To bust or not to bust

[sandylee1]

I'm struggling to understand what made this counsellor blame you for the affair, without even meeting your wife.

 

At the end of the day , you know what constitutes a dealbreaker in your marriage

Only you can decide if you'll be able to forgive

Only you can determine if you can trust her again

 

At this point , you may not know the answer to these questions.

 

Truth is very important. A good way to get the truth if that is something you want, is to ask your wife to TELL you EVERYTHING.

To give a timeline, like a story . The PA aspect being fundamental. If you find out later, something she doesn't tell you now , then you will file for sure.

 

This helps to stop the TT, because it shows you mean business and will not be messed around with .

 

How will you find out anything else?? There's always a poly.

[drifter777]

Usually an IC will work with the betrayed to avoid an immediate, emotional reaction until they give themselves a chance to think through the situation. For this reason it is not unusual that she (IC) would try to help you take a more pragmatic approach. In this case the patient will often hear only the side of the issue that angers and/or offends them. I mean they literally don't hear anything else the counselor has to say. If you continue to see this counselor you should not be shy about disagreeing with her and telling her exactly what you are thinking and how it makes you feel. Most people are intimidated by a shrink and will not engage in a real discussion if they say something that the patient doesn't believe or disagrees with.

 

So, there is a bottom line here that should be a focus for you. Answer this question - in your heart - "can I continue to dedicate my life to a committed relationship with this woman after her betrayal? Will I ever accept her as a wife now that she has had sex with another man?"

 

Some of this might sound like you have to guess or make a projection about the future. I disagree - I think you know in your heart how you feel about this. That is why it is so vitally important that you find out the whole truth regarding her affair - did they have sex? If the answer is yes you can then begin processing it to answer the important questions I have posed. If the answer is no you still have to look inside yourself regarding the emotional betrayal and all the lying. A counselor really should be able to help you peel the onion of your emotions to get down to this core.

[eric1]

I disagree - vehemently - that the right approach that an IC should take is analyzing emotional distances. The emotional topic, period, is Zinger healing himself. If I blow out my knee running I don't spend the next day analyzing my gait. I heal my knee, go through physical therapy THEN hit the road and analyze how I got hurt.

 

He needs to work crap out in his mind, analyzing how that crap got there is pointless until he has a relationship worth protecting on the table.

 

I also think that deep down Zinger knows what he's OK with. When he's awake staring at the ceiling that guy knows if he'll never be able to be with a woman who had a boyfriend while married with him or if his desire to be married to his wife is worth the mental challenges of reconciling that and if his trust is there that this will never happen again. Everyone is different. I trust Zinger is smart enough to take our advice with the appropriate grain of salt (particularly because he's shown he's willing to hold to his emotions with advice from everyone.fro. Parents to ICs to friends).

[66Charger]

[quote=merrmeade;6381363

 

Now, this next is going to be controversial:

What if there was no PA yet? I think it's possible. It's possible something's worth saving or at least working to a clearer place of assessment..

 

The one thing that doesnt fit in the PA dump her hysteria, is the emails.

 

If a cheater is going to go under cover, they are going to erase/delete ALL THE EMAILS. Not just the juicy stuff. Per the OP nothing in the emails alluded to a PA. There was talk from the OM about love stuff (just as damaging as a PA) but no "love" quotes from the wife. It is also illogical that "they" talked about love on one email address, and sex on another.

Emails and text rarely lie.

 

Same thing with the phone. Granted, a lot of conversations were probably done on her work phone, It appears she did not tell him "dont call me on this phone use the "other" phone, He called on her phone that he knew of. Your phone timeline may be correct.

 

The PI saw displays of affection, but not displays of passion.

 

This is not 100% proof that there was no PA, and the bald face lying is enough of a reason to divorce, but it certainly should give you pause and reflect on your own statement about her "sliver of hope"

I am not suggesting you do one thing or the other, and i almost never advocate on the behalf of a wayward, But you should know the answer to the question. What if there was no PA?

Do the polygraph and be done with it. I put the odds at 50/50.

 

IMHO and I may be completely wrong, but it is your life and your words.

 

DONT flame me.posters for having a legitimate doubt or if I missed some info.. There are enough burn her at the stake post.

Edited June 15, 2015 by 66Charger

[66Charger]

Assuming he has the KIk passwords

Edited June 15, 2015 by 66Charger

[No Limit]

OPs STBX has yet to bring forth proof that nothing ever happened. Why isn't she showing the messages that everything was harmless and that they had never met up? Oh that's right, because most likely none of their chats can back this gaslighting tale up. Even OM is running for the hills - you think he'd run if they had been out to get coffee?

[itmustbeme]

I think I get it. Actually this is almost word-for-word the line of thinking of the said IC. Her next logical step in the thought process that started with this exact approach - as presented to me- was that since said "creation of a distance and building up the lack of attention" must have been a long and gradual process and the whole affair is a one time and just her sort term "lapse of judgement", I should be really trying hard to make amends. And she needs to contactIC to help her to go " through the difficult period of her life".

