elaine567 Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 but till now i didn't get real honest examples in this thread .... Not sure what you mean there? Link to post Share on other sites
carhill Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 It all depends on whether you're a god or a demon that minute or that day and it can change each minute of each day. Like my best friend says, one doesn't know what flavor one will get. I can usually tell from whether it's a kiss or something thrown at me. If the former, nice to relax for a few minutes; if the latter, duck. That's reality. IME, it's perfectly normal to refuse treatment. The organ affected is the one which makes the decisions. That's the difficulty with mental and emotional conditions. The organ affected has to process and decide and it's injured or diseased. That ties in with triggers and why they can be unpredictable, as the brain is incredibly complex. Link to post Share on other sites
Clarence_Boddicker Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 Nothing you can do or learn will matter unless you leave. You are teaching your children a horrible lesson. You are teaching your kids that marriage, relationships & their own needs have less value than a sociopath's. Your wife is a piece of work also & doesn't care about her kids either. You both should act like adults instead of spoiled children & put your kids needs first, and seek an amicable divorce. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Lois_Griffin Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 With all due respect, you're trying to compare apples to oranges. Your wife is bipolar if I'm understanding correctly? The pretty much changes all the rules and for the most part, you can't compare her to women who don't suffer from the same thing. I don't know a whole lot about Bipolar, but from the few relationships I've personally known about where one was Bipolar, NONE of those relationships lasted and were pretty dysfunctional. Your wife wants to do nothing at all but watch 15 hours of TV every day. Most women work their butts off raising children, working outside the home, being responsible for the overwhelming majority of housework and cooking and everything else inside the home, PLUS trying to keep their husbands happy. I don't know ANY woman who sits on her butt 15 hours a day and is belligerent. If THAT'S what you're dealing with, you probably won't find the answers to your questions in this thread. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Michelle ma Belle Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 (edited) All I can say to that is you can't lump all of us women together and come up with some kind of eureka moment that will help you better understand YOUR wife and save your marriage. That just isn't realistic . We're only getting one side of the story. And although that is the case with anything being said on here, asking for a one-size-fits-all solution is naive at best. As much as I feel for you, there is clearly a lot going in your marriage and probably even more we don't know about. There are always three sides to every story; yours, hers and the truth. I think the bottom line to any issue in any relationship is communication. Either you have it or you don't. Either you want it or you don't. But without it, you're lost. Edited May 21, 2015 by a LoveShack.org Moderator Reference without attribution redacted 2 Link to post Share on other sites
BlueIris Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 Obviously those "silly" issues are not so to your wife, perhaps you need to look behind those issues and find out why she is getting so upset with you. Also maybe the fact you are rating the issues "silly" in the first place may be a huge source of annoyance for her too. This ^^^ is what I was thinking too. I'd definitely "shut down" and get disgusted toward my partner if he thought my concerns were silly or unimportant. That's a relationship-ender. What's the point in interacting with someone who is dismissive of what you think and feel? If he also thought that I was lazy and selfish, as you've described your wife, I'd check out of that relationship at least emotionally. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
carhill Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 With all due respect, you're trying to compare apples to oranges. Your wife is bipolar if I'm understanding correctly? The pretty much changes all the rules and for the most part, you can't compare her to women who don't suffer from the same thing. I don't know a whole lot about Bipolar, but from the few relationships I've personally known about where one was Bipolar, NONE of those relationships lasted and were pretty dysfunctional. Your wife wants to do nothing at all but watch 15 hours of TV every day. Most women work their butts off raising children, working outside the home, being responsible for the overwhelming majority of housework and cooking and everything else inside the home, PLUS trying to keep their husbands happy. I don't know ANY woman who sits on her butt 15 hours a day and is belligerent. If THAT'S what you're dealing with, you probably won't find the answers to your questions in this thread. OP, when you wrote BPD, I went clinical and presumed Borderline Personality Disorder and answered from that perspective. If indeed Bi-Polar (BP1-2), though sometimes comorbid with BPD, disregard. My observations were those from interactions with diagnosed BPD. The main differences I've noted between the two disorders is in the area of 'switching', with BP1-2 being far slower and more predictable than BPD which can be lightning fast and come ostensibly out of nowhere, in that you could wake up and share your joy for the new day and the spouse would start in with a hate-filled temper tantrum because, well, you're the demon of the day at that moment. Then, moments later, switch back to a caring spouse like nothing had happened. Stuff like that. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
