BF jealous of my best guy friend and I

[smackie9]

Smackie

 

I don't think that violence is ever justified but neither is being dishonest in a relationship. OP has admitted that she intentionally kept the past relationship with Dan from her BF. This too is wrong. When Jeff tried to have a talk with her, she would not come clean with the details of her relationship with Jeff.

 

They are both very young and hopefully will both learn from their mistakes. To only fault Jeff seems a bit selective to me.

 

You and I are on the same side of the table most of the time and maybe in this case we'll just have to agree to disagree. They both have a fair share of fault in this and hopefully will grow from the experience.

Dishonesty and physical violence should never be compared. I never once said dishonesty was OK. Violence is on a whole different level of wrong.

 

My comment was directed at Spectre not about this thread. What he posted was disturbing. IMO it exhibited something he would have one himself. He shows such hate towards women and as I pointed out, he never posts the same way about dishonest, or cheating guys or male posters.

 

As to this thread, everything that you just posted has been repeated several times. The OP already has acknowledge these posts waaay waaaay back. At this point it's redundant.

[qubist]

Re: billyjohn

 

I admit that I should have told Jeff earlier about my friendship with Dan. I was unsure and scared because I have never told anyone else about my friendship with Dan and Jeff and I got close very fast so I feel we were trying to slow things down and trying to get to know each other. I did not TAUNT Jeff. Why would I do that? The birthday was just a party and a bunch of my high school buddies got together to throw Dan a party, so we all I chipped in. I wasn't the only that "threw" him a party. The gift was Assassin's Creed graphic books because Dan liked them. Everyone else also bought him gifts as well. The only thing that was unfortunate was that I never got to throw a party for Jeff because it wasn't his Birthday and we already broke up. I really do regret that because I can really to prove to him.

 

Dan's relationship with his gf was his business and he was quite private about it and it was fine. We rarely talked about our partners when we hang out. Its mostly small talk, jokes and schoolwork. There are no talks of feelings or attraction to each other. I do not know why Dan broke up his gf and I won't ask him why.

 

Cutting back time with Dan was what I did because I wanted to spend more time with Jeff. Since Jeff is studying in another university I had to travel to spend time with Jeff. Dan studies in the same university as I do. I also DID enjoy my time with Jeff and we had a lot of fun. I will say that the sex was intimate and full of emotions. I didn't regret spending time with Jeff, so please stop saying that.

out of curiosity. would you consider a second run with Jeff if he came asking for it?

[kgcolonel]

Ya know, I too think that the OP horribly mishandled her relationship, and thus caused it to fail. Even so, I kinda think this topic has run it's course, and do not understand why a few posters are conducted what seems to be a bit of a witch hunt against her. We have all screwed up a relationship or two, those of us who have actually had relationships, anyway. I think it's time to give the OP a bit of a break. I think she gets the point.

 

I completely agree. At first I was on the Jeff team and to some extent still am however, Heer has come back several times and probably done her best to clarify, respond and answer questions while some of us have been, in my opinion rather harsh with the young lady. Yes, she made some mistakes but has also admitted them. Let's let her be and Heer, if you read this, feel free to check off this thread if you wish. You have had more than your share of advise here as well as criticism. I only wish you and Jeff could have made things work as it appeared that you two really did care for each other.

 

Thanks for stepping up and not running away from the hard questions posted here.

 

KGColonel

[kgcolonel]

Dishonesty and physical violence should never be compared. I never once said dishonesty was OK. Violence is on a whole different level of wrong.

 

My comment was directed at Spectre not about this thread. What he posted was disturbing. IMO it exhibited something he would have one himself. He shows such hate towards women and as I pointed out, he never posts the same way about dishonest, or cheating guys or male posters.

 

As to this thread, everything that you just posted has been repeated several times. The OP already has acknowledge these posts waaay waaaay back. At this point it's redundant.

 

Good point, I must have misread the post. I don't support or compare violence or dishonesty. Neither is acceptable within or outside of a relationship. Not comparing only stating the obvious.