 

Who am I to argue with great minds thinking alike.

 

So why were you not cheating on your wife? You felt the distance your wife created but did not cheat?

 

If a man is beating his wife would a counselor ask her what she is doing wrong to cause him to beat her? This just proves that men are at fault no matter what.

 

You did not cause her to cheat. It was up to her and nothing you could have done to stop her. I would find another counselor. What a load of crap.

[whichwayisup]

Basically what NoLimit has said. Apparently there is some flaw in me that forced my wife to seek something outside the marriag. So I need to work with IC to find it, eliminate it and work on me to be a better man. Learn some sort of "languages of love" or something?

 

More time I spent answering (negative) to her questions (no I'm not a heavy drinker, no I have never abused her, no I don't spend to much time in the office or playing sports, yes I give her compliments and gifts, yes I pay attention), the more suspicious she was getting. So I walked out, she suggested my wife to contact her.

 

And yes, that is why I should've put the talks and remorse first. Was getting a good talks and some vibes of what even people here would probably call a remorse. Then my family member told her about the lawyer appointment and my place turned into the brothel on fire in the middle of the flood.

 

I just walked out and let for the weekend.

 

 

IQUOTE=eric1;6380631]Why did the IC say it was all your fault?

 

And I think at this point, particularly with divorce looming, remorse and reconciliation can be pretty hard to distinguish from one another.

Your wife chose to cheat on you, you didn't force her to do that! She could have communicated, spoken up and voiced her unhappiness. She chose to cheat instead of talk. THAT IS ON HER, not you.

[zinger]

Thanks all,

 

To comment on a couple of points (in no specific order) :

1. Deep down I know that something had happened that was hidden from me - PA as you called me. As many of you pointed out that is the only logical explanation that joins all the dots. Yet part of me wants to believe only the facts that area against thi, although I suspect this is just irrational. Quoting drifter I need to know the facts.

2. Agree with comments that I need to talk to FWW, get her some reading, she needs IC (which will be more than willing to help as I can see now) etc. There is only one caveat - and with respect to the posters who have different points of view - I'm going to follow this through : she needs to want it and I should see that she wants it badly. If not - see p. 3

3. My lawer thinks that what I'm offering is generous (in a way that it's likely to be more that court would have awarded her). So after the divorce she'll have an ultimate choice. Try to fight for and win back the guy (me) who was thrre for her all these years but at best is going to be angry, pissed off and as trusting as Ignatius Loyola for a while OR be free to find someone better (perhaps the guy who can quote these languages or read it tokens of love back to front).

4. I have no clue about the motives of the IC, and I was not to any to express what I needed. Yet I felt like a participant in that old movie when the person was referred to the psychiatrist who was convinced he's insane and more be protested his sanity, the more the psychiatrist was getting convinced he's insane.

[zinger]

Forgot to add :

 

- These emails are mostly not emails but text files she's been using to compose the messages (which she deleted, but some of them were named up). So they were not in the open

 

- If I was accused of having an affair but it wasn't physical I'd use each and every channel and opportunity available to protest my innocence at least in that department.

 

- as I mentioned I was getting good and down to the point talks with FWW until the info I'm seeing a divorce lawyer got leaked. Now it's back to square one and I'm getting tired

[No Limit]

- as I mentioned I was getting good and down to the point talks with FWW until the info I'm seeing a divorce lawyer got leaked. Now it's back to square one and I'm getting tired

 

I guess that means that your place has turned to the Niagara falls thanks to her. Self-pity is quite nasty though.

[BetrayedH]

What, if anything, has she offered up to clear up your concerns about a physical affair (PA)?

 

I agree with your assessment that if I was accused of a PA, hadn't had one, and was about to be divorced for it, I'd be using every resource at my disposal to prove that it never went there. People with nothing to hide, hide nothing.

[Friskyone4u]

Zinger

 

2. I met IC - apparently it's all my fault and I need to work hard with her to win my wife back.

 

You need to get rid of this IC. Your wife has an affair (I'm still not sure if you know the extent of it) and you are supposed to try to win her back. Sorry, that is ass backwards.

 

You are responsible for 50% of the marriage but the affair is 100% on her.

 

You should know that this therapy stuff is NOT a quantitative science. If you tell the same story to ten of them you will get five different opinions.

 

I still cannot figure out what you have decided to do from your posts, but nicing her back is the last thing you should be doing. First you need the truth of what really happened and it seems like you are having a real difficult time getting that. not sure why you have not told her she is taking a polygraph. Seems lke that is your best chance at this point

 

All you do know is she voluntarily entered into a relationship with another man, has lied to you repeatedly, certainly was emotionally involved enough to buy him presents, and does not seem to be wanting to do much except deny and withhold information. not exactly what you might be looking for.

 

So whatever you do, I hope to totally reject this advice from this IC and fire him or her immediately.

