Wife has been having a LTA for 15 years

[merrmeade]

Even if it's not scotland per se, if you look up fault divorce around the world, there are not many places (English-speaking) that have it. Therefore, this extremely specific, detailed example is a reasonable reference. Some elements will be similar.

 

Sounds to me like quick justice to victims of moral turpitude. Good ol' calvinists.

 

Note to conjecture naysayers: As far as logic goes, it's perfectly valid to speculate based on valid examples and demonstrated deduction. OP updates will quickly sort all this without undue discussion.

[Noirek]

No. Read it. Granted, OP hasn't confirmed this but it's pretty likely that it's Scottish law. IF, indeed, it is, it's different and very specific:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Divorce_in_Scotland

 

It's not that straightforward at all even if the OP was in Scotland.

 

How to file for divorce in Scotland | lawpack.co.uk

 

https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/scotland/relationships/relationship-problems-s/getting-divorced-s/#h-divorce

Adultery

 

A court may grant a divorce if one of you has had a sexual relationship with someone else of the opposite sex (committed adultery). If you or your partner has had a sexual relationship with someone else of the same sex it is not technically adultery but is likely to be seen as evidence of irretrievable breakdown.

The court will need details of the adultery, for example, dates and places when it happened. The court will only grant the divorce if it is satisfied that the marriage has irretrievably broken down and the other partner could no longer live with the partner who has committed adultery. There is no minimum period that you have to be married before a divorce action based on adultery may be started.

If you both agree to the divorce, the court will usually only need statements and details of the adulterous sexual relationship. If one of you doesn't agree to the divorce, proof will

be necessary and this may be difficult and expensive to get.

Edited June 15, 2015 by Noirek

[Noirek]

Even if it's not scotland per se, if you look up fault divorce around the world, there are not many places (English-speaking) that have it. Therefore, this extremely specific, detailed example is a reasonable reference. Some elements will be similar.

 

Sounds to me like quick justice to victims of moral turpitude. Good ol' calvinists.

 

Note to conjecture naysayers: As far as logic goes, it's perfectly valid to speculate based on valid examples and demonstrated deduction. OP updates will quickly sort all this without undue discussion.

 

but even at fault divorces don't happen quite like the OP suggested. He may be able to have the divorce papers served ASAP, but as I stated earlier that is really just the beginning. Not close to being over.

 

And people on here often confuse what it means. It usually means you don't have to wait a the stipulated amount of time to file for divorce. In Scotland, for example, it has no bearing on dividing of property or custody.

[merrmeade]

Good reply to the point. You're right.

 

However, I am suddenly doubting what we - what I - have been doing here. For example in this situation and in another thread, the OPs are in life-altering positions. Whatever steps they take will affect the rest of their lives. We posters react to each update and other posts as they come and with truly limited context. I find myself waffling and unsure what direction to encourage the OP to take.

 

OP, please take mine and other posters' advice with caution, realizing that we do NOT have all the information, we're just people like you, and we can't know all the changes that are happening.

 

I'm going to sit out and observe for a while. I hope I've not misled you and want to encourage you again to find the right support for your goals, actions and decisions. Good luck, my friend.

Edited June 15, 2015 by merrmeade

[beach]

There's also the option of bullying the spouse out of the house.

 

Let's not jump to any conclusions.

 

We know the OP has stated the DNA tests show he isn't likely the bio Dad to the two girls. Based on emails the OP is assuming the OMM is the bio Dad. But testing may need to be done with the OMM to determine IF the OMM is their bio Dad.

 

But based on what OP has written - it appears the girls are not biologically his. Who fathered the girls has not been determined as of yet.

 

 

Hope you are ok OP.

[Trimmer]

The facts as we know them:

 

1) WW is having a ongoing 15 year affair with a co-worker, who is a friend to both OP and WW. He has good evidence from emails.

 

2) The younger two daughters, from DNA tests, are the OMs. The kids have not been told, both will be soon.

 

3) OM knows that the two sisters are his.

I would clarify this, because if we're going to summarize the facts, they may as well be accurate, since others may depend on this summary to put the thread into context: The OP knows the younger daughters are not his, from DNA tests. He assumes, with high confidence, that they are the OM's, based upon the Email evidence that reveals the long-term nature of the affair, and also reveals the OM's belief that these two children are his (the OM's).

 

I know it's a subtlety, and all evidence points to the conclusion as you've stated it, but we might as well get the summary accurate.

 

Wouldn't surprise me if the update we're all waiting for isn't coming today.

Yeah, no matter what happened, I'm expecting that "posting on LS" isn't likely at the top of his priority list right now, and it possibly might not be for some time.

