Do modern women reject men too often?

[Gary S]

Listen to BlueIris

[Halcyon]

I didn't get that impression from the OP, why did you? In fact the general premise was surrounding the effects of OLD on womens' reaction to attention.

 

Personally, I'm no longer bitter but I am still able to empathize with those feelings. When gathering recent data from Tinder, OKC, Match etc, they recently surmised that women(at least those on OLD), found 80% of men unattractive. It isn't that men think that women are doing something "wrong" by rejecting them, it's the base principal behind their thinking is totally skewed, so many women are made to think they are special snowflakes and deserve a very own Brad Pitt of their own. Consequently many women value themselves above 80% of men, and it's frustrating to see that, especially if they aren't deserving of it.

 

Not really the OP mostly other posters within the thread. Though the title basically set it up as a 'come on in and bitch about how evil women are' thread is more what I meant.

 

The data does not say each women wants their own Brad Bitt that is just what people have decided it means. What women like varies between each person and if I don't actually really see that as a particularly unrealistic figure. I would say I'm about the same in terms of people who I find attractive and who's business is that to anybody other than myself? no ones. They don't owe dates to people they are not attracted to simple as that.

 

It's like saying they are ****ty people for not giving those other 80% a go. No they are not ****ty people, there is no point they are not attracted.

 

Once again that is people interpreting the data to suit their means. It does not mean that women think they are better than 80% of men simply they are not attracted to them.

 

I can empathise with men having a hard time dating I can. What I don't empathise with is the extremely bitter, sexist, degrading attitudes they generally tend to develop as a result which in turn makes them their own worst enemy when it comes to dating. They are often blind to this fact as well.

 

You can still reject someone while being in a relationship with them, that's what I mean.

 

That happens on both sides. Initial rejection for asking out people guys get a raw deal for sure in that regard after that I would say it evens out some what.

 

I know what she meant. I was just pointing out the absurdity of replacing feminism with misogyny in that quote.

 

Considering people who generally are opposed to feminism (and I'm not talking about extreme feminism) generally have a lack of understanding or in general some pretty misogynistic viewpoints I wouldn't say that is unreasonable. I wouldn't go that far myself because I don't know your reasons for the way you have developed that viewpoint but still.

 

What's the basis for the one not being a fantasy?

 

I've found a few women I'd give up dating for, but that's because my standards as a man are totally different, they're simpler. I don't need an insane checklist of specific traits like I see from women(there was a thread a couple weeks ago about this) I actually couldn't care less about their job, how much money they make, what their future career aspirations are etc. To clarify what I mean by not caring, because I know that will be taken out of context, I mean that it does not contribute to my attraction or feelings of love at all, those things are superficial and immaterial when it comes to the raw biology. I don't think it is the same for women.

 

Not all women care about this either... Not all people have checklists. Most people do though I have things I will and will not accept.

 

I'd take a 9 months discomfort and a few days of extreme physical pain over the exhausting mental/emotional pain the comes from facing rejection weekly. But then again I'd also love to be catcalled by women and have women actively pursuing me for sex. The irony is kind of delicious I admit.

 

I'm pretty blunt when it comes to rejection these days now it really doesn't effect me I just move on with my life. Yes it sucks I know.

 

You would be cool being catcalled and pursued for sex by women who for the most part you are not attracted too? I think you would find that gets pretty old pretty fast. I think your mistake here is that you think you would only be pursued by people you found attractive.

Edited June 19, 2015 by Halcyon

[ZA Dater]

You are jealous of something they have and you don't. Women by a certain age are pretty well aware not all guys are just looking for sex. For the most part PUA prey on women with low self esteem, those who are naive or those who are fully aware what they are doing but don't care.

 

Let me ask you this though? Why keep yourself up at night over this? How are they affecting you personally?

 

A defeatist attitude is very unattractive which you have. One thing I found most important to being attractive to anyone is to be happy on your own. IF you are desperate for a relationship that will be sensed by anyone you are interested in and they will most likely run.

 

 

Yet many of them still bleat about only being used for sex?

 

 

Players negatively effected my ability to find females because one generally gets dumped into a group of "only looking for sex". Does it bother me players using females, it does because its morally wrong.

 

Well by most accounts there isn't a lot attractive about me anyway so thanks for adding another to the list. , fortunately I am quite happy with who I am and at the end of the day that's all that matters.

 

 

As for people run, I have seen many run, usually in an undignified way with the most ridiculous of "excuses".

