Author lessthanherex Posted June 17, 2015 Author Share Posted June 17, 2015 Did I miss it? How old are you and your wife? We married at 22, the sexual frequency issues began at 24 (same age), first child at 26, less frequent sex, complaints, and other issues from 26-30, knew about her boyfriends but learned about her age and other past at 38, we are 40 now. So no, age is not effecting sex drive directly, as issues began at 24 and worsened in late twenties. Link to post Share on other sites
BetrayedH Posted June 17, 2015 Share Posted June 17, 2015 In theory, you have a great approach. Yes, my job takes a great deal of my time and my kids take most of the rest. The problem with divorce......I don't see my kids. Oh sure, custody can be had, but it is unlikely, 85% chance that she gets primary, I only get a portion of their time, I have to deal with family issues, I spend 40% of my salary on support/alimony plus the up front on attorney(s), my kids are damaged as a result, and there are mutual friends that will have future strained relationships. Not a choice. Therapist. Are there any good ones? Yes, the time is limited. The money, well I just hate wasting $ for nothing. I guess I am looking for an option that doesn't include divorce or hearing some "expert" force their opinions on me when I KNOW what I want. I want a marriage with love, friendship, intimacy, and sex. That simple. If mine cannot be fixed, I can find the sex elsewhere. I am starting to lean that way, and understand why guys cheat. I appreciate your response. I also understand that divorce isn't an option you like. Frankly, there aren't many great options here so you're going to have to make a choice. Here's the options as I see them: (1) Continue with status quo. Continue to cajole her into occassional sex but have no long-term improvement. Suck it up because you don't want a divorce. (2) Cheat to get your needs met. I think you're leaning toward this option. You haven't thought it through. The end game is never a good one. And any high ground you have on your wife will be out the window. (3) Request an open marriage. Get denied. Return to option 2. (4) Insist on resolving this issue through mutual effort, under realistic threat of divorce. (5) Give up now and file for divorce. None of these options is fun. If I'm missing an option, let me know. You can thank your wife for painting you into this corner. Which one has the highest chance for a positive outcome? 1 Link to post Share on other sites
davidromero43 Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 Originally Posted by davidromero43 Did I miss it? How old are you and your wife? We married at 22, the sexual frequency issues began at 24 (same age), first child at 26, less frequent sex, complaints, and other issues from 26-30, knew about her boyfriends but learned about her age and other past at 38, we are 40 now. So no, age is not effecting sex drive directly, as issues began at 24 and worsened in late twenties. I wasn't thinking sex drive. I was thinking this happened a very long time ago. You know one of my issues and after that she said I was not her best lover. She said she did lots of things with past lovers, that she would never do with me. I was pissed and hurt. She said I'm sure you had better lovers than I. Because I'm not doing it in the butt with you, I'm not letting you cum in my mouth, and some other things I did in the past. I was super pissed and hurt. more information I didn't need. But she is right. We all change and what we once did is not what we want to do now. I no longer blast loud music in my headphones. Sexually I'm the same. But that does not mean she is the same. If you want someone to tell you to divorce the prude. Here it is. Try a separation. Because you do not seem to be able to get over the new information you gathered at the reunion. It is not fair to her or you to hold the past over her. Bitc*ing about it on a public forum is perfectly acceptable. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
CarrieT Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 it is simply another factor in the "why did she enjoy sex, and does not now." As a woman, I can tell you that one of the reasons is: People Change. I was a 20-something nympho who had tons of huge c*cks that were very satisfying. Does that mean I want that for my entire life? Not necessarily! We find things - and people - who are more important that passing, illusive physical pleasure. You, OP, with your multiple threads, are dwelling in the past and not building a positive future. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
GoBlue Posted June 18, 2015 Share Posted June 18, 2015 You are absolutely right about counselors. You do have to call and talk to them and find out whether they are a good fit or not. I am very glad that you ordered those books. If you have an interest I know about a faith-based ministry that offers a one-time counseling session by phone at no cost. They also have a website and an article titled What Should we to look for in a marriage counselor. I can share more information for either resource if you would like to send me a private message. Blessings! 1 Link to post Share on other sites