DivorcedDad123 Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 OP did reference BPD and stated that bi-polar was easier,so I take it she's diagnosed borderline. OP, you might want to read "I Hate You! Don't Leave Me!" It gives pretty good insight from various people with borderline personality disorder,as well as their SO's. It provides some tools in dealing with someone with BPD. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
carhill Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 When I was caregiving, though psychosis is a much different kettle of fish, I found reading a book called 'Stop walking on eggshells' to provide some valuable assistance in dealing with both issues and certainly helped my interactions with the BPD'ers I have regular contact with. What stood out, and I also gleaned this from the work in MC with my exW, is to accept that I can't change or control anyone's behavior, rather only my own. That may seem simple but was an issue I needed to work on to make sense of, especially, dealing with psychosis. In any event, I found the combination of reading and therapy to assist greatly. OP, if you're in this for the long haul, meaning interacting consistently over a long period of time, IMO the more and healthier tools you have at your disposal, the more likely a positive outcome for yourself and, especially, your children. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
DivorcedDad123 Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 "Stop Walking on Eggshells" is a good book too! 1 Link to post Share on other sites
autumnnight Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 Specifically one of the main issues I found in my marriage was that if I swallow my tongue and agree about everything we are fine , If i disagree even politely I will spend the rest of the month in a cage ... What raised my attention is that sometimes silly issues can make a women hurt Venus , how many of you disconnects for days or weeks over a simple issue , such as where to put the treadmill or asking for a service for family that you are not convinced in ? The bolded is probably a lot of the issue. You are basically calling her feelings and her views "silly" and "simple." If YOU think it is unimportant, then you think she should get over it. Also, the part about you disagreeing with anything means being "in a cage" is disrespectful. What it sounds like you are saying is: My wife gets upset over nothing because she is silly, and she is irrational and punishes me for everything You are deciding your wife is not important, and then you are surprised she doesn't like it. Do you think you are better, smarter, etc. than your wife? 3 Link to post Share on other sites
autumnnight Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 I will give a real life example. We were once with a group of friends, and while I was helping the hostess with the dishes, my ex was talking to the husband. The hostess is a very organized, type-A, neat person. She had a certain way all the pots/pans sat inside each other, a way the lids and tupperwear went in drawers, etc. Now, my kitchen is clean, but the pots and pans are not organized by size, etc. Yeah, sometimes when you pull out the pizza pan a cookie sheet slides out. I commented on her cabinets being so neat. My husband said, "Yeah, you should give autumn some pointers. Organization is not her strong point." It hurt my feelings. I didn't say anything then, but I mentioned it as gently as possible on the way home. His defense was "well, it's true, isn't it" and proceeded to tell me he didn't mean it as an insult and I was silly to be hurt. Guess how THAT went over. No, I did not cut him off for weeks, but it hurt that he just blew off my feelings and made me feel stupid. Link to post Share on other sites
Rejected Rosebud Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 OP I think it would help you if you would look at your relationship like it's an entity of its own and there are things you both can do to make it better, or to dissolve it, instead of looking at it like you're a fine man involved with an unreasonable cold mentally ill woman. Also if she is actually really mentally ill you are not going to find out answers about that by talking to "venus" here on LS as mentally ill people behave outside of what is usually considered normal! 