The spouse

[Ifalltopieces]

The common consensus across the LS boards is that OW/OM feel guilt and sadness for the spouses of their AP's. However, I came across an article the other day, which explained that most OW/OM actually feel hate and contempt for these spouses. I never really gave it much thought but I guess it's something I should think about....

 

What are your thoughts?

 

Do you have negative feelings for the spouse of your AP?

Do you feel like they win and you lose?

Do you feel anything?

 

Explain

[Hope Shimmers]

The common consensus across the LS boards is that OW/OM feel guilt and sadness for the spouses of their AP's. However, I came across an article the other day, which explained that most OW/OM actually feel hate and contempt for these spouses. I never really gave it much thought but I guess it's something I should think about....

 

What are your thoughts?

 

Do you have negative feelings for the spouse of your AP?

Do you feel like they win and you lose?

Do you feel anything?

 

Explain

 

Well, I used to feel that she won and I lost, but actually the opposite is true.

 

I feel sorry for her. I never hated her. I don't like her as a person (nothing to do with her being his wife) but she didn't deserve any of it. She didn't do herself any favors by refusing to ever have sex with him again, though.

[minimariah]

What are your thoughts?

 

i was just talking about this with a colleague the other day - i think most APs (at least from what i've seen) don't really think about the spouse at all.

 

i remember talking about the BS with a friend who was an AP at one point and she absolutely HATED the BS mostly because her AP would constantly vent about his marital problems and seeing how she loved him -- she of course, took his side. she was mad at the BS for not caring and treating her love the way she thought he deserved. the BS refused to have sex or to show any kind of affection for her husband but what my friend DIDN'T know was that she was acting that way as a response to the WH's verbal abuse that lasted for years.

 

i remember she was talking about the BS as some kind of damaged goods which was amazing to me because she refused to see her AP as nothing but a victim. i remember asking her how does she feel about the fact that he DID choose and marry her (for me, for example, that alone would be a major red flag because i don't believe people change drastically over night and for no reason) and that he probably heavily influenced her change in a negative way with her own negative behavior - she suddenly went quiet.

 

i will say one thing - i highly doubt the APs feel any kind of positive feeling for the BS. they either don't care or have negative feelings.

[Ifalltopieces]

In the beginning I rarely, if ever thought about her. As time has passed, I have let thoughts of her consume me. I often feel like she is the winner in all of this. I have moments when I wonder why I'm not good enough. It's amazing how you can drive yourself crazy comparing yourself to someone you don't even know.

[Josmatjes]

Well, I used to feel that she won and I lost, but actually the opposite is true.

 

I feel sorry for her. I never hated her. I don't like her as a person (nothing to do with her being his wife) but she didn't deserve any of it. She didn't do herself any favors by refusing to ever have sex with him again, though.

 

My story also. I feel bad for her now. I don't like her but she also knew who she married and she was spiteful by cutting him off...

[RoseVille]

In the beginning I rarely, if ever thought about her. As time has passed, I have let thoughts of her consume me. I often feel like she is the winner in all of this. I have moments when I wonder why I'm not good enough. It's amazing how you can drive yourself crazy comparing yourself to someone you don't even know.

 

I vacillate between this and understanding that I could never compare to her because she comes with the trappings of the marriage that he wants.

 

I sometimes think if he could just lift her out of the house and magically replace her with me, re-writing history such that I was there (or really, more accurately, give her the qualities that I have that she's missing...) he would.

 

When I think about her now, I understand her feelings and I understand how they got to where they are. And I empathize. And I don't want her to feel pain, but she's been feeling pain for years before I ever came into his view.

[minimariah]

In the beginning I rarely, if ever thought about her. As time has passed, I have let thoughts of her consume me. I often feel like she is the winner in all of this. I have moments when I wonder why I'm not good enough. It's amazing how you can drive yourself crazy comparing yourself to someone you don't even know.

 

you ARE good enough -- do not ever let a man or some other woman make you feel "less than" because of the way things ended. you are good enough - just the way you are, more than good enough.

 

when you really think about it - at least in my personal opinion, a BS can never be a winner, ever. not even when the WS swears up and down how sorry he is and no matter how hard he tries to win the BS back or fix the marriage.

 

in fact, there are no winners or losers in situations like that.

someone gets hurt or dumped, someone divorces and someone gets to be happy. just facts of live, you know? no winners or losers. what's winning to some, won't be winning to someone else.

[HappyAgain2014]

When I was in my affair, I viewed her as a good person who had spent twenty years focusing on her children while xMM focused on his job. The typical growing apart scenario where they lost their relationship in the course of raising children.