[billyjohn]

I admit that I should have told Jeff earlier about my friendship with Dan. I was unsure and scared because I have never told anyone else about my friendship with Dan and Jeff and I got close very fast so I feel we were trying to slow things down and trying to get to know each other. I did not TAUNT Jeff. Why would I do that? The birthday was just a party and a bunch of my high school buddies got together to throw Dan a party, so we all I chipped in. I wasn't the only that "threw" him a party. The gift was Assassin's Creed graphic books because Dan liked them. Everyone else also bought him gifts as well. The only thing that was unfortunate was that I never got to throw a party for Jeff because it wasn't his Birthday and we already broke up. I really do regret that because I can really to prove to him.

 

Gotcha. I don't think you were taunting him. I don't think it was intentional. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. But it showed that you valued your "BFF" way more than your boyfriend. Dan came before Jeff to the extreme. And you admitted it in the end. You never really "loved" Jeff. You "love" Dan. And you were self-centered and self-absorbed beyond belief to think that Jeff would accept being the "third wheel" just for the pleasure of some very limited time with you.

 

Dan's relationship with his gf was his business and he was quite private about it and it was fine. We rarely talked about our partners when we hang out. Its mostly small talk, jokes and schoolwork. There are no talks of feelings or attraction to each other. I do not know why Dan broke up his gf and I won't ask him why.

Yes, but did Jeff know that Dan didn't have a girlfriend by the time you were planning the party? That's what I want to know. And if he didn't, he was bound to find out. It's amazing that you would do this now that Dan didn't have a girlfriend anymore.

 

But I don't think you were intentionally trying to hurt Jeff, no. But he was definitely your "cuddle bitch", whether you realized it or not. You were expecting him to put up with literally ANYTHING or else you would dump him. What's funny is, he was on the verge of agreeing to the terms ("I understand but it makes me uncomfortable") but you ended up dumping him anyway, just because you had "been through to much"!!! You actually dumped Jeff because you did not want to give him any more chances to prove his unconditional "love" for you, i.e. you gave up right when he was about to agree that you could pretty much do whatever you wanted!!!

To discard Jeff at this point reveals that you didn't really even like him that much at all. Let's be honest about that.

 

Wow, you must be a very beautiful girl.... For Dan to want spend all his time with a girl who insists (no sex is your decision, not his) that they be "BFFs", i.e. he gets no sex; and for Jeff to still want to keep you knowing he will get about 10% of your time compared to Dan, you must be drop dead gorgeous. You are, aren't you?

 

 

Cutting back time with Dan was what I did because I wanted to spend more time with Jeff. Since Jeff is studying in another university I had to travel to spend time with Jeff. Dan studies in the same university as I do. I also DID enjoy my time with Jeff and we had a lot of fun. I will say that the sex was intimate and full of emotions. I didn't regret spending time with Jeff, so please stop saying that.

No. You reluctantly "cut back" on your time with Dan for Jeff. You didn't regret all of the time you spent with Jeff. You really enjoyed some of it. But you regretted having to spend as much time with him as you did, because if it were up to you, Jeff would have gotten even less. We both know this is true, and you revealed it throughout your post by always saying you were "cutting back" or "scaling back" time with Dan. That reveals you were intentionally sacrificing your time with Dan because something else had to be done. "Cutting back" or "scaling back" implies that you don't really want to do it, and you were "cutting back" throughout the entire time with Jeff.

 

When you said you were "cutting back" on your time with Dan for Jeff, we both know that by that you meant that you occasionally sacrifice being with Dan for Jeff. You said, "He knows that I have been cutting down on my time with Dan, and I told him that" as an attempt to appease or compromise with Jeff. To help assuage Jeff's rightful uncomfortableness you were reminding him that you often sacrifice some time with Dan for him. And this reluctant "cutting back" was going on throughout the thread.

 

No, we both know that you liked your time, generally speaking, with Dan much much more than Jeff. Dan is your soulmate, not Jeff. And you know this. Jeff was actually your FWB that you had to call a "boyfriend" to be right and proper. Just like Dan's "girlfriend" was only an FWB (your own words).

 

How sad.... You and Dan love, and I mean truly love, each other, but either you or both of you are not interested physically/sexually. I think he is but you are not.

 

Obviously, the preferred solution is to find a soulmate that you also desire physically. Why don't you do that and set your cuddle kitten Dan loose?

 

P.S. Tell the honest truth, Heer. Try to remember your time with Jeff. Go over it from beginning to end in your mind. Then honestly answer this:

 

Who got the bulk of the time throughout your relationship with Jeff?

