Got dumped...

[GammaLeonis]

I've been following some of the posts for some time and I just need encouraging words to either move on or stay put. Basically, I need to vent.

 

I was in a wonderful STR with a woman. I'm 26 and she's 24. We met during our internship Aug. 2014. Didn't start going out until Dec. 2014. We had a talk and made the relationship more serious in early March and were planning on getting married some time next summer.

 

We lived in different cities that was about 45-min to 1-hour drive away. We worked a 7 on 7 off schedule since Feb. Unfortunately, we had a near opposite rotations, so we only had every other Tuesday to have the entire day to ourselves. Otherwise, we tried to visit each other during weekends before/after work. That was something we were working towards to work it out.

 

Additional info: I am active in the church group I'm in right now. She's been inactive in it since 18. Our last relationships were back in 2012 due to some bad breakups. For me, my previous ex essentially cheated on me. For her, it was a divorced army dude who seemed to play a cat-mouse game with his ex-wife.

 

I have met her family and we had plans to visit mine this Thanksgiving...that's not happening now.

 

Anyways...

 

On Sunday, May 17th, she drove down to visit me. She gave me the news that she was going to break up with me. Naturally, I was upset. I asked her why and I received the classics:

 

She had a gut feeling from the start that if she kept at it, she'd be hurt at the end and she's had that feeling since the inception of the relationship, but hoped that feeling would go away...

She felt something was missing and didn't know what it was.

 

The funny thing was, she was the one came to me in March to inquire if we should be in a more serious relationship. She had made mentions in the past that the only way our relationship would crash and burn is because I wanted to leave her...oh the irony.

 

She suggested to spend the evening on good-terms. We drove down to the chapel where we made our relationship official. Things got hot and heavy, but we didn't have sex. That was the agreement we had when we started dating...no premarital sex. I don't think she needed to lie to me about her being a virgin still. Even if she wasn't, it didn't bother me.

 

My ex made mention about how I hesitated to go further because that's just not who I am. And that as much as she wanted me to have sex with her, it wouldn't have been right. I wanted to go further, but she stopped me and saying how she wanted to protect me because she loved me.

 

We still spent the night making out and kept our Tuesday appointment.

 

Tuesday rolls around...she came to my place. I thought about many of the things she had said, including how I would be so much happier with someone else, etc. I told her I wanted to give her my coherent thought before we end things. She agreed to listen.

 

I told her I didn't care if she felt like she didn't live up to some of the more church-y standards because I knew she was a much better person than that. My boldest move was when I asked her to marry me, to which she broke down crying how she couldn't say yes and be unhappy like her parents. She insisted that something felt missing and she couldn't put her fingers on it. That she had felt that with one of her exes (who now has been married for some time by the way) and just wasn't in ours.

 

Growing desperate, I carried her into my room and attempted to engage in intercourse with her. I hesitated again. She proceeded to tell me that I wasn't the type of person who would do that. She wasn't sure if she could handle the emotional drain from noncommittal sex later. In fact, she would have been disappointed in me had we engaged in sex. So, she was pleasantly surprised that I wasn't just in it for her body.

 

So, we ended up just cuddling in my bed. She revealed more about her past. About how she was abused by some of her exes and finally explained how she got some of her scars on her legs (she used to tell me I would eventually know one day). I asked her why she was telling me all this and still felt comfortable being with me. She made mention how she knew I wouldn't hurt her and I was probably the nicest guy she's ever dated. She further states that her close friends advised her not to come to me that day, but she chose to come to me anyways.

 

My ex continued with that she had contemplated suicide before meeting me, but talking about our potential future gave her more hope. She felt I was special in some ways and she didn't want me to break my character just to have a moment of passion.

 

Well, we then went out for dinner. She told me that we probably shouldn't see each other for some time unless it's an emergency (being locked out of car is one...we both still have spare keys to each other's car). She felt August is a great time because that's when I move to a different part of the city and she would love to come help me move. My ex claimed that she would like to be friends and still hangout, but with bounds because she doesn't want the mutual attraction to cause us do crazy things.