[SycamoreCircle]

I think it would be funny to commission a giant sign or banner from that company that reads:

 

YOU HAD AN AFFAIR WITH MY WIFE

AND NOW YOU ARE HIDING FROM ME

[66Charger]

Forgot to add :

 

- These emails are mostly not emails but text files she's been using to compose the messages (which she deleted, but some of them were named up). So they were not in the open

 

- If I was accused of having an affair but it wasn't physical I'd use each and every channel and opportunity available to protest my innocence at least in that department.

 

- as I mentioned I was getting good and down to the point talks with FWW until the info I'm seeing a divorce lawyer got leaked. Now it's back to square one and I'm getting tired

 

This answers any question I may have had. If I was falsley accused, I would have offered a polygraph right away. Unfortunate, that people dont understand that anything can be forgiven (in time) except a lie.

Edited June 16, 2015 by 66Charger

[eric1]

Zinger if she has been composing in text files then deleting them you can recover all of them with a simple, free software called Recuva.

 

I still encourage you to just pay someone a few hundred to have forensic retrieval of everything on the laptop/computer and phones. All of your answers will be there.

[eric1]

Forgot to add :

 

- as I mentioned I was getting good and down to the point talks with FWW until the info I'm seeing a divorce lawyer got leaked. Now it's back to square one and I'm getting tired

 

You're not back anywhere. In a true reconciliation it's the cheater who is driving this process. You're tired because you've been running this process. The divorce thing is a setback for HER.

[drifter777]

I think it would be funny to commission a giant sign or banner from that company that reads:

 

YOU HAD AN AFFAIR WITH MY WIFE

AND NOW YOU ARE HIDING FROM ME

For a man's wife to betray him for another man is crushing to his spirit, self-esteem, and ego. This would be the most humiliating thing I can think of - but that's just me...

[zinger]

I guess that means that your place has turned to the Niagara falls thanks to her. Self-pity is quite nasty though.

 

Feels more like a bedlam at times (when my or her family are going nuts because of the divorce) or its grave quiet (when I feel like I've had enough) and lock myself in my 'quarters'

[zinger]

Yes, she's been fired. No IC for now. It's rather send the cheque or the best flowers money can buy to the ladies here and equally the best alcohol to the gents of LS (or maybe vice versa). Much better ROI /value for money if you ask my business alter ego.

 

 

Zinger

 

2. I met IC - apparently it's all my fault and I need to work hard with her to win my wife back.

 

You need to get rid of this IC. Your wife has an affair (I'm still not sure if you know the extent of it) and you are supposed to try to win her back. Sorry, that is ass backwards.

 

You are responsible for 50% of the marriage but the affair is 100% on her.

 

You should know that this therapy stuff is NOT a quantitative science. If you tell the same story to ten of them you will get five different opinions.

 

I still cannot figure out what you have decided to do from your posts, but nicing her back is the last thing you should be doing. First you need the truth of what really happened and it seems like you are having a real difficult time getting that. not sure why you have not told her she is taking a polygraph. Seems lke that is your best chance at this point

 

All you do know is she voluntarily entered into a relationship with another man, has lied to you repeatedly, certainly was emotionally involved enough to buy him presents, and does not seem to be wanting to do much except deny and withhold information. not exactly what you might be looking for.

 

So whatever you do, I hope to totally reject this advice from this IC and fire him or her immediately.

[zinger]

Yes and request the OM to work on it. Thanks for the reminder, I need to check on him they're again, maybe will be lucky this time.

 

I think it would be funny to commission a giant sign or banner from that company that reads:

 

YOU HAD AN AFFAIR WITH MY WIFE

AND NOW YOU ARE HIDING FROM ME

[zinger]

I'm still digging. And whatever I may discover myself won't give her any credit (unless it's something positive).

 

One of the primary directions for me is based on the fact that I kind of knife how and where they met, so I'm looking down that angle.

 

 

Zinger if she has been composing in text files then deleting them you can recover all of them with a simple, free software called Recuva.

 

I still encourage you to just pay someone a few hundred to have forensic retrieval of everything on the laptop/computer and phones. All of your answers will be there.

[81West]

If I was at fault and wanted to save my marriage I would spare no effort during a separation that I fully deserved. I would turn myself inside out to find the remorse, self awareness and insight necessary. But if somebody actually divorced me and expected me to to fight for them after that? Pfffft. Anybody who divorces their spouse better really mean it. This is just way too rigid an approach if you're truly open to remorse and reconciliation.

[66Charger]

Just so we are clear, Are you saying that divorcing your spouse for infidelity is way to rigid of a response? And that they should be open to remorse and reconcilliation?

Edited June 16, 2015 by 66Charger

[81West]

Just so we are clear, Are you saying that divorcing your spouse for infidelity is way to rigid of a response?

 

No. Divorce is a perfectly reasonable response to infidelity. But if you do so unilaterally in the face of a spouse who hopes to repair the marriage don't be surprised if that spouse holds you to your decision.