drallafi Posted June 19, 2015 Share Posted June 19, 2015 (edited) Ok, a little bit of a different perspective here. So, I have been the "ex". The kind of guy that you talk about on here. I was dating a girl in 2008 and after we broke up we remained friends. She started dating someone else shortly after and for the duration of their relationship, she confided in me that sexually, she just didn't find him as desirable as she found me. What I found odd about this was that the new guy was taller, more handsome, in better shape, and (according to her) much more well-endowed than I was. It was a pretty interesting friendship we had. So I asked the question, "What is it about me that you like so much?" She couldn't articulate exactly, but I did some research and learned the following: Sex for women is different than sex for men. I know you're thinking, "No ****, Sherlock." but let me explain. For men, sex is largely about the buildup and the orgasm. We like to bust that nut as hard as possible as often as possible. It's a pretty simple thing. For women, orgasm is neat, but it's not the essence of sex. For women, sex is an expression of passion. What I learned from my ex was that while her new bf had all the right equipment and did all the physical stuff right, he wasn't stimulating her mind, like at all. For women, sex is as much mental as it is physical. It sounds to me like you've got the physical part down (you go on and on about multiple orgasms and stuff) but I think you may be ignoring the mental aspect. So I gotta ask you... how good are you at foreplay? How's your romance game? How good are you at making your wife laugh? Do you stimulate her mentally at all? Because if you aren't getting inside her mind, your big penis and flawless technique amounts to little more than just masturbation for her. Be spontaneous. Be funny. Next time you have sex, don't make her cum as fast as you can... tease her a little bit. Bring her close then back off. Make her work for it a little bit... Edited June 19, 2015 by drallafi 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Author lessthanherex Posted June 19, 2015 Author Share Posted June 19, 2015 I appreciate your response. I also understand that divorce isn't an option you like. Frankly, there aren't many great options here so you're going to have to make a choice. Here's the options as I see them: (1) Continue with status quo. Continue to cajole her into occassional sex but have no long-term improvement. Suck it up because you don't want a divorce. (2) Cheat to get your needs met. I think you're leaning toward this option. You haven't thought it through. The end game is never a good one. And any high ground you have on your wife will be out the window. (3) Request an open marriage. Get denied. Return to option 2. (4) Insist on resolving this issue through mutual effort, under realistic threat of divorce. (5) Give up now and file for divorce. None of these options is fun. If I'm missing an option, let me know. You can thank your wife for painting you into this corner. Which one has the highest chance for a positive outcome? Absolutely!! #1 is where I have been for the past 5-7 years. Not liking it. #2, I hesitate because of the impact on my kids. I could care less what others think, and there is an entire book to be written about how I feel about her knowing. #3 sounds interesting, but guaranteed denial #4 most plausible #5 not an option now I am leaning toward #2 or #4. #2 may satisfy the short term as well as allow me to be with my kids and still have a relationship with me wife. Oddly, I think it would improve my relationship with her. #4 because it could be attempted and then I can always go to #2, and then when my kids are older, #5 Link to post Share on other sites
Author lessthanherex Posted June 19, 2015 Author Share Posted June 19, 2015 I wasn't thinking sex drive. I was thinking this happened a very long time ago. You know one of my issues and after that she said I was not her best lover. She said she did lots of things with past lovers, that she would never do with me. I was pissed and hurt. She said I'm sure you had better lovers than I. Because I'm not doing it in the butt with you, I'm not letting you cum in my mouth, and some other things I did in the past. I was super pissed and hurt. more information I didn't need. But she is right. We all change and what we once did is not what we want to do now. I no longer blast loud music in my headphones. Sexually I'm the same. But that does not mean she is the same. If you want someone to tell you to divorce the prude. Here it is. Try a separation. Because you do not seem to be able to get over the new information you gathered at the reunion. It is not fair to her or you to hold the past over her. Bitc*ing about it on a public forum is perfectly acceptable. I don't mean this in a weird