To bust or not to bust

[zinger]

4) I walked her through the separation / divorce proposal. She admitted is generous (quote more than I (she) deserve) and she won't be fighting it so she doesn't need a lawyer (her words). However I guess she realised I'm serious so it sent her to full (confirmed my a doctor) nervous breakdown like I never seen before. I can't help but feel sorry, call me soft if you like, it's not ready to switch these feedings off in a month. As per the advice of my surveillance guy and poly consultant it was best to delay the test. And it'll be more cruel than I want to allow myself towards her (OM is not covered by this statement). So it's in 2 weeks now.

 

5) plans are not changed, I've got no info warranting them to be changed either way. I'll be moving out (although she offered to move out herself), legal reasons are not a priority as per #4. The issue is how far I'll be moving - the same city and in an amicable way if I know the full extent of the affair or to another continent and not leaving my contact details behind of she slept with him (that is why I'm chasing the job in States)

[zinger]

No, my apologies, I wasn't clear. She didn't blame me at all (bold upper case here). She said that the fact he didn't even try to contact her leaving her hi and dry shows what a garbage he (om) is and she will be forever cursed that she allowed that excrement to enter our life. Yet, one thing you are right about that too me it sounded bit to close to regret she is not seeing him anymore though she unambiguously reassured me that's is not the case (hey words were much clearer on it than my digest here).

 

 

Zinger

 

I am astounded. She is actually telling you that she is disappointed that the OM has not tried to contact her and blaming you for her affair .???

 

Unbelievable. !!!! You can bet your ass there is a lot more . I'd bet on it

[Friskyone4u]

Zinger

 

The fact she is calling him excrement is a clear indication that she slept with him and not just once. Do you really think that if all this was was hugs and a watch and a few e mails that she would not be dragging you to do the polygraph or anything else. Why would she all of a sudden be so bitter at him for not "facing the music" with her as you I think put it .

 

I still think you should do the polygraph but every thing you post here incriminates her more. No begging, no truth. Just a stealthy resolve to keep you as clueless as possible.

 

You better be prepared for more "breakdown" from her as she realizes this little game is truly not going to have a happy ending for her. Her calm statement that the offer seems generous just says she knows there is no way out because she did sleep with him. Sad thing about consequences for the cheater . The consequences are no fun like the affair

 

I am still a little confused as to why you are heading for different continent just because you divorce her unless offer is that great . You are a smart guy and have a lot to offer. Don't let her adultery chase you out of the country

[Clay]

I think the fact she is so disappointed is probably the sign that she has had a physical affair with him. On the other side at least it sounds like your starting to hear more of the truth and she is starting to realize it is really over with.

 

Clay

[beatcuff]

Just didn't feel qualified enough to participate in that highly intellectual discussion on polygraph.

 

too funny. some of the 'discussion' clearly shows that some do not have any understanding of how it works.

 

it appears, at this point, they only option to get the truth is to --- lie. this is cruel, but it appears you will not rest until you get it so: in a quiet non-alcohol moment tell her the only hope for R is if she is totally honest. at some point say OM told you it was PA. then trust your gut (as you did early on). do not judge, keep a straight face, she will read it and adjust if you become angry or show hurt. remember the goal: to get answers.

 

now i am with the other recent posters: it was PA, her reaction is too harsh for a 'coffee date'.

[No Limit]

Don't take what she said to heart. OM showing her the cold shoulder just kicked her ego to the ground because it made her realize she was merely another lay to him. Looks like he's fleeing alright by the way - how in the world do you chase someone who's moving away?

[TobyBoy]

So she's pissed that OM hasn't tried to contact her......well why don't you make it happen!!! Set up a fake email or app profile and contact your WW pretending to be OM and tell her that "I haven't forgotten you" "I still love you" "I'm afraid for my life" "what did you tell your husband?" "I've lost everything"........basically bu11**** her to get your truth.