 

However, I am suddenly doubting what we - what I - have been doing here. For example in this situation and in another thread, the OPs are in life-altering positions. Whatever steps they take will affect the rest of their lives. We posters react to each update and other posts as they come and with truly limited context. I find myself waffling and unsure what direction to encourage the OP to take.

 

OP, please take mine and other posters' advice with caution, realizing that we do NOT have all the information, we're just people like you, and we can't know all the changes that are happening.

I agree. My advice, when the courses of peoples' lives hang in the balance: take legal advice from a competent attorney, take medical advice from a competent physician, and as much as you are in pain and "entitled" to revenge or lashing out, try to act rationally with an eye on your long-term goals - even if you have to "act" rational when you aren't really there in your head. This can include considering rational advice from others who empathize with your pain and distress, which is one of the reasons we're all here.

 

Finally, if there's any uncertainty, withhold drastic, dramatic action until you settle down. Don't make things worse for yourself, or those you care about.

Edited June 15, 2015 by Trimmer

[Darth Vader]

Yep. I know of one account where I BH physically removed a WW and forced her into a car. I understand his anger, but he should have been charged with assault. Period.

 

There ARE some things you just don't do.

 

It's like when people say "quit your job today." Are those people going to be around to pay next month's mortgage?

 

 

If the roles were reversed and a woman moved a man out like this, nothing would ever be said, let alone done about it!

 

What Hypocrisy!

[autumnnight]

If the roles were reversed and a woman moved a man out like this, nothing would ever be said, let alone done about it!

 

What Hypocrisy!

 

What a load of crap. Where I live, if a woman assaulted a man and he called 911...she'd be carted off too.

 

Nice try though.

[Darth Vader]

Just have to say how funny this struck me. I've got the giggles.

 

Yes, you just have to keep reminding yourself that legally they're human.

 

 

Yes! But, only in theory!

[Darth Vader]

What a load of crap. Where I live, if a woman assaulted a man and he called 911...she'd be carted off too.

 

Nice try though.

 

 

No, not nice try, it's the truth! Perhaps not where you live, but it does happen!

[Poutrew]

Concerning divorce, fault, no fault, etc. Does it depend on where you got married, where you are living when you get divorced, or what? Like if I get married in California, where it's very liberal, can I apply for divorce in a state that is not so, er, enlightened, or do you have to be living in that place in order to take advantage of the laws? Or, since I married in Cali, then Cali laws apply no matter where I am...

 

 

With that being said, anyone know of any places outside of Isis controlled territories, that still allow burning at the stake for adultery?

[No Limit]

I have a bad feeling about this, no doubt things escalated. OP, wherever you are, best of luck to you and OBS.

[minime13]

No, not nice try, it's the truth! Perhaps not where you live, but it does happen!

 

Enough. It depends on how badly someone wants to press charges. Nobody is going to have assault charges dropped on them without someone pressing charges.

[aliveagain]

Concerning divorce, fault, no fault, etc. Does it depend on where you got married, where you are living when you get divorced, or what? Like if I get married in California, where it's very liberal, can I apply for divorce in a state that is not so, er, enlightened, or do you have to be living in that place in order to take advantage of the laws? Or, since I married in Cali, then Cali laws apply no matter where I am...

 

 

With that being said, anyone know of any places outside of Isis controlled territories, that still allow burning at the stake for adultery?

 

You may want to try some of the Ironman challenges. We Italians have one that involves endurance swimming like swimming around a small island which both the U.S. and Canada have many of. The race officially starts when the 200 lbs. block of concrete that's chained to the swimmer hits the water.

[lifedestroyed]

Sorry for not being able to post before, but I don't come empty handed folks. For now this is the update only, I will reply later to any previous posts that this update doesn't answer. I also apologize if the post is too long, I just want to give as much detail as possible unlike some of my previous posts.

 

Firstly I would like to mention the building layout of their workplace so that you can all have a better idea of everything. It's a 16 story building, OM and WW's offices are both on the 14th floor, isolated from the rest of their subordinates, including their assistants, but their offices are right next to each other though. All the times i've been there i've never found out what's on the 15th floor, but their boss (owner of company) has the the entire 16th floor to himself. So obviously by now you should all know that WW and OM are very high up in their company.

 

I showed up first to their workplace with flowers for my WW, I told my WWs assistant that I was there to "thank my wife for the helping me on the weekend", to which he said it was sweet of me and gave me the green light to go in my WWs office. I went into my WWs office and she was on the phone, she saw me with the flowers and smiled at me, she signaled to me with her hand that she won't be long and I sat down.