[Halcyon]

Yet many of them still bleat about only being used for sex?

 

 

Players negatively effected my ability to find females because one generally gets dumped into a group of "only looking for sex". Does it bother me players using females, it does because its morally wrong.

 

Well by most accounts there isn't a lot attractive about me anyway so thanks for adding another to the list. , fortunately I am quite happy with who I am and at the end of the day that's all that matters.

 

 

As for people run, I have seen many run, usually in an undignified way with the most ridiculous of "excuses".

 

Because people generally don't like manipulative behavior? Not an unreasonable assumption.

 

One only gets put in the 'only looking for sex' category if they act a certain way around women. If that keeps happening to you, look in the mirror before blaming players. Not that I like players I think it's pretty disgusting but they are good for a laugh when I have cock blocked them or pulled their frame out from under them when they are practicing their 'art'.

 

If people are constantly running from you need to assess why.

[BronzeAgeJaeger217]

But that surely is another problem?

Letting life just happen to you is not usually good either.

 

Well usually that happens to women more than men

[S_A]

Ok guys... Just an FYI... Women do reject men more because women can afford to be more selective. Guys have less leverage now. Women don't "need" us the way they did centuries ago and they are more empowered than ever before.

 

You can't be mad at women for having more leverage in the modern world. It's actually not a bad thing. 500 years ago if a man had a wife and kids, and the man suddenly died, the woman and kids would be screwed. Society at that time dictated that a wife should be entirely dependent on her husband. My future wife is building a great career for herself. Which is great because should something happen to me, she would be independent and strong enough to live life how she wants and be in a better position to care for the kids. She won't not to frantically look for another husband and settle for some loser that is willing to inheret her "baggage." It's not even that. If I screw up (I won't), she now has the power to leave. That's also a great thing. I know someone that wants to leave her husband, but she can't because she DEPENDS on him. How cruel is that? Stuck in a miserable relationship for the rest of your life because you depend on the source of our misery.

 

Oh, and I have not even touched on the modern day sexual empowerment.

 

I have not read more than half this thread (I'm a late comer), but the complaining about the rejection just looks really freakin' bad. If you approach five women and just one of them accepts, that one "victory" totally outweighs the four rejections collectively IMO. Stop trying to bat 1.000; only Jen1447 bats and 1.000

Edited June 19, 2015 by S_A

[Shining One]

I'm curious. What sort of ratios are being complained about? I see numbers being thrown out here and there, but what is considered "unacceptable"?

 

Not counting OLD, I have roughly a 5% positive response rate. It sucks, but it is what it is. I just learn to deal with it and approach far more women than the guy next to me.

On a ratio I would guess I am rejected at least 50-60 times before I even get to a date...

Going with the lower number, this comes to a 2% positive response rate. I've never heard of a woman having such a horrendous ratio when approaching men. I'm impressed that you're not complaining about it. I would not be surprised to learn that a lot of people complaining in this thread have better ratios than this.

[minime13]

I've only read the first page and don't care to go through them all, but I'm just a little curious as to why women's replies are so vicious and defensive? I mean logically if this many people are complaining about the same thing simultaneously then maybe it's not in their heads. Or maybe we're all just bitter neckbeards who just come to cry on here when we get rejected. (lol)

 

The majority of women's replies are not vicious at all, they are defensive because they are reacting to a rather misogynistic thread that directly pins a negative association to women. We all know this guy - he's insecure and jealous because his friends pull more chicks then he does, and that's probably the wording he chooses.

 

I'm immensely annoyed by claims that "both men and women have tons of options". To me this instantly shows that you don't live in the real world, or cannot see outside of your own existence. Sexual selection is real, it's scientific, men and women are different in many ways, both excel at different things because we evolved this way.

 

This world is full of people, a little less than half being men and a little more than half being women. Most of us are average, but always looking to get something a little better. There are plenty of options, but you have to be willing to see them.

 

Feminism is toxic and hypocritical and until it changes drastically this will be the status quo.

 

Well, I don't see us going back to the 50's anytime soon, so maybe men's dating tactics should evolve.

[minime13]

Let's be real here. The concept of "the one" that you are talking about is a complete fantasy. It doesn't exist, and no if you just bide your time and "be yourself" a decent woman isn't going to just drop in your lap.(because women don't pursue)

 

I'm pretty damn sure I found the one with the relationship I'm in now, and I'm the one that got his number.