And over what periods?

 

I think if you're honest you'd have to admit that Dan got much more time in comparison to Jeff, at least for most of the relationship....

[billyjohn]

Cutting back time with Dan was what I did because I wanted to spend more time with Jeff. Since Jeff is studying in another university I had to travel to spend time with Jeff. Dan studies in the same university as I do. I also DID enjoy my time with Jeff and we had a lot of fun. I will say that the sex was intimate and full of emotions. I didn't regret spending time with Jeff, so please stop saying that.

No. You reluctantly "cut back" on your time with Dan for Jeff. You didn't regret all of the time you spent with Jeff. You really enjoyed some of it. But you regretted having to spend as much time with him as you did, because if it were up to you, Jeff would have gotten even less. We both know this is true, and you revealed it throughout your post by always saying you were "cutting back" or "scaling back" time with Dan. That reveals you were intentionally sacrificing your time with Dan because something else had to be done. "Cutting back" or "scaling back" implies that you don't really want to do it, and you were "cutting back" throughout the entire time with Jeff.

 

When you said you were "cutting back" on your time with Dan for Jeff, we both know that by that you meant that you occasionally sacrifice being with Dan for Jeff. You said, "He knows that I have been cutting down on my time with Dan, and I told him that" as an attempt to appease or compromise with Jeff. To help assuage Jeff's rightful uncomfortableness you were reminding him that you often sacrifice some time with Dan for him. And this reluctant "cutting back" was going on throughout the thread.

 

No, we both know that you liked your time, generally speaking, with Dan much much more than Jeff. Dan is your soulmate, not Jeff. And you know this. Jeff was actually your FWB that you had to call a "boyfriend" to be right and proper. Just like Dan's "girlfriend" was only an FWB (your own words).

 

How sad.... You and Dan love, and I mean truly love, each other, but either you or both of you are not interested physically/sexually. I think he is but you are not.

 

Obviously, the preferred solution is to find a soulmate that you also desire physically. Why don't you do that and set your cuddle kitten Dan loose?

 

P.S. Tell the honest truth, Heer. Try to remember your time with Jeff. Go over it from beginning to end in your mind. Then honestly answer this:

 

Who got the bulk of the time throughout your relationship with Jeff?

And over what periods?

 

I think if you're honest you'd have to admit that Dan got much more time in comparison to Jeff, at least for most of the relationship.

 

And also, again, let's be honest:

 

You enjoy flirting with Dan when you are with him, and often do.

 

You admitted the way you "knew for a fact" that it was platonic was because "we've had that conversation before, and it was flirting before I met my bf. I have toned down on the flirting and am now acting more friendly".

 

Let's be honest. You enjoy flirting and teasing Dan sometimes. He's not supposed to come on to you, he's agreed. He's not allowed. You get a rise out of tempting Dan, it's fun to watch him try to resist the temptation. You admitted this when you said "Yes, we cuddled once but there were numerous other "chances" and we did not succumb to temptation." And I bet you must admit you make yourself look pretty, maybe even sexy, before hanging out with Dan.

 

Face it, OP. Jeff picked up on this too and it of course made him insanely jealous. Which you also like doing sometimes, true?

 

He knew there was probably some flirting, some temptation, going on, and there was, and that is why he was jealous.

[Rephinican]

I must confess, when I first read through this thread as a lurker I was very much on Jeff's side over Heer's but quite frankly I think that both of them made mistakes during the relationship.

 

Heer as you know and have acknowledged you should have told Jeff about your friendship with Dan. And you should have especially mentioned the naked cuddling or at the very least that the two of you had "gotten somewhat intimate" if you did not want to provide details. I have plenty of female friends and my girlfriend used to be very much the jealous type (or at least much more than I am) and she used to have a ton of problems with some of my female friends that were flirting with me. Honestly, I couldn't even tell they were doing that (I was incapable of seeing them as romantic partners and thus it didn't come across as flirting) and once I found out I cleared it up almost immediately. Whenever I go out with a female friend, go study with a female classmate, or interact with a girl in a one-on-one setting without my girlfriend present I tell her about it. Not in detail (she's neither a history nor politics major and I think my theories on the social formation of race and how it represents less of a paradigm shift as a new definition of previous existing trends through conquest... or something like that would bore the heck out of her:p) and not because she makes me tell her. But because talking about opposite sex friends eliminates the veil of secrecy that makes people suspicious and can mean that you get to keep your friends as opposed to having to reduce contact or give them up for your significant other. Had you told Jeff about Dan earlier I doubt that he would have had as much of a problem as he did.