[eric1]

Don't take what she said to heart. OM showing her the cold shoulder just kicked her ego to the ground because it made her realize she was merely another lay to him. Looks like he's fleeing alright by the way - how in the world do you chase someone who's moving away?

 

It's tremendously easy, particularly if you have more resources at your disposal than your prey does.

 

-----

 

Of course as usual I feel Zinger is on the complete right path. He's right to have his spider senses raised about her distraught over him not trying to contact her. One, it means at some level amidst all this junk she still wanted to hear from him. Secondly, she has to know Zinger is monitoring everything so my gut feeling is that their primary contact was via a method undiagnosed yet. Probably office phone. Thirdly, I hate to be the type the says this is proof of a PA...So I'll instead say it's proof of something worse. There was a significant emotional attachment here.

[drifter777]

No kids?? My God - how did I miss that?

 

zinger: you said you didn't want to discuss the "no kids" thing a few pages back but, since this will be my last contribution to your thread, I'm going to discuss it anyway.

 

Why in God's name are you putting yourself through any of this crap when you don't have children? It's not rational - all of this pain & anger & shame and for what? Saving a marriage with a woman who is not the mother of your children? You can't be serious! Tell your lawyer to finish up the legal crap and get yourself that new job in the State's. Time to stop punishing yourself.

[sandylee1]

Zinger

 

I just wanted to say you seem to be doing okay. You are focused and your plan looks to be on track, apart from the delay with her being unwell.

 

You know I really wonder why people risk it all and don't think about the consequences. Unless you can morph yourself and change your look (so as not to be identified) and never leave a shred of evidence like a text /email, there's every chance you're gonna get caught.

[zinger]

No kids?? My God - how did I miss that?

 

zinger: you said you didn't want to discuss the "no kids" thing a few pages back but, since this will be my last contribution to your thread, I'm going to discuss it anyway.

 

Why in God's name are you putting yourself through any of this crap when you don't have children? It's not rational - all of this pain & anger & shame and for what? Saving a marriage with a woman who is not the mother of your children? You can't be serious! Tell your lawyer to finish up the legal crap and get yourself that new job in the State's. Time to stop punishing yourself.

 

Well I'll miss your posts, but... Vaya con dios drifter, thank you very much and your did help me a lot.

 

As for the rest: I'm going as fast as I can. Since the official wording in the divorce petition (close to my sit) is something like "unreconcilable differences" and in my case is better to avoid judicial interference, I'm following the pace set by my lawyer . He had been recommended as the best and not time sharing my case. The rest of the plan is pretty much what was in your last sentence.

[zinger]

You know I really wonder why people risk it all and don't think about the consequences. Unless you can morph yourself and change your look (so as not to be identified) and never leave a shred of evidence like a text /email, there's every chance you're gonna get caught.

 

You know, these are exactly the questions that pop up in my head each day and night. In addition to "was it worth it", "what were you thinking" and "did you realise how much are you putting at risk", the list goes on. "You" means my FWW, not you personally of course. Having accepted everything else, the irrationality of all of this is haunting me. In a way of feel better if she would just say one day "sorry, I love the other guy". The outcome would be the same, but it'd at least make sense to me.

 

Not knowing your circumstances I don't know if/why these questions are relevant to you, but you are spot on as usual.

[66Charger]

Some people are cheaters because thats who they are. They have this little voice that says "go ahead, you wont get caught" and they listen to it. Its in them. Its their flaw. The whys and hows will never be understood by someone with different values. You have a better chance of figuring out why a seriel killer kills.

[singer23]

You know, these are exactly the questions that pop up in my head each day and night. In addition to "was it worth it", "what were you thinking" and "did you realise how much are you putting at risk", the list goes on. "You" means my FWW, not you personally of course. Having accepted everything else, the irrationality of all of this is haunting me. In a way of feel better if she would just say one day "sorry, I love the other guy". The outcome would be the same, but it'd at least make sense to me.

 

Not knowing your circumstances I don't know if/why these questions are relevant to you, but you are spot on as usual.