 

Week one of BU, I texted her a message at a time and didn't respond until she responded. She still sent comic strips (something she's been doing since we've been together) to me last Sunday over FB chat.

 

I haven't texted her since the 26th. I do plan on dropping off a card to her mailbox just wishing her a safe trip to see her best friend who had a baby recently in TN and let her know that I will be here for her if she needs it. Then, I will just not contact her until she contacts me. I haven't completely moved on yet because something in me tells me it's not quite over, but I'm probably wrong.

 

Let me know your thoughts and I can fill in the holes and details as needed. I didn't fill them in because I didn't think most people would understand the setting.

 

Cheers

Edited May 30, 2015 by GammaLeonis

[Downtown]

GL, welcome to LoveShack. You describe a woman whom you started dating last December. A little more than two months later (early March), she is so ecstatic she is already "planning to get married" to you. Yet, just two months later (mid-May), she is so depressed she "contemplates suicide" right after dumping you. Do you realize you're describing the behavior an emotionally unstable woman? When you visited her family, did you hear anything about a history of bipolar disorder, severe hormone problems, or BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder)?

[GammaLeonis]

She said that she had contemplated suicide before meeting me. So, it's not because of the BU.

 

Her family has issues. I know she doesn't quite get along with her mom.

 

As for hormones, I know she mentioned how she had a bit of thyroid insufficiency and she feels tired easily at times.

[ZiggyZoo]

Honestly, this sounds done to me. It sounds like she doesn't have any bad feelings towards you per se, just not enough romantic ones. It doesn't matter WHY she feels like this, just that she does. Sometimes two people just don't click romantically. I also think that being "just friends" right now isn't the best idea, you're going to be wanting more and it's going to hurt when she doesn't feel the same way.

[GammaLeonis]

Why do people say all those lovey dicey stuff when they don't really feel that way is beyond me.

[GammaLeonis]

I guess I just find it surreal that she was on about how she was falling more in love with me with each passing day 2 weeks ago to I want to break up based on a gut feeling.

[ZiggyZoo]

People say that sort of thing because feelings aren't black and white. My guess is that she's felt something was off for a while and decided to end it, but felt differently when you two were actually together. She could very well have felt that she WAS falling more and more in love with you while you were there and the endorphins were flowing. But then she gets home and realizes that it just isn't what she really wants.

 

Of course, some people say one thing and mean another because they're jerks, but I don't see this with her. I think she's been very considerate of your feelings and beliefs, and truly doesn't want you to be hurt. The fact that she declined intimacy so it wouldn't make you feel worse is a great example of this.

[GammaLeonis]

Well, I'm just gonna let her go and see if we ever cross paths again. Time to move on.

[GammaLeonis]

Strangely, she still sends me a comic strip through FB message this Sunday during church like she's always done.

 

I feel like something needs to be addressed here...

[mightycpa]

Strangely, she still sends me a comic strip through FB message this Sunday during church like she's always done.

 

I feel like something needs to be addressed here...

 

You're right. Tell her to leave you alone until you're ready to contact her.

 

Unless, of course, you like being the yo-yo that she jerks up and down.

[hollycraze]

She's already comfortable with you...and the rapport/chemistry has been built well. unfortunately, she's not attracted to you! It seems like you've been her "revenge"...

 

My best advice: reject her sometimes, focus on doing your passion! Have attractive characters & lifestyle! Do it for yourself!

Edited June 30, 2015 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[mightycpa]

She's already comfortable with you...and the rapport/chemistry has been built well. unfortunately, she's not attracted to you! It seems like you've been her "revenge"...

 

My best advice: reject her sometimes, focus on doing your passion! Have attractive characters & lifestyle! Do it for yourself!

 

I'm a Dating coach...message me if you want to know more...

 

I would think that you'd capitalize both Dating and Coach, you know, to make it seem like a real title.

[FistOfTheNorthStar]

It is crazy how a little missing thing can end something you loved. Similar to me, me and my ex were "soulmates" when it came to a normal relationship but we had two different lifestyles. If it does not work, then its okay YOU WILL FIND someone who will have all of the qualities!