 

Jeff made a huge mistake when he got physical with you. You didn't deserve that. No one ever deserves their partner getting physical with them. Is his anger understandable due to the whole situation with Dan? Sure. Are his actions justifiable due to the whole situation with Dan? Not in the slightest. He shouldn't have done that, and I'm glad that even though you have ended your relationship with him you seem to have parted more cordially than his incident of violence would suggest.

 

There are two issues in this relationship: The fact that Dan was kept as a secret for far too long (and that the naked cuddling was never revealed), and the fact that Jeff got physical before Dan's birthday party. Neither of these two issues excuses the other, and neither issue can be downplayed due to the existence of the other. Both participants in this relationship made mistakes, and to demonize one or the other is to ignore half of the issues in the relationship. Yes, some issues were around longer than others but it only takes a single cut that removes the head to do more damage than a niggling shoulder injury. Time is not an accurate way of rating the severity of relationship issues, and I think it's fair to say that even if Jeff's issues emerged later he was equally to blame for the collapse of this relationship as Heer.

 

Now, contrary to my initial opinion, Heer has earned my respect. She stayed around, took her lumps, clarified her position more and she seems to understand that she made a mistake here. However, she was not the only one who made a mistake in this relationship and she did not force Jeff to react in the way he did. To suggest that is patently false and represents a fundamental misunderstanding of how people think and how humans operate.

 

Honestly, I'm not sure much more can be garnered from this thread save for anger and more pain both from Heer and from some of the posters who may be triggered by her story or even by her positive demeanor in the wake of her story. If Jeff or Dan was posting here, we could get another side of the story, but to assume Heer is not telling is the truth (or at least as much of the truth as she knows) is unreasonable based on her numerous posts and clarifications designed to answer posters' concerns. I think Occam's Razor comes into play here as it is much more likely that Heer made mistakes in her relationship, has learned from them (or at least some of them), and understands how to not make similar mistakes in the future than it is that she is nefariously manipulating people here while pining after Dan even though she states that she is not interested in him.

 

Anyways, there's really nothing more to say here. And unless Heer would like to continue this thread while providing updates about her continued interactions with Jeff (should there be any) or her friendship with Dan as a whole, I think everything has been discussed to death by this point.

 

I wish Heer the best of luck with her studies and hope that she has learned from this experience

 

-Reph

[Heer]

Re Billy:

 

I won't comment on Dan's relationship with his gf because I really don't know much about it other than gossip within my own circle of friends and they're mostly just making stuff up. I only "love" Dan in a platonic way and my feelings towards him never changed since day 1 when we met and we got close over the years but the feelings never changed. We're still platonic. I will admit that we might have crossed the line when we cuddled but it was because of the pressure of school and it was one thing that led to another. It was not premeditated and Dan and I agreed that its best if we moved on from that night. Again, this was hashed out the morning after the cuddling and it was a mutual understanding. I had plenty of time to ask him out and he had the same as well but we didn't and we moved on into relationships. Under no circumstances did he get a gf to make me jealous and I did not find Jeff to "get back" at Dan. I would never hurt Dan, Jeff or my friends and for what?

 

 

I cut back time with Dan because I realized I had a boyfriend and I wanted to spend more time with Jeff and get to know him better. I have almost 10 years worth of friendship with Dan and Jeff and I weren't even together for a year from start to finish. He was uncomfortable with Dan and I so I cut back and included him, I feel thats a reasonable solution won't you say? The mistake was me not telling him the full history between Dan and I and he started to nag me which made me more uncomfortable. I was uncomfortable to start with because we weren't that close and I keep certain things to myself.