 

I was actually the voice of reason to him about her. As a mother, I related to her focus on her children.

 

In the end, I realized the primary difference between his wife and I in the affair scenario was that I had the information to make choices while she was in the dark. Regardless of their history, she was the only innocent party. He vacillated between leaving and staying and tortured her in the process.

 

I enlightened her and walked away. She was gracious to me despite being heartbroken. She is my true regret. I've never intentionally hurt anyone in my life. I can't make that better or undo the affair.

 

I did the right thing in the end by telling her. She had the right to make choices with all the information. I also stuck by my word to never speak to him again and forwarded all communication he sent to her.

 

Did she win? No. Her world as she knew it was gone. I can't feel sorry for myself when my pain couldn't compare to hers. Two years out... She is my only thought.

[MissBee]

The common consensus across the LS boards is that OW/OM feel guilt and sadness for the spouses of their AP's. However, I came across an article the other day, which explained that most OW/OM actually feel hate and contempt for these spouses. I never really gave it much thought but I guess it's something I should think about....

 

What are your thoughts?

 

Do you have negative feelings for the spouse of your AP?

Do you feel like they win and you lose?

Do you feel anything?

 

Explain

 

In my A I never knew or met her, didn't know what she looked like, he never spoke badly of her, he mostly spoke about her in relation to their child or something matter of fact. That being said, I had nothing to go on to have a really informed (or misinformed even) opinion of her.

 

What I did assume was that she was probably a bit similar to me and that he might have a type. I never compared myself to her, but I did feel jealous that she got him more than I did and I sometimes wondered what their relationship was like. He never talked about the dynamics except to say it was a normal relationship, it has its ups and downs like all relationships and he loved her but he loved me too. He was also adamant that he didn't believe in discussing their private relationship with me and rationalized that he wouldn't discuss the intimate details of our relationship with anyone either and that was his boundary. He literally conducted the A as though he was carrying on two separate relationships with two women he valued and in his own mind felt he was having integrity by keeping things discrete and keeping us in our own realms where he thought he could be fully my man and hers separately, it didn't work but that logic was what he was going with and that made it so he acted in the way he did.

 

I accidentally spoke to her on the phone once and her voice was pleasant and polished, that was the only tangible thing of her I had. I had never seen pictures or seen her in real life during the A either (I did see her picture years later though, she didn't look as I expected but she's attractive), based on her voice I further assumed she was similar to me in some ways. I never felt anger, contempt or anything, but I did feel guilty about the A especially the first time we had sex I kept thinking you're supposed to be away visiting your dad and here you are inside me and she has no clue, I could put myself in her shoes and imagine if my SO was doing that to me and that made me feel awful for her and mad at him and myself.

Edited May 13, 2015 by MissBee

[ttfn555]

IMO when one is in the A, the MM or MW many times, not all, but in my case, play the victim and villainize the BS to justify what they are doing or why they are separated etc. I bought into that thinking she must be horrible. When we agreed to not see each other while he agreed to go to MC "for his kids" he sent me flowers, told me how much he missed me etc and called me. At this point I really thought about her, that in her mind they were trying to reconcile and he was doing this-yuck- I wanted no part in hurting someone else. I do get sad and think I wasn't "good enough" but I realize that in no way did she "win", it wasn't about her and I, it was about as A**hole who wants it all and that's what she will probably live the rest of her life with. She has no idea about

our relationship while they separated and probably never will

[endingpage]

I only found out her name and what she looked like a few months ago (about a year and a half after it started; me and exMM were mostly done then even though I stupidly broke NC a few more times). I have never met her in person. And as far as I know, she doesn't know about the affair.

 

I feel extreme guilt and sadness that I could be so horrible to someone I don't even know. I feel so ashamed. I don't feel any contempt for her, why would I? I don't know her, but she is beautiful and looks really kind. There isn't anything wrong with her and the exMM had the affair because of his own insecurities.

 

I don't feel like she won and I lost. That's flawed thinking. The BS's whole life is turned upside down if she finds out (I can't imagine that amount of mind****ery and pain) and if she doesn't, then she's still married to a cheater who will likely cheat again. She doesn't "win", not by a longshot. That's what I also feel really sad and guilty about. I don't want to hurt someone like that and, yes, I wish everyday I was stronger to realize that before it became an affair.

 

I won't be making any more mistakes though.

[Popsicle]

They're never going to breakup so it doesn't matter what I feel about her or what I do. Because of that, I don't give her much thought. She's like Hilary Clinton.