way......but, I love you man!! Separation is where I may go after reading some material and attempting again (Michigan guys suggestion). The thing is, that information hurt and sucked, and yes I am jealous of many things about her past. My biggest fantasy is to be back in her high school and be the guy to date her as opposed to puke-douche. However, it really would not have bothered me to know #1 guy was hung or #2 guy received a blow job every other night, etc. The problem is knowing that I DON'T get that treatment, or she doesn't say positive things about/to me. If she admitted and confided in me (we always did until this), I would have responded much better. She hid it, denied it, and made me feel like an idiot (similar to many other women responding on here). I'm sorry, but if I banged some hottie and then I was dating these women saying "you need help", "your deluded", they would be pissed and hurt if I talked about my epsiodes with the hottie before them, and ignored them. Guarantee they would have attitude just as I do now. You are absolutely right. I need to A) demand some change B) ask for separation to see if she wants to change 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author lessthanherex Posted June 19, 2015 Author Share Posted June 19, 2015 As a woman, I can tell you that one of the reasons is: People Change. I was a 20-something nympho who had tons of huge c*cks that were very satisfying. Does that mean I want that for my entire life? Not necessarily! We find things - and people - who are more important that passing, illusive physical pleasure. You, OP, with your multiple threads, are dwelling in the past and not building a positive future. I understand. Well said, but your honesty is what I am looking for from her. If she would have said how she felt and told me what she enjoys about me, or showed me, GREAT! The problem is that she is negative, not complimentary, non-physical, and non-sexual. Yet this all occurred in her past. What is a guy to think? It isn't until we talk about the problems or hint at divorce that she loses her **** and tells me that I am everythign to her. Confused. How is that possible? She doesn't seem to care 99% of the time, until I mention leaving or changing our relationship. Link to post Share on other sites
Author lessthanherex Posted June 19, 2015 Author Share Posted June 19, 2015 You are absolutely right about counselors. You do have to call and talk to them and find out whether they are a good fit or not. I am very glad that you ordered those books. If you have an interest I know about a faith-based ministry that offers a one-time counseling session by phone at no cost. They also have a website and an article titled What Should we to look for in a marriage counselor. I can share more information for either resource if you would like to send me a private message. Blessings! Let me read those books first. They just arrived last night. Thank You!! And then I may take you up on that and message you Link to post Share on other sites
GoBlue Posted June 19, 2015 Share Posted June 19, 2015 No Problem friend! 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Clay Posted June 19, 2015 Share Posted June 19, 2015 I think I would have this as a problem too. I understand people do change but I am not dead yet and If my wife told me she wouldn't do some of the things that she did with other people without even a doubt we probably wouldn't be together. The way I look at it is if you truly love someone you will compromise to make each other happy. Sure somethings might need to be talked about but other things should be obvious. Sex is not just Sex in my mind. Its a level of intimacy that build a bond between to people that you don't share with anyone else. Is there things you told her you would not do for her? For instance if she liked a occasional back rub or breakfast made for her? Something she considers to be special? Sadly I can see how you would probably draw lines in a lot of ways and get very resentful. I personally and not for the suggestion by the previous poster of cheating. I think if you just can't get past this then maybe a separation is the answer. She needs to understand you have needs to but with saying that you should be doing all you can to meet her needs too. Its not a one way street. Clay 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author lessthanherex Posted June 19, 2015 Author Share Posted June 19, 2015 Ok, a little bit of a different perspective here. So, I have been the "ex". The kind of guy that you talk about on here. I was dating a girl in 2008 and after we broke up we remained friends. She started dating someone else shortly after and for the duration of their relationship, she confided in me that sexually, she just didn't find him as desirable as she found me. What I found odd about this was that the new guy was taller, more handsome, in better shape, and (according to her) much more well-endowed than I was. It was a pretty interesting friendship we had. So I asked the question, "What