[billyjohn]

I won't comment on Dan's relationship with his gf because I really don't know much about it other than gossip within my own circle of friends and they're mostly just making stuff up. I only "love" Dan in a platonic way and my feelings towards him never changed since day 1 when we met and we got close over the years but the feelings never changed. We're still platonic. I will admit that we might have crossed the line when we cuddled but it was because of the pressure of school and it was one thing that led to another. It was not premeditated and Dan and I agreed that its best if we moved on from that night. Again, this was hashed out the morning after the cuddling and it was a mutual understanding. I had plenty of time to ask him out and he had the same as well but we didn't and we moved on into relationships. Under no circumstances did he get a gf to make me jealous and I did not find Jeff to "get back" at Dan. I would never hurt Dan, Jeff or my friends and for what?

 

Sorry, Heer. I have only now read some of your other posts. I think I now understand the situation a lot better.

 

I now realize why Dan got a gf. Normal reason - sex. Of course he will get a gf after you let him know you are not interested in that kind of relationship with him. And I feel the same now with Jeff. You just wanted a bf for normal reasons.

 

But you definitely played Jeff by trying to hide all your time with Dan from the very beginning. You tried to have a secret relationship with Dan behind his back, not a sexual one, but one that made it clear that he was not #1 in your life, and that you did not really love him. The b-day party and gifts for Dan, right after Jeff knows that Dan is now available, show this to the extreme. You "played" Jeff by making it out like you really cared for him, when in reality you didn't give a crap about making him jealous beyond measure. His feelings meant nothing to you. You even refused to tell him what the present was, because "it was a surprise". It clearly appears to be "taunting", even if you were so obsessed with Dan that you couldn't see it, and it's amazing that all Jeff did was rip it open and throw some books around. Any guy being openly "side fiddled" like that would respond the same way. It was pure humiliation for him, and if it wasn't intentional on your part it shows complete disregard for the person. You "played" him because you made him think that your "FWB" relationship was something more.

 

I cut back time with Dan because I realized I had a boyfriend and I wanted to spend more time with Jeff and get to know him better. I have almost 10 years worth of friendship with Dan and Jeff and I weren't even together for a year from start to finish. He was uncomfortable with Dan and I so I cut back and included him, I feel thats a reasonable solution won't you say? The mistake was me not telling him the full history between Dan and I and he started to nag me which made me more uncomfortable. I was uncomfortable to start with because we weren't that close and I keep certain things to myself.

No, it's very unreasonable to think that Jeff would be happy sharing his time with you. You wanted to make it a sort of "threesome", with Dan being the cuddle-bitch and Jeff the "man". I won't judge you for that, but the fact that Dan knew this while Jeff did not shows definite "playing" and using people. Dan understood what you wanted and had no problem with it, but you deceived Jeff and gave him a completely false picture of who this "good friend" really is. You openly deceived him so you could have them both, and that's "playing" people.

 

BTW, from reading your sexual proclivities in some other threads, it's still not clear to me just how far you and Jeff went, nor how far you and Dan might go and you consider it "platonic". Very strange and inconsistent definitions of "sex" throughout them.

 

For example, Heer, it appears that mostly you and Jeff did not do natural intercourse with a penis, but only "foreplay", which included "handjobs", "footjobs", "blowjobs", "dildos", etc. To me, that is clearly "sex" if either party climaxes. So I must ask,

 

Did your "sex" with Jeff include him climaxing, having an orgasm. And did you yourself achieve orgasm?

 

Because you realize that if either of you did most people would call that "sex" and not "foreplay"?

[Clay]

Jeff clearly did the right thing. I am sure in time he will find a far better partner for himself. Lieing and hiding things never gets you anywhere in life. I think all you did in this case is be shady and your idea of what you think was fair was based on the fact that you and only you knew the truth about your relationship with Dan. Hopefully in the future you will see just how wrong this was.

 

When you are in a relationship that person in your life takes priority over friendships. If those friendships start to threaten your relationship then you need to decide what you really want. Your partner? Or your Friend.

 

C

[thecharade]

Heer, your answers and explanations make perfect, reasonable sense. Even if you had told Jeff everything from the get go, it does not sound like the outcome would have been any different. There are much more level-headed guys than Jeff who will not ask you to sever friendships with everyone of the opposite sex. I stood up in the wedding when one of my guy friends got married! And one of my aunts became best friends with her husband's ex! No jealousy, no issue.

 

[Heer]

Hi everyone, as you all know I've been broken up for around 2 weeks and I just wanted to give everyone a big hug *gives big hug* to everyone that commented. I talked to Jeff the last few days and it was very emotional and we were very honest to each other.