-F

[GammaLeonis]

Yeah...I'm not sure what the dating coach guy is saying.

 

I already planned on delivering a card tomorrow, which should address a few things. I'm not sure why people think you could stay friends like that after such a heartbreak, but I figured I should at least let her know.

 

Since I don't know anyone who has regretted their so-called intuition (or so they say), I'm not banking on the idea she could be regretting her decision in a short 2 weeks.

[GammaLeonis]

So, recently my ex told me the real reason why she decided to break up with me.

 

Turns out. She is a pathological liar (found out from her older sister). In addition, she really doesn't want committed relationships let alone marriage.

 

She's like a homosexual person who tries to convince himself that he isn't gay by getting married to a woman (fake it to make it.)

 

The reason why she left the church group was that she never wanted marriage. And, the church emphasizes on family, etc. She's not even sure about committed long-term relationships.

 

Perhaps she just never met the right person?

 

She thought I would make her feel otherwise about relationships, especially she took a two-year break before dating me after some terrible experiences.

 

Now, I think I have trust issues. The irony lies in the fact that she felt betrayed by me because I asked her sister about how I felt something was off about my ex. She talked about how she'll never visit home again because stuff that would be told to her family when in reality, I asked questions.

 

The best part is that she says she has trust issues.

Although, I do suspect it's a product of a traumatic experience in her early teens which she refuses to seek counseling for.

 

I just feel used and played. And yet, I pity her. Her odd behaviors are the reason why she's had several failed 6+ months relationships in the past.

 

I got all the answers I needed. I still extended the olive branch. She's just my hiking buddy now. Then again, she's a pathological liar (apparently trying to change it) as she claimed. Who knows...

Edited June 29, 2015 by GammaLeonis

[Downtown]

She thought I would make her feel otherwise about relationships.

GL, the reason I asked about a family history of BPD (Borderline Personality Disorder) is that BPDers (people having strong BPD traits) typically have the false self image of being "The Victim," always "The Victim." They therefore tend to perceive every new lover as "The Rescuer," which might explain why your Ex believed you were going to turn her life around.

 

The irony lies in the fact that she felt betrayed by me because I asked her sister about how I felt something was off about my ex.

Her feeling of betrayal and her inability to trust you is another warning sign for BPD because BPDers have extreme trust issues. This problem usually does not appear at the beginning of the relationship because her infatuation over the new partner convinces her that he is her rescuer -- thus holding her fears of abandonment and engulfment at bay. Yet, as soon as her infatuation starts evaporating -- typically at 4 to 6 months into the R/S -- those fears return and she no longer will be able to trust the partner for any extended period.

 

She says she has trust issues. Although, I do suspect it's a product of a traumatic experience in her early teens which she refuses to seek counseling for.

Perhaps so. Yet, if her BPD traits are strong, the trauma likely would have occurred much earlier -- probably before age 5, at which time it would have stunted her emotional growth.

 

I just feel used and played.

If she has strong narcissistic or sociopathic traits, you would be correct. If she has strong BPD traits, however, the strange behaviors you saw likely were not the result of manipulation but, rather, emotional instability. Generally, BPDers are not bad people. Their problem is not being bad but, instead, being unstable -- with the result that their perception of you will dramatically change every few weeks or months (or even several times a day). And their recollection of your past behaviors will dramatically change, which is why it will frequently seem that a BPDer is "rewriting history" in her own mind.

 

She's just my hiking buddy now.

If you ever feel inclined to take her back as a GF instead of just a "hiking buddy," I suggest you see a psychologist -- for a visit all by yourself -- to obtain a candid professional opinion on what it is you've been dealing with. I also suggest you take a look at my list of BPD red flags at 18 BPD Warning Signs. If most of those signs sound very familiar, I would suggest you also read my more detailed description of these warning signs at my posts in Rebel's Thread. If that description rings many bells, I would be glad to discuss them with you.