 

While WW was still on the phone, OBS came in to "drop off something her husband forgot", fortunately no flags were raised as both WW and I saw OBS walk past WWs office into OMs office. WW eventually got off the phone, we talked for approx 15min and then finally two processors came to serve both OM and WW at the same time. Obviously the atmosphere changed quickly to a very quiet one on that floor.

 

When the processors showed up I instructed WW to go into the conference room they have on that floor, as did OBS to her WH. As we walked into the conference room I saw how tense everything was, their subordinates looked so uncomfortable. Now we were all in the conference room and we both spilled the beans on them. We both had our VAR's on us btw. We calmly told them that we know of their affair and we wish to divorce amicably. They both just sat there shocked beyond belief, dumbfounded by what was going on, i'll be honest this was very satisfying. Anyway OBS and I did all the talking, very calmly explained to them that there is no possible chance of R for either of them. OM eventualy opened his mouth, asked us how long we have known for and how we found out, and OBS said to him that's not important. That pissed them both off so much, I saw it in their eyes. We told them that was all we had to say, that they could resume their jobs, nothing mentioned about the kids on both sides.

 

On our way out we asked both their assistants if they knew that they were having an affair, to which they were shocked and denied knowing anything. To be fair I don't suspect anyone in that company knew anything, from my past observations OM and WW keep a very professional demeanour in front of others at all times, this affair was hidden very well from everyone. After that, OBS and I went up to the 16th floor. After some pleasantries, I briefly explained to the boss that his subordinates were carrying on an affair for 15 years in his workplace. He awkwardly stood there and couldn't say anything. I quickly ended the awkward silence by mentioning to him that OBS and I had investigated our family financials, that we both found nothing connected to the affair. I told him to investigate them incase they were using company money to fund their affair. He said they would look into it right away and apologized to us for not knowing anything. I told him not to feel bad and assured him that nobody else had a clue either.

 

On our way down we bumped into OM and OBS as they were leaving the building also. I remember thinking that this is going to be the longest most awkward elevator ride I will ever have, and sure enough it was. WW said to us that her and OM were leaving town for a short time to "sort things out", and OM asked us not to mention anything to the kids and our families until they get back. I refused, I told them that we were going to tell the kids and our families today.

 

I wish that what happened next never happened but what's done is done now... WW started bawling her eyes out begging me not to say anything to my family. I got furious instantly and finally snapped. I raised my voice at her said a whole bunch of nasty things at her including that she was a selfish whore. OM got furious at me and told me to calm down, then OBS got furious at OM that he was defending WW. I got so angry at OM and told him to get his hands off me as he had put his hand on my shoulder. WW pushed the emergency stop on the elevator and we stopped.

 

Everyone just stood quietly for a second in shock and I asked WW why she pushed the emergency stop. She said that it was a good time to "talk things out". OBS made it clear to OM and WW that she was not interested in talking anything out. I asked WW what it is that they need to leave town for to sort out, and OM quickly answered in the most annoying smart arse way possible "that's not important" with a smirk on his face. I don't know what consumed me to punch him but it felt so good when my fist connected with his face. I regret it now of course.

 

OM fell to the floor when I punched him, and as WW got down to embrace/caress him, OBS started crying while looking at them. There was no sign of remorse at all in any of their eyes, they couldn't even look OBS and I in our eyes. It was a bizzare 10 minutes while stuck in that elevator because after my WW pushed the emergency stop button, a technitian was on the intercom asking what is the problem if we are safe and no one answered him during this entire time. He heard everything and after we all finished arguing he said he wishes us the best in resolving our issues and that he was resetting the elevator, then we were going down again to the ground floor.

 

We all hurried out when the elevator was opened at the ground floor and on our way out I asked WW what I should tell the kids in regards to her whereabouts, then OM said they will deal with the kids by themselves about that. I got furious again that now he was answering for my wife? and he mumbled something quietly, i'm almost certain I heard him say "she was never yours". I didn't want to cause any more problems for myself in the future so I let it go, didn't even ask him to repeat himself, but deep down inside I was fuming so much!!! I was ready to beat the living **** out of him.

 

They left the car park in OMs car and left WWs car there. OBS and I decided to go to lunch to discuss what had just happened before we had to pick the kids up at their schools. On the way there in my car I absolutely lost it, the way I cried I honestly would have put a newborn to shame. When OBS and I got out of our cars in the restaurant carpark, I could see she had been crying as well. We just looked at each other and before I knew it we both started bawling our eyes out. As you would know from before, i'm not the type to cry easily, but I was overwhelmed with so many negative emotions that I couldn't control myself. OBS and I ended up holding each other, for a long time actually, it helped a lot. I don't know how either of us would have handled seperate confrontations without each other, just like WW and OM had "each other", makes me sick to my stomach!