 

There are actually positive things to women having found empowerment in dating. More and more are doing the pursuing. However, men do have to step up and realize that it's a different dating scene now, and they no longer have the privilege of picking the girl they want and expecting her to simply go along with it.

[Keenly]

I'm pretty damn sure I found the one with the relationship I'm in now, and I'm the one that got his number. .

 

these are the stories I like to hear.

[Zing]

Not really the OP mostly other posters within the thread. Though the title basically set it up as a 'come on in and bitch about how evil women are' thread is more what I meant.

 

The data does not say each women wants their own Brad Bitt that is just what people have decided it means.

 

It's like saying they are ****ty people for not giving those other 80% a go. No they are not ****ty people, there is no point they are not attracted.

 

Once again that is people interpreting the data to suit their means. It does not mean that women think they are better than 80% of men simply they are not attracted to them.

 

Maybe if you looked behind the reasoning to why women find 80% of men attractive you'd understand what I'm saying. I'm not debating that it's purely about attraction, I agree completely and I don't think a women is inherently wrong for rejecting someone. I think society is skewed and culture is to blame more so than anything else, we raised our children this way, and then added in massive technology advancements and this is where we end up.

 

I can empathise with men having a hard time dating I can. What I don't empathise with is the extremely bitter, sexist, degrading attitudes they generally tend to develop as a result which in turn makes them their own worst enemy when it comes to dating. They are often blind to this fact as well.

 

Shouldn't you just pity them then? Seems like a waste of effort if someone isn't having a respectful debate.

 

That happens on both sides. Initial rejection for asking out people guys get a raw deal for sure in that regard after that I would say it evens out some what.

 

What do you mean exactly there? Men face initial rejection constantly and also face the looming threat of rejection once in a relationship, and men have to face that threat more often too(70% of divorces initiated by women)

 

Considering people who generally are opposed to feminism (and I'm not talking about extreme feminism) generally have a lack of understanding or in general some pretty misogynistic viewpoints I wouldn't say that is unreasonable. I wouldn't go that far myself because I don't know your reasons for the way you have developed that viewpoint but still.

 

I think you are being way too general here, and maybe you don't realize how many anti-feminists(or just people who don't identify/agree with some of their ideology) there are in the world. I live in a fairly western country and I have conversations daily with people who don't agree with feminism, and never have I thought that any of those were crude or resentful.

 

I'd say this is just a case of anonymity causing extremism. It's probably not indicative of most anti-feminists.

 

I have the viewpoint because there's no need for modern feminism, feminism(especially extreme feminism) promotes misandry and seeks to elevate women's interests above mens. At it's core it is in my opinion not about actual equality. Also feminism ignores science and still tries to claim a dissonant point that men and women are the same. Which is ridiculous honestly.

 

I'm pretty blunt when it comes to rejection these days now it really doesn't effect me I just move on with my life. Yes it sucks I know.

 

Well are you really being rejected though?

 

You would be cool being catcalled and pursued for sex by women who for the most part you are not attracted too? I think you would find that gets pretty old pretty fast. I think your mistake here is that you think you would only be pursued by people you found attractive.

 

Totally valid point, except that I find a lot more women attractive than women find me attractive, and why is that? because I'm a visual creature, there are tons of attractive women around, and all they have to do is not be fat.

 

But the effort I have to go through to be attractive to those women is insane by comparison.(always be confident, never show weakness, have an amazing career, or have one lined up, have interesting/unique hobbies, be funny, be emotional(but not too much!), spend time with her, but not too much time..and you get the picture.

[ZA Dater]

Because people generally don't like manipulative behavior? Not an unreasonable assumption.

 

One only gets put in the 'only looking for sex' category if they act a certain way around women. If that keeps happening to you, look in the mirror before blaming players. Not that I like players I think it's pretty disgusting but they are good for a laugh when I have cock blocked them or pulled their frame out from under them when they are practicing their 'art'.

 

If people are constantly running from you need to assess why.

 

 

Along with aforementioned bleating usually comes the following "I wish I could find a decent guy", I have pursued a few who trot out this line and I guess I am just not decent because I got flatly rejected by all of them.

 

 

People are quick to judge, quicker to reject and slow to understand. Perhaps that the be all and end all of this thread.

 

 

The only continual variable with me has been rejection so I have chosen to remove myself from the dating "pool" completely. Just unfortunate that being kind, generous, honest and good manners are not qualities anyone seeks.