 

Significantly, learning to spot these red flags will NOT enable you to diagnose your exGF's issues. Only a professional can do that. Yet, like learning warning signs for stroke and heart attack, learning those for BPD may help you avoid repeating the painful experience -- i.e., avoid taking her back and avoid running into the arms of another woman just like the one you left (if she has strong BPD traits). Take care, GL.

[GammaLeonis]

The hardest part is that these are complicated by the fact she is a pathological liar. She claimed she's improved. I can't tell if I'm grasping at straws or there are serious implications to your 18 points.

 

1. Black-white thinking, wherein she categorizes everyone as "all good" or "all bad" and will recategorize someone -- in just a few seconds -- from one polar extreme to the other based on a minor comment or infraction

 

We went to different colleges. They are in-state rivals. Can't tell if she's for reals about how people from my institution are hypocrites and judgmental or just playing along with the stereotype bantering.

 

3. Irrational jealousy and controlling behavior that tries to isolate you away from close friends or family members;

 

While dating, she has always mentioned how I would move closer to her and change my job in the near future.

 

7. Low self esteem

 

Besides referring to herself as an awkward white girl, the only other sign is when she told me she used to have an eating disorder. Hence why she's the smallest in her family at 5'4".

 

9. Fear of abandonment or being alone -- evident in her expecting you to “be there” for her on demand, making unrealistic demands for the amount of time spent together, or responding with intense anger to even brief separations or slight changes in plans

 

During month 5 of our relationship, she always comment on how it's getting harder for her to see me go and ranted about the distance and increasing physicality that couldn't be satisfied due to us not being married and haven't hit her expectation of a relationship of over 12 months, which is the point she would felt comfortable having premarital sex.

 

Funny thing is, she always said that I would be the one to end the relationship. Instead, she did.

 

10. Always being "The Victim," a false self image she validates by blaming you for every misfortune

 

This is especially true when she confronted me about calling her family. She's more worried about how she will never return home again because what I TOLD them about her when I asked questions in reality.

 

She felt I was trying to control her and manipulate her back into my life when I have never begged her to come back after the breakup. Our subsequent meetups (two times) have been about Q&A (and I pointed that out to her, which she could only respond with silence).

 

She did make the instance where we almost had sex twice as me pressuring her to have sex instead during our most recent phone call.

 

11. Lack of impulse control, wherein she does reckless things without considering the consequences (e.g., binge eating or spending)

 

She apparently used to go on hikes, running, etc. alone at night. Recently, she dumped $800 on a bed frame and new mattress just for the hell of it after insisting that she can just sleep on the floor.

 

12. Complaining that all her previous BFs were abusive and claiming (during your courtship) that you are the only one who has treated her well

 

She made up the ex that physically beat her. She caused those scars herself after she broke up with #3 because they were both pathological liars and she hated how she couldn't keep track of reality and fantasy. That guy was 15 years older than her...

 

She said she had an amicable breakup with #2 and hated #1 because he dumped her due to her not being active in church, etc.

 

As for me, she tells me recently that our relationship was okay, but had a strong friendship base. I'm still the most respectable guy she's dated. I can only imagine she enjoys drama.

 

13. Mirroring your personality and preferences so perfectly during the courtship period (e.g., enjoying everything and everyone you like) that you were convinced you had met your "soul mate;"

 

Hard to say, she jumped the gun by saying she was surprised we had similar view points on issues and whatnot. I don't know how much she mirrored me because she obviously don't share my attendance at church. But, the scary thought is...I can't name other obvious differences aside from some minor disagreement on raising children and some dating philosophies.

 

All my friends felt we were a total match. My best friend even claimed that she was everything I ever dreamed in a significant other. In other words, I felt natural with her.

 

14. Relying on you to center and ground her, giving her a sense of direction because her goals otherwise keep changing every few months

 

She did ask me whether she should still pursue pharmacy school or grad school at one point. I was reluctant to make that decision for her, so she winded up flipping a coin and chose grad school and started to prepare for the GRE.

 

Our most recent conversation revealed that she's probably going to be a med tech for a while.