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Maybeoneday11 Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 (edited) You need to be direct. Ask her specific questions. Touching is something that actually helps. If you can hold her hand while you talk to her then do so. You need to think about how YOU come across. Are you coming across as a pushover or a bully? Too much of either will destroy your chances, especially now. Find that middle and sway towards one when the time calls for it. Think of it like cooking. You can add but not subtract so don't go too far. Stop wasting time on the petty arguments. First you have to determine if there is a chance anymore. Look her in her eyes. There is NO pride. NO impatience. NO hurtful words. And most importantly, DO NOT give up when things get hard. Show her that you can handle the pressure of her feelings. Also.. be prepared for her answers. There may be some things that will devastate you. That should be expected so mentally prepare for it. Ask: Do you love me? Do you want to be with me? Why? Now here you can choose to push further no matter the answer. If you can get this far, you are halfway there. If you choose to continue, show her you can be trusted. Make sure you get close and grab her hand if you can. Keep eye contact. If she said yes to those first two questions, this is when you need to hold her to it. If she offers resistance, then let her know! "If you love me and want to be with me, then we have to communicate. You don't have to run away. I'm here. Let me be here for you. I know I have messed up things with you. I want to understand the extent of my mistakes. I want to turn that around. Let's get through this together." Now.. if she says no, you HAVE to find out why? Get those exact reasons. Don't settle for mediocre default answers. "I love you and I never wanted our love to turn to this. Help me understand what has happened to us." You need to learn from your mistakes. Whether you will be with her or not, you still have room to grow as a man. Understand what went wrong. Get to the ROOT! The treadmill is like a mirage. It is a distraction from finding the real reason for her frustrations. This imo is a form of fitness testing. Don't keep falling prey. Insanity means extreme foolishness or irrationality. Repeating the same way of doing things and expecting different results is a form of insanity. As far as the kids go, are they watching this go on? are they smothered by the dysfunction? What do they see? How do they feel? What do they think?This part should be a family discussion. Roots man roots. Direct questions are key. Stop staying together for the kids. If the divorce needs to happen then as ADULTS you both need to explain what is going on. Talk to your kids. You may be surprised at how far you will get with their understanding. Does your love for them change? Stop trying to understand the psychology of "women". Instead focus on what matters. Repairing the marriage and being happy or moving on and being happy. Good luck man. Hope this gives you some ideas! Edited May 21, 2015 by Maybeoneday11 forgot to add something 1 Link to post Share on other sites
xxoo Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 If your husband irritate you by having a different opinion that yours on a non-crucial issue , , and he doesn't irritate you again , how many hours/days it takes from u to calm down ? I don't get over stuff without working it out. But we work stuff out. We don't dismiss each other's concerns. We communicate, consider each other's opinions and point of view, and problem solve something that works for both of us. So far, that's served us well for over 20 years of marriage. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Author Phoenician Posted May 21, 2015 Author Share Posted May 21, 2015 I will give a real life example. We were once with a group of friends, and while I was helping the hostess with the dishes, my ex was talking to the husband. The hostess is a very organized, type-A, neat person. She had a certain way all the pots/pans sat inside each other, a way the lids and tupperwear went in drawers, etc. Now, my kitchen is clean, but the pots and pans are not organized by size, etc. Yeah, sometimes when you pull out the pizza pan a cookie sheet slides out. I commented on her cabinets being so neat. My husband said, "Yeah, you should give autumn some pointers. Organization is not her strong point." It hurt my feelings. I didn't say anything then, but I mentioned it as gently as possible on the way home. His defense was "well, it's true, isn't it" and proceeded to tell me he didn't mean it as an insult and I was silly to be hurt. Guess how THAT went over. No, I did not cut him off for weeks, but it hurt that he just blew off my feelings and made me feel stupid. That's a real example , a normal person would not escape for weeks ... though hurt , I never said that it is silly to her , though i believe it is . I just said tredmill doesnt fit in our bedroom and no , she is smater , I ask her a question in a nice way , never recieve an answer , instead she puzzles me with a question... Link to post Share on other sites
Author Phoenician Posted May 21, 2015 Author Share Posted May 21, 2015 This ^^^ is what I was thinking too. I'd definitely "shut down" and get disgusted toward my partner if he thought my concerns were silly or unimportant. That's a relationship-ender. What's the point in interacting with someone who is dismissive of what you think and feel? If he also thought that I was lazy and selfish, as you've described your wife, I'd check out of that relationship at least emotionally. Blueiris,so if yourpartner gently said that a treadmil wont fit in bedroom ,though you dont even exercise an though u know that putting it there while other logical options exists ,you would be insulted? And diconnect for weeks althoigh this is the only "humilating" action that came from his side during that period? Link to post Share on other sites