 

I confessed that I had a close relationship with Dan and Jeff said that he knew but never knew we were that close and he said that I never told him the entire truth. I told him I agreed and the reason why I didn't tell wasn't to hurt him but because I was scared and I didn't want him to get mad as well. Since Jeff is my first serious bf I told him that I didn't know if it was appropriate to tell him and what I should tell him and what I shouldn't keep to myself. I feel that I might embarrass myself and Dan if another person knew about us cuddling. Both Dan and I swore that we shouldn't tell anyone else about that night especially our parents. Its kind of like our little secret and I was scared of the repercussions if someone else knew. I apologized to Jeff and told him that I should've told him and I hope he understands why I didn't tell him about Dan. He said that he really hated how I acted more normal when I was with Dan than I was with him and said that he was angry about that. I told him that Dan and I knew each other for 10 years and we both are close friends so of course I might be a bit more open when I was with Dan, but that does not mean that I didn't love you (Jeff). Of course it takes time to fall in love and I really did cherish the moments we had together and I don't regret it. I told him that believe it or not I love him a lot more than I love Dan because you're my bf and Dan is a friend. Jeff said that he loved me too but my actions didn't translate to me loving him. I cried after this :( because I couldn't believe that Jeff would think I didn't love him after all this time. He said that looking back he understands that I loved him but he couldn't see it at the heat of the moment.

[anna121]

 

For example, Heer, it appears that mostly you and Jeff did not do natural intercourse with a penis, but only "foreplay", which included "handjobs", "footjobs", "blowjobs", "dildos", etc. To me, that is clearly "sex" if either party climaxes. So I must ask,

 

Did your "sex" with Jeff include him climaxing, having an orgasm. And did you yourself achieve orgasm?

 

Because you realize that if either of you did most people would call that "sex" and not "foreplay"?

 

Srsly?

 

This is creepy.

 

Heer, I can't help but why you continue to respond to these incredibly invasive and frankly voyeuristic questions??

[anna121]

Jeff clearly did the right thing. I am sure in time he will find a far better partner for himself. Lieing and hiding things never gets you anywhere in life. I think all you did in this case is be shady and your idea of what you think was fair was based on the fact that you and only you knew the truth about your relationship with Dan. Hopefully in the future you will see just how wrong this was.

 

When you are in a relationship that person in your life takes priority over friendships. If those friendships start to threaten your relationship then you need to decide what you really want. Your partner? Or your Friend.

 

C

 

Gosh, maybe if Jeff's next gf is a better partner, he will be able to restrain himself from throwing things at her.

[Heer]

Srsly?

 

This is creepy.

 

Heer, I can't help but why you continue to respond to these incredibly invasive and frankly voyeuristic questions??

 

Hello Anna!! Well the original reason why I joined this forum is because I had problems regarding sex with Jeff. You can find the thread in the sexual and reproductive board. I feel that loveshack is a good environment to discuss personal issues so thats why I usually respond. It would be wayyy to awkward in real life :o:o:o:o

[Heer]

Another thing we talked about was his anger issues:

 

I told Jeff that I was very scared and humiliated that night when he went berserk. When I told him about Dan's party Jeff was really mad that night and he was very angry. I had Dan's gift wrapped up and he literally took it out of my hands and ripped out all of the pages and threw them at me. All the while calling me very derogatory and demeaning names. He said that he hated how I acted like a $lut when I acted friendly and how he hated me when his friends were talking about me. I was crying like crazy and when I told him I'm gonna leave he pulled me out and I had to call a taxi back to my place. I had never been so scared and humiliated in my life. Jeff said that he was very sorry and was worried when I didn't return his calls the next morning. He said that he was very sorry and didn't mean a word of it. He said that the reason why he had this outburst was because he cared about me and he hated when I acted too friendly to Dan or with anyone else. He said that he was very sorry and it won't happen ever again. I said that I forgave him and I am also very sorry for my part.