 

16. Having many casual friends but not any close long-term friends (unless they live a long distance away)

 

She has revealed two best friends who are married. One of which she frequently visits and another she visited earlier in June in TN. I've never gotten the chance to get to know her friends. Just passing by them with casual talks.

 

She claims that it was her defense mechanism because previous ex(s) have used them against her. Does she really have any friends? Who knows. Most of the FB interactions I've seen are from family friends and coworkers during her school days.

 

Another point to consider is how she told me that she felt out of touch with her old roommates/friends after meeting up with them again.

 

She went as far as telling me that I am currently her best guy friend over the phone.

 

18. Always convinced that her intense feelings accurately reflect reality -- to the point that she regards her own feelings as self-evident facts, despite her inability to support them with any hard evidence.

 

Going back to the victim theme, that's what she told me when we broke up. It was about how she was going to get hurt (not me). That her gut feelings have never led her astray.

 

Another one is our disagreement involving finding happiness in oneself and not basing it on others. She disagreed with me that a working romance required work and felt strongly about it because that's how she felt based on experience. I believed spontaneity only lasts so long until it breaks down completely.

 

The irony? Our most recent phone call, she tells me about how I should find happiness within myself after the revelation about her never interested in relationships and used me as her "rescuer" for the way she is. The strangest part is her saying that she has trust issues with guys.

 

With all the recent events, I am planning on moving closer to my work. She offered to help and stated that we couldn't hangout like everyday. I responded to her by saying I was perfectly fine only seeing her 2-3 times a week when we dated, of which I only get another silence. So, she offered that we only hangout once or twice a month. She also sent me job postings in her area and thinks I should change jobs.

 

We plan on going hiking tomorrow from 16:30-22:00. I'm slightly concerned.

 

I think I have trust issues now.

Edited June 30, 2015 by GammaLeonis

[Downtown]

I think I have trust issues now.

Smart man! You should have trust issues with her. It took me 15 years to realize that you can never trust a woman who is unable to trust you -- because she can turn on you at any time. And she eventually will do exactly that.

[GammaLeonis]

Not just towards her...I think it'd be hard for me to date for a while.

 

My last two relationships before her ended with my exes cheating on me. There was a year between those two relationships. After the 2nd one, I stopped trying for relationships for about 2 years (2012-2014) and opted for casual dates.

 

I'm not sure how long will it take for me to recover from this one.

[mightycpa]

Not just towards her...I think it'd be hard for me to date for a while.

 

My last two relationships before her ended with my exes cheating on me. There was a year between those two relationships. After the 2nd one, I stopped trying for relationships for about 2 years (2012-2014) and opted for casual dates.

 

I'm not sure how long will it take for me to recover from this one.

Maybe none at all if you realize how unfair it is to punish one person for what another has done.

 

Why don't you write a justification for your mistrust of all women here, so you can see how ridiculous it sounds? You need to place the blame squarely upon whom it belongs - the cheaters.

[GammaLeonis]

Maybe none at all if you realize how unfair it is to punish one person for what another has done.

 

Why don't you write a justification for your mistrust of all women here, so you can see how ridiculous it sounds? You need to place the blame squarely upon whom it belongs - the cheaters.

 

And let me guess? You have some sort of ESP that allows you to determine who is a cheater, pathological liar, etc. beforehand? I am justified to not deal with dating for some time.

[GammaLeonis]

So,

 

We did wind up hanging out on June 30th to a state park we've been meaning to go while we were dating.

 

She revealed to me the (or one of) source of her childhood trauma involving abusive parent. She claimed that that's why she has trust issues, etc. and how none of her 6 other siblings are into (1 is with a controlling bf right now) relationships. I also mentioned that she had borderline tendencies like some of her siblings.

 

We both shared childhood experiences in regards to abuse and whatnot and learned a few new things about each other. I let her know that I left the door open for her.

 

We still had physical contacts...they weren't intimate, but obviously not platonic.

 

We met 4:00pm that day and was at the park till about 9pm. We returned to her place and chatted till 1:30am.