Author Phoenician Posted May 21, 2015 Author Share Posted May 21, 2015 One thing that attracted me in few posts that if a partner resond to a physical need ,this willbe duty sex ? And when partner is a demon for a single minute it is normal to torture him/her foweeks . Is it acceptable the other way ? Flip roles Link to post Share on other sites
xxoo Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 Blueiris,so if yourpartner gently said that a treadmil wont fit in bedroom ,though you dont even exercise an though u know that putting it there while other logical options exists ,you would be insulted? And diconnect for weeks althoigh this is the only "humilating" action that came from his side during that period? Why does she want it there? How was the conflict navigated on each side? 2 Link to post Share on other sites
BlueIris Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 Blueiris,so if yourpartner gently said that a treadmil wont fit in bedroom ,though you dont even exercise an though u know that putting it there while other logical options exists ,you would be insulted? And diconnect for weeks althoigh this is the only "humilating" action that came from his side during that period? If I proposed having a treadmill in the bedroom and he didn’t want it there, I would not be insulted. However, if he called me silly, lazy or selfish, or rolled his eyes or mocked me… or even if he just went on and on about not putting it in the bedroom without suggesting possible alternatives (fighting rather than solving, working together), I’d also think he was more concerned about some kind of power struggle than about where we should put the treadmill. If he didn’t want it there, I’d think we’d discuss where to put it instead. It’s only a treadmill. Another thing that some “rejectable” sorts do is use the “you always…” or “you never…” or “this is just like you to…” or they dreadge up past stuff, like: “Sure, put the treadmill there, you never care what I think, just like last New Year’s when you….” I don’t deal with folks like that- at home, in social settings or at work- because they’re not concerned about teamwork and getting things done. They’re about their power-struggles. To be honest, I tend to tell them they’re right (to end the verbal stream) and then just shut them off, don’t deal with them. But I’d also expect both people to be willing to give in. So if I didn’t want it there and he did, and we couldn’t agree where to put it, I’d suggest- “let’s try it here for a couple of weeks and see if it’s ok or we think of a better place.” Also saying it gently wouldn’t be the determinant. Cooperation and respect as a foundation for discussion and problem-solving as a couple is the determinant. In the end, it's just a treadmill.... 1 Link to post Share on other sites
autumnnight Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 I never said that it is silly to her , though i believe it is . She may have picked up on this. However, if your W truly has BPD and is not involved in therapy (preferably CBT), then none of the "regular" things people suggest are going to work most likely. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
BlueIris Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 OP, the only person we can control is ourself. So, as xxoo suggested, maybe think through the entire dynamic. This gives me pause: One thing that attracted me in few posts that if a partner resond to a physical need ,this willbe duty sex ? And when partner is a demon for a single minute it is normal to torture him/her foweeks . Is it acceptable the other way ? Flip roles "A demon for a single minute?" That sounds very worrisome. I would reject someone who was a demon EVER, and I'd expect to be rejected if I were a demon EVER. I wouldn't have sex with someone that I witnessed being demonic, and certainly not if he was demonic toward me. That's such a horrible turn off, disgusting to me. Maybe think through want you said or did. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
elaine567 Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 Blueiris,so if yourpartner gently said that a treadmil wont fit in bedroom ,though you dont even exercise an though u know that putting it there while other logical options exists ,you would be insulted? And diconnect for weeks althoigh this is the only "humilating" action that came from his side during that period? After 15 years I doubt it has anything to do with the treadmill per se. There are far deeper issues here and that is for you to figure out. Where has the treadmill ended up? 15 hours a day of TV, I guess means she is retreating into some sort of woman cave. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Popsicle Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 I bet you if you tell your kids how unhappy you are, they would WANT you to divorce. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Popsicle Posted May 22, 2015 Share Posted May 22, 2015 This may sound crazy to you, but why not just say "I'm sorry" and let her have her way? 1 Link to post Share on other sites
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