 

Maybe she would say it if she knew for sure that he would fight for her.

 

She knows she is a sugar mommy now..

[No Limit]

Maybe she would say it if she knew for sure that he would fight for her.

 

She knows she is a sugar mommy now..

 

Definitely. In another case I read the WW came back after a fun weekend with AP and after basically preparing a full-on sneaky leave because he had sucked her bank accounts dry. Still too late - BH luckily realized that and he bought her out of the house two months later and is happily divorced and has custody of his two sons (the mother not even asking about the kids or caring at all probably also made the decision easier for that fella).

[oldshirt]

That's the problem when the OM flees like a cockroach in the spotlight.

 

When that happens (which is the vast majority of the time) the BH will never know if she is actually choosing to stay with him of her own free will or stuck with him because her other plans fell through.

 

For all anyone knows, if the OM had made a full court press for her, Zinger may have come home one day to find a moving truck in the driveway and them moving her stuff out to their new place.

 

It sucks to lose your spouse to someone else.

 

When the AP stands and fights and the WS chooses the spouse, at least then you can call it a choice.

 

But I don't know if it's better or worse to have your spouse turn back up at your door but never know if it's by choice or default and especially if the next time the AP will stand and fight and she'll leave for good the next time.

Edited July 1, 2015 by oldshirt

[SpokenFor]

You all have posted more than I have and seen more LS threads. I'm trying to figure out Zinger's wife's actions and what she was thinking.

 

Best I can come up with is an EA that went PA as the POS sucked her in and got what he wanted, then Zinger comes home early from trip, wife actually snaps out of fog when she realizes he suspects, buys a nice watch as a good-by, thinks she is out of danger -- and then sees Zinger leaning on her car. Everything since then is painful painful noise. So she had made her choice (or thought she had), POS is gone, and Zinger is on his way out too.

 

So now she will pay the price. Zinger sets the price.

 

Zinger, if the best thing for your happiness is to be with her, hope you find a way -- through a D or not. If the best thing is to move past her for now and let life happen, seems like you have options and that could work as well. Best wishes in any event.

[eric1]

And kind of bringing things back to he source, she originally perhaps suspected Zinger knew when he came home from the trip early. A trip, if everyone remembers, is one she was not too keen to go on. Previously she was a woman who loved going on business trips with her husband, but now she wasn't keen on it any longer.

 

We now know it was because she wanted to be with her lover instead. A relationship she insultingly called kind of 'motherly'.

 

Women don't get over going good on trips with their loving husbands because of 'motherly' relationships.

[zinger]

Replying in reverse order: exactly Eric, and it was one of the huge red flags to me at that time. Please don't think I'm showing off here, but if you (e.g. FWW) work flexible hours, have a chance to fly with your husband you claim to love to the place you love with all bells and whistles and perks one could imagine (seriously, please understand the context ) , why would you choose to stay home alone, if you are not sick or have something urgent to do (not the case here)?

 

 

And kind of bringing things back to he source, she originally perhaps suspected Zinger knew when he came home from the trip early. A trip, if everyone remembers, is one she was not too keen to go on. Previously she was a woman who loved going on business trips with her husband, but now she wasn't keen on it any longer.

 

We now know it was because she wanted to be with her lover instead. A relationship she insultingly called kind of 'motherly'.

 

Women don't get over going good on trips with their loving husbands because of 'motherly' relationships.

[Buckeye2]

Replying in reverse order: exactly Eric, and it was one of the huge red flags to me at that time. Please don't think I'm showing off here, but if you (e.g. FWW) work flexible hours, have a chance to fly with your husband you claim to love to the place you love with all bells and whistles and perks one could imagine (seriously, please understand the context ) , why would you choose to stay home alone, if you are not sick or have something urgent to do (not the case here)?

 

 

What did your wife have to say for herself about this?