 

Jeff did say that I was the first gf to ever cook for him and wash his clothes so he told me he appreciates it and that he really did love and care for me. He says that he understands that we need some space and he wants me to do good at school. I really felt a lot better after he said that and he says that he hopes to keep in contact. I said that we should and that was it. I cried the entire night after that :(:(

[Rephinican]

But seriously, this entire interrogation does sound rather one-sided don't you think? I feel like Heer has been pretty open with all of us about answering these questions and that she's trying to be as honest as possible to all the posters and to Jeff. She finally told him all the details about her and Dan's relationship (even though she really didn't have to-- but seriously good on ya Heer) and she has shared some things about Jeff's anger outburst that she did not previously mention that paints a significantly more extreme picture than I first thought. Saying that Heer is making all of these mistakes, refusing to acknowledge the progress she's made (she began this thread talking about how it was okay for her to keep Dan a secret from Jeff all-together and now she's basically told him all there is to tell) is misguided to say the least.

 

It almost seems like Heer can do nothing right to billyjohn other than admit that she was secretly lusting after Dan all this time and never really loved Jeff at all and was merely stringing him along for her own sadistic amusement and her continued security. And quite simply, I don't think that's true billyjohn. And I don't think Heer thinks that's true either. And honestly, I don't think Jeff thinks that's true anymore. And to say you know more about another person's scenario than that person themselves is just egotistical as well as patently false. So billyjohn, do you think you know more about this scenario than Heer? Or are you willing to accept her answers even though you may not agree with them 100%?

 

Heer, I'm sorry that your relationship with Jeff didn't turn out well. And I'm sorry he called you all of those names and got violent with you. That's not the proper way to respond to a problem, and you didn't deserve that. But I think you have learned a few things from your experiences in this relationship that will serve you very well should you decide to get back together with Jeff (after he deals with that anger issue of course) or in your next relationship, so it's not like this was a total waste. Sometimes we have these sort of sad experiences in life that shape us and make us better people even though we did not necessarily want to have them. I think that in time you'll find this relationship with Jeff was one of these shaping experiences.

 

Sorry for your pain and wishing you happiness in your future,

 

-Reph

Edited November 23, 2015 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
clean-up response to deleted posts ~6

[Clay]

Gosh, maybe if Jeff's next gf is a better partner, he will be able to restrain himself from throwing things at her.

 

We all do things in the heat of the moment. While it sure is wrong it sound like he was really hurt. I have seen a few women in my life do the same things. I am not hunting them down to tell them how wrong they are for it. OP made a choice that she felt best suited her. Sadly in her case it did not.

 

Its clear to me people are seriously biased on these things. Imagine if it was guy hiding a girl he once cuddled naked with. I can just imagine all the people telling him what a lost cause he is.

 

The hope is that she will learn from this experience and hopefully she can make better decisions in the future.

 

C

[autumnnight]

I told Jeff that I was very scared and humiliated that night when he went berserk. When I told him about Dan's party Jeff was really mad that night and he was very angry. I had Dan's gift wrapped up and he literally took it out of my hands and ripped out all of the pages and threw them at me. All the while calling me very derogatory and demeaning names. He said that he hated how I acted like a $lut when I acted friendly and how he hated me when his friends were talking about me. I was crying like crazy and when I told him I'm gonna leave he pulled me out and I had to call a taxi back to my place. I had never been so scared and humiliated in my life. Jeff said that he was very sorry and was worried when I didn't return his calls the next morning. He said that he was very sorry and didn't mean a word of it. He said that the reason why he had this outburst was because he cared about me and he hated when I acted too friendly to Dan or with anyone else. He said that he was very sorry and it won't happen ever again. I said that I forgave him and I am also very sorry for my part.

 

Anyone who can read the above and still defend Jeff has some personal issues to work out...seriously.

 

Lying is wrong. This guy has no self control and is abusive.

 

Regardless of what the internet lets us believe, the latter IS worse than the former in this case.

[CalvinM]

That is such bs. She humiliated him. She's been seeing this guy behind his back and I suspect we're still not getting the full story. He invested time into the relationship and trust in her that Dan was "just a friend". She betrayed that trust.

 

I'm guessing you've never been cheated on. It's the worst pain in the world. I think he reacted the way most people would act in that situation.

 

Op, you've made your bed. You're a cancer and you'll get absolutely no sympathy from me. If Jeff is smart, he'll cut you out of his life completely.

[Spectre]

So you are saying it's justifiable for him to have acted with violence towards her.