Edited May 13, 2015 by Popsicle

[GoldieLox]

I definitely feel some guilt towards her. I know if she ever found out she would take his kids. I feel guilt and remorse that I would play a part in her losing her family and being a single mother.

 

I used to feel a twinge of hate towards her. I wanted to have what she had. His time, his pretty house with her, his sense of humor to share, his arms around me instead of her. Now? Now I just feel a little bit of pity towards her. Sure, she'll still have all of that. She always will. But she'll also have a husband who is an emotional blockade whom I honest of God, deep down, feel that he feels stuck in his marriage. He does not have unconditional love for her, or even the decency to come clean with her. I recently found out, it's not the first time he cheated either. He messed around with an ex-girlfriend years ago one night. I mean... I think I'm all set. I may not be content in my marriage but at least I'm making an honest effort From here on out. She can have him.

Edited May 13, 2015 by GoldieLox

[m4p]

At the beginning and throughout the 2 years of A I have felt neither guilt /sadness nor hate/contempt towards his wife.

 

It was more of a "out of sight, out of mind" thing. I couldn't bring myself to think about him and her and everything that they share.

 

Well, but of course things won't always go as planned. Sometimes she consumes my thoughts and I obsessed about her character, her behavior, her looks... the way they interact. Lots of wondering and active imagination going on.

 

I've seen her photographs and accidentally met her in real life twice when I was out alone. Almost had a heart attack. my heart was thumping so hard! She was beautiful and confident. It's superficial but looks was all i could based on because we almost never talk about our partners.

 

It's been months since the A ended. My mindset is slowly changing. I am starting to see her as a proper person deserving of respect. And happier that at least I no longer play a part in hurting her anymore.

 

Having said that, I do believe xMM have a type. I remember right at the beginning when we were not so emotionally entangled yet, we did bring up our partners and he mentioned that he sees a bit of her in me.

 

Whatever problems they might had, she was a devoted wife. Now that I am looking in from the outside, and it hurts me to say, but I actually find her very well suited to xMM.

 

So there. Nobody win and nobody lose because I don't want to play this game anymore.

[cocorico]

The common consensus across the LS boards is that OW/OM feel guilt and sadness for the spouses of their AP's. However, I came across an article the other day, which explained that most OW/OM actually feel hate and contempt for these spouses. I never really gave it much thought but I guess it's something I should think about....

 

What are your thoughts?

 

Do you have negative feelings for the spouse of your AP?

Do you feel like they win and you lose?

Do you feel anything?

 

Explain

 

She wasn't someone I wasted much time thinking about, but what responses she generated were negative - as was her wont. It was small things, initially - the way his mother would fuss over me, telling me how much she liked me; or how his sister expressed surprise when I went to help with the dishes after the meal because "if the other one ever condescended to eat with us, she'd retire to read the paper after the meal, leaving the servants to tidy up"; or his father texting me to tell me not to dump him because he was "desperate to have a decent DIL at last"... But later I found out more about her and why everyone disliked her so strongly. And once I witnessed her myself, any benefit of doubt evaporated. She really went out of her way to earn people's dislike.

 

I think she feels like I won and she lost. Her accusations that I "stole" "her" H, "her" kids, "her" house, "her" life, suggest a worldview I'm not particularly sympathetic toward, but also fail to consider what she did win - an escape from a toxic M and damaging familial relationships and the chance to start again with a clean slate with someone new.

 

These days, I feel only mild irritation when she gets up to her tricks again, but I've heard she may be moving so I'm hoping that's true.

[still_an_Angel]

In the beginning I never really gave MM's W much thought. I'm in a D/s relationship with MM so I see her and him as very vanilla, thus nothing to compare with the relationship that I have with him. Do I feel I have the upper hand sex-wise? Sure, he sought me out and our kinks match.

 

 

I don't have any negative feelings about her, ok maybe the very few times that I felt she has engineered an issue or event so that MM has to cancel on our day together. I know this is not intentional on her part but a lot of incidents have come up and she has dropped meaningful hints to MM that indicates she is aware of me. Sometimes I'm thinking maybe she does, but she looks the other way because she can't do or won't do what I can and do for him.

 

 

But over time, I've gotten to know more about her through him, it feels like reading a book, I get to know the characters through the story. I don't want to hurt her because she has been through so much in her life (and yet I'm still engaged with her H) and I do get overwhelming feelings about this sometimes so I feel I'm walking the line between breaking it off with MM and leaving them alone.