is it about me that you like so much?" She couldn't articulate exactly, but I did some research and learned the following: Sex for women is different than sex for men. I know you're thinking, "No ****, Sherlock." but let me explain. For men, sex is largely about the buildup and the orgasm. We like to bust that nut as hard as possible as often as possible. It's a pretty simple thing. For women, orgasm is neat, but it's not the essence of sex. For women, sex is an expression of passion. What I learned from my ex was that while her new bf had all the right equipment and did all the physical stuff right, he wasn't stimulating her mind, like at all. For women, sex is as much mental as it is physical. It sounds to me like you've got the physical part down (you go on and on about multiple orgasms and stuff) but I think you may be ignoring the mental aspect. So I gotta ask you... how good are you at foreplay? How's your romance game? How good are you at making your wife laugh? Do you stimulate her mentally at all? Because if you aren't getting inside her mind, your big penis and flawless technique amounts to little more than just masturbation for her. Be spontaneous. Be funny. Next time you have sex, don't make her cum as fast as you can... tease her a little bit. Bring her close then back off. Make her work for it a little bit... I am aware of the difference but appreciate your perspective, tremendously. I think that is WHY I am so pleasing for her. Our relationship began with comfort, family, laughs, and plenty of foreplay. I make it exciting, and I love to try new things. She has verbalized her appreciation for this and making her try new things. She has said, sex has NEVER been like that before. I will concede that my efforts have been less than exemplary at times. Still, her typical complaint is that she DOES NOT want me to wait. She wants quick. You are right about something. It is mental/emotional that has her distant from me. I just cannot pinpoint the problem. I do worry, as you pointed out, that she enjoyed "them" because of the newness and physical appeal. I have been going to the gym regularly, and achieving success. I am curious to see if that helps, but I am certain it is not the only issue. Remember, she was far more physically attracted to her #2 than #1 or me. That is a factor she has admitted. The other factor is certainly that mental. I suppose I do well in bed and foreplay, but need to work on the romance. I was certainly better. I saw females comment on she may feel pressures of kids, etc. more than her early years with "them." Well, true. It is far more difficult to be romantic with an adult schedule. However, I have always been the initiator. I think most of my concern about physical attention/attraction is that she pursued #2, and even when he denied her when she talked marriage, and treated her crappy, she pursued him. Me? She gives up. Link to post Share on other sites
Author lessthanherex Posted June 19, 2015 Author Share Posted June 19, 2015 I think I would have this as a problem too. I understand people do change but I am not dead yet and If my wife told me she wouldn't do some of the things that she did with other people without even a doubt we probably wouldn't be together. The way I look at it is if you truly love someone you will compromise to make each other happy. Sure somethings might need to be talked about but other things should be obvious. Sex is not just Sex in my mind. Its a level of intimacy that build a bond between to people that you don't share with anyone else. AMEN!! I'm not dead. I think this is a huge problem with how we communicate and perceive each other. She had two boyfriends who sought sex without commitment, and one that was extremely distant unless they were having sex. They didn't give a crap about her long-term. Now, she has a guy (me) that never wanted sex outside a relationship, and truly believes sex is an expression of love by being a higher level of intimacy. Sure, I love "banging" her brains out and the naughty stuff too, but ultimately, I would be content with many levels and include sex. There is nothing I have denied her. I give it all. Bottom line is that she is starting to change me. I have realized my ideals of sex are starting to reach that curiosity stage. What if I did just go out and bang some women? Consciously, I know it won't provide long term satisfaction, but my thoughts are leaning the opposite of how I have always been. Link to post Share on other sites
Clay Posted June 19, 2015 Share Posted June 19, 2015 Well maybe that is the problem. She gave it all to these other men because it was the chase. She sought after that wonderful dream of having the life long relationship but she also enjoyed the chase. With you she feels safe so she doesn't feel she has to invest in the relationship like she did with those other people. That to me alarms me more than the lack of sex. If she is just settling for you because its safe then you have more problems than you can really deal with. I personally would rather be with someone I felt was truly in love with me. Takes care of me while I am sick. Is concerned about my health and not about my paycheck. Is excited to spend time with me and actively makes special plans to do things together. If you don't have those things in your relationship then this might be a real eye opener for you. Clay 1 Link to post Share on other sites