 

 

Strangely enough those who did find me attractive, I was always honest as to why I didn't find them attractive, honest in a constructive way, alas it seems this too is just not done, its far easier to simply just ignore people and give the metaphorical middle finger.

[Zing]

Well are you really being rejected though?

 

Screwed up my post and i can't edit, ignore this part.

 

 

This world is full of people, a little less than half being men and a little more than half being women. Most of us are average, but always looking to get something a little better. There are plenty of options, but you have to be willing to see them.

 

 

Actually I think the majority of men do not think that way. And, well "average" is a pretty relative concept here. It's already been established that the "average" for attractive females is higher and the "average" for men is lower.

 

Well, I don't see us going back to the 50's anytime soon, so maybe men's dating tactics should evolve.

 

I never suggested as much. The current iteration of feminism(third wave) and it's current goals didn't start in the 50s. That was a different feminism which I think was vital. That is not the type of feminism to which I'm referring.

[Rejected Rosebud]

Let's be real here. The concept of "the one" that you are talking about is a complete fantasy. It doesn't exist, and no if you just bide your time and "be yourself" a decent woman isn't going to just drop in your lap.(because women don't pursue)

"Be yourself" doesn't equal just sitting on your butt.

[Zing]

"Be yourself" doesn't equal just sitting on your butt.

 

It doesn't mean anything, it's a useless piece of airy fairy advice right up there with "the one". The world is a pretty cruel place are advice like that is never actually tangible in reality.

 

I'm pretty damn sure I found the one with the relationship I'm in now, and I'm the one that got his number.

 

There are actually positive things to women having found empowerment in dating. More and more are doing the pursuing. However, men do have to step up and realize that it's a different dating scene now, and they no longer have the privilege of picking the girl they want and expecting her to simply go along with it.

 

When has that EVER been the case?

 

I dont know anything about your relationship so I won't comment but uh talk to me in 10 years. As much as I wish it were the case, humans are not suppose to spend 10-40 years with one person.

[minime13]

Screwed up my post and i can't edit, ignore this part.

 

 

 

 

Actually I think the majority of men do not think that way. And, well "average" is a pretty relative concept here. It's already been established that the "average" for attractive females is higher and the "average" for men is lower.

 

The things is that what you say and what women see are different. Women see 4-5 guys floating around the hottest girl in the room. Yes, she gets to pick and choose as she pleases. When she chooses, it's like the pack tries to hunt out the next hottest girl in the room. Women see that - we see the hunt, and we're not going to be thrilled to be the third or fourth woman that they decide to come talk to. Women can see the men that play the numbers game, and it's a turn-off. That's one way that men and women are different - if we pursue, we take our time and observe them far longer. We don't go from person to person because that gives of an air of desperation, which is unattractive. Not all men, mind you, but this does seem a little more normal than the exception.

 

The reason for this is due to the fact that, up until the last 15 or so years, men were the ones that chose the "lucky girl," while the "lucky girl" waited to be chosen. This era of dating is quickly melting away, and it seems like men simply need to catch up to it and realize they need to bring more to the table than their male presence - and this has been stated ad nauseam on this thread.

 

 

 

I never suggested as much. The current iteration of feminism(third wave) and it's current goals didn't start in the 50s. That was a different feminism which I think was vital. That is not the type of feminism to which I'm referring.

 

It appears that is what you were suggesting when you essentially said feminism is ruining dating. No - it's not. Plenty of men and women are getting together. It's changed the dynamics of dating, pretty permanently, and you can choose to evolve with the times or be disgruntled because women are actually getting to make the calls now.

 

If I'm missing the point, maybe you can explain to me the detrimental feminism.

[BlackOpsZombieGirl]

The only continual variable with me has been rejection so I have chosen to remove myself from the dating "pool" completely. Just unfortunate that being kind, generous, honest and good manners are not qualities anyone seeks.

 

Those ARE qualities that we seek in a guy - but, some of us are attracted to those qualities when they're presented inside the body and face of a physically attractive guy. Men feel the exact same way! Even though a lot of the guys here moan and groan how they'd screw an unattractive woman because they're 'thirsty enough', in reality, they would much rather date, screw and be in a relationship with a woman they're physically and sexually ATTRACTED TO.

 

 

 

Strangely enough those who did find me attractive, I was always honest as to why I didn't find them attractive...