 

 

There are no winners in our scenario, everyone will be hurt once our A is discovered. She will loose a lot and I will gain nothing. Not even MM, as he might end up loosing both.

[LovelyBrown]

I can empathize with his wife, even if our thing was never physical. I Understand why she's so aloof and bitchy! As a mom I know, when you have small kids and you're at home is like you live in a bubble when all you do is care after all these kids all day long, I've been there. And then your husband gets home and doesn't recognize all the work you've put into your day because it doesn't look like you've done anything.

On the other hand, I see him. He's such a sweet man that's very broken but she knew that going into the relationship! As a partner, he would require so much patience, love and understanding, and since all her focus has shifted he's now left out in the cold.

But, I often feel sorry for her, I wouldn't want to be marry to him! He's a total workaholic (working Sundays so he doesn't have to go home) completely disconnected with his home life, just going through the motions and trying to escape, and she has NO IDEA!

[Adoraxx]

Since the xMM is my neighbor, I know her pretty well too. I used to watch their children and got to know her quite well, and honestly, I don't like her and I don't understand what xMM sees in her. It's not that I don't like her because she is his wife. I know I wouldn't have liked her either if she was just a random person. She is incredibly selfish, only talks about herself ALL the time, will never ask another person a well meant "how are you" , never pays any compliments. All she can think about is herself. And all the xMM thinks about is himself too, so I guess they're an excellent match.

 

And the xMM told me the other day that he is 'crazy about his wife' : I don't get it! And why pressure me for sex for all these years??? I don't get that either!!

 

I really wish I never would've met either one of them. To me it always felt very weird that he likes her so much whereas I couldn't see what was so nice about her. (And again: I would have said the same if she wouldn't be his W)

[Got it]

I was and am neutral to her. She is human with strengths and weaknesses. I really haven't given her much thought except when it directly impacts us (far more times now that we are married and just routine issues around the kids, than in the affair). I am surprised by her seemingly lack of involvement with the younger kids compared with the oldest and always thought the relationship with the oldest was a little too blurred on a pal level. I have been surprised as the younger ones have become teens that she isn't as involved in their lives and going ons but it is what it is.

 

Honestly I am just thrilled that the parental alienation has stopped and there is a very nice status quo. Everyone is coexisting in some level of balance without the drama that used to routinely come up.

[OWAmy]

In the beginning I never really gave MM's W much thought. I'm in a D/s relationship with MM so I see her and him as very vanilla, thus nothing to compare with the relationship that I have with him. Do I feel I have the upper hand sex-wise? Sure, he sought me out and our kinks match.

 

 

I don't have any negative feelings about her, ok maybe the very few times that I felt she has engineered an issue or event so that MM has to cancel on our day together. I know this is not intentional on her part but a lot of incidents have come up and she has dropped meaningful hints to MM that indicates she is aware of me. Sometimes I'm thinking maybe she does, but she looks the other way because she can't do or won't do what I can and do for him.

 

 

But over time, I've gotten to know more about her through him, it feels like reading a book, I get to know the characters through the story. I don't want to hurt her because she has been through so much in her life (and yet I'm still engaged with her H) and I do get overwhelming feelings about this sometimes so I feel I'm walking the line between breaking it off with MM and leaving them alone.

 

 

There are no winners in our scenario, everyone will be hurt once our A is discovered. She will loose a lot and I will gain nothing. Not even MM, as he might end up loosing both.

 

WOW if an affair is not complicated enough you also have the Dominant/submissive element which in itself is a fantasy...a fantasy within a fantasy. Complicated. I wonder if he ever 'played' with his wife?? My friend is a psychotherapist and also a professional dominant and I've met and talked to her clients. They hold such tremendous guilt in coming to see her and that is a strictly professional relationship - no kissing, sex or anything like that. She describes it like she's having intellectual affairs with them at worst and always having to maintain strict boundaries with them.

 

Sorry if I appear nosy just interesting to have something different come along.

[OWAmy]

I never had any bad feelings towards his wife. He never said anything bad about her...there was the odd grumble but nothing nasty or disrespectful. I envy her in that she has a great life with him but that's as far as it goes. After all she met him first and she is a good 15yrs older than me. She is a good person - I can tell from bits and pieces she's had on the Internet but now all the social media has disappeared.

 

Three years into the affair I heard her voice on his answer phone from across the dinner table. 'Hi sweetheart' and only then did she become real to me. I thought - this woman loves him. Only then did I truly receive my wake up call. A couple of months after this I joined LoveShack.