 

Lot of stuff we talked about then were just stories from our past, you know, random topics. I mentioned about moving up to the same city because that's closer to my employment. She suggested areas I should live in (which are all within 10-15min drive from her btw) and urged me to work at the laboratory company she works at (it's a large one, we probably won't ever see each other due to different departments and specialties).

 

We also discussed about a coworker of hers who has been making inappropriate advances since we've been dating as well as her younger sister's controlling bf issue.

 

There's still touching (arms and hands, forehead to forehead, etc.) before we said goodnight, no kisses.

 

On July 14th, we are supposed to go to another state park for its cave trails. She also mentioned about a Halloween event that we should attend later this fall. Honestly, I have no idea where this is going, but I do intend to use it as an opportunity to gradually wean off of her. Maybe she's doing the same?

 

So far, things have been confusing for me.

 

1. We maintained LC for the most part post-breakup.

2. She should have dumped my ass when I called her family

3. We are hanging out

[GammaLeonis]

Still maintaining contact over texts as well as our Sunday comic exchanges. We are still planning on going to the cave trails on Tues. BPD or not, we shall see.

 

Potential directions:

 

1) Just friends for indefinite time. She's a pretty cool person.

2) She's using me until her next man (of which, I will have plenty of figurative ammo to counter).

3) She's actually in a leabian relationship with her new roommate from out of state. The roommate is here for grad school and they've been sightseeing quite a bit already. I'm actually okay with that.

4) Reconciliation

5) She pushes me off the ledge on the trails on Tues. So, if I'm no longer around, this might have happened.

[Qboro90]

Every time you post in this thread there is another event/incident/past secret that this girl reveals to you. Is that really someone you want to be with or even around. There are people who have baggage and that's fine.... But this girl is carrying an entire luggage container with her and it's fully visible to you. Chalk it up to "yea I dated a girl who ended up not being who I thought she was, lesson learned". The relationship timeline was drastic to say the least. You met, you got to know each other, you dated, you agreed on marriage. You seem to have a very religious background and it sounds like she tried to live that kind of life but it's just not who she is by the actions she's done over the course of her life.

 

She doesn't know who she is or what she wants. You can either hang along for the ride hoping and guiding her for the less than 1% chance she is the girl you fell for.. OR you can accept that you shouldn't have to be her crutch and have been more than a good guy towards her. You did your part, now you need to let her know that you just need time apart because there are things that you want for your life, relationships, etc in which she clearly cannot give you at this time. Tell her that you really hope eventually she finds herself and the two of you work out but she's got to understand that you can put all your eggs in her basket and not explore other possibilities.

 

She's trying to get you a job with her company and thinks you'll move closer to her? Seems like YOU have to do an awful lot in this "relationship" while she uses you as her personal cuddle buddy therapist. You'll find someone else, might not think so right now but you will. She's got way to many issues at such a young age (some of which aren't her fault, some are) but I can only imagine what a lifelong marriage with her track record can hold down the road. No contact for 1-2 months.. See where you're at then and decide

[GammaLeonis]

Well, the cave trials didn't happen as we didn't reserve tickets ahead of time. Instead, we met up and went to a pizza cafe for lunch. We caught upon recent events in our lives and had some laughs before we returned to her place.

 

At one point, were scrambling on the floor because she didn't want me to read the rough draft of a story (even though she brought it up) for a personal competition between her and her younger sister.

 

All the friendliness ended when I kissed her (stupid me). She mentioned how she felt we were moving into a fwb situation. Neither of us have been in that sort of situation before. She started to mention how she thought about being my roommate if I moved into her city, etc.

 

After some frank discussions, well, here we are. Obviously, no sex was involved this day. However, we did wind up experimenting ways to kiss and make out until her roommates came home. She is concerned that if things escalate, she would lose control of her apparent high sex drive.

 

As much as I enjoyed it, and curious how much it'd escalate, I don't think this will end well. I know both of our families are getting annoyed by the fact that we still hang out, etc. in a quasi-couple fashion.

 

I should probably run away while I still can. It's kinda sad that I still care a lot about her. Somehow, intimate gestures trigger something in her head and she starts acting like a different person.