 

I never said it is okay to act with violence, I'm just saying the OP treated this guy badly.

[Spectre]

Anyone who can read the above and still defend Jeff has some personal issues to work out...seriously.

 

Lying is wrong. This guy has no self control and is abusive.

 

Regardless of what the internet lets us believe, the latter IS worse than the former in this case.

 

I think you and I are reading a different reply. He ripped her gifts and threw them and yelled at her a bunch. Couples do have fights all the time with yelling. I am not condoning what Jeff did, but you are acting like he is a monster who beat the hell out of her.

 

I think it is obvious that Jeff just exploded. All the drama with Dan probably built up and this was the tipping point. It doesn't sound like Jeff was an abusive guy before this. Again I am not condoning any abuse of any kind, but it just seems like all the drama and games the OP played(whether she did it on purpose or not) all added up and drove the guy to the breaking point. I feel sorry for both, I don't condone violence I just want to say that again, but this was all just.. I don't know, maybe Jeff is just this crazy abusive guy. Maybe not, but nobody is innocent in this is what I guess my main point is.

 

I will be perfectly honest..if I was in Jeff's place I might of done some of the same things. I would never of physically touched anything or any gifts, but I probably would of flipped out and yelled or something. I'd never physically hit a woman unless she struck me first, but I definitely would of been pissed off.

Edited October 16, 2015 by Spectre

[Heer]

Please....I never set out to hurt Jeff:(:( Why would I do that? He has many good qualities and it was him that started the relationship. I was thankful and honoured that he asked me out and I will never forget that. I had never had a serious bf before and I had a close circle of friends from high school while being in a relationship with Jeff. I gradually distanced myself with my friends and Dan because I was in a relationship with Jeff but I did not cut off contact with any of my friends. I made a mistake of not telling Jeff about my past and I should have told him.

 

There's no conspiracy going on here....just mistakes on my part and his.

[autumnnight]

That is such bs. She humiliated him. She's been seeing this guy behind his back and I suspect we're still not getting the full story. He invested time into the relationship and trust in her that Dan was "just a friend". She betrayed that trust.

 

I'm guessing you've never been cheated on. It's the worst pain in the world. I think he reacted the way most people would act in that situation.

 

Op, you've made your bed. You're a cancer and you'll get absolutely no sympathy from me. If Jeff is smart, he'll cut you out of his life completely.

 

I have been cheated on. I'm still not over it. It crushed the life out of me.

 

If I had been violent, that would have been MY issue and MY responsibility.

[Spectre]

Please....I never set out to hurt Jeff:(:( Why would I do that? He has many good qualities and it was him that started the relationship. I was thankful and honoured that he asked me out and I will never forget that. I had never had a serious bf before and I had a close circle of friends from high school while being in a relationship with Jeff. I gradually distanced myself with my friends and Dan because I was in a relationship with Jeff but I did not cut off contact with any of my friends. I made a mistake of not telling Jeff about my past and I should have told him.

 

There's no conspiracy going on here....just mistakes on my part and his.

 

So somebody said you told Jeff about the cuddling but not that it was naked cuddling. Not sure if that was true or not? Though at this point I guess it is moot. Was just wondering if you did the whole "only tell part of the truth" here with Jeff.

 

Let me ask you another question. Let's say a few months from now you meet a new guy and begin dating. Are you going to inform this new guy about Dan and the naked cuddling? How are you going to handle future relationships when it comes to your friendship with Dan? What if you are with a guy, you tell him about your past with Dan, and he says Dan needs to 100% go. What then?

 

I have been cheated on. I'm still not over it. It crushed the life out of me.

 

If I had been violent, that would have been MY issue and MY responsibility.

 

Of course it would be your issue. But it still might behoove us if we tried to find out why you resorted to violence. Like I said I think Jeff exploded, I think he put up with stuff he shouldn't of and the OP took advantage of that and then boom, eruption. It's on him for letting that happen, but it would be silly if we didn't try to understand why, especially so the OP doesn't end up driving some other dude to the breaking point in the future. Since again, prior posts didn't indicate Jeff was this volatile guy and as a guy myself I can see why he'd be driven utterly crazy by this. His biggest mistake, IMO, wasn't the book throwing. It was not nipping the Dan thing in the butt a long time ago.

Edited October 16, 2015 by Spectre