[Mr Mind of Shazam]

Best I can come up with is an EA that went PA as the POS sucked her in and got what he wanted, then Zinger comes home early from trip, wife actually snaps out of fog when she realizes he suspects, buys a nice watch as a good-by, thinks she is out of danger -- and then sees Zinger leaning on her car. Everything since then is painful painful noise. So she had made her choice (or thought she had), POS is gone, and Zinger is on his way out too.

 

I think that's essentially the narrative but I don't come to the conclusion that she was breaking things off with the artist and that the expensive watch was a goodbye gift. I think a gift like that cements a relationship, and that it isn't part of the denouement.

 

I think she was cold cocked busted in the mall when Zinger was waiting for her.

 

You're reading some self serving stuff for her at that part of the story. I just don't see it, but I can't read her mind.

[oldshirt]

Yeah, no way in hell a designer watch was a parting gift.

 

 

It was a symbol of love and commitment.

 

 

OM was the one that fled the scene and broke it off.

[SpokenFor]

You could well be right, the thing that leans me towards it being an ending was that her contact rate had dropped way off even prior to trip, and my most likely is that it went physical, then the dropoff as she had some doubts, then Zinger gets back earlier and she goes into protective mode and tries to stop it. I could easily be persuaded either way and would be interested to know how long she'd been drawing out the cash to pay for the gift.

 

I am certain that at the point she declined to go on the trip she was definitely either already in PA or moving that way fast.

 

All of this is speculation. Zinger knows her, saw her face when she declined the trip, when he came home early, and when she saw him leaning on her car. I trust his judgment!

[Friskyone4u]

Problem is everyone has good points but it is all speculation because she ain't giving up any information, EVEN when faced with divorce. All I know is if Her only chance to keep him in marriage is to come clean, why is she making I effort to do anything to change his mind

 

Her inaction incriminates her. I agree that in opinion the watch was no closure gift. And who refuses to go on trip with her husband to get together with a non physical OM

[zinger]

..You are absolutely correct and I have accepted that this is the question that I'll never have and answer to (in my mind I mean, of course she's telling me he never meant to be 'the one' but I'll never be sure).

 

I have recovered some of the marriage infidelity sites she was browsing (interestingly enough one had been referred to in this thread earlier). I think I may have developed some plausible answers to my burning questions.

 

How could she do it? The answer is 'easy'. So many posts from remorseful ww's who met other men in gym, on business trip or socially, enjoyed the flirt and slept with them. Easy. I guess my expectation of better resilience here were too optimistic.

 

What was she thinking risking the marriage? Once again, a lot of men there who's first reaction was to work it out. So I guess she expected me to do the same.

 

I think I get it more or less right. ButiI'll never get an answer you the first question.

 

That's the problem when the OM flees like a cockroach in the spotlight.

When that happens (which is the vast majority of the time) the BH will never know if she is actually choosing to stay with him of her own free will or stuck with him because her other plans fell through.

 

For all anyone knows, if the OM had made a full court press for her, Zinger may have come home one day to find a moving truck in the driveway and them moving her stuff out to their new place.

 

It sucks to lose your spouse to someone else.

 

When the AP stands and fights and the WS chooses the spouse, at least then you can call it a choice.

 

But I don't know if it's better or worse to have your spouse turn back up at your door but never know if it's by choice or default and especially if the next time the AP will stand and fight and she'll leave for good the next time.

 

 

 

That's the problem when the OM flees like a cockroach in the spotlight.

 

When that happens (which is the vast majority of the time) the BH will never know if she is actually choosing to stay with him of her own free will or stuck with him because her other plans fell through.

 

For all anyone knows, if the OM had made a full court press for her, Zinger may have come home one day to find a moving truck in the driveway and them moving her stuff out to their new place.

 

It sucks to lose your spouse to someone else.

 

When the AP stands and fights and the WS chooses the spouse, at least then you can call it a choice.

 

But I don't know if it's better or worse to have your spouse turn back up at your door but never know if it's by choice or default and especially if the next time the AP will stand and fight and she'll leave for good the next time.