because you THINK that it was you wearing your heart on your sleeve that caused the demise of THIS relationship (it could have been a million other things - there are always 3 sides to every breakup) doesn't necessarily mean that it will ruin the next one. Sheesh, if you pull a 180, the next girl you go out with/fall in love with might leave you because you're TOO insensitive after changing. The point is that you need to be yourself and find someone who loves you and adores you and wants to be with you just the way you are, mushy wushy and all!!

 

When the person you are in love with is your companion and best friend and you do everything together, that person becomes a huge part of your life. It's easy to suggest "getting a life" but much harder to do when that person is no longer in your life anymore. It takes time.

 

That was your mistake - doing EVERYTHING with the person and having them be your entire world. A relationship isn't so much about 2 halves becoming one as it is about 2 people bringing out the absolute best in the other. You cannot be your absolute best if your world revolves around another person...OR if you aren't being 100% true to yourself. You need to maintain your identity and just let the woman IMPROVE, not MAKE, your life.

 

My biggest issue is controlling my emotions when I really love someone.

 

The entire POINT of falling and being in love is completely losing control of your emotions. LOVE is not something that should be controlled.

[alphamale]

Originally posted by KissMyTiara

The entire POINT of falling and being in love is completely losing control of your emotions. LOVE is not something that should be controlled.

i dig most of what you're saying KMT but I must whole-heartedly and unilaterally disagree with the above.

 

uncontrolled love is a tragedy waiting to happen but love when tempered with logic and reason is a beautiful sight to behold.

[KissMyTiara]

Originally posted by alphamale

uncontrolled love is a tragedy waiting to happen but love when tempered with logic and reason is a beautiful sight to behold.

 

 

How about uncontrolled emotion but controlled action based on that emotion?

[ConfusedInOC]

Originally posted by KissMyTiara

I've made stupid choices in my life, that is true. But that doesn't make me any less immoral than you are. Mr. Christian, didn't someone die for our/my sins? Aren't I entitled to some forgiveness? Anyways...

 

You shouldn't worry about my forgiveness. The only place you can truly gain forgiveness is with the Lord. If you are truly sorry he's the only one who can give you solace.

 

Just because you THINK that it was you wearing your heart on your sleeve that caused the demise of THIS relationship (it could have been a million other things - there are always 3 sides to every breakup) doesn't necessarily mean that it will ruin the next one. Sheesh, if you pull a 180, the next girl you go out with/fall in love with might leave you because you're TOO insensitive after changing. The point is that you need to be yourself and find someone who loves you and adores you and wants to be with you just the way you are, mushy wushy and all!!

 

My ex likes me that are soft spoken, show very little emotion and make her want to chase them. I did everything wrong that I could have. Not afraid to admit that. I feel too hard, too fast. I was "too into" her which caused her to not be "into" me. That's the best way to explain what happened. Once the newness wore off and she didn't have to chase me, she got bored.

 

That was your mistake - doing EVERYTHING with the person and having them be your entire world. A relationship isn't so much about 2 halves becoming one as it is about 2 people bringing out the absolute best in the other. You cannot be your absolute best if your world revolves around another person. You need to maintain your identity and just let the woman IMPROVE, not MAKE, your life.

 

I agree. I lost of a lot of my identity.

 

 

The entire POINT of falling and being in love is completely losing control of your emotions. LOVE is not something that should be controlled.

 

I think that's subjective, depending on who is receiving the love.