drallafi Posted June 20, 2015 Share Posted June 20, 2015 (edited) I am aware of the difference but appreciate your perspective, tremendously. I think that is WHY I am so pleasing for her. Our relationship began with comfort, family, laughs, and plenty of foreplay. I make it exciting, and I love to try new things. She has verbalized her appreciation for this and making her try new things. She has said, sex has NEVER been like that before. I will concede that my efforts have been less than exemplary at times. Still, her typical complaint is that she DOES NOT want me to wait. She wants quick. You are right about something. It is mental/emotional that has her distant from me. I just cannot pinpoint the problem. I do worry, as you pointed out, that she enjoyed "them" because of the newness and physical appeal. I have been going to the gym regularly, and achieving success. I am curious to see if that helps, but I am certain it is not the only issue. Remember, she was far more physically attracted to her #2 than #1 or me. That is a factor she has admitted. The other factor is certainly that mental. I suppose I do well in bed and foreplay, but need to work on the romance. I was certainly better. I saw females comment on she may feel pressures of kids, etc. more than her early years with "them." Well, true. It is far more difficult to be romantic with an adult schedule. However, I have always been the initiator. I think most of my concern about physical attention/attraction is that she pursued #2, and even when he denied her when she talked marriage, and treated her crappy, she pursued him. Me? She gives up. Yea man, the female mind is anything but clear. Exacerbating the problem is that this is the one area where, as far as I can tell, women are as mental as they are emotional, so there's a lot of mystery there. I've acted as a sex therapist (non-licensed) for a couple of years and based on the limited amount posted here, this is what I see... She's obviously not mentally attracted to you. More to the point, she probably doesn't realize it because women are at their core emotional beings and the mental aspect of things tends to be overlooked for them. I'm not in any way saying women are dumb, they're just wired to notice certain things and not others. What to do? Well that's where it would be helpful to know her. Counseling is probably the best bet, but since she's mentally checked out she's probably not gonna benefit from it. As much as I hate to say it... (God, I can't believe I'm gonna say it...) you might need to play a little bit to get her head back in the game. You might need to use female logic against her. Here we go... You should make her jealous. Why? Because quite simply, women want what other women want. There is a very real very tangible validation and effect when women see that other women find you attractive. In a perfect world you wouldn't have to use this against your wife, but here we are. I know... i know. It's incredibly childish and stupid. But anybody who knows women will tell you that the only thing that motivates them more than the safety of their children is the feeling of jealousy. You don't have to do anything untoward, just say something that's completely insensitive and out of character for you. Maybe just mention in passing that you met a woman at your job who reminds you of how she used to look before the children. She's going to be PISSED, but blow her off (tell her she's overreacting and smile while you're saying it). Then, don't initiate sex for a few weeks. Seem aloof, uninterested, basically ignore her. Spend as much time as you can on your phone, and keep it with you at all times. She will notice the change in your behavior. Then, stay out late one night. Don't cheat or anything, just come home much later than you are "supposed" to. When she asks where you were, tell her the truth, but try to make it sound like you're lying. Suddenly, you will have her mental attention. From there, you need to capitalize. I realize this sounds like horrible advice, but the alternative is divorce or cheating, and since you really aren't doing anything wrong, you can do so with a clear conscience. Lastly, she's going to accuse you of infidelity with the nonexistent woman in the above paragraph. I invite you to show her this post when that happens, to let her know the lengths you were willing to go to just to get her friggin attention again. Yes, it sounds like bad advice, but I promise you it will work. Do with this information as you will. Good luck. Edited June 20, 2015 by drallafi Link to post Share on other sites
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