 

So, why weren't you attracted to 'those women' who DID find YOU attractive? And, don't you think you were within your rights as a human being to NOT date them or have sex with them because you didn't find them attractive enough? Or do you think you should've screwed them and dated them because if you didn't, then people would've called YOU shallow, conceited or too picky??

 

I've been rejected by guys who didn't think I was attractive enough for them to want to date. Physical attractiveness is subjective for EACH person on this earth. Some guys think I'm 'hot', some guys think I'm 'average' and a few others thought I was 'unattractive'. But, I don't sit around whining and being bitter towards guys in general just because the ones that I was interested in and attracted to weren't interested in or attracted to me. I just moved on to the guys who WERE attracted to me and interested in me.

 

We each have the genetic cards that have been dealt to us at the moment of conception; and as such, we have to make the best of those 'cards' as adults in this world. If you're unhappy with your physical appearance - instead of complaining about how women constantly reject you as if it is their fault for not being attracted to you - DO something about it; get plastic surgery, become a gym rat, do a complete appearance overhaul or whatever it'll take to make you physically attractive to the opposite sex. Since you say you possess all of the inner positive character traits and qualities that you feel women SHOULD be attracted to, you apparently don't have to work on the personality aspect of yourself. We're each attracted to who we are attracted to, PERIOD. If you find yourself getting rejected most of the time, then maybe pulling yourself out of the dating game and feeling bitter and resentful towards women for the rest of your life will be doing yourself a huge favor.

 

We, as women, have the right to be selective in who we allow into our lives emotionally, physically and sexually; just as men have always been doing since the beginning of time.

 

 

 

.

[MGX]

I think the reason why average women have no problem finding men is because they are WOMEN. There's always someone out there willing to screw them, no matter how ugly.

 

 

 

Well, that IS good to know.

A woman's worth is entirely to be found between her legs...

 

So just because there are men happy to hump and dump us like pieces of dog poo on their shoe we should be happy about that?

 

Nice... My Friday is now complete and I feel so much happier with the world.

 

And this is why women simply can not reject men too often. Do men really think we should sleep with all the men who want to get in our pants?

 

We're b!tches if we reject men. We're sluts if we don't.

 

Pretty sure she meant misogyny because there has been a lot of it in this thread. Particularly in the suggestion that women are only as valuable as to how often they give men access to their genitals.

 

Which is how women took offense at my statement.

 

I'm commenting on Elam's statement as to WHY women have an easier time finding dates than men do. Elam said that men go for less attractive women because they can't find hotter women. I think men are far less picky than that.

 

A lot of men are horn dogs, who don't fuss about particulars like women tend to do with men. Women have lots of messages in their inboxes every day, while men might get a couple every year.

 

I'm talking about how easily women get attention from the opposite sex. I didn't say a thing about their self-worth. I never said anything about discarding a woman. And I didn't say anything about women sleeping with every guy that asks her out.

[BlackOpsZombieGirl]

The things is that what you say and what women see are different. Women see 4-5 guys floating around the hottest girl in the room. Yes, she gets to pick and choose as she pleases. When she chooses, it's like the pack tries to hunt out the next hottest girl in the room. Women see that - we see the hunt, and we're not going to be thrilled to be the third or fourth woman that they decide to come talk to. Women can see the men that play the numbers game, and it's a turn-off. That's one way that men and women are different - if we pursue, we take our time and observe them far longer. We don't go from person to person because that gives of an air of desperation, which is unattractive. Not all men, mind you, but this does seem a little more normal than the exception.

 

The reason for this is due to the fact that, up until the last 15 or so years, men were the ones that chose the "lucky girl," while the "lucky girl" waited to be chosen. This era of dating is quickly melting away, and it seems like men simply need to catch up to it and realize they need to bring more to the table than their male presence - and this has been stated ad nauseam on this thread.

 

*Snap*. +1 Mini Couldn't have said this better myself.

 

 

 

 

.

[ZA Dater]

Those ARE qualities that we seek in a guy - but, some of us are attracted to those qualities when they're presented inside the body and face of a physically attractive guy. Men feel the exact same way! Even though a lot of the guys here moan and groan how they'd screw an unattractive woman because they're 'thirsty enough', in reality, they would much rather date, screw and be in a relationship with a woman they're physically and sexually ATTRACTED TO.

 

 

 

 

 

So, why weren't you attracted to 'those women' who DID find YOU attractive? And, don't you think you were within your rights as a human being to NOT date them or have sex with them because you didn't find them attractive enough? Or do you think you should've screwed them and dated them because if you didn't, then people would've called YOU shallow, conceited or too picky??