 

Honestly LS i'm not going to be the calm guy anymore. I am hurt beyond words that are not invented yet could ever describe. The disrespect and arrogance that OM and WW showed proved to me that we are actually not dealing with normal human beings here. This will NOT be an amicable divorce, in my point of view they have waged war. I will always have my kids best interests at heart, but those suggesting I "take the high road" have no idea what i'm going through right now.

 

I will not bend over and let them get away with this scot-free after that filth they just pulled on OBS and I, especially that scumbag OM. He is a dead man walking now, funny thing is I may have to be the one to protect him from my younger brothers/cousins who are in a very dangerous gang that even the police are afraid of. They will absolutely not tolerate this disrespect to one of their family members. I do want him to pay for what he did but I fear for his life a little, just for the record death isn't something I wish on either of them. Not sure what will happen to WW, but it sure explains why she begged me not to say anything to my family and why they left town so quickly. They know as soon as my family find out, they will face very very heavy consequences. Even I do not have any say in anything the gang will do to them, unless of course I wanted to R with WW in which case she would likely face a lesser consequence.

 

Unfortunately this is all I have time for to write atm, I will finish off the rest of the update later as there is much more to update. In the meantime pray for OBS and I, LS. We are not doing well at all and things are spiraling out of control now that the confrontation has happened. Again, thank you for your support it means everything to me. Much love.

 

p.s i'm of latin descent, born in Australia, relocated to my parents birth country after uni in Australia so I consider myself Aussie too.

[harrybrown]

hope the kids do okay.

 

They may need some counseling.

 

Good luck and hope your attorney does a good job for you.

[No Limit]

I have to admit, my heart skipped a beat when I saw you posted OP.

 

Don't feel bad for crying. I was actually surprised that you held it in for so long. What I'm less surprised about is that both of them aren't remorseful - they've been stuck in the "us against the world" mindset for a long time now.

 

But you have no time to loose anymore; OM and WW went out of town to escape and plan for themselves. You have to do things quickly now; expose expose expose and talk to the kids before they get back. You've managed to blindside them, don't give them a minute to recover. These kind of people are ruthless, who knows what they'll do next. No rest for the weary - and high five for that punch!

[Morro72]

WW said to us that her and OM were leaving town for a short time to "sort things out"

Arranged that pretty quickly, didn't they? I'm going to take a wild guess and say they've got a place somewhere else to conduct their alternate personal lives. I wonder who will get that in the divorce settlement.

[aliveagain]

<<<<Lifedestroyed>>>> Man hugs, you did well. The fact that O/M slipped and fell into your fist as you reached out to catch him is your word and the other betrayed spouse's word against the word of a couple of cheaters and liars. Take care of your children, they will need it the most.

[beach]

I'm glad you are ok. I hope things can get better. I understand your anger and I wish to heck you hadn't hit him. Hopefully he doesn't press legal charges.

 

How the heck can they just up and leave a job on a moments notice - together? They may have devised a plan long ago - or stashed money away somewhere and need to retrieve it? Or have a home somewhere else?

 

I'd be having a PI following her.

 

So sorry for your pain.

[No Limit]

Arranged that pretty quickly, didn't they? I'm going to take a wild guess and say they've got a place somewhere else to conduct their alternate personal lives. I wonder who will get that in the divorce settlement.

 

Please, please good Lord make it that they've been stupid enough to use company resources. It will mean the death of their careers if they got sued by their company for that.

[CarrieT]

Bravo, OP.

 

Bravo. Well done...

[velvette]

Interesting that your WW chose to leave town with OM rather than attend to her children. Ditto for him.

 

 

In any case, let them do what they will. Proceed with what is in your best interests.

 

 

Take care of your kids.

[JS84]

Sorry all of this has happened. At this point you should prbably start telling family and friends, because as soon as the shock wears off they're both going to go into sel preservation mode and damage control ASAP.

[Buckeye2]

You had the OM pinned to the wall (figure of speech) in front of both women and he couldn’t tolerate it. I tell my son that if he’s going to fight a guy don’t do in front of a woman. He’ll fight much harder.

 

 

If it’s any consolation your WW and the OM are discussing paternity and $hitting a brick. They will assume that you don’t know the truth or you would have certainly mentioned it during the altercation. You said its war. They will plan their attack as if you didn’t know.

 

 

You have a nuke in your pocket. Make them show all their cards and see how vicious they get before you reveal it.

 

 

If you can find out if they stay in the same hotel. If they do they’re not considering R very much and it may help you in court. It just looks bad if once discovered the first thing the affair couple does is shack up. It might be worth getting a PI.