[minimariah]

I don't have any negative feelings about her, ok maybe the very few times that I felt she has engineered an issue or event so that MM has to cancel on our day together. I know this is not intentional on her part but a lot of incidents have come up and she has dropped meaningful hints to MM that indicates she is aware of me.

 

what's the reason for negative feelings if she didn't do it intentionally & doesn't know about the two of you, simply planning to spend time with her husband? if she does know -- she did do it intentionally.

 

There are no winners in our scenario, everyone will be hurt once our A is discovered. She will loose a lot and I will gain nothing. Not even MM, as he might end up loosing both.

 

sometimes losing isn't a bad thing... *shrugs*

 

and if she does know about your A, nothing will probably really change for her -- unless he decides to divorce her to be with you.

[Grapesofwrath]

I feel bad for her, which is one of the reasons why the A just couldn't work for me. He never spoke ill of her, and from all evidence she is a loving wife and caring mom. Pretty lady. Wholesome looking. The most I could figure out is that she is "vanilla" in the sex department, and fairly rigid about rules in life. I got the sense that she isn't a whole lot of fun, and so my role was to be the fun. But not being fun does not justify being betrayed.

 

Ultimately, I empathized with her because I think she is really trying to make that marriage work. She is attentive and caring. She gives him sex--though perhaps not as much or the kind that he wants--and she takes care of things at home while he travels for work. In the time we were together, they went on a yoga retreat and another weekend trip with the kids. I don't think she is cold, distant, or mean. Knowing all that, I just couldn't figure out why he would betray her. She didn't deserve it. And knowing that he could betray his wife when their relationship is good, what could possibly protect me from being cheated on by him when our relationship is good? The answer? Nothing.

 

Maybe I could see it if the relationship we had was just about sex. Just about him getting some side action to keep things exciting. But he was all about the love. Would tell me all the time how much he loved me. How in love he was with me, from the moment he saw me. That I took his breath away. If I was married and my husband cheated, I think that part would be the worst. Knowing he slept with someone else just for sex? Maybe I could get over it. Maybe. But knowing he was saying I love you to someone else? That would crush me.

 

So, yes. I had feelings about her. Feelings of compassion. I think she's probably a really nice woman. Never met her.

[Giggle]

He just told me that she says he's an *******. She's got reason for it beyond this I've no doubt.

 

There is a song called Girl Crush that I can relate to. Mostly I'm sad for them that they can't get along. She's a type of woman I don't get... Nails done, eyebrows plucked, all dolled up who doesn't prioritize the kids. Since he married her and I've seen a past gf, I can't quite fathom why he likes me. I told him he's having a middle life crisis. Younger gf, new tattoos, new bike.

 

He figures I'd get upset with her if he told me anything, so I'm pretty sure I wouldn't like her. Mostly just sad for them that their marriage isn't working either. It sucks to be in a marriage where someone is that unhappy.

[RoseVille]

I feel bad for her, which is one of the reasons why the A just couldn't work for me. He never spoke ill of her, and from all evidence she is a loving wife and caring mom. Pretty lady. Wholesome looking. The most I could figure out is that she is "vanilla" in the sex department, and fairly rigid about rules in life. I got the sense that she isn't a whole lot of fun, and so my role was to be the fun. But not being fun does not justify being betrayed.

 

Ultimately, I empathized with her because I think she is really trying to make that marriage work. She is attentive and caring. She gives him sex--though perhaps not as much or the kind that he wants--and she takes care of things at home while he travels for work. In the time we were together, they went on a yoga retreat and another weekend trip with the kids. I don't think she is cold, distant, or mean. Knowing all that, I just couldn't figure out why he would betray her. She didn't deserve it. And knowing that he could betray his wife when their relationship is good, what could possibly protect me from being cheated on by him when our relationship is good? The answer? Nothing.

 

Maybe I could see it if the relationship we had was just about sex. Just about him getting some side action to keep things exciting. But he was all about the love. Would tell me all the time how much he loved me. How in love he was with me, from the moment he saw me. That I took his breath away. If I was married and my husband cheated, I think that part would be the worst. Knowing he slept with someone else just for sex? Maybe I could get over it. Maybe. But knowing he was saying I love you to someone else? That would crush me.

 

So, yes. I had feelings about her. Feelings of compassion. I think she's probably a really nice woman. Never met her.

 

I can relate to all of this, your description of her sounds exactly the same especially, except my MM never spoke of love for me. I do think it was just about sex for him. I think he caught some feelings though, and it was those feelings that made him run back to his W.