 

I've been rejected by guys who didn't think I was attractive enough for them to want to date. Physical attractiveness is subjective for EACH person on this earth. Some guys think I'm 'hot', some guys think I'm 'average' and a few others thought I was 'unattractive'. But, I don't sit around whining and being bitter towards guys in general just because the ones that I was interested in and attracted to weren't interested in or attracted to me. I just moved on to the guys who WERE attracted to me and interested in me.

 

We each have the genetic cards that have been dealt to us at the moment of conception; and as such, we have to make the best of those 'cards' as adults in this world. If you're unhappy with your physical appearance - instead of complaining about how women constantly reject you as if it is their fault for not being attracted to you - DO something about it; get plastic surgery, become a gym rat, do a complete appearance overhaul or whatever it'll take to make you physically attractive to the opposite sex. Since you say you possess all of the inner positive character traits and qualities that you feel women SHOULD be attracted to, you apparently don't have to work on the personality aspect of yourself. We're each attracted to who we are attracted to, PERIOD. If you find yourself getting rejected most of the time, then maybe pulling yourself out of the dating game and feeling bitter and resentful towards women for the rest of your life will be doing yourself a huge favor.

 

We, as women, have the right to be selective in who we allow into our lives emotionally, physically and sexually; just as men have always been doing since the beginning of time.

 

 

 

.

 

Put simply I wasn't attracted to them for the following fairly generic reasons.

: poor vocabulary

: lack of intellect and ability to converse about anything of substance

: lack of general knowledge

: lack of any sort of opinion

: 99.9 were obese

: they had no real ambition

: class was lacking in many of them.

 

 

I'd never lead someone on who I didn't find attractive, that hurts too much for them and its not fair to do that to another person. Nor am I going to sleep with someone I don't find attractive.

 

 

I am already slim and athletic so clearly that isn't the problem and I am not getting plastic surgery to change my face. Maybe me shy personality is a problem.

 

 

You right I have pulled myself out of the game because it simply made me terribly unhappy the majority of the time and when you get rejected as a friend then yes its really not worth bothering with getting hurt and feeling like dirt, there is more to life than feeling like that.

 

 

Get rejected often enough and eventually you acquire a very low level of self worth.

[xxoo]

Which is how women took offense at my statement.

 

I'm commenting on Elam's statement as to WHY women have an easier time finding dates than men do. Elam said that men go for less attractive women because they can't find hotter women. I think men are far less picky than that.

 

A lot of men are horn dogs, who don't fuss about particulars like women tend to do with men. Women have lots of messages in their inboxes every day, while men might get a couple every year.

 

I'm talking about how easily women get attention from the opposite sex. I didn't say a thing about their self-worth. I never said anything about discarding a woman. And I didn't say anything about women sleeping with every guy that asks her out.

 

I agreed with your post. Didn't take offense.

[Zing]

The things is that what you say and what women see are different. Women see 4-5 guys floating around the hottest girl in the room. Yes, she gets to pick and choose as she pleases. When she chooses, it's like the pack tries to hunt out the next hottest girl in the room. Women see that - we see the hunt, and we're not going to be thrilled to be the third or fourth woman that they decide to come talk to. Women can see the men that play the numbers game, and it's a turn-off. Not all men, mind you, but this does seem a little more normal than the exception.

 

So what should a guy do once that first woman rejects him? Go home and cry? Oh or should he pick you out because you're a special snowflake?

 

You simply do not understand how much emotional, mental exertion, time and money go into pursuing just one girl.

 

That's one way that men and women are different - if we pursue, we take our time and observe them far longer. We don't go from person to person because that gives of an air of desperation, which is unattractive.

 

A) Women don't pursue, because their is no pursuit to be had.

 

B) Women don't go from person to person because they DO NOT NEED TO.

 

Men play the "numbers game" because of the sheer amount of rejection we face on a weekly, sometimes daily basis(depends how much you're trying to date). Stop trying to elevate yourself above men with this "times-are-a-changing" bs.

 

The reason for this is due to the fact that, up until the last 15 or so years, men were the ones that chose the "lucky girl," while the "lucky girl" waited to be chosen. This era of dating is quickly melting away, and it seems like men simply need to catch up to it and realize they need to bring more to the table than their male presence - and this has been stated ad nauseam on this thread.

 

Ummm, because women are bringing so much to the table?

 

It appears that is what you were suggesting when you essentially said feminism is ruining dating. No - it's not. Plenty of men and women are getting together. It's changed the dynamics of dating, pretty permanently, and you can choose to evolve with the times or be disgruntled because women are actually getting to make the calls now.

 

If I'm missing the point, maybe you can explain to me the detrimental feminism.

 

 

I already have, if you chose not to read it that's your problem.

 

Honestly many of your arguments are straw man's.

[minime13]

 

 

The only continual variable with me has been rejection so I have chosen to remove myself from the dating "pool" completely. Just unfortunate that being kind, generous, honest and good manners are not qualities anyone seeks.

 

 

That is such a poor, poor, pitiful me line. Ugh. And really - that is NOT attractive at all.

 

Women find all those qualities attractive, but those are not generally qualities that someone sees firsthand. Physical attraction is what gets it started.

 

Aside from your looks, your attitude plays an important role in physical attraction. How you carry yourself, how you dress, what your demeanor is. In essence - your confidence. Guys on this thread seem so hesitant to take this advice that women are giving because they have heard it so much. The problem is that they don't practice it. If you don't practice it, then how do you know it is bs?

 

First thing - make yourself look polished with a fresh, and clean-shaven appearance. Don't use body spray or excessive cologne, and dress like you understand the basics of the color wheel that we all learned in kindergarten. You don't have to be the best-dressed guy in the crowd, but you do have to look like you've got it together, and you didn't just pick out the clothes that passed the smell test. So, in essence, keep your clothes organized and nicely pressed at home, so you can give and live the appearance of being put together and organized. Take some pride in the way you dress, because that's sexy.

 

Second thing - demeanor means so much. When you're out in a social setting, make it your goal to know more details about the wall than the floor. This is highly important in the smart phone era. Your head and neck control your entire stature, and if you' slumped over and looking down half the time, you're not approachable. Hold your head high, expand your shoulders, and work on your posture. Make eye contact throughout the room with everyone, because that shows you are confident and self-assured. Confidence is very attractive. Honestly - why are the guys with the biggest egos getting the attention? Because they own themselves.

 

Third - the numbers game. A few guys have mentioned this, and it does work, in theory. There is a fine line between playing the numbers game and appearing desperate, though. Desperation is never attractive. Never. The way to do this successfully is not make it obvious. Don't do the thing where you bounce around from woman to woman when you're out. Mingle - when you're looking around the room, making eye contact with those around you, set your sights on some women that you want to approach. This way, you don't come off as being a player or desperate.

 

Have the person or people that you want to meet picked out before you approach, and watch their demeanor as well. If you see that inviting demeanor (that I described above), then go in and introduce yourself. If you see the uninviting demeanor (shoulders and body pulled inward, avoiding eye contact, arms crossed or other guarded positions), then do not approach. People make themselves available or unavailable with their body language. I don't know that a lot of men realize this - some women just don't want to be approached sometimes, and it is told in their body language.

 

The biggest reason why other men give the attitude of dating as being a numbers game is to not take rejection so personally. If one woman isn't interested, that's fine. Move along, because there are plenty of other available women out there. If you keep that attitude in mind (but don't show it), then you'll be able to keep your confidence.

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So what should a guy do once that first woman rejects him? Go home and cry? Oh or should he pick you out because you're a special snowflake?

 

You simply do not understand how much emotional, mental exertion, time and money go into pursuing just one girl.

 

 

 

A) Women don't pursue, because their is no pursuit to be had.

 

B) Women don't go from person to person because they DO NOT NEED TO.

 

Men play the "numbers game" because of the sheer amount of rejection we face on a weekly, sometimes daily basis(depends how much you're trying to date). Stop trying to elevate yourself above men with this "times-are-a-changing" bs.

 

 

 

Ummm, because women are bringing so much to the table?

 

 

 

 

I already have, if you chose not to read it that's your problem.

 

Honestly many of your arguments are straw man's.

 

You know, maybe you're right and I'm wrong about what women see and want. How's your girlfriend, by the way? My boyfriend, whom I did pursue, is doing great. We're excited about the weekend together.

[Zing]

You know, maybe you're right and I'm wrong about what women see and want. How's your girlfriend, by the way? My boyfriend, whom I did pursue, is doing great. We're excited about the weekend together.

 

Are you actually a teenager? Because now I wouldn't be so surprised at all.